Here's why you need to keep your biz relationships on the down low...

by R Hagel

Posted: 15 years ago 46 replies

INTERNET MARKETING

Hey, you're excited! You just sold your first product. Or service. Or maybe you got your first newsletter subscriber. Or maybe a "guru" just joined your newsletter list.

Very cool.

Go ahead and share that excitement. Post here on the forum and let us give you a big slap on the back. Let's pop the champagne. Take your sweetie out for dinner. Go skinny dipping. Take a few jello shots off a cute guy/gal...

Well, you get the idea -- celebrate. Enjoy. Savor.

But as you get caught up in the whirlwind of excitement, keep these two words in mind: client confidentiality.

Now, there's a chance your TOS (especially your list TOS) actually tell your subscribers that you won't reveal their info to anyone else. But even if you don't specifically tell people you won't reveal their names or other info... DON'T DO IT.

Keep your business private. Keep it on the down low.

See, some of your customers or prospects wouldn't enjoy finding out that you tell others that they bought your product, joined your newsletter, etc.

--

Fictional example...

I'm about to buy a vacation package and surprise my SO (Significant other? wow, this is totally fiction, but just follow along anyway). I decide to buy it from a Warrior. The Warrior gushes here on the forum about the vacation package I just purchased.

SO is also a Warrior. Surprised ruined.

Won't be buying from that person again.

--

Another example...

Let's suspend belief again and pretend I'm married to another Warrior (let's say Thaddeus, the Hillybilly Marketer). But shhh, I'm cheating on him (don't tell, ok?). I buy that vacation package from another Warrior... but this time I'm taking my guy on the side. The Warrior I purchased the package from gushes about the purchase... Thaddeus sees it... and my cheating ways are exposed.

Won't be buying from that person again.

---

Another example...

Offline business owner decides to whoop his competition by hiring someone to do SEO for his Company X. He hires someone here on the forum. The Warrior talks about what he's doing for Company X -- maybe even talking about what words he's optimizing for and how he's doing it.

One day the competitors are searching for Company X online, run into the thread... and decide to use the instructions and the same keywords to beat Company X.

Think maybe Company X might be a little peeved? You bet.

---

I could go on and on with examples of how revealing the names of your clients, prospects and JV partners could embarrass them, make them uncomfortable, or just plain piss them off. So show some courtesy and don't do it. And if there is a good reason to do it, ask for permission first.

And remember: There's always some prospect lurking quietly... and he's making the decision not to do business with you because he'd rather buy from someone who can be discreet.

Cheers,
Becky

#customer

melanied 15 years ago

I completely agree - if I want it known that I purchased a WSO or a service, I'll post in the thread myself, thankyouverymuch.
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- R Hagel 15 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by melanied
  
  I completely agree - if I want it known that I purchased a WSO or a service, I'll post in the thread myself, thankyouverymuch.
  
  Exactly.
  
  And if you don't mind it being known a bit more, you can even give permission to the product owner to use your testimonial elsewhere. But that's your choice.
  
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Andyhenry 15 years ago

What brought this on?

I haven't seen anyone do this but I'm guessing you have
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- R Hagel 15 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Andyhenry
  
  What brought this on?
  
  I haven't seen anyone do this but I'm guessing you have
  
  Yep. There's a recent one, but I've seen it happen over and over and over. Folks even start up threads here and ask, "what gurus on your list?" and stuff like that. Or a few months ago when a product owner got peeved at a customer and posted his private contact details.
  
  Happens a bit more than I'd like to see.
  
  Thanks
  
  1 reply
  
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  ShayB 15 years ago
  
  I run into this issue as a ghostwriter, as well.
  
  I have a lot of experience. I have clients whose names you would recognize.
  
  But there is no way I am going to tell anyone who my clients are without their permission, and some people don't want to say that they are using a ghostwriter.
  
  No biggie. Just a part of doing business.
  
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George Wright 15 years ago

Way back when, I was very excited to see who had joined my little group. Although I was happy to have them on board I didn't crow about it. After reading your OP I'm glad I didn't.

Thanks for the reminder.

George Wright
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R Hagel 15 years ago

George, you look a little drawn. Are you feeling ok?

Cheers,
Becky
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- AndrewCavanagh 15 years ago
  
  This is good advice.
  
  Learning to show some discretion in business is very important.
  
