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Unread 29th January 2013, 10:19 AM   #1
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Lightbulb Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud


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Unread 29th January 2013, 10:25 AM   #2
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

Where did the Koch brothers find 30,000 scientists?

Oh, and sue him for this internet thingy too...it's kerflooey.
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Unread 29th January 2013, 10:25 AM   #3
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

That's at the top of the stupid pile for me.


....it's also rehashed from the same announcement in 2008...which was labeled a "myth"


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Unread 29th January 2013, 11:48 AM   #4
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Originally Posted by MoneyMagnetMagnate View Post
Where did the Koch brothers find 30,000 scientists?

Oh, and sue him for this internet thingy too...it's kerflooey.
It's Art Robinson, not the Koch Bros. Art is the same scientist that believes the radiation from nuclear plants is "good" for us. There's also lots of controversy about many of his 30,000 signitures on the pettition.

Check him out for yourself. This is the lead scientist debunking global warming:


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Unread 29th January 2013, 12:23 PM   #5
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

Just for starters...
Quote:
Robinson opposes abortion and supports gun rights,[1] cutting taxes, increasing border security and building new power plants.[1] He argues for balancing the federal budget, defunding earmarks and ending special-interest influence in Washington.[1] He also supports restoring sound money and ending the Federal Reserve System. Robinson is against bailouts to Wall Street banks. He also supports a strong national defense, but with a more restrained foreign policy.[21] Robinson is a signatory to A Scientific Dissent from Darwinism, a petition circulated by the Discovery Institute to promote intelligent design.
Though he is quite credentialed, I would have to see his supportive data...
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Unread 29th January 2013, 12:37 PM   #6
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Originally Posted by MoneyMagnetMagnate View Post
Just for starters...

Though he is quite credentialed, I would have to see his supportive data...
Watch the video. Let him speak for himself.

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Unread 29th January 2013, 01:20 PM   #7
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Originally Posted by Kurt View Post
Watch the video. Let him speak for himself.
I thought he spoke for himself fairly well. He definitely knows the bogus overused tactics of Rachel Maddow. She constantly uses out of context quotes, which lead to faulty analogy. And those logically challenged fall for it every time.

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Unread 29th January 2013, 01:37 PM   #8
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Watch the video. Let him speak for himself.
After watching the video, the argument got nowhere...he spoke, but wasn't allowed to speak - when I called him 'credentialed', I was referring to his degrees, and if/what he may scientifically offer in rebuttal to global warming claims. I found it amusing, that he opened and sidestepped the issue of campaign funding, and according to this story, he ended up spending 400K more than DeFazio, and lost for a second time. http://www.nrtoday.com/news/3111681-...county-percent

I'll have to see the what/why of these 30k scientists to see if there is any weight to their argument. (are they blaming it on cow farts? or what?)

As a citizen of Colorado, I'm sure you are aware of terms 'survivalist', 'doomsday', and links to Armageddon, from some folks who may have a fundamental way of looking at things, - Douglas County Oregon is a bastion for those types of ideas.

My remark about the Koch's may have been flippant in this particular case, but I'm sure you as someone who has great interest in alternative energies is aware of the big checks they have written to combat the ideas of a global warming.

As for John Coleman, he may have been a co-founder of 'The Weather Channel', but I cannot find anything that says he is even a Meteorologist - and as far as 'weatherman' gigs go, San Diego has to be one of the best ones going.. "today, sunny - tomorrow, sunny - next week...probably sunny...
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Unread 29th January 2013, 01:58 PM   #9
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

This 30k figure is utterly bogus, irrespective of whatever stance one holds on global warming. Spreading such a lie really has an erosive effect on the credibility of whatever argument one presents.

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Unread 29th January 2013, 02:18 PM   #10
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Originally Posted by thunderbird View Post
This 30k figure is utterly bogus, irrespective of whatever stance one holds on global warming. Spreading such a lie really has an erosive effect on the credibility of whatever argument one presents.

Spreading lies for some is not really erosive to their credibility... it's more like an "inconvenience"...

Al Gore's 'nine Inconvenient Untruths' - Telegraph

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Unread 29th January 2013, 02:22 PM   #11
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

In lieu of hard scientific data...

Have not the summers felt hotter?
The winters seem shorter?
Arent the northern ice caps melting?
Sea levels rising?
Glaciers melting at a record pace?
Carbon emissions at an all time high?
Hurricanes/Typhoons/ Super storms occuring at greater strength and frequency?
Or are y'all living on a different planet?

