I got a little tip for the noobies thinking about doing offline.

[chrisnegro]

Originally Posted by Preben Frenning

My family knows, and are sceptical. Too bad for them I'm so stubborn

Believe it or not...THERE IS A GOOD STUBBORNESS....the stubborness to succeed while others get the vision down the road.

Just know that people have predictable patterns. When things don't "bare witness" in their spirit or the predictable sheep don't want you to succeed because it never worked for them attitude --- just take it with a grain of salt.

My problem....is that these people have no idea that they are VISION KILLERS -- trying to destroy your dreams ....and everyone they come in contact with. If anything ...I have to hold back resentment in my heart and judge them for their lack of knowledge and awareness of what they are actually doing.

Prophetically....people have no idea what seeds they are planting everywhere they go in other people (when they are negative and have a vision killing spirit)....and the GENERALAL IMPACT OF THEIR WORDS. Because I see this....till this day I struggle with these type of personality types. In fact...I'll buy someone a $7 beer if they can PM the revelation I still need (I'm serious too....lol... as I know I need to change in how I respond to these peronsality types).

Chris Negro

[Preben Frenning]

@Irishman - That is some great tips! - I personally use the "Free analysis" myself. And that's not just a preselling analysis, it's a pretty deep, 6-8 page long analysis, focusing on most aspects of their website etc.

If you give value first, it's like planting a seed - And the pick the fruits from the tree. You'll need to give it plenty water though, meaning it's just a waste of time if you don't follow up. You'll usually need to call them to get anything back.

@M4UNow - Great tips! However, there are many good seller's tricks
to know when doing this.

For example when you try to get an appointment. NEVER ask them when
it's appropriate for them to have a meeting.

Instead, ask "Is Tuesday or Wednesday best for you?"
They will always say one of them And if they ARE interested before
you ask so, they might say another date that is even better for them.

- I wrote a blog post about selling offline here: The Easy Way To Offline Riches | The iMarketing Blog

@Domenick King and others - Check out Mason's blogpost here if you want an actionable, easy business plan:
Thai Food and eMail Marketing In The Offline World | MasonWorld Internet Marketing Strategy | Mark Mason | Internet Based Marketing Blog

It's really one of the easiest business models out there, and I bet
it works like a charm, as well as you get to eat out way more often

However, I have a few tweaks for this model:

1. If they are insecure about the service, offer them 1 month for free. Maybe
even 2.
2. Send them an attractive "offline opt-in form" with your watermark in
the mail. - This is for them so hand out to their customers along with
the bill.
3. Use hard selling if they are hard customers, as this WILL make them
more money, whether they like it or not.
4. After they're signed up for free, and have build a list of at least 10,
they CAN'T stop using your service, as they would be idiots for letting
10 potential customers away.

@Chris Endres - Lol...

@Leanne King - Great tips! You could also target companies who's already
spending money on adwords. They know the power of Google as well, but are
pretty often bidding on WAY too broad keywords!

@FlightGuy - You're right. If I had listened to my parents, I'd be working a "safe job"
on a gas station now, instead of building my own company at the age
of 19 =)

@Loren Woirhaye - Great tips! If you can get THEM to talk about something THEY like to talk about, and you listen, it does not only build credibility, it helps you find the best solution.

@chrisnegro - I know it's good
I could use another beer, so I'll think about this for a little while. Keep your wallet ready

A few other notes for this thread...

If you get your family to listen to you, and you manage to explain
why it works, and they understand - Then you are REALLY set for success,
as they are obviously the ones who's least likely to believe in this!

And another thing, YOU are hanging around the warriorforum right now,
reading this, so you obviously haven't given up yet

To sum up a bit here, you should NOT act as a salesperson when selling this.
However, when SHOULD you act as a salesperson? Answer: NEVER! People
usually hate salespeople

Listen, plan, act - Or multi-task the last 2.

The best sellers are good listeners as well, and when you are selling your
own services, you can customize your services after their needs, and
give them exactly what they want. - For a good price of course.