  Kindest regards,
  Andrew Cavanagh
  
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Devon Brown 15 years ago

Did someone say jello-shots? Is this the sign-up form for that?

Seriously though, you make a very valid point. I have been excited about a guru buying my product or signing up to my list and one time personally emailing me! But I kept it to myself and only told my closest confidants, ones that I know would share in my excitement but not reveal any details to anyone else. Although sometimes I would love to come on WF and shout it to the world.
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Mohsin Rasool 15 years ago

Hi Becky,

Thank you for posting this! Yes client confidentiality. It is even more needed
when you are offering services to them. We do projects for our clients and I know
they would ask us to work with them on projects which are going to be released
to the market next year or so, and they would never ever like us to share even a bit
of the behind-the-scenes operations.

Really Becky very Solid advice, thanks for sharing and also LOL for those scenarios.
Regards,
Mohsin
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Diana Lane

15 years ago

I know what you mean. A few years ago there was a big fuss in some of the papers because Cherie Blair (wife of Tony, UK Prime Minister at the time) had been discovered to have been buying a few bits and bobs on eBay and the sellers were revelling in fifteen minutes of fame. I thought that was a revolting way to behave, and there was no way I would have bought a thing from any of them afterwards. There's never a good reason to breach a customer's privacy, and as you've pointed out, a million good reasons why you shouldn't.

Come to think of it, if that whole thing then hadn't shone the spotlight on thrifty politicians trawling eBay for bargains, the papers might not be shining the spotlight now on extravagant politicians who'll spend three figures on a toaster

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melanied 15 years ago

I've definitely seen WSO threads where the person posts every so often with "Product sent to username, username, and username."

I know it's supposed to be social proof, but all it is to me is proof that I don't want to buy! LOL
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marciayudkin

15 years ago

Becky,

This is a really important point. Three personal examples...

Last week I got an email from someone at a big company who wanted to pass my email newsletter around within his company. He asked, who else from XX company is on your list?

I replied very nicely that he was free to forward the newsletter within his company but that I never revealed my subscribers' identities without their permission. Made perfect sense to him after I explained it.

The second example happened six years ago but I have not forgotten it. I hired a VA to take care of my business affairs while I was on a long trip. Something came up that she wasn't sure how to handle, and she mentioned to me that she'd asked for advice on it on a forum for VAs. She used my name as her client.

This made me quite upset, and with my current VA, I have made it clear that she is not to use my name with anyone without my knowledge and permission. She agrees with this philosophy.

Third example: I have a private member site and have had people send me messages asking, whatever happened to so-and-so? I say I'm sorry, but it's not right for me to share information that was given to me in private. I will not say whether or not the person is still a member and just not showing up that often, whether they quit because of money problems or whatever.

Some of this stuff should be common sense, but it obviously isn't.

Marcia Yudkin

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R Hagel

15 years ago

Originally Posted by AndrewCavanagh

Learning to show some discretion in business is very important.

Indeed.

I mean some marketers think about products like porn and agree that client confidentiality is a good idea. But it doesn't occur to these same folks that their own clients might not like being "outed."

Originally Posted by Renegade Success

Did someone say jello-shots? Is this the sign-up form for that?

You uncovered my true reason for this post -- to promote my new jello shot blog. Please go to _____...

Originally Posted by Mohsin Rasool

Hi Becky,
We do projects for our clients and I know
they would ask us to work with them on projects which are going to be released
to the market next year or so, and they would never ever like us to share even a bit
of the behind-the-scenes operations.

Yes! For example, folks don't always like others to know they hired a ghostwriter (and create the product themselves). And as you mentioned, freelancers shouldn't be yapping about what's going on inside someone's business.

Originally Posted by Diana Lane

I I thought that was a revolting way to behave, and there was no way I would have bought a thing from any of them afterwards.

I would feel the same way!

Originally Posted by mywebwork

Wow, you sure know how to have fun Becky - I feel so sorry for Thaddeus right now!

Well, if you were married to Thaddeus you'd probably start doing jello shots too (which leads to all those other activities).

Originally Posted by melanied

I know it's supposed to be social proof, but all it is to me is proof that I don't want to buy!

Me too! (And GREAT example!)

Originally Posted by marciayudkin

Becky,
This is a really important point. Three personal examples...

Thanks for sharing those three excellent examples.

