Denver homicides cut in half after pot legalized in Colorado

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Correlation isn't always causation, but...

Homicides Down Over 52% Since Beginning of Legal Cannabis Sales in Denver | The Joint Blog
  • Profile picture of the author serryjw
    I'm proud.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mikaedi
    That being the case then I wander what Colorado will legalize next..from what I'v seen of the negative and harmful effects of this garbage especially on young minds.

    I would suggest that in the next decade Colorado will face an epidemic of mental illness combined with a lack of will to succeed..

    A state full of zombies with no hope..so is it really worth it in the long run even though their homicide rate is down 52% hmm
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    • Profile picture of the author DJL
      Originally Posted by Mikaedi View Post

      ...A state full of zombies with no hope...
      Yes, and think of all those DEA agents who will be forced to find honest work! The horror!
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    • Profile picture of the author ThomM
      Originally Posted by Mikaedi View Post

      That being the case then I wander what Colorado will legalize next..from what I'v seen of the negative and harmful effects of this garbage especially on young minds.

      I would suggest that in the next decade Colorado will face an epidemic of mental illness combined with a lack of will to succeed..

      A state full of zombies with no hope..so is it really worth it in the long run even though their homicide rate is down 52% hmm
      You mean like Carl Sagan and Sir Richard Branson?
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  • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
    Banned
    that's because they're too busy sitting on the couch, eating a bowl of Cheetos, saying "whatever dude."
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    Pot smokers never were violent -- that's booze that creates violence. With all the lawyers, doctors, Corp execs, and that gold medal winning olympic guy (can't remember his name) that smoke........I'm not sure where people get the impression that people that smoke never get anywhere. Some of the most successful people I've ever met like a fattie now and again.

    Maybe "now and again" is the key to that one? I swear I've seen people get up, smoke a bowl and then go on with their day's work. If I smoked a bowl when I woke up.....I'd be back in bed before the coffee was brewed. Guess it depends on your system. Chamomile kicks me hard, too. I can only drink it before bed because it makes me just dopey tired.

    Maybe people got the wrong idea about pot because it was illegal, so the successful people kept their smoking hidden - while those who didn't, got busted and ruined their lives.
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    • Profile picture of the author joe golfer
      Originally Posted by HeySal View Post


      Maybe people got the wrong idea about pot because it was illegal, so the successful people kept their smoking hidden - while those who didn't, got busted and ruined their lives.
      Interesting. I don't know what it is, but lately I see lots of kids smoking joints openly around downtown here. I don't know if they don't care, or if busy cops don't bust them enough to worry.
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    • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
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      Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

      Pot smokers never were violent -- that's booze that creates violence.
      Neither pot or alcohol creates violence. There are many serial killers and just plain killers who smoke(d) pot and those who drank excessively and those who did both. Serial killers who smoked pot include Richard Ramirez, the Night Stalker, Gein, Gacy, Bundy, Holmes, El Ponchis" The 14 Year Old Mexican Assassin, Manson, Crutchley, etc.

      Marijuana paradise?
      When most heads think of Humboldt County, bucolic fields of bud, a rugged coastline and fun-loving pot growers come to mind, but few realize that there's a dark side to this hippie paradise that only the locals know about.
      Humboldt County: Murder, Mayhem and Marijuana | High Times
      Then there's the video of Casey Anthony smoking one of those big fat joints and Jael Mullings, who killed both her kids and said she was smoking too much weed.

      It wasn't the substances that made these people what they are. If that were the case, there would be millions of serial killers/killers slaughtering people. That would be a very convenient defense for all killers ... it was the pot/alcohol that made me do it. Some are sociopaths and some are just criminals.
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      • Profile picture of the author darkhorse30
        Originally Posted by sbucciarel View Post

        Neither pot or alcohol creates violence. There are many serial killers and just plain killers who smoke(d) pot and those who drank excessively and those who did both. Serial killers who smoked pot include Richard Ramirez, the Night Stalker, Gein, Gacy, Bundy, Holmes, El Ponchis" The 14 Year Old Mexican Assassin, Manson, Crutchley, etc.

        Marijuana paradise?


