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How to JV the Licensing of a Marketing Campaign?

by RRG
17 replies
I know a lawyer in my town who has created a 3-step direct mail campaign that is sent to prospects for a certain legal niche. This campaign has a proven track record of success and a healthy ROI.

I want to approach this lawyer (he used to be a client of mine for my done-for-you newsletter service) and ask him if he would like to do a Joint Venture to license his direct mail campaign to similar lawyers in other markets.

He created the marketing, and I would be doing all the work to market and sell the license to other lawyers to use it.

What do you think would be a fair split? 50/50? 75/25?

Also, assuming the target market is lawyers charging $5000+ for this legal service, what do you think is a good price point to charge for the license? Is it charged one time, annually, or a set-up fee plus a monthly or annual fee?

Also, would it make sense to offer the license at two different levels?

Example: Gold License is the three step direct mail sequence and the right to use it. Diamond Level would be completely done-for-them, where I would physically create and mail the three pieces. All they would do is take the calls and close the clients.

Any advice you could give, I sure would appreciate.

Thanks!
#campaign #licensing #marketing
  • Profile picture of the author fasteasysuccess
    If he's open and explain how it's a win/win because he's limited in area now definitely see if he's down for 50/50 but ideally he may want more.

    Either way free profits for both. When i sold a few campaings I charged upfront and percentage/royalties and yes more for the completely done for them as well is what suggest and did.
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    • Profile picture of the author RRG
      Originally Posted by fasteasysuccess View Post

      If he's open and explain how it's a win/win because he's limited in area now definitely see if he's down for 50/50 but ideally he may want more.

      Either way free profits for both. When i sold a few campaings I charged upfront and percentage/royalties and yes more for the completely done for them as well is what suggest and did.
      It would all be 100% passive income for him. I don't think I'd want to take it on for any less than 50%.

      Ideally, I'd want 65-75% as I would be doing all the work.
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      • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
        Originally Posted by RRG View Post

        It would all be 100% passive income for him. I don't think I'd want to take it on for any less than 50%.

        Ideally, I'd want 65-75% as I would be doing all the work.
        In his mind he probably thinks he did all the hard work.
        ..and he might be right. You have no idea how much
        time,effort.money and failures went into creating his

        Originally Posted by RRG View Post

        I know a lawyer in my town who has created a 3-step direct mail campaign that is sent to prospects for a certain legal niche. This campaign has a proven track record of success and a healthy ROI.
        My point is simply ... you might want to think of a better - non confrontational angle
        before you pitch him the idea.
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        • Profile picture of the author Ron Lafuddy
          Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

          In his mind he probably thinks he did all the hard work.
          ..and he might be right. You have no idea how much
          time,effort.money and failures went into creating his
          Or the attorney might think, "why do I need a middleman?"

          I'll offer this proven program to other attorneys myself.

          After all, I'm the one with the credentials, documents and the proof that it works.

          No need for a partner...at any percentage.
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          • Profile picture of the author savidge4
            Originally Posted by Ron Lafuddy View Post

            Or the attorney might think, "why do I need a middleman?"

            I'll offer this proven program to other attorneys myself.

            After all, I'm the one with the credentials, documents and the proof that it works.

            No need for a partner...at any percentage.

            But is there the time?
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            • Profile picture of the author Ron Lafuddy
              Originally Posted by savidge4 View Post

              But is there the time?
              Great question. And of course, the OP would know more about that.

              My point was to get the him to think,"what if...?"

              And to sharpen his approach, so that he doesn't undersell what he
              brings to the deal.
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              • Profile picture of the author savidge4
                Originally Posted by Ron Lafuddy View Post

                Great question. And of course, the OP would know more about that.

                My point was to get the him to think,"what if...?"

                And to sharpen his approach, so that he doesn't undersell what he
                brings to the deal.
                As much as I agree with what you are saying I to some extent may disagree. There comes a point when thinking of the "What ifs" can walk yourself out of making the pitch to begin with.