That reminds me of when I hired a freelancer on a forum. He not only revealed publicly that I was his client, he also took one of our emails and shared it as a testimonial of sorts. All of this without my permission. I wasn't a happy camper.

Cheers,
Becky

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Don Schenk

15 years ago

Originally Posted by R Hagel

Indeed.

You uncovered my true reason for this post -- to promote my new jello shot blog. Please go to _____...

Cheers,
Becky

And here I thought it was about the skinny dipping. Darn. Well, at least now my neighbors won't need to go running in fear when I take my clothes off.

My wife is an attorney with a high profile firm. Apparently she and others at the firm work for many high profile clients. I say apparently because that is all she can tell me. She never says who the firms clients are. It is not prermitted.

And that is how it should be.

:-Don

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Steven Wagenheim

15 years ago

Becky, this is why I really don't understand why people would willingly
supply testimonials for certain products.

I know it's not quite the same thing but imagine this.

Marketer X comes out with a product for creating authority sites.

Marketer Y writes a testimonial as to how great the authority site model
works using this method.

Marketer Z looks up marketer Y's name and finds HIS authority sites.

Marketer Z then sets out to best marketer Y in the SERPs using the exact
same methods.

A little stretched?

Maybe, but the more info you give about what you do and what products
you use to do it, the easier it is for the smart marketer (and therein lies
the key) to reverse engineer what you've done simply by finding your
sites online.

It's not hard to do.

This is why I give very few testimonials unless I am absolutely sure that
nobody can use that info against me.

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Andyhenry

15 years ago

That's an interesting point Steven and I'm sure it happens - but people who copy others and don't innovate never do well over the long term because they rely on others to come up with their business model for them.

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Steven Wagenheim

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Andyhenry

Andy, to a degree, don't we all copy those who came before us?

I certainly gained a lot of my marketing knowledge by reading books and
observing what others do. Yes, I've come up with some things on my own,
and maybe that's what separates the very successful people from the so-so
successful people, but I've also learned from others. To say I haven't would
be a lie and quite self indulgent.

As a matter of fact, I have personally (not publicly) thanked certain people
for the few things that they taught me.

But I do understand what you mean by somebody directly copying
another marketer without any individual thought at all. I believe you can
only get so far with that mindset.

Why I try to do, when I learn something from somebody else, is look to see
what I can add to it to maybe make it even more effective. Sometimes I
succeed and sometimes I end up ruining the whole process. But even when
I fall on my face, I at least learn that what I did isn't going to work.

For example, I tried to take the basic model used in the occult niche and
apply it to a unique product and concept. It bombed, but not because
the methods didn't work but because the product I created was one that
just didn't catch on.

But taking chances like that is what separates the good from the great
marketers and product creators...not that I in any way classify myself
as a great marketer. But at least I march to the tune of my own guitar.

Anyway, sorry for taking this so far off topic, but your comment about
people who simply copy tactics made me think about all this rambling.

I'll go back into my gopher hole right now.

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Paul Myers

15 years ago

Becky,

This is a really important point. Thanks for emphasizing it.

When I was writing copy for clients, one of the things that a lot of them wanted was confidentiality. I always assumed that to be the case unless they said otherwise. (At the time, folks in marketing online didn't like it known that they outsourced something like sales copy. They thought it would make them look less experienced or knowledgeable. Fortunately, the market has matured since then.)

When anyone would ask me if I had written for [whoever], my reply was consistent: "I don't answer that question. If the person is a client and I say yes, I've violated a confidence. If they are and I say no, I've lied to you. If they're not and I say they're not, that signals that I'm willing to discuss the issue and you might ask about other people. At some point, I'd be put in the position where I'd either have to lie to you or violate a confidence. I don't much like either of those options."

One day I said that to someone who asked me about a woman who was a client. I didn't know it, but they were close friends. The person who asked went back to the client and told her what I'd said. Over the years, I got a LOT of business as a result of her telling that story to her friends.

People appreciate discretion. It's a sign of real respect.

Anyone who wants to is welcome to steal that response for their own use, by the way.

Paul

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Andyhenry

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

Anyone who wants to is welcome to steal that response for their own use, by the way.

Paul

Can I say where I got it

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Paul Myers

15 years ago

Andy,

Can I say where I got it

Sure, if you want people knowing you're getting ideas from me.

