OK, This is NUTS!

Not in my world.

Was he the 'dork factor' that most shows feel obligated to book?

Personally I try never to eat out anymore and rarely do now that I work at home.

(after I saw shows about people not washing their hands, spitting in the food etc.)

There are too many diseases you can catch starting with some weird exotic flu all the way to hepatitis from people not washing their hands - not to mention the food borne stuff.

Ok I could get that at the grocery store. Someday I will grow my own but right now I am stuck with the grocery store.

As for tips I admit I am pretty cheap - usually $1 to $2 per person depending on lunch or dinner. As far as I am concerned they should be grateful I was kind enough to leave a tip - I am not responsible if their employer doesn't pay them enough.

Further a gift is supposed to be something you want to give. I can't stand it when people tell you how much to tip, what to buy them or charities that tell you how much to give. That is up to me and I consider it very rude to make demands on something that should be my decision.

... even God doesn't give points for things you do because you feel obligated. It has to come from the heart and mine is broken.

I've heard lots of guys over the years brag about how cheap
they are. That's what they actually say, "Hell yeah, I'm cheap."

I always wondered about that.

Well, I shop and spend as intelligently as possible. But what ever
cheap is, I'm not it.

I think a lot of times it reflects on a person's sense of security and
other inner considerations.

There is no end to what is available in life - in my life at least.

And that is so completely screwed up about taxing on number of
drinks served. Oh man, the people who came up with that one
need to be beaten senseless.

Sorry to hear some people are kinda afu at the casino down there.

Ken

Well Steve, using your logic, if you don't care about them, then why
should they care about you?

Is that an incorrect way of looking at it?


Ken

I usually tip 15% if service is good enough, much more if service is great, and nothing for rude service (rare but it does happen sometimes). That said we eat at home most of the time and cook our own food (not because it's cheaper, but because it's better).

Steve you crack me up. Never fails.

I care about you. I want you to have the best food possible
wherever you go - and for FREE.

K?


Ken

Last week I was in Park City, UT and ate lunch with a couple friends. We went to a restaurant my wife loves. (My wife was not there as she had commitments in another state that weekend.)

I am extremely allergic to onions and tomatoes. Unfortunately they make me violently ill - think of the worst stomach/intestinal flu you can imagine. Yuck!

If the server who takes my order is wonderfully careful about checking with the chef as to the presence of tomato, onion, onion powder, onion or tomato juice, I always tip even more than 20%.

So at this lunch, the server was rather flippant about checking for the presence of onion and tomato. He assured me there would be none, but he didn't want to check with the chef. Of course it turned out the salad dressing had onion, and there was a fresh, juicy slice of tomato on the plate next to the sandwich I had ordered. And there was a cherry tomato on the plate too.

I asked just what part of onion and tomato he didn't understand, and sent him back to the kitchen with the meal. A minute later he is back with my lunch. Hmmm that was too quick, so I asked, "Is this the same sandwich or did the kitchen make a new one?"

Same sandwich! Arrrrggggghhhh. What if the juice from the tomato, or the onion in the salad dressing had gotten onto the sandwich? (The salad was piled high on the same large plate as the sandwich.)

I had the kitchen remake the entire meal from scratch. And I did not leave a good tip.

Contrast that to another Park City area restaurant to which a group of us went the week earlier. It is Schnitter's at the Zermatt Resort in Midway, Utah. The have a seafood buffet on Friday evenings.

When I expressed my onion and tomato concerns, the server talked to the Chef, and the
Chef came out to our table to see what I would like for dinner. He broiled several kinds of fish just for me so I could avoid the sauces in the buffet. Now THAT is great service!

I tipped more than 20%.

:-Don

Tina - it used to be 8% tax on sales, I see they are managing to take more and more from the servers while not giving them much of a wage. In all honesty - the wage is nothing more than to make sure the server can pay their taxes in some states.