                There is ( I don't think ) no question this would be a venture worth looking into. There ( from the outside ) appears to be a fairly equal amount of leverage on both sides. I think the issue with the question within itself is way ahead of where in the strategy to make this JV a reality really is.

                If the pitch is presented as You have this, and I can offer that.. and here is the split, you immediately are on the short side of the stick. you have simply handed over the leverage. you ideal percentage break 25% or the letters and 75% for the work goes right out the door. at BEST you would walk with 50/50, and if the guy is half as smart as most people think Attorney's are, you may end up with less.

                Take the discussion of money out of the presentation.... and just broker the deal to start. Get the agreement that this would be beneficial to both sides. From this, you can then gauge the split... if they are really excited about the idea.. then your portion is worth more.. if they are dragging their feet, well your portion is now worth less.

                When I personally work with a presentation such as this ( actually to some degree I do this with everything - web sales, client sales, consumer sales etc ) I work with a base statement. Drop your whole presentation right down to one sentence:

                It’s a < 1 > that does < 2 > so you/we can < 3 >.

                In this simple statement you are identifying what you can do, by creating an answer to a problem. now all you have to add is motivation.. why would they sell the letter, and why you are the person to make it happen.
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                • Profile picture of the author RRG
                  Originally Posted by savidge4 View Post

                  As much as I agree with what you are saying I to some extent may disagree. There comes a point when thinking of the "What ifs" can walk yourself out of making the pitch to begin with.

                  There is ( I don't think ) no question this would be a venture worth looking into. There ( from the outside ) appears to be a fairly equal amount of leverage on both sides. I think the issue with the question within itself is way ahead of where in the strategy to make this JV a reality really is.

                  If the pitch is presented as You have this, and I can offer that.. and here is the split, you immediately are on the short side of the stick. you have simply handed over the leverage. you ideal percentage break 25% or the letters and 75% for the work goes right out the door. at BEST you would walk with 50/50, and if the guy is half as smart as most people think Attorney's are, you may end up with less.

                  Take the discussion of money out of the presentation.... and just broker the deal to start. Get the agreement that this would be beneficial to both sides. From this, you can then gauge the split... if they are really excited about the idea.. then your portion is worth more.. if they are dragging their feet, well your portion is now worth less.

                  When I personally work with a presentation such as this ( actually to some degree I do this with everything - web sales, client sales, consumer sales etc ) I work with a base statement. Drop your whole presentation right down to one sentence:

                  It's a < 1 > that does < 2 > so you/we can < 3 >.

                  In this simple statement you are identifying what you can do, by creating an answer to a problem. now all you have to add is motivation.. why would they sell the letter, and why you are the person to make it happen.
                  You're on track with how I plan to present it to him. Hey, here's a possible win-win scenario where I do all the work and I put some incremental 100% profit dollars in your hands.

                  If he's receptive to that, then figure out what kind of split he wants. Negotiate from there.
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          • Profile picture of the author RRG
            Originally Posted by Ron Lafuddy View Post

            Or the attorney might think, "why do I need a middleman?"

            I'll offer this proven program to other attorneys myself.

            After all, I'm the one with the credentials, documents and the proof that it works.

            No need for a partner...at any percentage.
            Ron, that is certainly possible. If he were to react that way, I would understand.

            But obviously part of the thinking is . . . division of labor. He's a lawyer. He spends his time growing the law practice. He might not have the time or desire to do this on his own.
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        • Profile picture of the author RRG
          Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

          In his mind he probably thinks he did all the hard work.
          ..and he might be right. You have no idea how much
          time,effort.money and failures went into creating his



          My point is simply ... you might want to think of a better - non confrontational angle
          before you pitch him the idea.
          Ken, you're absolutely right. I know this guy, and I respect what he's done, otherwise I wouldn't be interested in the project in the first place.

