wow, who does google think they are?

39 replies
Wow...

Google is already "powerful" enough, has been accused of being a monopoly, stores data, records many things you do, has been shown not to be that trustworthy (i.e., they don't "delete forever" your e-mail -- read the fine print, if someone has a problem with the data, they can hand it over, etc, etc) -- has there finger in so many pots its pretty much possible to track everything you do (i.e., google analytics... if you use your real name on one website, then visit 10 other websites - if all of them use the 'free' google analytics, it is possible to store all that information, resell the packaged information to marketing firms, etc, etc).

NOW -- if you want to set up a gmail account -- they also want your PHONE number to make the tracking that much easier, under the bullsh*t guise of "protecting" their gmail accounts.

Try and set up a gmail account -- you will be then asked to set up a CELL PHONE -- and they insult you telling you -- well, if you don't have a cell phone -- get a friend to do it for you.

Who wants to use their services now?

I just hope young "kids" aren't stupid enough to sign up with google and just voluntarily hand over their cell phone number. Next... I'm surprised if they wouldn't be asking for passport ID's, three references, and a $5,000 deposit just to use their e-mail. How freakin ridiculous.

Edit:

I decided to add this here for the benefit of new readers with respect to one of Mike's comments:

Mike,

You are correct that they can decide their own business practises. And of course there are plenty of other 'free' e-mail providers. However, I am objecting to several things on several different levels, not just the 'immediate' SMS requirement.

1. Unfortunatley there will be people dumb enough to provide this information. And this information 99.9% will be misused, because these people don't read the fine print, or the information 'accidentally' gets placed into the 'wrong' hands, etc, etc.

2. It's sets a dangerous precedent, in which other firms figure it is 'ok' with this kind of "verification". Before you know it, you see all sorts of services popping up with this requirement. (As a matter of fact, it is already happening, and firms feel that it is their 'right' to have this information, and many people voluntarily hand it over, because 'everyone else' is doing it).

People are already getting "used" to voluntarily providing all of their personal information, whether it is buying a pack of batteries at radio shack (what is your phone,address/etc), or ordering food from KFC (a number of stores, if not all, now require biometric fingerprint scans to open the cash register).

The fact is that this information is now being demanded, and some people will voluntarily hand it over, until it eventually becomes a "requirement" and a "business standard". And then there is a HUGE potential for misuse and abuse down the road, that many people don't seem to see. If it was "truly" just a simple verification to "honestly" just weed out spam -- then not a bad idea. But the thing is -- the information is almost always 'saved', tracked, and then misused. That is my objection.
#google #wow
  • Profile picture of the author Lisa Gergets
    Yeah, I'm going to have a serious problem with this as I don't have a cellphone. It's pretty ridiculous.
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  • Profile picture of the author BIG Mike
    Banned
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    • Profile picture of the author Johnathan
      Mike,

      You are correct that they can decide their own business practises. And of course there are plenty of other 'free' e-mail providers. However, I am objecting to several things on several different levels, not just the 'immediate' SMS requirement.

      1. Unfortunatley there will be people dumb enough to provide this information. And this information 99.9% will be misused, because these people don't read the fine print, or the information 'accidentally' gets placed into the 'wrong' hands, etc, etc.

      2. It's sets a dangerous precedent, in which other firms figure it is 'ok' with this kind of "verification". Before you know it, you see all sorts of services popping up with this requirement.

      People are already getting "used" to voluntarily providing all of their personal information, whether it is buying a pack of batteries at radio shack (what is your phone,address/etc), or ordering food from KFC (a number of stores, if not all, now require biometric fingerprint scans to open the cash register).

      The fact is that this information is now being demanded, and some people will voluntarily hand it over, until it eventually becomes a "requirement" and a "business standard".



      Originally Posted by BIG Mike View Post

      I have to disagree with you wholeheartedly, because Google isn't doing anything (except on a vastly larger scale) than anyone else in business is doing.

      What's more, Google doesn't force anyone to use their free services - and like any business, they can pretty much define the policies and terms of use anyway they want to as long as it's legal.

      I've never understood all the ranting about large organizations like them - they're in business to make money just like all of us are, right? And personally, because they're like the epitome of Internet Marketing, I think they're worth studying and emulating.

      Honestly, the solution is a simple one - don't use them if you're not comfortable with them. Don't get angry or frustrated; just don't use them.
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      • Profile picture of the author JohnMcCabe
        Originally Posted by Johnathan View Post

        People are already getting "used" to voluntarily providing all of their personal information, whether it is buying a pack of batteries at radio shack (what is your phone,address/etc), or ordering food from KFC (a number of stores, if not all, now require biometric fingerprint scans to open the cash register).

