Sales Strategy, which is better?

9 years ago

Originally Posted by socialedu

Which is a better sales strategy?

I have been doing option #1 so far. It has been working okay but I find that it can get tense as I"m asking someone to change mental states from working to buying my product. So I'm wondering if it would be better if I do more prospecting and to make the client realize that they need my product without me telling them.

I have zero sales experience. So any advice is greatly appreciated.

You have answered your own question

Keep doing what is working. In fact, do more of it.

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socialedu

9 years ago

Thanks for the response, I really appreciate it. Door to door is fine but it's not so efficient for me right now, especially if I don't do hours worth of prospecting.

I'm just trying to ways to optimize my approach. I guess there is no harm in trying. So I'm going to get on the phone and try it out...we'll see what happens. I just wonder if I"m over complicating it by doing a survey in the beginning. It might make sense to just pick up the phone and say "hey I have something to sell you.." I guess i"ll find out for sure this week.

Thanks
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John Durham

9 years ago

Originally Posted by socialedu

Thanks for the response, I really appreciate it. Door to door is fine but it's not so efficient for me right now, especially if I don't do hours worth of prospecting.

.

Just an idea.

Create a high paying commission opportunity for sales people and affiliates to be able to make a thousand dollars per sale.
Give the opportunity to hundreds of people via a large scale online recruiting campaign
Train them online to sell, via a forum or the like, once you have proven that your selling process works.
Watch a dozen of them go out making sales every week. Rinse lather and repeat.

I don't know if your cost model will allow you to pay anyone a thousand dollar commission, but if it did, then that's what I would do.

In order for this to work, it is important to understand that you need to give the opportunity to 100 people for every one or two that you expect to go out and actually work hard at selling.

If door to door works, then you should systemize your door to door selling process into a training course for everyone you give the opportunity to, and provide some kind of forum to support them.

Don't worry about the ones who don't take hold of the opportunity. There is going to be a lot of fodder, that is just the nature of it.

It's a numbers game. Give the opportunity to enough people, in the most efficient way possible, in order to turn out a few people who make you 2-6 grand per week apiece.

Now you don't have to be out selling every day, just managing your sales people in an online forum.

Hope this helps. Just helping you generate some ideas here.

-JD

Ps. Another thing you can do is hire a professional sales manager, have him create the training program and figure out a killer sales process that works, as well as do all the recruiting...and give him 500 bucks for every sale his organization makes.

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tryinhere

9 years ago

Originally Posted by John Durham

In order for this to work, it is important to understand that you need to give the opportunity to 100 people for every one or two that you expect to go out and actually work hard at selling.

If door to door works, then you should systemize your door to door selling process into a training course for everyone you give the opportunity to, and provide some kind of forum to support them.

Don't worry about the ones who don't take hold of the opportunity. There is going to be a lot of fodder, that is just the nature of it.
-JD
.

Been in this for a long time / many moons and I have never heard of let alone imagine running a large force over the internet on a forum or the like.

Maybe some hilly billy wanna be might run like that but I think I could count on less than one finger any professional company that use or run like that alone (maybe in a small support way only).

Also the first part you say to get it to work, just pile in 100 wanna be sales people ? that is very wrong thinking in todays world if you stop and think about it, what professional company would just grab hundreds of drop kicks with out vetting them in at least some form. But any way after saying to get it to work, you follow with if it works ? does it work or not are are we second guessing it might work ?

You would think to get it work above a hope and prayer that training would be a primary concern not a secondary one.

Lastly the concept of rack em and pack em and treat them like cannon fodder is very much outdated, all of the stuff you mention may work in a telemarketing environment, put placing that in a real world environment would almost if not certainly see it fail before you start.

or just maybe I am getting to old / and John is in some way right and thats just my 2c on it.

Thanks
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John Durham

9 years ago

Originally Posted by tryinhere

Been in this for a long time / many moons and I have never heard of let alone imagine running a large force over the internet on a forum or the like.

Maybe some hilly billy wanna be might run like that but I think I could count on less than one finger any professional company that use or run like that alone (maybe in a small support way only).

Also the first part you say to get it to work, just pile in 100 wanna be sales people ? that is very wrong thinking in todays world if you stop and think about it, what professional company would just grab hundreds of drop kicks with out vetting them in at least some form. But any way after saying to get it to work, you follow with if it works ? does it work or not are are we second guessing it might work ?