That may not be the best thing for your rep.

Paul

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Michael Mayo

15 years ago

Oh come on Becky,

You mean I would be wrong to tell other Warriors that my list contains names like,

1. Daffy Duck
2. Bugs Bunny
3. Grinch
4. Mary Poppins
etc...

On a more serious note, I totally agree with your OP!

Have a Great Day!
Michael
PS, Now that I've looked at my list, it seems the only one that
opens my mailings is Mortimer Snerd.

oops!

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R Hagel

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Mayo

Oh come on Becky,

You mean I would be wrong to tell other Warriors that my list contains names like,

1. Daffy Duck
2. Bugs Bunny
3. Grinch
4. Mary Poppins
etc...

Hey, those guys are on my list too!

Double oops. (Where's that edit button?)

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Andyhenry

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

Andy,Sure, if you want people knowing you're getting ideas from me.

That may not be the best thing for your rep.

Paul

Sometimes I need to blame them on someone

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Tina Golden

15 years ago

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rapidscc

15 years ago

Originally Posted by TMG Enterprises

rapidscc, breaking the confidence of one partner to impress another is not only not being discreet, if the potential partner is ethical, you are likely to blow that deal. I know that if you did this to me, I would never work with you. I really think you should refresh your memory on the meaning of confidentiality.

Tina G

Hi Tina,

There are different types of customer relationships. A person can judge by himself what type of relationship he's with a customer.

If it's a don't kiss and tell then definitely "DON'T KISS AND TELL". but if you have reached a type of relationship that you have really impressed and served the customer beyond his wildest expectations, in most cases you don't even have to tell others yourself. Word or mouth will already work for you.

If this is the case it's where I'm saying that you should still practice being discreet. You don't want to be seen as a name dropper even if it's alright.

Totally saying you should "NOT" mention names is wrong for there are cases and situations that you should BUT also saying that "YOU SHOULD NAME DROP" all the name is also incorrect.

Evaluate the situation, specially your level of relationship with a customer. (specially non-disclosure clauses). Then use your own mind. Both ways is wrong if used erroneously..

oMar

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JohnMcCabe 15 years ago

Becky, thanks for posting this. I have to believe it helps when a respected member of the community such as yourself brings it up.

There's another aspect to the idea of confidentiality...

I've mostly seen it in the "offline gold/cash cow" type threads. Someone wants to learn how to set up a site, or what content to put in an autoresponder, etc., and asks for examples. Then they get upset when others refuse to post links, etc.

Beyond the matter of ethics and confidentiality, which are sufficient unto themselves for denying such requests, there are practical reasons not to share. They have nothing to do with "not wanting to help others" or "afraid of competition."

1. There are over 100,000 members of this forum, and via Google et. al., millions with access to the public areas. Not all of them have lofty ideals. I would hate to provide, and get paid for, a custom design and have my client come back later because the client found an exact copy promoting something else.

2. One of the value-added services I provide is testing and tracking. If I post a link to a client site, and dozens or hundreds of Warriors click through and look around, it could screw up important tests. Which could take profits out of my client's (and my) pocket.

3. If I have them hooked up to a service like Aweber, with fees tied to the number of subscribers, posting a link so non-prospects can satisfy their curiosity by signing up for an autoresponder is directly costing my client money.

So if anybody wants to post one of those "I just got a client, can you show me what you did?" posts, don't take it personally if you don't get the response you're hoping for. There are solid practical and ethical reasons for not doing so.
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Paul Myers 15 years ago

Andy,

Sometimes I need to blame them on someone

In that case, feel free. I'm an excellent scapegoat, or so I'm told...

Paul
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mywebwork

15 years ago

Originally Posted by R Hagel

Go skinny dipping. Take a few jello shots off a cute guy/gal...

I'm married to another Warrior (let's say Thaddeus, the Hillybilly Marketer). But shhh, I'm cheating on him (don't tell, ok?).

Wow, you sure know how to have fun Becky - I feel so sorry for Thaddeus right now!

Seriously, this is an excellent point. Our sites are all supposed to have privacy policies, and the purpose of these is to show that we don't share subscriber or customer information. This needs to be true both online and offline.

Great post, I love starting my day with a smile!

