SHAME! Torturing pigs and calling it research

15 years ago

In the article:

"I think the relevance of this is highly questionable. People are not pigs."

I think this is a highly questionable statement...

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Michael Motley

15 years ago

I think that if strapping body armor on pigs and blowing them up helps to find new ways to keep our soldiers safe, then i have no problem with the free bacon

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themindvoid

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Motley

I think that if strapping body armor on pigs and blowing them up helps to find new ways to keep our soldiers safe, then i have no problem with the free bacon

same here, if your gunna be so sensitive how many pigs get killed daily, just to end up spoiling in somebodys fridge or the supermarket. if we can save 1 human life with 10 pigs, it was worth it.

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RebeccaL

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Motley

I think that if strapping body armor on pigs and blowing them up helps to find new ways to keep our soldiers safe, then i have no problem with the free bacon

What a lovely person you are Michael.

Why is a human life more important than that of another living being?
Did you know that pigs are highly intelligent animals?
Even if they weren't intelligent, they FEEL just like we do.

This is despicable but not surprising as the US military has been abusing animals in 'research' for decades.

If people knew just 0.001% of the animal abuse that takes place in this world on a daily basis, you'd be sick. Unless your Michael Motley or any of his supporters of course.

Earthlings the DVD is a MUST WATCH if you want to find out just heavily humans rely on and abuse animals for our own existence. Truly eye opening and sickening.

Anyone who supports the lab or field testing of animals for ANY purpose needs their head read.
It just proves how self centred the majority of the human race is when so many people can not show respect for others who share this planet - living things without a voice.

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Star69

15 years ago

Michael, I know you're just kidding around, but there won't be any free bacon. It'll be hauled to the dump.

What really pisses me off about this is that they won't euthanize the injured pigs, instead choosing to 'study' them, and these animals suffer horribly for days!

You want to keep our soldiers safe? BRING THEM HOME WHERE THEY BELONG!

In this day and age with the technology we now have, there should be no need to put our soldiers in harms way. Instead, they choose to torture animals (pigs, by the way, are more intelligent than dogs) to help protect people who shouldn't be put at risk in the first place!

If they used dogs or horses, imagine the outcry then!

I remember back when the auto industry got caught using human cadavers for auto safety testing. People protested. Guess that hit a bit too close to home even though the people were already dead!

These pigs are alive and feel pain the same as we do.

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Michael Motley

15 years ago

Because in this country, dogs and horses arent food, or human cadavers. A pig is not a pet, it has one purpose, that is to be food. I dont care if it feels pain. I didnt care this morning when i ate sausage for breakfast, i wont care tomorrow when i have a ham sandwich.

And yes, we have to put our soldiers in harms way. There is no way that we can win a war without infantry on the ground unless we plan on bombing the entire country flat.

Now which would you be more livid about....dead pigs, or dead iraqi civillians.

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Star69

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Motley

Because in this country, dogs and horses arent food, or human cadavers. A pig is not a pet, it has one purpose, that is to be food. I dont care if it feels pain. I didnt care this morning when i ate sausage for breakfast, i wont care tomorrow when i have a ham sandwich.

And yes, we have to put our soldiers in harms way. There is no way that we can win a war without infantry on the ground unless we plan on bombing the entire country flat.

Now which would you be more livid about....dead pigs, or dead iraqi civillians.

Well, to answer your question, Michael, I am equally livid about BOTH. Innocent Iraqis have died for no other reason than they happened to be in the way. Innocent Iraqi's have been maimed and permanently injured simply because that's where they lived. They were treated no better than animals, given no better concern. DON'T EVEN GET ME STARTED. THIS G*D D***ED WAR WAS NOT NECESSARY, AND NOBODY EVER WINS.

You don't care if an animal feels pain? You're a real piece of work. Yes, we turn them into food, but that does not mean we must cause them horrendous agony for days on end! The bacon and sausage you ate was not tortured.

These animals were tortured, and for what, research?

Here's an idea. Why don't you volunteer? They could gain valuable research by conducting these tests on live humans instead of pigs, which are no where near the shape of humans.

Oh, sorry, that would mean you would feel pain, wouldn't it? Suddenly you care?

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Michael Motley

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Star69

Well, to answer your question, Michael, I am equally livid about BOTH. Innocent Iraqis have died for no other reason than they happened to be in the way. Innocent Iraqi's have been maimed and permanently injured simply because that's where they lived. They were treated no better than animals, given no better concern. DON'T EVEN GET ME STARTED. THIS G*D D***ED WAR WAS NOT NECESSARY, AND NOBODY EVER WINS.

