Article Spinning - is it a killer tactic or a waste of time?

[Adrian Cooper]

Originally Posted by djenyns

Hey warriors,

I'm fairly new to the forum and want to know people's thoughts on article spinning.

I've done it well in the past to great success but the quality of so many of the services offering spinning vary beyond measure.

Does anybody have the killer strategy completely mastered, working and automated?

Article spinning is one of those religious debates that happen on forums like this.

I write all my own original material, so I don't use re-processed material.

But if you must do I personally think it is better to re-write an article by hand - i.e. just use alternative words and phrases as you go along. It takes longer, but the result is totally human readable.

Someone suggested using Dragon once for this sort of thing, and I think that is a good idea.

I have seen and tested many article spinners over the years from very bad to very good.

I am not up to date on spinners these days, but I am of the view that a really good one would work - probably well - for spinning AdSense pages.

AdSense pages are made for search engines, so you want pages that rank well but bore the reader so they click away from the page via an AdSense link.

[TheRichJerksNet]

Originally Posted by greff

I'd love to see some proof that they "do work." How? AdSense? If you try to read even the best of them you will throw up. Maybe dyslexic readers may like them.

They are not worth the effort in my opinion. I have no moral objection to them, though.

It's obvious that you have not even read the thread.. I have posted proof over and over as well as others have. I have articles that out rank EZA, if that is not proof nothing is...

If you use the proper tools -- "Human Spinner" and you do all the writing yourself, how can you call that something that would make you throw up ??? Like many you have been mis-lead into thinking spun articles are junk.. Well if you put junk in then you get junk out.. Use a proper tool, the proper way, and you use your "own" content, then you get beautifully crafted articles ...

James

[Jon Alexander]

true, garbage in, garbage out. Modern automated tools have advanced enormously, even since last year.

[GeorgR.]

i can tell you my opinion:

IMHO, the time/work it needs to spin an article to make it a GOOD spun article is not worth it. In the same time i can write (or let write) a 400-500 wds article myself.

The GOOD tools are those semi-automatic tools where you still need to write parts yourself - but the overal savings in time/work are not really worth it, in my opinion, especially if you bother to correct an article after a tool spun it.

The BAD spinning tools just result in garbage which is 100% and utterly worthless and will just **** off your site visitors.


There are TWO kinds of articles:

1) Garbage
2) Good ones

And 2) will always need some work, regardless whether a tool helps or not.

[Adrian Cooper]

Originally Posted by GeorgR.

i can tell you my opinion:

The BAD spinning tools just result in garbage which is 100% and utterly worthless and will just **** off your site visitors.

Again - I would never personally spin articles -I think it is lazy and shows a lack of respect to site visitors and is not the strategy of someone wishing to build a business.

That said, if the spun articles are on an AdSense site - which is all they are good for - then ****ing off the visitors is not necessarily a bad thing, because they are once only visitors anyway who will leave by the most obvious link - an AdSense link.

[ExRat]

Hi therichjerksnet,

I come to the forum this morning and the front page is littered with OLD spinner threads, all bumped today by two different NEW anonymous posters, and the bumps all ask questions like this -

So what is the best human powered article spinning. I need them for my plr articles.

...and continue with you writing essays in reply, all about your amazing products.

Coincidence?

If one looks back at post #50 on page 2 of this thread, from three weeks ago -

Originally posted by TheRichJerksNet

Self promotion is not allowed here so can't answer that ..

Just as the name says using SpinLeverage Technology a "human" writer controls every single bit of text to create and spin the content.

Here is a simple explaination:

{insert essay here}

[TheRichJerksNet]

Originally Posted by ExRat

Hi therichjerksnet,

I come to the forum this morning and the front page is littered with OLD spinner threads, all bumped today by two different NEW anonymous posters, and the bumps all ask questions like this -

...and continue with you writing essays in reply, all about your amazing products.

Coincidence?

If one looks back at post #50 on page 2 of this thread, from three weeks ago -

I did not bump these threads, also the essay as you say I posted has nothing to do with my product ...

Maybe you should re-read it, it is a very helpful post giving a great idea to those that take the action to run with it ...

James

[ExRat]

Hi therichjerksnet,

I did not bump these threads

That could easily be true, but your consistent overly-promotional manner and consistent unfounded slurs upon other peoples' competing products, coupled with the mysterious bumpings, in combination - don't look so good and make you look guilty even if you're not.

also the essay as you say I posted has nothing to do with my product

Well if that were true, why would you preface the essay with -

Just as the name says using SpinLeverage Technology a "human" writer controls every single bit of text to create and spin the content.

[Glenn Leader]

Originally Posted by GeorgR.

