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My Greatest Love...And No Credibility

by Steven Wagenheim
7 replies
  • OFF TOPIC
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I have been writing songs for over 30 years. I love writing.

I'd love to write a book showing other people how to write hit songs.

But how can I?

I've never had a hit song.

I've had 2 songs published that never got off the cutting room floor.

So what, I write a book "How To Write A Song That Gets Published?"

I don't think it has quite the ring as "How To Write A Hit Song."

There is a point to this.

Those of you who are thinking of writing a book on something in an area
where you've had little or no success, think about how ridiculous it is.

Unless you're going to flat out lie, you have no credibility. What are you
going to put into your book that's going to make people take you seriously?

Yeah, I know what some are going to say.

Have somebody write it for you, or interview a top songwriter.

Well, all that does is make me a reporter. Big deal. It's not sharing my love
for music and my knowledge with the world. Ultimately, it's just a way to
make money and there are plenty of other ways to do that where at least
I can share something that I'm good at and have success with.

And let me tell you, trying to get a hold of a top songwriter to interview,
when you're a nobody...not easy. I've tried. Heck, I can't even get
publishers to take me seriously.

Anyway, if you're going to write something and pass yourself off as an
authority on the subject, you damn well better be one.

At least that's my opinion.
#credibility #greatest #loveand
  • Profile picture of the author zerivabella
    Gee Steve, I've agreed with you twice in one day. I have been so disappointed with ebooks that purport to be from 'so called experts' that have turned out to be cut and paste or bad re-writes or worse.

    That is the bane of the web where anybody can say they are what they are not. With traditional paper books, apart from vanity publishing, you know that somebody has pitched the idea and it has been read by an editor before being approved for printing.

    I shall have to find my old Latin school book so that I can put "Reader Beware" instead of the poor old buyer.
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  • Profile picture of the author R Hagel
    Originally Posted by Steven Wagenheim View Post


    Anyway, if you're going to write something and pass yourself off as an
    authority on the subject, you damn well better be one.
    Hi Steven,

    I think you sort of answered your own question here.

    Look at folks on this forum. There are some people who are just starting out. They aren't making enough to quit their day jobs. But there are certain things they do know about -- like how to make $30 a day (or $50 or whatever). Or maybe they've become quite good at one piece of the puzzle, such as copywriting or SEO.

    There are people who are willing to pay them for what they know. It doesn't matter if the folks don't know it ALL ... as long as they're not trying to pass themselves off as something that they're not.

    Let me give you another example...

    Suppose you have someone who can housetrain any dog in just a couple days. But while he can do that, he doesn't know how to train his dogs in other ways. So his dogs are running amok -- jumping on people, barking a lot, ripping up shoes.

    This guy could write a very good and successful "how to housetrain" a dog book. But he could never pass himself off as a professional dog trainer.

    See what I'm saying?

    Same with you. You might not be an expert in ALL the steps -- but you know stuff that other people want to know. Start there.

    Cheers,
    Becky

    P.S. I bet you can find a niche of people who aren't looking for the whole kitnkaboodle. For example, just a fast glance at WordTracker reveals searches like:

    "how to write worship songs"

    "how to write songs for a sick person"

    "how to write a country song"

    "how to write a blues song"

    "how to write a sad song"

    "how to write a love song"

    And so on. Just skip the market that's looking for "how to write a hit song" and you'll be ok.
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    • Profile picture of the author Steven Wagenheim
      Originally Posted by R Hagel View Post

      P.S. I bet you can find a niche of people who aren't looking for the whole kitnkaboodle. For example, just a fast glance at WordTracker reveals searches like:

      "how to write worship songs"

      "how to write songs for a sick person"

      "how to write a country song"

      "how to write a blues song"

      "how to write a sad song"

      "how to write a love song"

      And so on. Just skip the market that's looking for "how to write a hit song" and you'll be ok.

      Thanks Becky. You make some good points here and I guess if I wrote
      a book that simply delivered on the promise, I could do okay.

      Question is, how much of a market is there for the above keyword
      phrases?

      Looks like I have some niche research to do.
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  • Profile picture of the author Art Turner
    You don't even have to write it yourself...head over to Sitepoint Startup Websites and look at all the Clickbank-ready sites, including an ebook, a personal story and testimonials. You can become an instant authoritative expert for about $700.

    Art
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  • Profile picture of the author GrantFreeman
    Nice point steve. A person can't teach someone how to make $5k a month if they've never made that kind of money themselves.

    To whom it may concern..

    Are you reading this right now and think you could swing it anyway? A good idea to make quick cash? Go right ahead. But people on the internet today are smarter.

    I suppose you have to ask yourself if the refunds you'll get after the sale are worth it?

    Steve,

    All you need is one! Don't give up on what you love.

    Grant
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  • Profile picture of the author Peter Soos
    I certainly understand your angst Steven. I think you only have it half right however... Of course you don't want to represent yourself as a 20 hit wonder or something you are not. However, listening to your dilemma...I feel that you do have some info that is valuable to beginning songwriters, am I right? You may modify this scenario as it actually fits with the real details in your life...here goes.

    Easy Step-By-Step Song Writing by Steven Wagenhiem

    A Beginner Guide To Song Writing With 20 Interviews With The Most Prominent Published Experts In The Field Of Song Writing.