        Then there's the video of Casey Anthony smoking one of those big fat joints and Jael Mullings, who killed both her kids and said she was smoking too much weed.

        It wasn't the substances that made these people what they are. If that were the case, there would be millions of serial killers/killers slaughtering people. That would be a very convenient defense for all killers ... it was the pot/alcohol that made me do it. Some are sociopaths and some are just criminals.
        you are so very right
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    • Profile picture of the author darkhorse30
      Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

      Pot smokers never were violent -- that's booze that creates violence. With all the lawyers, doctors, Corp execs, and that gold medal winning olympic guy (can't remember his name) that smoke........I'm not sure where people get the impression that people that smoke never get anywhere. Some of the most successful people I've ever met like a fattie now and again.

      Maybe "now and again" is the key to that one? I swear I've seen people get up, smoke a bowl and then go on with their day's work. If I smoked a bowl when I woke up.....I'd be back in bed before the coffee was brewed. Guess it depends on your system. Chamomile kicks me hard, too. I can only drink it before bed because it makes me just dopey tired.

      Maybe people got the wrong idea about pot because it was illegal, so the successful people kept their smoking hidden - while those who didn't, got busted and ruined their lives.
      thumbs up.its just a misconception that smoking pot gets one mentally derailed and yet i have known very good doctors,lawyers,even preachers that smoke pot and still do very well in their endeavours.
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  • Profile picture of the author Taraka
    That's logical. I'm still surprised the feds led Denver do it.

    Ah! Poor and jobless DEA agents
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    • Profile picture of the author serryjw
      It's NOT Denver but the entire state of Colorado.
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  • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
    http://www.denvergov.org/Portals/720...enses_2014.pdf

    The drop was from 17 homicides to 8 homicides, so it's not
    a statistically significant percent of the population.

    The number of rapes increases with an increase in ice cream sales.
    Does that mean ice cream makes people more violent? Or, does
    it mean that more people eat ice cream during warm weather and
    more people are out and about during warm weather?

    Anyway, this winter was much harsher than last winter, so
    maybe the drop happened just because more people stayed inside.

    If the drop in violent crimes is related to legalization, I hope it has to do with
    fewer drug deals gone bad and less gang violence.

    I'm not sure how the drop in sexual assaults would relate at all to legalization
    of pot. Must be the weather.
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  • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
    You're welcome, Jason.
    I struggled through four required semesters of college
    sadistics, I mean statistics, courses. I did sort of get
    the principles though.


    ---------------------

    Having worked as a doorman, etc., I do think that those under
    the influence of pot are less violent than drunks. But, I don't
    think that enters into the homicide numbers. Maybe the aggravated
    assault numbers - if fighting and domestic violence are under that
    heading.

    The only reasons I voted to legalize marijuana are because I thought
    it would eventually lower the violent crimes from dealers and amongst
    the gangs, and lower the numbers of people over-penalized for recreational
    use and possession.

    I don't personally use it and can't stand the overuse of any drug or alcohol.

    I had to set a no marijuana use on premises policy for my hotel. lol
    Naive people from other states think they can smoke anywhere in Colorado.
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  • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
    The number of rapes increases with an increase in ice cream sales. Does that mean ice cream makes people more violent? Or, does it mean that more people eat ice cream during warm weather and more people are out and about during warm weather?
    Probably the best example I've seen yet of the distinction between correlation and causality. Thank you. I shall be stealing that.

    My favorite statistic: The average person has approximately one testicle.


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    • Profile picture of the author dborz
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      • Profile picture of the author ThomM
        About the only stat I'd give any real credence to with cannabis being legal is the number of arrests dropping for use and possession.
        People have been smoking and using cannabis for centuries. The last report I read about the number of cannabis smokers in the U.S. put the number around 50 million. It's only been illegal for roughly 80 years so it being legal again isn't really anything new.
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        • Profile picture of the author Kurt
          Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

          Pot smokers never were violent -- that's booze that
          Originally Posted by bizgrower View Post

          Having worked as a doorman, etc., I do think that those under
          the influence of pot are less violent than drunks.
          Let me say as a former cab driver, drunks are 1000 times worse than pot heads...The only problem is, I didn't know who the pot heads were, other than they were probably in the large group of people that didn't talk a lot and didn't give me any hassles.

