Pre-empt before benefits?

9 years ago

Well... Sales is kind of like a job interview, over and over again (in my experience)... Why would I care to bring up my bad points? for them to leverage that into the next company? I would much rather sell them on WHY they should do business with me as opposed to giving them reasons not to.

Sounds wishy-washy.

Thanks

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9654785].message }}

socialentry

9 years ago

Well, he didn`t really expend on this. The way I interpreted it was that he just pre-empted the likely objections that might come up first before going into the main body of the pitch.

Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9654804].message }}

kirbymarketingconcierge

9 years ago

Originally Posted by socialentry

Well, he didn`t really expend on this. The way I interpreted it was that he just pre-empted the likely objections that might come up first before going into the main body of the pitch.

My initial response is, the old debates

bring price/cost up 1st or not
objection prevention or response after they state an objection

sales is real time responses or marketing is setting up a sale

yes. splitting hairs - do what you want, the biz. is out there, enough money to do your own thing

what do you think about the split from sales and marketing?

it was a split in my experience - I saw a sales department, then a new "marketing dept" in business

sales IS marketing, marketing IS sales - or are we "specializing"

[ 1 ] Thanks
2 replies

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9654887].message }}

ewenmack

9 years ago

Originally Posted by kirbymarketingconcierge

sales IS marketing, marketing IS sales -

I see them as very different.

One is what you do to attract the very best buyers to you,
ready to buy, using automation.

The other is manual labor where there is no automation.

Best,
Doctor E. Vile

[ 1 ] Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9655242].message }}

kirbymarketingconcierge

9 years ago

Originally Posted by ewenmack

I see them as very different.

One is what you do to attract the very best buyers to you,
ready to buy, using automation.

The other is manual labor where there is no automation.

Best,
Doctor E. Vile

awesome Ewen (in a good way)

I feel insulted.

I'm just a grunt. doing the work I was breed to do.

I wish I had the sophistimication (can't even spell it) to be a "consultant", "marketing expert", or a "guru"

so what is Sales and Marketing combined?

like psychology and neuroscience is Neuropsychology
evolutionary biology
mechanical engineering

Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9655852].message }}

savidge4 9 years ago

pre empting as I practice it, is Defining. as in defining what it is I do. I don't ever I say I don't, but firmly plant what I do.

So I am very much in the camp of Pre-Empt, Pitch, and Close
- Thanks
Signature

Success is an ACT not an idea
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9656316].message }}

Claude Whitacre

9 years ago

Originally Posted by kirbymarketingconcierge

sales IS marketing, marketing IS sales - or are we "specializing"

I have to agree with Ewen "Doctor Evil".

Marketing is everything you do, without directly pitching in person. Your sales funnel, your advertising, positioning, posting, publicity, branding, everything. Maybe selling is even part of marketing, I don't know. To me, marketing is everything.

Selling is being in front of a person, after all the marketing is done.

You can make money just marketing (Online and mail order companies) And I made lots of money just selling. But my sales income took a huge leap upward when I started incorporating marketing before every sales call.

And like Ewen said, you can automate your marketing, but your selling is going to be manual labor. You can structure your selling, create scripts, use patterns,...but you still have to say something to a living prospect.

[ 1 ] Thanks
2 replies

Signature

One Call Closing book https://www.amazon.com/One-Call-Clos...=1527788418&sr

What if they're not stars? What if they are holes poked in the top of a container so we can breath?

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9657116].message }}

savidge4

9 years ago

So basically marketing is "Pre Selling" and the sale is just that, the sale.

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

I have to agree with Ewen "Doctor Evil".

Marketing is everything you do, without directly pitching in person. Your sales funnel, your advertising, positioning, posting, publicity, branding, everything. Maybe selling is even part of marketing, I don't know. To me, marketing is everything.

Selling is being in front of a person, after all the marketing is done.

You can make money just marketing (Online and mail order companies) And I made lots of money just selling. But my sales income took a huge leap upward when I started incorporating marketing before every sales call.