Yes, Al "me want banana" Gore is NOT the sharpest knife in the drawer
And his facts tend to be skewed, however, not acknowledging that there is even a minute amount of "Truth" to his claims is living in denial
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Unread 29th January 2013, 02:24 PM   #12
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Originally Posted by garyv View Post
Spreading lies for some is not really erosive to their credibility... it's more like an "inconvenience"...
Whichever side one is on, spreading lies harms one's own side. I'll qualify that -- guess sometimes it works if no one is called out on the lie.

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Unread 29th January 2013, 02:25 PM   #13
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Originally Posted by Big Rob View Post
In lieu of hard scientific data...

Have not the summers felt hotter?
The winters seem shorter?
Arent the northern ice caps melting?
Sea levels rising?
Glaciers melting at a record pace?
Carbon emissions at an all time high?
Hurricanes/Typhoons/ Super storms occuring at greater strength and frequency?
Or are y'all living on a different planet?

Yes, Al "me want banana" Gore is NOT the sharpest knife in the drawer
And his facts tend to be skewed, however, not acknowledging that there is even a minute amount of "Truth" to his claims is living in denial
Oh, poo-poo and pish-tosh :p :rolleyes:
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Unread 29th January 2013, 02:35 PM   #14
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Originally Posted by Big Rob View Post
In lieu of hard scientific data...

Have not the summers felt hotter?
The winters seem shorter?
Arent the northern ice caps melting?
Sea levels rising?
Glaciers melting at a record pace?
Carbon emissions at an all time high?
Hurricanes/Typhoons/ Super storms occuring at greater strength and frequency?
Or are y'all living on a different planet?

Yes, Al "me want banana" Gore is NOT the sharpest knife in the drawer
And his facts tend to be skewed, however, not acknowledging that there is even a minute amount of "Truth" to his claims is living in denial
But they are not occurring at greater frequency - they are being reported at a MUCH greater frequency than before. And we have social networks that let us know when anything anywhere happens now.

Big storms, heat, and weird weather have always happened - There was just never a youtube, facebook, and 24hr news channels to report it.

I'm not saying that our lifestyles have NO effect on global climate - it's just not nearly as much as those making billions saying it actually lead you to believe.


ps - Al Gore recently sold "Current TV" which was suppose to be his mouthpiece to spread his global agenda of "making smaller carbon footprints". He sold it to Al Jazeera - which is completely funded by the sale of fossil fuels. It's about money.

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Unread 29th January 2013, 02:42 PM   #15
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

btw: Recycling plays a big part in saving the planet too -
Wondering what to do with your 'poptops'?
Here's a creative suggestion...:rolleyes:
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Unread 29th January 2013, 03:00 PM   #16
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Originally Posted by garyv View Post
But they are not occurring at greater frequency - they are being reported at a MUCH greater frequency than before. And we have social networks that let us know when anything anywhere happens now.

Big storms, heat, and weird weather have always happened - There was just never a youtube, facebook, and 24hr news channels to report it.

I'm not saying that our lifestyles have NO effect on global climate - it's just not nearly as much as those making billions saying it actually lead you to believe.


ps - Al Gore recently sold "Current TV" which was suppose to be his mouthpiece to spread his global agenda of "making smaller carbon footprints". He sold it to Al Jazeera - which is completely funded by the sale of fossil fuels. It's about money.
I am mobile and its a huge PITA to post links...

And I am not going to do youre research for you.
Look it up. I believe youll be surprised
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Unread 29th January 2013, 03:11 PM   #17
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Originally Posted by MoneyMagnetMagnate View Post
Oh, poo-poo and pish-tosh :p :rolleyes:
Now THATS a thoughtful intelligent arguement
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Unread 29th January 2013, 04:01 PM   #18
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Originally Posted by Big Rob View Post
I am mobile and its a huge PITA to post links...

And I am not going to do youre research for you.
Look it up. I believe youll be surprised
I have - and I'm not.

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Unread 29th January 2013, 04:06 PM   #19
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

The 30,000 scientists are ALL degreed. The degree is required to sign, unlike the Kayoto petition of a few thousand which included people such as hair dressers. Kewl eh?

We don't have warming - we have desertification. There is one hella difference. Yeah it's change - but what the govs want to do won't cure it.

