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Phone Sales - Let's Try Again

by David Miller
114 replies
Maybe the 3rd time is the charm. I've tried this 2 times and in both cases, somewhere along the line, the thread DEvolved thanks to off topic posts. It's my hope that this time that won't happen.

In the hopes of avoidance, here's what happened:

We were going along nicely and getting some good input about phone sales and closing than one post comes along talking about how they hate phones and cold calling and here's a better way. Needless to say that was the end of that. Tried to move back to the topic but no such luck. Too many people with shiny object syndrome I guess.

So here is what I hope we can chat about here......PHONE SALES!

Not appointment setting, not about how much we hate cold calling, not about "I like to send emails first" and certainly not about ways to avoid it!

Phone sales is what allows anyone to make money from anywhere. If you have a full time job and think you can't reach a business because it's after 5, well, if you live in New York it's only 2 in 1/3 of the country. If you live in California and you really want to break away on your own, you can wake up early. In fact, when I lived on the west coast, telemarketing companies opened their doors at 5AM.

Deals can be closed on the phone, and that's what I would like this thread to be about. There's so much talent on this forum and I believe that everyone of us can benefit by learning more about, or enhancing what we already do to build our business using the phone...for SELLING!
#closing on the phone #phone #phone sales #sales #telemarketing
  • Profile picture of the author Michael Bucker
    Ok my friend I am not exactly sure where you want to go with this but let me be the first to start by saying.

    He who asks the most questions win. Is your prospect asking the most questions or are you.

    When training sales reps I have found a big problem is the prospect is asking all the questions and controlling the direction of the conversation. They need involved but in answering more questions you ask then you answering theirs. Yes you answer theirs, but you maintain the control of the direction the conversation goes in. How you do this is through questions of your own. Don't make a call with just a few questions. Have plenty. And yes with the right questions.

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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      He wants to talk about how to close deals on the phone Mike.

      He's referring to the need for cold calling info and how every telemarketing thread seems to get derailed by haters trying to push a shiny bell or whistle even though everyone knows that telemarketing is ABSOLUTELY the best way to set appointments, next to just walking in someones door and pitching them hardcore like Zig Ziglar, who would close them on the spot with ten rebuttals right here and now, and even use the body language, head nodding...everything thats uncomfortable for those too cool to close on people, but that WORKS!!

      We have been trying to talk about the idea of phone closing, or closing credit cards over the phone... but keep being interrupted by people who think that we want to talk about craigslist, email or direct mailers and the like, or "consulting".

      No we dont want to consult, we want to "close"; New York Style...you know; the way of the people who are waaay behind the rest of the world?

      Closing on the phone hardcore is very "New York City" , no matter where you are from.

      David is like me in the sense that he wants "dont bore us, get to chorus"... Lets just make a direct bee-line to the sale and close it, bag it and tag it!

      "Next"!!!!

      However again, we cant keep a straight beeline because haters come in talking about all the "better, more sophisticated ways"...

      He is saying "Dont give me what you think I might like better, instead give me what I am 'asking for".

      Cant wait to get into this but cant ATM.

      Theres nothing against other ways, but in a telemarketing phone close thread, thats what we want to talk about, much like your other thread was about selling even jerks, and we turned it into a philosophy thread and killed your point. Sorry bro.

      Instead fof adding to it, "Someone" decided to redefine your message even though it wasnt being asked for, nor was it needed, and it did kill the direction. I was at fault too after that.

      Lets get intense on this Thread then David! Im in, but cant comment anymore just ATM. Will be back though.

      YES! You can PHONE CLOSE!

      We dont want to talk about consulting in a telemarketing thread, we want to talk about boiler room just BANGIN IT!

      Slammin it in the bucket right on the phone in one call!

      Driving through the numbers like a freight train and making 3 sales to other peoples ONE sale!

      Thats what Im talkin about, so is my New York brotha from anotha motha!

      Wall Street style poundin the phones for straight up results!

      You know, the way thats too crude and (lol) primitive for the faint of heart?

      Savage even maybe?

      That way.
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      • Profile picture of the author David Miller
        Obviously you get it John. It's about closing and NEXT! I have no time to look for someone's pain, or do some "needs analysis"....here's what I've got, you need to get some. Will that be Visa, or Mastercard.

        That's where I wan't to get to because that's where the money is....at least in my model.

        Now before anyone gets all bent out of shape and says you can't sell big ticket items on the phone, I strongly disagree. I have bought and sold items into the thousands of dollars on the phone and so have millions of others. Car insurance is pretty expensive in and around New York City, somehow I don't expect the "little lizard" to call me asking for an appointment. He takes my 2k right over the phone.

        In addition with the cost of doing business today, if you insist that the only reason for the phone is to make face to face appointments, all you're doing is reducing your profit.

        Whatever we do to close the deal in person, can be done on the phone, more efficiently, and just as effectively.

        The reason for this thread is to learn from each other how we can do all this better.
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        -- FRANK SINATRA, quoted in The Way You Wear Your Hat
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    If anyone gets bent out of shape they should go to another topic.

    You made me realize something with this post.

    We do each other, the forum, and Allen Says a disservice when we let threads get off topic. From now Im not going to bother with other straying thoughts when entering a thread and just try to keep things in a bee-line for whatever the topic.

    You have helped me advance today, there is power in HIGHLY TARGETING a subject, and keeping it on track...

    Ironically there is the same power in doing that with a phone pitch!

    So lets talk about your subject...

    In phone sales, the more it stays on track, the more concentrated and powerful it is, so we constantly redirect back to the subject at hand all the way to the close.

    Calls centers know that, which is why they have a hundred people driving a VERBATIM pitch with Verbatim rebuttals hard all day long...everyone in the room is in unsion with a one track mind.

    And the telemarketer does not stray from the subject. Nor do they stray from hitting one number after the next all the way till their fifteen minute break, four quarters per day, back to back from days beginning to days end.

    Thats why they get powerful results. Their people crank out 2-5 sales a day apeice.

    For your faith:

    Back when I did fundraising I sometimes got 15 credit cards per DAY! And so did others...

    In selling web pages via the bower method, i would sometimes get 5 sales per day, at least 3 on average, credit card closes.

    Later when I sold avertising on the phone at $400 per pop... I got two closes per day, so did my telemarketers when I eventually had my own room.

    When I sold websites on the phone, and recruited affiliates at $300 per pop, Michael Bucker can tell you, i did it from my kitchen table and slammed 2-4 credit cards per day, later he and I, got an office, hired some telemarketers and trained them all to do the same thing...

    Phone closing simply "Happens".

    Its not a myth.

    I would love to hear anyone elses closing experience as well... Are there any hardcore phone closers here?
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    • Profile picture of the author Vanquish
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      If anyone gets bent out of shape they should go to another topic.

      You made me realize something with this post.

      We do each other, the forum, and Allen Says a disservice when we let threads get off topic. From now Im not going to bother with other straying thoughts when entering a thread and just try to keep things in a bee-line for whatever the topic.

      You have helped me advance today, there is power in HIGHLY TARGETING a subject, and keeping it on track...

      Ironically there is the same power in doing that with a phone pitch!

      So lets talk about your subject...

      In phone sales, the more it stays on track, the more concentrated and powerful it is, so we constantly redirect back to the subject at hand all the way to the close.

      Calls centers know that, which is why they have a hundred people driving a VERBATIM pitch with Verbatim rebuttals hard all day long...everyone in the room is in unsion with a one track mind.

      And the telemarketer does not stray from the subject. Nor do they stray from hitting one number after the next all the way till their fifteen minute break, four quarters per day, back to back from days beginning to days end.

      Thats why they get powerful results. Their people crank out 2-5 sales a day apeice.

      For your faith:

      Back when I did fundraising I sometimes got 15 credit cards per DAY! And so did others...

      In selling web pages via the bower method, i would sometimes get 5 sales per day, at least 3 on average, credit card closes.

      Later when I sold avertising on the phone at $400 per pop... I got two closes per day, so did my telemarketers when I eventually had my own room.

      When I sold websites on the phone, and recruited affiliates at $300 per pop, Michael Bucker can tell you, i did it from my kitchen table and slammed 2-4 credit cards per day, later he and I, got an office, hired some telemarketers and trained them all to do the same thing...

      Phone closing simply "Happens".

      Its not a myth.

      I would love to hear anyone elses closing experience as well... Are there any hardcore phone closers here?
      Good post.
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      Nothing to sell, only value to give and new knowledge to learn.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jay Rhome
    If the client has current access to the web and you have sales material that can be shown from the web, use join.me to show them your screen, and thus with the phone, visual material (your screen and your mouse to point at the right spots), go through what works for you and close.

    If you can get to have them on their desktop seeing the same thing as you, it's much easier for them to buy from the web since they already are on the web, and with your helping hand guiding them. No need for them to send checks, etc.

    My motto is the easier we make it for prospects, the more likely they'll become clients.
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    • Profile picture of the author David Miller
      Thanks Jay...and thanks for staying on point. Using joinme or gotomeeting is a great way to save time and get a message across, that's certainly true. But it brings into the picture another challange.

      1. You could easily fall into the trap of starting to set telephone appointments for an online meeting, which can easily be broken.

      2. If you go into the call with the gotomeeting in mind, they can easily say they are not near their pc at the time.

      So the question is, how would you lead the prospect to the web meeting in a way that doesn't delay the objective of the call?

      Once you've got the prospect interested enough to take part in the process, isn't it possible that making the move to the pc could break the momentum?
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      The big lesson in life, baby, is never be scared of anyone or anything.
      -- FRANK SINATRA, quoted in The Way You Wear Your Hat
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by Jay Rhome View Post

      If the client has current access to the web and you have sales material that can be shown from the web, use join.me to show them your screen, and thus with the phone, visual material (your screen and your mouse to point at the right spots), go through what works for you and close.

      If you can get to have them on their desktop seeing the same thing as you, it's much easier for them to buy from the web since they already are on the web, and with your helping hand guiding them. No need for them to send checks, etc.

      My motto is the easier we make it for prospects, the more likely they'll become clients.
      Jay, not arguing your point just asking, and perhaps you have a good answer that will be an evolvement:

      The best way to do this is focused, hard driving, straight beeline, staying on track hitting 300 numbers per day and fully pitching 10% of them all the way down to the close, then closing 10% of the people you got to the close or higher... Thats a minimum of 3 sales per day...

      So my questions are:

      1: How can you drive hard like that when you are navigating people through webinars all day, doesn't that slow the pace? How can you get a rhythm?

      2: How do you keep it verbatim and military like that, so that you are constantly repeating a repetitive action consistently enough for the laws of numbers and momentum to work for you?

      These are real questions, no hidden sarcastic agendas...

      They are asked because nothing less than what we described above will yield more than a sale per day, if every other day...?

      If you could get that kind of momentum I could see how that (GoTo) would benefit.

      Also, how can you consistently find people who are in front of their computer?

      How long does it take to even get them logged in...? Not from a theoretical perspective, but from the perspective that at least 50% are having slow loading or hangups and this and that...or trouble understanding the instructions...?

