What Goes Around Comes Around

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There have been threads and stories in the news about the US Government criminally prosecuting persons in other countries for violating US copyright. They are extradited to the US and imprisoned.

Today, Egypt filed criminal charges against 8 Americans for insulting Islam - arising from the much to-do about the anti-Islamic movie and YouTube video causing riots worldwide and the death of a US ambassador. The video was available for downloading in Egypt. The likely penalty for a conviction is death.

The Sacramento Bee ran an editorial this week stating US First Amendment rights should not apply if the speech - in the US by US citizens - is likely to cause anger and distress to persons in another country.

Soooo, should the US extradite residents to Egypt for trial?

The topic is application of another country's law to your website or online activities - and not politics or religion - and what standard the US should apply given its prior positions.

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  • Hell - they want Terry Jones...they can have him, and tell you what, throw in the WBC on the deal too - I may get hit with an infraction, but I'm tired of these *******s abusing their 'right' of free speech - their irresponsible, reckless, and self-centered behavior get people killed. (IMO)
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    • Originally Posted by Ken_Caudill View Post

      So people can say anything they want as long as you approve.

      That's nice.
      We will go around until we all get banned, but free speech is not "what I approve" at all - but it is not free if it gets people killed for no reason - no more than yelling "fire" in a crowded theater...

      Free speech is a discourse we all enjoy and covet in this nation - but it carries a lot of responsibility - and if you are free to say it, you should also be accountable and take responsibility for the damage it may cause should it be necessary.
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      • Originally Posted by Ken_Caudill View Post

        Gawd, the crowded theater argument. Why is it that anyone who wants to allow coercion to suppress free speech resorts to that tired chestnut?

        No, we should not allow people who use violence to curb free speech. No way in hell.

        Someone might get killed if you express yourself? I have news. The fault lies with the killer.

        I was amused by Sarah Palin's remark that the only politically acceptable slight to religion is trashing Christians.
        Well, in the first place, I used it because I don't have the time to write a fully lucid argument that I could present to the Supreme Court - and it expresses the point - that just because we are free to speak, we are not necessarily free to act on that speech. Peaceful and lucid expression is allowed and is called discourse - advocating, inciting, or causing physical violence is not allowed and has recourse.
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        • Profile picture of the author Kay King
          The thought police have arrived.
          I'm reminded of a Stephen King interview I saw long ago. His tales of weird death, fright and dismemberment took you to another world - a scary one sometimes.

          The interviewer asked King how a mind that could write such stories could also raise four children in a normal fashion. His reply was that when his children misbehaved he handled the situation calmly "but at the same time I am dismembering him in my mind". As long as your thoughts stay in your mind, no one can censor you.

          I remember being confused by the big fuss over prayer in school a few years ago. As you can pray without anyone knowing you're doing it - the argument was about the appearance rather than the substance.
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        • Originally Posted by Ken_Caudill View Post

          Advocating?

          Heaven help us.

          The thought police have arrived.
          funny - ya caught me...I was debating whether that was a good word, or not...:p

          Removed by order of:
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  • Profile picture of the author Patrician
    "FREEDOM IS NOT LICENSE"

    We are free here - that's awesome. We will die to stay free. Cool.

    But we have an obligation to use our HEADS, HEARTS ETC

    If people have to PUSH THE ENVELOPE

    and/or do not have anY EMPATHY.

    OR COMMON SENSE?

    Then you start to have to mitigate WHAT ARE CIVIL RIGHTS? WHAT IS HARASSMENT? WHAT IS RELIGIOUS PERSECUTION?

    WHAT IS I-N-C-I-T-I-N-G

    again WAVING A RED FLAG IN FRONT OF A MAD BULL - WTF WILL HAPPEN, YO?

    HE WILL ATTACK.

    BUT, SURE YOU CAN BE RIGHT.
    YOU CAN MAKE YOUR POINT.


    BUT AT WHAT COST?

    I liked Google's reaction to the conflict. Keep the movie rolling but block the countries that were offended.

    Done.
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    • Profile picture of the author Patrician
      HOWEVER - There is a long way to go to equating
      American Copyright Infringement (a crime)

      with 'INSULTING' SOMEBODY? GIVE ME A BREAK - APPLES AND ORANGES.

      Stealing is against the law and it should be.

      Insults are just TACKY AND PEOPLE SHOULD BE ABLE TO CONTROL THEMSELVES FROM BEING UGLY ESPECIALLY IF THEY ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR INCITING A RIOT AND GETTING PEOPLE KILLED'

      .. and I don't mean the people that made the video.

