Originally Posted by ripperdav

Well, no matter which way you want to look at it...positive thinking is the only thing that drives me..so I'll stick with that!

Originally Posted by WritingMadwoman

Excellent post, and I could not agree more.

Positive thinking has done wonders for me over the years. If nothing else, it just helps you to feel happier - isn't that what most people are seeking? Happiness? Unfortunately many people think they have to have certain "things" to feel happy, when just improving their quality of thought would help a LOT!

Wendy

Originally Posted by markfoo76

I can’t remember where I saw it. But the following comment was what I came across while reading some blogs or forum online:

Positive thinking doesn’t pay the mortgage.
Positive thinking doesn’t pay the bills and put food on your table.

Well… obviously the person who left the comment doesn’t believe in Positive Thinking (at least, that’s what it seems to me).

I think people who don’t believe in Positive Thinking have totally missed the point. But who can blame them? They have probably been misled into thinking that it is enough to turn their lives around simply by having positive thoughts (hint: The Secret).

I agree that the message being conveyed in the movie ‘The Secret’ can be very misleading. The general message the movie is trying to tell us is: If you want to attract what you want in life, you have to constantly think about what it is that you want, and you will start seeing them appearing in your life. So, it seems all you need to do to dramatically change your life is simply to think about it!

Although it sounds incredible, one needs to understand that your success in life does indeed begin with the way you think. Let me explain why.

You see… success must first be created in the mind before it can be manifested in physical reality. Successful people are successful because they think and see the world very differently.

Where most people see problems, those with a positive mindset see money-making opportunities. Unless you have the positive mindset, you will never be able to see the limitless money-making opportunities around you.

Without a positive mindset, you will not have the focus, drive and determination to take the massive action necessary to implement the ideas and strategies.

Take Donald Trump for example. In the early nineties, Trump lost his entire fortune when he ended up with a massive US$935 million personal debt during the property market crash. Down, but not out, Trump pulled himself out of the pits to triumphantly make a fortune of US$3.7 billion, all within ten years!

Why didn’t such a crushing failure crush him completely? It’s because Trump may have lost all his physical wealth, but his true wealth did not lie in what he has stashed in his bank account; it lay in his mind.

It was his way of thinking and his financial intelligence that was worth billions, and that is what continues to make him a genius in negotiating the best deals.

In other words, even though the odds may be stacked against you, keeping a positive mindset can give you the mental push and energy you need to stick to your plan and build your life the way you intended.

If you develop a negative “I can’t” attitude, it can pervade nearly every situation you’re in. It can affect your business plans, career track, or even personal family or social situations.

And if you’re still not convinced, why not look at it this way:

Positive thinking doesn’t pay the mortgage. Neither does negative thinking.
Positive thinking doesn’t pay the bills and put food on your table. Neither does negative thinking.

So if you’re going to think at all, why not think positively?

Cheers~

Originally Posted by Bart Loos

Well I've a slightly different view. Both negative and positive thinking are not doing you a favor. A balanced viewpoint will give you much more then a highly positive feel good vp.

I've written about the dangours of Positive Thinking here before in this thread

Have fun

Bart

Originally Posted by markfoo76

Hi Bart,

After reading your thread, I have the impression that there's been a mixed up between 'self-denial' and 'positive thinking'. For example, you mentioned:

"And I guess everyone does fall for this trap, an example can be as simple that you clean up the room, stiff all the mess in one closet, with the result that the mess is still there and probably will there for quiet some time, but that you feel good that the room is cleaned up.

Or avoid working on a certain project because there might be fear of failure getting in your way and you'll assure yourself that you'll get that project done after you've done these other 2 projects first.. and then when it's time to work on the project you're avoiding, you'll find an excuse to work on something else first...

These are mere examples of how people can keep themselves stuck while thinking positively and getting in a feel good rush."

I have to say what you mentioned in your thread is NOT positive thinking. This is simply the same as saying,"OK, at least I've done something. So everything's good." This is merely an excuse a person uses to justify his own laziness or fear.

Positive thinking is, when you're born with no legs and no arms, you're still able to live strongly and believe that you're brought into this world to do something great; to inspire other people to believe that nothing is impossible. And most importantly, even with no legs and no arms, you're still able to live a happy and fulfilling life. That's what positive thinking is all about. Watch video below:

Nick Vujicic

And you can also read a positive thinking story at my blog:

2 Choices to Determine Whether You Enjoy Your Life Or You Hate It

After you watch the video and read the story, I hope you'll have a better understanding of what's positive thinking.

Cheers~

Mark

Originally Posted by Bart Loos

Mark this is exactly the point, for many people "Positive Thinking" is very often a form of self denial, without them realising it is. And there's a a neurological process that goes with it.