If you are only paying a 15% tip - 8-10% of that is tax for the server so if you are a tightwad it actually can cost a server to wait on you. Conversely, from what I've seen is that the people who are the cheapest are the most demanding, irritating people on earth. I've seen servers refuse to serve some people because of their attitude, and after throwing the attitudes they refuse to tip. Sooner or later the staff will run that customer off. I sure wouldn't pay out of my pocket to wait on some jerk who thinks because it's a "tip" and not part of the cost of going out.

Whatever gratuity used to mean - our Gov has wrangled around to making it part of the wage, so people need to start shifting into the frame of mind that your tip is not only covering the taxes on your food so the server doesn't have to pay to serve you, it's also part of their wage. If they have a nasty attitude, they are in the wrong profession.

From all you've written here, I have a good idea that you might be one of the customers that a restaurant would try to blow out. I wouldn't want to serve you - you sound like the type of dude who finds fault no matter how far someone would go out of their way for you. Might as well start eating at home where the only person you can blame for crappy food is yourself.

People that work for tip usually made that choice.

Tina,
I don't agree.That may be the simplest way to work the hours they need and still take care of the children ,put food on the table, etc etc, but it is not the only way.

But then again, that's also beside the point.

If I make the choice to go eat out at a place where the server works for tips, the server will still need to earn that tip. I'm not going to tip 15% or 20% or more just because the employer pays them minimum wage.

I was a waiter for many years ( though it seems PC to call them "servers" now)
But I was single and it was my choice to be a waiter.

I was also a single parent at one time, And I had a job (not as a server though) that was very hard to get to work with me as far as hours and school meetings and dr appointments and such,but things somehow managed,as I am sure they did for you.

Currently one of my daughters is a server.While I'm not going into numbers , she makes a damn good living at it.

What I am trying to get across has already been said. A erver knows what type of work they are getting into,so the cannot expect to get a certain amount of money just because they chose to be a server. The need to and should earn it.

I can"t argue with that!

Kurt,

I don't think there is a Piggley Wiggley around here. In fact, I have never seen one! But MAN, you have me pegged wrong ALSO! I'm actually a good tipper. I just don't tip NEARLY as much for bad service. TWICE I didn't tip ANYTHING! TWICE IN MY LIFE! Once it was because I was THIRSTY, wanted ONLY a drink, and she ignored me for well over 20 minutes. AND, if I were looking to save money, I WOULD go elsewhere. I know that stuff that is fully cooked and set is BOUND to cost more. Did you not see where I said an average of $20? I guess the most I have paid PERSONALLY, was $150 BEFORE the tip. And that is PER PERSON. At one point on a contract, I paid over $50 for a steak and drink. I ADMIT that I haven't gone to "capital grill" here. I heard THAT can cost about $200 for a steak, ONE PERSON. So I went to "not your average joe's". I probably paid about $26 the first time, BEFORE the tip, and about $20 the second time, before the tip. I wasn't quite as hungry. Both times I paid about 20%. OK, maybe YOU consider that little/ Sorry. Does it help if I let you know that I paid a 50% tip a couple weeks ago on a haircut, or if I tip money to people I know could use it.

And **I** am not the one that is exploiting the system. HECK, at that restaurant, where I got the steak, the waitress mentioned she wouldn't work anyplace that charged less than $50 for a steak.

MAN you STILL have the taxicab driver mentality. And YEAH, I tip taxicab drivers ALSO! I guess you would complain if you knew that I know the owner and got a $50 flat fee to my home. The REGULAR fee varies between $48 and $179!!!!!!!! YEAH, you read right! SAME COMPANY, SAME STARTING LOCATION, SAME ENDING LOCATION, SAME TRAFFIC, WILDLY different price. So I pay the $50 flat fee, all make money, and I get a reasonable fare. And a taxi driver set it up for me without my asking. I have always paid the tip, but it is on the $50. The $179 was because she took me the fast way, that usually costs about $65, didn't follow my directions, got lost in new construction, etc... I recently helped the owner with his system, so he could stay in business. I didn't charge a penny.