          Plus, MJ helps ease nausea. Drunks puke in the cab. It didn't take me long to realize working the "bar rush" wasn't worth it. I never needed a few bucks that bad.

          It's kind of funny how Denver has a rep for MJ, while it's also the microbrewery captial of the country. And the state of Colorado produces more beer than any other state. How come no one talks about all the legal booze?
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          • Profile picture of the author serryjw
            How come no one talks about all the legal booze?
            BECAUSE Gov Hick made his money in microbrewery
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          • Profile picture of the author ThomM
            It's kind of funny how Denver has a rep for MJ, while it's also the microbrewery captial of the country. And the state of Colorado produces more beer than any other state. How come no one talks about all the legal booze?
            In my circle we actually do talk a lot about the different micro breweries and their beer. I don't drink and still find it all fascinating. Here in New York (and Vermont) there has been a big resurgence in micro brews and also local wineries that produce some real outstanding organic wines. I still enjoy a little wine once or twice a year, the last being a Blueberry Blush for the Putney Mt. Winery Blueberry Blush - Blueberry Wine - Putney Mountain Winery
            I've believed for a long time that Cannabis will go the same way as beer and wine has. There will be corporations providing "standardized" cannabis and then there will be the micro growers working with more exotic strains.
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            • Profile picture of the author serryjw
              CO is only the beginning. WHERE there is $$$$$, there are new opportunities. We are having MJ parties of the upper crust. They are all in their 40's and drinking and performing at peak is getting harder with years. BYOMJ...everyone 'shares'...it is really the IN thing.
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    • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
      Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

      Probably the best example I've seen yet of the distinction between correlation and causality. Thank you. I shall be stealing that.

      My favorite statistic: The average person has approximately one testicle.


      Paul
      Paul; Be honest, you're talking about Riffle, aren't you?
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      • Profile picture of the author Paul Myers
        Claude,
        Be honest, you're talking about Riffle, aren't you?
        Are you suggesting that Dan is "the average person?"


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        • Profile picture of the author ThomM
          I don't think most people want to see young people go to jail and get felonies on their records either for smoking it and getting caught. So, will it be decriminalized for adults, but not for youth?

          Believe me, I'm not for young people smoking it more than trying it out and maybe very occasional smoking, and I'm not really for that ... but kids are going to do what they want to do in the long run.
          I believe in Colorado you have to be the same age to purchase cannabis as you do alcohol.
          As for those of a younger age I think they should be subjected to the same charges and penalties as those caught drinking under age.
          My daughters all knew their mother and I smoked cannabis. We also sat them down and explained that doing anything like smoking or drinking was not wise as their minds and bodies where still developing and they shouldn't do anything that may effect that. We also told them when they turned 18 we would allow them to try smoking cannabis or drinking at home but not out in public. We didn't smoke in front of them though unless they happened to walk in on us. But they usually knew what we where doing and none of them liked the smell of the smoke so they would stay away from us till we where done.
          All are well over 21 now and out of the 4, two will smoke, one won't and the youngest who I raised on my own from the age of 13 will smoke when she is having problems eating or sleeping.
          The two that do smoke can take it or leave it and the one that doesn't really doesn't like smoke of any kind.
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        • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
          Originally Posted by Paul Myers View Post

          Claude,Are you suggesting that Dan is "the average person?"


          Paul
          Paul; No. He isn't average at all. Much smarter than average...

          But you ruined my insult. Now I have to sulk.
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          • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
            Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre View Post

            Paul; No. He isn't average at all. Much smarter than average...

            But you ruined my insult. Now I have to sulk.
            I know where you can get some marijuana cookies - cheap.
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  • Profile picture of the author serryjw
    I have not smoked for 35 years but I did my part. Collected signatures on (4) MJ petitions & was the Notary on thousands of petitions. I doubt that people are going to smoke (more) because it is now legal. I did it because the DEA is a waste of tax dollars. I did it because I was tired of seeing kids ruining their life by having a felony for smoking a plant, AFTER YEARS in prison. I have no interest in making Barbara Bush & the Prison Industrial Complex wealthier.

