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"Knock-off" products

by lcombs
19 replies
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I can create a knock-off of a recently launched $2,000 product.

It won't be quite as comprehensive but it'll be damn good.

Would you pay $500 for it?

Hypothetically speaking of course.
  • Profile picture of the author Killer Joe
    Let's see the sales letter.

    Better yet, the lead up videos like the big boys do.

    Other than that, who knows?

    KJ
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    • Profile picture of the author lcombs
      [QUOTE=Killer Joe;1779591]Let's see the sales letter.

      Better yet, the lead up videos like the big boys do.

      Other than that, who knows?

      KJ[/QUOTE

      So, you're saying it doesn't matter how good the product is. It's how good of a sales pitch I make?

      OK...

      All things being equal, great sales copy, great launch sequence, etc., etc.
      You want the product.

      It delivers as advertised.

      Let's say I duplicate Kern's Mass Control or The Magic Bullet System, or The Video Boss, whatever...
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      • Profile picture of the author Killer Joe
        Originally Posted by lcombs View Post

        So, you're saying it doesn't matter how good the product is. It's how good of a sales pitch I make?
        No, actually what I'm say is, in the absence of projected benefits there is no way of knowing how your product will benefit me.

        OK...

        All things being equal, great sales copy, great launch sequence, etc., etc. You want the product.
        Who knows? I haven't seen a single benefit to me even mentioned yet.

        It delivers as advertised.
        Delivers what? A $500 hole in my bank balance?

        Let's say I duplicate Kern's Mass Control or The Magic Bullet System, or The Video Boss, whatever...
        I didn't want to buy any of those.

        And you're not Frank Kern, so any associations I make to a product that FK would produce that would make me believe some of Franks' coolness would rub off on me won't apply to your product.

        You're not Andy Jenkins, either. So the legacy of videos I have watched that AJ produced won't help you there, either, because you don't have the same history with me that he does. I'd like to make my videos look like AJ's. I like his style.

        As far as the Magic Bullet is concerned, I need another small blender like I need another hole in my head.

        Basically, what I'm alluding to is that without an emotonal attachment to some benefit I'll have no strong urge to buy. Anything. Logic won't make me buy. Logic is not making me quit smoking cigars, either.

        Ironically, it is my emotional attachment to cigars that keeps me smoking them.

        So if you tell me that your product is, or will be, just as good as someone else' product only at 25% the price, you may miss the entire emotional hook that would cause me to want the original product.

        Unless you can tap into my emotional needs for your product you won't get my money. And those emotional needs could be as varied as I need to make more money, or I just like the seller as a person and want some of them to rub off on me.

        KJ
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  • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
    Originally Posted by lcombs View Post

    I can create a knock-off of a recently launched $2,000 product. (...) Would you pay $500 for it?
    Did I want the $2,000 product?
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    "The Golden Town is the Golden Town no longer. They have sold their pillars for brass and their temples for money, they have made coins out of their golden doors. It is become a dark town full of trouble, there is no ease in its streets, beauty has left it and the old songs are gone." - Lord Dunsany, The Messengers
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    • Profile picture of the author seasoned
      Originally Posted by CDarklock View Post

      Did I want the $2,000 product?
      GOOD POINT! Frankly, I take umbrage at the idea that the price connotes ANY value! I have seen EXPENSIVE things that I considered to have almost NO value, and inexpensive things that were valuable.

      And HEY, ROLEX is a GOOD watch! Rolls royce is apparently a GOOD car! Can you build the same for less? OF COURSE! But even the NAME gives it some value. What about compatibility? Are the materials and specs the same? You may build a rolex watch that seems IDENTICAL, and find it won't sell at even HALF the price! Most of the copies, at least those I have seen, sell at well below a tenth of the price. Unfortunately, the copies may not even be worth THEIR price.

      Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author lcombs
    This is simply a hypothetical question.

