Question: What's Stopping You From Using Direct Mail?

36 replies
I'd like to understand what's stopping you from using direct mail in your business.

Obviously it's not the only way to drive customers, clients, patients and guests to your business.

In some cases, I say there is better use for your marketing dollars, I tell my paid consulting clients.

If you have considered direct mail, have used it and stopped, I'd like to hear what's holding you back now.

Best,
Doctor E. Vile
#direct #mail #question #stopping #useing
  • Profile picture of the author Joe Stewart
    Originally Posted by ewenmack View Post

    I'd like to understand what's stopping you from using direct mail in your business.

    Obviously it's not the only way to drive customers, clients, patients and guests to your business.

    In some cases, I say there is better use for your marketing dollars, I tell my paid consulting clients.

    If you have considered direct mail, have used it and stopped, I'd like to hear what's holding you back now.

    Best,
    Doctor E. Vile
    Copywriting. Now that I'm actually bringing in clients I've been seriously considering print advertising, but I'm not real confident with my copywriting skills, at least not using postcards and direct mail. I suppose I should dig back into some of my Bob Ross stuff and set aside a budget to test 1-2 pieces.
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    • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
      Originally Posted by Joe Stewart View Post

      Copywriting. Now that I'm actually bringing in clients I've been seriously considering print advertising, but I'm not real confident with my copywriting skills, at least not using postcards and direct mail. I suppose I should dig back into some of my Bob Ross stuff and set aside a budget to test 1-2 pieces.
      Thanks Joe.

      Best,
      Ewen
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  • Profile picture of the author Oziboomer
    Hi Ewen, thanks for the post.

    For me personally there are a few factors that always hold back some of my marketing initiatives.

    Usually lack of resources being the greatest inhibitor. Time, people, money.

    Sometimes that might be funds because I'm concerned to tie up cash that is needed for servicing an already growing business.

    Time and personnel are already stretched so there is the constraint of meeting existing client's needs whilst managing additional growth.

    For some areas it is targeting the right list and putting the right offer in front of that list at the right time. Fear of making a bad choice and losing money because of it.

    Also postage costs in Australia have effectively doubled in the last few months.

    I tend to do small batches of mailings created in house and then either sent to our own internal lists or to the prospects I can easily identify.

    Often I find it easier to run a campaign for a client because I've worked harder on identifying what will deliver results for them whereas in my own business sometimes I'm a bit to close to it to take that subjective look. Plus when you already have steady flows of both new and repeat business you tend to be in a sort of maintenance mode as opposed to growth focussed.

    Having said all that if I was to consider using more direct mail campaigns I would use someone like you to assist given your experience in particular in relation to list identification and messaging.

    Kind regards,

    Ozi
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    • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
      Originally Posted by Oziboomer View Post

      Hi Ewen, thanks for the post.

      For me personally there are a few factors that always hold back some of my marketing initiatives.

      Usually lack of resources being the greatest inhibitor. Time, people, money.

      Sometimes that might be funds because I'm concerned to tie up cash that is needed for servicing an already growing business.

      Time and personnel are already stretched so there is the constraint of meeting existing client's needs whilst managing additional growth.

      For some areas it is targeting the right list and putting the right offer in front of that list at the right time. Fear of making a bad choice and losing money because of it.

      Also postage costs in Australia have effectively doubled in the last few months.

      I tend to do small batches of mailings created in house and then either sent to our own internal lists or to the prospects I can easily identify.

      Often I find it easier to run a campaign for a client because I've worked harder on identifying what will deliver results for them whereas in my own business sometimes I'm a bit to close to it to take that subjective look. Plus when you already have steady flows of both new and repeat business you tend to be in a sort of maintenance mode as opposed to growth focussed.

      Having said all that if I was to consider using more direct mail campaigns I would use someone like you to assist given your experience in particular in relation to list identification and messaging.

      Kind regards,

      Ozi
      Great insight Ozi.

      If you were to compare the available lists and list data in Australia,
      I suspect it will be behind what's available in USA.

      Best,
      Ewen
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  • Profile picture of the author TheBigBee
    Originally Posted by ewenmack View Post

    I'd like to understand what's stopping you from using direct mail in your business.