8< snipped

The GOOD tools are those semi-automatic tools where you still need to write parts yourself - but the overal savings in time/work are not really worth it, in my opinion, especially if you bother to correct an article after a tool spun it.

The BAD spinning tools just result in garbage which is 100% and utterly worthless and will just **** off your site visitors.

8< snipped

I've always says that if you need more than half a dozen or so articles in
total (over a period of time), then it's worthwhile investing your time in a
GOOD article spinning tool or service. If you need a handful or less, ever,
then do the job by hand.

HTH

Glenn

[Glenn Leader]

Originally Posted by apc01

Again - I would never personally spin articles -I think it is lazy and shows a lack of respect to site visitors and is not the strategy of someone wishing to build a business.

Lazy? I could say the same about people who use blogs rather than HTML, or people who use
XSitePro to build sites. These people are not lazy, well, they might be, they're using the right
tools to help them to do their jobs. I can assure you, I have built a successful business (or
two) using the content from properly spun articles. I provide valuable information that helps
people decide is a product is right for them, with full technical specs, if that's right for that
article.

HTH

Glenn

[Glenn Leader]

Originally Posted by rodge09

I tried it for a long time and although i did earn a little, the cash was no prize for the amount of work that i put in

You could say the same about any tool, give me a lump of wood and a set of
carpenters tools, and I'll build you a fire, give them to my dad, and you'll get
a beautiful carved wooden box.

It's not the tools and raw material, it's how you apply them. I'm not for one
second suggesting you built a fire but it could be that you didn't use them
as well as they could have been used... if that makes any sense?

HTH

Glenn

[andyj00]

Originally Posted by TheRichJerksNet

..... This is where the power of a "real spinner" comes into play...

Hi James, what example do you have of a "real spinner"? Software?

Thanks.

[SiteBlaster]

Used correctly and responsibly it can be a very powerful tool/technique. I love it myself.

[elle56]

I spin articles manually. I do use an article software for rewrites but I still have control over it. It's not entirely automated. This software helps me with my articles. Naturally, the more I rewrite the article, the more it gets published.

[MavisAA]

Thanks James and Glenn for your posts in this thread. I've found them very helpful and it has opened up a whole new chapter in my article writing adventure.

James you mentioned two human spinners - Glenn is one - which one is the other one please?

[YellowDot Software]

I think the best way to spin an article is have a good writer rewrite it for a few dollars, maybe have them write some spin syntax into it as well so you can then spin it even more.

I've had good results, but let's say I might be a little biased

[Marty S]

Originally Posted by MavisAA

Thanks James and Glenn for your posts in this thread. I've found them very helpful and it has opened up a whole new chapter in my article writing adventure.

James you mentioned two human spinners - Glenn is one - which one is the other one please?

There are more than 2, and this is the best one IMHO -

Power Article Rewriter and MyArticleNewtwork - Video

[cryptone24]

The first time I tried to spin an article. I wrote it myself, then I spent a really long time to make sure all the possible variations made sense. I also checked how original they were against each (albeit two at a time) to see how much similar or different they were.

Well after about a full day of writing different variations and correcting the ones I saw that didn't make any sense ( i was obsessed by this time), I was getting on average about 65-85% non duplicate. Meaning that of the 40 or 50 random times I compared articles, I was getting a fairly original article with 65-85% originality. I use a free software called "DupeFree" that allow you to input two article and compare them.

I consider most of those articles to be original however I still got the odd ones where it would show 40-50 % of the content was similar on both the articles compared.

Does article spinnig work?

In my opinion, its allot work. This was my first time and I was went overboard on the spinning just cause I am little paranoid about duplicate content. I am sure I will get faster.

Now I can spin the bloody thing 100 times and stand a good chance of getting a fairly unique article, which I can use for all sorts of things, and its all my spinning, not a machine's choice of words .

I now feel that if I send that article to be distributed on an article directory or blog directory, that I would have a good chance of getting a fairly unique article and that would make that link from those sites all the more effective (in my mind)

Personally I feel like coming up with fresh content is too hard, and I cant imagine having to write 100 articles even after 24 or 48 hrs. These were average 400-450 word articles.

I would say article spinning works for me, but I use a good spinner but it can be done be hand as well. The more you do the faster you will become.

[Marcel Hartmann]

I spin content for link wheels to 50% originality.

[SMS]

This is an age-old debate that is unlikely to ever be resolved, but for those that think spinning produces crap quality articles only good enough for search engines... would you say that applies to the articles below?

----------
Article 1:

For a very long time Black Monday 1987 will be remembered for one of the most severe one day declines ever experienced on Wall Street. Yes, October 19 of 1987 is one date that will be remembered time and time again.

