Can anyone tell me why all people are opposing SOPA (stop online piracy act)

[Hardik Jogi]

I am hearing a lot about SOPA in recent days. According to the title, it is about stopping piracy on internet.

But i have seen many people opposing it. What are the reasons for the oppose?

[HeySal]

Hardik - It's a trojan horse. Not at all what they are publicizing it to be.

We HAVE laws against piracy. If they want to shut down piracy sites, they already have the law on their side. This bill would not even exist if it were just allowing them to enforce a law already in existence.

What SOPA does is give them powers that will allow them to shut down any site they want - destroy any business they want. It also guarantees large companies will have little, if any competition. There are other threads about the bill in here that have links that can give you a more clear picture of what is really going on.

[seasoned]

What Heysal said is certainly correct. What I hate about it is that "IP protection" laws now are MORONIC! As heysal said, we have had laws for a LONG time! Those laws are INTERNATIONALLY recognized, agreed to, and replicated! So JAPAN, for example, honors ours, and we honor theirs. There is NO reason to change those!

They have no reliable central repository to load things into, though that ITSELF is a security risk, and people could claim rights they don't have, and shut sites down claiming they infringe. Further, the government is asking for too much power! It is ILLEGAL, but THEY are the ones that would enforce the laws they are breaking!

Did you know that they are now trying to say that freedom of the press applies ONLY to bone fide journalists? GEE, given the old description of journalists, VERY few qualify, but they now must define it a NEW way. Although I agree that the person in question should be found guilty, and she is clearly not a journalist, I don't agree with their subjective reasoning.

How long before THIS law morphs into something different? With new laws, it seems it is within months.

Steve

[Okoji]

We have have to stand against SOPA, if we don't, one day we may no longer have WF to use.

We have to be careful!

[HeySal]

Originally Posted by seasoned

Did you know that they are now trying to say that freedom of the press applies ONLY to bone fide journalists? GEE, given the old description of journalists, VERY few qualify, but they now must define it a NEW way. Although I agree that the person in question should be found guilty, and she is clearly not a journalist, I don't agree with their subjective reasoning.

How long before THIS law morphs into something different? With new laws, it seems it is within months.

Steve

She who? What are you talking about? What happened?

[seasoned]

Originally Posted by HeySal

She who? What are you talking about? What happened?

Sorry, I should have specified when I talked about the woman being prosecuted, it WASN'T you. There is a blogger claiming she is a journalist, but the piece was propaganda for the "99%". I'm not sure if THIS is the same case, but t is at least similar:

Why An Investment Firm Was Awarded $2.5 Million After Being Defamed By Blogger - Forbes

Frankly, I think journalism should be defined by the merits of the work and the research and diligence and NOT by the association or title! In any event, protection by the first amendment should be based on fairness and reasonable intent.

Steve

[HeySal]

Originally Posted by seasoned

Sorry, I should have specified when I talked about the woman being prosecuted, it WASN'T you. There is a blogger claiming she is a journalist, but the piece was propaganda for the "99%". I'm not sure if THIS is the same case, but t is at least similar:

Why An Investment Firm Was Awarded $2.5 Million After Being Defamed By Blogger - Forbes

Frankly, I think journalism should be defined by the merits of the work and the research and diligence and NOT by the association or title! In any event, protection by the first amendment should be based on fairness and reasonable intent.

Steve

LOL no - if had been me, I'd probably have known what you were talking about. I hadn't heard about that one. Figures though. So much for freedom of speech. If you are paid by a corporate news team and you lie your face off nobody can touch you for it. So freedom of speech is now also a corporate right rather than an individual freedom. Great. I have a word for that. Take that sticky off the top of this forum and I'll spell it out real loud and clear.

[seasoned]

Originally Posted by HeySal

LOL no - if had been me, I'd probably have known what you were talking about. I hadn't heard about that one. Figures though. So much for freedom of speech. If you are paid by a corporate news team and you lie your face off nobody can touch you for it. So freedom of speech is now also a corporate right rather than an individual freedom. Great. I have a word for that. Take that sticky off the top of this forum and I'll spell it out real loud and clear.