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Unread 29th January 2013, 05:58 PM   #20
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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The 30,000 scientists are ALL degreed. The degree is required to sign, unlike the Kyoto petition of a few thousand which included people such as hair dressers. Kewl eh?

We don't have warming - we have desertification. There is one hella difference. Yeah it's change - but what the govs want to do won't cure it.
I would think desertification is a process...warming is a result - and one begets the other...

(ftfy - Kyoto)
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Unread 29th January 2013, 06:06 PM   #21
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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I would think desertification is a process...warming is a result - and one begets the other...

(ftfy - Kyoto)
Yep I ALWAYS misspell it for some reason. Mental block.

Desertification does result in heat. Go into a city then walk out into a forest. The difference is immediately perceptible. Unfortunately, until we get the population into a negative growth pattern, there's not much that we're going to do about this - especially considering the illegality of growing hemp, which could be used to save tens to hundreds of millions of trees annually. What the hell, there is NO profit for major corps or our greedy leaders in saving trees. They don't care what happens after they are dead. Destruction is getting bad enough though that they might suffer themselves during their own lifetime if they don't knock it off. There comes a point that a lot of money won't save your butt. They just haven't figured that out yet.

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Unread 29th January 2013, 07:04 PM   #22
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Originally Posted by MoneyMagnetMagnate View Post
I would think desertification is a process...warming is a result - and one begets the other...

(ftfy - Kyoto)
If that's what it is, it makes more sense than denying something that is obviously happening. I've seen desertification happen even here in Canada of all places, so it does seem plausible to me, as does the concept of the greenhouse effect.

Whatever can be done to improve the environment will be vigorously fought by the big-time corporate-welfare recipients Koch Bros, who are up to some very weird stuff:
Climate denial, Koch brothers style | Georgia Straight

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Unread 29th January 2013, 07:42 PM   #23
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

Maybe it's not 30 thousand scientists...maybe I misread it and it actually is what it said 30(point)000 scientists...they do like to be accurate and all (they are scientists :rolleyes so 30.000 'mad' scientists is not so many...we can handle that...(it's probably more like 29.9999)
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Unread 29th January 2013, 08:23 PM   #24
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

How come they have 30K scientist are they working together or are they just working alone? This is crazy, we al have our fair share of deeds and acts that caused global warming I think.

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Unread 29th January 2013, 08:37 PM   #25
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Unread 29th January 2013, 08:40 PM   #26
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Unread 29th January 2013, 08:54 PM   #27
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Unread 29th January 2013, 09:17 PM   #28
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

Quote:
Have not the summers felt hotter?
The winters seem shorter?
Arent the northern ice caps melting?
Sea levels rising?
Glaciers melting at a record pace?
Carbon emissions at an all time high?
Hurricanes/Typhoons/ Super storms occuring at greater strength and frequency?
Or are y'all living on a different planet?

Yes, Al "me want banana" Gore is NOT the sharpest knife in the drawer
And his facts tend to be skewed, however, not acknowledging that there is even a minute amount of "Truth" to his claims is living in denial
Hmmmm, l suspected l would open a can of worms with this thread! :rolleyes:


The glaciers melting at a record pace is true, but there is also concrete proof, that the Earth has tilted by 25 percent.

Which means one ice pole losses a lot of ice, and the other gains a lot of ice!

If news reports were true, then both poles would be losing a lot of ice, and water levels would be up by an obvious amount, worldwide?

Apart from some small islands, that hasn't happened!


In AU the climate committee, (or whatever it is called) is run by someone who lies, and distorts climate info, on a regular bases. Thankfully some colomists in a Australia wide paper tends to show his inconsistencies!

He seems to be more interested in justifying his and his counterparts actions on this issue, than giving the facts as they are!

One example was, he said that wind power generates constant electricity, which is a lie!

There have been days and up to a week where entire states didn't have any wind. SA didn't have enough wind to turn one of these massive things, for a good part of a week.

And the list goes on!

In the meantime China is using more coal than all other countries combined, so, regardless of what we do, according to some scientists, we will have a "Soylent Green" type future by 2100!

Unless we can create a clean, sustainable way to generate power, and China, India, etc use this on a vast scale!

Shane


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Unread 30th January 2013, 12:18 AM   #29
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

Quote:
Have not the summers felt hotter?
The winters seem shorter?
Arent the northern ice caps melting?
Sea levels rising?
Glaciers melting at a record pace?
Carbon emissions at an all time high?
Hurricanes/Typhoons/ Super storms occuring at greater strength and frequency?
Or are y'all living on a different planet?
It think for some the official to this is either "technicalities that have nothing to do with the hype I'm spinning" or "says you".