      Can you time your average call like this and create a duplicaable system for success where you can say "It takes this many hours - to dial this many numbers- to get this many full pitches- to get this many closes..." ?

      Again if this is an improvement upon old school smiling and dialing then it should be more efficient, not for the pitch itself, but for the "days gross", in the terms we are talking about.

      Can a predictable, projectable result be created with this based on certain actions being repeated a certain way, a certain number of times?

      This way every day you know you have a machine, or system that works and spits out the result its supposed to.

      If it is an improvement, or more efficient, then it should either produce more sales, or the same amount more efficiently... and most importantly it should be predictable and duplicable based on a numbers system.

      I guess the word Im looking for is "consistency" .

      Is a person able to get into a momentum and have a consistent experience from call to call without alot of bumps?

      I have always felt that was more for a slower consulting approach, but maybe you can change my mind. Would love that...even though its easier in my mind to not have anything to worry about other than a pitch and a scratch pad.

      Thanks.

      PS. Why not just get a pay pal virtual terminal and take their CC number over the phone and process it yourself? Less action for the prospect to take, plus if it declines you can know that before they get off the phone... and ask them for another card.
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    • Profile picture of the author Deidra Renee
      Originally Posted by Jay Rhome View Post

      If the client has current access to the web and you have sales material that can be shown from the web, use join.me to show them your screen, and thus with the phone, visual material (your screen and your mouse to point at the right spots), go through what works for you and close.

      If you can get to have them on their desktop seeing the same thing as you, it's much easier for them to buy from the web since they already are on the web, and with your helping hand guiding them. No need for them to send checks, etc.

      My motto is the easier we make it for prospects, the more likely they'll become clients.
      This is a great idea..I just learned about join.me while going through my set up with safe soft solutions (market dialer.) I never thought to use it in this way.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jay Rhome
    Not everyone will be able to get in front of a PC, but it rarely breaks momentum IF the desktop is already opened - and you keep talking. Join.me is VERY quick. They type join.me in their browser, then the code you give them. That's it. No email or long explanation needed.

    I guess since I sell mobile sites/SMS I feel it's a visual thing. And the "wow" effect of screen sharing, the visual aspect of mobile (desktop site vs mobile), the "I'm a real company not just a bum on the phone look at my website" factor, that all adds for ME in getting more conversions. I don't consider that a webinar, just a mix between a phone and a face-to-face presentation. And it will only happen if you can get an interested prospect first, so the presentation only happens as it would have anyway, though it can be longer.

    I have different windows opened: my website, packages offered, smartphone emulator, even a client value calculator, BUT I will only use what's needed, adjust to the conversion and the client's need, not do the exact same presentation to listen to the client's needs (as consulting IS also one of the service offered)

    So John you're right in that it's not a repetitive drill like telemarketers do, and it's thus more complex to teach to others. Mmmm. I don't do the volume I should either (and that telemarketers can do) but that's me, not the process. Unless it's very simple, an in a way mobile sites/SMS ARE simple, I tend to think appointment settings can be done fast, but sales take a longer, more elaborate process. Would you agree with that?

    I want to make it super easy for the prospect (i.e. don't give him/her too many options) yet have flexibility from my end. But I might need to simplify that if I want (and believe me I do!) to hire telemarketers. Good points.
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    • Profile picture of the author David Miller
      Here's the thing, you see I'm just a BUM on the phone, and if I ask a prospect to log into anything at all he has the option to say "I can't get to my computer at the moment" so than where am I.

      What I've done is painted myself into a corner where I've said that the only or best way for me to show what my product is or does can best be demonstrated online. Any other attempt is not going to be fair. So what's a good time to get back with you when you'll be at your pc Mr. Prospect?

      So let the chase begin.
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      The big lesson in life, baby, is never be scared of anyone or anything.
      -- FRANK SINATRA, quoted in The Way You Wear Your Hat
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      • Profile picture of the author Deidra Renee
        Originally Posted by David Miller View Post

        Here's the thing, you see I'm just a BUM on the phone, and if I ask a prospect to log into anything at all he has the option to say "I can't get to my computer at the moment" so than where am I.

        What I've done is painted myself into a corner where I've said that the only or best way for me to show what my product is or does can best be demonstrated online. Any other attempt is not going to be fair. So what's a good time to get back with you when you'll be at your pc Mr. Prospect?

        So let the chase begin.
        ok, now I see where this can be a problem, but still a cool idea I've had clients tell me they don't have access to their email just yet, so I'm guessing they'll say the same thing as far as the computer goes.
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        • Profile picture of the author John Durham
          I do think Jay has brought up some strong points, in fact its the best explanation of a smooth process Ive heard. However, I feel like most of those who are saying they arent at the computer are saying it because they just dont want to go through the process... even more believe in viruses and are afraid people will be able to access their computer later.

          The thing Jay says (Thanks Jay) that makes sense is that; with the presentation being a part of the process , the numbers might be the same percentage wise), just like we dont get past the greeting with 40% or whatever, and into the body of our pitch, he doesnt get to start the webinar with 40%...

          However, Im thinking most people including myself would not agree to such a thing from a cold call. I'd sooner give you my credit card number probably... with all the phishing scams, I wouldnt necessarily believe we were really using join me... In any event the pace is slower.

          I thought it was a great post though, and a great description of the process.
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        • Profile picture of the author David Miller
          I see it's not taken very long to get off topic....only a few posts before we're talking about tools to make things easy.

          Let's not get down the business of closing if we can avoid it....that's pretty much how I see the last few posts. It amazes me that "warriors" are so afraid....that's right I said afraid of closing, that it's even avoided on a forum thread.

          As long as I'm already somewhat disgusted, let me address the "just another bum on the phone" remark. How is that so different from just another bum with a website on the phone?

          Just exactly what is it about sales or sales people that would make anyone want to make that kind of statement? Is there something about NOT asking for the order on the first call that makes me more of a gentleman? If that's your view of telemarketers, I think you may want to rethink your plans to hire any. I don't care what you pay, no one is going to give 100% or even 50% to someone that has no respect for the skills they bring to the table. But now I'm getting off track.

          In my work I have to meet with salespeople a few times a month. Sometimes in the office, sometimes on the phone. They meet with me because they have something they want to sell, or because they have something that I'm interested in buying. If they aren't going to make a logical presentation that is going to lead me to a buying decision, they are wasting my time...and theirs.

          So that's what I was hoping this thread would be about! How to make a logical presentation that leads to a buying decision. NOW!

          If you want to talk about the myriad of tools and techniques that are available to make it easier to pick up the phone, or to feed the need to be a "professional" this isn't the place.

          I'm just a bum with a phone, a list, and a product I believe in. If you're like me.....than let's talk about what we need to do and some of the ways to do it.

          JUST A NOTE: While I was writing this post I see that we're back on track! NICE!
          Signature
          The big lesson in life, baby, is never be scared of anyone or anything.
          -- FRANK SINATRA, quoted in The Way You Wear Your Hat
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          • Profile picture of the author John Durham
            Originally Posted by David Miller View Post


            Just exactly what is it about sales or sales people that would make anyone want to make that kind of statement? Is there something about NOT asking for the order on the first call that makes me more of a gentleman?
            Og Mandino would say a man who isnt afraid of the close is rather a "Man AMONG men".

            I dont know how much of a gentleman I feel like , but when I SLAMMMM a credit card, I feel like a CHAMPION!

            Thats what makes it worth while for me. When you work in a room with many others you realized that being a champion at this DOES make you a man among men, and you learn to close every type...

            You feel a sense of empowerment.

            Thats what its all about for me, and what I want to share with others. Get the money if you want to feel REALLY good. Bring it home. Look in the mirror and say "I am confident that I am a skilled closing machine. I can get the job done".

            Telemarketers arent bums, good ones are true professionals at a level most men will never go to.
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          • Profile picture of the author Sue Bruce
            How to make a logical presentation that leads to a buying decision. NOW!
            1. Build rapport. Depending on your personality, use humour, consultative approach, informational, however you deal best with people. Build confidence and trust. Tell them why you are calling
            (it better be a good one).

            2. Most people are more interested in talking than listening. Sound confident, courteous, friendly and sincere. Engage them personally in the call. Let the talk and finish sentences so they know that you care. Manage the conversation, mirror their pace.

            3. Ask open ended questions to get needs and buying objectives. (what, who, how, why, and where)

            4. Tell them what you have for them. Watch for "hot buttons" give them features and benefits. Listen for buying signals.

            5. Hard close using "what, when and how" questions. Soft closes are good for those who like Big Macs. LOL

            6. Find out the reason for the objection. Could be inattention miscommunication, wrong argument. End rebuttal with a question "Does that make sense? Anything else I can clarify?"

            7. Woo Hoo, closed another one!

            P.S. Of course, what is logical for us, may not be logical to the client!

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  • Profile picture of the author Deidra Renee
    To add to the phone closing part of the thread...I have *secretly* been closing website deals over the phone for the past week or two. I say secretly because I was supposed to be sharing my results over at the telemarketing forum but have been slacking on that.

    Here's how I did it. I dialed at LEAST 100 #s per day (manually) via skype, with my headset. I used the Offline On Crack script, made some changes to it to make it sound like my own so it would come naturally (for instance, I don't say *folks* so I knew I wouldn't want to say it in a script, so I took it out lol)

    I got my music going, to get souped up to make the calls (I'm still scared to call, but I do it everyday) and I just closed my eyes and dialed. And I mean literally closed my eyes, so needless to say I had to memorize the script.

    After doing the *introduction* I asked the questions needed to see if there was interest, if there was even a HINT of interest, I went right into *Now I send out my invoices via email..do you have access to your email right now, or will you have access to it some time today?* The reason I give the option of accessing it later because I know the majority of the time they would say *no I don't* so i'm letting you know that if you can't access it now, you can still pay me later...you're not getting out of this sale lol

    So once I say that, they either get to their email and pay or say no, but I'll have access to it later. If that's the case I let them know the invoice needs to be paid within 24 hours or I won't be able to deliver the website to them and that's that! My first day doing this I made a sale, second day, nothing, but my leads were majority disconnected on that day. I have consistantly made at least 1 sale per day since (I'm taking a *break* this week for Thanksgiving

    The point is..phone closing can be done. As David said above, you don't have to go to someone's office to tell them exactly what you could tell them over the phone, unless they really don't have time to talk when you call. Setting appointments limits your income. You can't set an appointment in New York if you live in Missouri.

    All of my leads are in Missouri, but NO sales I've made are close to me. They're all in towns I've never even heard of before. It can be done, you just know how to ABC..always be closing..if they get off track, get back into the reason for your call.

    I will get into more detail later, because I have A LOT to say on this subject..and thank you for this thread, It's nice to see something other than *set appointments* And thanks for making it clear to the haters that this is a thread for people who actually WANT to cold call

    ps..what does ATM mean?? lol
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    "At The Moment"



    Hi D.
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  • Profile picture of the author Deidra Renee
    Also, to newbies or anyone that will try to self sabotage themselves with *I don't have a virtual terminal, I don't have an autodialer, etc...I don't have either of those things yet either.