[Popstar]

I know everyone has their own way of approaching this.

But Matt, I strongly urge you NOT to follow the freebie method of sales. Otherwise, you'll waste all your time working for nothing.

There wasn't anything wrong with the original prices you quoted. Yes, it's probably best to customize according to what the customer wants. But honestly, most offline business owners don't really know what they want, so you can guide them however you think best.

But you need to be confident when you quote prices... as though you expect to get those numbers... and you will.

I believe too many people start caving on price the minute a business owner hesitates to pay.

Also, not every prospect will turn into a customer. Sometimes, you just have to walk away if the business owner is too cheap.

There are so many businesses out there that there's no need to undercut yourself. With this business model, you're trading time for money, so make it worth your while. Your prices shouldn't be based on your cost, they should be based on what the market will pay.

There are a lot of web design companies out there that are charging thousands, sometimes tens of thousands, for 5 to 7 page sites with no SEO and lousy sales design. Play up the benefits you have to offer.

As for your family, I'm sure they mean well but they clearly don't understand business. Ignore their misguided opinions.

Believe in yourself, believe in your prices. Don't justify your prices or act apologetic. Act as though that's what you routinely charge... and receive... and you'll get it.

If they ask to see other companies' sites, tell them you keep all customer information confidential. But you can show them a sample site, if necessary (if you have one).

Allow yourself some time to learn and gain confidence. So if there's a company you really want to work with, practice on another company first.

This is mostly about having self-confidence and approaching businesses that have enough money to pay you.

Good luck,
Debbie

[clashctyrokr]

Just hope they don't know anything about the internet...because that's incredibly overpriced.

[Popstar]

The 4K upfront isn't.

[Matt Gannon]

Originally Posted by Popstar

I know everyone has their own way of approaching this.

But Matt, I strongly urge you NOT to follow the freebie method of sales. Otherwise, you'll waste all your time working for nothing.

There wasn't anything wrong with the original prices you quoted. Yes, it's probably best to customize according to what the customer wants. But honestly, most offline business owners don't really know what they want, so you can guide them however you think best.

But you need to be confident when you quote prices... as though you expect to get those numbers... and you will.

I believe too many people start caving on price the minute a business owner hesitates to pay.

Also, not every prospect will turn into a customer. Sometimes, you just have to walk away if the business owner is too cheap.

There are so many businesses out there that there's no need to undercut yourself. With this business model, you're trading time for money, so make it worth your while. Your prices shouldn't be based on your cost, they should be based on what the market will pay.

There are a lot of web design companies out there that are charging thousands, sometimes tens of thousands, for 5 to 7 page sites with no SEO and lousy sales design. Play up the benefits you have to offer.

As for your family, I'm sure they mean well but they clearly don't understand business. Ignore their misguided opinions.

Believe in yourself, believe in your prices. Don't justify your prices or act apologetic. Act as though that's what you routinely charge... and receive... and you'll get it.

If they ask to see other companies' sites, tell them you keep all customer information confidential. But you can show them a sample site, if necessary (if you have one).

Allow yourself some time to learn and gain confidence. So if there's a company you really want to work with, practice on another company first.

This is mostly about having self-confidence and approaching businesses that have enough money to pay you.

Good luck,
Debbie

Yes if i get good I can probably guide a business owner into buying whatever I say would help them out, of course id make sure it would help them out. I wont overprice but I will charge what I think is fair for me, the time i have to work on the project. I plan on trying to get them to buy some kind of service that I keep working on so I get paid every month. Thanks for the tips too they all help a lot!

[John Durham]

My ex wife complained everynight that I was not getting to bed early...told me I was pipe dreaming and that my internet related telemarketing business wasn't gonna work... said I was "all talk"...blah, blah. blah... we finally split up (this was back around 2001...)...6 months later I had made like 300k, had a new car, a beautiful blond bombshell on my arm... and she was blowin my phone up begging me to come back home!