The bull market which commenced in 1982 was still going strong by the summer of 1987. Unfortunately, the never ending assault by the market had resulted in stocks that were heavily overvalued, and P/E ratios that were unsustainable. The argument presented by the bulls was that new developments in the economy justified the valuation levels. Many people believed the promise by the gurus that "this time, things are very different". Can you believe that?

The optimism could not hide the fact that all was not well with the Stock Market. A case in point was that at the time there was an uncomfortably large number of cases involving insider trading that were being investigated. The signs were ominous to those that noticed.

The week prior to the 1987 Stock Market crash, the Dow Jones Industrial Average (DJIA) fell by almost 10%. People could sense the fear in the market, although nobody knew exactly what was to follow. The sharp and relentless losses suffered on Black Monday justified the fear.

Such was the severity of the 1987 Stock Market crash that the NASDAQ software system could not cope with the selling pressure, while on the NYSE trading was stopped several times.

By the end of that fateful day in 1987, the DJIA had lost about 23% of it's value. Investors all over the world were badly bruised by the events of Black Monday.

----------
Article 2:

If you witnessed the events of Black Monday 1987, I can assure that they will not be forgetting them in a hurry... and that's a promise. October 19, 1987 is the date that will live long in the memory of many of us.

There was no sign that the five year bull market had any plans of changing course. Price Earning ratios were too high comfort, and as expected this was accompanied by stocks which were unbelievably overvalued. The gurus on TV assured us that the valuations were not overvalued because we were in a new economy. They argued that this time 'things were different', and that the Stock Market's rise could continue unabated.

Observant eyes noticed that things weren't all that they seemed on Wall Street. For instance, the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) was investigating several cases of fraud at the time. The writing on the wall was clear.

The week prior to the 1987 Stock Market crash, the Dow Jones Industrial Average (DJIA) fell by almost 10%. Even though nobody had a clue that the 10% fall was just a precursor to worse things on the horizon, there was a lot of fear in the market. The crash of Black Monday proved that people had every reason to be afraid.

The crash was so severe that the software system used by the NASDAQ could not handle the frenzied selling in the market. Even the NYSE had to halt trading several times during the day.

When the market eventually closed, the Dow Jones Industrial Average was 23% lower than it was at the start of trading. Black Monday was black in more ways than one.

----------
Article 3:

The memories of events that unfolded on Black Monday 1987 will live with us for many decades to come. How many of us will ever forget the 19th of October 1987?

The bull market which commenced in 1982 was still going strong by the summer of 1987. Not many heeded the warning signs posed by overvalued stocks, and Price/Earning ratios which were way to high. The mantra at the time was, "don't panic... the economy has evolved". Yeah right! All of them told us that "things were different this time", and that there was absolutely no cause for alarm.

The optimism could not hide the fact that all was not well with the Stock Market. This was exemplified by a number of SEC investigations into insider trading and other fraudulent practices. Things were brewing under the surface.

Just a week before the market crashed, the Dow Jones Industrial Average (Dow Jones) lost over 9% of its value. Nobody knew what exactly was to follow, but the fear on Wall Street was palpable. The sharp and relentless losses suffered on Black Monday justified the fear.

The 1987 Stock Market crash was so severe that the NASDAQ software system buckled under the relentless selling pressure, and on the NYSE, trading was halted several times during the session.

The Dow Jones Industrial Average lost over 23% of its value that day. Black Monday was a Black day... one that won't be forgotten any time soon.

----------

[ayyaz1234]

If done properly, you can get great results. At first it seems difficult, but you just get better and quicker at it. I always seem to get great results from it.

[dave147]

a complete waste of time (IMO)

[Palitra]

I use the article spinning for the automatic publishing tool. It gives me free backlinks. As for my blog article, so they are my originally written ones.

[admiral]

Originally Posted by TheRichJerksNet

Articles are more useful than just posting to blogs or article directories. This is where the power of a &quot;real spinner&quot; comes into play... Articles have more of a repurpose value then what most think.

I can take 1 article and spin it 20 times and then do the following:

Use 1 to submit to article directories
Use 1 to create a short report to build opt-in list
Use 1 to create a video articles to post on How-To video sites
Use 2 to create a squidoo lens
Use 2 to create a hubpage
Use 3 (the summaries) and post to 20 related blogs
Use 2 to post to my blog
Use 5 to post to the top 5 social networks that have a blog function
Use 3 to post to news release sites

There are more that can be done but you just need to think outside the box. By using the proper spinner you can create a very powerful marketing campaign with just 1 article.

Let's assume I paid someone to write the original article, with the above I just done massive exposure that cost my business $10 - $15 and about 3 days work.