      -->>> but the ones who are exploiting it to push their agenda = HATE = WAR = YOU LOSE/I WIN

      Originally Posted by Patrician View Post

      "FREEDOM IS NOT LICENSE"

      We are free here - that's awesome. We will die to stay free. Cool.

      But we have an obligation to use our HEADS, HEARTS ETC

      If people have to PUSH THE ENVELOPE

      and/or do not have anY EMPATHY.

      OR COMMON SENSE?

      Then you start to have to mitigate WHAT ARE CIVIL RIGHTS? WHAT IS HARASSMENT? WHAT IS RELIGIOUS PERSECUTION?

      WHAT IS I-N-C-I-T-I-N-G

      again WAVING A RED FLAG IN FRONT OF A MAD BULL - WTF WILL HAPPEN, YO?

      HE WILL ATTACK.

      BUT, SURE YOU CAN BE RIGHT.
      YOU CAN MAKE YOUR POINT.

      BUT AT WHAT COST?

      I liked Google's reaction to the conflict. Keep the movie rolling but block the countries that were offended.

      Done.
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  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    Well, there certainly ARE about 8 or more I would hold responsible, but some are untouchable, and most are secret. But the one that is KNOWN and free!?!?!?!?!?!?!? OK, SUPPOSEDLY he is in jail, last I heard, but really free compared to what he should be.

    He is from EGYPT! He believes that citizenship is mere PAPERWORK! He has made it CLEAR that "ALL involved with the film are 'ACTIVE' US CITIZENS". Apparently all are AT BEST naturalized, belonging to cultures often MUSLIM, and are CLAIMED to be christians. Actually, all are apparently EGYPTIAN christians, AT BEST. He was BORN in EGYPT!

    He DUPED most of the players into creating that piece of garbage.

    And he wants the world to believe that he is JEWISH and/or christian, AMERICAN, and from ISRAEL! He said he KNEW there would be bloodshed, and WANTED IT!

    And he is a CONVICTED con artist that got out of jail relatively recently. He wrote that script IN PRISON!

    I will let you guess what I am pretty sure I know, but hanging is too good for him. If I were king, I would probably run him through an ordeal to get him to give up EVERYTHING, and have a rank amateur set him up for a hanging photographed to be sent to the muslims, saying he was hung only for this garbage and his complicity in the deaths, NOT just insults to islam! If we extradite him, we may find that he gets a hero's welcome. I doubt he was EVER christian!

    He is guilty of SO many things, it would make your head spin. For starters, he was a CONMAN!!!!!!!! One of the requirements of his parole is that he use NO aliases! They CLAIMED they were wondering if the alias he used for this film qualifies as a violation of parole! Let me help them.

    1. It was an ALIAS(********VIOLATION*********)

    Not enough?

    2. Used to hide his actions! (********VIOLATION*********)

    Not enough?

    3. Used to hurt/con others! (********VIOLATION*********)

    Not enough?

    4. Used to get three of the worlds largest religions at war! (********VIOLATION*********)

    Not enough?

    5. Used to evade the law! (********VIOLATION*********)

    Not enough?

    6. Played a part in inciting world war, property damage, and MURDER! (********VIOLATION*********)

    SERIOUSLY! If THIS is not a violation of parole for aliases, WHAT COULD BE?

    Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author Patrician
    Again Ken - you can express yourself in a free country.

    But you should use your common sense about some things.

    Bull in a China Shop kind of thing.

    And again - the fault is not with the people who made the video

    It is about the people on both sides that are INCITING this and MAGNIFYING it to be sure it causes violence.

    ... and I agree with Sarah's FACETIOUS REMARK - only cool people trash Christians. It is politically correct to persecute us for our beliefs - that makes you hip in some circles.

    So to me what was hip was to therefore become a Christian (I was one always but to be out front about it).

    SO MUCH HYPOCRICY AND SO LITTLE TIME.

    If that video was about Jesus I would become militant in my vehemence.

    HOWEVER:

    He says that we are not to show the least bit of resentment to tyranny and insults.

    ... but we are not perfect like He is.

    and that's okay with Him too.
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  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    You know, it is ironic. As bad and stupid as it was, those protesting are acting very much like the beginning of the film.

    I believe it was Stossel this evening that said if some college student presented that trailer as his work in a media class he would get an F!(The LOWEST American grade, whch means FAILURE!) SERIOUSLY, it is INCREDIBLY STUPID! Why is ANYONE giving it ANY attention?