Weather patterns are changing. It may be natural or man may have something to do with it. If natural, we can do nothing. If we contribute (can any look at a smog cloaked city and think we don't have something to do with it?) and we fuss and argue and do nothing...we're fools.

There is no downside to cleaning up our planet and using resources wisely instead of assuming they will always be available. It may or may not affect climate change - but it will do no harm.


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Unread 30th January 2013, 12:30 AM   #30
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Originally Posted by MoneyMagnetMagnate View Post
After watching the video, the argument got nowhere...he spoke, but wasn't allowed to speak - when I called him 'credentialed', I was referring to his degrees, and if/what he may scientifically offer in rebuttal to global warming claims. I found it amusing, that he opened and sidestepped the issue of campaign funding, and according to this story, he ended up spending 400K more than DeFazio, and lost for a second time. DeFazio beats Robinson for second time in 4th Congressional District | NRToday.com

He was allowed to speak. He was running for public office and refused to give a straight answer to valid questions.

While he does have "credentials", he is unbalanced emotionally, distorting his intelligence. A while back we had a discussion here about IQ and I was the only one that brought up emotions. Later, I saw a study on the brain and IQ and those experts validated my theory. Emotion does play a part in intelligence and Art's emotions are in question (by me).

Anyone that thinks that wasn't a fair interview is showing extreme bias. BTW, Art Robinson implying that a Rhodes Scholar (Maddow) isn't intelligent, needs to rethink his stance.

And if you believe Art's view on radiation, I have some land I'll sell you next to a beach front nuke reactor in Japan.



Quote:
I'll have to see the what/why of these 30k scientists to see if there is any weight to their argument. (are they blaming it on cow farts? or what?)
About 1% of them are qualified in the field in question. There's some other signatures that are questionable, as well as some controversy about how the petition was administered and if it confused some by intentionally looking like something official from The National Academy of Science.

Quote:
As a citizen of Colorado, I'm sure you are aware of terms 'survivalist', 'doomsday', and links to Armageddon, from some folks who may have a fundamental way of looking at things, - Douglas County Oregon is a bastion for those types of ideas.
As a citizen of Colorado, I have a cousin who's husband worked an NCAR for 30 years. I'll take his word over Art's any day.

Quote:
My remark about the Koch's may have been flippant in this particular case, but I'm sure you as someone who has great interest in alternative energies is aware of the big checks they have written to combat the ideas of a global warming.
And one of the Koch bros research studies recently found global warming to be true. Ooops.

Climate study, funded in part by conservative group, confirms global warming - CSMonitor.com

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Unread 30th January 2013, 12:43 AM   #31
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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I thought he spoke for himself fairly well. He definitely knows the bogus overused tactics of Rachel Maddow. She constantly uses out of context quotes, which lead to faulty analogy. And those logically challenged fall for it every time.
I have a very good grasp of logic. Art wouldn't answer direct questions. Again, he was seeking public office, he had a responsiblity to answer those questions and instead of giving straight answers he started crying and attacking Maddow. I'm not sure how you claim Maddow had "faulty analogy", she voiced virtually no opinions and simply wanted to hear Robinson's response.

And no, Art didn't know anything about Maddow, other that what he heard. He didn't even know who she was. If the quotes were "bogus", Robinson should have corrected her instead of attacking her. He simply wouldnt respond to comments printed in his own newsletter. Be a man. If you say something, own up.

Luckily, the people of Oregon agreed with me and Robinson lost in a landslide.

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Unread 30th January 2013, 12:56 AM   #32
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Originally Posted by HeySal View Post
The 30,000 scientists are ALL degreed. The degree is required to sign, unlike the Kayoto petition of a few thousand which included people such as hair dressers. Kewl eh?

We don't have warming - we have desertification. There is one hella difference. Yeah it's change - but what the govs want to do won't cure it.
Let's take a look at all of those "degreed" signers...