The alternative: Let's assume you needed a writer to write the content for the above. 20 articles at $10 a pop is $200. So you just spent $200 for the above and 3 days work.

Logically which option is more effective especially with this economy ??

Personally myself I would rather pay for the 1 Article and then use it to create all that massive exposure by spinning the article (using a proper spinner)..

James

excellent thread it what makes this site so special

[MSGeek]

Funny thing, this thread caught me in the middle of looking for a good one and serious considerations of creating a better one...

That said, I am still somewhat skeptical about article spinners.

There are two kinds of articles spinners.

#1: Synonym and grammar based. I've never seen a good one of this kind. If, like James, you don't care that it may be a total crap, there are better ways to generate keyword-rich text that look like the result of mentally challenged efforts. Still, it will fool search engines including Google. It's unlikely to fool humans and definitely won't raise their attention. Make sure you use alias, if you use it for SEO -- you won't be proud of those texts.

#2: Human controlled. Basically, you write the article with permutations like:

You write {articles|content} with {permutations|variations|versions}.

Then the article spinner generates all 6 possible variations (2 ways to pick the first permutation and 3 for the second one).

These article spinners work much better and generate an intelligent text, however, they also has two issues:

1. You have to create all permutation. Advantage: you can outsource it. Still somebody has to create it.

2. This one is a bit thicker. Why you would use an article spinner is to prevent duplicate content. To avoid that the algorithmic complexity to recognize spinned articles as the same should be higher than what Copyscape and Google currently do. To do that, minimum repeated fragment of ANY two articles should be at least N words. And don't ask me what N is, I don't know, but for sure it grows with the time as Google throws more machines into their network and tunes their algorithms.

It means that if you generate all possible article variations, some of them are likely to be recognized as duplicate content. To avoid that you will have to put a lot or permutations in the article and use very limited number of versions. Also, you have to be sure that your article spinner understand that.

Say, in the exmaple above, if you ask for 2 articles (that's maximum number to avoid 4 words in a row repeated), the article spinner should not create:

You write articles with permutations.
You write articles with variations.

It should instead try to permutate both groups:

You write articles with permutations.
You write content with variations.

I doubt there are article spinners on the market that do that properly.

Anyway, as TheRichJerkNet said, use it while it works.

[James Pateman]

I’m happy with doing both.


Regards,
James Pateman

[SMS]

Spinners are certainly not a waste of time, but you need to know how to use them effectively. Have a look at the articles in my post above (Post #120). I can produce 40 similar articles at the click of a button, and it took me less than an hour to setup.

That's the power and beauty of spinning, guys.

[yukinari84]

To me it all depends on what the content will be used for. If
I'm doing a quick-hit type of promotion where I want to get many
sites ranked fast, then I will usually use one piece of content
on multiple properties.

If it's more of a long-term strategy I'm going after, then I
will definitely use more unique content. I use Human Spinner
or outsource article writing/spinning. Since it's done by an
actual human, it get's better rankings and results most of the
time.

[kennethsmith72]

Article spinner is not a good idea and waste of time,try to write fresh article using your own idea and try not to copy to others article.

[SMS]

Hi Kenneth,

Do you mind sharing with us your reason for saying this? I happen to disagree, so was just wondering what your statement is based on.

Thanks.

Originally Posted by kennethsmith72

Article spinner is not a good idea and waste of time,try to write fresh article using your own idea and try not to copy to others article.

[bluenetworx]

I think the spinners like Power Article Rewriter are great, the spinners that automate the rewrite suck, but how can having 100's of unique well spun articles be bad thing, I use them all over the web for content to get backlinks, and I hate writing so it works wonders for me.

[DougSanderson]

I've seen some good stuff come from Magic Article Rewriter - go to eamarketing (dot) com .. They also have a submitting software too.

I think spinning is a great asset. It can hurt too.... I wouldn't spin more than 30-40 versions or so.... what I have done too is submit my original either to my website or EZA (the best places to get ranked)... then use the others on the lesser known article directories (but still get ranked and it will still drive traffic) and THEN take portions of 10 versions, like a paragraph or something, and tweek if it needs it.... and BOOM you have lots of original content to copy and paste into tons of blog comment areas that are in your industry or niche....

SO:
spin it (30-40 versions)
submit original to the places you want to rank best
submit the others to lesser known directories
take 10 spun versions and use paragraphs as blog comment posts

There is more you can do with this..... this is a basic start.... just play around and figure out what you think is best....

[Glenn Leader]

Originally Posted by dave147

a complete waste of time (IMO)

Have you been reading the same thread you just posted to?