    Even southpark has more substance and the cheap animation is a kind of contrivance. I think they actually use newer methods. But STILL, why does ANYONE care. Hindus don't, catholics don't, protestants don't, jewish don't, budhists don't, I'm sure satanists don't either! Only ONE religion seems to.

    BTW have you SEEN how they portray Satan? Some wimpy guy that isn't all that scary, that is homosexual and has a relationship with saddam. And GOD is portrayed as some sort of weird small monster type character.

    Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author Joseph Robinson
      Banned
      Originally Posted by seasoned View Post

      BTW have you SEEN how they portray Satan? Some wimpy guy that isn't all that scary, that is homosexual and has a relationship with saddam. And GOD is portrayed as some sort of weird small monster type character.

      Steve
      Some of the best characters/indvidual pieces of satire on TV.
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      • Profile picture of the author Kay King
        I do not in any way excuse the killers. I don't think their actions had anything to do with this movie.

        But anger toward the killers doesn't make me excuse people who would dub a film deliberately designed to create trouble.

        What would happen today to someone who shouted "gun" in a theater to see what people would do? Would we say he was exercising free speech and defend his rights? I don't think so.

        With the tensions in the world right now - blatantly mocking basic Islamic beliefs is the same thing on a bigger playing field.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jacqueline Smith
    I agree with Ken on this one.....Hell No!

    I can not even begin to imagine a world where we are held to the laws of every country.
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    • Profile picture of the author MissTerraK
      Originally Posted by Jacqueline Smith View Post

      I agree with Ken on this one.....Hell No!

      I can not even begin to imagine a world where we are held to the laws of every country.
      Agreed!

      And just who would police the whole world's laws?

      Only possible with one entity and that entity would be a one world government.

      Where have I heard that term before? :rolleyes:

      Terra
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  • Profile picture of the author Patrician
    Yep Terra - you see where this is going.

    PROVACATEURS

    to bring it on. (one world government)
    Guilty on both sides of this argument if it happens.
    Who has the biggest foot to put in the biggest mouth then?

    It is not always possible to resolve issues with WORDS or WISDOM - apparently.
    But we should pick our bad causes lest that is all we have time for.

    If I commit a crime in my country i will go to court here.
    If I commit a crime in somebody else's country I will go to court there.

    But the Internet there are no 'countries' - it is the information super highway.

    That is as far as COMMUNICATIONS - including free speech.

    If they have a problem with what we say -
    it is NO CRIME. If you don't like what I am saying BLOCK ME.
    If not, it is on THEM, to get over it.

    Again, stealing American copyrights from (sitting in) some other country even though you are not doing the crime IN our country - however you are doing it TO US (sitting) IN our country.

    period - do the crime pay the time

    big, big difference - how can they even make an analogy that is so bizarre.

    (copyright laws and MISCOMMUNICATIONS)

    YOU KNOW WHAT? How many of these old VIDEOS have you seen?
    Well I won't post if but you have probably seen them.

    The ones where they are BURNING THE AMERICAN FLAG?
    and FOAMING AT THE MOUTH whatever they are saying.

    Pretty INFURIATING and ACTUALLY as IT HAS COME TO PASS, TERRORIST.

    excuse me?

    COUNTERSUIT LOL
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    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      Brian -

      Do we have an extradition treaty with Egypt?

      I don't think the full story is out yet on this video. The actors say what was shown was not what they had as a script. It was dubbed into Arabic for a reason and I think the reason was to make trouble. It definitely succeeded.

      Free speech is precious but hiding behind free speech when the goal is to cause trouble or to insult another culture or religion or person...is nothing to admire or defend.

      If we allow people to interpret free speech as "the right to do and say anything i want no matter who it hurts or puts in danger", I think we damage the true meaning of free speech. You can argue full rights all day - but you can't shout "fire" in a crowded theater without consequences.

      I expect in Egypt and other counties it's much like it is here - many who are screaming about the video haven't even seen it.
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  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    Kay,

    Did you see what wrote? The actors said they were lulled by people that say they were conned by the guy. The films central character was "master george". Someone else dubbed that over with mohammud. Of course, who sentences were changed as well.

    Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      Yes, I've been following the story. The actors didn't seem to know what was being done. Am I missing something?

      To my mind, the people responsible for the problem are the ones who changed the words, dubbed it in Arabic and released it that way. When I say "problem" I'm referring to the film.

      I don't think this film is the real reason for the demonstrations - don't think it had anything to do with the Libyan attack that killed people.
      I think it was a catalyst that served a purpose and gave people something to rise up against.