    Obviously it's not the only way to drive customers, clients, patients and guests to your business.

    In some cases, I say there is better use for your marketing dollars, I tell my paid consulting clients.

    If you have considered direct mail, have used it and stopped, I'd like to hear what's holding you back now.

    Best,
    Doctor E. Vile
    Ewen,

    In order for me to use direct mail, I need you to kindly take the time to do the following:
    1. Define my goals, with precision.
    2. Align my goals around a target CPA. Example; I say "Ewen, I need 1 customer per 1,000 letters, but I only want to get an e-mail opt-in - not push the offer on the first touch..."
    3. I need you to build my list for me.
    4. I need you to develop a psychological profile of my target customer so that YOU can talk to them more effectively for me.
    5. Finally, I need you to guarantee that this will all "Work." Please and thank you.

    I'm being facetious and I'm sure you were able to tell by point number 2, but this is my way of saying that fear - unabashed fear is what holds people back from direct mail. They're kinda justified in having this fear... It's scary to fail "cold."

    Example; if you're a standup comic and you bomb where 80% of your jokes are duds, you can at least see those duds in real time and file away winners for re-use.

    Internet marketing provides you a glimpse into those "duds" and winners as well. You may re-arrange a landing page, re-tool an offer, etc. Direct mail offers you little clues into why your duds may be duds and fighting blind fights with "blind traffic" is not something many have the courage to do!

    Just speaking from my own experience. For the record, I've shed my own fear.
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  • Profile picture of the author Ellen Chedid
    Great question. Direct mail is definitely more time consuming and much more expensive. You can experiment with Email a lot more. With the right software, you are better able to track your emails and see which ones receive more clicks than other. Its just more effective and efficient. You are able to reach a much higher audience in a smaller span of time. I mean i think its safe to say that society has become more globalized and technologically aware.
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    • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
      Originally Posted by Ellen Chedid View Post

      You are able to reach a much higher audience in a smaller span of time. I mean i think its safe to say that society has become more globalized and technologically aware.
      Yes that is correct on a global scale.

      For those that have a local business where their pool
      of customers, clients and patients are with a few mile radius,
      then mail gets the message into all their hands.

      Best,
      Ewen
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  • Profile picture of the author qu4rk
    Fear that I will not get an ROI
    Lack of experience.
    No one to field the inbound calls
    No system to convert inbound calls into cha-ching
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    • Profile picture of the author 100PctCoupons
      Fear of the unknown especially with a start-up is always there in one sense or another. I draw strength from resources and knowledge from the trial and errors of those before me.

      Many have paved the way for us in any endeavor. While direct mail is somewhat new to me I took a look at what direct mail systems have worked and have been tried and proven. Then with any system that has been in place for some time try to put a new twist on it while keeping the base model that works intact.

      I believe direct mail has high value for someone using it for their own business or as an agency providing the service to others. To be successful you have to present the VALUE for either party.

      If for my own business; what do I have to offer to someone that will guarantee the best ROI. What is my budget and what can I get for it that will keep my campaign consistent in the same market area.

      As an agency; give them value, come up with "no-brainers", view your direct mailer as prime real estate and only an exclusive few can and will have access to it.

      If you are a "one-man-show", so be it...you have no choice, do what you can to make it happen. You just have to start and let things fall in place...they won't at all if you don't try. Look for others that you can partner with, you have a product/service of value.

      Come up with a plan and go for it. Direct mail is not dead. So nothing is stopping me from getting my first EDDM direct mailer out.
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      • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
        There's a common theme, cost.

        Associated with that is risk of not getting your investment back
        because it's asking the mailer to bring in more revenue to cover
        the cost of it.

        Then this creates fear that your ad writing skills aren't
        good enough.

        Or is it going to the right people.

        What if the cost of printing and mailing is taken off the table
        all together?


        Would there be anything stopping you from using direct mail now?

        Best,
        Ewen
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        • Profile picture of the author kemdev
          This thread.
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          • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
            Originally Posted by kemdev View Post

            This thread.
            ?

            Best,
            Ewen
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        • Profile picture of the author 100PctCoupons
          Originally Posted by ewenmack View Post

          There's a common theme, cost.

          Associated with that is risk of not getting your investment back
          because it's asking the mailer to bring in more revenue to cover
          the cost of it.