        The fact is that this information is now being demanded, and some people will voluntarily hand it over, until it eventually becomes a "requirement" and a "business standard".
        Johnathan, collecting customer data is nothing new. Radio Shack did it when I worked there briefly almost 30 years ago. The information they ask for is already publicly available.

        Your KFC example doesn't match your rant here. If you were talking about working for big G, maybe. The thumbprint scan is purely for security, so that only the employee who is supposed to open the cash drawer can do so. Before that, they used a scannable ID card, and before that, a mechanical key.

        If you were born in the USA, there's likely a scan somewhere of both your handprints and footprints, collected at birth...

        As far as the cell number, if you're that paranoid, go down to Walmart and get a disposable cell. Do your verifications, then stomp on it and throw the pieces in a deep hole.

        There's absolutely nothing new here; companies are simply using more high-tech methods.
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  • Profile picture of the author Karen Keyes
    From my research it's only certain blocks of IP addresses that will get assigned to the mobile phone confirmation requirement. I also found that they did this years ago as well (some time ago).. I'm going to test creating one now and report back results.
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  • Profile picture of the author Steven Carl Kelly
    Don't forget: Google Voice is going to be rolled out soon.
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    • Profile picture of the author Project-Octagon
      Originally Posted by Steven Carl Kelly View Post

      Don't forget: Google Voice is going to be rolled out soon.

      Steven, What's Google Voice? When is that coming out?

      Thanks!
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      • Profile picture of the author Fernando Veloso
        Originally Posted by Project-Octagon View Post

        Steven, What's Google Voice? When is that coming out?

        Thanks!
        Use search?

        Google Voice

        Anyway, i use Gmail everyday not only to my gmail account but to receive/send from some different domainname accounts.

        Yes, Gmail can do it too.

        But i really don't like the idea of giving out my mobile number to someone. Maybe they're just trying to close doors to spammy accounts? You know, users who create 50 Gmail accounts per day?



        Fernando
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  • Profile picture of the author Karen Keyes
    Ugh.. right now I'm connected to my work's VPN server so my IP address is from the US (I'm in Canada). Tried creating a gmail and it is asking me for mobile phone confirmation. Then I wondered what do they say to those who don't have a cell phone? Hmph...

    SMS account verification - Gmail Help

    I'll try later when I disconnect from my VPN and my IP is from Canada, to see if that's going to ask for mobile phone confirmation also.

    Karen
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  • Profile picture of the author Expert-World
    Most of us have several domain names that we easily set up up POP3 email accounts on. None of us have to use gmail.

    It can be that they are trying to reduce scams and spamming or
    just trying to make more money
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    • Profile picture of the author Dan C. Rinnert
      Originally Posted by Expert-World View Post

      Most of us have several domain names that we easily set up up POP3 email accounts on. None of us have to use gmail.
      Exactly. I don't see why people feel the need to have a gmail account. It looks unprofessional anyway. You know how the advice is to have a domain name for your website so you don't look amateurish by having an URL like mysite.somebodyelsessite.dom? Same thing applies to eMail.

      If you have your own domain and website, you can get a POP mail account generally without any issues. You might even be able to setup an IMAP account. And, there's really no reason you couldn't set up your own webmail account either, if that's what you're looking for.
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      • Profile picture of the author The Copy Nazi
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        Originally Posted by Dan C. Rinnert View Post

        Exactly. I don't see why people feel the need to have a gmail account. It looks unprofessional anyway. You know how the advice is to have a domain name for your website so you don't look amateurish by having an URL like mysite.somebodyelsessite.dom? Same thing applies to eMail.

        If you have your own domain and website, you can get a POP mail account generally without any issues. You might even be able to setup an IMAP account. And, there's really no reason you couldn't set up your own webmail account either, if that's what you're looking for.
        Gmail looks "unprofessional"? Hardly. You tried the fully-loaded version? Amazing what it can do.
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        • Profile picture of the author R Hagel
          Originally Posted by Metronicity View Post

          Gmail looks "unprofessional"? Hardly. You tried the fully-loaded version? Amazing what it can do.
          The interface may look professional. But having a gmail account (rather than one on your own domain) can look unprofessional in the customers' eyes.

          Like imagine if you went to email Dell computers, and you wrote to them at: Dell@gmail.com.

          Or amazon-books@gmail.com. Or clickbank-support@gmail.com.

          It just looks... unprofessional.