Originally Posted by kennethsmith72

Article spinner is not a good idea and waste of time,try to write fresh article using your own idea and try not to copy to others article.

Who says my 'spun' articles don't contain my original ideas? I
write the original seed article, and I add all the variations and
permutations that I want to use. In other words, I use MY
brain, and as a result, I get highly effective articles.

HTH

Glenn

[krishnaGopal]

Personally, I suggest using unique content! The is substantial to get a decent ranking in google because they will love fresh new content. Though you can get away with article spinning, I personally don't believe it has the same impact !

[macknox]

Originally Posted by cryptone24

The first time I tried to spin an article. I wrote it myself, then I spent a really long time to make sure all the possible variations made sense. I also checked how original they were against each (albeit two at a time) to see how much similar or different they were.

Well after about a full day of writing different variations and correcting the ones I saw that didn't make any sense ( i was obsessed by this time), I was getting on average about 65-85% non duplicate. Meaning that of the 40 or 50 random times I compared articles, I was getting a fairly original article with 65-85% originality. I use a free software called "DupeFree" that allow you to input two article and compare them.

I consider most of those articles to be original however I still got the odd ones where it would show 40-50 % of the content was similar on both the articles compared.

Does article spinnig work?

In my opinion, its allot work. This was my first time and I was went overboard on the spinning just cause I am little paranoid about duplicate content. I am sure I will get faster.

Now I can spin the bloody thing 100 times and stand a good chance of getting a fairly unique article, which I can use for all sorts of things, and its all my spinning, not a machine's choice of words .

I now feel that if I send that article to be distributed on an article directory or blog directory, that I would have a good chance of getting a fairly unique article and that would make that link from those sites all the more effective (in my mind)

Personally I feel like coming up with fresh content is too hard, and I cant imagine having to write 100 articles even after 24 or 48 hrs. These were average 400-450 word articles.

I would say article spinning works for me, but I use a good spinner but it can be done be hand as well. The more you do the faster you will become.

I agree spinning does work ONLY if you put the effort in.

It is a right pain thinking up mutliple sentences and getting them read properly when spun.

It also depends on the subject you are spinning about... it's easier if its about a subject you are interested in like 'hair loss' or 'erectile dysfunctions' - I write under a nom de plume for every niche!

[SMS]

For those of you that say spinning is a waste of time... I think you need to take a close look at my earlier post below. By the way, I could produce 40 more like these at the click of a button. Time spent? Less than 1 hour.

Does spinning still loook like a waste of time to you?

POST STARTS HERE:
This is an age-old debate that is unlikely to ever be resolved, but for those that think spinning produces crap quality articles only good enough for search engines... would you say that applies to the articles below?

----------
Article 1:

For a very long time Black Monday 1987 will be remembered for one of the most severe one day declines ever experienced on Wall Street. Yes, October 19 of 1987 is one date that will be remembered time and time again.

The bull market which commenced in 1982 was still going strong by the summer of 1987. Unfortunately, the never ending assault by the market had resulted in stocks that were heavily overvalued, and P/E ratios that were unsustainable. The argument presented by the bulls was that new developments in the economy justified the valuation levels. Many people believed the promise by the gurus that "this time, things are very different". Can you believe that?

The optimism could not hide the fact that all was not well with the Stock Market. A case in point was that at the time there was an uncomfortably large number of cases involving insider trading that were being investigated. The signs were ominous to those that noticed.

The week prior to the 1987 Stock Market crash, the Dow Jones Industrial Average (DJIA) fell by almost 10%. People could sense the fear in the market, although nobody knew exactly what was to follow. The sharp and relentless losses suffered on Black Monday justified the fear.

Such was the severity of the 1987 Stock Market crash that the NASDAQ software system could not cope with the selling pressure, while on the NYSE trading was stopped several times.

By the end of that fateful day in 1987, the DJIA had lost about 23% of it's value. Investors all over the world were badly bruised by the events of Black Monday.

----------
Article 2:

If you witnessed the events of Black Monday 1987, I can assure that they will not be forgetting them in a hurry... and that's a promise. October 19, 1987 is the date that will live long in the memory of many of us.

There was no sign that the five year bull market had any plans of changing course. Price Earning ratios were too high comfort, and as expected this was accompanied by stocks which were unbelievably overvalued. The gurus on TV assured us that the valuations were not overvalued because we were in a new economy. They argued that this time 'things were different', and that the Stock Market's rise could continue unabated.

Observant eyes noticed that things weren't all that they seemed on Wall Street. For instance, the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) was investigating several cases of fraud at the time. The writing on the wall was clear.