Quote:

Global warming: Oregon candidate Art Robinson epitomizes GOP dogma - National environmental policy | Examiner.com

However, in 2001, Scientific America did a random sampling of the petitioners and found many irregularities, including duplicate names, phony names, and people who could not remember signing such a petition. Numerous individuals said they would not sign the petition again. Loosely extrapolating the numbers, it was determined the petition only had a core of about 200 legitimate climate researchers.
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In addition, there are 18 organizations on record calling global warming a “fraud”. They include numerous petroleum, mining, transportation, energy associations, and the US Chamber of Commerce. There are 103 organizations on record calling global warming a “fact”. They include NOAA, NASA, US department of Defense, US Department of Energy, and dozens of global scientific academies.

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Unread 30th January 2013, 01:18 AM   #33
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

I'm curious Kurt, how you may have surmised I was on Art Robinson's side...when in fact I am quite far from anywhere being on his side. He could almost be the poster child for right wing Southwestern Oregon fundamentalist/survivalists - he is a nut job, but I wanted to see if there was any creditability at all in his position, as I like to keep an open mind and see what the opposition camp is thinking, and I certainly don't support his crazy ideas regarding radiation...or really much else in his political platform.
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Unread 30th January 2013, 01:31 AM   #34
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

Gore invented the internet, Bush invented the interwebs. The interwebs are all around us.



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Unread 30th January 2013, 01:33 AM   #35
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Originally Posted by garyv View Post
I thought he spoke for himself fairly well. He definitely knows the bogus overused tactics of Rachel Maddow. She constantly uses out of context quotes, which lead to faulty analogy. And those logically challenged fall for it every time.
Rachel Maddow totally owned him.

I am here
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Unread 30th January 2013, 01:41 AM   #36
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

Personally, I have formed no opinion on the validity of global warming as a man-made problem. Mostly because of the vast number of agendas that the different scientists on both sides seem to have.

But, good news is, we may be headed for a real answer soon ...

One of the more compelling counter arguments is that the warming and cooling of the earth is directly affected by the sun's activity or lack thereof. The more active the sun is, the warmer the earth's temperature.

Some scientists are, in fact, now warning that we may actually be headed for a planetary cooling because the sun's activity is waning. And not just a little ...

"This week, scientists from the US Solar Observatory and the US Air Force Research Laboratory have discovered – to their great surprise – that the sun’s activity is declining, and that we might experience the lowest solar output we’ve seen since 1645-1715."

Source: Is a Planetary Cooling Spell Straight Ahead? NASA: We May Be On the Verge of a

Should that happen, they believe a small "maunder minimum" could occur. Possibly leading to a somewhat rapid mini "Ice Age". So, I guess the scientists will at least have something new to argue about ...

Was the Ice Age of the new millenium caused by man-made global warming stalling the ocean conveyor belt? Or, was it caused by the sun once again entering a time of low solar activity?

Truth is, I don't know who to believe here. But, if you ask this poor layman, devoid of colorful graphs and statistics, if global warming was caused by mankind, in his limited scope and knowledge ... or if it's this giant ball of fire in the sky that has been doing it for centuries -- I'm probably going to choose the sun.

I just think that mankind and his tiny, little smokestacks may have "warming envy". :rolleyes:
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Unread 30th January 2013, 02:16 AM   #37
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Personally, I have formed no opinion on the validity of global warming as a man-made problem. Mostly because of the vast number of agendas that the different scientists on both sides seem to have.

But, good news is, we may be headed for a real answer soon ...

One of the more compelling counter arguments is that the warming and cooling of the earth is directly affected by the sun's activity or lack thereof. The more active the sun is, the warmer the earth's temperature.

Some scientists are, in fact, now warning that we may actually be headed for a planetary cooling because the sun's activity is waning. And not just a little ...

"This week, scientists from the US Solar Observatory and the US Air Force Research Laboratory have discovered – to their great surprise – that the sun’s activity is declining, and that we might experience the lowest solar output we’ve seen since 1645-1715."

Source: Is a Planetary Cooling Spell Straight Ahead? NASA: We May Be On the Verge of a

Should that happen, they believe a small "maunder minimum" could occur. Possibly leading to a somewhat rapid mini "Ice Age". So, I guess the scientists will at least have something new to argue about ...

Was the Ice Age of the new millenium caused by man-made global warming stalling the ocean conveyor belt? Or, was it caused by the sun once again entering a time of low solar activity?

Truth is, I don't know who to believe here. But, if you ask this poor layman, devoid of colorful graphs and statistics, if global warming was caused by mankind, in his limited scope and knowledge ... or if it's this giant ball of fire in the sky that has been doing it for centuries -- I'm probably going to choose the sun.