Well, we agree there! As I said: "Frankly, I think journalism should be defined by the merits of the work and the research and diligence and NOT by the association or title! In any event, protection by the first amendment should be based on fairness and reasonable intent."

Journalist is a term describing a FUNCTION of a REAL NATURAL PERSON. It certainly predates any current companies.

HECK, I am a programmer. I WRITE programs, among other things. A company may hire some drunk janitor as a programmer, and he may even put a string of characters into a computer. That doesn't make him a programmer.

LIKEWISE, they may hire a janitor as a journalist, and he may even write some nice sounding prose. That does NOT make him a journalist!

On the other hand, a person off the street may become the best journalist EVER. It doesn't matter WHAT training, title, or job they have!

Steve

[Sunfyre7896]

Originally Posted by Okoji

We have have to stand against SOPA, if we don't, one day we may no longer have WF to use.

We have to be careful!

It's only a matter of time until this passes. There's no reason to think that this won't pass when something as asinine and anti-rights as the N.D.A.A. just got passed by both houses of Congress and Obama. Once SOPA is passed, they'll have total control over many aspects of our lives and complete power to do what they will. Censorship at its finest.

[Young And Opulent]

That's easy.
Because they want to be able to pirate other people's products and then cry for a law like this when their stuff is being pirated. Funny how IM'ers cry about their stuff being shared on other sites. But they cry even more about this law passing.

[calhoun]

Because OP if you share a link that violates copy right on a website like Reddit you can be charged and prosecuted for it.

Now who would enforce these SOPA violations, huh? I thought the internet was anonymous. Oh well, I guess a new industry devoted to enforcing SOPA in America will be invented.

Soon we will all be serfs to our new overlords.

[DEaFeYe]

Originally Posted by calhoun

Because OP if you share a link that violates copy right on a website like Reddit you can be charged and prosecuted for it.

Now who would enforce these SOPA violations, huh? I thought the internet was anonymous. Oh well, I guess a new industry devoted to enforcing SOPA in America will be invented.

Soon we will all be serfs to our new overlords.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

[seasoned]

There is NOT 94% of ANY group that believe in immaculate conception, or even the virgin birth. Not even CATHOLICS! The US has 25% of CO2 emissions? DOUBT IT! Some nations are VERY large, and have far less efficient engines. or dirtier machinery and/or fuels. Have you SEEN china lately? Still, those plants that they complain are vanishing NEED CO2! I guess we COULD make the cars less efficient and have them put out CO! It would be more dangerous, and plants may not be able to use it, but it would weigh less.

I doubt the healtcare industry spent $1.4Million/day to defeat the "HCP", but the other side is certainly going gangbusters pushing something! Still, these days, $1.4 millday doesn't go far on TV. IWICSM

Interesting thing. SOME catholics actually believe that MARY was born to a virgin mother, etc...! I guess the reasoning is that only this way could Jesus be subject to effictively NO inerited sin, etc... And some believe in transubstantiation. But 94% of ANY group? Include ANY christians(EVEN Pentecostal), ANY catholics, GOP, etc....? NOPE! And I doubt any other than some catholics believe in MARY being born to a virgin.

People say SO much about Christians, etc... If SO many were in government, and they were SO intransigent, and were such STRONG believers, the US, heck the WORLD, would be very different.

Then again, if they did believe in the immaculate conception, SO WHAT? HECK, some that do may be in africa. Some are CERTAINLY in some VERY poor parts of spanish speaking countries. Some even help them out from richer countres. DannyThomas prayed, honored his oath, and even named his hospital after a saint! Did HE believe in the immaculate conception? MAYBE. Does that invalidate anything he did?

Steve

[KimW]

Rule of thumb:
The more benign something sounds the more dangerous to your rights it is.