You don't care if an animal feels pain? You're a real piece of work. Yes, we turn them into food, but that does not mean we must cause them horrendous agony for days on end! The bacon and sausage you ate was not tortured.

These animals were tortured, and for what, research?

Here's an idea. Why don't you volunteer? They could gain valuable research by conducting these tests on live humans instead of pigs, which are no where near the shape of humans.

Oh, sorry, that would mean you would feel pain, wouldn't it? Suddenly you care?

the sausage i ate wasnt tortured? I grew up on a farm. Spend your life in a 8x8 pen, knee deep in your own crap, eating your food from it, get shot, throat cut, skinned, then drawn and quartered, see if that feels like torture to you. That is the life of a domesticated farm animal. Its not a pet, its not a cute pig that talks to spiders..its a hog. It has one purpose and one purpose only. Food.

And as far as the pigs in question being used as bomb dummies. Sorry, but a soldier's life is WAY more important than any pig (hint: thats why we test on pigs, not humans). If this research keeps the soldiers safe, i couldnt possibly care less than i already do about the way the pig dies to ensure that safety.

We do the same thing with chickens as well. One of the displays i witness in the army was the implentation of a APDS round. (armor piercing, discarding sabot). Its a tank/artillery round that shoots a dart about 3 inches in diameter and about 2 feet long. In front of that dart is a depleted uranium ball that burns through armor, then the dart comes through and usually goes out the other side. They lined up 3 tanks side by side and put a chicken in the center tank. They fired this round through the side of the tanks, the dart went through and actually pulled that chicken out of the tank it was in, through the exit hole. The dart only made a hole the size of its diameter...3 inches.

I dont believe in animal cruelty, but I also dont think animals should be afforded 'rights' or that they are even close to being of the same importance as a human.

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RebeccaL

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Motley

I dont believe in animal cruelty, but I also dont think animals should be afforded 'rights' or that they are even close to being of the same importance as a human.

I've never come across such an attitude in my life.
How sickening.

Michael you do not deserve a place on this earth.

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HeySal

15 years ago

Humans are a cruel species - we would do well to kill anyone with this kind of mentality - because people who will do this to another life form will also do it to another human.......and do. Look at how some treat their spouses and children........and don't forget that the EPA was involved with spraying babies with toxic chemicals in Florida to see what it would do to them - mothers who participated got 1,000 USD and a tee-shirt. The guy who headed that up had to stop so he could be put in charge of the FDA - they couldn't approve him because of public outrage at the experiments.
What do you think of the forced drugging of children that is going on now, too? If a kid is a foster kid, orphan, or even if the parents are on welfare with no means to fight, schools are allowed to put the kids on phsycoreactive drugs -- for reasons that are not much more than experimentation and money for the drug companies....many of the drugs are known to be dangerous.

Apparently, if we can't just gun them down or jail them to get them out of society all we can hope for is that they have a brutal afterlife - or get sent back to be the subject of the same brutality.

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Loren Woirhaye

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Michael Motley

Animals are not people. Animals are animals. We didnt get to the top of the food chain because we gave them rights.

And people who cry about using animals for testing, are also usually the ones wearing leather jackets, knee high leather booths, leather tennis shoes and having a cheeseburger for lunch. People dont want to know where their food and goods come from, whether it be an animal or slave labor, but they sure dont mind using it because not being able to see pigs getting blown up or kids working 20 hours a day for a bowl of rice is ok if you cant see it and they dont have to actually be inconvienced to do their own work

That's really a very silly generalization Michael. Cartoonish.

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Star69

15 years ago

Michael, you're really starting to tick me off, in case you haven't figured that out yet.

I was also raised on a farm. Don't think you were the only one. I have PERSONALLY shot hogs, gutted them and skinned them out so don't even think about lecturing me about what torture is. The hogs were dead in SECONDS after I shot them. If I had to shoot them several times, I did so, long as they were dropped and died ASAP. I know full well they don't live a Charlotte's Web existence, but they didn't live for DAYS with blunt force trauma to their bodies and brains. I killed them in the quickest, most humane manner available. I didn't torture them.

I've also worked in slaughterhouses and I know exactly what goes on on the kill line. I know exactly where my meat comes from, so don't think you're talking to a schoolboy.

My main point is this is completely unnecessary testing. This is an outrage! All of this can be done with computer programs except the f***ing government doesn't want to spend the money. Torturing animals is more cost-effective.