Stupidly I did...and we ended up divorcing anyway, bummer is that the blond really loved me. I just should have stayed with her, but she's married now.

Point is, don't let anybody tell you you're just a dreamer. amazing things "CAN" happen if you stay passionate.

[elle56]

My family couldn't grasp what I am doing online. They keep reminding me that I might get myself scammed in the future for transacting business on the internet. If I listen to them, I would have forgone opportunities that wasn't available to me offline. The bottomline is to listen to yourself and believe that you can do it no matter how others think that you're crazy doing IM. They'll shut up when they see your bank account.

[Preben Frenning]

@Popstar - You're right. You WILL NOT be able to get paid this good if
you don't personally believe it's worth it.

You will need to seem confident all the time, the price shouldn't be
your selling point.

Don't sell yourself based on price, sell your services based on
the customers desire to get a performing website and more customers.

If you manage to do so, and make them realize that "This IS the price", they
will be willing to pay it too.

If you don't believe it's a fair price to pay, then they definately won't.
So that is something you might want to work on first, if needed.

Now if you have a hard time getting started with this, I would say try
out the free analysis method.

There are many different ways to do it, and some of them don't work at all,
but if you find a good way, it will be fun and profitable.
- It's easier to approach someone when you are going to give them something
for free anyways. And people might even approach you to get it.
Just remember to be a master at follow-up, or I can guarantee it won't
work. - They're not going to throw their money after you if you don't ask.

[Mark McClure]

Originally Posted by MNicholas

Well... if you don't mind going face to face setting up appointments with people
who don't really understand the online world and need to be convinced and you
have the time and energy to handle all their objections (and they will have them)
then give it a shot. When I was doing local web master jobs it was all like going
against a strong current in the wrong direction.

That can be true!
The 'easiest' client to 'hook' often understands a lot of the marketing ideas but doesn't have the time or patience to implement them properly. They're prepared to spend money on someone who can.

However, they can have very high expectations - so it's important to be clear what you can do for them from the start (after you've better understood their marketplace and what they're doing right/wrong.)
Under promise, over deliver...

[altos]

Matt,

Hang tough! I am walking the same road as you right now in the offline world and my wife is not a big believer but she will come around!!!! I have faith!!

[Matt Gannon]

Originally Posted by kadensnga

My ex wife complained everynight that I was not getting to bed early...told me I was pipe dreaming and that my internet related telemarketing business wasn't gonna work... said I was "all talk"...blah, blah. blah... we finally split up (this was back around 2001...)...6 months later I had made like 300k, had a new car, a beautiful blond bombshell on my arm... and she was blowin my phone up begging me to come back home!

Stupidly I did...and we ended up divorcing anyway, bummer is that the blond really loved me. I just should have stayed with her, but she's married now.

Point is, don't let anybody tell you you're just a dreamer. amazing things "CAN" happen if you stay passionate.

Yes, I will never give up my dreams, it's too bad about that blond bombshell, I also agree with not letting business owners try talking you into some low price, I think a little saying comes to mind. "You get what you pay for!"

[bigdollarsnow]

Matt,

Good for you, go for it, Matt. I am 58 years old I have an offline consulting business. Just have faith in God and keep you head up.

As far as the price, ask for the $4k and negotiate. It worked for me. One client paid me $6600 when I asked for $7600. I had already place negotiating room into the contract. And please get a contract. Your actions says you are doing it right nor

[Robert_Rand]

Back when I was 19 and about to get into Direct Sales my Dad was extremely negative... But in the end proving him wrong drove me to much greater success than I probably would have achieved otherwise.

[Matt Gannon]

Originally Posted by bigdollarsnow

Matt,

Good for you, go for it, Matt. I am 58 years old I have an offline consulting business. Just have faith in God and keep you head up.