You would think to get it work above a hope and prayer that training would be a primary concern not a secondary one.

Lastly the concept of rack em and pack em and treat them like cannon fodder is very much outdated, all of the stuff you mention may work in a telemarketing environment, put placing that in a real world environment would almost if not certainly see it fail before you start.

or just maybe I am getting to old / and John is in some way right and thats just my 2c on it.

In all of those many moons, you have never heard of an affiliate program?

Has the definition changed?

Do people not make a living with them anymore, and Im just not aware?

Has the idea of starting one become outlandish, out dated, and unworkable?

An affiliate program is a program whereby you own a product, and you get others to sell it for you and pay them a commission, right?

Also there are both high and low ticket affiliate programs out there, right?

Also most affiliates are recruited online, right?

Affiliate programs often sell things like mobile apps, right?

An "Affiliate" program is just another name for an online commission based sales force, right?

Most affiliate programs don't vet people for professionalism, or inte4rview them face to face, they rather "funnel" them from large scale online advertising campaigns, and hire them online, right?

Many large affiliate programs are run by professionals, right?

Many of them come from places like California and aren't considered hillbillies. right?

Most affiliate programs don't fly you into their office and pay your hotel for a month of live, face to face training , right?

Most of them train you online via membership sites and support forums , right?

Usually out of 100 people who sign up for an affiliate program only about three percent of the people who sign up actually sell consistently, or significantly, right?

The idea of online sales training is outlandish?

A lot of people land six figure jobs from college DEGREEs that they got online these days, right?

So the idea that professionals cant be trained online can't be correct , right?

The 80/20 rule is outdated? I agree, it's more like the 97/3 rule nowadays.

Rack em and pack em as you call it (a term which I have never heard used before) seems to be your own interpretation of what Im calling the law of large numbers...or what MOST people call it, and it seems to work across the board, not just in telemarketing environments, right?

I have taken your advice and thought about it as you suggested, and I very HONESTLY cant find a single point you have made that is valid.

On an entirely different note I have HAD an offline Affiliate Force before, like the one I described, and it does work exactly as I have laid this out.

To end this post;

Unless you know something about affiliate programs that I don't know, then maybe in this case some really wild possibility came in, and in fact John Durham does know something that you don't. In fact ALOT of people know it, so I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt and choose to believe that you simply don't understand what concept Im talking about, and try to be more concise;

What Im talking about , or "describing" is an "offline affiliate program", "if you think about it".

Now I will hand "it" back to you...

Can you make a valid point, or informed and intelligent argument to show a good reason why you would think the plan I presented is unworkable? Because, so far, none of your points are even CLOSE to valid, as I understand them.

Now,

If you had said that you think it's a pretty bold idea for an average thinker to grasp, then I might agree with you.

-JD

Originally Posted by tryinhere

But any way after saying to get it to work, you follow with if it works ? does it work or not are are we second guessing it might work ?

I guess Im confused, even though your sentence here made perfect grammatical sense....but what I think I said was:

Originally Posted by John Durham

Train them online to sell, via a forum or the like, once you have proven that your selling process works.

"Quote" me if I'm wrong, but I think that is what I said.

Should I have advised that he train them BEFORE he had made sure his selling process worked?

Im confused about what you are disagreeing with here, and for the record I don't know where I mentioned anything about training being "secondary" as you put it. One could reread my post to make sure, but I don't think I even implied that anywhere in it.

Cheers.

I think you are going to have to really stretch to validate anything you said, but don't worry, Im not looking for it. I just wanted to help the guy with a solid time proven idea.

Do you need me to list 100 quotes from people who have learned to sell websites and mobile solutions to offline business owners after having been trained in a report, or forum online?

That can be arranged.

-JD

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tryinhere

9 years ago

Originally Posted by socialedu

4th - 12th continue selling.

I am sure there is a little more to it than one simple answer but rather a combination of tweaks to get things right, so slightly adjusting then reviewing what works and what does not will lead to the a better way. Just try not to change 100 things at once but rather keep things simple and change one or two if that things and monitor then if it works improve it and make another small change or if not back track and start again.

In regards that quote above, that worries me, if people are thinking they need to push a sale per sale for steps 4 to 12 that is just swimming against the tide and possibly frustrating and wasting everybody's time if that really is happening.