And OK, a person at the taxi place DID taken over 15 minutes longer than he said he would, couldn't be reached, and so I got a rental. Sorry, but I didn't tip THEM.

BTW capital grill might have a dress code, and requires you to use their valet. Especially with a rental, I don't want to take the chance. BUT "not your average joe's" was fine, and I don't plan to go to a place so I can spend more for a bill, and take longer, so the tip can be larger. I may not ever go there. SORRY.

Steve

Melvin kicks ass.

Boom, boom, boom... BOOM.


Ken

I have to agree with Thom. A good server ( there I am being PC again) is usually not concerned at all with the hourly rate.
They are concerned with the average tip, and the smart ones are also concerned with menu prices.Because they know high menu prices mean good tips if they are a good server.
Why wait at Joe's diner where the average check is $20 making a 20% tip $4, when they can wait at Ruth Chris where the average check is $100-150.( I'm guessing, I've never eaten at a Ruth Chris, but I hear they are great!),which would make the tip to be $20-$30 for the same time frame of work?

--

Yet you think that it's okay that if you don't tip enough it all gets eaten in taxes and the server gets nothing for handling a severely critical customer - or because the cook is off?

I have gone out with bad tippers - I have seen servers go out of their way to be pleasant and helpful - and in the end the guy has a reason to cop out on the tip. That's when I go back, drop them a decent tip myself and find another way home.

Sorry guys and gals. I made a MISTAKE! I believed you and my collegue. Interesting thing, the page was posted here to PROVE your point.

The minimum for tipped employees is ALSO subject to state! The following states, possessions, do NOT reduce minimum wages for tipped employees:

alaska, california, guam,minnesota, montana, nevada, oregon, washington!

So 14% of the US, and at least one US possession. I guess if you want to be paid minimum wage, OREGON is the place to be! They have the highest minimum across the board. The FLSA allows states to elect a wage as low as 2.13, as of JANUARY, though it was increased july, IF you make more than $30/month in tips. Only DC, MA, and NM go out of their way with an excessive "credit" so they can MATCH the federal minimum. Most of the others EXCEED the federal minimum for tipped employees. Arizona, for example, has a tipped minimum of $4.25, connecticut has $5.69, but bartenders get a minimum of $7.34 Hawaii gets $7.00. etc....

BTW you will LOVE this! Virginia's minimum drops to ZERO if you make $7.25/hour, or more, in tips! If you want to debate something, debate THAT with Virginia! Suppose you work an hour and do NOTHING! You get $7.25! Suppose you get $7.25 in tips for serving 5 customers, and you did a GREAT job! You get $7.25! Suppose you get $200.00 in tips, you get $200.00! I HATE laws where you lose money such that, at the beginning, you lose 100%! My mother said social security is like that! The long term care facility said medicaid is WORSE! Oh, and what major city that is really NOT a city, is confused as a state, has TWO police forces, and is defined in the constitution is primarily in Virginia? WASHINGTON DC! Figures, huh?

U.S. Department of Labor - Wage & Hour Divisions (WHD) - Minimum Wages for Tipped Employees

steve

I don't ever give less than 20% tip. Every waiter/waitress is entitled to a bad day in my opinion. If it happens on a day that I'm there, so what. I'm not so shallow of a person that I'll let a wait-staff ruin my mood. And if I can't afford to give at least 20% tip, then I don't even bother embarrassing myself by going out.

Servers have a far harder job than most people think. In fact, most people would be incapable of doing an average server's job in a busy restaurant on a weekend night. They'd be running around headless with a look of severe persecution in their eyes believe me. And most people have no idea that in most restaurants of any quality their server is probably better educated than they are. I've worked as a server for more than a decade and I've worked with so many masters and doctorate degrees that it's unbelievable.

