34 {{ upvoteCount | shortNum }}
34 {{ upvoteCount | shortNum }}

Electric Cars Could Wreak Havoc on Oil Markets Within a Decade

by Joe Mobley
34 replies
  • OFF TOPIC
    • |


Joe Mobley
  • Profile picture of the author yukon
    Banned
    The first electric car was built about 50 years before the first gas car so I guess payback is a bitch.

    Unbelievable the US Gov allows fracking, especially in 2016. It's like they haven't learned a damn thing about the environment.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10562667].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author lanfear63
      You must also consider hybrids, of which we have two. Not requiring filling up for over two weeks on our current ones.

      Then we have increased efficiency in engines and Solar, Wind and Sea power. Slowly, all these are whittling away our total dependence on oil.
      Signature

      Feel The Power Of The Mark Side

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10562711].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
        Originally Posted by lanfear63 View Post

        You must also consider hybrids, of which we have two.
        Braggart.

        I have a hybrid too. Half squirrel, half Kurt. I call it a Squirt.
        Signature
        One Call Closing book https://www.amazon.com/One-Call-Clos...=1527788418&sr

        What if they're not stars? What if they are holes poked in the top of a container so we can breath?
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10564101].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author Taviuss
        Originally Posted by lanfear63 View Post

        You must also consider hybrids, of which we have two. Not requiring filling up for over two weeks on our current ones.

        Then we have increased efficiency in engines and Solar, Wind and Sea power. Slowly, all these are whittling away our total dependence on oil.

        The hybrid can easily be of assistance, but there are other areas out there that can help.

        A good friend of mine is working on a project that can make a HUGE difference... in fact it cold KILL the oil industry,...

        How water Can Be Used as Fuel

        https://my.bookbaby.com/book/how-wat...e-used-as-fuel
        Signature
        Tavius Southard
        What would an extra $17,342 a month do for you?
        Find out the 3 steps that has helped others!
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10567156].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author whateverpedia
      Originally Posted by yukon View Post

      Unbelievable the US Gov allows fracking, especially in 2016. It's like they haven't learned a damn thing about the environment.
      Oh, they're aware of it alright. It's just that Big Oil pays for the election campaigns of too many in government(s).

      Let's leave aside the environmental devastation that Big Oil has inflicted on the world for a moment, and look at the geopolitics.

      Imagine a world where first world nations didn't have to prop up savage dictatorships, or conduct illegal invasions to enable oil companies to rape the resources of third world countries.

      Then of course, none of the citizens of those countries would want to take revenge on the developed nations by flying planes into skyscrapers, strapping bombs to their torsos and detonating them in crowded places, or going on shooting rampages through city streets.

      And on top of all that there's, as you mentioned, the devastation of the only home we've got.

      I say bring on the end of Big Oil (and King Coal).
      Signature
      Why do garden gnomes smell so bad?
      So that blind people can hate them as well.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10562715].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author YouCannotKillTheMetal04
    nah. id like to think the Oil is what keeps everything in checked. You mess with oil companies youre gonna have a clusterf*ck of wars from different parts of the globe.
    Signature
    Bluagile DSP | RTB | Programmatic | Mobile | Retargeting
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10563095].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author yukon
      Banned
      Originally Posted by YouCannotKillTheMetal04 View Post

      nah. id like to think the Oil is what keeps everything in checked. You mess with oil companies youre gonna have a clusterf*ck of wars from different parts of the globe.


      I think you have it backwards.

      Really it doesn't matter either way because people will always find/create something to fight about.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10563249].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Jill Carpenter
      Originally Posted by YouCannotKillTheMetal04 View Post

      nah. id like to think the Oil is what keeps everything in checked. You mess with oil companies youre gonna have a clusterf*ck of wars from different parts of the globe.
      Interesting name you have there.

      My spidy senses are tingling....

      Or maybe not.
      Signature

      "May I have ten thousand marbles, please?"