          Cheers,
          Becky
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          • Profile picture of the author Steven Carl Kelly
            Originally Posted by R Hagel View Post

            The interface may look professional. But having a gmail account (rather than one on your own domain) can look unprofessional in the customers' eyes.
            Becky:

            This has actually changed a lot over time. Because this e-mail service is offered by "The Big G" you'd be surprised how accepted it is, even by customers and even in business circles.
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            • Profile picture of the author jcaviani
              Google simply needed to protect its interests from a host of miscreants who were creating gmail accounts by the hundreds to carry out their misdeeds.

              This development is really no different than many of the other least common denominator type rules we have to suffer with because a few among us can't learn to control their greed impulses.

              Unfortunately, those that know what they are doing with VOIP can get around this little speed bump rather easily and once again it just turns out to be an inconvenience for those who have accepted that certain rules of conduct are necessary for us to stay on the civil side of civilized.

              It's funny (and sad) there are parts of this forum (CPA forum) where people talk openly about committing FRAUD. You will also find any attempt to reason with these plebes or illuminate the law is met with an endless supply of self serving rationalizations and resentment.

              Unfortunately, for every one of theses scumbags you take out, ten more spring up like weeds after a wild fire. The good part is that while they are tinkering around with their juvenile business models, which are just another form of employment, the rest of us will be developing relationships we can serve for a lifetime.
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              • Profile picture of the author John Durham
                Hey Jonathon,

                I was kind of rude to you on a post a few weeks back and just wanted to publicly apologize and say I'm sorry. You have alot of great things to say.

                It was unbecoming and certainly not appropriate for me to do that. Please accept my apologies, there's enough negative people around already the world doesn't need me or you to add one more.

                Once again sorry dude. Didn't act rude in private, so I didn't want to apologize in private.

                Maybe you don't remember. If so; Good, it didn't hurt you then.

                On dealing with companies like Google:

                They are like a thousand pound guerrilla. When you try to make friends with a 1,000 pound guerilla, and you hand em a banana... they could slap your head off. If they don't, though you just made friends with a 1,000 pound guerrilla!

                You just have to ask yourself Is it worth taking the chance?
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                • Profile picture of the author Johnathan
                  Yes, I remember, and sure, no problem

                  Please to hear you like what I have to say. And yes (pursuant to the thread I believe you are referring to), I think it is great to 'make' money, provide quality products, etc, etc, and I think people should do that, and give it their all. However, when the information is abused, provided under false pretenses, or designed to 'trick' someone into giving information their commonsense would otherwise tell them not to, that's what I object to.

                  Originally Posted by kadensnga View Post

                  Hey Jonathon,

                  I was kind of rude to you on a post a few weeks back and just wanted to publicly apologize and say I'm sorry. You have alot of great things to say.

                  It was unbecoming and certainly not appropriate for me to do that. Please accept my apologies, there's enough negative people around already the world doesn't need me or you to add one more.

                  Once again sorry dude. Didn't act rude in private, so I didn't want to apologize in private.

                  Maybe you don't remember. If so; Good, it didn't hurt you then.

                  On dealing with companies like Google:

                  They are like a thousand pound guerrilla. When you try to make friends with a 1,000 pound guerilla, and you hand em a banana... they could slap your head off. If they don't, though you just made friends with a 1,000 pound guerrilla!

                  You just have to ask yourself Is it worth taking the chance?
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    • Profile picture of the author bgmacaw
      Originally Posted by Expert-World View Post

      Most of us have several domain names that we easily set up up POP3 email accounts on. None of us have to use gmail.
      And there are also plenty of free alternative email sites. Google may rule search but they don't rule email.... yet.
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  • Profile picture of the author The Copy Nazi
    Banned
    Originally Posted by Johnathan View Post

    Wow...

    Google is already "powerful" enough, has been accused of being a monopoly, stores data, records many things you do, has been shown not to be that trustworthy (i.e., they don't "delete forever" your e-mail -- read the fine print, if someone has a problem with the data, they can hand it over, etc, etc) -- has there finger in so many pots its pretty much possible to track everything you do (i.e., google analytics... if you use your real name on one website, then visit 10 other websites - if all of them use the 'free' google analytics, it is possible to store all that information, resell the packaged information to marketing firms, etc, etc).

    NOW -- if you want to set up a gmail account -- they also want your PHONE number to make the tracking that much easier, under the bullsh*t guise of "protecting" their gmail accounts.

    Try and set up a gmail account -- you will be then asked to set up a CELL PHONE -- and they insult you telling you -- well, if you don't have a cell phone -- get a friend to do it for you.