Rather than try and force a sale it would be better if people came to you wanting to buy the product, so go back to your presentation and look at how that can be improved, look at the initial first call back and look at the getting involved structure etc, work a lot more on those angles trying to work those out and put your energy there rather than trying to drag people over hot coals.

Talk to those you prospect and try and understand where their concerns are, and what hurdles are in the way, if you go about this right people will talk with you and give good and honest feedback and from that feedback, reset and reload.

The end result should be people asking you how soon can they get involved / coming to you with a few more questions etc where you can close them. chasing people time and time again and not understanding why they are running is wasting everybody time and money.

Thanks

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tryinhere

9 years ago

Can you make a valid point, or informed and intelligent argument to show a good reason why you would think the plan I presented is unworkable? Because, so far, none of your points are even CLOSE to valid, as I understand them.

Not even going to bother trying to get to the bottom of your reply, it seems we are on different boats, you seem to be more talking affiliate sales and not a boots on ground workforce and i did say "and John is in some way right". I thought the forum was about having a voice and view point seems your more all about attack over discussion so hope you Have a good day.

The informed or Valid point to this that I might add is I have built many state and national sales forces for companies, and am in the process of building another national sales force, so all I have is years of real world real time experience and am doing what I talk about, that said I accept that what your describing it now seems to be different than I first read it. So thats my error. Again enjoy your day and good luck with your methods moving forward I am sure they work well for you.

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John Durham

9 years ago

Originally Posted by tryinhere

Not even going to bother trying to get to the bottom of your reply, it seems we are on different boats, you seem to be more talking affiliate sales and not a boots on ground workforce and i did say "and John is in some way right". I thought the forum was about having a voice and view point seems your more all about attack over discussion so hope you Have a good day.

The informed or Valid point to this that I might add is I have built many state and national sales forces for companies, and am in the process of building another national sales force, so all I have is years of real world real time experience and am doing what I talk about, that said I accept that what your describing it now seems to be different than I first read it. So thats my error. Again enjoy your day and good luck with your methods moving forward I am sure they work well for you.

Thank you, if you look back at your first response to me, which I have quoted, you will see that your choices of words regarding the idea I was offering were quite inflammatory, and clearly not well intending... so, it's understandable why I came back so strongly.

Originally Posted by tryinhere

Been in this for a long time / many moons and I have never heard of let alone imagine running a large force over the internet on a forum or the like.

Maybe some hilly billy wanna be might run like that but I think I could count on less than one finger any professional company that use or run like that alone (maybe in a small support way only).

Also the first part you say to get it to work, just pile in 100 wanna be sales people ? that is very wrong thinking in todays world if you stop and think about it, what professional company would just grab hundreds of drop kicks with out vetting them in at least some form. But any way after saying to get it to work, you follow with if it works ? does it work or not are are we second guessing it might work ?

You would think to get it work above a hope and prayer that training would be a primary concern not a secondary one.

Lastly the concept of rack em and pack em and treat them like cannon fodder is very much outdated, all of the stuff you mention may work in a telemarketing environment, put placing that in a real world environment would almost if not certainly see it fail before you start.

or just maybe I am getting to old / and John is in some way right and thats just my 2c on it.

However; understandable or not..., I shouldn't have responded at all.

For what it's worth, we are NOT on different pages, I AM talking about a "boots on the ground" affiliate organization; simply one that is recruited, trained and managed online. Unless walking door to door can somehow be done online "in this day and age":

Originally Posted by John Durham

If door to door works, then you should systemize your door to door selling process into a training course for everyone you give the opportunity to, and provide some kind of forum to support them.

Originally Posted by John durham

On an entirely different note I have HAD an offline Affiliate Force before, like the one I described, and it does work exactly as I have laid this out.

In any event, further debating isn't worth it. You are right.

-JD

Thanks

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Oziboomer

9 years ago

Option 1 or Option 2...test both.

You can always outsource or automate some of Option 2.

If door to door is working I would start employing someone via a small retainer and high commission arrangement much like what John is talking about.

It doesn't matter whether it is teams of people you train or small satellites of key sales people who have second tier affiliates working under them.

Scaling up is the key as technology and apps have a habit of getting old fast so if it is a saleable and profitable project you need to get going with expansion fast.