      The only thing that spreads faster than fear is anger.

      To the mind of someone outraged at the film and not knowing the background story (or not believing it - and why would they?) everyone associated is "guilty".

      There may have been something new revealed today that I'm not aware of as I haven't been following news today.
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      • Profile picture of the author Kay King
        And just who would police the whole world's laws?

        Only possible with one entity and that entity would be a one world government.
        I can imagine a time when there will be an international (one world) court devoted to internet activity.

        It may not be in our lifetime and may be a gradual series of agreements and treaties or may be a result of internet law breaking that reaches epidemic proportions or has catastrophic results.
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    Frankly - I think that the only response to them is that they need to get a grip on their murdering fanatics. How the hell do they get off demanding respect for a group of thugs - and no I'm not calling all Muslims thugs. I am calling the radical element that's been slaughtering people with abandon since I was old enough to remember. The Egyptian gov can just have their nose broken until they control of their terrorists. Then they earn the right to ask for respect.
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  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    I got an email last week that listed murders, and extreme violence, over DECADES, and it claimed that ALL the culprits belonged to the SAME group. This was about TEN events starting with the murder of a US president and ending with the latest garbage. In most of the cases, I KNOW they are right. It is common knowledge. I'm going to have to check the other few. But WOW!

    Their really has to be a limit. OK, speech can make people mad, etc... WE GET IT! HEY, I have been mad, and others can attest here that I made them mad. But we don't go blowing people up. If we let ONE group win in this way it demeans all other groups that were offended, and all the people that fought for rights.

    OK, I'll go to another movie. There was a star trek episode where a guy channeled the anger of the kids. Yeah, a LOT of kids have been angry at their parents. Anyway, THOSE kids killed ALL their parents! They were all alone, except for the malevolent force. The enterprise heard about the kids, but NOT about what happened, and saved them. They then kept killing the people on the enterprise. Eventually, of course, all that was stopped, but the instigator was dong this for his own ends and cared about nobody. He lived off the kids anger, etc....

    The heads of the people destroying the embassies are VERY similar! Do you just want to live ALONE? I mean if you live with someone, sooner or later you are likely to be offended.

    Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      How the hell do they get off demanding respect for a group of thugs
      I think this is going off track. They are demanding respect for their religion.

      If you attack the thug mentality, you will have moderate Muslims staying out of the fray. But when you insult the religious beliefs, it suits the purposes of terrorists as even moderate Muslims will take offense and that escalates the conflict.

      It's not a violent religion but there are violent fringe elements. I see people claiming Christianity is not violent - yet Chrisitianity has a long history of violence.

      Ridiculing a religion like Islam is taken as a personal insult. The one thing missing from the religion is humor. I've know Muslims who have a great sense of humor and fun - but all of them are serious when it comes to their religion.

      What has always struck me odd is the antagonism between those in Islam and those of Jewish descent. Both of those religions (not the people but the faith itself) have similar traits of lifestyle and food rules with strict rules for holy days, etc. Yet neither has respect for the other.

      Terry Jones is no more a Christian to me than a terrorist is a true follower of Islam. They are both fringe elements using religion to justify destructive activities.
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      • Profile picture of the author HeySal
        Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

        I think this is going off track. They are demanding respect for their religion.

        If you attack the thug mentality, you will have moderate Muslims staying out of the fray. But when you insult the religious beliefs, it suits the purposes of terrorists as even moderate Muslims will take offense and that escalates the conflict.

        It's not a violent religion but there are violent fringe elements. I see people claiming Christianity is not violent - yet Chrisitianity has a long history of violence.

        Ridiculing a religion like Islam is taken as a personal insult. The one thing missing from the religion is humor. I've know Muslims who have a great sense of humor and fun - but all of them are serious when it comes to their religion.

        What has always struck me odd is the antagonism between those in Islam and those of Jewish descent. Both of those religions (not the people but the faith itself) have similar traits of lifestyle and food rules with strict rules for holy days, etc. Yet neither has respect for the other.

        Terry Jones is no more a Christian to me than a terrorist is a true follower of Islam. They are both fringe elements using religion to justify destructive activities.
        Yeah - my post was an emotional response rather than a logic based answer.

        Actually - I understand what Brian is getting at here. We are demanding the whole world obey the US laws and if they don't - we're on them like flies. Deadly flies. So how do we keep our own sovereignty when we break the laws of another country? Only by being powerful enough to bully. That's basically what we have become thanks to the greed of the criminals now installed in our gov offices.