I don't have to be there to know that after they explode the bombs they not only have parts of dead pigs, they also have pigs that are still alive, bleeding to death, squirming in severe pain and screaming as loud as they can. To walk up to them and simply observe without offering any type of aid, yes EVEN TO AN ANIMAL, is inhumane. (It's inhumane that they even considered doing this type of testing!) As the article said these animals live 24-48 hours afterwards. To be forced to live that long with such injuries and without any form of pain relief would be to wish for death to come.

As I have already said, you want to keep our soldiers safe? BRING 'EM HOME WHERE THEY BELONG! We don't need this kind of testing, especially when it can be done on computer programs!

For someone who says he doesn't believe in animal cruelty, you sure have a f***ed up way of showing it. I pity any pets you might own.

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Tina Golden

15 years ago

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RebeccaL

15 years ago

Originally Posted by TMG Enterprises

You are equating this research with only the war in Iraq. If they can discover new ways of preventing or treating brain injury, this research will have a much further reach.

I don't believe in torturing any creature purely for "fun" but when it comes to research for medical advancement, they have to test something that reasonably equates to the bulk of a human being.

It sucks for the pigs, definitely. But I have to agree with Michael - human life is more important to me.

Tina G

People are generally ignorant of the reality of life on earth. Of the reality of the absolute inexcusable torture that is forced on animals on a daily basis. All because some humans think that we are the supreme species. LOL!

I would not expect Michael to have even an inkling of an idea of the evolutionary history of this earth and how short a time humans have been here. Heck he probably doesn't even believe in evolution.

We all know that Michael is simply thieving oxygen from the planet, but thankfully the majority are not so uneducated. By the way, people who abuse or support the abuse of animals are almost certain to have a violent nature and turn out to be potential human murderers. I feel truly sorry for anyone who crosses paths with Michael Motley.

I could rattle off hundreds of links here, here is one for Tina and others who have no problem with animal testing
StopAnimalTests.com > Animal Testing 101

And a link to the documentary that every human being should watch:
http://earthlings.com/

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Tina Golden 15 years ago

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- YiKeS 15 years ago
  
  Carrots have feelings to yanno
  
  STOP CARROT MURDERS TODAY!!!
  
  ... :rolleyes:
  
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  KimW 15 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by YiKeS
  
  Carrots have feelings to yanno
  
  STOP CARROT MURDERS TODAY!!!
  
  ... :rolleyes:
  
  YiKeS
  
  They cut off my EARS of corn!
  
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Star69

15 years ago

In my opinion, this doesn't fall far from "torturing for fun". It is unneccesary.

If you are all so concerned about saving our soldiers, you should've been a lot more vocal when our soldiers were actually adding their own armor to humvees because their superiors in the Pentagon refused to buy the MRAPS they so desperately needed.

Remember when American families were shipping armor plates to our soldiers in Iraq so they could armor their humvees? WTF?!

This pig testing 'to protect our soldiers' is bullshit.

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Tina Golden 15 years ago

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- Star69 15 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by TMG Enterprises
  
  How do you know whether or not we were "a lot more vocal" about that?
  
  We all have differing opinions on this research, that's all.
  
  Tina G
  
  Please, let's not try to kid ourselves here. :rolleyes:
  
  Animals were put on this planet as food for mankind but mankind was also intended to be the caretaker over these animals and that means to take care of them.
  
  I doubt that animal/medical research was what was originally intended. When man tries to play god, we all suffer for it.
  
  I've long held that humans are the worst disease on this planet, and yes, I say that with the full knowledge that I am within that group. No other mammal on this planet wars against each other like humans, employs other species to battle for them, or abuses other species like we do. There is no good reason for our doing this, yet we have done so in the past, do so now and will do so in the future.
  
  I don't hold animals out as equals to humans but just because they might be a lesser to us does not mean we have a right to cause them pain and injury for little or no good reason. (When is there ever a good reason to cause pain and suffering?)
  
  Some humans have a sense of compassion and are more kind to other species than some other humans. And it is that compassion within me that fuels the anger that will give me the strength to beat you bloody if I ever see you abusing an animal. And I don't care what your name is or how big you might think you are.
  
  That's where I stand. You can agree or disagree, it matters not to me.
  
  I've said my piece and now I am going to leave this thread before we begin to become uncivilized toward each other.
  
  I wish you all well.
  
