How concerned should I be about the latest Escherichia coli strain?

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So it turns out it's not just cucumbers that could cause a health risk.
Should I stop eating salads and fruits altogether?
Are vegetables safe to eat?
Does the E -coli bacteria survive cooking/boiling?

For the time being, I think I am going to stick to cooked/boiled meals.
  • Profile picture of the author ThomM
    Originally Posted by bravo75 View Post

    So it turns out it's not just cucumbers that could cause a health risk.
    Should I stop eating salads and fruits altogether?
    Are vegetables safe to eat?
    Does the E -coli bacteria survive cooking/boiling?

    For the time being, I think I am going to stick to cooked/boiled meals.
    From what I've heard it's mostly German related with all the cases either in Germany or people who visited Germany.
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    You think that cutting out raw foods is NOT a health risk? If you aren't getting enzymes, you are not going to be well for very long.

    I wash my fresh veggies down with hydrogen peroxide and let it bubble for a minute then wash the H2O2 off if I'm worried about it. Especially seafood that feels a tad slimy. You can also skin the veggies before you eat them.

    If you are concerned that the ecoli has been absorbed by your food, you can also eat something like cheese or drink milk. Calcium is harder for your system to digest than other foods and you will produce more stomach acid - which inadvertently destroys more bacteria during digestion.

    If it's water that has the ecoli problem, yes - boil the heck out of it, but you absolutely have to have fresh raw foods.
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    • Profile picture of the author bravo75
      Heysal, what about salads and fruits? Is simply washing them with cold water enough?

      Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

      You think that cutting out raw foods is NOT a health risk? If you aren't getting enzymes, you are not going to be well for very long.

      I wash my fresh veggies down with hydrogen peroxide and let it bubble for a minute then wash the H2O2 off if I'm worried about it. Especially seafood that feels a tad slimy. You can also skin the veggies before you eat them.

      If you are concerned that the ecoli has been absorbed by your food, you can also eat something like cheese or drink milk. Calcium is harder for your system to digest than other foods and you will produce more stomach acid - which inadvertently destroys more bacteria during digestion.

      If it's water that has the ecoli problem, yes - boil the heck out of it, but you absolutely have to have fresh raw foods.
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      • Profile picture of the author HeySal
        Originally Posted by bravo75 View Post

        Heysal, what about salads and fruits? Is simply washing them with cold water enough?
        Washing with water is NOT enough if the food is tainted. Washing with water doesn't remove fluoride pesticide, either. You need to soak it in salt water and scrub it a bit to get that crap off your food.
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    • Profile picture of the author ThomM
      Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

      You think that cutting out raw foods is NOT a health risk? If you aren't getting enzymes, you are not going to be well for very long.

      I wash my fresh veggies down with hydrogen peroxide and let it bubble for a minute then wash the H2O2 off if I'm worried about it. Especially seafood that feels a tad slimy. You can also skin the veggies before you eat them.

      If you are concerned that the ecoli has been absorbed by your food, you can also eat something like cheese or drink milk. Calcium is harder for your system to digest than other foods and you will produce more stomach acid - which inadvertently destroys more bacteria during digestion.

      If it's water that has the ecoli problem, yes - boil the heck out of it, but you absolutely have to have fresh raw foods.
      I was going to go on a rant about monsanto, but this ones better
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      • Profile picture of the author HeySal
        Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

        I was going to go on a rant about monsanto, but this ones better
        Oh by all means - continue your MONSANTO rant. If I have time, I may join you on that one. I will never understand human refusal to boycott that company off the face of the planet.
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    • Profile picture of the author mattlaclear
      Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

      You think that cutting out raw foods is NOT a health risk? If you aren't getting enzymes, you are not going to be well for very long.

      I wash my fresh veggies down with hydrogen peroxide and let it bubble for a minute then wash the H2O2 off if I'm worried about it. Especially seafood that feels a tad slimy. You can also skin the veggies before you eat them.

      If you are concerned that the ecoli has been absorbed by your food, you can also eat something like cheese or drink milk. Calcium is harder for your system to digest than other foods and you will produce more stomach acid - which inadvertently destroys more bacteria during digestion.