The week prior to the 1987 Stock Market crash, the Dow Jones Industrial Average (DJIA) fell by almost 10%. Even though nobody had a clue that the 10% fall was just a precursor to worse things on the horizon, there was a lot of fear in the market. The crash of Black Monday proved that people had every reason to be afraid.

The crash was so severe that the software system used by the NASDAQ could not handle the frenzied selling in the market. Even the NYSE had to halt trading several times during the day.

When the market eventually closed, the Dow Jones Industrial Average was 23% lower than it was at the start of trading. Black Monday was black in more ways than one.

----------
Article 3:

The memories of events that unfolded on Black Monday 1987 will live with us for many decades to come. How many of us will ever forget the 19th of October 1987?

The bull market which commenced in 1982 was still going strong by the summer of 1987. Not many heeded the warning signs posed by overvalued stocks, and Price/Earning ratios which were way to high. The mantra at the time was, "don't panic... the economy has evolved". Yeah right! All of them told us that "things were different this time", and that there was absolutely no cause for alarm.

The optimism could not hide the fact that all was not well with the Stock Market. This was exemplified by a number of SEC investigations into insider trading and other fraudulent practices. Things were brewing under the surface.

Just a week before the market crashed, the Dow Jones Industrial Average (Dow Jones) lost over 9% of its value. Nobody knew what exactly was to follow, but the fear on Wall Street was palpable. The sharp and relentless losses suffered on Black Monday justified the fear.

The 1987 Stock Market crash was so severe that the NASDAQ software system buckled under the relentless selling pressure, and on the NYSE, trading was halted several times during the session.

The Dow Jones Industrial Average lost over 23% of its value that day. Black Monday was a Black day... one that won't be forgotten any time soon.

----------

[rype89]

Okay I'm pretty convinced that article spinning can work for me, but no way am I gonna do it all by myself. Does anyone know of a quality spinning service? If you don't want to seem to be self-promoting on the forum, please do PM me.

[Reg McMicking]

Search engines are getting very wise to spun articles. I know because I actually rewrote one of my own articles from about a year ago and got spanked not only by google but also the Article Directory. I thought I did a really good job with the rewrite and topic change. I guess not.

Writing articles with informative and original content is not too hard as there is so much information about almost anything available online. So, I would go that route everytime because article marketing is too important to screw up.

[SMS]

Yep. It will be hard to get away with spun articles with the good directories such as EZA. But if you spin your articles the right way, Google will even 'reward' you with higher rankings.

It's all in the how.

Originally Posted by Reg McMicking

Search engines are getting very wise to spun articles. I know because I actually rewrote one of my own articles from about a year ago and got spanked not only by google but also the Article Directory. I thought I did a really good job with the rewrite and topic change. I guess not.

Writing articles with informative and original content is not too hard as there is so much information about almost anything available online. So, I would go that route everytime because article marketing is too important to screw up.

[MSGeek]

Oz, looks like you are using article spinner of the second category. Do you really find it easier that spinning it manually? I understand that with your attitude toward duplicate content, it does not bother you much if long parts of articles are similar?

It's not just curiosity. I was considering doing such spinner client, but what stopped me, is the task to generate sufficiently different articles -- that's really tough part even to properly describe. So, I wonder, if it was still worth the effort to create one.

[SMS]

You are spot on... for the majority of case, I don't think it is necessary to do the level of spinning I did in that example. To be on the safe side, because you never know when Google will change their algorithm, I still like to do some spinning.

Content Boss has been much maligned on this board, but I think it has vastly improved from what it used to be. In many cases, spinning with CB and then validating/editing the output is often good enough for me... and that will only take a max of 5 minutes (in most cases less than 5 mins) per article.

However, there's a commercial project that I have in mind that does require that level of spinning.

Are you thinking of spinning multiple versions of one article for the same client? How many versions?

Originally Posted by MSGeek

Oz, looks like you are using article spinner of the second category. Do you really find it easier that spinning it manually? I understand that with your attitude toward duplicate content, it does not bother you much if long parts of articles are similar?

It's not just curiosity. I was considering doing such spinner client, but what stopped me, is the task to generate sufficiently different articles -- that's really tough part even to properly describe. So, I wonder, if it was still worth the effort to create one.

[Glenn Leader]

Originally Posted by Reg McMicking

Search engines are getting very wise to spun articles. I know because I actually rewrote one of my own articles from about a year ago and got spanked not only by google but also the Article Directory. I thought I did a really good job with the rewrite and topic change. I guess not.

8< snipped

Search Engines are not as wise as they want us to think they are.
Magicians use the same tricks of misdirection to look where they
want us to look. It looks like you're basing your opinion on one single
event. I have a history of using many many spun articles in all sorts of
environment, and have only been punished when I push the envelope to
see how far I can get away with things. Now I use the right tools, well
within the self discovered boundaries, and get good results.