    Who wants to use their services now?

    I just hope young "kids" aren't stupid enough to sign up with google and just voluntarily hand over their cell phone number. Next... I'm surprised if they wouldn't be asking for passport ID's, three references, and a $5,000 deposit just to use their e-mail. How freakin ridiculous.
    What's the problem? Just use a bodgey number. And a proxy server. You know why they're so powerful? Because they're bloody good at everything they do. They have 67% of the Search market as opposed to their nearest "rival" Yahoo with 16%. Which isn't to say they don't annoy me 'cause they do. Ever tried communicating with them when they flick your Adsense a/c from a site? You can whistle Dixie.
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  • Profile picture of the author R Hagel
    I absolutely agree with Big Mike.

    Not only do you have 100% free will regarding whether you do business or don't do business with Google, there are also plenty of other choices. Like the email, for example. You can get an email account on your own domain. You can get a Yahoo or Hotmail account. You can get one through your ISP. Hell, you can forget email all together and go back to using those stone tablets that Doc Taylor is always raving about.

    Cheers,
    Becky
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  • Profile picture of the author Kurt Henninger
    Well, there are the big boys on the block, and really provide the best service for searchers. Until a search engine comes up with some real competition for them, we are stuck with what we have arent' we?
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  • Profile picture of the author houdy
    Isn't a free email account a "Right" like Life, Liberty, a house, a job (or welfare) and health insurance?
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  • Profile picture of the author Lisa Gergets
    Well, looks like there's an easy way around it...

    Also, if you know someone who already has a Gmail address, you can ask them to email an invitation to you.
    Just send an invitation to yourself...that's what I'll do.
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  • Profile picture of the author Steven Fullman
    I guess these guys will get real busy, real soon

    inumbr:: Auto expiring. FREE anonymous phone numbers for online safety.

    They're upgrading their architecture at the moment.

    ...I wonder why

    Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author Sam Rodrigo
    Hey Johnathan,

    Not to be a smart ass, but using google is *optional*. Nobody will ever put a gun to your head and say "sign up", unless Kim Jung Il is sitting behind you and that's what he wants.

    As long as they tell us what they do, then all is well. However, keep in mind that when the Patriot Act was passed there was a requirement by the Feds that they could not tell. So, the best thing to do is to assume that EVERYTHING you ever do on Google is out in the open.

    If you have something private, just whisper. That's still possible.

    I personally think that in this digital age we have to "give a bit" and "take what we can get" with all the resources online. I think our lives are much better by all this stuff at our fingertips.

    Well, with the exception of Twitter. Man, for the life of me, I have no idea what all the fuss is about.

    Anyway, success,
    Sam
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  • Profile picture of the author jakesellers
    Gmail is abused to death by 419'ers and spammers, steps that help curtail abuse are positive. I'd be happy if Google cc verified new accounts. If you look on various blackhat sites you'll see Gmail accounts sell for about $10 per 1000. Craigslist also phone verifies accounts, if they didn't cl would be more of a mess than it is.
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  • If you don't like Google, don't use Google. That's the free market.
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    • Profile picture of the author Lawrh
      I have two Gmail accounts created from my Canadian IP address and one I created two weeks ago from a U.S. IP address. I was never asked for a phone number. Is this very recent?
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    • Profile picture of the author Brad Mc Bard
      Originally Posted by SurviveUnemployment View Post

      If you don't like Google, don't use Google. That's the free market.
      Free market?
      More of a monopoly, in my eyes.

      When 1 provider "owns" 80% of the search market, you really have no choice. Either use their platform, or perish.

      Brad

      PS
      My nick is Black Hat Code Breaker, only something's going on in this site today and they're replacing Black Hat with Blue Fart. Please excuse the bad air, and help me open a window.
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      • Profile picture of the author Jeremy Kelsall
        I'm sure most people already have a gmail account....

        So, what's the big deal?

        The only ones this is really going to hurt are the people that want to create a ton of gmail accounts everyday.

        I don't see what the big deal is?

        The CL spammers definitely aren't going to like it...

        The people that are spamming the daylights out of the google sites aren't going to like it...

        Personally, I don't care one way or the other, I've had my gmail acct for a while now and don't need another one

        and code breaker...the word black hat has been replaced throughout the entire forum with bluefart so, you might want to think of another name
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  • Profile picture of the author ebizstrategies
    those with the power and control like to throw it around as we have seen numerous times in the past with other entities.
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  • Profile picture of the author nizhama2
    I just signed up a new account with Google and I have no problem. They don't ask me to give my phone. My account work properly. I live in Malaysia.