And like Ewen said, you can automate your marketing, but your selling is going to be manual labor. You can structure your selling, create scripts, use patterns,...but you still have to say something to a living prospect.

[ 1 ] Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Success is an ACT not an idea

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9657152].message }}

Claude Whitacre

9 years ago

Originally Posted by savidge4

So basically marketing is "Pre Selling" and the sale is just that, the sale.

Yup. Although there are sales methods in good marketing (sales letters for example). And great selling contains marketing ideas (fear of loss, social proof, scarcity, proof)...

Again, you can get a customer with just marketing. But I always think of selling as what you do when speaking to a prospect.

And, if you never speak to them verbally, and just using e-mail? I still think of that as marketing. Maybe because it isn't instant, and it can be done by someone other than you.

To me, selling is interaction on a personal level.

But you know what? It's just a thought. If a different idea works better? I'm all for it.

Thanks
2 replies

Signature

One Call Closing book https://www.amazon.com/One-Call-Clos...=1527788418&sr

What if they're not stars? What if they are holes poked in the top of a container so we can breath?

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9657329].message }}

kirbymarketingconcierge

9 years ago

Is a sales book, marketing or sales?

Is a marketing book, sales???

If I tell a prospect I'm not a salesmen, but a marketer, is the response different.

I wonder.

I don't intend to argue, just here different sides of a debate.

Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9657700].message }}

ewenmack

9 years ago

Originally Posted by kirbymarketingconcierge

Is a sales book, marketing or sales?

Is a marketing book, sales???

If I tell a prospect I'm not a salesmen, but a marketer, is the response different.

I wonder.

I don't intend to argue, just here different sides of a debate.

I've seen split test results where a sales rep was compared to a customer rep.

The customer rep won.

It was for a follow up when people abandoned
the shopping cart.

In restaurants where the chef or owner makes a recommendation,
order sizes increased compared to the waiting staff.

One can conclude in these cases, the buyers feel they have been hped more so.

Best,
Doctor E. Vile

Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9657747].message }}

kirbymarketingconcierge

9 years ago

Originally Posted by ewenmack

I've seen split test results where a sales rep was compared to a customer rep.

The customer rep won.

It was for a follow up when people abandoned
the shopping cart.

In restaurants where the chef or owner makes a recommendation,
order sizes increased compared to the waiting staff.

One can conclude in these cases, the buyers feel they have been hped more so.

Best,
Doctor E. Vile

ever here the story:

a fortune 2000 company. 1 of 3 major players in their sector, but ranked #3 and customers leaving in droves.

the CEO went to the sales department and told every rep. not to sell, but to call

each of their clients and just ask a series of questions (survey questionaire to understand that business).

the next QTR, they had the best sales ever!

Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9657756].message }}

savidge4

9 years ago

Originally Posted by kirbymarketingconcierge

ever here the story:

a fortune 2000 company. 1 of 3 major players in their sector, but ranked #3 and customers leaving in droves.

the CEO went to the sales department and told every rep. not to sell, but to call

each of their clients and just ask a series of questions (survey questionaire to understand that business).

the next QTR, they had the best sales ever!

I have something to admit. I am TERRIBLE at sales. However, I am... I like to think... better than average at Marketing.

Marketing as I see and use it, is reaching out and touching that prospect with your message, your knowledge, your understanding of their situation. Marketing in all of its forms is the trust building portion in the "Sales" process.

It doesn't matter if it is a mailer, a tweet, a blog post, or even a face to face conversation. Marketing is trust and relationship building.

Branding as an example is without question marketing. The process of branding is to aquire "Brand Recognition" which directly translates to Brand Trust. People BUY from brands they trust.

For the most part I don't sell a damn thing, My prospects know what I do, and know how to get ahold of me. I generally don't have to "Sell" my services, because they Trust my services are a fit. There is, on the flip side of that A LOT of marketing that takes place.