[Roaddog]

This was kind of interesting,
Bob Parsons CEO of GoDaddy...
Mastering the publicity stunt or the art of trolling

Supports SOPA, then unsupports it...GooooDaddy.

[Barry Unruh]

Originally Posted by seasoned

There is NOT 94% of ANY group that believe in immaculate conception, or even the virgin birth.
Steve

Ok, I've read this post 4 times, and I still have yet to unravel how it pertains to SOPA. I'm guessing you had a point, but somehow I'm missing it.

[seasoned]

Originally Posted by Barry Unruh

Ok, I've read this post 4 times, and I still have yet to unravel how it pertains to SOPA. I'm guessing you had a point, but somehow I'm missing it.

About that reeducation video. It covers so many things, ironically out of context, that it is clear they want you to tie all of them together, etc..

Steve

[seasoned]

Originally Posted by benmoore47

Some people make it as a living that's why it is hard for them to stop online piracy. Sad but true.

Probably most people that pirate don't do it for a living. The reason why it is so hard to stop is because there is relatively little risk, and often NO laws. I have surveyed a lot of people from a nation of over a BILLION people. Almost 100% have NO concept of the idea of protecting software distribution. And THAT isn't even china! CHINA is known for piracy.

So THERE you have it, over 1/3 of the world's population that think sharing software is as reasonable as sharing a cup of soda. And there are two other groups numbering well over a billion people that may feel the SAME way!

Steve

[Barry Unruh]

Originally Posted by seasoned

About that reeducation video. It covers so many things, ironically out of context, that it is clear they want you to tie all of them together, etc..

Steve

That will teach me....I read all the posts, but I sure didn't watch the video. Dang...now watching embedded videos is going to have to become part of "read the entire thread before replying"...

[seasoned]

Originally Posted by benmoore47

Well. I must agree in your post since you made a survey about this. So the government must do something about this. They must increase the punishment of piracy.

Sorry, China ********WILL NOT******** do so, and certainly NOT at our behest! The OTHER nation won't either. And it certainly isn't worth getting the world obliterated over. BOTH those nations have atomic weapons, so I doubt anyone in the US would feign to do much more than suggest that they do so.

I don't know if I even ever noticed this before, but my danish aunt gave me a special parking device for denmark. By law, almost every car parking on danish streets must have one. It tracks when a person parked the car, so the police can ticket it if they stay too long. The US does the reverse! We PAY the city to track the time and THEN, if it elapses, we pay the ticket. It is a nice idea, so other european nations may have it. I got it around 1989. GUESS where it was made! CHINA! INCREDIBLE! IMAGINE! They probably got a buck or two for EVERY car in denmark, just for this simple little sticker like device!

Anyway, it is astounding that so many trust a nation that really can't be trusted.

Steve

[chrislangley]

There are still those that want the Internet to be totally free to share copyrighted material or not

[seasoned]

Originally Posted by chrislangley

There are still those that want the Internet to be totally free to share copyrighted material or not

They have always, and will always, exist.

[JustVisiting]

For "All people opposing " you can add "Large tech companies opposing". None of the large tech companies want SOPA. either.

It would seem to be a legal "can of worms".

Quote:
"Indeed, legal experts agreed: SOPA did open a lot of dangerous doors, many of which could lead to the widespread censorship of the Internet. Harvard law professor Laurence Tribe recently even argued recently that the bill violates the First Amendment."

Source:
The Titans of Silicon Valley Rally Around the SOPA Alternative - Politics - The Atlantic Wire

SOPA will make sites like Youtube unworkable. Youtube knows that. They cannot police every video uploaded. Google and other search engines cannot review every site they index.

SOPA would kill WEB 2.0. ...Dead.

The tech companies are in favor of a proposed alternative bill;OPEN. This proposes a process to stop piracy. It is not what amounts to the summary execution of websites a.k.a. SOPA.

Note: There is a similar subject thread to this on the main forum and this is a similar post to the one I made there.