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10563519].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author yukon
    Banned
    Originally Posted by Jill Carpenter View Post

    It all seems to be going at a snails pace if you asked me.
    There's still massive resistance from auto manufactures like Ford & Chevy. They brag about electric cars but they still don't push the technology into mainstream, it's more like a novelty. Odds are they get massive tax breaks from the Gov for acting like they're trying to build electric cars.

    Even Elon Musk is full of shit. If he was serious he would mass produce an electric car that cost less than $15k [USD] following in the footsteps of Henry Ford & the Model T. That's how transition happens, affordable mass production.

    As a comparison the Model T cost $260 which is roughly $3,500 in 2016 while the lowest priced Tesla is $35,000. I realize the most expensive part of an electric car is the battery but as always, mass production lowers the price of anything that can be manufactured. IMO Musk is doing things ass backwards.

    Musk is targeting a dying breed, upper middle class incomes.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10563590].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by yukon View Post

      There's still massive resistance from auto manufactures like Ford & Chevy. They brag about electric cars but they still don't push the technology into mainstream, it's more like a novelty. Odds are they get massive tax breaks from the Gov for acting like they're trying to build electric cars.

      Even Elon Musk is full of shit. If he was serious he would mass produce an electric car that cost less than $15k [USD] following in the footsteps of Henry Ford & the Model T. That's how transition happens, affordable mass production.

      As a comparison the Model T cost $260 which is roughly $3,500 in 2016 while the lowest priced Tesla is $35,000. I realize the most expensive part of an electric car is the battery but as always, mass production lowers the price of anything that can be manufactured. IMO Musk is doing things ass backwards.

      Musk is targeting a dying breed, upper middle class incomes.
      Lithium batteries ARE still expensive. Think of it this way. 15 gallons of fuel weighs less, and puts out more power than those batteries. And those batteries aren't even necessarily safe. As for the model T? I bet it is closer to 13000! STILL, an inflation website says that is $6542.66 in todays dollars. And that is for an obsolete underpowered car! They won't even build a GAS car for much less than $15K, why would they build an all electric one?

      BTW manufacturers DO NOT PUSH! If they did, we would have fifty different kinds of everything.

      Steve
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10568005].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author yukon
        Banned
        Originally Posted by seasoned View Post

        Lithium batteries ARE still expensive. Think of it this way. 15 gallons of fuel weighs less, and puts out more power than those batteries. And those batteries aren't even necessarily safe. As for the model T? I bet it is closer to 13000! STILL, an inflation website says that is $6542.66 in todays dollars. And that is for an obsolete underpowered car! They won't even build a GAS car for much less than $15K, why would they build an all electric one?

        BTW manufacturers DO NOT PUSH! If they did, we would have fifty different kinds of everything.

        Steve


        You would lose your bet on the $13K.

        Tesla will soon be selling a $35K car. A replacement battery for a Prius sells for less than $2.5K, so their battery can't possibly be that expensive. That's retail so buying at wholesale in bulk is obviously at least half that price (ex: $1.25K).

        You missed the point on the $15K car, Tesla could build the car & profit the same as Henry Ford did with the Model T. Selling millions of cars to lower class incomes would be more profitable than selling a few higher priced cars to upper middle class incomes. That would also flood the market with aftermarket parts/sales/service.

        No way 15 gallons of gas puts out more power than an electric motor. You can drive a longer distance on gas but no way it has more power/torque. An electric motor has full torque instantly which will never happen on an ICE.

        BTW, Tesla batteries are the exact same batteries found in laptops. There's a whole DIY electric car niche that revolves around those cheap laptop batteries (Google it (18650 battery)).
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10568941].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author seasoned
          Originally Posted by yukon View Post

          You would lose your bet on the $13K.
          NOT LIKELY!

          Tesla will soon be selling a $35K car. A replacement battery for a Prius sells for less than $2.5K, so their battery can't possibly be that expensive. That's retail so buying at wholesale in bulk is obviously at least half that price (ex: $1.25K).
          FIRST, $35K is NOT $35K! Even if that included upsells, crosssells, scams, and taxes, it STILL doesn't take into account OTHER taxes, expenses, and subsidies. And this is even MORE true if they sell through dealers! And why does everyone believe that everyone gets 100% increase? THEY DON'T! So 2.5 does NOT mean 1.25. STILL, that is a SMALL price on a car. In GAS cars the FULL RETAIL at the END of the chain is $50-<$200. You will likely spend a good deal LESS than $200.