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RebeccaL

15 years ago

Sorry Tina but Michael clearly stated that he does not believe in animal abuse. It doesn't get any clearer than that - he does not care if/when animals feel extreme pain.
That is a clear sadistic attitude and one that thankfully is only carried by a few specimans in the human population. It's just a shame that people like him can continue polluting the gene pool.

Tina, yes I think if people want medicine then they can test it on themself. Every animal born into this world has instincts and needs. No living thing wants to live a life of misery and pain, and certainly not for the benefit of another species.

Animal testing is outdated and its only a matter of time until it comes to an end altogether.

Sorry Tina but bacteria do not have a brain or feelings so your argument there is rather redundant.

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Tina Golden

15 years ago

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RebeccaL

15 years ago

Originally Posted by TMG Enterprises

This is the line that I was responding to, rather facetiously I suppose.

This is one of those highly controversial subjects that sparks very strong feelings as is evident in this thread. Perhaps it's one of the topics that I should avoid...lol.

For the record, we may disagree on the research issue but I do not in any way, shape or form advocate animal abuse and don't wish to get into arguments with anyone over it.

Tina G

Tina I'm certainly not putting you in the same category as another person in this thread - who is now the first member ever put on my ignore list

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Michael Motley

15 years ago

Originally Posted by RebeccaL

Sorry Tina but Michael clearly stated that he does not believe in animal abuse. It doesn't get any clearer than that - he does not care if/when animals feel extreme pain.
That is a clear sadistic attitude and one that thankfully is only carried by a few specimans in the human population. It's just a shame that people like him can continue polluting the gene pool.

You misunderstand me in your righteous indignation. I stated that i do not believe in animal abuse. To me animal abuse is inflicting pain just for the sake of amusement. That to me is wrong and there is no justifcation for that at all. But something like the case of these pigs, there is a reason for that pain inflicted, to help save lives of soldiers. And I will ALWAYS place a human life above an animal, no matter how smart people may think it is.

But thank you so much for going off half cocked and putting an infraction on me because of what you percieved was being said.

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Michael Motley

15 years ago

Originally Posted by RebeccaL

Sorry Tina but Michael clearly stated that he does not believe in animal abuse. It doesn't get any clearer than that - he does not care if/when animals feel extreme pain.
That is a clear sadistic attitude and one that thankfully is only carried by a few specimans in the human population. It's just a shame that people like him can continue polluting the gene pool.

Tina, yes I think if people want medicine then they can test it on themself. Every animal born into this world has instincts and needs. No living thing wants to live a life of misery and pain, and certainly not for the benefit of another species.

Animal testing is outdated and its only a matter of time until it comes to an end altogether.

Sorry Tina but bacteria do not have a brain or feelings so your argument there is rather redundant.

and how do you know they dont have feelings? they could be crying their little bacteria...err...eyes? out everytime you pick up the bleach

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RebeccaL

15 years ago

Hi Yikes
That is a typical comment given to vegetarians by meat-eaters. Just makes you end up looking stupid though.

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YiKeS 15 years ago

Originally Posted by RebeccaL

Hi Yikes

That is a typical comment given to vegetarians by meat-eaters.
Just makes you end up looking stupid though.

G`day Rebecca,

Maybe it`s a reference to the utter
stupidity of the whole damn thread .. :rolleyes:

Yours is a typical response .. I eat meat, you don`t
... I also eat vegetables as do you ... I don`t have a
problem with that ... you do.

So who is the stupid one?

Man is a meateater ... get over it.

You single out the bacteria reference yet you ignore
the mouse/spider one ... typical :rolleyes: ... you kill cockroaches?
What about ants that get into your house? Mossies? Flies?
Ticks? Fleas? List goes on and on ...

... of course you wouldn`t admit to killing those here would you ...

Anyway ... gotta go cook me up some pig
coz this thread has made me hungry ...

I`ll be back if I find any shrapnel k ...

YiKeS
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RebeccaL

15 years ago

Animals were not "put on this planet" as food for humans - I thought you were brighter than that Star!
Animals have been here for hundreds of millions of years, modern humans evolved a relative fraction of a second ago. Animals are here to be animals, not to provide for humans!

I've long held that humans are the worst disease on this planet

You only have to look at the utter destruction of the planet and our rapid overpopulation to know that's the truth.

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derekwong28

15 years ago

Much much worser things have been done for the sake of "scientific or military" research. Below is one of the sickest videos I have have seen.

Warning: don't watch it if you are squeamish, it could ruin your whole day.