      If it's water that has the ecoli problem, yes - boil the heck out of it, but you absolutely have to have fresh raw foods.
      You are absolutely right on the money when it comes to the health benefits of digesting vegetable enzymes. I used to be a huge fan of V8 until I found out the enzymes in it had long since died before I ever got the can in my hand.

      One way to beat ecoli is to grow your own food and can it. But then you have to worry about botchulism.
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  • Profile picture of the author bravo75
    3 cases now in the U.S of the European E-coli strain.
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    3 cases? This is news?

    Sounds to me like a scare tactic that will make people willing to let them irradiate our vegetables - which will nullify any nutritional value left in them. People are going to end up starving to death even while having enough on their plates if we don't get a handle on food regulation pretty soon.
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    • Profile picture of the author bravo75
      Didn't think you were allowed to say stuff like that without being branded a conspiracy theorist. lol.
      I see your point though, sort of a false flag. Nothing surprises me these days.
      Here's the link anyway, for what it's worth.

      Three suspected cases of mystery e-coli in US - Yahoo! News

      Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

      3 cases? This is news?

      Sounds to me like a scare tactic that will make people willing to let them irradiate our vegetables - which will nullify any nutritional value left in them. People are going to end up starving to death even while having enough on their plates if we don't get a handle on food regulation pretty soon.
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    • Profile picture of the author ThomM
      Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

      3 cases? This is news?

      Sounds to me like a scare tactic that will make people willing to let them irradiate our vegetables - which will nullify any nutritional value left in them. People are going to end up starving to death even while having enough on their plates if we don't get a handle on food regulation pretty soon.
      Now correct if I'm wrong (I'm not) but doesn't e Coli bacteria primarily live in animal intestines, including humans? And isn't it transmitted to the vegetables through the use of fertilizers made from waste and from using brown water for irrigation or from the workers and/or conditions at the processing plants?
      Now does it or does it not make sense that GMO veggies that are modified with animal genes would make perfect carriers for e Coli?
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      • Profile picture of the author derekwong28
        Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

        Now correct if I'm wrong (I'm not) but doesn't e Coli bacteria primarily live in animal intestines, including humans? And isn't it transmitted to the vegetables through the use of fertilizers made from waste and from using brown water for irrigation or from the workers and/or conditions at the processing plants?
        Now does it or does it not make sense that GMO veggies that are modified with animal genes would make perfect carriers for e Coli?
        This is a good point, it would probably have come from the intestines of animals. However, with many other types of food poisoning, you would have literally eaten another person's faeces as the bug can only be found in humans.

        This is among the most mysterious food associated outbreaks of all time. "Hepatitis A Associated with Consumption of Frozen Strawberrie from Mexico"

        http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/00047129.htm
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        • Profile picture of the author ThomM
          Originally Posted by derekwong28 View Post

          The latest suspect is beansprouts from an organic farm in Germany.

          E.coli Outbreak: German Beansprouts Grown On An Organic Farm Are The Likely Cause Of E.coli Outbreak | World News | Sky News

          This just shows that supposedly the 'healthiest and safest" of farming methods is not 100% failsafe.
          Considering how you produce bean sprouts, I'm thinking the contamination had to come from one of the workers. The only other ways would be from the water supply or the supplier of the bean seeds. I grew and ate bean sprouts as well as other types of sprouts for years without a problem as have millions of other people. Something is just not right about that.
          Also there are a couple different methods of organic farming.
          For example in my organic garden, I don't use anything that comes from an animal in the soil. It's not that I'm opposed to using animal manure for fertilizer, but since the dairy farms closed around me I don't have the manure available to me like I did 30 years ago.
          Producing bean sprouts just uses water unless you are growing the beans to sprout.
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    Actually Thom - the stuff used for fertilizer is supposed to be aged and treated some way to kill the ecoli in it. However - the amount of livestock has created a problem that water is often full of it. It's carried to waterways via storm water, so when fields are irrigated the bacteria is spread.