          Then this creates fear that your ad writing skills aren't
          good enough.

          Or is it going to the right people.

          What if the cost of printing and mailing is taken off the table
          all together?


          Would there be anything stopping you from using direct mail now?

          Best,
          Ewen
          EDDM made a way to avoid purchasing mailing list and savings on postage when you don't have to directly target specific addresses. I would love to hear if there is a way to take printing and mailing off the table. I'm sure that would take away just about all of the hurdles on using direct mail.
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        • Profile picture of the author kemdev
          Originally Posted by ewenmack View Post

          There's a common theme, cost.

          Associated with that is risk of not getting your investment back
          because it's asking the mailer to bring in more revenue to cover
          the cost of it.

          Then this creates fear that your ad writing skills aren't
          good enough.

          Or is it going to the right people.

          What if the cost of printing and mailing is taken off the table
          all together?


          Would there be anything stopping you from using direct mail now?

          Best,
          Ewen
          "What's stopping you from using direct mail?"

          Why not have an honest thread title...

          "What's stopping you from using direct mail with me?"

          That's my answer. This thread.

          I mean come on, start a WSO if you want to blatantly promote yourself without adding value or a discussion. And the nauseatingly pandering post I quoted... Honestly it's the only reason I posted in the first place.

          And I know, I know... this IS the offline forum and you ARE a local celebrity here, so this is all okay because you're displaying the power of defining and overcoming objections, right?
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          • Profile picture of the author Doran Peck
            Originally Posted by kemdev View Post

            "What's stopping you from using direct mail?"

            Why not have an honest thread title...

            "What's stopping you from using direct mail with me?"

            That's my answer. This thread.

            I mean come on, start a WSO if you want to blatantly promote yourself without adding value or a discussion. And the nauseatingly pandering post I quoted... Honestly it's the only reason I posted in the first place.

            And I know, I know... this IS the offline forum and you ARE a local celebrity here, so this is all okay because you're displaying the power of defining and overcoming objections, right?
            Ouch kid...that was a helluva faceplant. ( ...little secret...we all saw this coming)

            Respect yer Elders ! (and thats not an age reference)
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            • Profile picture of the author kemdev
              Originally Posted by Doran Peck View Post

              Ouch kid...that was a helluva faceplant. ( ...little secret...we all saw this coming)

              Respect yer Elders ! (and thats not an age reference)
              I stand by my point.

              Nothing against Ewen, I'm sure he has good intentions. He and I spoke on the phone for over an hour a couple months ago and he helped me get on the right track to start advertising my business. He's a good guy. The post wasn't begrudging his character or marketing abilities, as I'm sure he knows. He's also not stupid and knows how to promote himself. This is a marketing forum after all, so you can't be too offended by that notion.

              So yeah, I stand by my point. And when ad reps ask me things like...

              "Aside from cost, is there anything stopping you from..."

              "If this were affordable, would you be able to..."

              "In a perfect world where cost isn't involved, could you..."

              ... I shut down. But that's me. Perhaps I worded my response too harshly, but that's the response I feel when that's how I'm being sold on an idea.

              Ewen; to answer your actual question, copywriting. I need someone to understand my market, my services, my selling points and put that into the right words for my target audience. I would pay for the mailing costs myself, and pay someone else to write the ad.
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              • Profile picture of the author Robscom
                1. Copywriting. I'm working on it, but it's still a work in progress.
                2. We're B2B. It makes EDDM impractical. (Right? Or am I off base?)

                Can you do this method with a B2B-type mailing? Just get a couple of other B2B-type businesses in order to make it work?

                The mailing would be smaller, but it could be targeting businesses, so it might still work, I think?
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                "Do. Or do not. There is no 'try.'" -- Yoda
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                • Profile picture of the author myattitude
                  Originally Posted by Robscom View Post

                  1. Copywriting. I'm working on it, but it's still a work in progress.
                  2. We're B2B. It makes EDDM impractical. (Right? Or am I off base?)

                  Can you do this method with a B2B-type mailing? Just get a couple of other B2B-type businesses in order to make it work?