    I had a walk through of safe soft, but my list was too big for the guy to upload at the time and we had some other problems, so he's calling me tomorrow to finish everything up. You can get an unlimited call package from skype for $13 per month and it's free for the first 30 days. If you take massive action you can make that money (and of cours way more lol) before your 30 days is up.

    You don't really need an autodialer. I prefer using a headset vs an actual phone just because it helps my confidence. I guess I feel like I'm actually at work lol But stop making excuses and PICK UP THE PHONE!! Or keep emailing people and hoping it doesn't go to spam.

    I'm not an *email hater* I use to use it allll the time, but it's no where near as fast as telemarketing. I say, just pick up the phone..call at least 100 numbers (I dial 200 now) and make some money
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Uh oh, the man speaks.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jay Rhome
    I regret my "just a bum" comment, because I never feel like that. My point was more on the line that as my website exudes professionalism, I *feel* it can help sales, just like if I meet somebody for the first time, if I'm dressed and come across as a "casual professional" it helps. The first impression thing.

    And John you're right about the fear of viruses with join.me. I remember I felt exactly like that when a tech guy I KNEW used teamviewer to access my desktop... Funny how we forget about such things so easily. Well, it still does a great job of doing a great visual presentation while still working with the phone.


    I see it's not taken very long to get off topic....only a few posts before we're talking about tools to make things easy.
    I use "tools" WITH the phone to add a visual aspect to a sales presentation when the call has actually led there. You want a pure phone close. Fine. I'll leave your precious thread alone. Let's just say I add to edit myself a few times to not write what I really think.
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    • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
      I don't know about you guys, but i have been closing deals on the phone for years, one call one close. and after all this time, when i'm about 5 minutes away from asking for the numbers, or i execute a perfect tie down , or take way, i start to get all jittery , excited, ( not nervous ) but i get a a huge friggin dose of adrenaline. does this happen to you guys as well ?

      To me what is really interesting is the amount im asking for does not correlate with the adrenaline. so 20.00 or 20,000, it still the same awesome feeling.


      Turns out i'm a adrenaline junky, and that is what keeps me going.
      There are only Three parts of selling i like,

      A) when im pre-qualifying,
      B) when im asking for the money
      C) rebuttals -- man i love the rebuttal stage.

      So, that's what i'm really good at, because i have been polishing my "finishing moves" since i was 18. ( 38 now )

      I'm mediocre at best with the rest of it.

      and that is what i can share with this thread if anybody wants to hear
      any of it.

      Personally its now the holidays. so my closes / rebuttals all reflect the holiday status.

      and they will until feb


      --- edit

      I take that back, i am good at one other thing to, and that sniffing out the BS ansers / questions
      people will ask/ say to avoid giving you a sale.

      such as,
      can you send me some info first ... complete bs. you need to re pitch them

      show me your website. more bs

      can you fax me something... uh NO , how will a fax provide you better information than myself -- again complete bs

      and on and on
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      • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
        IM going to try and put an hour or two aside tonight.

        and i will hammer out 10 tie downs and 10 closes.

        and maybe if i have time. 10 rebuttals.

        maybe we all can do that ?

        Lets really teach these naysayers how to use the phone to convert.
        and possible even give some new people a fighting chance.

        I'm so tired of hearing, making phone calls is a waste of time.
        irritates the living sh** out of me.

        You guys game? i think that's what the thread OP is looking for.

        Real world techniques that work on a daily basis
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        • Profile picture of the author David Miller
          Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post


          I'm so tired of hearing, making phone calls is a waste of time.
          irritates the living sh** out of me.

          You guys game? i think that's what the thread OP is looking for.

          Real world techniques that work on a daily basis
          It's right on the money Ken....of course not just for ME.....I think it's time that people stop looking at the phone as a tool for the poor souls that can't spell HTML or SEO but need to make a living just the same.

          Now I don't want to put down web site builders or search engine optimizers as unapoligetically as they would speak of sales people and those of us who believe a sale could be made without the assurance of a broadband connection.

          The fact is that it's not the "website" that makes the sale, it's the "salesperson" that does it.

          "If you build it they will come" is a great thought for a movie fantasy, real life....not so much.
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          • Profile picture of the author David Miller
            I once brought this up on a thread and gave up defending myself because it was becoming a pointless endeavor. Someone, don't remember who, surveyed their customer base and asked a series of questions of them. Among those questions was one about how many times a day they were solicited by "telephone sales people". I proposed that the numbers that were given were probably not accurate. I based this suppositionn on a combination of my own experience and the urban myth that seems to exist whenever telemarketing is brought up. Naturally I was quickly taken to task because my years of experience couldn't compare with an unscientific poll of 60 customers.

            So here is MY experience. I am a director of marketing at a fairly good sized New York law firm. I do not hide my name or position. I make myself accessible to marketing firms because there may be something of value that they may have to offer. I am not difficult to deal with and our "gatekeeper" like most gatekeepers is busy updating her facebook page most of the day.

            So how many calls have I gotten in the past 2 weeks. ONE! Probably no more then 15 in the past 6 months.

            A good friend of mine is a chiropractor. I asked his receptionist if she would be kind enough to keep track of how many sales calls his office gets in any given week. Here's the results of that: 6 robo calls, and one call from an ad salesperson.

            So what's my point in all this? There is a school of thought that when we pick up the phone and call a business that we are "just another annoying telemarketer"....the 100th call they got TODAY! Frankly I believe that's a crock. Yet it's one of those things that keep so many of us from picking up the phone. We don't want to "annoy" anyone.

            Well, if someone is annoyed by my call, or your call, it's not going to ruin my day! If they want to run around all day crabbing about how many phone calls they get, that's their problem, not mine and not yours either.

            Now just to further my point about how not picking up the phone is downright nuts!

            There's a new thread on this VERY forum, and it's someone who wants to know when is a good time to email lawyers. What he's doing looks like I might have an interest....so I sent a PM...I said here's my SKYPE....I want to talk about what you have....I posted that as well....this person is online as I'm typing this....perhaps I should give him my email!
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            • Profile picture of the author Deidra Renee
              Originally Posted by David Miller View Post

              I once brought this up on a thread and gave up defending myself because it was becoming a pointless endeavor. Someone, don't remember who, surveyed their customer base and asked a series of questions of them. Among those questions was one about how many times a day they were solicited by "telephone sales people". I proposed that the numbers that were given were probably not accurate. I based this suppositionn on a combination of my own experience and the urban myth that seems to exist whenever telemarketing is brought up. Naturally I was quickly taken to task because my years of experience couldn't compare with an unscientific poll of 60 customers.

              So here is MY experience. I am a director of marketing at a fairly good sized New York law firm. I do not hide my name or position. I make myself accessible to marketing firms because there may be something of value that they may have to offer. I am not difficult to deal with and our "gatekeeper" like most gatekeepers is busy updating her facebook page most of the day.

              So how many calls have I gotten in the past 2 weeks. ONE! Probably no more then 15 in the past 6 months.

              A good friend of mine is a chiropractor. I asked his receptionist if she would be kind enough to keep track of how many sales calls his office gets in any given week. Here's the results of that: 6 robo calls, and one call from an ad salesperson.

              So what's my point in all this? There is a school of thought that when we pick up the phone and call a business that we are "just another annoying telemarketer"....the 100th call they got TODAY! Frankly I believe that's a crock. Yet it's one of those things that keep so many of us from picking up the phone. We don't want to "annoy" anyone.

              Well, if someone is annoyed by my call, or your call, it's not going to ruin my day! If they want to run around all day crabbing about how many phone calls they get, that's their problem, not mine and not yours either.

              Now just to further my point about how not picking up the phone is downright nuts!

              There's a new thread on this VERY forum, and it's someone who wants to know when is a good time to email lawyers. What he's doing looks like I might have an interest....so I sent a PM...I said here's my SKYPE....I want to talk about what you have....I posted that as well....this person is online as I'm typing this....perhaps I should give him my email!
              I actually *surveyed* my sister too lol She's a receptionist at a doctor's office and I asked her how many sales calls they get because I too was scared to be an annoying telemarketer and she told me...NONE that she can think of since she's been there. She's been there for A YEAR! I'm going to give here the benefit of the doubt and say 1 a month lol The only sales people they get are the drug reps that go office to office and feed the employees to get the doctors to buy samples of new drugs or whatever.

              My point is, people will make you think business owners sit around cussing telemarketers out all day, but you will find that to be very untrue when you start calling. They aren't even as *mean* as you would think. The ones that are-are probably miserable with their life or something because all they have to do is say no and hang up, the cussing and *get a real job*, etc..is unnecessary.

              My next post will get back to phone closing
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              • Profile picture of the author David Miller
                A coincidence no doubt!

                Shortly after I wrote my last post I actually received a sales call. To the best of my recollection this was the first cold call I've gotten in about a month. Now this was no mere salesperson....this was Bloomberg, not the miserable whiney Mayor of New York, but the corporation.

                Bloomberg doesn't have salespeople, they have Market Specialists!

                Let me share with you how this phone call went and I'm going to be as accurate as I can about the chain of events:

                Taking a break from texting, the call was answered by one of our crack support team members. I was told they asked for the managing partner. Calls like that make them pay a bit more attention and they asked what it was in reference to. The message was relayed to me as "David, somebody asked for Bob and I think they are selling something...."

                I want to add at this point that this type of professionalism, or lack thereof is not untypical in a LOT of business environments....but that's a story for another day. Let me also say that our managing partner doesn't have any involvment in the firm's marketing so those calls come to me as a matter of course.

                Now I would like you to pay attention to what these Marketing Specialists proceeded to do....and remember...they are the professionals....not we mere telemarketers....after answering my line with a polite: "Dave Miller, can I help you?"

                Bloomberg: I'm trying to reach Bob Smith, he's the Senior Partner, right?
                Notice they are not bright enough to introduce themselves
                Me: Yes he is, but who are you?
                Bloomberg: I'm calling from Bloomberg and would like to speak with Bob Smith, is he there?
                Notice again, I still don't have a name!
                Me: Maybe you should tell me what it's about, I'm probably the person you should be talking to.
                Bloomberg: Who are you?
                Me: I'm the Director of Marketing for the firm, and you have one last opportunity to introduce yourself.
                Bloomberg: (with a silly giggle) Oh I'm sorry I'm Leanne Somethingorother
                Me: Well Leanne, would you mind taking me off speakerphone, it's difficult to hear you, not to mention rude.
                Bloomberg: No I can't.
                A bit amazed at that!
                Me: You can't?
                Bloomberg: I'm in a conference room with a another Marketing Specialist
                Me: I really don't care, it's difficult to hear you.
                Ignoring the fact that I am annoyed, can't hear her well, I just want to hear what they have and finish my diet coke.
                Bloomberg: At this point she proceeds with a 4 minute non-stop bla bla bla about what they are selling. 4 minutes of someone blathering on is a LONG time.
                Me: What's the licensing fee?
                Bloomberg: 1975 a month.
                Me: We have attorneys in 43 states, can it be networked?
                Bloomberg: I'm not sure.
                Me: Can it be tailored to suit our model?
                Bloomberg: I'm not sure.
                Me: Is there a multiple license discount.
                Bloomberg: Yes
                Me: Would you care to share that?
                Bloomberg: (silly giggle) It would be 1675, so you would save 300 a month.
                Me: Is there something else you'd like to tell me?
                If you're not amazed by this already what comes next should do it.
                Bloomberg: Should I be talking to you, I mean shouldn't I be speaking with Bob Smith?
                Me: Why would you ask that? Do you have a GOOD presentation for him?