A MAJOR part of my working with primarily LOCAL clients is simply the fact they are easy for me to "Touch". I think Claude and I see this some what the same way. Communication is not just words, it is the body language. The look in some ones face speaks volumes to how on or off target your approach is.

You can SEE it far before you may hear it, that you have gone off base with your pitch.

God bless those of you that do phone sales... You simply must be more in tune with the tone of voice or something, because I am lost.

Ironically I am the first one NOT to use a text or e-mail to communicate and will pick up the phone.

but back to the topic. I think Marketing by itself can and does induce sales. but the reverse... I think is impossible.

Thanks

Signature

Success is an ACT not an idea

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9658316].message }}

savidge4

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

Yup. Although there are sales methods in good marketing (sales letters for example). And great selling contains marketing ideas (fear of loss, social proof, scarcity, proof)...

Again, you can get a customer with just marketing. But I always think of selling as what you do when speaking to a prospect.

And, if you never speak to them verbally, and just using e-mail? I still think of that as marketing. Maybe because it isn't instant, and it can be done by someone other than you.

To me, selling is interaction on a personal level.

But you know what? It's just a thought. If a different idea works better? I'm all for it.

I totally get what you are saying. BUT I make a living selling without a single word spoken. I build web sites that are designed and built to do one thing and one thing only. and that's sell. Be it a product, a service, or selling the prospect on the idea to call a number or walk into a door.

On my end, the action of the purchase, or the action of the physical connection ( phone, in the door, or e-mail I guess ) is a Sale. Or a better term I guess would be a "conversion".

The online process is 99.9% marketing, and that little .1%... clicking the "Buy Now" button, or clicking the "Call Now" button or clicking the "Get Directions" button.

The online marketing effort starts with that initial contact. be it a search engine, or social media or that PPC link off on the right of a Google search. Providing a relevant piece of content to match the newly found prospects wishes, wants, desires, or needs.

Once you have them within the wide graps of entry points you draw that prospect through a channel of further information and detail. You offer choice and definition to their request... you feel their pain and have the answer.... Click here and all your problems will dissolve away.

That whole process funneled to that one simple action. "click"

When I sit back and look at this for a second... "click" is such a let down. Why doesn't a mouse button make a "BOOOOOM" sound or something! haha

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

Success is an ACT not an idea

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9658331].message }}

Claude Whitacre

9 years ago

Originally Posted by savidge4

I totally get what you are saying. BUT I make a living selling without a single word spoken. I build web sites that are designed and built to do one thing and one thing only. and that's sell. Be it a product, a service, or selling the prospect on the idea to call a number or walk into a door.

On my end, the action of the purchase, or the action of the physical connection ( phone, in the door, or e-mail I guess ) is a Sale. Or a better term I guess would be a "conversion".

The online process is 99.9% marketing, and that little .1%... clicking the "Buy Now" button, or clicking the "Call Now" button or clicking the "Get Directions" button.

The online marketing effort starts with that initial contact. be it a search engine, or social media or that PPC link off on the right of a Google search. Providing a relevant piece of content to match the newly found prospects wishes, wants, desires, or needs.

Once you have them within the wide graps of entry points you draw that prospect through a channel of further information and detail. You offer choice and definition to their request... you feel their pain and have the answer.... Click here and all your problems will dissolve away.

That whole process funneled to that one simple action. "click"

When I sit back and look at this for a second... "click" is such a let down. Why doesn't a mouse button make a "BOOOOOM" sound or something! haha

Your system is marketing, through and through. Like I said before, you can make sales with just marketing, and no selling.

And if you are successful at marketing, you already know how sales works, and would probably be good at it. You might not want to do it, you may not enjoy it...but you would probably be good at it.

Everyone says that they would be terrible at sales. It's similar to saying "I'm too honest to be in sales"..or "I'm not pushy enough to be in sales".