                  The mailing would be smaller, but it could be targeting businesses, so it might still work, I think?
                  Yes you can do B2B. Say you are a website design business, you can contact restaurants with your offer to do their online marketing, then the other two partners on the postcard can be local farms offering their produce, and alcohol distributors providing their liquor. Now you have 3 non-competing businesses all offering something relevant to the restaurant.
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                  • Profile picture of the author Robscom
                    Originally Posted by myattitude View Post

                    Yes you can do B2B. Say you are a website design business, you can contact restaurants with your offer to do their online marketing, then the other two partners on the postcard can be local farms offering their produce, and alcohol distributors providing their liquor. Now you have 3 non-competing businesses all offering something relevant to the restaurant.
                    Ah. So the EDDM mailing can have the B2C businesses on it, but I can ride along to pick up B2B customers that might see it? Yes?
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                    "Do. Or do not. There is no 'try.'" -- Yoda
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  • Profile picture of the author myattitude
    I'm just (relatively) recently getting started in it. Yes the print and mail costs are high, but the response rates are good and you can scale. I can see why the costs put people off. I prefer not sitting in front of computers all day too, frankly.

    Why do you ask, Ewen?
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    • Profile picture of the author NomadLifestyle
      I haven't figured out what to sell using Direct Mail that I couldn't sell better with retargeting and email marketing.

      Not knocking DM, I wish, wish, wish I could master DM, but at the moment my time resources are limited and so I would need a pretty strong reason to choose DM over the email+remarketing that I'm using currently.

      I think it has a lot to do with the products I'm selling atm. If I had products better suited to offline consumption, then I'd look into DM.

      What I'd LOVE to do someday is get into the print newsletter business. That's the kind of stuff that's right up my ally, but again, it's that time factor of setting aside the time to learn something new like DM.
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  • Profile picture of the author SashaLee
    Ewen,

    In fairness, you can't take the cost of printing and mailing off the table. How else would your direct MAIL piece be created? These costs constitute the largest portion of any mail campaign (unless you use a ride-along process).

    All the best,

    Sasha,
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    • Profile picture of the author Oziboomer
      Originally Posted by SashaLee View Post

      Ewen,

      In fairness, you can't take the cost of printing and mailing off the table. How else would your direct MAIL piece be created? These costs constitute the largest portion of any mail campaign (unless you use a ride-along process).

      All the best,

      Sasha,
      I'm sure Ewen will weigh in but perhaps the mailing and printing costs may be the highest cost of any campaign but maybe the point is about the risk.

      If you select the wrong list.

      If you create the wrong message.

      If the timing is wrong.

      The cost of the printing and mailing comes after those higher costs for getting those bits wrong.

      An average message to the right list would beat a great message to the wrong list for example.

      I think Ewen is highlighting his skills in list selection and message creation to boost results.

      Best regards,

      Ozi
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      • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
        Originally Posted by Oziboomer View Post


        I think Ewen is highlighting his skills in list selection and message creation to boost results.

        Best regards,

        Ozi
        Thanks Ozi,

        Sure list selection, right message and timing of it all make a BIG difference on whether you
        fail in misery or laugh all the way to the bank.

        Their's always that possibility things don't work out for some reason.

        By putting no money in, just some time into the campaign means you can never lose money therefore you have the ability to keep on marketing, more often.

        Just by having two others mail with you.

        Best,
        Ewen
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    • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
      Originally Posted by SashaLee View Post

      Ewen,

      In fairness, you can't take the cost of printing and mailing off the table. How else would your direct MAIL piece be created? These costs constitute the largest portion of any mail campaign (unless you use a ride-along process).

      Sasha,
      You nailed it Sasha, ride-along.

      Have two others advertise on the same postcard.

      Not new to those who have bought Bob Ross's M3 training.

      For those who haven't bought it, not familiar with the concept, here's some examples...

      Example 1 My business which supplies paper to point of sales machines.

      Reaching out to restaurants and café's I would contact coffee roasters, cleaning suppliers, cooking oil suppliers, baking suppliers, fresh food suppliers, accountants and bookkeepers, payroll people, air filter suppliers and cleaners, table napkin suppliers.

      Example 2 Bob Ross: His business which replaces home windows.
      He has a liquor store and pizza store on his postcard.