    They only need the phone number if you want to use Google Mobile and this is another good service. I will try it.
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  • Profile picture of the author derekwong28
    Google is becoming to act more and more like Microsoft in their old days. In fact, I am sure a lot of people want Microsoft to give Google a bloody nose.
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  • Profile picture of the author derekwong28
    Originally Posted by velsudheer View Post

    But they will rule this web market in the future
    They are ruling it NOW and it doesn't mean what they do is ALWAYS RIGHT!
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  • Profile picture of the author zen_affiliate
    This change must have just occurred because I set up a niched gmail account, like, 2 days ago and I didn't have to submit a #.
    I was waiting for a request of blood samples or some such when I set up google checkout, though(and even then they didn't ask for a cell #).

    You ever use a debit card? Got a drivers' licence? Library card? You do any affiliate marketing? I had to give up a SSN & contact info to every network I signed up with, if I want them to pay me. I even gave it to one network that never did pay me, answer the phone OR emails. Live, learn & get some monitoring services.

    EBay has my number, Paypal too. I'm sure I could come up with others. I'm not thrilled with giving up some of my info, sometimes, but that's part of the entry requirements & I want to use the services.
    (mebbe I should put a cheap cell phone offer up? I saw a phone for something like $15.00 in the convenience store earlier tonight.)

    BTW, if you've ever use a cell/land line/surfed/texted anything, in the U.S. over the last 7-8 years, your data has already being logged, packaged & handed over, tied with a bow. That was part of the Hoo-Hah over the last Administration spying on U.S. citizens, illegally. And the communications companies that gave up your information already got absolved by their legislators.
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    • Profile picture of the author melanied
      I just went to gmail and clicked "create account" and there was no space for cell #
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  • Profile picture of the author zen_affiliate
    Sure hope Johnathan hasn't gotten hacked by, what was it ~gumblar~ that turned up in hacked google results?
    That's why I always give it a good long think before I cough up my info(and why I invested in ID protection).
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  • Profile picture of the author rapidscc
    Originally Posted by rlrlphs View Post

    I think they asked your Phone number because you exceed to the maximum level of accounts that have been created. Because Gmail allows you to register 4-5 accounts a day.
    Yups I think that's the cause..

    I agree with some of us here that if you don't like a service then just stop using it.

    Google and other free service are given for free..They don't force us to use them. We don't pay for anything..and to serve us properly these people must

    1. Weed out abusive users
    2. Make a way to monitize a free service..That's got millions in overhead expenses.

    Imagine if the table was turned and you are the provider of free service with millions of overhead expenses and millions of abusive users what will you do?

    Just my .02

    oMar
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  • Profile picture of the author Michael Taylor
    Originally Posted by Johnathan View Post

    People are already getting "used" to voluntarily providing all of their personal information, whether it is buying a pack of batteries at radio shack (what is your phone,address/etc)...
    I used to work at Radio Shack years ago. The reason they used to ask for that information (while I was there, they dropped the policy...don't know what they do these days) was to build a mailing list. Yep. Exactly why WE as marketers ask for email addresses...they sent out monthly flyers. Why waste an opt-in opportunity, even if the purchase was with cash for a pack of batteries?

    And we as employees would quietly lose patience with grumbly customers who threw diaper-soiling temper tantrums at giving contact info. Here's a hint...all you have to do is say, "No thank you."
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    • Profile picture of the author Johnathan
      Originally Posted by Michael Taylor View Post

      I used to work at Radio Shack years ago. The reason they used to ask for that information (while I was there, they dropped the policy...don't know what they do these days) was to build a mailing list. Yep. Exactly why WE as marketers ask for email addresses...they sent out monthly flyers. Why waste an opt-in opportunity, even if the purchase was with cash for a pack of batteries?

      And we as employees would quietly lose patience with grumbly customers who threw diaper-soiling temper tantrums at giving contact info. Here's a hint...all you have to do is say, "No thank you."
      Actually -- in terms of saying 'no-thank-you', you would be correct if it was that easy. I have gone to radio shack (and other stores for that matter that have copied it) -- and they are exceptionally pushy. If you don't give it, they try to make you feel guilty as if you are doing something wrong, if you still don't give it, they use social pressure ('everyone ELSE is doing it, why not you?'), and if you still don't give it, they use any number of other tactics...

      jsut because 'they' did it back then and were pushy doesn't make it right. If they were up front, and said 'It's for a mailing list', thats one thing. Nowadays, it's told that its a 'requirement', everyone else does it, etc, etc. Not upfront. Deceptive.
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