    I will now get off my soapbox!
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  • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
    My favorite statistic:

    60% of all statistics are made up on the spot


    --------------------

    I have a funny anecdote about the legal pot.

    There is a marijuana store a couple of blocks from my hotel.
    At check out a very conservative looking, 65 year old Texan who had
    Justice of the Peace decals on the side of his truck offered to
    sell me his marijuana cookies. He said that because it was legal,
    he decided to try it and all it did was make him dizzy. Hence the cookie
    sale. I don't use it and if I did, $20 for two 5" cookies is too steep for me.

    ---------------------

    The OPs' link and the link I posted from denvergov.org only refer to
    City and County of Denver stats. I took a quick look for other cities and
    the state and I don't see any 2014 stats.


    ------------------------------

    http://www.foodsafetynews.com/2014/0.../#.U3Y2NHlOXcc
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  • Profile picture of the author HeySal
    A Red Rocks concert would be awesome with legal pot. Love that place.

    Suzanne - you're talking about people who are sick from the get go. I don't think ANYTHING helps them, but the average guy on the streets is more likely to get in a fight on booze than on pot.

    There's too much actual science that shows the old propaganda about pot is just that.

    Mikaedi - you want to see zombies, that actually at times literally drool, and have no real memory -- what you are thinking of is people on psychotropic drugs. Pot smokers only have a problem with memory when they are actually really stoned - and a few don't even have problems then. Just part of the propaganda mill that they used to make people okay with illegalizing hemp so the gov's sponsoring corporations wouldn't have their profits interfered with by natural, environmentally healthy production.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mikaedi
      Originally Posted by HeySal View Post

      A Red Rocks concert would be awesome with legal pot. Love that place.

      Suzanne - you're talking about people who are sick from the get go. I don't think ANYTHING helps them, but the average guy on the streets is more likely to get in a fight on booze than on pot.

      There's too much actual science that shows the old propaganda about pot is just that.

      Mikaedi - you want to see zombies, that actually at times literally drool, and have no real memory -- what you are thinking of is people on psychotropic drugs. Pot smokers only have a problem with memory when they are actually really stoned - and a few don't even have problems then. Just part of the propaganda mill that they used to make people okay with illegalizing hemp so the gov's sponsoring corporations wouldn't have their profits interfered with by natural, environmentally healthy production.
      Hey Sal, I see cannabis zombies weekly in my nephews and nieces/teenagers that spend their day sitting around smoking pot..actually in my country as dope is illegal many of our teenagers had found a replacement in what LEGAL HIGHS! this stuff was ten times worse than the damage dope was doing to these kids.
      Corporate type dope smokers may well be successful but my biggie with dope is the damage it is doing to young developing minds..so no I was not talking about psychotropic drugs at all.
      Adult brains are a lot more developed than teens and kids still at Collage.

      I'm not swayed at all by the propaganda mill from ether sides, I just see what this crap does to growing young minds..when Adults preach that dope is harmless and all the other pro dope crap that comes out of their mouths..no more said on that.that's my rant.
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      • Profile picture of the author serryjw
        Colorado did NOT make MJ legal for under 21. I know plenty of dysfunctional people, young and old. Do ya THUNK we have plenty of very successful people that are alcoholics. I don't smoke, haven't for 35 years , but I celebrate the legality of it.
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      • Profile picture of the author ThomM
        Mikaedi, nobody is saying children should be allowed to smoke cannabis. It's a poor argument for not allowing adults to be able to decide if they should smoke and not have to worry about going to jail for it.
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        • Profile picture of the author sbucciarel
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          Originally Posted by ThomM View Post

          Mikaedi, nobody is saying children should be allowed to smoke cannabis. It's a poor argument for not allowing adults to be able to decide if they should smoke and not have to worry about going to jail for it.
          I don't think most people want to see young people go to jail and get felonies on their records either for smoking it and getting caught. So, will it be decriminalized for adults, but not for youth?

          Believe me, I'm not for young people smoking it more than trying it out and maybe very occasional smoking, and I'm not really for that ... but kids are going to do what they want to do in the long run.