      Example 3: You do online lead generation for Lawyer's.
      You would contact office cleaners, accountants, office supplies, cloud payroll, office leasing companies, copier companies, office water companies, telcos, office furniture companies.

      They all want the same clients as the person in the examples


      They win because it's half the cost of printing and mailing compared if they did it themselves.

      You win because they paid for the printing and mailing.

      If you are going to a targeted list, then you add that into the price.

      No matter how much you screw up, you can never lose money this way.

      So all one's fears about direct mail are gone by using this method.

      You have unlimited opportunity to reach as many of your target audience as many times as you want.

      So thanks to all who were brave enough to post what's stopping you using direct mail.

      Best,
      Ewen
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  • Profile picture of the author myattitude
    Brilliant Ewen, thank you. For selling gardening books, I could contact lawnmower companies, garden center stores, etc. I get it.

    Couple of questions:

    1) Why would it be half the price of if they were mailing and printing it themselves? (EDIT: Ahh I understand, because you get TWO partners in on it.)

    2) Who would you contact for this if you were promoting licensed bizopp products to rented in lists?
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    • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
      Originally Posted by myattitude View Post

      Brilliant Ewen, thank you. For selling gardening books, I could contact lawnmower companies, garden center stores, etc. I get it.

      Couple of questions:

      2) Who would you contact for this if you were promoting licensed bizopp products to rented in lists?
      To those that have a much higher and much lower price point than yours
      because within that list there will be those that are willing to pay more than yours and there's those that won't be willing to invest as much as yours.

      Make sense?

      Best,
      Ewen
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  • Profile picture of the author kemdev
    Here's a question for Ewen or anyone else...

    B2B direct mail. You want to lower (or eliminate) the cost of mailing, so you partner with non-competing businesses and place them on the ad you're sending out.

    Wouldn't this heavily dilute your marketing message? Plus, you have to go through the hassle of approaching and selling other businesses on partnering with you for the ad.

    I understand this method is supposed to lower to barrier of entry for those wanting to get into direct mail, but at what cost?
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    • Profile picture of the author myattitude
      Originally Posted by kemdev View Post

      Here's a question for Ewen or anyone else...

      B2B direct mail. You want to lower (or eliminate) the cost of mailing, so you partner with non-competing businesses and place them on the ad you're sending out.

      Wouldn't this heavily dilute your marketing message? Plus, you have to go through the hassle of approaching and selling other businesses on partnering with you for the ad.

      I understand this method is supposed to lower to barrier of entry for those wanting to get into direct mail, but at what cost?
      It would dilute your response rate but the marketing is free for you, so it's not a problem. MY concern is that the partners who are paying (albeit a cheaper price) will themselves be unsatisfied with the low response rate, and they may not stick around.
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    • Profile picture of the author SirThomas
      Originally Posted by kemdev View Post

      Wouldn't this heavily dilute your marketing message? Plus, you have to go through the hassle of approaching and selling other businesses on partnering with you for the ad.
      It's just one way to get your message out. If you think it's not worth the hassle, you can always use solo mailouts instead of coops. When it comes to your message being heavily diluted, every message is already diluted by other messages regardless of their origin or packaging. When you send a solo postcard and it arrives in my mailbox at the same time as dozen of other offers, your message will be diluted. The only difference is that they didn't cover the costs of your message! :-)
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      • Profile picture of the author Ron Lafuddy
        Originally Posted by SirThomas View Post

        If you think it's not worth the hassle, you can always use solo mailouts instead of coops. :-)
        Or just eliminate the mailing cost and have a referral partner distribute
        your piece to all of his clients/customers. When your referral partner, who
        is a trusted source, refers you to his customers, it makes all the difference.

        I do this with business cards. The cost is minuscule and it works like dynamite.

        Ron
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        • Profile picture of the author Robscom
          Originally Posted by Ron Lafuddy View Post

          Or just eliminate the mailing cost and have a referral partner distribute
          your piece to all of his clients/customers. When your referral partner, who
          is a trusted source, refers you to his customers, it makes all the difference.

          I do this with business cards. The cost is minuscule and it works like dynamite.