You could always have an option 2 type system that you run as a warming up campaign for the door to door sales team.

Anyone the door to door guys see as prospects but don't buy instantly put in a follow sequence.

Good on you for doing the walk in work as that will help you get the process right before you bring in others.

Best of luck.

Thanks

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Claude Whitacre

9 years ago

Originally Posted by socialedu

Option #1:
Go door to door and demo the app in under 60 seconds. See if prospect is interested. Leave information. Follow up. (this is what I have been doing).

Not even close, do #1. Your flaw isn't that you are doing te wrong thing. Your flaw is that you aren't pitching them right there. Ask a few questions to make sure they are the right people to talk to, and then pitch. If you need to make an appointment, do it. But usually, they can sit down (except at lunch or diner time). If they aren't excited at the end of your demo, they won't be excited later. And if they are excited, they will be less excited later.
.

Originally Posted by socialedu

I have been doing option #1 so far. It has been working okay but I find that it can get tense as I"m asking someone to change mental states from working to buying my product. So I'm wondering if it would be better if I do more prospecting and to make the client realize that they need my product without me telling them.

I have zero sales experience. So any advice is greatly appreciated.

You're under an illusion that you need to change mental states. Nobody is ever going to be in a more receptive mental state. There is no "Buying" mental state. The process of demonstrating snaps them out of what they are doing.
At the beginning of every presentation, the prospect isn't interested in your offer. In fact, they have taken a silent vow, not to buy. That doesn't change because you made an appointment. You need to snap them out of that. A great quick demonstration might do it. But once they are excited, don't leave. Why make them wait?

That's what you are doing, by making appointments...you are making them wait.

The only reason there are appointments at all, is when you call them on the phone (or e-mail) and you aren't in front of them. But you are already in front of them.

If someone came into my store and wanted to make an appointment, I would instantly think they didn't know what they were doing. I fact, I would say, "You want to make me go through this again? Tell me now".

And..the problem with restaurants, is they can't tell you when they won't be busy...in the future. So, do it now. grab their interest, or move on. If you want to get their e-mail...to keep in touch, go ahead. You'll get some results. But it will weaken you. You'll think you did something if you got their e-mail, and you didn't do anything.

If they ask you to come back, because they are truly interested, but you caught them when they are busy, that's one thing...make the appointment. But if you go in there, with the purpose of returning later? You are wasting their time, and yours.

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Oziboomer

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Claude Whitacre

If someone came into my store and wanted to make an appointment, I would instantly think they didn't know what they were doing. I fact, I would say, "You want to make me go through this again? Tell me now".

You are wasting their time, and yours.

This is so true...

I often get sales reps calling up to make appointments and in many cases I don't even do any business with their companies.

People who show up and catch you...if somewhat unawares...have a distinct advantage.

You somehow feel obligated to listen because.

1. They took a risk.
2. You may learn something.
3. You've got a minute right now.

The observation of coming back later rings true with me because if I've said "come back later" it only means one...or both...of two things....

"I'm broke and I can't buy what you are going to show me today."

or....

"I really don't want what you've got no matter how good you say it is"

Demos are good because they get engagement.

Get me engaged...

...and

...Show me REAL value instantly...like in 30 - 60 seconds...

...pitch now...

you've got a chance.

Thanks
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socialedu

9 years ago

Thanks everyone for the feedback. Every post was very helpful.

First, I'm not going into the restaurant and asking for an appointment. I may have said that it would be part of my new strategy but that really doesn't make sense. Regardless of what I do i realize that I need to ask for the sale.

online marketing - this is something that I am going to do. I have experience in online marketing - paid search, banner ads, retargeting and everything else. I ran a social network for about 2 years and I got pretty good at driving traffic. But I do find it a bit harder to reach restaurant owners online.

I just built an online platform for the app. So I'm going to place a focus on inbound leads and marketing.

With that said, I have been studying sales for awhile. It's crazy. I learn one thing then when I turn the corner I realize that I have about 10 more things to learn. I believe that cold calling and telemarketing can be extremely effective for what I"m doing, I just need to refine my strategy and scale it.

I do have competition. I have done competitive intell on every competitor and they don't have the same quality, directness (i.e., the aren't cold calling) and angle as me. I have a very good angle. It's not just an app that I'm selling.