          You missed the point on the $15K car, Tesla could build the car & profit the same as Henry Ford did with the Model T. Selling millions of cars to lower class incomes would be more profitable than selling a few higher priced cars to upper middle class incomes. That would also flood the market with aftermarket parts/sales/service.
          ***YOU*** miss the point! Their profit will NOT be the same as ford. FORD didn't do a lot different from what was out there. HECK, it made it cheaper, and better, by NOT falling into the ALAM trap. In fact, at one point he took a GAMBLE that the US courts would show some REASON. If they didn't, ford would be DEAD! Luckily, they DID and ford was able to laugh as he sold already built cars.

          And selling millions to people with lower incomes would NOT be so profitable. DENMARK has been making electric cars since AT LEAST 1989!!!! Cars in Denmark often cost a lot, and importing them can also cost a lot. And earnings is NOT based on number of cars sold, but what you make on each car. A loss is generally a loss.

          No way 15 gallons of gas puts out more power than an electric motor. You can drive a longer distance on gas but no way it has more power/torque. An electric motor has full torque instantly which will never happen on an ICE.
          By power, I meant over time. For a particular instant, it depends on MANY things. And YES, electric cars ARE subject to the SAME problems with ICE. It has NOTHING to do with low power, but with traction.

          BTW, Tesla batteries are the exact same batteries found in laptops. There's a whole DIY electric car niche that revolves around those cheap laptop batteries (Google it (18650 battery)).
          Even LAPTOP batteries aren't laptop batteries! There are a TON of different batteries, and they may have a TON of different cells. They AREN'T cheap, and just TRY to run an electric car on even the LARGEST and MOST POWERFUL laptop battery ever made! GOOD LUCK! As for the 18650 battery? They would be one type of CELL. Laptops generally have a powersupply voltage of 18-20v. Using THESE cells, at 18v, you would need about 5 of these batteries. That would give you an 18.5v and likely less than 5ah.

          Wikipedia says the tesla uses 7,104 of these cells, and claims it is 85-kWh . At a $1 cost per cell, it would cost about $7104, based on the lowest initial price I saw! BTW the lower the wh or ah, the less time it will be good for, at the same voltage. So they COULD use about 3552 cells to run half the distance. Something to think about on low end models. Let's see... 2.5K huh? Maybe they want it to run 1/3rd the distance!

          Steve
          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10572685].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author irawr
            Banned
            Originally Posted by seasoned View Post

            FIRST, $35K is NOT $35K! Even if that included upsells, crosssells, scams, and taxes, it STILL doesn't take into account OTHER taxes, expenses, and subsidies. And this is even MORE true if they sell through dealers! And why does everyone believe that everyone gets 100% increase? THEY DON'T! So 2.5 does NOT mean 1.25. STILL, that is a SMALL price on a car. In GAS cars the FULL RETAIL at the END of the chain is $50-<$200. You will likely spend a good deal LESS than $200.
            Uhm What?

            I think you need to see a doctor. I'm really serious. There's some things I'm seeing in your writing patterns that indicate to me that there is a problem and you should seek professional help, who will be able to help you.

            You seem very intelligent but it seems to me that one problem or another is interfering with your ability to convey your intelligence.
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10572943].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author seasoned
              Originally Posted by irawr View Post

              Uhm What?

              I think you need to see a doctor. I'm really serious. There's some things I'm seeing in your writing patterns that indicate to me that there is a problem and you should seek professional help, who will be able to help you.

              You seem very intelligent but it seems to me that one problem or another is interfering with your ability to convey your intelligence.

              WOW, OK, I will explain it!

              FIRST, $35K is NOT $35K!
              In OTHER words, just because you "pay $35K" for the car does NOT mean that is all you pay, etc....