                OK...I'm not going to bore you with the rest of this, needless to say it ended with, send me an email, don't call me I'll call you.

                My point to all this, and I do apologize for the length of this, but it's important to realize that Bloomberg is one of the largest most influential corporations in the world. This is what they have representing them.

                By contrast, about 6 months ago I got a call from a woman, her name was Felicia and she was selling placemat advertising. She was pleasant, informative, and had answers. The ad for one pretty busy diner was 495. I bought it. Bloomberg could learn a lot from Felicia.

                I promise you that Felicia is far more sucessful than the Marketing Specialists at Bloomberg will ever hope to be.....of course, Felicia will not be able to say she a Marketing Specialist with a major multinational corporation. Too bad for Felicia, she's just going to have to get by with a better income.

                I think it's important to understand that you don't need an awesome title, or to work for a well known firm, or have access to the latest and greatest techno toy. You just have to have a product that you believe in, a logical way to present it, the answers to a few common questions, and a way to take the money.
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            • Profile picture of the author Rockrz
              Originally Posted by David Miller View Post

              I am a director of marketing at a fairly good sized New York law firm.
              Do you tell people this as to attempt to intimidate them, since you could counter sue them if they tried anything legal against you for what many would claim is high pressure sales tactics?


              Originally Posted by David Miller View Post

              Well, if someone is annoyed by my call, or your call, it's not going to ruin my day! If they want to run around all day crabbing about how many phone calls they get, that's their problem, not mine and not yours either.
              I run a business and sales people call me all the time...I don't get annoyed, I hang up!

              Since I'm in sales myself, I don't care to be "sold" because I only shop when I'm ready to buy and then I do the looking on my own.

              Alot of people are put off by pushy sales people...and then of course there are the slows ones that have money and buy cause that's what the sales guy said they oughtta do.

              You can scam a person in to buying when they've been in sales themselves, and most of the time the people that call me don't have anything I'd buy anyway...especially from some high pressure guy on the phone.

              Personally, that's my red flag when doing any deal...is when the sales guy starts saying I just gotta buy it and I just gotta do the deal...no, I don't have to do anything

              But, good luck to ya...I know there are actually plenty folks that are willing to buy. I'm just not down for pushing people in to buying. I'll make the sale if it's right for them and they understand whassup with it all as I don't steam roll over people... we all reap what we sow in that regard.




              Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

              Objections are not worth straying from your pitch for very much
              But, if I'm a good business person...and I have objections because you aren't taking time to educate me effectively to SHOW me how your product / services is going to benefit ME (I'm the customer, and me don't care about the sales guy when I'm buying something)...then, I'm not buyin!

              That's because high pressure sales is always about the sales guy making commission...not about satisfying the customer.

              This is what's wrong with most sales people...they don't understand that the best money follows SERVING the customer's need, which is where the sales guy earns his money and can sleep good at night because he did right by his customer.

              I used to be in sales / management for a major auto repair, tire company...and high pressure rarely flies in that business. I learned that serving people...is where it's at and is first priority....cause that leads to good things including bigger money.

              It got me in to management where I could run the show and teach other sales people that people are the company's best asset, so we cannot run them over as we are working towards building repeat business over the long term.
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              • Profile picture of the author David Miller
                @Rockrz - I love how everything you've said is completely out of context. Which cable news network are you hoping to work for?

                This is a thread for sales people who respect their profession. It's a post like yours that adds nothing of value and only serves to take a series of helpful posts and than dump a big smelly load of negative crap all over it.

                So you don't really like to sell. You like to people to buy. Guess what, we all do, but that doesn't happen often enough to pay the mortgage and feed the family.

                It got me in to management where I could run the show and teach other sales people that people are the company's best asset, so we cannot run them over as we are working towards building repeat business over the long term.

                Clearly this is a good spot for you. There's an old saying:

                Those who can, do, those who can't, teach....and added to this...those who can't do either, manage!


                I've had people with your attitude about sales work for me and they spread this kind of negative crap about how no one likes a pushy salesperson. It's my experience that this statement is usually made by people who simply are incapable of making a decision.
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                • Profile picture of the author Rockrz
                  Ah, you must be jealous cause I take the position of doing right by my customer BEFORE the almighty dollar!

                  This is what all this comes down to... being pushy and high pressure is all about trying to FORCE people into buying something. Eventually, you will reap the fruits of your ways as that's gonna bite you in the arse one day in the not too distant future.

                  So, what's wrong with being a professional and educating your customer so they can make an intelligent decision concerning the product / service being right for them or not?

                  Isn't that how YOU would like to be treated, or would you rather someone go high pressure on you and insult your intelligence???

                  If you have to pressure people in to buying... you have a product / service that isn't worth selling cause if it was, people would actually WANT they product / service.

                  Yeah, I actually run my own company now and have several side gigs going and do very well with it all to the point that providing for my family is no problem at all...and, I don't have to worry about the law coming after me for questionable sales tactics... you do understand that high pressure sales can get you into alot of trouble...don't you??
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                  • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
                    Originally Posted by Rockrz View Post

                    Ah, you must be jealous cause I take the position of doing right by my customer BEFORE the almighty dollar!

                    This is what all this comes down to... being pushy and high pressure is all about trying to FORCE people into buying something. Eventually, you will reap the fruits of your ways as that's gonna bite you in the arse one day in the not too distant future.

                    So, what's wrong with being a professional and educating your customer so they can make an intelligent decision concerning the product / service being right for them or not?

                    Isn't that how YOU would like to be treated, or would you rather someone go high pressure on you and insult your intelligence???
                    So what do you consider high pressure? asking for the money ?

                    nothign is wrong with "being a professional and educating your customer"

                    But, isn't part of educating some one, telling them when they are wrong?

                    also, while educating, aren't you supposed to motivate them
                    to get off their ass and make a decision?

                    You can do all of that while being professional.

                    I don't know you from adam, but it sounds to me, you don't really know sales. you think you do. but you don't.

                    Your a talker. You talk to your blue in the face, waste your potential clients time, hope you said some thing that might make them take action with you.

                    Im sure that works every now and then. However, its not sustainable income. ins more of a hope and poke.

                    i have a family to feed. when i get on the phone. im not taking the risk.
                    i am not going to be all cuddly, and sweet.

                    I 100% believe in what i sell. And if i am talking to you, then i am talking to you because you need what i have even if you don't know it.

                    My job is to make you know it. Then make you take action, with me.

                    -- edit

                    im not trying to be a dick. but what your saying just does not make any sense to me.
                    but it make just enough sense on first appearance to confuse new people into thinking
                    a lot of wrong things when it come to sales.
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                    • Profile picture of the author Rockrz
                      Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

                      what your saying just does not make any sense to me.
                      How could it??? You live for the almighty dollar FIRST, and the love of money is the root of all evil...meaning, when you get right down to it, you'd to ANYTHING for money including that which is not right!

                      I hope you high pressure boys don't get in trouble for your actions...some prosecutor may need to have a word one day, then it'll be too late cause they'll have recordings of yo high pressure sales pitches... which is actually illegal in a growing number of states.

                      So, be very careful what you say...some folk record sales people so others can be the judge of your tactics....so, don't step over the line...Hope that works out for ya!
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                      • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
                        Originally Posted by Rockrz View Post

                        How could it??? You live for the almighty dollar FIRST,
                        Wrong, I live for my FAMILY first.
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                        • Profile picture of the author Rockrz
                          Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

                          Wrong, I live for my FAMILY first.
                          Is that your excuse for going high pressure on other people's family???

                          Look, I'm no phone sales guy...the reason is because in my business I've had some high pressure phone sales guys call me...and I refuse to do business with anybody that is pushy and that likes to insult people's intelligence. (my years of experience are face to face sales, where you cannot act like an azz and sell anything!)

                          Maybe that's the only way sales can be done over the phone since it's so easy for your prospect to...HANG UP... which is what I do anytime any sales person calls cause I don't have time for some goof ball to tell me over the phone that I just HAVE to have his product / service...no, I don't!

                          Even if I did, I can shop and get the same product / service on my terms at a much better deal because I can deal direct and not have to pay some high pressure, pushy sales guy and award him commissions for being an azz!

                          All I can tell you is that, in my business I have the need to be aware of legal trends, and high pressure sales tactics will in fact get you in trouble, so if you love your family...do them a favor and find some balance where you aren't being high pressure.

                          Because... if you go to jail, who's gonna take care of that family you claim you love so much??? On the other hand.... act however you think you need to act, but remember... you will reap what you sow! Nobody gets around ye olde reaper my friend!
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  • Profile picture of the author Deidra Renee
    Ok, so someone asked me via PM how did I use John's script and get into the close so here was my response to that question.

    After you're done explaining your offer and have quoted the price, just get into your methods of payment. It's really as simple as that. They're either going to stop you and say *hey I didn't say I want it* (lol) or say ok and pay you! Example: "My basic website package is half off right now @ only $300..now I accept payment via paypal, etc.. which one will work best for you today?" They'll either answer or like I said stop you and then you can rebuttal (if you want)

    To add to the response, *I* don't take credit cards over the phone yet, so I just tell them I will be sending them an invoice via email and ask if they can access their email now. I have only had 1 person tell me that they don't have access yet, but will later on. I think the majority think that they won't be able to pay if they don't log into their email at that moment (which is what I want them to believe lol)

    Basically, you just go right into payment options once you quote the price. So for SEO you could say *It's a monthly fee of $500 and we take credit card or check by phone..which one did you want to use today* You don't pause or give them time to think, just basically assume the sale and get right into it, if they don't want it they will let you know..trust me lol

    It's not as bad or hard as it may seem, trust me I'm still scared of the phone, but I do it consistantly everyday now. I have a goal of $6,000 by December 23rd and I will not get to it via email marketing..and that $6000 is not monthly, just a lump sum
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    This reminds me of a time... "I know most non telemarketers arent going to believe this"... but I will put it out there anyway because its true... when I had lost my company where we produced internet generated applications, which we generated ourselves, you can ask Michael Bucker, he was my partner... and recruited "recruiters" over the phone to go out and find customers for our web directory... We had thousands of customers...

    Anyway, after that went down, another company in town (Nashville Tn) asked me to recreate the system for THEM...

    So I did, and they had about 60 telemarketers that I managed and trained... One day I was challenged to close a sale in one call on speaker phone in front of the whole room, and I did.

    Fortunately I was very good at reading applications and picking out my prospects, the ones I knew I could work with (Cherry picking)... besides , I created the system and understood how it worked really intricately.

    So every day after that the owner would come to me and say "Fix Him" and I would fix a telemarketer who was having trouble.

    "Fix Him" meant "Take him in your office and close somebody on speaker phone in front of him".

    So I would have to make one call per day aside from my other GM duties for about a month.