          As for drunks being more obnoxious than pot smokers @HeySal, yeah they are more obnoxious, with some exceptions and I've seen plenty of those exceptions in the circles I used to be in . My statement was that you can't extrapolate alcohol being the cause of truly violent people any more than you can extrapolate pot causing the people in my original post to be stone cold killers. As one who has abused both as much as anyone can abuse them and still be alive to tell about it (in the long distant past), I've never had a violent bone in my body.

          The vast majority of drinkers, like smokers, are social drinkers and never have any sort of bad behavior or consequences that occur due to drinking alcohol. Those that we come across with over the top behavior are most often alcoholics, who have a very high tolerance and drink massive amounts. The amount of alcohol that an alcoholic drinks would put a social drinker to bed for the night.

          Since pot isn't an addicting substance as alcohol is, it's rare to find people who "smoke their brains out" but it's not rare to find an alcoholic who has long passed the point of self control of any sort. Since alcohol is noted for reducing inhibitions, people who are prone to violence to start with will be more prone to violence while drinking.
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  • Profile picture of the author bizgrower
    Yes, one must be 21 to buy in Colorado. There are
    penalties for supplying minors.

    There have been some unintended consequences
    cases of kids eating marijuana snacks because
    they thought they were just snacks. There will
    be some voluntary labeling standards.

    Another thing they are working on is dosing ie.,
    how much can you put in a cookie batter...?


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    • Profile picture of the author serryjw
      I think standardizing it would be a good idea even for adults. There will be more control over limiting exposure to kids NOW than before it was legal.
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  • Profile picture of the author DWaters
    In my opinion the more that pot becomes legal and decrimialized the better for society in many ways. Obviously the crime rate will immediately go down and violent crime in particular will decrease. Of course that stats in the article are from a short sample. The DEA can start pursuing harmful drugs, not pot. The tax payers money will not be wasted (I expect the politicians will then have to find other ways to waste it) and the states could make money by coillecting taxes just like they do with alcohol. It is such a obvious win-win situation that I expect only people who have never smoked pot will think it is a bad idea. The fact that pot has been illegal makes people automatically think it must be bad. They equate illegal with bad. Remember - it was once illegal for women to vote and doctors promoted cigarettes. We have come a long way but we still have a ways to go.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mikaedi
      Originally Posted by DWaters View Post

      In my opinion the more that pot becomes legal and decrimialized the better for society in many ways. Obviously the crime rate will immediately go down and violent crime in particular will decrease. Of course that stats in the article are from a short sample. The DEA can start pursuing harmful drugs, not pot. The tax payers money will not be wasted (I expect the politicians will then have to find other ways to waste it) and the states could make money by coillecting taxes just like they do with alcohol. It is such a obvious win-win situation that I expect only people who have never smoked pot will think it is a bad idea. The fact that pot has been illegal makes people automatically think it must be bad. They equate illegal with bad. Remember - it was once illegal for women to vote and doctors promoted cigarettes. We have come a long way but we still have a ways to go.
      @DWaters, no offense but you make the same arguments as all those that support dopes legalization! to say society will be better is a joke, that the crime rate will go down is hilarious.

      In truth its all a backward step like a lot of things now-days that have been legalized as a part of progress..in my own country laws have been changed that is widely accepted by many, but I question whether it's for society's benefit..more so pandering to liberal mindset of anything goes.
      Booze is rampant and destructive in many western society! with laws passed lowering drinking age making it more widely available for them.

      What gets me is the pro doper think only of themselves and their own needs rather than the younger ones that look up to them as an example to follow..progress, progress, progress yeah right.

      I had an incident that I'll never forget when my kids were younger..our capital city of my country is Wellington! we have an awesome park for young kids that's really popular and I had taken my two daughter there for the day..lots of stuff to do..right next door to the children's park was a demonstration by a group call NORMAL a pro pot organization
      Approaching this group and finding the organizer angry they had their protest next to a children's park..

      This dope protest numbering about 100, many openly smoking their pot next door to the park..I along with others were forced to leave the park because of the utter selfishness of these people..

      That said I totally appose all forms of making it legal.
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  • Profile picture of the author Ron Lafuddy
    All this talk about drugs and no music?
    Just doesn't seem right.

    Here's an old favorite, from a bygone era.

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