              Even if that included upsells, crosssells, scams, and taxes,
              These are a SMALL example of the things that affect what perhaps EVERY car company adds. They have NOTHING to do with the fuel source. An upsell is some added product to make the vehicle better, that may be called NEEDED(alloy wheels, etc...)! A cross sell is some related thing that AGAIN may be desired(like an alarm system), scams (Like undercarriage treatment, advertising coops, etc...). And TAXES? OH, they are LEGEND! We have ALREADY paid a LOT for solar power. The children that will be born in 2030 have ALREADY paid for it. HECK, I was reading only a few days ago about a tax to pay for repairs that were made in 1942, and the tax is STILL being charged TODAY. Last I knew, the taxes put in to support phone booths, and the 1994 northridge earthquake costs are STILL being assessed.

              it STILL doesn't take into account OTHER taxes, expenses, and subsidies.
              There are UNLISTED taxes, holdbacks(Car companies often charge more for cars on the idea that it can facilitate advertising, etc.... and the car dealers get the money back if they meet goals. Unless they have a special sale, and give YOU some of the money, YOU don't get they money!), and they may get subsidies(The governments or car dealer may give them money to make things easier and seem cheaper). ALL of that comes from SOMEONE SOMEWHERE!

              And this is even MORE true if they sell through dealers!
              Obviously, the more hands in the pot the higher the taxes and margins will be.

              And why does everyone believe that everyone gets 100% increase? THEY DON'T! So 2.5 does NOT mean 1.25.
              A number of people figure the difference between what an item costs and what they sell it for is 100%. It often ISN'T. So a retail price of $200 does NOT mean they paid $100 for it.

              [quote]STILL, that is a SMALL price on a car. In GAS cars the FULL RETAIL at the END of the chain is $50-<$200. You will likely spend a good deal LESS than $200.

              The battery has been a minor expense in cars, so a low battery cost does NOT mean that the car will cost little.

              Steve
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10573382].message }}
              • Profile picture of the author irawr
                Banned
                Originally Posted by seasoned View Post

                The battery has been a minor expense in cars, so a low battery cost does NOT mean that the car will cost little.

                Steve
                That makes a lot more sense, thank you.

                Not quoting your entire response but I did read it and for the most part I agree.

                I thought the markup on new cars was about %50 on the total cost to get the vehicle to the lot, minus sales and what not (the sticker is 1.5 times real cost.) I know any time a dealer hands you an invoice it's fake. I know a guy in auto sales and the cost numbers were kept secret from him for a few years before he started signing for deliveries of new vehicles, which was when he got to see a real invoice for the first time.

                I don't want to say what brand, but it was an import economy car brand. I realize there's not that many but I don't want to out the guy completely.

                It's also possible that dealerships work a little bit differently in Ohio.
                {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10573548].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author David Beroff
    One thing to consider here, that does not seem to be touched by that video, is that the power does have to come from somewhere. OK, so let's say that electric cars do start to increase in market share. When you plug them in to recharge, somewhere that represents a conventional plant generating electricity, typically by burning fossil fuel. (Similar idea for hybrids' batteries.) Of course I hope we start replacing these with renewable sources, but my main concern is that this whole video never even mentions it; it's as if, by plugging cars in, we magically eliminate the need for a real power source.
    Signature
    Put MY voice on YOUR video: AwesomeAmericanAudio.com
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10563719].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author yukon
      Banned
      Originally Posted by David Beroff View Post

      One thing to consider here, that does not seem to be touched by that video, is that the power does have to come from somewhere. OK, so let's say that electric cars do start to increase in market share. When you plug them in to recharge, somewhere that represents a conventional plant generating electricity, typically by burning fossil fuel. (Similar idea for hybrids' batteries.) Of course I hope we start replacing these with renewable sources, but my main concern is that this whole video never even mentions it; it's as if, by plugging cars in, we magically eliminate the need for a real power source.

      True.