You say your article got spanked by a directory, what was the actual
reason?

Glenn

[kwopp]

Originally Posted by MSGeek

I doubt there are article spinners on the market that do that properly.

I've been thinking this as well.

Some of the 300 word articles I spin can reach 1100 words in total with all their added alternative phrases. I have a feeling though that the programming randomly selects alternatives within the brackets, and doesn't have a function to maximise variation.


Spun articles definitely don't have to be bad - like anything, it's all about technique. And that means sentence structure and grammar to ensure that you can easily add new phrases that are both syntactically equivalent, and fit into the rest of the text.

[SimonHarrison]

Originally Posted by SMS

For those of you that say spinning is a waste of time... I think you need to take a close look at my earlier post below. By the way, I could produce 40 more like these at the click of a button. Time spent? Less than 1 hour.

Does spinning still loook like a waste of time to you?

POST STARTS HERE:
This is an age-old debate that is unlikely to ever be resolved, but for those that think spinning produces crap quality articles only good enough for search engines... would you say that applies to the articles below?

----------
Article 1:

For a very long time Black Monday 1987 will be remembered for one of the most severe one day declines ever experienced on Wall Street. Yes, October 19 of 1987 is one date that will be remembered time and time again.

The bull market which commenced in 1982 was still going strong by the summer of 1987. Unfortunately, the never ending assault by the market had resulted in stocks that were heavily overvalued, and P/E ratios that were unsustainable. The argument presented by the bulls was that new developments in the economy justified the valuation levels. Many people believed the promise by the gurus that "this time, things are very different". Can you believe that?

The optimism could not hide the fact that all was not well with the Stock Market. A case in point was that at the time there was an uncomfortably large number of cases involving insider trading that were being investigated. The signs were ominous to those that noticed.

The week prior to the 1987 Stock Market crash, the Dow Jones Industrial Average (DJIA) fell by almost 10%. People could sense the fear in the market, although nobody knew exactly what was to follow. The sharp and relentless losses suffered on Black Monday justified the fear.

Such was the severity of the 1987 Stock Market crash that the NASDAQ software system could not cope with the selling pressure, while on the NYSE trading was stopped several times.

By the end of that fateful day in 1987, the DJIA had lost about 23% of it's value. Investors all over the world were badly bruised by the events of Black Monday.

----------
Article 2:

If you witnessed the events of Black Monday 1987, I can assure that they will not be forgetting them in a hurry... and that's a promise. October 19, 1987 is the date that will live long in the memory of many of us.

There was no sign that the five year bull market had any plans of changing course. Price Earning ratios were too high comfort, and as expected this was accompanied by stocks which were unbelievably overvalued. The gurus on TV assured us that the valuations were not overvalued because we were in a new economy. They argued that this time 'things were different', and that the Stock Market's rise could continue unabated.

Observant eyes noticed that things weren't all that they seemed on Wall Street. For instance, the Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) was investigating several cases of fraud at the time. The writing on the wall was clear.

The week prior to the 1987 Stock Market crash, the Dow Jones Industrial Average (DJIA) fell by almost 10%. Even though nobody had a clue that the 10% fall was just a precursor to worse things on the horizon, there was a lot of fear in the market. The crash of Black Monday proved that people had every reason to be afraid.

The crash was so severe that the software system used by the NASDAQ could not handle the frenzied selling in the market. Even the NYSE had to halt trading several times during the day.

When the market eventually closed, the Dow Jones Industrial Average was 23% lower than it was at the start of trading. Black Monday was black in more ways than one.

----------
Article 3:

The memories of events that unfolded on Black Monday 1987 will live with us for many decades to come. How many of us will ever forget the 19th of October 1987?

The bull market which commenced in 1982 was still going strong by the summer of 1987. Not many heeded the warning signs posed by overvalued stocks, and Price/Earning ratios which were way to high. The mantra at the time was, "don't panic... the economy has evolved". Yeah right! All of them told us that "things were different this time", and that there was absolutely no cause for alarm.

The optimism could not hide the fact that all was not well with the Stock Market. This was exemplified by a number of SEC investigations into insider trading and other fraudulent practices. Things were brewing under the surface.

Just a week before the market crashed, the Dow Jones Industrial Average (Dow Jones) lost over 9% of its value. Nobody knew what exactly was to follow, but the fear on Wall Street was palpable. The sharp and relentless losses suffered on Black Monday justified the fear.

The 1987 Stock Market crash was so severe that the NASDAQ software system buckled under the relentless selling pressure, and on the NYSE, trading was halted several times during the session.