Originally Posted by markfoo76

As mentioned in my last reply, there's been a mixed up between self-denial and positive thinking, so positive thinking is essentially DIFFERENT FROM self-denial. It doesn't matter if people have mistaken self-denial as a form of positive thinking or not, ultimately, positive thinking and self-denial are still NOT the same.

Originally Posted by Bart Loos

Absolutely it matters. Especially when you're giving advice.

Originally Posted by markfoo76

Yes, you need to deal with your own negative emotions. You need to acknowledge it and seek to understand how it comes about. But you just can't hang on to them. Negative thinking will get you thinking, "What if I fail?" Positive thinking will get you thinking, "What if I succeed?" It's a matter of how you look at things; which angle are you looking from. So which one do you think is more helpful?

Originally Posted by markfoo76

Positive thinking doesn’t pay the mortgage.
Positive thinking doesn’t pay the bills and put food on your table.

Originally Posted by MemberWing

So it all boils down to beliefs!
Then - what is [limiting] belief?
Belief is a repeated thought associated with feelings.
Back to positive thinking then: to change limiting belief - change habitual thoughts and feelings. And these 2 could be done independently of each other.

Gleb

Originally Posted by Bart Loos

You gotta ask yourself... who needs 'positive thinking' in the first place???

Originally Posted by drwhogoesthere

I have to agree with this comment. Positive thinking alone will do nothing for you.

Originally Posted by markfoo76

Erm... I think everybody needs positive thinking. Because everybody is bound to face challenges in life and it is in time of challenges that you need to see there's hope. Positive thinking will help you to see hope.

Well, I think it's a chicken and egg thing. Saying positive thinking is an expression of what you believe on a fundamental level implies that positive thinking comes after self-belief. I think otherwise. Without a positive attitude or thinking, how would one have confidence in the first place?

Originally Posted by Bart Loos

Ever seen a little 6 month year old not having confidence? They don't have to think 'positive' to be confident. They are confident in learning, in what they want, in their curiosity... By the time they learn to walk they have fallen over a zillion times, and just get up every time again as confident. They don't feel they are not capable. They do not get in their own way of what they want.

They don't think negatively AND they don't think positively.

Originally Posted by frankgotgame818

What Bart says,

"They don't think negatively AND they don't think positively.

This is the point people don't get.. confident people don't think negatively and they don't have to keep thinking positively to overpower their negative feelings either, . they filter the world much different then you do.

They go along with the flow and act upon it.

They know that the sun won't always shine,they realize that there will always be moments when there are clouds but they also know and feel in their core being that they are capable of handling whateva comes on their way.

They don't think about it they just act."

Makes me remember a very important book for me when I was struggling badly.

It's called 'Deep Survival, Who Lives, Who Dies, and Why' by Laurence Gonzales.
It contains stories about people in seemingly impossible situations. The stories tell what they thought about, what they did and the mental approach they took to keep going when all appeared to be lost.

It is not about positive thinking but the focus these people put on doing what needed to done at the time it needed to be done. The attention they put on the result they wanted made a huge difference for most of the people in difficult situations.

I can not recommend this book highly enough.

Frank C.

Originally Posted by markfoo76

I don't think 6-month old kids are naturally confident. I don't think they're able to do what they do because they're confident. They're able to do what they do because they do not know or understand failure.

Originally Posted by markfoo76

All they know is to keep moving forward to get what they want. You do not need confidence if you do not know or understand failure.

Originally Posted by markfoo76

The reason we adults need confidence is because we know and understand what failure is and that most of us are afraid of failure. And because we need confidence, we need positive thinking.

Originally Posted by markfoo76

Yes, confident people believe they are capable of handling whatever comes their way. That's because they think positively of themselves!

Originally Posted by markfoo76

Would a negative person have the same belief and be as confident? No, because they think negatively of themselves.

Originally Posted by markfoo76

"Whether you're confident or not, it depends on how you see or think of yourself."

Originally Posted by Bart Loos

Exactly Mark, that IS confidence.

Not having any limiting emotions getting in your way.

It's your natural state of being.

It's not something artificial. It's not a pumped up state, that you'll need to overcome and overpower negative feelings.

This what you're not getting. You don't NEED confidence, you already HAVE IT.

Never seen the difference between someone who's trying to look confident, and someone who is confident?




Interesting don't ya think.

Here you say.. If you don't have fear in the way.. you don't need confidence..

Which is exactly what I've been telling you all along. Deal with your emotions.. so you do not have to patch them up with an artificial feeling of confidence or positive thinking.

Btw confidence is something you don't just think up. It's an expression of yourself and your core essence.