      The Tesla Powerwall is an attempt but I don't think it's a complete off the grid system.
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10563751].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author lanfear63
      Originally Posted by David Beroff View Post

      One thing to consider here, that does not seem to be touched by that video, is that the power does have to come from somewhere. OK, so let's say that electric cars do start to increase in market share. When you plug them in to recharge, somewhere that represents a conventional plant generating electricity, typically by burning fossil fuel. (Similar idea for hybrids' batteries.) Of course I hope we start replacing these with renewable sources, but my main concern is that this whole video never even mentions it; it's as if, by plugging cars in, we magically eliminate the need for a real power source.
      As far as I know

      The cost of recharging is very low, no more than having a regular domestic appliance plugged in. So it would not affect your electric bill much and that would reflect on the consumption from the power stations.

      Our Prius hybrid's runs on gasoline but is significantly supplemented by the battery, especially when idling at a red light or in traffic jam. The battery is charged from the wheels turning so requires no separate charge.

      Changing out the 742 AA batteries once a month is s a bit of a chore though.
      Signature

      Feel The Power Of The Mark Side

      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10563869].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author David Beroff
        Originally Posted by lanfear63 View Post

        The cost of recharging is very low, no more than having a regular domestic appliance plugged in. So it would not affect your electric bill much and that would reflect on the consumption from the power stations.
        I don't know the numbers, either, so I'm not going to argue. But simple physics would imply that there are several conversions and corresponding losses as coal (or whatever) is burned to generate electricity, then transmitted, then stored to the car's battery, then drawn to turn the wheels. I'm sure that someone more familiar with this could spell out the details.

        Originally Posted by lanfear63 View Post

        Our Prius hybrid's runs on gasoline but is significantly supplemented by the battery, especially when idling at a red light or in traffic jam. The battery is charged from the wheels turning so requires no separate charge.
        Right, but there's still no magic. The combustion engine simply turns off when it's not needed, and the car's kinetic energy is converted to electricity to store in the battery instead of a conversion to heat with the brakes.

        Originally Posted by lanfear63 View Post

        Changing out the 742 AA batteries once a month is s a bit of a chore though.
        While I realize that you're saying this in jest, I think that the Prius' battery does need to get changed out every decade or so, at a not-insignificant financial and environmental cost.
        Signature
        Put MY voice on YOUR video: AwesomeAmericanAudio.com
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10563902].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author lanfear63
          Originally Posted by David Beroff View Post

          I don't know the numbers, either, so I'm not going to argue. But simple physics would imply that there are several conversions and corresponding losses as coal (or whatever) is burned to generate electricity, then transmitted, then stored to the car's battery, then drawn to turn the wheels. I'm sure that someone more familiar with this could spell out the details.



          Right, but there's still no magic. The combustion engine simply turns off when it's not needed, and the car's kinetic energy is converted to electricity to store in the battery instead of a conversion to heat with the brakes.



          While I realize that you're saying this in jest, I think that the Prius' battery does need to get changed out every decade or so, at a not-insignificant financial and environmental cost.
          The Prius battery used to be like all the others of this type. A single unit. Now they are modular (like I suspect the others are now), you can slide out a single tube of batteries and replace it. Yes, ten years is about right, batteries do not re-charge forever. Compared to not many years ago though, buying a Prius or equivalent was quite a gamble as batteries (probably the single unit versions) would only last several years and you would have to think in terms of 7k for a new one.

          Recently I watched a You-Tube video of a guy replacing a modular battery in an old Prius (same size as ours). It was pretty involved and I would not attempt it. However, he said, he bought a new one for around $1000.00 and saved himself another $1000.00 by fitting it himself. So, now the garage prices are only 2k to replace it. A lot less.

          Our 2015 Prius A (the largest without being an SUV) gets 50 to the gallon. The Wife's 2016 model, the Prius 4 (renamed same size car) get's 52 mpg.

          We are both into our third week without a re-fill and drive them to work and back every day. Working it out, they both seem to be performing better than the rating.
          Signature

          Feel The Power Of The Mark Side

          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10563935].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author yukon
            Banned
            Originally Posted by lanfear63 View Post

            Our 2015 Prius A (the largest without being an SUV) gets 50 to the gallon. The Wife's 2016 model, the Prius 4 (renamed same size car) get's 52 mpg.
            That's what I was getting at earlier, 50 MPG was done in 1984. So we've literally had no advances in MPGs in over 30 years.