I just think that mankind and his tiny, little smokestacks may have "warming envy".
Arrrrrgggggg great, now we have to go through this BS all over again! At least global cooling might be more legit?

And instead of carbon tax, maybe we may start getting taxed for ice?

Better start stocking up on ice cubes.

Shane

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Unread 30th January 2013, 02:39 AM   #38
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

They are scientists.

30.000 is thirty and zero thousandths.

Significant digits will get ya every time.
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Unread 30th January 2013, 03:16 AM   #39
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Originally Posted by MoneyMagnetMagnate View Post
Maybe it's not 30 thousand scientists...maybe I misread it and it actually is what it said 30(point)000 scientists...they do like to be accurate and all (they are scientists :rolleyes so 30.000 'mad' scientists is not so many...we can handle that...(it's probably more like 29.9999)
It's a tad over thirty thousand. You can see the petition list at a site called Icecap.org. It's a site where climatologists circulate climate news - political, physical, etc.

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Unread 30th January 2013, 03:45 AM   #40
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Thankfully some colomists in a Australia wide paper tends to show his inconsistencies!
LOL. Those columnists (one of whom was convicted for lying in a racist manner) constantly lie about everything at the behest of their lord and master who is currently being investigated by the FBI and UK authorities for bribing police officials.

Just because you believe the crap they publish doesn't mean it's the truth.

You are of course entitled to your opinion. You are not entitled to your own facts.

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Unread 30th January 2013, 07:59 AM   #41
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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LOL. Those columnists (one of whom was convicted for lying in a racist manner) constantly lie about everything at the behest of their lord and master who is currently being investigated by the FBI and UK authorities for bribing police officials.

Just because you believe the crap they publish doesn't mean it's the truth.

You are of course entitled to your opinion. You are not entitled to your own facts.
This columnist is a regular in the Herald Sun, Australian paper. And he doesn't make up crap, he gives evidence against the BS artist running the climate committee.

He wouldn't keep his job for long if he just made things up!

And Adelaide, not having enough wind blowing for a good part of a week is a fact!

But apparently this is only the tip of the iceberg, their lifespan and generation capacity is also dodgy!

But, it's a free world, so you can believe what you like!

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OFFICIAL DATA SHOWS TURBINES ARE FAILING TO DELIVER

The Renewable Energy Foundation has published a new study, ‘The Performance of Wind Farms in the United Kingdom and Denmark’, showing that the economic life of onshore wind turbines is between 10 and 15 years, not the 20 to 25 years projected by the wind industry and used for government projections.

The work has been conducted by one of the UK’s leading energy & environmental economists, Professor Gordon Hughes of the University of Edinburgh, and has been anonymously peer-reviewed.


This groundbreaking study applies rigorous statistical analysis to years of actual wind farm performance data from wind farms in both the UK and in Denmark.


The results show that after allowing for variations in wind speed and site characteristics the average load factor of wind farms declines substantially as they get older, probably due to wear and tear. By 10 years of age the contribution of an average UK wind farm to meeting electricity demand has declined by a third.


This decline in performance means that it is rarely economic to operate wind farms for more than 12 to 15 years. After this period they must be replaced with new machines, a finding that has profound consequences for investors and government alike.
-------------------------
The REF study can be downloaded in full, with the data that informs the analysis, from the REF website.
Windbyte - Wind farms in North East England, the Scottish Borders and Lothians - Home

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Unread 30th January 2013, 08:47 AM   #42
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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I have a very good grasp of logic. Art wouldn't answer direct questions. Again, he was seeking public office, he had a responsiblity to answer those questions and instead of giving straight answers he started crying and attacking Maddow. I'm not sure how you claim Maddow had "faulty analogy", she voiced virtually no opinions and simply wanted to hear Robinson's response.
She pulled a quote from over 15 years ago out of it's full context, and Art knew it. And he was right - there's no way to properly argue that without the documents and plenty of time to fill in the context. So you just don't argue it. Not on a show where you have maybe 6 minutes. Plus it had nothing to do with the current issues at hand.

It's an extremely common tactic used by many on that channel - but especially her. It's not real journalism, it's just as he said - a smear campaign of out of context quotes. - One could even make Mother Teresa look bad with that foolish tactic. And as I said - many fall for it as you have proven.

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Unread 30th January 2013, 11:56 AM   #43
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

First, this "suit" was brought up in 2008, 4-5 years ago. It was nothing more than a publicity stunt.