The Dow Jones Industrial Average lost over 23% of its value that day. Black Monday was a Black day... one that won't be forgotten any time soon.

----------

I only took a very quick look and thought it was poor...

For example:

If you witnessed the events of Black Monday 1987, I can assure that they will not be forgetting them in a hurry.

That sort of stuff is fine for search engines, web 2.0 , backlinks etc but some people would have a heart attack if their name was put to such dross.

My issue is that if your an unknown and you're just looking for content, then why not it's sort of good enough .. just , but for somebody who's known for their topic, you could never put your name to this stuff.

[SMS]

Point taken, Simon... but I can assure you that the error you spotted was not down to spinning. It's down to human error - my humble self.

Even the best writers make mistakes, and that's what editors are for.

To be honest, I didn't even spend the time checking & editing the spun article, because I only produced it as an example. I wonder if there were any other errors.

Ideally, I'd like perfection, but I'm a realist and am happy to live with one minor omission in a 300 word article. The time and labour saving make it a no brainer.

I could submit each of those 3 articles to EZA under the same account, and am pretty certain they'll get approved.

You make a very good point, though, and that is...

If you are writing an article to brand yourself, I don't think spinning is the best solution!

Good debate, guys. Please, let's keep it civil, or I'm outta here.

Originally Posted by SimonHarrison

I only took a very quick look and thought it was poor...

For example:



That sort of stuff is fine for search engines, web 2.0 , backlinks etc but some people would have a heart attack if their name was put to such dross.

My issue is that if your an unknown and you're just looking for content, then why not it's sort of good enough .. just , but for somebody who's known for their topic, you could never put your name to this stuff.

[TerryG]

Originally Posted by admiral

excellent thread it what makes this site so special

and

Originally Posted by TheRichJerksNet

Articles are more useful than just posting to blogs or article directories. This is where the power of a "real spinner" comes into play... Articles have more of a repurpose value then what most think.

I can take 1 article and spin it 20 times and then do the following:

Use 1 to submit to article directories
Use 1 to create a short report to build opt-in list
Use 1 to create a video articles to post on How-To video sites
Use 2 to create a squidoo lens
Use 2 to create a hubpage
Use 3 (the summaries) and post to 20 related blogs
Use 2 to post to my blog
Use 5 to post to the top 5 social networks that have a blog function
Use 3 to post to news release sites

James

I'm with you one hundred per cent James.

You just described the perfect mini-network for a keyword/keyword phrase and I use my spun articles everytime to build my network exactly this way, with one or two more.

I use Magic Article Rewriter and if anyone else does, here's a tip. Post the original article on your site then when you spin the article, delete the first word, original article word, from the spin syntax. Original content every time.

Great thread and some terrific ideas, from both sides of the fence.

[mistermint]

Hi, Interesting read!

I'm using mass article control 2009 pro, it's a really good tool and can if you want it to, produce hundreds of spun articles from one original. You can add your own synonyms or choose from the built in database..it's packaged with a directory submission tool. This is a really good tool and one of the few things I've bought that's worth the money. Adeel Chowdhry and Bobby Walker have invested very heavily in this software.

IMO, why not write an original article and spin it for marketing purposes,you have to remember that not all folk are good at composing articles and, how time consuming is that!

Also I agree with the thoughts posted by wiser people than me, search engine spiders are not that smart...

[SMS]

You can certainly say that again!

You'd be positively shocked at what you could rank #1 in Google with or should that be without?

search engine spiders are not that smart...

[SimonHarrison]

Originally Posted by SMS

Point taken, Simon... but I can assure you that the error you spotted was not down to spinning. It's down to human error - my humble self.

Even the best writers make mistakes, and that's what editors are for.

To be honest, I didn't even spend the time checking & editing the spun article, because I only produced it as an example. I wonder if there were any other errors.

Ideally, I'd like perfection, but I'm a realist and am happy to live with one minor omission in a 300 word article. The time and labour saving make it a no brainer.

I could submit each of those 3 articles to EZA under the same account, and am pretty certain they'll get approved.

You make a very good point, though, and that is...

If you are writing an article to brand yourself, I don't think spinning is the best solution!

Good debate, guys. Please, let's keep it civil, or I'm outta here.

No argument here, we are on the same page.

I have zero issue with well spun content used for specific requirements, it's just not usable for authors who are known well for their subject. Even the best spinners effectively remove the nuances of a well known writer.

For pretty much all other requirements, well spun content is absolutely fine.

[rype89]

Hey guys. Just wondering, would it better to submit different spun versions of an articles to multiple article directories? Compared to submitting the exact same article to all of them. If it's better, how so?