    Yes, or No.

    do you want a good product that delivers the same info as another only cheaper?
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    • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
      Originally Posted by lcombs View Post

      do you want a good product that delivers the same info as another only cheaper?
      There is no such product. Just by being a different person with a different style, the info is different. If I like your style better, I might pay $2,000 for it. If I don't, I might not even pay $50 for it.

      It's not just about the teaching, but the teacher.
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      "The Golden Town is the Golden Town no longer. They have sold their pillars for brass and their temples for money, they have made coins out of their golden doors. It is become a dark town full of trouble, there is no ease in its streets, beauty has left it and the old songs are gone." - Lord Dunsany, The Messengers
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      • Profile picture of the author lcombs
        Originally Posted by CDarklock View Post

        There is no such product. Just by being a different person with a different style, the info is different. If I like your style better, I might pay $2,000 for it. If I don't, I might not even pay $50 for it.

        It's not just about the teaching, but the teacher.
        I agree that it is about the teacher.

        But, there is the same info being re-package over and over and over constantly.

        A different approach or presentation doesn't change the information.

        Is it Frank Kern being "cool", or Andy Jenkins' style that sets the value of the product?

        Granted, being taught by Kern or Jenkins as opposed the teacher from "Ferris Bueller's Day Off" is worth much more because you get more out of the class.

        But, everyone here is, (or aspires to be), a marketer.
        So, it goes without saying that we would all at least make the attempt to emulate what works best.
        In our own style of course.

        I think the reason you don't see more of John Reese is his style.
        He's a brilliant marketer. But, he isn't as personable as Frank, Andy, and some of the more visible IMers.

        Does that make his products less valuable?
        Or, are Frank and Andy's products over-priced but they get the proce because of their styles? Their personas?
        Frank is not as off-the-cuff as he appears.
        His videos and presentation are very well planned to appear that way.

        he doesn't appear bare-foot in his videos and seminars because heis attitude is "Fu*k it! I'm not wearing shoes".
        And, his language is planned as well.
        It's his "signature".

        Just like the Rich jerk.

        His "You're ugly. I'm ugly too. But, I'm rich"...

        Anyway, you get the point.

        Thanks for all the great feedback.

        I love a good debate.
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        • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
          Originally Posted by lcombs View Post

          A different approach or presentation doesn't change the information.
          That rather depends on how you look at it.

          If you don't understand gravity, it still works.

          If I explain gravity to you, that is not going to change the way it works.

          When you walk away, gravity will be the same as it always was.

          But if I didn't explain it properly, you still don't understand gravity.

          Now, replace "gravity" with whatever you're trying to teach or learn, and ask yourself whether that really matters.
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          "The Golden Town is the Golden Town no longer. They have sold their pillars for brass and their temples for money, they have made coins out of their golden doors. It is become a dark town full of trouble, there is no ease in its streets, beauty has left it and the old songs are gone." - Lord Dunsany, The Messengers
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          • Profile picture of the author lcombs
            Originally Posted by CDarklock View Post

            That rather depends on how you look at it.

            If you don't understand gravity, it still works.

            If I explain gravity to you, that is not going to change the way it works.

            When you walk away, gravity will be the same as it always was.

            But if I didn't explain it properly, you still don't understand gravity.

            Now, replace "gravity" with whatever you're trying to teach or learn, and ask yourself whether that really matters.
            The approach matters.
            The teaching style matters.
            But, "gravity" is still "gravity"
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  • Profile picture of the author Profit-smart
    I'd tread carefully. You might just end up with a lawsuit on your hands.

    Otherwise, certainly.
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  • Profile picture of the author Loren Woirhaye
    Knocking-off is a great business model for publishing and
    direct-response. All the big players do it.

    If a product is successful it always gets knocked-off sooner or later.

    You can gain insights on why copying ideas that work makes good
    entrepreneurial sense in Felix Dennis's book "How To Get Rich" - and
    the dynamics of knock-offs and how to protect your market from them
    as long as possible are covered in Eugene Schwartz's "Mail Order".

    That said, maybe you aren't an IM guru and without a big
    name selling your product it might not sell too well, even if
    it's comparable or better than the product you are knocking-off.