As far as the price, ask for the $4k and negotiate. It worked for me. One client paid me $6600 when I asked for $7600. I had already place negotiating room into the contract. And please get a contract. Your actions says you are doing it right nor

That's a good idea to leave some negotiating room in the contract, I have never written a contract before, any tips on doing that?

[Preben Frenning]

Back when I was 17 (I'm 19 now ), I started with direct, commission-based sales, and I have loved it ever since - Except I'm selling my own services now.

I really believe direct selling have made me strong, and have had a major impact in my life, as for personal development, social life etc.

Direct sales are hard, but if you never give it up, it will be worth it in the end.

Proving negative people wrong never goes out of fashion! I can't wait for my business to get launched! (Just 1-2 weeks left now...)

[AndrewCavanagh]

Originally Posted by chrisnegro

these people have no idea that they are VISION KILLERS -- trying to destroy your dreams ....and everyone they come in contact with. If anything ...I have to hold back resentment in my heart and judge them for their lack of knowledge and awareness of what they are actually doing.

You know as I get older and find that I'm really enjoying the laid back lifestyle I lead with a nice income and not too much work...

I find it difficult to see anyone as a vision killer.

In fact most of them kind of envy me when they find out how I live which I also find kind of funny.

I can remember years ago being so broke that every now and then I'd envy ANYONE who had a full time paying job and money to spend...and that feeling would last for about 3 seconds...

Then I'd remember how crappy it is working a full time job, how much I hated it and how I'd prefer to be struggling but walking my own path.

Some of these people are genuinely concerned for you, some are just ignorant.

Think about it.

How many people do they know who make an income of over $100,000 a year or over $1,000,000 a year.

I know quite a few but I can remember one guy who really helped me out many years ago simply by telling me how he was making over $100,000 a year working one or two days a week.

He was encouraging, told me exactly what he was doing.

And it didn't matter so much what he was doing...it's not the path I ended up going down anyway.

But the fact that he was doing it...someone I knew personally had the income and lifestyle I wanted at the time...I could see it was possible...a genuine reality.

Now I know many, many people like that....some work a whole lot harder than others...some make a WHOLE lot more money.

But these people whose opinions you're worried about have probably never personally known ANYONE like that.

Their view of life is based on working their arses off to make a living and often getting beat down in life.

Or doing enough to get by and having a reasonably peaceful...if somewhat downtrodden...life.

These aren't people you should be taking business advice from.

But they're not people you should be angry at either.

They have enough problems as it is.

Kindest regards,
Andrew Cavanagh

P.S. If you read that post closely you'll notice that I shared a big secret...get to know some people who have the kind of success and lifestyle you want personally.

A huge part of business success is simple belief that you can get the things you want...that it's really possible.

[FlightGuy]

Originally Posted by AndrewCavanagh

You know as I get older and find that I'm really enjoying the laid back lifestyle I lead with a nice income and not too much work...

I find it difficult to see anyone as a vision killer.

In fact most of them kind of envy me when they find out how I live which I also find kind of funny.

I can remember years ago being so broke that every now and then I'd envy ANYONE who had a full time paying job and money to spend...and that feeling would last for about 3 seconds...

Then I'd remember how crappy it is working a full time job, how much I hated it and how I'd prefer to be struggling but walking my own path.

Some of these people are genuinely concerned for you, some are just ignorant.

Think about it.

How many people do they know who make an income of over $100,000 a year or over $1,000,000 a year.

I know quite a few but I can remember one guy who really helped me out many years ago simply by telling me how he was making over $100,000 a year working one or two days a week.

He was encouraging, told me exactly what he was doing.

And it didn't matter so much what he was doing...it's not the path I ended up going down anyway.

But the fact that he was doing it...someone I knew personally had the income and lifestyle I wanted at the time...I could see it was possible...a genuine reality.

Now I know many, many people like that....some work a whole lot harder than others...some make a WHOLE lot more money.

But these people whose opinions you're worried about have probably never personally known ANYONE like that.

Their view of life is based on working their arses off to make a living and often getting beat down in life.