            I don't know about anyone else but I expect a lot more from auto manufactures especially since car prices have tripled in 30 years. We're pretty much buying the same thing repackaged year after year.

            What are automotive engineers doing all day, playing solitaire?
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10563978].message }}
          • Profile picture of the author DWolfe
            Originally Posted by lanfear63 View Post


            Recently I watched a You-Tube video of a guy replacing a modular battery in an old Prius (same size as ours). It was pretty involved and I would not attempt it. "Smart man"! However, he said, he bought a new one for around $1000.00 and saved himself another $1000.00 by fitting it himself. So, now the garage prices are only 2k to replace it. A lot less.
            The average person should never fool with those batteries. There is enough juice in those systems to send a person to there grave. You need special gloves to do the process. Plus they recommend disconnecting the ground and let the car power down on older units. You do not want to rush into a change only to get ZAP !
            {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10573337].message }}
            • Profile picture of the author seasoned
              Originally Posted by DWolfe View Post

              The average person should never fool with those batteries. There is enough juice in those systems to send a person to there grave. You need special gloves to do the process. Plus they recommend disconnecting the ground and let the car power down on older units. You do not want to rush into a change only to get ZAP !
              I don't know how true what you are saying is, but if you are wrong, you are NOT far off! They have been talking about using lithium for a LONG time, though they didn't really seem to have a lot of success until the 1990s. They KNEW it was a good direction to go. They DO provide a lot of power.

              LONG ago, they made a product that stores a lot of power, and they may even have them in electric cars. They used to be in TVs, and computers, along with some other things, these huge capacitors. STILL, most of those capacitors were less than the size of one of these cells, and THEY provided a lot of power. People have gotten large shocks, and I think some people have even died.

              And YEAH, they ARE looking at using capacitors. Historically they have been very efficient, and can hold a charge for decades, but they usually rapidly discharge.

              My point is don't believe that a small thing, or one disconnected for a long time, is harmless.

              Steve
              {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10573400].message }}
      • Profile picture of the author yukon
        Banned
        Originally Posted by lanfear63 View Post

        As far as I know

        The cost of recharging is very low, no more than having a regular domestic appliance plugged in. So it would not affect your electric bill much and that would reflect on the consumption from the power stations.

        Our Prius hybrid's runs on gasoline but is significantly supplemented by the battery, especially when idling at a red light or in traffic jam. The battery is charged from the wheels turning so requires no separate charge.

        Actually the electric motor is slowing the vehicle down as it lags. You can't keep driving the same speed using electricity while producing electricity. You first have to use electricity or gas to get up enough speed to recoup a small percentage of electricity. You're burning through more than you're generating..

        Granted it's way more efficient than the average car, though the average car sucks on MPG.

        The Honda CRX got 50+ MPG back in the 1980s, for some reason today that number isn't doable for most cars.
        {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10563903].message }}
        • Profile picture of the author SteveJohnson
          Originally Posted by yukon View Post

          ...
          Granted it's way more efficient than the average car, though the average car sucks on MPG.

          The Honda CRX got 50+ MPG back in the 1980s, for some reason today that number isn't doable for most cars.
          The biggest reason is weight - a 1980 VW Rabbit weighed in at around 1700lbs, a new Prius is 3500lbs+.

          Most of the weight of newer cars comes from crash protection features and interior trim. Look at the difference in the trim levels of an 80's economy car vs a 2010+ economy car.

          Even if a company built a stripped-down, lightweight gas-engined car that could get 60+mpg the government wouldn't let them sell it.
          Signature

          The 2nd Amendment, 1789 - The Original Homeland Security.

          Gun control means never having to say, "I missed you."