          Not sure what you mean by confrontational angle, but I can assure you that is not what I have in mind.
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  • Profile picture of the author animal44
    Originally Posted by RRG View Post

    What do you think would be a fair split? 50/50? 75/25?
    Fair is whatever you negotiate. Some people don't really understand the value they hold, so you can often pick up these things for a song, maybe a one time payment.

    Just ensure you have your lawyer look over any terms...
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  • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
    What do YOU bring to the table?

    Do you have a large network and connections to other attorneys? That would be crucial IMHO

    what does he have in place - does he have a lot of connections to other attorneys?

    That will be key IMHO

    If you don't have those "ins" you could just be a salesperson for his "product"
    if you have proven ability in this field then you could talk partnership
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    • Profile picture of the author RRG
      Originally Posted by Freebiequeen1999 View Post

      What do YOU bring to the table?

      Do you have a large network and connections to other attorneys? That would be crucial IMHO

      what does he have in place - does he have a lot of connections to other attorneys?

      That will be key IMHO

      If you don't have those "ins" you could just be a salesperson for his "product"
      if you have proven ability in this field then you could talk partnership
      I don't have a large network of attorneys.

      What I do have is the direct response marketing and sales skills to make it happen.

      This is something that can work nationwide, and I don't know that he has that broad of a network.

      When you say partnership, do you mean a forming a separate company for this?
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      • Profile picture of the author Freebiequeen1999
        Originally Posted by RRG View Post

        I don't have a large network of attorneys.

        What I do have is the direct response marketing and sales skills to make it happen.

        This is something that can work nationwide, and I don't know that he has that broad of a network.

        When you say partnership, do you mean a forming a separate company for this?
        He might be the one to want a company...after all he is a lawyer )

        I have done work with lawyers and currently work with 2 of them and I can tell you that the "rules" governing what they can and can't say online, what and where they can promote are really much more strict that other kinds of marketing.

        I have not tried to approach them nationwide (no reason to) but I would think that havin some sort of "in" would be needed - cause they do have a lot of gatekeepers in place usually? Also in order to "sell" the program to other lawyers - they will want some sort of "contract" or agreement - that is just the way they roll

        not just a handshake LOL...it is different from promoting a plumber or a day spa for instance . The one upside to lawyers is they(or more likely their assistant) actually do get back to you with their written material, their photos, all the info you need - they seem to be much more organized than my usual client who often has no idea where the original file for their logo is hiding haha
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        • Profile picture of the author savidge4
          Originally Posted by Freebiequeen1999 View Post

          I have done work with lawyers and currently work with 2 of them and I can tell you that the "rules" governing what they can and can't say online, what and where they can promote are really much more strict that other kinds of marketing.
          The "Rules" in this instance do not apply. he would be selling a product to attorneys and NOT attorney based services.

          I personally am currently working with a JV concerning ancillary doctor services... you want to talk about "Rules" OMG yeah... go look up "Stark Law" and the "Anti Kickback rules" then come talk to me.

          Its not that I have a bunch of doctors in my back pocket, its the fact that I know how to market that got me into the deal. I know how to set up funnels. How to reach out effectively on Social Media. How to setup a website to in effect create a result. Its usually never about who you know.. its what you know, that gets you into these kinds of deals.
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  • Profile picture of the author Ron Lafuddy
    Doggone it! I was going to argue with Savidge, but now that the OP's back
    I'll just add, it sounds like you know this attorney guy pretty well.

    That takes a lot of the guesswork out of it. Also adds to the comfort level
    of both parties. That will help make the deal happen.

    RRG, I have a good feeling about this one. I believe you're going to make it happen.

    I'm in the middle of a project right now, where something like this may be of use.

    Let me know if you're considering opening up territories.

    Ron
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  • Profile picture of the author RRG
    Thanks to all of you who contributed to the thread.

    Update: my lawyer friend is going out of town for a couple weeks, but wants to explore this further later in the month!
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