Or doing enough to get by and having a reasonably peaceful...if somewhat downtrodden...life.

These aren't people you should be taking business advice from.

But they're not people you should be angry at either.

They have enough problems as it is.

Kindest regards,
Andrew Cavanagh

P.S. If you read that post closely you'll notice that I shared a big secret...get to know some people who have the kind of success and lifestyle you want personally.

A huge part of business success is simple belief that you can get the things you want...that it's really possible.

You are so damn spot on about this.

Surround yourself with positive and successful people. Soak it in, reap the rewards. I learned this the hard way too.

[Preben Frenning]

If you are persistent and stubborn enough, so-called "vision killers" don't exist.

Anyways, great tips andrew. You are definately right about successboost by hanging out with other successful people. I'll be that motivator for other people in a few months

P.S. I'm going to purchase your wso when I get the time to read and implement it all

[oleskool]

Stick to your guns and develop your dream.

I heard on a show Wayne Dyer was on say "The only regrets I have are about the things I didn't do." Live your life with no regrets.

[joshril]

Any updates? Hope you've got some solid deals working!

I started in the insurance business when I was 18 years old... My parents and almost everyone else I knew thought it was insane. I ended up earning almost 6 figures my first year, and I was only working about 2 days per week. Felt pretty good... All of the people saying is was a bad idea and I should get a steady job were making much less than I was and working a lot harder at it. Put your mind to anything and follow it up with action... you'll be unstoppable!

[AndrewCavanagh]

Originally Posted by kadensnga

My ex wife complained everynight that I was not getting to bed early...told me I was pipe dreaming and that my internet related telemarketing business wasn't gonna work... said I was "all talk"...blah, blah. blah... we finally split up (this was back around 2001...)...6 months later I had made like 300k, had a new car, a beautiful blond bombshell on my arm... and she was blowin my phone up begging me to come back home!

Stupidly I did...and we ended up divorcing anyway, bummer is that the blond really loved me. I just should have stayed with her, but she's married now.

Point is, don't let anybody tell you you're just a dreamer. amazing things "CAN" happen if you stay passionate.

I think the REAL moral of the story is if you're an internet marketer you should ALWAYS stay with the beautiful blonde bombshell...it's good for those 'this is my lifestyle' type photos in your sales letters.

I thought that was a given...but apparently not!

Kindest regards,
Andrew Cavanagh

[Preben Frenning]

Yeah, beautiful, blonde bombshells converts MUCH better than a "standard wife" in salesletters. Especially in the newbie market!

Lol, I guess I'm not the only one who stays up late to work and hang around the WF.
I'm hoping for a launch of my offline biz this week, so we'll see how it goes. Hopefully, my late nights will pay off, and I will be able to live that kind of lifestyle.

I wouldn't say it's completely necessary though,if getting a beautiful blonde was my main goal

Anyways, I hope people have success with this, please keep me posted!

- Prebz

[RentItNow]

I thought of doing this as well. The problem I see is I think very few local bizes would spend that kind of cash off the bat. I would use some kind of funnel. A $100 service, or even free to begin with. I could probably sign up stores all day long with that deal. BUT, as I am learning, you may only attract opportunistic customers and BURN through too much cash and more importantly time before getting to core customers. I'm still working on the model myself. Let me know how you do.

[Sheila]

How much a business will pay depends a lot on how much additional business they will be getting from having a website that actually generates leads for them, and providing them with a follow-up autoresponder system to stay in contact with their clients/customers/patients. You can't control their product, their pricing, or their offer, but you can get an idea of what their current conversions are and price yourself accordingly.

Look at the numbers. By having a good idea of the traffic they'll be getting, the lifetime value of each of their customers, and their current conversion rate - you'll have a good idea of how much you'll be increasing their overall profits - if you come up with an amount under $4K, then you're charging too much - but, in most cases, I don't think charging $4K will be an issue, once you show them the value you're giving them. It's all about the value.