So right now I'm going to try to cold calling. I have my script ready to go and I realized that I could demo the app from the app store. I just bought my headset and I'm going to get started tomorrow.

I see more opportunity to scale cold calling. So right now I'm going to be on the phones until I figure everything out. Then I'll try to get 3 telemarketers in a room as soon as possible.

Run like any other SAAS organization and sell online. Option 1 places obvious geographical barriers. and the truth is even if you DID sell to everyone in town.. then what would the advantage be to them, they would all be on an even playing field.

One guy did say that to me when I went door to door, but I actually have a great response to that and it's part of my angle. So it doesn't hurt me.

Spend sometime and research SAAS. Read up on Growth Hacking,and spend some time reading up on how to convert those online users with CRO.

I do plan to use online marketing, mainly paid ads. But not growth hacking. Growth hacking confused the hell out of me. Cold calling and direct marketing online seemed way more direct and faster.

I have also done competitive intel on my competition. I see a lot of gaps in their marketing and sales process. Most of my competition are waiting for the leads to come to them. I'm not patient enough for that.

ou're under an illusion that you need to change mental states. Nobody is ever going to be in a more receptive mental state. There is no "Buying" mental state. The process of demonstrating snaps them out of what they are doing.
At the beginning of every presentation, the prospect isn't interested in your offer. In fact, they have taken a silent vow, not to buy. That doesn't change because you made an appointment. You need to snap them out of that. A great quick demonstration might do it. But once they are excited, don't leave. Why make them wait?

Thanks, this really gave me a lot to think about.

Thanks

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savidge4

9 years ago

Option 3?

Run like any other SAAS organization and sell online. Option 1 places obvious geographical barriers. and the truth is even if you DID sell to everyone in town.. then what would the advantage be to them, they would all be on an even playing field.

Option 2 getting closer.. kinda. I might use this method in conjuction with option 3 to start the conversion ball rolling.

I can see where John is coming from with the affiliate marketing, but I would not do that in a offline environment as much as I would in a online one.

Spend sometime and research SAAS. Read up on Growth Hacking,and spend some time reading up on how to convert those online users with CRO.

Hope that Helps!

Originally Posted by socialedu

Which is a better sales strategy?

Here's the background information
- You're selling to restaurants and bars. The easiest way to reach them is to walk straight in or call.
- The product is a mobile app with a unique selling angle.
- Product costs over $3,000 but payments are broken up into monthly or annual payments.
- Basic objections include (price, already using social media, getting people to download app, etc..) - I can deal with each objection easily

Option #1:
Go door to door and demo the app in under 60 seconds. See if prospect is interested. Leave information. Follow up. (this is what I have been doing)

Option #2:
Cold call prospects with a survey that goes through 3-4 very fast questions about how they are integrating mobile technology into their marketing strategy to increase customer retention. No attempt to sell anything on the first call. It's just a survey/introduction Follow up at least 24 hours later with a monthly research report that educates the prospect and further creates a need/urgency for them to buy. By the 3rd follow up start getting more aggressive, ask for the sale. 4th - 12th continue selling.

- Option #2 could also be applied door to door. This option is more about educating, prospect and building a relationship..but I haven't tried it yet.

I have been doing option #1 so far. It has been working okay but I find that it can get tense as I"m asking someone to change mental states from working to buying my product. So I'm wondering if it would be better if I do more prospecting and to make the client realize that they need my product without me telling them.

I have zero sales experience. So any advice is greatly appreciated.

Thanks
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Claude Whitacre

9 years ago

Originally Posted by savidge4

Option 3?

Run like any other SAAS organization and sell online. Option 1 places obvious geographical barriers. and the truth is even if you DID sell to everyone in town.. then what would the advantage be to them, they would all be on an even playing field.

I see that as a real problem if; The OP offers exclusivity, or The app is something that would detract from the other restaurants.

For example, the Sign guy, ad rep, furniture, cleaning company... has every restaurant as a client, but the restaurant clients don't expect exclusivity. If you were offering Google placement, it would be a real problem, for obvious reasons.

And yes, if the OP is wanting to grow beyond his travel area, then online marketing is the best way. And marketing online, while also directly selling, isn't a bad idea. It's what I do.