Here is a real world example from this morning. (9-12-2010).
Ihop was founded in 1958, and I am on the East Coast and it was started on the west coast,so I will assume most of you should have heard of it.
My local Ihop is lesst than 10 minutes away from my house.
I have been going there for years.
Today,I left at about a quarter till 9 so I'm guessing I got there about 9.
I got seated by the hostess,and was told such and such would be my server.I didn't catch the name. Didn't matter because after wating almost 5 minutes, another server came over and said she would be taking my order instead.
I ordered water (because of my illness thats about all I ever order anywhere. I can't justify paying almost $2.50 for a drink when I can't drink more than a few sips),and the breakfast special.
I was informed that they had new managers and that the breakfast special now included one pancake instead of two.
I said that was fine.
She went to put my order in. Remember, I waited about 5 minutes for this part to happen,so it was about 5 after 9.
I then walked up to the cashier to get change for a dollar so I could get a newspaper. The cashier informed me that the place no longer had a cashier and that I would have to get my change from my waitress.
That would have been fine and good except most of the waitresses were in the kitchen.
No one came to check on me until my waitress brought me my food, which was at 25 minutes past 9.
I had just waited 20 to get two eggs and a small pancake brought to me.
Those were the only items that had been cooked fresh.
The sausage which I understand being pre-cooked but still should be warmed up,was cold. The hash browns which usually are warm and crispy were cold and greasy.
My food was left with me and I ate.While I was eating the waitress came back once ,not to check how things were or if everything was alright,but to drop off the check.
I immediately place my card in the bill holder and set it upright so the waitress could see it was ready to be picked up and processed.
I finished eating.
After I finished eating the waitress still had not come back and picked up the bill. I watched as another customer went to find a manager to take his payment because his waitress was standing around talking too.
After the manager processed his payment, he walked to a table near me and asked if everything was ok,then started to walke away.
I cleared my throat ( a LOUD "ahem") and asked if he could take my payment for me,which he did.
As I was walking out I looked for the "customer comment cards" which were usually right in front of the register.The hostess told me they were out and had been for months. I knew better,but I also knew better than to argue with her.It would have been a lesson in futility.
Bottom line is, my check was $5.24.
I tipped a dollar.
I think I overtipped.
But at the same time,understanding how bad the economy is I rarely will go under a dollar.
That tip was almost 20%.
Did my service warrant 20%? I don't think so.

What would YOU have tipped?




Note: I think Ihop is a good example because they are just a middle of the road kind of place.
Your average check isn't low,but its not outrageously high either.My experience was at 9am,which,usually,most places are realtively busy,but today this Ihop had maybe 5-10 tables seated and I saw at least 4 waitresses. I couldn't see how many cooks there were.
And there was no managerial presence on the floor till the last few minutes when the other customer trying to pay had to go locate one.

That IS another thing. Kimw, I often see that. Waitresses all talking together, people going about, etc...

At "not your ordinary joes" for example, the restaurant has like four areas. Where I was seated BOTH times, probably since I was only ONE person, there are LOTS of people. MOST are families. And some are there for the first time. They ask you if you have been there before, and give new patrons a sort of welcome kit. So DON'T think it is ONLY new people, ONLY old, or just ME. They treat us pretty much as Kimw was treated, as far as time and being kind of ignored. I am treated the same way at outback. I think I have ALWAYS tipped about 20% at outback.

Kim, with the lies, etc... maybe I would have tipped 15%. Of course, I don't like the way ihops I have been in lately do things, and don't like the place anymore. For the last few years I went there ONLY because my mother wanted to, and I had NOTHING!

BTW when I am done, or want to pay the check, I make it OBVIOUS. Why would ANYONE not take money?

OH, and sometimes I don't order dessert, if they are too slow, and THAT lowers the tip ALSO, even if I DO pay the same percentage.

Steve