    Im not kidding..

    I knew how to cherry pick my prospects by reading their apps and looking for things I liked...

    I closed 21 sales in a row on speaker phone....

    Just sayin.

    On the twenty second sale I lost my vibe, and blew the close, and got a complex after that and didnt make another call for a month... It hurt me so bad to blow that record. I got to where I thought I couldnt miss.

    True story.

    Ps. They were $300 credit card closes.


    Originally Posted by Deidra Renee View Post


    My point is, people will make you think business owners sit around cussing telemarketers out all day, but you will find that to be very untrue when you start calling. They aren't even as *mean* as you would think. The ones that are-are probably miserable with their life or something because all they have to do is say no and hang up, the cussing and *get a real job*, etc..is unnecessary.

    My next post will get back to phone closing
    Thats such BS... My friend Davids Wallpaper retail store gets about 3 sales calls per week ON A HEAVY WEEK, usually not even that... and virtually NONE from internet marketing companies... Most of the telemarketers are selling print ads or merchant services trying to get him to switch over his credit card processing.

    I get so sick of the "Biz owners get 20 calls per week" BS...did I say TOTAL BS myth?

    THANK YOU DIEDRA!
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    • Profile picture of the author MRomeo09
      I did quite a bit of studying with Jordan Belfort with my staff and lots of his stuff really stood out.

      I think many phone sales people don't really understand how important tonality is. We hammer tonality down to a very high level. It's always a work in progress.

      There are a lot of subtle nuances to tonality that many people aren't aware of. For instance how if you raise your pitch at the end of a statement it creates a subtle mini-agreement. How you can lower your pitch at certain points to create mystery and to really engage their mind, and how you can whisper at strategic points and really get people to listen and believe forgetting their normal internal barriers.

      And then you have to practice and practice the script so you can really get the tonality down. You might have to practice that script 300-400 times before you're REALLY ready to do it on a "live one".

      One of our essential training resources for anyone who is going to be on the phone is the Straight Line Persuasion course. Best $2k I ever spent. Now of course he comes from the boiler room background so not everything he does is immediately applicable, but applying these techniques to something mundane like a dentists office and the results are simply phenomenal.



      Marcos
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      We do not have to become heroes overnight. Just a step at a time, meeting each thing that comes up ... discovering we have the strength to stare it down. - Eleanor Roosevelt

      Your opinion of yourself becomes your reality. If you have all these doubts, then no one will believe in you and everything will go wrong. If you think the opposite, the opposite will happen. It’s that simple.-Curtis Jackson- 50 Cent
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  • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
    Nurtured leads outperform cold calls :: BtoB Magazine

    In fact, the statistics continue to worsen year over year.

    The bottom line is that "cold calling" is a form of LEAD GENERATION. A sales person's function is to CLOSE DEALS. Not generate leads.

    The pure cost analysis should be the deciding factor. If you generate leads in a fashion that's cheaper, then your cost of customer acquisition is lower - leaving more cash for you to run your business and keep in your pocket.

    And it's not a BS myth... maybe in some sectors, but in others, it's obscene. Particularly with high net worth execs on financial lists. 30-40 per day sometimes. I know because I am one.

    The one upside to phone solicitation is that it is truly the looking for the needle in the haystack, which is a much different kind of effort than the mass, direct response marketing effort promoted by most internet marketing... build a list of 10,000,000 and then get a .0001% conversion to be rich.... RICH I TELL YA!!

    I have one client in a vertical that pays $30-40 per click... because his average sale is $500K and "cold calling" represented a customer acquisition cost of $25-30K average (paying someone a draw for a long sales cycle). Going to PPC cut his customer acquisition cost to less than $10K.

    So before diving into the pool after a giant gulp of the koolade... be sure that there isn't another version of the gospel floating around. You might want to think through your strategy before burning up weeks and weeks of time effort that aren't reclaimable.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    All I know Brother is that I have seen more reports of sales on the WF offline forum from cold callers than any other form of marketing...probably all of them combined.

    Ps. No offense but B2B Online Magazine isnt exactly the Alibaba of online marketing magazines.... There are a million business info magazines on the web...
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  • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
    All in context. If most of your context is anecdotes in cold calling mom & pop retail and service shops, then you're going to score hits because they're the decisionmaker and make emotional decisions. If someone is slick in the phone room, we all know that someone can be closed over the phone.

    But step outside of this tiny segment of the B2B space and you're dealing with larger organizations. Exec decisionmakers involve their domain influencers and even have purchasing committees to make recommendations about purchases.

    You simply aren't going to cold call and close a marketing director over the phone when he or she may report to the operations manager, who also has to seek approval for non-budget line item expenditures from the controller... and only then if the vendor is already on the approved list with an open purchase agreement. Otherwise it can take 30-45 days to get into the accounts payable system and legal review.

    Anyone who has worked for any length of time in any business to business environment with companies of anything larger than $1-2 million per year understand this process. That's how I can differentiate between who is playing at what league in what market.

    Context.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Michael have you read my story about Paul the one legged baptist preacher who landed a ten million dollar per year Walmart contract for my friend David Weinberg wallpaper manufacturing plant by cold calling executives out of a wholesale directory with just a pen, a directory, a pitch and a phone?

    Im sure thats not an isolated incident and that it happens in large numbers every day.

    However yes, we are trying to teach average people here how to sell 1-2million dollar per year mom and pop businesses.

    Edit: On another note, I was cold calling small modeling agencies one day and ran across one of the very top ones in the country and landed a deal. The president of a 20 million dollar per year modeling agency picked up the phone, and I pitched him and he became my client and later endorsement.

    I will give you his email address and let you ask him yourself if you want in a pm, if you dont believe me.
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    • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
      Originally Posted by John Durham View Post

      Michael have you read my story about Paul the one legged baptist preacher who landed a ten million dollar per year Walmart contract for my friend David Weinberg wallpaper manufacturing plant by cold calling executives out of a wholesale directory with just a pen, a directory, a pitch and a phone?

      Im sure thats not an isolated incident and that it happens in large numbers every day.

      However yes, we are trying to teach average people here how to sell 1-2million dollar per year mom and pop businesses.

      Edit: On another note, I was cold calling small modeling agencies one day and ran across one of the very top ones in the country and landed a deal. The president of a 20 million dollar per year modeling agency picked up the phone, and I pitched him and he became my client and later endorsement.
      Sure there are exceptions to anything... as we've discussed in the past. But a business model can't be built on exceptions. It must be built on realistic averages.

      If one's target market is mom & pop retail and services of $500K-$2M, then cold calling is certainly viable.

      If you're wanting to target say... managed IT service providers or application development consultants in the $10-50M range, then you might find yourself in for a bit of a slog without some process to manage the average sales cycle of 90-120 days.

      I've hit the lucky lick too... but that makes for great beer conversations and fodder for BS sales letters that entice people into thinking that it's as easy as shooting fish in a barrel. It ain't. Never has been... never will be.

      BTW... this isn't anything new or different. We still square... I am just bringing the angle of "all things in context" back to the discussion since there's a lot of narrow focus on just this method of lead gen.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    There are many great sub shops in Phili, and they all have their fans who think they are the best.

    Michael... I would only give the email address to you mentioned above, because I trust you. Let it be known that this debate doesnt mean I dont agree with you as a "person".

    Still I think cold calling works for just about everything. Investment banking firms have rooms full of them doing nothing but cold calling CEO's every single day.
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  • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
    I recently worked with a client firm that was floundering. Their sales folks (2 of them) were not able to make it happen... but that was a shared problem. The company didn't have a consistent focus or story, so the sales folks were forced to make it up as they go... which led to sporadic sales and inconsistent results. It also made for difficult marketing because they couldn't target their lead gen efforts to a qualified prospect set. They wanted to be all things to everyone, afraid to focus on a particular profile for fear of leaving money on the table.

    In the end, they had no lead generation strategy at all, and worse, couldn't come up with one in short enough order to keep from a budgetary shortfall that was going to create a hatchet for as many as 4 people in a single month.

    They were located in a nice office park, and their core services were applicable to most general businesses. I literally took their sales people with me as we cold called in every building in the park. That is... good old fashioned cold door to door sales calling!

    "Hey we're over in the other building and I was just telling these guys we needed to just go meet our neighbors and see what everyone did as a business..."

    They generated 3 deals out of that exercise for a total of probably $100K in business.

    I am not averse to cold calling or even walking in.

    However, it's not going to be a short sales cycle in any business with size. It's also not going to be particularly scalable (paying people to "do stuff" is expensive in general, and requires a lot of HR and training).

    For a lot of the folks on WF who might be just getting their feet wet in B2B sales, they're going after the low hanging fruit of the mom & pops and small service business. No problems... make it happen!!

    And you can even make the case that if you call enough people, you'll get lucky. But in general, most B2B selling is based on a marketing lead generation effort... hopefully resulting in qualified prospects. Whether that's trade show marketing, cold calling, direct mail, etc... the marketing activity is designed to generate a prospect who is further interested in engaging in a buying discussion. You can spend lots of money and brute force to find that prospect... or you can lower your costs and nurture your leads so that your expensive personal time spent in sales mode is being directed towards prospects more likely to close.

    They're more likely to close because they're further along their own BUYING PROCESS. You can help facilitate that buying process at times, but trying to impose your own SELLING PROCESS onto a B2B buying process usually results in disaster. Cold calling success stories simply mean that the phone rang right when the buyer was already interested, likely had already made the decision to buy from someone, and then the phone rang. Not bad if you're the holder of that lottery ticket... but what about all the other people who said not interested right now? Those people may buy in the future... in fact, statistically they will buy (if you're selling into a targeted prospect base). What's the nurturing cycle? Those "no's" today are someone else's yes. A systematic approach to demand gen captures a larger share of those while building your street cred with the prospect through facilitating their buying process with education... value add.... etc...
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Certainly there is a place for all types of sales. And yes, fortune 500 companies have processes. Paul the one legged baptist preacher landed wal marts interest on a cold call, but there was definitely a process following it as you describe. Sometimes you are just closing them on the opportunity to get your foot in the door. Still cold calling for permission to proceed works.

    In any event, I think for the most part the people reading this "are" focusing on small mom and pop businesses....closing $300- $500- $3,000 deals. and you can do that cold calling faster than any other method and in more volume.

    Edit: UNLESS, you have a 50-100k ad budget.

    In fact you can actually cold call a buyer at Walmart right now and book a meeting to go demonstrate your widget, they actually have a department that does nothing but that 5 miles down the road from me. Im in Benton county... Walmart world. lol
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  • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
    Well... you could buy a list from Hoovers and drive the targeted traffic to a landing page offering premium content in exchange for an opt-in.

    Then you could literally put a million dollar pipeline into place in a couple of days time... more business than you could ever manage, even with a relatively low conversion.

    Spend your phone time actually closing pre-qualified prospects who have already opted in for your stuff and know your name.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Wheres the link?
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  • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
    To what? Hoovers?

    Hoovers | Business solutions from Hoovers

    It's Dunn and Bradstreet.