Selling is just clear communication, with a purpose. And you can obviously do that. That's what you are doing now. You just aren't doing it in front of a prospect, in person.

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

One Call Closing book https://www.amazon.com/One-Call-Clos...=1527788418&sr

What if they're not stars? What if they are holes poked in the top of a container so we can breath?

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9659198].message }}

kirbymarketingconcierge 9 years ago

from Threadstarter, Socialentry:

What do you guys think?Did you ever give it any thoughts or do you believe it is splitting hairs?

it's better to bring the bad points of your company up front, so that the strong points resonates better afterward.

do what you want. you work hard, and ask for the money you can bark like a dog and people will buy.

looking at the most recent posts.

not "hair splits" when your specializing, like "marketing", and "getting into the weeds"

making a destinction from bias or I am better than you, IMO, is splitting hairs.

As if 1 is better than the other or essentially different.

If I hire a sales robot, fully automated is it sales or marketing??? Both!

The old battle of sales dept. vs. marketing dept. is what I see.
- [ 1 ] Thanks
{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9659326].message }}

ewenmack

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

I have to agree with Ewen "Doctor Evil".

Claude, could you kindly put a dot after E. then have a space
between the e and v followed by an e at the end so it becomes
E. Vile.

Thank you kind sir.

Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9659653].message }}

Claude Whitacre

9 years ago

Originally Posted by ewenmack

Claudius, could you kindly put a dot after E. then have a space
between the e and v followed by an e at the end so it becomes
E. Vile.

Thank you kind sir.

Doctor E. Vile;

Would you kindly not call me Claudius? Please take off the "ious", and replace it with an E...or whatever the most expensive letter of the alphabet is. Thank you kind sir.

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

One Call Closing book https://www.amazon.com/One-Call-Clos...=1527788418&sr

What if they're not stars? What if they are holes poked in the top of a container so we can breath?

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9659849].message }}

ewenmack

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

Doctor E. Vile;

Would you kindly not call me Claudius? Please take off the "ious", and replace it with an E...or whatever the most expensive letter of the alphabet is. Thank you kind sir.

I will if you will!

Now watch the correct way it's spelt...

Best,
Doctor E. Vile

[ 1 ] Thanks

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9659876].message }}

socialentry

9 years ago

objection prevention or response after they state an objection

I`m pretty much on the prevention side.

I`m just asking myself which is better:
Pitch
Pre-empt
close

or

Pre-empt
Pitch
Close.

or if i'm overthinking it.

The exact quote is: "Tell your prospective client what your weak points are, before he notices them. This will make you more credible when you boast about your strong points."

Thanks
2 replies

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9654911].message }}

kirbymarketingconcierge

9 years ago

Originally Posted by socialentry

I`m pretty much on the prevention side.

I`m just asking myself which is better:
Pitch
Pre-empt
close

or

Pre-empt
Pitch
Close.

or if i'm overthinking it.

I agree. and thanks for this thread I hope it continues with quality replys

prevention is better for me. it seems easier too

what feels right for You???

I always go back to "we sell the way we like to buy"
we sell to "niches were passionate about, have experience in, and like"

your not over thinking it, this is what we do everyday

[ 1 ] Thanks

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9654913].message }}

Claude Whitacre

9 years ago

Originally Posted by socialentry

I`m pretty much on the prevention side.

I`m just asking myself which is better:
Pitch
Pre-empt
close

or

Pre-empt
Pitch
Close.

or if i'm overthinking it.

The exact quote is: "Tell your prospective client what your weak points are, before he notices them. This will make you more credible when you boast about your strong points."

Pre-empt, pitch, close. Always tell your limitations up front. Why? Because then the entire time you are presenting, they lose importance.

The first thing I say when presenting is any negative in my service or product. I say it matter of factly, and ask if it's a real problem. It almost never is.

Just don't apologize for it. State it, and verify that it's not a deal breaker.