    The only way the problem will ever be mitigated is to quit eating as much meat as we do and put a cease to factory farming. Right now there is so much livestock being grazed and herded everywhere that both ecoli and desertification is a threat to human population. There are some places you can't even walk on public land without having to walk through cow dung because the government rents the property out to cattle farmers. Livestock creates a LOT of dung. Usually it's just buried somewhere or left scattered. There are some places that pig farms were creating a lot of mess not too long back - not sure whether they cleaned it up or not.

    As far as an animal gene? I don't think that would be enough to make something particularly an ecoli carrier - the stuff doesn't grow generally in animals - it's just in the intestines when all is working normally.

    The GMOs that scare the crap out of me is the roundup ready stuff. That "natural" bacteria they use to make a plant roundup ready resistant (and who wants to eat a plant sprayed with that toxic crap anyway?) is a toxin. When you eat a GMO plant, it actually dumps that toxin in your intestines where it actually gets into your other bacteria and starts reproducing itself, making your intestines a toxin factory. It can actually explode the stomachs of rats and mice - and they are finding severe problems in people that eat it now, too. They even know that MONSANTO hid the research and knew that would happen. The answer that America came up with for that is to make it legal to NOT have to put "GMO" on a food label so people just plain won't know when they are eating it.

    The only way we are going to get MONSANTO out of our lives is to start to refuse to eat anything that isn't labeled "organic". Once companies can't sell their packaged foods because people won't eat food stuffed with poison, and they have to use real food if they are going to stay in business - and farmers have to use real seeds instead of Monsanto frankenseeds, we might see a few laws protecting us kick in. We already can't sell meat, corn, and soy to most other countries. I'm wondering how long before our food becomes so tampered and poisonous that we will have to move out of the country to survive if we don't have our own farm.
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    • Profile picture of the author ThomM
      The only way the problem will ever be mitigated is to quit eating as much meat as we do and put a cease to factory farming.
      I have a big problem with factory farms they don't give a rats ass about the environment, the care of their charges, or the quality of their products.
      You can run a farm of any size and have it be a benefit to the environment, but you can't do it by putting profit first.
      Take the beef, oops, cattle farm. At best they sell off the manure or at worse 'compost' it which produces a run off that pollutes and carries e Coli.
      Instead they could collect it in a sealed pit to compost. In the process two main elements will be released, Methane and water. The methane can be collected and used to power the farm, the water can be collected and with very little processing can be used as a cleaner gray water for toilets and even cleaning equipment. The solid compost can be dried further and pressed in to plant containers for landscape plants and many, many, other items.
      Right now mostly plastic pots are used for landscape plants and very few are recycled or used again. The compost pots can be planted with the plants and will provide fertilizer to the plant.
      Any ways changing the methods used in large farming will go a long way in stopping the spread of e Coli in the foods we eat.
      Man's always going to eat some kind of meat, though it needs to be in balance with other types of foods.
      But you know as well as I that anyone who has any control or say over what we eat don't want us or the environment healthy, there's no profit in that.
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    My first and most major problem with factory farms is the way they treat live beings. Can you imagine what someone from another planet would think of us if they saw the way humans treat other beings?

    And what we feed them? Can you imagine going your whole life without ever being fed food that you were naturally meant to eat? Then, too - the crap they feed them, GMO corn, antibiotics, you name it - and that all gets transferred straight into us. Meat has become so bad now that they are using a glue like substance to keep it from falling apart in the stores. Yuck. And antibiotics aren't fed to them to keep them well - they are fed to make them fat. Did someone say that Americans are fat? Maybe they should be eating more of that wholesome antibiotic stuffed meat! Just one more reason that if it's not organic, it doesn't belong in your mouth.
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    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      I agree, Sal. That we would allow any living creature to be treated and fed as so many livestock are is reflection of our true nature - and it's not pretty.

      Whether an animal has a short life or not - it deserves to have some quality in that life. It should be fed as nature intended it to eat and be allowed to mature at a natural rate.

      Oops - wasn't done yet.