    EDIT... the idea is that if you want to saw a board into two... well you could use a butter knife or you could use a Stihl 460 Magnum chainsaw.
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  • Profile picture of the author MRomeo09
    David- Strike Three You're Out???
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    We do not have to become heroes overnight. Just a step at a time, meeting each thing that comes up ... discovering we have the strength to stare it down. - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Your opinion of yourself becomes your reality. If you have all these doubts, then no one will believe in you and everything will go wrong. If you think the opposite, the opposite will happen. It’s that simple.-Curtis Jackson- 50 Cent
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  • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
    BTW John, BtoB Online is the online version of B2B Magazine, which is essentially the defacto Ad Age for business to business marketing and selling. The largest trade pub in the world dedicated to B2B selling.

    It's not some little pimptastic blog site.
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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Here's another good one, Thanks. ThomasNet® - Product Sourcing and Supplier Discovery Platform


      Originally Posted by MichaelHiles View Post

      BTW John, BtoB Online is the online version of B2B Magazine, which is essentially the defacto Ad Age for business to business marketing and selling. The largest trade pub in the w orld dedicated to B2B selling.

      It's not some little pimptastic blog site.
      Alright man... :rolleyes:...
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      • Profile picture of the author kirbymarketingconcierge
        where is the thread headed?

        cold calling works.

        john is right, michael is right.

        room to sell your way and most ways.

        p.s. - I could sell michael with 1 phone call and john over several weeks
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  • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
    I'm just saying... there's far more than a single way to skin the cat. If someone is a broke joke, has nothing but an idea and a phone... hammer the stinking pizz out of it.

    But as fast as you can, build out a model and a solution to scale and get yourself into a different position.
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Lol.... Yeah, because I dont even pick up my phone most of the time (Unless I recognize) ... and check my messages only every other day.
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  • Profile picture of the author MichaelHiles
    No you couldn't Kirby... because I am not the decision-maker.

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    • Profile picture of the author John Durham
      Originally Posted by MichaelHiles View Post

      No you couldn't Kirby... because I am not the decision-maker.

      ROTFLMAO!!
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      • Profile picture of the author kirbymarketingconcierge
        Re: Phone Sales - Let's Try Again
        Quote:
        Originally Posted by MichaelHiles
        No you couldn't Kirby... because I am not the decision-maker.



        ROTFLMAO!!

        michael, thank you for the NO.

        David wanted cold calling and rebuttals.

        I love the No's. it pisses me off in a good way.

        for newbies : no's are your ally, not to be avoided.
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        • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
          Hey guys, as promised, im going to hammer out some things that work for me.
          First let me just say, i'm a hell of a lot better sounding on the phone, then i am in print.

          What i'm going to post here isn't conjecture, isn't, "i think this may work",
          or even "this should work", or worse "i heard that this works."

          This is stuff i use, stuff that works for me daily.


          First thing is, everyone has there own personality on the phone. Personality and trust sell.

          Truth be told, personality and trust, are more important the the actual product or the price.

          My personality fluctuates, based on who i am talking to and how they act.

          For instance, if im talking to a new yorker, i speak faster .. a lot faster, and i add in a bit of a ny accent,
          and i damn sure let them know i was born in flatbush.

          If im talking to some one from the west i slow way down and draw out my words, and i absolutely DON'T tell them i am from NY.


          if this sounds hard, its not, it becomes second nature. The key here is to mimic the person on the other end of the phone, its builds trust very quickly.

          ( if your wonder why or how, its all psychology, everybody thinks highly, of how they portray themselves and if your mimicking them, and you do it properly, they feel a instant connection to you ... ie themselves )


          Next part of my personality, is I control the conversation. To me, this is the single most important part of a phone call. if you cant control the conversation, it has no direction, and you will never
          be able to even get close to asking for the money.

          The key to controlling the conversation for me, is to do it with questions. the only way to do that, is to only ask questions that will give back answers that you want.

          Another tool i use for directing the conversation if it does get off track, is by what i call the bitch slap, this can be in the form of a take away

          ( well obviously your not interested in generating more revenue for your company or you would actually be paying attention to me.)

          , or some thing silly like asking if they like anchovies on their pizza

          The point is simply to take control of the conversation back from the potential client.

          Now i use questions to do several things at one time.

          A) control the conversation
          B) Pre qualify the prospect / lead
          C) create a feeling of how much i care.
          D) find out the personality type of the person
          E) and I use what i call yes questions.
          F) emotional blackmail questions

          ( i want to hear them say the word yes about 30 or more times during a phone call. basically yes questions are questions that 99% of the time you will here the response yes to )

          a lot of people over look yes questions. They are super powerful.

          If they say yes,yes,yes, and then you ask for anything from them, they are so used to saying yes, they literally have to stop and think for a minute before they can even say the word NO.


          try it, say yes 10 x in a row and then try and say no. see what happens


          Another part of my phone personality, is i present myself as a senior business consultant.

          the reason i do this is it immediately sets the tone. i am the authority. I can now say things and get away with things other callers cannot. Such as

          ( you just told me spent X amount a month on tv advertising, and obviously that isn't working, now is it bob? time to stop wasting money isn't it ? )

          or your spending how much for a return ? how come you haven't been fired yet.

          Or, one of my favorites,

          (Bob, you told me you were the decision maker, were you lying to me ?)


          Setting myself up as the authority, also allows me to ask questions about there private fiances which in turn allows me to pre qualify them, on how much i can make the sale for.

          I take the authority vibe one step farther, and i establish it with in 10 seconds on the phone.

          pull this off properly, and you can ask them any damn thing you want.

          this is how i do it.

          "Hi Bob this is Rick, I'm one of the senior business consultants with XX consulting, here at richard hiltons, daytona beach office."

          That might look corny in print. but try it before you knock it. because if you pull that off properly, you can not only establish control quickly, but you will be able to ask the important questions.

          to me the important thing is. what am i going to sell them?, and how much can i sell it to them for? and can i get a credit card today.

          That might sound harsh. but i'm on the phone to make money. So during my phone sessions, it is all i care about.

          Getting the money. and getting it in a way that will not result in a charge back.

          ( that means no lying, no stretching the truth )

          Here i'm going to give you a quick example of ONE of the ways i pre qualify.

          word of warning, pre-qualifying is an art form, in my opinion, to do it properly it is harder then sales.

          if you do it wrong, you sound nosy at best, and a scammer at worse.

          ---------------------------------

          Ok, bob great, so you have been in business 10 yrs, and your seeing a 3% growth every 6 months,
          am i right, is that what you said?

          (Bob) yes

          (me) excellent, well first i want to ask you, are you happy with that?

          (bob) no

          (Me) of course not, your in business to make more money that that.
          The next important question is how are you doing it.

          (bob) we are doing a half page spread in the local newspaper or radio. or whatever.

          (me) OIC, yeah those newspapers dont work as well as they used to, do they bob ?

          (bob) no, they sure dont

          (me) I remember back in the day when ads were running only about a grand a wk.

          (bob) i wish.

          (me) sound like your getting raked over the coals on price

          (bob) yeah i am

          (me) whats the circulation on that ad your running

          (bob) i think its 300,000

          (me) and whats that running you per wk.

          (bob) $2500.

          (me) bob , so your spending 10k a month for only 3% growth. those numbers seem way off. sound to me like you need some thing to work better, and cost less, am i right Bob?

          (bob) yes

          (me) bob, tell me real quick, how long have you been running that ad?

          (bob) 6 months

          (me) bob, let me ask you, how bad does it sting to right that check every month ?

          (bob) a bit

          (me) Bob im just curious, if i could show you a strategy to use the money coming in from your business instead of taking any more cash out of your pocket, using your credit cards, would you be interested?

          (bob) of course

          (me) well it only works with a few kinds of cards visa, master card and discover.

          it does NOT work with american express. so bob do you have one of those?

          (bob) yes

          (me) i use visa myself bob, which one do you use?

          (bob) visa

          ( me) great, and that is a credit card right ?? not one of those debit cards ?

          *** ( if he says debit, ill ask him about any other cards, i get too much buyer remorse with debit cards ) ***

          and you said your currently paying $2500 a wk. now, so let me ask you, can your Visa hold $2500?

          it can? excellent.

          ok bob ill explain the strategy part here in a few min. but i'm trying to get a better overlay of your business right now, so i really want to know what other types of advertising you have tried.. even the ones that failed.


          (shhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh hhhhhhhh)

          ( let him talk )

          ------

          if u got here YOU HAVE HIS ATTENTION and you know the minimum amount you can charge.

          and if you let him keep talking you will find out what stuff he has tried, and why it failed.

          this is in danger of becoming a lay down. simply because the more he talks, the more ammo you have for closing him

          ----


          And you haven't even pitched him yet.

          There is a 1000 and one ways to pre qualify some one, the trick is to know every thing you say and do and every thing the potential client on the phone says and does has a value , perceived or real.
          its there, and you can always use that value as a rebuttal and to pre qualify.

          ----------------------------



          Wow, i talk about getting carried away, i was just planning on doing a few tie downs, rebuttals and closes.

          ill do that on the next post.
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          Selling Ain't for Sissies!
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    There was this _____________ over in another thread that I wasted my best post on buying signals on... Im bringing it over here for Davids sake to get this back on track, a little revised to better fit the context. This is a better place for it.

    What are buying signals on the phone?

    How much do you charge?

    How long does it take to get results?

    How do customers see me on search engines?

    I want links going down the side, can you do that?

    can you link it to_____?

    Do I get to choose my own template or design?

    What do I have to do from my end?

    Almost any question they ask that tells you they are "considering" is a buying signal.

    Once you get buying signals you are in as long as you dont blow it and give the right answers... anytime you get the idea that they are considering the pros and cons, it means they are leaning toward buying but just want to be comforted. You can drive it home.

    Do I get my own domain or is it a subdomain?

    Is this a template page?

    Can I update it when I need to?

    Do You are charge for updates?

    Do my employees get their own dot com email addresses?

    Can I put pictures of my staff?

    Can I list___________ or____________?

    You arent like this other guy who ___________ are you?

    You arent going to charge me for ____________ are you?

    Do I get stat reports?

    Again, almost any question they ask is a plea for comfort because they are considering you, and thats a buying signal. It shows their interest.

    It can also come in the form of statements and not questions such as:

    I was really concerned with the last guy because he___________

    I really wanted _________ on my last site but the guy said _____________

    Last time some guy quoted me he said ___________ but I thought that was way too much...

    They are telling you they want someone to work with and want to be sure you are the right guy. This can get very deep.... this should be an interesting thread.

    Basically anything you hear that tells you they are still interested means you havent blown it.

    The fact that you are still pitching at all is a sign of initial interest... An object in motion stays in motion till its met with resistance... as long as you say the right things you can easily close fifty percent of the people who invite you out or more.

    The initial interest is in motion... just dont create any resistance.

    Buying signals mean you have the sale up against the ropes , now all you have to do is pay attention, and look for an opening to knock it out.

    BAMMM!

    Close in hand.

    "Hey Babe, I made money today!! Lets go out and celebrate! Just look at this     PHAT Sale!! Can you believe it? Our business is working!"