For example, when I was selling a vacuum cleaner that was very heavy, I wold take it out of the box and say, "The only problem we ever run into...is that the machine is too heavy for some people. Here, can you lift this easily?"

If I don't bring it up....they will. And it's far far better that I bring it up. Because if they bring it up, now you are in "answering objections" mode. And it's a very hard fight to win.

Bringing up your bad points, in a matter of fact manner shows strength and confidence in your positioning.

[ 3 ] Thanks

Signature

One Call Closing book https://www.amazon.com/One-Call-Clos...=1527788418&sr

What if they're not stars? What if they are holes poked in the top of a container so we can breath?

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9655205].message }}

Rus Sells

9 years ago

First, lets get our semantics correct.

We're really talking about "selling" not sales.

It's cerebral, intuitive, psychological, intimate, helpful, etc.

Good selling NEVER appears as selling to begin with that's the bar guys.

Thanks

Signature

Review Sentry

Dotcomcodex

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9659490].message }}

donpurdum

9 years ago

Yes, marketing is a form of pre-selling. In fact, I will take it another step and say that if you do your marketing right, sales will be fairly easy. That doesn't mean you will close every deal. A lot of factors can go into that.

Here is why I say that.

In reality, marketing is about building competency and then solving a problem or meeting a need. People are not going to buy you if you do not demonstrate that you can solve their problem. Many assertions are that people buy from relationships. That's not true in my opinion in the beginning.

You build relationships after the sale. In the meantime they are buying you because you can deliver, i.e. you're competent. If you stop being competent, the relationship you develop will sour and end the business relationship almost 99% of the time.

Marketing done right sets the stage for sales. I just wrote a recent article titled "Businesses Succeed and Fail Based on Their Marketing - You Can SUCCEED!" and I explain how many people in sales continue to market in the sales cycle. This creates confusion and doubt on behalf of the prospect and normally results in a lost sale.

If you're marketing was well done before the actual meeting or call, then you're not there to convince anymore. You're their to allow them to buy. They've generally been persuaded. Now, it's just a matter of specifically listening and educating them on how you can solve their specific problem or meet their need.

In many ways, ad agencies over the years have confused and blended the differences between marketing and sales.

Thanks
1 reply

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9659902].message }}

Claude Whitacre

9 years ago

Has anyone else noticed how socially unacceptable it is to say that you are good at selling?

Every upwardly mobile person that I meet that I tell I'm in sales, says "I'm no good at selling" or "I could never be in sales"....and it's usually followed with "I'm not pushy enough" or "I could never be a good salesperson, I'm just too honest".

They wear this inability as a badge of honor.

The higher up they are socially, the more often they deny that they could ever sell. It's got a real social stigma to it.

And of course, many of them are excellent salespeople. But they will do anything to not call it selling.

Thanks
1 reply

Signature

One Call Closing book https://www.amazon.com/One-Call-Clos...=1527788418&sr

What if they're not stars? What if they are holes poked in the top of a container so we can breath?

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9659970].message }}

kirbymarketingconcierge

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

Has anyone else noticed how socially unacceptable it is to say that you are good at selling?

Every upwardly mobile person that I meet that I tell I'm in sales, says "I'm no good at selling" or "I could never be in sales"....and it's usually followed with "I'm not pushy enough" or "I could never be a good salesperson, I'm just too honest".

They wear this inability as a badge of honor.

The higher up they are socially, the more often they deny that they could ever sell. It's got a real social stigma to it.

And of course, many of them are excellent salespeople. But they will do anything to not call it selling.

yes. I am very aware of it.

but since this thread - I am thinking of saying I'm a pre-emptive,

"pre-mature, master debator" of marketing

Thanks

{{ DiscussionBoard.errors[9660078].message }}

Pre-empt before benefits?

Trending Topics

Looking at the average screen time and socmed usage

What's the Best IM-Related Skill to Learn Today That Can Help in the Future?

Would You Go?

Any good link monetization services?

Are billboards still effective in driving customers?