Here I'm going to give you an example: .. my gf and I are going to be on a training next week, and on the first evening there's going to be a fire walk..
I find this amazingly interesting... and I'm looking forward to it.. but not for the obvious reasons. Not to create a great state change, but to have the experience of 'fire walking'

This is what is going to happen... We'll get in a pumped up confident feeling like we can handle the world. Because we are going to accomplish or do something that on a certain level doesn't make sense to you. and it will feel great for sure. Gives you an adrenaline rush.

How long do you think that state is going to last btw? One hour, one week, a fortnight, 6 months, the rest of your life?

The same goes up with trying to use artificial confidence or positive thinking, they will get you out of your normal range of emotional states that you flow through, which you're not used to experience, which will just flop you back to your daily state you're used to experience.

Ever wondered why seminar goers. get amazing things done in the seminar and the days after that .. but a few months down the road have lost all these magical 'seminar skills' they had.

This is because the foundation is weak.

Build a better foundation people.





Here you're mixing a few things. Thinking positively about yourself ..or thinking positively about a certain outcome while you feel negative about yourself, feel failure, feel doubt, ... is a complete different animal.


Ok let me ask you one question... what is a person like that thinks negatively about themselves and now takes the advice and starts to ad positive thinking to the mix...

big incongruency imo





Exactly that's what I've been telling you all along.

Euh??? .

How you see yourself is what you believe about yourself.


and is something completely different then positive or negative thinking about a certain context, or what might be possible, or what you could be doing, what choice to make, or keep focusing on that 1% chance ...


Cheers mate

Have fun

Bart

Originally Posted by markfoo76

In your opinion, is there a difference between a positive attitude and positive thinking? If no, are you also saying we do not need a positive attitude in life? If yes, please tell me the difference.

Cheers~

Mark

Originally Posted by MissTerraK

Because birds of a feather flock together! If you are negative, just as a magnet, you will repell all postives!

Attitude determines altitude, or how high=successful you become!
Negativity limits your success to pretty much ground level=failure

Positivity is not an emotion, it's a way of life! A choice you have the power to make!

Not everybody's life is peachy keen, many have had a lot of horrendous things happen to them, they chose to use those experiences to determine whether they would become bitter=negative,...

Or they chose those circumstances to determine whether they would become better=positive

Notice the only difference in those words is I, leaving the choice up to everyone, themselves, to choose negativity or positively!

Reasons enough?
MissTerraK

Originally Posted by Bart Loos

MissTerrak,

Why want you to get stuck in an either or case?

life is much more then just + vs -

Why do people want to put it in just 2 boxes?

Is that the way to grab it? to control it, to understand it?

Life is a flow through context by context.. and your choice to hold yourself is endless and does not limit to just + or -

Have fun

Cheers

Bart

Originally Posted by samthor

postive thinking is ok to a point.... the problem lies when it becomes too extreme.
Extreme pessimism is bad for us. It does us no good to all ways see the bad in every situation. But on the other end extreme optimism is just as dangerous. It leads to ignoring warning signs and problems.
Always and only looking for the flowers and never seeing the snake….. might result in a poisonous bite.
Yes you are responsible for your own thoughts. You create your own life. But it must be balanced. And if should deal in reality.
Our western culture keeps promoting this “positive thinking’ as a way to blind us to the snakes out there. Just keep looking at the flowers, don’t mind the snakes.

This is how the tragedy in Sedona happened. James Ray one of the guys behind The Secret charged ppl thousands of dollars to attend a “Spiritual Warrior Retreat”.
The power of positive thinking helped these attendees “see beyond” the high price tag , and “look past” the haphazardly and poorly constructed sweat lodge…. Cause well we wouldn’t want any negative thoughts in our heads. Even as people passed out, vomited and slipped into comas the attendees were encouraged to “stay positive and stay focused” instead of using their common sense to save their own lives.

When the ambulances and police finally arrived on the scene, how did the Guru James Ray handle the reality of the scene? He ran and hid. He refused to cooperate with the police. He never visited anyone of his paying customers in the hospital or speak to them directly. A vague apology was posted on the website and a spokeswoman for the retreat offered the explanation that 3 people died in the sweat lodge because those people decided to leave their bodies and vibrate to a higher plane.
Very positive.

Not to rain on your parade or anything. But a balance is necessary.
First, you must see things as they ARE.

Originally Posted by samuel_sawyer

"Take Donald Trump for example. In the early nineties, Trump lost his entire fortune when he ended up with a massive US$935 million personal debt during the property market crash. Down, but not out, Trump pulled himself out of the pits to triumphantly make a fortune of US$3.7 billion, all within ten years!"

If you look at everything he wrote, he does not vouch so much for the positive thinking. He works 12 hours each day even in the days he doesn't work.

This does not mean that you need to work hard to achieve success. But taking action is way more important than the positive thinking.

Try to think "I can't" thoughts and still take action and you will see that you will make more things happen than just by being positive.