    It would be impossible to address every buying signal in one post, and we are only talking about buying signals; haven't even touched "take aways" yet.

    Those are even cooler!

    However,
    First you address the buying signal by comforting them with a benefit or two...and even go an extra mile, then follow it with a take away, then a relief from the take away.

    Example:
    Customer: Do I get my own domain name?

    Yes, its really your own domain too, not a sub domain like alot of these companies issue...

    ( You are inferring alot here without saying it... He's thinking "Wow, I didnt know they did that".)

    As a matter of fact, we even register it for you and handle all details associated with assigning it to your host ... you dont have to worry about any of the registration     details , setting up your own hosting or anything...

    (Again your answer is inferring that with other companies he might have to actually get involved with the registration process personally... but you arent saying it... In his mind, it sounds like he is saving himself alot of headaches by hiring you...

    Now, that you sound too good to be true, even though the things you mentioned are just normal routine things, you have to add a "take away" to make it seem more "real" again.

    I will put the "take away" in red:

    Do I get my own domain name?

    Yes, its really your own domain too, not a sub domain like alot of these companies issue...

    As a matter of fact, we even register it for you and handle all details associated with assigning it to your host ... you dont have to worry about any of the registration details , setting up your own hosting or anything...

     Now you will have to pay another $14.00 every 2 years... to keep it current...


    (He's thinking "Oh! You are taking away my benefit that I loved so much"?)

    Then again you get to provide relief and be his hero again...

    But dont worry, they renew it automatically for you... so you dont have to think about it.

    (Whew! Relief! You gave back the benefit!)




    This sort of emotional cat and mouse , and occasional take away makes him want to act faster at the close before a take away comes... So lets look again:

    Do I get my own domain name?

    Yes, its really your own domain too, not a sub domain like alot of these companies issue...

    As a matter of fact, we even register it for you and handle all details associated with assigning it to your host ... you dont have to worry about any of the registration details, setting up your own hosting or anything...

    Now you will have to pay another $14.00 every 2 years... to keep it current... (slight pause and raising of eye brow as if "You understand that right?) But dont worry, they renew it automatically for you... so you dont have to think about it.




    The above is an example of how you (or at least "I") work a buying signal. You can try to think of some ways on your own of how you might deal with specific ones...


    If there is a system I would say...

    "Answer the buying signal with the answer, added benefit to make it too good to be true, then a take away to make it true again, and then a relief from the takeaway...

    But if all else fails, dont think too hard, just give him a good answer that will meet his buying signal with satisfaction...

    During (throughout) the call try to keep a sense of when to offer benefits and when hes feeling you are too good to be true, and provide a take away in those moments.

    Then relieve the take away... dont be mechanical though, try to be natural.

    The biggest thing to remember is that if he wasnt interested, then you wouldnt still be talking.

    "An object in motion stays in motion...". The biggest part of your job will be "Just dont blow the interest thats already there".

    Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

    That is pure truth. It also seams to be the hardest thing for new people to learn. well, that and just telling them to go get their credit card.
    Thats the easy part, if you worked through pitch thoroughly, its the natural conclusion to end the meeting, and comes across easily...

    At the end of your pitch ask if there are any questions... he will probably say "What do I need to do to get started"... then you just say well... I can go ahead and get this started as soon as we get your down payment processed...I can either do that by visa, mastercard, or check by phone, whichever is easiest for you... (pause and let him answer).

    If he doesnt ask first then close by saying...

    "Okay well I think I have everything I need here... now as far as payment ....".

    Next thing you know .,.. "I got one honey, I slammed one home..."!

    Objections are not worth straying from your pitch for very much- You want to try and roll over those as quick as possible and get back to the script-, but BUYING signals are worth pausing for.... If you start getting those, then slow down and give them the full treatment using the system above, then go back to pitching the script once they are totally satisfied.

    You can even try to "create" them with questions, ask enough of them in your pitch and you will hit a hot button that brings them forward. The point is that you have to be "pitching" thats why we use a system. You cant get to the questions that bring out the buying signals if you cant get through your greeting, which is the point of "Quickly rebuttal and redirect" Whenever reasonably possible.

    It helps to have your rebuttals laid out so you can refer to them quickly and then "Like I was saying..." back to the pitch.
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    • Profile picture of the author kirbymarketingconcierge
      IMO

      Advice

      take what john has above.

      make phone calls and record both sides of the conversation.

      you will pick up these (if you're not already), because
      sometimes were so involved in the sales pitch, we don't listen.

      what if they ask a buying question (signal) within the 1st minute and you miss it?


      ouch!
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  • Profile picture of the author John Durham
    Awesome... Wow. Nice. Back when I was on the phone personally, sometimes I would get up and have alot of bass in my voice, so I could do the authority vibe for about 3 1/2 hours, then the voice started losing bass, so I would switch to a different vibe. Its like, you dont look like a bum if you just go with the vibe... you look "grunge" and it works.
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    • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
      I noticed i left out a few things, so i figured i would address them before i did the rebuttals and closes.

      Showing i care
      ------------------------------------------------
      ------------------------------------------------

      When i am on the phone with a potential client, i know the client needs to feel as if i care.

      This is all about trust.
      Trust that i care enough about them, to lead them in the correct direction
      Trust that i wont rip them off
      Trust that i actually know what im doing,

      Simply put, the more trust you build, the more money you can ask for.

      I do this with questions. The more questions you ask the more they think you care.

      It really is a silly concept, but for some reason its human nature.

      ( ask a girl 100 questions about her that aren't off the wall or stupid, and shes going to want to marry you )

      Now you cannot machine gun these questions, and you really have to listen well to understand what questions to ask, and you have to sprinkle them through the conversation.


      and of course, if your smart about it, you can make turn them into YES questions.

      (me) Bob, you sound like your killing your self over there to make a living, is that right ?

      (me) You had great goals when you first started out, didnt you?

      (me) Bob would you be happy if i could help you get your business back on track today?

      (me) Now bob, take a moment to think about this before you answer me, but why bob, why are you in business for yourself?


      (bob) independence, better for my family, i want to be rich.

      ( i hear all kinds of reasons some really crazy ones )

      (me) bob, what do you mean, better for your family? you mean like putting your kids thru college?

      (bob) yes, and other things

      (me) like what ?

      This can go on forever if you let it. So don't let it, just remember your collecting information to create a bond, mannerisms to emulate, and closing bullets.

      When you have enough info, or you got the yes'es flowing or you can feel his attitude change, to the point that, your not just a buisness consultant, but hes now talking to you like a friend you got him.

      Its going to be impossible for him to say no to you at this point
      no matter what you just asked for. He just made a friend, and he wont want to let his new friend down.

      At this point, its all about money. and if he has it. its yours.


      ------------------------------------------------
      ------------------------------------------------


      Finding out the personality type.

      Knowing the personality type of the person your on the phone with is pretty important.

      You can sell them with out knowing it. However it is a LOT easier in some cases if you do.

      Goverment workers, retired military, retired police, retired nurses, all respond to well to taking orders.

      Like this: Go get a pen a piece of paper and your credit card, and ill hold while you get that.


      Sales people god bless them there are 2 types. they will almost always let you get a pitch off.

      Both want to check out your "moves", both will tell you were you went wrong. BOTH will buy from you if you dont blow your lines. we are weak. hell, we will buy off of principal alone if your any good.

      As long as they aren't messing with you because you flubbed your lines, just keep closing them no joke. rebut, close, rebut, close , rebut close, some where around the 4 or 5th time they will start to get seriouse. and you will sell them. and truthfully... the ones that sell high ticket items are the easiest ones to sell too.

      ( i cannot answer the phone at home , its a rule, becuase my wife knows ill buy just about everything )

      Then you have the honesty vrs shady personality. you can tell this pretty quick

      The honesty type is super simple to work with, he is as honest as the day is long, and even tho he knows that he doesnt know you, and that he should not blindly trust you, he will any way. its in his nature.

      You can help this along by saying things like

      ( bob, yes you have the potential for an 8% increase, but you have to remember, this is advertising. its all about potential, so as much as i want to guarentee you 8% or more, i cant in good concience do that.
      it just would not be fair, now would it?

      Or answer his questions very directly, and say fair enough ?

      ---

      now the shady guy is a different story. he assumes your lying. period. but he interested enough to see what your about. so he is just looking for somethign to prove he is right. but since you know his personality type.

      Avoid saying things like ( trust me ) or ( fair enough ) or even something as mundane as ( believe me ) these are saying he prob uses, when hes trying to pull a fast one.

      I used to sell these guys, just for the sake of the challenge... now. i deep six them. They are nothing but long term problems.

      There are a lot more types, but i really don't want to wright a book

      -------------------------------------------
      -------------------------------------------


      OK that's enough for now, its late and i'm tired. ill try and get the rebuttals done some time today for you guys.
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      • Profile picture of the author David Miller
        The fact is that most people here are working with the mom and pops, not because they are the low hanging fruit, but for the simple fact that the Marketing Specialists, Account Executives, and Business Development Consultants aren't calling them. They're too busy with the highly prized and sophisticated 27 step selling process. We just want to close the deal and deposit a check.

        Now can we stay with phone sales please?

        (I know this post is out of sequence but lost my power last night around 10PM EST and saw where this thread moved in another direction....thanks for bringing it back on track)
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        • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
          David,
          i really did not know i had so much to say. Took me a moment to figure out why. I have a passion for selling, i love it. As a matter of fact i could have taken another path in my life, and i chose sales.
          Telephone sales specifically.
          It is probably the single most important as well as the best decision i ever made in my life. I am 20 yrs into my career, and i am still happy with my choice, so happy in fact i cannot wait to teach my son this trade.

          I urge anybody and everybody to not listen to all the BS.
          and just try it for yourself. Its the only way you will know for sure if its for you or not. Its not easy, and there is a lot to learn. but this is one of the few jobs where you can make some serious cash while your learning.

          and if you do learn how to pick up the phone and make a deal.

          well, then you really will have the world in the palm of your hands.

          Ill post those rebuttals later, i am 30 min late for getting on the phone today.

          so. its time to dial


          edit ---
          Feel like going old school? remember back in the day, before we got on the phones and we
          had one of those meetings were we would throw objections on the floor,
          and and we had to rebut ?

          got the mojo flowing ...

          we could do that here, you throw and objection, ill rebut , and throw a objection your way.

          could be fun, and it would def give this thread some knowledge , we might even be able to get some others to join in ...
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          • Profile picture of the author David Miller
            Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

            Feel like going old school? remember back in the day, before we got on the phones and we
            had one of those meetings were we would throw objections on the floor,
            and and we had to rebut ?

            got the mojo flowing ...

            we could do that here, you throw and objection, ill rebut , and throw a objection your way.

            could be fun, and it would def give this thread some knowledge , we might even be able to get some others to join in ...
            Ken....

            That's exactly what I know a lot of people (myself included, of course) would love to see. It's the essential element of sales. The great thing about sales, in general, is that you can go from broke to having your bills paid, to a lot more than that in just a couple of days...maybe less.

            The great thing about phone sales is that you can do it a lot faster, and it doesn't matter if you're so broke you can't afford a tank of gas.