        When they went after Assaunge for "treason" I couldn't figure out where the hell they got off. Julian was not on our soil - not a citizen. How do you charge someone with treason who has never been a citizen? But - oh this is AMERICA he attacked right? No. He just revealed the corruption of some officials here. Those that weren't bull-horning about "tinfoil" for the last 10 years already KNEW most of what came out. Nothing he revealed was ever "Top secret". His guilt was to expose and embarrass criminals. Period. And I'm sorry if someone doesn't like me referring to our leaders as criminals -- - I believe they are no better than citizens as far as law should be concerned -- you break laws willfully, laws that get other people killed or harmed - you are a freaking criminal.

        Okay - so now another country is pulling the same crap. Send us the US citizen who did this so we can prosecute them under Sharia (I believe it's Sharia, maybe not) law. Of course, there is outrage - but there is also actually fairness in the request considering how our own leaders are now acting as if they run the world.

        On the other hand you have someone who made a statement about a philosophy they find completely vulgar and disgusting. It happens to be a religious philosophy - so you prosecute someone for being revolted by that philosophy and you have another very strong religious faction that might take violent exception to that. Voila - religious war. You also have a sovereign people that might just decide to start a civil war because they take offense to their sovereignty being destroyed.

        You do not prosecute and - voila - religious war because the fanatics of that philosophy that feel violated happen to be violent people.

        Now - you also have people who are drinking the kool-aid and saying that free speech doesn't mean you can say anything you want. Um....well, yes........actually it does. Free speech allows someone to be as crude, insensitive, and stupid as they want to be. It always has. We just used to ignore, stay away from, or laugh at people who ran their mouths enough to reveal exactly how repulsive their stunted thinking was.

        So now you have a new problem -- do you put restrictions on free speech and risk governments just continuing to take more and more of the right as they please.........and you know that once the legislation is there, the progression is easy attainment for them.

        Now this whole matter is a large matter that shows why globalization is not going to work. You can not have free countries and dictatorships under the same governships. It won't work. To be able to govern globally, you have to have the same rules for everyone and sovereign people are not going to be okay with that. That's why we formed different countries in the first place. Working together in peace is a lot different issue that being governed the same.

        The US has been overstepping its authority for a long time now. Now Egypt is overstepping its.
        Prosecution of American citizens under laws of another country is treasonous action.

        What needs to be done? Respect national sovereignty - EVERY country. If Egypt doesn't like some of our people's views on their primary philosophies - don't deal with us, don't take money from us. If we don't like someone else's - leave them alone. Don't deal with them, don't send them money and try to buy false allegiance.

        Stop the globalization game. If we continue to play the globalization game they will have to squelch every public expression of religion. We have religious philosophies that will NEVER cease to clash and you can't make laws that won't conflict with one or another of those philosophies. And you can't FORCE respect for any of them. Those philosophies run too deep to be able to litigate fairly.
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        Sal
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        • Profile picture of the author ThomM
          I haven't been paying much attention to this so if I'm wrong on my take of it, oh well.
          But they're pissed because someone made a film that is supposedly anti-islamic or showed Mohammad or some such nonsense and they want us to turn over the ones who made it to stand trial. Am I close?
          Anyways haven't Islamic extremest made films of them torturing and beheading captured Americans? Did they turn those people over to us?
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          • Profile picture of the author Kay King
            When they went after Assaunge for "treason" I couldn't figure out where the hell they got off.
            Sal - that didn't happen.

            It's another example we've seen here lately of the "they did this or that" - and there is no fact to back it up. There are no charges against him in the US but the law did want to talk to him about Manning.

            The film is a smokescreen being used by extremists to excite the more moderate Muslims. Google has refused to remove the film - hey, look at all the hits it's getting.

            I don't think there's kool-aid involved:p nor do I think this is a freedom of speech issue. It's a bad, hateful, dubbed film trailer that's been turned into propaganda against us. Sad story all around.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mark Singletary
    A non religious question:

    If a few members of American based, not fully understood religions (think Jehovah Witnesses or Scientologists), started killing people because the media or others said vile and nasty things about their religion, history, or leaders, would the government ban or prosecute that speech?

    If not then we shouldn't bow to other people's idea of freedom.

    If so - boy are we in trouble.

    Mark
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    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      I agree, Mark. The "faith" is an excuse but when has any religion been so demonized?

      What I'm saying is this demonization and ridiculing plays into the terrorist's hands because it offends all members of the religion.