          Ron
          How would you approach someone with this proposal? What's the benefit for him/her? (I'm sure I'm missing something. Please be patient with me. Thanks in advance.)
          Signature
          "Do. Or do not. There is no 'try.'" -- Yoda
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          • Profile picture of the author Oziboomer
            Originally Posted by Robscom View Post

            How would you approach someone with this proposal? What's the benefit for him/her? (I'm sure I'm missing something. Please be patient with me. Thanks in advance.)
            This is the host/beneficiary relationship model that you can adapt to most businesses.

            We use something similar where we provide a gift check with $100 value to a number of local florists that they use as a thank you to people buying flowers for weddings.

            The average wedding purchase is $800 in our market and newly-weds and their parents are our target market.

            My business functions on a lifetime value model so when I get a couple who has just got married their "average" real value to my business is $3477 net profit over ten years .

            Giving away $100 in the beginning is a bit insignificant when you look at the results it generates.

            Of the 9 local florist I help with their "reward scheme" they usually have on average 51 weddings per month that generates 3-4 new clients per month over the long term who directly use the gift.

            There are also people who become clients who don't use the gift either because it has expired or they have directly referred our business to their relatives.

            The cost of generating business this way is low because the only cost is producing the gift checks and setting it up.

            You can get as creative as you like with this model.

            We do this with multiple businesses (not just florists) who are supplying services or goods to our best prospects.

            Before you go into it you must know your normal customer acquisition cost and have a good idea of your lifetime value of a customer.

            Then it becomes simple to design an offer that is attractive and cost effective.

            Hope that helps.

            Best regards,

            Ozi
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            • Profile picture of the author Robscom
              @ Ozi

              Thank you. That does help.
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              "Do. Or do not. There is no 'try.'" -- Yoda
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            • Profile picture of the author gjabiz
              Originally Posted by Oziboomer View Post

              This is the host/beneficiary relationship model that you can adapt to most businesses.

              We use something similar where we provide a gift check with $100 value to a number of local florists that they use as a thank you to people buying flowers for weddings.

              The average wedding purchase is $800 in our market and newly-weds and their parents are our target market.

              My business functions on a lifetime value model so when I get a couple who has just got married their "average" real value to my business is $3477 net profit over ten years .

              Giving away $100 in the beginning is a bit insignificant when you look at the results it generates.

              Of the 9 local florist I help with their "reward scheme" they usually have on average 51 weddings per month that generates 3-4 new clients per month over the long term who directly use the gift.

              There are also people who become clients who don't use the gift either because it has expired or they have directly referred our business to their relatives.

              The cost of generating business this way is low because the only cost is producing the gift checks and setting it up.

              You can get as creative as you like with this model.

              We do this with multiple businesses (not just florists) who are supplying services or goods to our best prospects.

              Before you go into it you must know your normal customer acquisition cost and have a good idea of your lifetime value of a customer.

              Then it becomes simple to design an offer that is attractive and cost effective.

              Hope that helps.

              Best regards,

              Ozi
              Thanks Ozi, GREAT stuff.

              Love this:
              Of the 9 local florist I help with their "reward scheme" they usually have on average 51 weddings per month

              I'm loving Trade Shows, and especially WEDDING and BRIDAL shows.

              Best host for me has been cake decorators, caterers and/or cookie/desserts. Why?

              Because they give FREE samples at the trade shows and bridal fairs.

              Imagine this, instead of giving them 100 dollar gifts, you gave them 700 dollars by way of a co-op postcard, with 7 "coupons" or "gifts" on them...

              Like Ron with his business cards, finding HOSTS works. And sharing distribution at a specific place where TARGETED PROSPECTS come in droves for the day...like a bridal fair...

              is turning into a spectacular business WIN for all involved.

              Add a "loyalty" program to their businesses and you have it made in the shade.

              gjabiz
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          • Profile picture of the author Ron Lafuddy
            Originally Posted by Robscom View Post

            How would you approach someone with this proposal?
            I would show them the benefits, both short term and long.

            I would give them 25 reasons why doing this will completely change their business for the better.

            I would show them how they could be making and saving thousands of dollars at the same time. Literally, doubling the return..

            I would show them a money generating machine, that will work non-stop for years and years - THAT THEY WOULD OWN.

            Then, I would let them know that their competition is also interested, and let the bidding process begin.
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