Bill

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Raydal 15 years ago

Way back then when I just started offering copywriting services
a fellow Warrior hired me and I posted my first draft on Fortin's
board for a critique. He wasn't too happy about it because he
didn't want anyone to know he was bringing out this product.

Since then I never shared work in progress publicly without
the clients approval. Of course the completed work I can
use in my promotional efforts, but this is after the product
is launched.

Lesson learned.

-Ray Edwards
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HeySal

15 years ago

Confidentiality isn't just an issue of intelligent business practice and courtesy. If you have made privacy statements, it can also be a legal issue. If you breech a confidentiality statement, you could wind up in a court battle.......and if your statement is in writing, it's a losing battle.

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R Hagel

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Raydal

Lesson learned.

Good lesson. It's easy to get caught up in the excitement, wanting to do a good job, etc that we sometimes forget about privacy issues.

Originally Posted by Mrslalas7

Hmmm. this seems interesting. But I am not sure if copywriting is something I am really good at.

For this thread, all you need to be good at is discretion.

Originally Posted by ShayRockhold

I have a lot of experience. I have clients whose names you would recognize.

Really? Who are they?

.
.
.

(hehe, just kidding)

Originally Posted by Paul Myers

When anyone would ask me if I had written for [whoever], my reply was consistent: "I don't answer that question. If the person is a client and I say yes, I've violated a confidence. If they are and I say no, I've lied to you. If they're not and I say they're not, that signals that I'm willing to discuss the issue and you might ask about other people. At some point, I'd be put in the position where I'd either have to lie to you or violate a confidence. I don't much like either of those options."

(...snip...)

Anyone who wants to is welcome to steal that response for their own use, by the way.

Consider it swiped! That's an excellent answer.

Originally Posted by HeySal

You're exactly right. At a minimum this is a privacy issue that can lead to customer/partner irritation. On the other end of the spectrum, it can lead to legal nightmares.

Cheers,
Becky

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ShayB 15 years ago

Originally Posted by R Hagel

Really? Who are they?

.
.
.

(hehe, just kidding)

Cheers,
Becky

You bad girl. ROTFL
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rapidscc 15 years ago

I agree, people should stop name dropping.

For me it's simply because having big names on your list or whatever is not really a good selling point. In some cases it can even work the other way.

I've heard people get disappointed because of some bad experiences with some "Big" people. What if the "BIG" name on your list happens to be one of them.

On the other hand, if you can sense in the situation that name dropping can help you, say, maybe in closing a deal. You could do it in the most discreet manner and only as a last option (if you are pressed for it). Do it with the tone of confidentiality. Doing it this way can help improve your image to the client but again do it discreetly.

Don't shout out in the whole world your clients name, unless he is also a JV partner :-)
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kennethtang 15 years ago

Doubly agreed...

Call it discretion or client confidentiality or whatever. I call it having a touch of class. Regardless of whether or not you have it stated explicitly in your TOS, it is a sign of good breeding and a touch of class to be discreet about such things.

I don't know how to explain it...

It's like when back when I was a very young man, reputed to have lots and lots of girlfriends (all rumors, all not true ) and "the guys" would ask me, "did you...you know...did you do her"?

And always, I kept my mouth shut. I answer nothing, and deny nothing.
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Richard Tunnah

15 years ago

Becky,
I've noticed a number WSO seller's posting PM into their thread.Presumably to bump their WSO. However for me if I send a PM it's because I don't want to post the question/querie within the thread. So WSO sellers please think before just copying and pasting a PM. If it's a great question check if it's ok to copy it to your thread with or without the persons details attached.

Rich

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Harvey Segal 15 years ago

Becky

I'd like to thank you for this good advice and also for
purchasing my last ten WSOs

Harvey
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- Martin Luxton 15 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Harvey.Segal
  
  Becky
  
  I'd like to thank you for this good advice and also for
  purchasing my last ten WSOs
  
  Harvey
  
  Harvey,
  
  I also purchased the 10 before that on her behalf because she didn't want her SO to know how much she was spending on WSOs.
  
  Seriously, though, is it so hard to think through the consequences of opening your mouth about clients/colleagues/bosses? It's kind of like Pandora's Box Meets The Butterfly Effect.
  
  One of the things I do freelance at the moment, I am not even allowed to tell people I'm doing it except in one situation. It's no big deal. There is a good reason why and that's enough for me.
  