[DEaFeYe]

Originally Posted by seasoned

There is NOT 94% of ANY group that believe in immaculate conception, or even the virgin birth. Not even CATHOLICS! The US has 25% of CO2 emissions? DOUBT IT! Some nations are VERY large, and have far less efficient engines. or dirtier machinery and/or fuels. Have you SEEN china lately? Still, those plants that they complain are vanishing NEED CO2! I guess we COULD make the cars less efficient and have them put out CO! It would be more dangerous, and plants may not be able to use it, but it would weigh less.

I doubt the healtcare industry spent $1.4Million/day to defeat the "HCP", but the other side is certainly going gangbusters pushing something! Still, these days, $1.4 millday doesn't go far on TV. IWICSM

Interesting thing. SOME catholics actually believe that MARY was born to a virgin mother, etc...! I guess the reasoning is that only this way could Jesus be subject to effictively NO inerited sin, etc... And some believe in transubstantiation. But 94% of ANY group? Include ANY christians(EVEN Pentecostal), ANY catholics, GOP, etc....? NOPE! And I doubt any other than some catholics believe in MARY being born to a virgin.

People say SO much about Christians, etc... If SO many were in government, and they were SO intransigent, and were such STRONG believers, the US, heck the WORLD, would be very different.

Then again, if they did believe in the immaculate conception, SO WHAT? HECK, some that do may be in africa. Some are CERTAINLY in some VERY poor parts of spanish speaking countries. Some even help them out from richer countres. DannyThomas prayed, honored his oath, and even named his hospital after a saint! Did HE believe in the immaculate conception? MAYBE. Does that invalidate anything he did?

Steve

Sometimes it's just better to get the point than to analyze the statistics. Stats posted by any group are almost always skewed towards what the end goal is. And 77.6% of the time they're completely made up.

Also, it's a rock song, not necessary to have deep analyses

[HeySal]

Steve's pretty well known for getting stuck on a "keyword" in a discussion and going off on an irrelevant tangent over it.

You are right - a lot of the numbers are off kilter in the video, but the whole message comes across pretty loud and clear.

SOPA allows them to pull down websites without due process. It also sets up draconian use of "copyright" -- such as if you use even a small quote from the news, even attributed correctly and used inside your own material for illumination or reference, they can call it "infringement" and pull you offline.

The worst part of it is that because there is no due process necessary to pull you offline - they can use any excuse they want to just yank you off if you say anything the "authorities" don't want you to say. It would be up to you to be able to fight them to get back online - and we know already how that works,eh?

As I posted somewhere before (maybe even earlier this thread) -- most of the 82 websites that got seized last year (early this year?) were completely innocent of any wrong doing and they were seized with NO due process. It harmed a LOT of innocent business owners - then the news reports it as if it were a good thing that 82 websites were seized. People, unless they looked into it, thought that a service had been done for them when it was just a draconian move against a lot of innocent people. SOPA would allow this to be everyday business in the world of the powerful and greedy. Gov has already been hassling Youtube about shutting down videos that do nothing but show real corruption at high levels. Not lies - just stuff they don't want the world to hear or see. That is NOT anti-piracy. It's censorship. Period. Chinese style censorship at its finest.

Remember during the Iran protests when the protesters had to go through proxy to get info out because their internet was shut down, monitored, etc? That is how Americans will be communicating any issues of extreme importance pretty soon. If you put this together with other current legislation and your blood doesn't run cold and your bowels don't run loose, you don't understand any of what is going on around you. People need to stop concentrating on one thing or another and start looking at whole packages - and they need to do that pretty fast.

[seasoned]

Originally Posted by HeySal

Remember during the Iran protests when the protesters had to go through proxy to get info out because their internet was shut down, monitored, etc? That is how Americans will be communicating any issues of extreme importance pretty soon. If you put this together with other current legislation and your blood doesn't run cold and your bowels don't run loose, you don't understand any of what is going on around you. People need to stop concentrating on one thing or another and start looking at whole packages - and they need to do that pretty fast.