    I think you know where this goes next Steven. If it were me, I'd contact every published author on the subject thru their publishing house rep and offer them a spot in your book in exchange for an article/chapter in their sub specialty.

    Explain that the author will have an intro that allows the professional mention of their current book and website if applicable. Also set up a blog site just for this project that allows for the update of the authors info as time goes on.

    Any books or other material presented on the site will have a link to wherever it is up for sale along with your affiliate link. It is the publishers responsibility to send you current info to post.

    You may put this up in a membership site format with recurring billing...annual fee for instance...low entry. Your site then has spin off products of your own creation...or sublicenced...cd/dvd/etc.

    Now ...long term...what's in it for you?

    You become known for your interest in the field
    You have a proven product
    You get a track record in these projects
    You now have something other publishers would have faith in whenever you want to do it again
    And...maybe one of the publishing houses would be interested in a book deal (breaking even on this is good...you become the expert)

    I have more...would this help in your ethical dilemma and still allow you to share your love for song writing?

    Just the first of many ways to crack this nut...and still provide real value. Hope it helps,

    Peter Soos
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    • Profile picture of the author Steven Wagenheim
      Originally Posted by Peter Soos View Post

      I certainly understand your angst Steven. I think you only have it half right however... Of course you don't want to represent yourself as a 20 hit wonder or something you are not. However, listening to your dilemma...I feel that you do have some info that is valuable to beginning songwriters, am I right? You may modify this scenario as it actually fits with the real details in your life...here goes.

      Easy Step-By-Step Song Writing by Steven Wagenhiem

      A Beginner Guide To Song Writing With 20 Interviews With The Most Prominent Published Experts In The Field Of Song Writing.


      I think you know where this goes next Steven. If it were me, I'd contact every published author on the subject thru their publishing house rep and offer them a spot in your book in exchange for an article/chapter in their sub specialty.

      Explain that the author will have an intro that allows the professional mention of their current book and website if applicable. Also set up a blog site just for this project that allows for the update of the authors info as time goes on.

      Any books or other material presented on the site will have a link to wherever it is up for sale along with your affiliate link. It is the publishers responsibility to send you current info to post.

      You may put this up in a membership site format with recurring billing...annual fee for instance...low entry. Your site then has spin off products of your own creation...or sublicenced...cd/dvd/etc.

      Now ...long term...what's in it for you?

      You become known for your interest in the field
      You have a proven product
      You get a track record in these projects
      You now have something other publishers would have faith in whenever you want to do it again
      And...maybe one of the publishing houses would be interested in a book deal (breaking even on this is good...you become the expert)

      I have more...would this help in your ethical dilemma and still allow you to share your love for song writing?

      Just the first of many ways to crack this nut...and still provide real value. Hope it helps,

      Peter Soos

      Thanks Peter, but as I said up top, this is relying on others for the
      credibility factor. Ultimately, this is just another way to make money and
      not really getting into sharing my own knowledge of songwriting.

      You know, it's kind of like being a master of ceremonies for a big event.

      You're really just there because of your pretty face or whatever. But the
      stars are the ones getting the awards.

      I'm not looking to be another pretty face. I want to know the thrill of
      having somebody write to me and say, "Hey Steve, your songwriting
      instruction got me my first record deal." Not, "Hey Steve, those guest
      writers in your book were great. They helped me get my first record deal."

      Ego maybe? Possibly, but like I said, if I'm just doing this to make money,
      there are easier ways. Trust me, I've been in this business a long time and
      it's not easy.
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  • Profile picture of the author Peter Soos
    Of course Steven,

    I should have stressed the fact that the ongoing blog and members area was for you to share what you love. The free level of the blog would be for the updated publishers info.

    We are not in this for the money alone (I Hope!).

    I have a friend that has an animal advocacy site (blog) She is very well known because of it and has gained authority site status...she really doesn't want to monetise it other than some AdSense sometimes or an ad or two that barely covers monthly hosting. Her love for this is what made her the come-to-expert in this field...not the draw of money. Steven...money pays bills...what we love pays our heart and soul. Thank you very much and I hope you can find a balance that is morally acceptable for you...Great Post,
    Peter Soos
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    • Profile picture of the author cshilling22
      What if you called it something like: The Anatomy of a Hit Song.

      Then you write all of your tips and information but use examples of actual hit songs to showcase how it works. Then you are using your information but the credibility of songs that have actually been hits. This seems like a product that would be very valuable to people and allow you to write about your passion and share your knowledge while also having credibility.
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      • Profile picture of the author Steven Wagenheim
        Originally Posted by cshilling22 View Post

        What if you called it something like: The Anatomy of a Hit Song.

        Then you write all of your tips and information but use examples of actual hit songs to showcase how it works. Then you are using your information but the credibility of songs that have actually been hits. This seems like a product that would be very valuable to people and allow you to write about your passion and share your knowledge while also having credibility.
        You know...you may have something here.

        I remember the first time I heard America's "Horse With No Name" driving
        to the dentist. I said to my mom, "That's going to be a number 1 song" and
        it was.

        I always could pick 'em, even before I learned how to write.

        Truth is, there is no anatomy to a hit song because this is a fluky biz.

        Some songs you'd think could never make it become huge hits.
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