  Martin
  
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ExRat

15 years ago

Hi Steven,

Marketer X comes out with a product for creating authority sites.

Marketer Y writes a testimonial as to how great the authority site model
works using this method.

Marketer Z looks up marketer Y's name and finds HIS authority sites.

Most of the time, marketer Y doesn't have any authority sites. Just one site with a reciprocal testimonial from marketer X. And marketer X is actually just another of marketer Y's personas.

:rolleyes:

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Steve Peters Benn 15 years ago

ExRat. That's shocking. Which mean's I'm a bit niave... oh dear.
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- ExRat 15 years ago
  
  Hi Steve,
  
  ExRat. That's shocking. Which mean's I'm a bit niave... oh dear.
  
  In fairness, I'm a bit cynical. But not without reason. Google some names from IM testimonials and you'll soon get the picture. Learn to use domaintools.com well and nose around a bit you'll get the high definition picture. Watch what occurs in forums and put them all together and you're screwed - you'll be cynical like me.
  
  Then you'll know where the inspiration for these SEO link-wheels and SEO cross-linking mini-nets come from.
  
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  Roger Davis
  
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  Andyhenry 15 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by ExRat
  
  Hi Steve,
  
  In fairness, I'm a bit cynical.
  
  I'd never have guessed
  
  You're not paranoid - they really are out to get you.
  
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  nothing to see here.
  
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Chris W. Sutton

15 years ago

As usual, Becky comes up with excellent advice! You seem to have disappeared for a bit but it looks like you're back now... keep em coming!

BUT, there is one problem I have with your post...

Go skinny dipping. Take a few jello shots off a cute guy/gal...

I KNOW that was intended at me and I am getting tired of being treated as a sexual object. I want to be respected for my mind not my sex appeal! Please don't hate me because I'm beautiful!

EDIT...

Besides that, take a look at my picture... I'M ONLY 7 YEARS OLD AND UNDERAGE!

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Steven Fullman

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Chris W. Sutton

As usual, Becky comes up with excellent advice! You seem to have disappeared for a bit but it looks like you're back now... keep em coming!

BUT, there is one problem I have with your post...

I KNOW that was intended at me and I am getting tired of being treated as a sexual object. I want to be respected for my mind not my sex appeal! Please don't hate me because I'm beautiful!

EDIT...

Besides that, take a look at my picture... I'M ONLY 7 YEARS OLD AND UNDERAGE!

Watch it, Chris...I hear that Hillbilly fella is crazy.

Especially when he's been cheated on...

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Michael Mayo

15 years ago

Hey Chris,
I tried to look at it Mind you, All I see in the picture is
Ad Space, How Much will it cost me to stamp the forehead
with my URL? :rolleyes:

Originally Posted by Chris W. Sutton

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R Hagel

15 years ago

We had bad weather here last night so I had to go hide in my basement.

Now I come back to all this great discussion. I want to thank everyone for their posts. Let me comment on just a few...

Originally Posted by Richard Tunnah

That's one I hadn't seen.

Originally Posted by Harvey.Segal

Becky

I'd like to thank you for this good advice and also for
purchasing my last ten WSOs
Harvey

I'm glad you posted, Harvey, because I wanted to let you know there's going to be a slight shipping delay on the "Girls Gone Wild: Unrated and Uncut" DVD set you ordered. You should have it by Wednesday.

Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe

Beyond the matter of ethics and confidentiality, which are sufficient unto themselves for denying such requests, there are practical reasons not to share. They have nothing to do with "not wanting to help others" or "afraid of competition."

Food for thought! I'm willing to bet lots of folks aren't all that afraid of the competition (because sooner or later you hope your entire niche sees your site). You gave three reasons for not sharing... I'm sure there are even more. Hopefully that sheds some light on the "not sharing" issue for some.

Cheers,
Becky

P.S. Chris, if you refer back to example #2 in my original post, you'll see you're not the one who interests me. It's your cousin.

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Harvey Segal

15 years ago

Originally Posted by R Hagel

Great, I'll let Paul Myers know.

I was doing him a favour as he ran out of Paypal funds.

Harvey

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Richard Tunnah 15 years ago

Originally Posted by Harvey.Segal

Great, I'll let Paul Myers know.

I was doing him a favour as he ran out of Paypal funds.

Harvey

LOL....the visions...eek!!

Rich
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