[Victor Edson]

Matt,

I've had my fair share of sales jobs, and I'd just like to say it's extremely possible, and it may take 1 or it may take 100, but you'll hear a yes and more after that.

A good tip for selling to businesses is to get involved in your local small business organizations, and get yourself known locally.

Also go to as many Home Shows, and gadget conventions as you can and see which companies are already out there spending money on advertising, and talk to them. A lot of times you'll find small business owners right there in their own booth selling their services.

And if you're talking to an employee, treat them the same, ask them the same questions, and if they think the owner would be interested, offer them a commission if they can help you get a deal. For $50 or $100, you might have just closed the deal without even selling it.

When I was about 15 or 16 years old my sister in law came over and showed me something she almost couldn't believe was so cool, a business card! Yes a business card that was so catchy that she was showing everyone she knew. Think of the extra exposure Bill Sanders Carpentry was getting by having his business card on a piece of red transparent plastic. All she wanted to know was, have you ever seen anything like that? And she probably only asked 50 people.


The last person I talked to about working online who wasn't a close friend or family member was a small business owner who spent 4,000 euro to someone to set up a website, and get them ranked for a keyword. He and his wife were excited about being ranked for the keyword, but they weren't really getting the traffic they wanted.

And they would have happily kept that same guy on the books every month to build their website into a more profitable part of their business. He left money on the money, and didn't get any referrals from a happy customer, don't be that guy!

Even if the muffler shop, cookie company and flower shop weren't interested today, doesn't mean the travel agency, tomb stone maker, and bath renovators tomorrow won't.

A lot of businesses are starting to look at the internet as the new window shop, and if they aren't already online they know they should be, and they're feeling left behind. Someone needs to help these small businesses brand themselves to the new generation of internet buyers who go on google and find the services they need, and then buy. Too much money is being left on the table.

[sandy]

Matt,
You are absolutely right not to tell your family about your plans. It is important to surround yourself with positive support and energy. Until you can show them that you are moving in the right direction their attitude will drag you down.

[brucemcc]

Matt, For a minute there I thought you were writing my story for me! I am heading in the exact same direction as you. I have 3 clients that I did websites for. Charged about $500 each. I am also hosting their sites for $39.00 per month. Recently however I found a dentist in my area, put together a custom video just for him showing him what is wrong with his current site and online marketing. Showed him what I could do for him. I signed him at $500 per month without any problem. I am currently working on trying some direct mail postcard marketing to see what that does. My biggest problem is working the full time job doesn't give me anytime to go out and meet one on one with business owners. Not sure how to get enough biz going to make the leap to working for myself fulltime. It is coming though. I can't wait!

BruceMcc

[digigo]

Originally Posted by Matt Gannon

I hear about people charging 7k or more upfront,and like $1,500/mo after that, so I don't think 4k is bad, what does everyone else think?

it depends on what kind of business you are talking about... a lot of mom and pop businesses rely on foot traffic and word of mouth marketing.. their customers are not more than 5-10 miles radius any way.. you have a tough time selling the package to them..

But do give it a try and share the result with us...

[jaybaker]

I have had success marketing to small businesses in my small town though the rates are not quite as large as $4k as most of these businesses are fighting to stay open with the current state of the economy. I offer them a wordpress site set up with the graphics they want and any plugins for around $300 and then a one month deal on seo for $300 extra.

I feel as though I get a better response by making the face to face contact as opposed to sending out letters. Just my two cents.

[ppbiz]

Matt, those fees are MORE than reasonable. What you are proposing is about my average price and most business owners don't even think twice.

The key is though, to target business owners with a decent turnover (think $5 mil plus). This is because they are small enough that they don't have someone in house- yet large enough that they have a marketing budget. Makes things A LOT easier!

Good luck, I think if you stick with it you'll see success.

Rhiannon

Originally Posted by Matt Gannon

I hear about people charging 7k or more upfront,and like $1,500/mo after that, so I don't think 4k is bad, what does everyone else think?