Second, there are no legal grounds for a suit.


Third, there's all sorts of documentation concerning Art Robinson's "31,000". And considering the facts about his list (such as names like "Donald Duck" being on the list), I'm not sure how anyone can respect his scientific method. He is obviously willing to lie and twist the truth to get his desired outcome.


Here's a list of references...At least check out the Wikipedia page.

Taken from:
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20100729214718AAMg6oH

Quote:


Wikipedia page about the petition
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oregon_Peti…

Current Oregon Petition website
http://www.oism.org/pproject/

Current covering letter from Prof Seitz
http://www.oism.org/pproject/s33p41.htm

The page before 12,000 names suddenly appeared
http://web.archive.org/web/2007121623322…

Original version before the wording was fraudulently changed
http://web.archive.org/web/1998120707231…

Sourcewatch page about the petition
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?tit…

Signatories to the Leipzig Declaration
http://www.sepp.org/policy%20declaration…

The Leipzig Declaration
http://www.sepp.org/policy%20declaration…

Sourcewatch page about the Leipzig Declaration
http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?tit…

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Unread 30th January 2013, 12:09 PM   #44
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Originally Posted by garyv View Post
She pulled a quote from over 15 years ago out of it's full context, and Art knew it. And he was right - there's no way to properly argue that without the documents and plenty of time to fill in the context. So you just don't argue it. Not on a show where you have maybe 6 minutes. Plus it had nothing to do with the current issues at hand.

It's an extremely common tactic used by many on that channel - but especially her. It's not real journalism, it's just as he said - a smear campaign of out of context quotes. - One could even make Mother Teresa look bad with that foolish tactic. And as I said - many fall for it as you have proven.
Nice try. Your boy Art was on for 11 minutes, watch the video. Nice example of a straw man fallacy, Mr. Logic. 11 minutes is plenty of time to correct at least one "out of context" comment, and almost twice as long as your "maybe 6 minutes" example, which is a non-sequetor fallacy, as well as a red herring.

Also, since you insist on logic, please give us an exact example of Maddow taking something Robinson said out of context. Speaking (writing) without examples isn't backed by logic.

He refused to respond to any question. Art was given the opportunity to respond to his controversial opinions and statements, and he cowardly avoided them. If Art's own quotes were taken out of context, he had an opportunity to put them into context, instead of attacking and insulting Maddow. Not a very logical response...As a matter of fact, one could correctly say that Art's response was a good example of an ad hominem attack, instead of a logical response we'd expect from a "scientist".

If you are going to reference a book written by a well known racist, expect to be asked about it. If you are going to say that radiation is good for you, be prepared to be questioned about it.

Maddow was extremely patient and polite with him, even wondering if there was a "failure to communicate" because of the time difference by using a satellite to communicate.

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Unread 30th January 2013, 12:23 PM   #45
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Default Re: Al Gore sued by over 30.000 Scientists for Global Warming fraud

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Originally Posted by Kurt View Post
Nice try. Your boy Art was on for 11 minutes, watch the video. Nice example of a straw man fallacy, Mr. Logic. 11 minutes is plenty of time to correct at least one "out of context" comment, and almost twice as long as your "maybe 6 minutes" example, which is a non-sequetor fallacy, as well as a red herring.

Also, since you insist on logic, please give us an exact example of Maddow taking something Robinson said out of context. Speaking (writing) without examples isn't backed by logic.

He refused to respond to any question. Art was given the opportunity to respond to his controversial opinions and statements, and he cowardly avoided them. If Art's own quotes were taken out of context, he had an opportunity to put them into context, instead of attacking and insulting Maddow. Not a very logical response...As a matter of fact, one could correctly say that Art's response was a good example of an ad hominem attack, instead of a logical response we'd expect from a "scientist".

If you are going to reference a book written by a well known racist, expect to be asked about it. If you are going to say that radiation is good for you, be prepared to be questioned about it.

Maddow was extremely patient and polite with him, even wondering if there was a "failure to communicate" because of the time difference by using a satellite to communicate.
Are you serious with that? lol - The man wrote articles every day of his life. He was one of the highest graduates from Cal-Tech in chemistry. And then after getting his PHD from University of California he was one of only a few students ever to be appointed to the faculty. The guy has decades of writing on the subject.

So no - 6 minutes - not even 11 minutes is enough to properly context decades of writing.

Again - Rachel dumbs down her content - and the logically challenged easily fall for it.

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