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bizgrower

9 years ago

Create a profile of the kind of restaurant and bars that will buy your app. Cold walk those types
Tuesdays through Thursdays between meal times and sell then and there as Claude suggested.
(Fridays, Saturdays, Sundays, and Mondays, IMO, the decision makers are preparing for the weekend,
or finishing up from the weekend and ordering fresh inventory... Or, closed on Mondays...)

Additionally, offer a worthwhile commission to marketing firms, website designers...
already working in that space. Perhaps offer a white label/reseller program.

Thanks

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digichik

9 years ago

Affiliate marketer (online) = Commissioned Sales person (offline). Exact same thing, except to people who hang out on the WF. Hmmm.....

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daniyal100

9 years ago

everything is easy and works but not as easy as some people think..
It gives you real money so you have to put real work into it. Just like a boy go to university for 4 years straight to get a degree then work hard to get the job and then start making some money..

If it does not require same amount of work and dedication you would not see people hanging around on different online forums all day everyday and writing long posts to gain reputation so they sell their s*** even though they already doing 50-100k every month as they claims.

Thanks
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Ron Lafuddy

9 years ago

Originally Posted by daniyal100

everything is easy and works but not as easy as some people think..
It gives you real money so you have to put real work into it. Just like a boy go to university for 4 years straight to get a degree then work hard to get the job and then start making some money..

If it does not require same amount of work and dedication you would not see people hanging around on different online forums all day everyday and writing long posts to gain reputation so they sell their s*** even though they already doing 50-100k every month as they claims.

What does your post have to do with the subject of this thread, which is:

Re: Sales Strategy, which is better?

Just curious.

Thanks
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daniyal100

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Ron Lafuddy

What does your post have to do with the subject of this thread, which is:

Re: Sales Strategy, which is better?

Just curious.

Lol, don't tell me you did not get the point?

Thanks
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Ron Lafuddy

9 years ago

Originally Posted by daniyal100

Lol, don't tell me you did not get the point?

Oh...there was a point?
I'm sorry. I had no idea.

I thought perhaps you'd posted in the wrong thread, since you seemed to be referring
to something other than the subject of this one.

Thank you for explaining, and good luck to you.

Thanks
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socialedu

9 years ago

I probably should have defined what I meant by 0 experience. I do have some experience with cold calling. Back when I had a full-time job I would go into the parking garage at my job during lunch hours and cold call people to join my websites. But I don't really consider that to be the best experience.

But I don't have sales experience like the majority of people here have. Everything that I know is based on my experiences and book that I have read. I have been doing online marketing for so long and now I want to get into offline marketing because it is the most direct way to reach my customer right now.

But the very last thing that a guy with admittedly ZERO SALES EXPERIENCE(his words) should do is hire and train a team of salespeople.

I agree 100% with this. I'm realizing that everyday I'm competing against time and myself. I need to stop bullshitting around either nail down this sales process or get someone in who can. I don't need to be great in everything if I can hire people who are better than me. Someone here, I think it was John suggested to hire a sales manager with experience to help me with my scripts and get started. That is actually a great idea.

I'd be happy to offer some recommendations on info/reading material/videos if you pm me. And I'd be happy to offer input on your script. Just pm me and we can Skype. You appear to have the ambition and courage to go pound the pavement and that's the most important trait. I don't mind rewarding that with some free advice if it'll help.

Thanks, I really appreciate the offer. I'll be busy over the next couple of days but I'll try to PM you soon.

Thanks

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CLSVentures

9 years ago

Originally Posted by socialedu

I have zero sales experience. So any advice is greatly appreciated.

Maybe I'm the only one who read this. But the very last thing that a guy with admittedly ZERO SALES EXPERIENCE(his words) should do is hire and train a team of salespeople. Save yourself the agony. You are not to that step of the journey yet.

You are on the right track: devour every piece of information from reputable, nationally recognized cold calling/TM trainers and pros. Process and harvest best practices and things that are common threads among them to flesh out a basic map or pitch ladder.
Refine based on your real-world results.

I'd be happy to offer some recommendations on info/reading material/videos if you pm me. And I'd be happy to offer input on your script. Just pm me and we can Skype. You appear to have the ambition and courage to go pound the pavement and that's the most important trait. I don't mind rewarding that with some free advice if it'll help.

Thanks

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Sales Strategy, which is better?

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