      It's unnecessary, it's hateful and it never has a positive result. I'm not saying free speech should be limited but I believe thinking people who see the damage being done will not defend this form of hate speech.

      I just watched that trailer and the beginning is enough to disgust any Muslim - it is such a poorly done video but it hits several buttons in a deliberate way. There is no redeeming property to it and the agenda is clear - to insult, to antagonize, to ridicule.
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      • Profile picture of the author Mark Singletary
        The thing is, though, we do that to JW, Scientologists, Mormons, and every one else. The difference is that those people do not kill because someone said something that offended them.

        It's not the speech, then, that's wrong or let's clean it up for everyone everywhere. It's the reaction to the speech.

        So while we are trying to get people to be more considerate (but please let's don't forget our own religions that are persecuted) we need to attack or fix (or whatever the PC word of the day is) the reaction.

        Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

        I agree, Mark. The "faith" is an excuse but when has any religion been so demonized?

        What I'm saying is this demonization and ridiculing plays into the terrorist's hands because it offends all members of the religion.

        It's unnecessary, it's hateful and it never has a positive result. I'm not saying free speech should be limited but I believe thinking people who see the damage being done will not defend this form of hate speech.

        I just watched that trailer and the beginning is enough to disgust any Muslim - it is such a poorly done video but it hits several buttons in a deliberate way. There is no redeeming property to it and the agenda is clear - to insult, to antagonize, to ridicule.
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      • Profile picture of the author seasoned
        Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

        I agree, Mark. The "faith" is an excuse but when has any religion been so demonized?
        You're KIDDING, RIGHT? Christianity, Catholicism, and Judiasm ALL have!!!!!!

        What I'm saying is this demonization and ridiculing plays into the terrorist's hands because it offends all members of the religion.

        There is no redeeming property to it and the agenda is clear - to insult, to antagonize, to ridicule.
        AGAIN, it HAS been, and IS, done with those other three.

        Steve
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      • Profile picture of the author JustVisiting
        Originally Posted by Kay King View Post


        I just watched that trailer and the beginning is enough to disgust any Muslim - it is such a poorly done video but it hits several buttons in a deliberate way. There is no redeeming property to it and the agenda is clear - to insult, to antagonize, to ridicule.
        And?... So why are they all watching it? They can't control how people think although I think they would very much like to. What was that saying?...
        "Sticks and stones may break my bones but words will never hurt me".

        Apparently they can.
        Signature
        "...If at first you don't succeed; call it Version 1.0"
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  • And,...to roll back around to kindsvater's initial question, the answer would be "no".
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  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    BTW we should NOT extradite the jerks that did this. Give them the WORST the US has dished out in the recent century, and vidotape it for the islamic people. MAYBE, after the embalming, at least the key player, send them the entrails. That should satisfy them, unless they wanted to give HIM a hero's welcome, like the lokerbie bombing guy.

    Just make it clear that the guy was born there, acted like them, was a conman, and endangered the US and its allies, and THAT is why we did it, NOT because they caused all this mayhem.

    Maybe they will get some new respect and fear for the US.

    Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author seasoned
    BTW have you heard? A cartoonist in FRANCE just published a magazine with nude cartoons of mohammud! The french closed their embassies.

    Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author KimW
      Originally Posted by seasoned View Post

      BTW have you heard? A cartoonist in FRANCE just published a magazine with nude cartoons of mohammud! The french closed their embassies.

      Steve
      and school...and...etc etc...
      I saw that in the news.
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  • Profile picture of the author Patrician
    yEP! gLOBALIZATION iS tHE cAUSE oF sO mANY oF oUR wORST pROBLEMS iN tHIS cOUNTRY.

    ... and it just keeps getting worse and worse

    globalization will lead to one world government (evil satan)

    where there is only one point of view (his)
    one religion, one army, one political party.

    Right now it just looks like well we can't forbid your religion, therefore not mine.
    and you can't shove it down our throat (force us to believe) and neither can we.

    Sounds democratic right? nah. it's just aRMEGEDON -
    just the plain old war between good and evil

    Over and over in perpetuity.
    We will get there someday.

    Where negativity will just spin off into the cosmos,
    leaving the perfect virgin earth
    and she alone will survive in peace.

    (or pieces if it keeps going the way it is now!)
    Signature
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  • Not strictly related...but amusing...maybe the ladies are getting a little tired of it -
    Iranian Woman Beats the Crap Out of Cleric for Telling Her to Cover Up

    Hope this bodes well for her...
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