I already have a friend that won't communicate with me using gmail's email. I wonder if he knows how RIDICULOUSLY insecure email is. Anyway, he says google is in bed with the us military!!!

As for the laws, etc... It is amazing. People here should see that. Congress, or whoever, picks a name that tries to make the bill sound GREAT! If they can't really do THAT, they will make it an ackronym that implies it is great. It is called HYPE or a SCAM.

ALSO, many have agendas they want to get passed that will NEVER legitimately pass! So they manage to attach them to bills that seem to have a good chance at passing. IF, once they succeed, ANYONE tries to change their text, it counts as a change to the bill, and the whole process is to start ALL OVER!

The result is that a chunk of delicious sirloin may be served with a poison center. They do that because people are BEGGING to be fed the sirloin that they said they have. This often leaves the public with a bunch of $%^&*( from the animals that devoured the sirloin), and maybe a stinking poisoned carcass.

So even a GOOD well-intentioned bill may be BAD!

Steve

[JustVisiting]

Have you seen this video? Every internet user should. It's worth watching the whole fourteen minutes! I never watch a video right through to the end but this one I just couldn't turn off. Brilliantly done.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

[Roaddog]

Originally Posted by JustVisiting

Have you seen this video? Every internet user should. It's worth watching the whole fourteen minutes! I never watch a video right through to the end but this one I just couldn't turn off. Brilliantly done.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

That's a pretty interesting vid. I had no idea CBS/Viacom owned cnet...figures.

That kind of reminds me of drug dealer moves...give them enough to hook 'em, reel em in...

Well it's obvious what needs to happen now, arrest themselves forthwith, and sue the pants off themselves...lol

Where's 60 minutes when ya need em?....

[biffula]

Don't just boycott godaddy for their support, get active. You need to contact (preferably call) your 2 senators and your representative and let them know that: you are a constituent, that you vote and that you are against sopa. Better hurry, hearings start in January.

[MoneyMagnetMagnate]

Just another Frankenstein Monster...

They don't really want you to know they create the "evil" until it escapes and turns on them.

Then of course, it must be stopped at all costs to protect "society".


(I really don't think this was a "masterplan"...I don't think they thought that far ahead...if they did, they are really evil bastards, and I would have to give them credit for being that viciously evil, and kill them mercilessly like Nazis, or terrorists, or drug kingpins, and I can't do that...yet.)

[HeySal]

Well, Jim - I'm thinking those are one of the places we should be sending this Youtube.

Thanks for posting this JustVisiting - as soon as I hit the post button on this thread - that video is going to FB and Twitter. It gives a least a little tad of hope in a corporate owned country that a action against the people by a corporation can be stopped.

[Roaddog]

Originally Posted by HeySal

Well, Jim - I'm thinking those are one of the places we should be sending this Youtube.

Isn't 60 Minutes on CBS?...

uh oh...checkmate on that move.

[seasoned]

Originally Posted by Roaddog

That's a pretty interesting vid. I had no idea CBS/Viacom owned cnet...figures.

That kind of reminds me of drug dealer moves...give them enough to hook 'em, reel em in...

Well it's obvious what needs to happen now, arrest themselves forthwith, and sue the pants off themselves...lol

Where's 60 minutes when ya need em?....

Well, THEY are going to claim that they don't manage them, that there is no two way communication between them, that there wa no LITERAL inducement, etc.... But he makes a good point in that video! And many programs don't want to hurt ANYONE in the industry. It is WELL KNOWN to be incestuous. If you are on CBS, and syndicaated, speaking against ABC could hurt your options if you are dropped, and increase the chances that you will be.

Steve

[HeySal]

Originally Posted by Roaddog

Isn't 60 Minutes on CBS?...

uh oh...checkmate on that move.

Hell, I don't watch who owns who anymore. I know that our news is corporate run and so is our country. That's all I need to know. I sent the video to FB, Youtube, and a few choice legislators. Not going to do any good to send it to many of them - they know where their money is coming from. You don't get too stinking rich not knowing who it is that is paying you off.