    I don't recommend plagiarism of another's intellectual property.
    That's uncool and could get you sued.

    Some of the bigger names IM gurus actually just read a lot of
    books and repackage the information as high-ticket multimedia
    courses on, for instance, time management.... but it's not the
    product that makes these things successful, it's the already
    established relationship with both the affiliates for the launch
    and the readers of the house list.

    Basically, the big IM launches are a pre-selling game.
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    • Profile picture of the author lcombs
      Originally Posted by Loren Woirhaye View Post

      Knocking-off is a great business model for publishing and
      direct-response. All the big players do it.

      If a product is successful it always gets knocked-off sooner or later.

      You can gain insights on why copying ideas that work makes good
      entrepreneurial sense in Felix Dennis's book "How To Get Rich" - and
      the dynamics of knock-offs and how to protect your market from them
      as long as possible are covered in Eugene Schwartz's "Mail Order".

      That said, maybe you aren't an IM guru and without a big
      name selling your product it might not sell too well, even if
      it's comparable or better than the product you are knocking-off.

      I don't recommend plagiarism of another's intellectual property.
      That's uncool and could get you sued.

      Some of the bigger names IM gurus actually just read a lot of
      books and repackage the information as high-ticket multimedia
      courses on, for instance, time management.... but it's not the
      product that makes these things successful, it's the already
      established relationship with both the affiliates for the launch
      and the readers of the house list.

      Basically, the big IM launches are a pre-selling game.
      Absolutely no plagiarism.

      But, yes, the whole point is, there is no new knowledge except in the sciences.

      And, in the words of Frank Kern, as stated in his Underachievers course, " Of course you don't want to sell crap. But, the thing you have to keep in mind is, we're marketers".

      So, the success of the sales obviously depends on the marketing.

      You confirmed my point.

      "knocking off is a great business model."

      I shall proceed and provide you all with a very good product at a very reasonable price.
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      • Profile picture of the author Killer Joe
        Originally Posted by lcombs View Post

        But, yes, the whole point is, there is no new knowledge except in the sciences.
        So there's no new knowledge about social bookmarking, facebook advertising, bandwith enabled media such as video, SEO (which changes with every new algorithm twist), using blogs, WordPress as a platform vs old HTML, new FTC regulations, and a host of other things that are making methods used just 2 years ago obsolete.

        I, for one, am glad to hear that.

        KJ
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        • Profile picture of the author lcombs
          Originally Posted by Killer Joe View Post

          So there's no new knowledge about social bookmarking, facebook advertising, bandwith enabled media such as video, SEO (which changes with every new algorithm twist), using blogs, WordPress as a platform vs old HTML, new FTC regulations, and a host of other things that are making methods used just 2 years ago obsolete.

          I, for one, am glad to hear that.

          KJ
          No, there's no new knowledge.

          There are new methods, new approaches to address particular issues. but not new knowledge.

          My mistake.
          I mis-spoke.

          what I should have said is, there is no new information.
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  • Profile picture of the author moises_pk2
    Banned
    Make some killer videos. It helps, forget sales copy. really man, most people do video marketing now.
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  • Profile picture of the author Vasquez11
    I'd say sell it for less.

    I have seen the same traffic system and niche 'blueprint' system more than enough times to count. All were related one way or another with nothing new.

    Yet they are making sales.

    But tread lightly, you may end up with a lawsuit. <stolen =]>

    But all jokes aside, be careful

    Best of luck fellow warrior,

    Jin
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    • Profile picture of the author lcombs
      Originally Posted by Vasquez11 View Post

      I'd say sell it for less.

      I have seen the same traffic system and niche 'blueprint' system more than enough times to count. All were related one way or another with nothing new.

      Yet they are making sales.

      But tread lightly, you may end up with a lawsuit. <stolen =]>

      But all jokes aside, be careful

      Best of luck fellow warrior,

      Jin
      Thanks for the advice and support.

      A lawsuit will not be an issue.
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