      Bacteria and viruses mutate all the time - nothing new there. I understand the scientists are excited about it - but the hysteria seems overblown. 1500 cases in Germany - 16 deaths. This isn't something that one person spreads to another like influenza.

      The three "suspected" cases in the U.S. are in people who just returned from Germany.

      This is the first I've heard of anyone in the U.S. being affected
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  • Profile picture of the author derekwong28
    The funny thing is that if you go to supermarkets in Hong Kong now, some vegetables and fruits now proudly display the sign "produced in China" and sell at a premium price. This would have been unthinkable a few weeks ago.
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    • Profile picture of the author HeySal
      Originally Posted by derekwong28 View Post

      The funny thing is that if you go to supermarkets in Hong Kong now, some vegetables and fruits now proudly display the sign "produced in China" and sell at a premium price. This would have been unthinkable a few weeks ago.
      You might want to stay away from the watermelon over there, Derek. They are using a very lethal spray on them - causes watermelons to explode. Incidentally - it can do about the same to your own digestive tract. Be careful of melons that are pale instead of bright pink, with white seeds (not the same as white seeds in seedless melons - they are deformed by the toxin). I wish I could remember the name of the stuff - you might find it on google. I bought a watermelon two days ago and the first thing I asked was where it was from.

      All in all though, the U.S. is about to take the lead in toxic food production.
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      • Profile picture of the author derekwong28
        Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

        You might want to stay away from the watermelon over there, Derek. They are using a very lethal spray on them - causes watermelons to explode. Incidentally - it can do about the same to your own digestive tract. Be careful of melons that are pale instead of bright pink, with white seeds (not the same as white seeds in seedless melons - they are deformed by the toxin). I wish I could remember the name of the stuff - you might find it on google. I bought a watermelon two days ago and the first thing I asked was where it was from.

        All in all though, the U.S. is about to take the lead in toxic food production.
        Sal, people are just being silly over here. Many more foods from China is tainted or substandard to some degree. Right now, there is boycott of Japanese food going on because of their nuclear power plant disaster. This is as if they think that all Japanese restaurants get their food from an extremely expensive Japan. It was the same with the BSE scare in the UK when beef from all other countries were avoided.
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  • Profile picture of the author Pauline60
    I have to agree with you Heysal - the underlying problem is that we now have a distorted view of food and how it should be produced. Safety and quality have been sacrificed for cheapness and huge profit margins. Corporations tell us what we want to eat and influence our eating habits to a frightening degree. We are encouraged to consume products instead of real food. As for how we treat the creatures we use for food, well its a disgrace. Cheap chicken = torture, but most people ignore the fact.

    Trouble is that food has become cheap and consumers have become conditioned to that. On average we spend a low proportion of our income on food despite the fact that it is so important. What has been forgotten is that organic farming is the normal way to produce food, not some newfangled thing, and was the norm until relatively recently.
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  • Profile picture of the author derekwong28
    The latest suspect is beansprouts from an organic farm in Germany.

    E.coli Outbreak: German Beansprouts Grown On An Organic Farm Are The Likely Cause Of E.coli Outbreak | World News | Sky News

    This just shows that supposedly the 'healthiest and safest" of farming methods is not 100% failsafe.
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    • Profile picture of the author ThomM
      Originally Posted by derekwong28 View Post

      The latest suspect is beansprouts from an organic farm in Germany.

      E.coli Outbreak: German Beansprouts Grown On An Organic Farm Are The Likely Cause Of E.coli Outbreak | World News | Sky News

      This just shows that supposedly the 'healthiest and safest" of farming methods is not 100% failsafe.
      Just saw on the news that it's not the sprouts.
      Now they're trying to blame it on Lettuce, Tomatoes, and Cucumbers:rolleyes:
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      • Profile picture of the author derekwong28
        It is completely possible that they will never have definitive proof where the outbreak cam from. All the evidence now is epidemilogical and simply done by interviews and questionnaires. Those are are infected are given a list of foods which they are asked to tick whether it had been consumed within the past few days. Obviously, the foods with the highest number of ticks will be the most suspicious.
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