          {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10567222].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Kurt
    Since it costs power companies more to turn off and restart the generators at night when little electricity is required, they leave them all running. There's a lot of electricity that is created that isn't being used that could power a lot of electric cars with no additional power needed.
    Signature
    Discover the fastest and easiest ways to create your own valuable products.
    Tons of FREE Public Domain content you can use to make your own content, PLR, digital and POD products.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10563886].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author RichBeck
    After reading this, I'm going to have to go watch Revenge of the Electric Car on Netflix... again.

    It is one of my favorite documentaries....

    In it, Danny DeVito pines away for his GM EV1... like a long lost love. :-)

    When GM delivers him a new Chevy Volt, he sheepishly asks, "You aren't going to take this one away from me? Are you?"
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10571528].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Everblue
    I'd really wish to see electric cars wreak havoc on oil markets within a decade, however this is very unlikely. This is mostly due to the fact that many countries around the world don't have the capabalities and money to create the foundations and systems required to sustain electric cars, in order for them to become widely spread.

    Some big and advanced countries can defenitely make it happen, but the vast majority will continue using Oil Markets for many decades.
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10571732].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author Sarevok
    The oil market is already in the tank. (Get it?).
    Signature
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10572450].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author Joe Mobley
      Originally Posted by Sarevok View Post

      The oil market is already in the tank. (Get it?).
      I see what you did there!




      Joe Mobley
      Signature

      .

      Follow Me on Twitter: @daVinciJoe
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10572867].message }}
    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by Sarevok View Post

      The oil market is already in the tank. (Get it?).
      The oil market has been going crazy for decades. In the 70s, it was considered rare, precious, and EXPENSIVE! We had a rationing system, in the US, with various people FORBIDDEN to get gas on certain days. NOW, with gas at the lowest price it has been at in 10 years, it is STILL only twice what it was in the 70s,iirc. SOME say THAT is why we have so many wars.

      1. Conspiracy theory ONE, and the oldest, is it is due to the price of OIL.
      2. Conspiracy theory two, it is due to their wanting to change the official base oil currency. StillKIND of like #1.
      3. Official statement is it is due to foreign unrest. Interestingly, I found out that this was officially REQUIRED based on the League of nations(now known as the united nations) put into place after WWI!!!!!! NOT a theory, it is actually in one of the first 25 articles of the treaty of versailles, and those articles started the league of nations. The US is one of the first members, and the country to call the first meeting.

      Anyway, oil is a commodity, and subject to all the forces the other commodities are subject to. Recently, for example, a commodity SKYROCKETED! The explanation given? To cover SHORT SALES! In other words, people bet that the price would drop, and it DIDN'T! It started to go up, and people bought the product to complete delivery without losing any more. They were HOPING that the price would drop enough that the buyer would simply buy the products at the market, or they could buy them at an even lower price. The SAME thing is just one example of what can happen to gas.

      Steve
      {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10572884].message }}
  • Profile picture of the author DWolfe
    Well they might not kill you but 270 DC volts to someone with a bad ticker is not a good combination. This is the first Generation of Batteries in the Prius. I'm not current with the new ones.

    HV Battery Pack
    Battery pack voltage 274-Volts
    Number of NiMH battery modules in the pack 38
    Battery pack weight 100 lbs
    NiMH battery module voltage 7.2-Volts
    NiMH battery module dimensions (inches) 11 x 3/4 x 4
    NiMH Battery module weight 2.2 lbs

    Below is a link for Emergency responders that will give more details to Hybrids. Ian is only talking about Toyota's, Ford Hybrids have more juice. Not dis-agreeing they maybe safe then I was told. But the average clown that knows little about cars, should not fool with the battery. A weekend project could stand his hair up straight or end up with battery acid dripping down onto him. A lot of fun to save a few $$"s.

    Resources - Electric Vehicle Safety Training


    Forgot this one from the Hybrid Shop LLC.


    "Dangerous

    Finally, the voltage produced by a Ford Escape Hybrid’s battery pack is more than enough to cause serious electrocution and even death. That’s why only an expertly trained technician should service or diagnose it."

    Frequently Asked Questions | The Hybrid Shop
    {{ DiscussionBoard.errors[10573433].message }}

Trending Topics