            Over the years I've had the occassion to hire salespeople, both phone and on the road sales. Many of the "sales people" told me that they had to have a guaranteed base in order to work for me. They would tell me that I needn't worry, they guaranteed they would make sales. Do I need to finish the rest of this story?
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  • Profile picture of the author Ashley Wright
    This here is a very good thread! Plus it has come at the right time as I am now focusing instead of setting appointments to actually closing on the phone as like many of said here it is possible and at the same time I believe it saves a lot more time and money.

    What I am wanting to know and learn is how flow from Introduction > Pitch > Close without boring the potential client, or making it feel like I am the one doing all the talking etc.

    When I set appointments I prefer to see it as just the introduction in simple terms "Bob, can I meet you to give you more info"

    Bob: YES/NO

    Then from there I book the appointment or I put the phone down and ring the next person.

    My only worry before reading this thread was thinking "Will someone actually pay for my service over the phone" and that seems to now be a certain yes!

    So back to my point if someone can go through the transition stages that would be great, then the next thing I will just need to focus on is getting past the introduction stage

    "Telesales is a numbers game" but if I can make 1 sale worth £250/$390 every 4 hours at least then I know my job is making me £62.50 an hour which some would say is not bad at all
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    • Profile picture of the author David Miller
      Ashley...

      That's exactly what this thread is about. Sharing information and ideas to move beyond setting appointments and getting the deal done on the phone. Before there's any flack about the necessity for face to face sales, let me just say that although that may be true, in a great number of instances, the appointment just adds one more, often unnessecary step to the process.

      One of the most challenging elements of sales is getting in touch with the decision maker. So let's take the appointment setting strategy.

      You get the decision maker on the phone after perhaps 3 attempts. Granted there are times when it's the first attempt, but often there are callbacks and voicemails and a host of other bobs and weaves before you finally get the appointment.

      Now you have to make sure that the appointment is within an intelligent time frame, let's say within 48 hours.

      The day of the appointment, you wonder to yourself...."should I call and confirm?" If you do, there's the risk of giving the prospect the opportunity to cancel. If you don't, there's the risk they may not be there. Regardless of your choice, it's clear that in the back of your mind, if not closer to the front, that your prospect most likely doesn't think this meeting is very important. Most likely, that's the case anyway.

      Best case scenario at this point, you arrive at the scheduled time and have the opportunity to make your presentation. That's great, but, are you a one call closer? After all this effort, if you're not, you've wasted a lot of time and energy and decreased the odds of a sale exponentially.

      Now, let's look at the phone sale.

      You've got the decision maker on the phone. Instead of the appointment script, you now have a sales script. Everything is in place to make a sale happen.

      Unlike the appointment scenario, you won't have to wind the prospect up and then let him off the hook, we all know he's going to forget the nature of your offer, and it a lot of cases, everything up to and including your name by the time you're face to face....we've all been there.

      In the long run, you're being of more value to everyone concerned by conducting the entire process on the phone.
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      • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
        Originally Posted by David Miller View Post


        In the long run, you're being of more value to everyone concerned by conducting the entire process on the phone.
        Nobody ever seems to get that. I have tried explaining that to people myself.
        glad to see a few like minds here in the WF.
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        • Profile picture of the author kirbymarketingconcierge
          yes. nobody gets it.

          When I worked for Qwest communcations, they never got it.

          keep in mind this is a telecommunications company.

          sales training: we were taught to go to industrial areas to get face to face, but you end up just collecting business cards.

          you then came back into the office, and got on the phone!!!!

          how blind can business be?

          p.s. - were not TM'ers! Were business people & professionals (the mind is a terrible to thing to waste on the phone ----> sales - it's a mind game)

          mr. biz. owner :

          I use the phone, it's still the best business tool. it saves us both time and money.
          besides, I'm nothing to look at!
          now here's what we need to get started..."what credit card would you like to use? "
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    • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
      Originally Posted by Ashley Wright View Post

      What I am wanting to know and learn is how flow from Introduction > Pitch > Close without boring the potential client, or making it feel like I am the one doing all the talking etc.
      Maybe this will help you. ( this is assuming that you have made appointments and actually made a sale after going to the appointment )


      Take a pen and paper, and right down everything that you said at the app.

      on another piece of paper right what they said.

      on a third. right out there questions and your responses


      now you have a base pitch, a base rebuttal sheet, and some common questions

      then get on the phone. and just start reading it. see what happens
      it will be very clear to you very quickly what you need to change.

      but it is a start , and that is what you need.
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      • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
        Here is a close, it works like a charm. in this case i made bob a little bit difficult.

        if you pre qualify ahead of time, this covo would have been a lot easier.
        You would have known exactly how much bob had to spend , with out the song and dance.

        This starts at the money. I chose this part to show, because if you sold it right everyone wants what your selling, the only thing stopping them is the money.

        If you find that isn't the case for you and your product. Then you are doing some thing wrong.


        -----


        (me) its $5500,00 to get you started today.

        (bob) uh, i don't have that type of money to invest in anything right now

        (me) ok bob, put the cost aside for one minute, can you do that?

        (bob) yes

        (me) Do you want to get started today?

        (bob) yes

        (me) and the only thing holding you back is the cost?

        (bob) yes

        (me) is that because you don't have $5,500.00 or you don't want to spend $5,500?

        (bob) i don't have it.

        (me) so bob, your saying if this was just 5.00 you would signed a check by now, is that correct?

        (bob) yes

        (me) well bob, we both know this isn't 5 bucks, and it will never be 5 bucks, but, now that i now your serious,

        let me ask you, if i can show you how to use the money coming in from your business instead of taking any cash out of your pocket, would you be ready to get started today?, right now ?

        (bob) of course

        (me) bob, have you ever heard of credit card stupidity, vrs credit card strategy?

        (bob) no

        (me) let me give you an example of stupidity bob, stupidity, is when you use your credit card to buy a bunch of stuff, and it never helps do anything except put you in the hole.

        for instance, you told you me you have 2 kids and a wife, and since christmas is right around the corner, lets use that.

        how much money did your wife spend on christmas last yr?

        (bob) i dunno couple grand

        (me) well bob, how much money did that couple of grand make you?

        (bob) nothing

        (me) that's right, bob, you got a few smiles, and everyone was happy for a few days, but the reality is you got stuck with a bill, and it did not help your business out one little bit, did it?

        (bob) yeah

        (me) so credit card strategy bob, that what its about, credit card strategy
        is simply using the money coming in from your business, instead of taking any cash out of your pocket.

        Now bob if you put that 5,500 on your credit card today. your not going to have to pay for anything until your next billing statement comes in, right ? about 30 days or so, correct?

        (bob) yes

        (me) and when it does come in you wont have to lay down 5,500 all at once now will you?

        (bob) no

        (me) right, so lets leverage your credit card to help your business, simply put bob, on a 5500 charge what do you think your min monthly will be?

        (bob) 100 bucks

        (me) bob unless you have fantastic credit, your min monthly will prob be more then that. but for the sake of argument, lets just say its 200, is that fair enought?

        (bob) yes

        (me) so bob, if everything we talked about works properly, do you believe you have the potential to bring in more then your minimum monthly payment?

        (bob) yes

        (me) great, then ill hold while you go get that.

        (bob) i cant

        (me) cant what bob?

        (bob) i cant do it, i don't have $5,500

        (me) bob, i am not asking you to cut a check, lets use credit card strategy

        (bob) i don't have 5500 on my credit card.

        (me) bob, lets start at the top. can you split that up on a few credit cards?

        (bob) no i only have one

        (me) well bob whats the available on it?

        (bob) around 4000

        (me) well bob that's pretty far off from 5500, i cant get you started for 4k.

        i just cant do it. i'm sure you understand , right bob ?

        (bob) yea

        (me) any way you can come up with the other 1500 today?

        (bob) no

        (me) well bob, that's too bad, i guess your going to have to pass on this for now.

        that's a shame bob, i was really excited too, about helping your business grow.

        (me) bob before i let you go. are you sure its just the money holding you back?

        (bob) yea

        (me) so if it was only 4k you would be giving me your credit card right now?

        --------------------------------------------------------------

        **** --- don't say a single word here --- not one word. *****

        if he comes back right away with a yes, then it really is JUST money,

        if he takes a minute or so. some thing is missing hes not sold yet.
        you need to find out where you lost him, and re pitch that just that area, and go right back into the close.

        for this conversation were going to assume it really is a money issue and that's it.

        -------------------------------------------------------------


        (bob) yes

        (me) well bob we both know it isn't 4k and it will never be 4k, but you sound really serious,

        are you really serious bob ?

        (bob) yes

        (me) bob, we use testimonials, all the time for our advertising, we obviously cannot pay for testimonials its against the law

        but let me ask you, if i worked with you, and helped your business do everything we talked about, would you be willing to provide us with a testimonial?

        (bob) of course

        (me) ok bob this is what i am going to do for you,

        Since your willing to work with me on the testimonials, ill work with you and help you get started.

        does that sound fair bob?

        (bob) yes

        (me) this is what i am going to do bob, you said you have 4000 on your credit card correct ?

        (bob) yes

        (me) i don't want to take your last penny bob, that's bad for business, plus i want to show you how much i believe in our work here at XX consulting.

        Today you put 3000 on your visa card, in 30 days you put another 1000 on your credit card.

        now that's a total of 4000 isn't it bob ? now i am not eating 1500 , that's not going to happen.

        but, i am going to put my money where my mouth is.

        Bob, in 90 days i am going to send you in invoice, that invoice will be for the remaining 1500 dollars

        now bob, i need you to understand what this invoice is all about.

        like i said bob, i am going to put my money where my mouth is.

        i am going to do that by predicating the remaining 1500 completely on your success!

        what that means bob is simple, if in next 90 days you are 100% satisfied, if you are absolutely blown away by our service,

        then your going to cut me a personal check bob, and your going to provide us with a testimonial,

        the flip side of that bob, is if your not 110 percent satisfied, when you receive that invoice bob, you simply throw the invoice in the garbage because you don't owe me a another dime.

        Ok bob, i showed you i am serious, i put my money where my mouth is, now its your turn.

        Now bob, tell me, is it your business name on the credit card, or your name?

        Your name? excellent, spell that for me exactly as it appears on the card.

        (bob) bob smith

        (me) bob what is the expiration date ?

        (bob) 10-10-15

        (me) bob flip the card over real quick? you see the ccv number ? what is that

        (bob) 443

        (me) now bob you said its a visa correct ?

        (bob) yes

        (me) go ahead and read me the numbers bob, starting with the 4

        (bob) 4128....

        (me) congratulations bob, you made a huge step forward for your business today.

        right my name and number down. your going to need it. I am now your senior business consultant

        and i want you to be able to contact me, when ever you need so we can continue to grow your business plan.


        ok bob, i have to send you to my verification department.
        they are going to go over the terms of our agreement, and they are going to record your order for your safety and for ours, and so there are no mistakes in todays order.

        once again bob, congratulations, please hold.
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        • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
          Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

          Here is a close, it works like a charm. in this case i made bob a little bit difficult. ......once again bob, congratulations, please hold.
          Ken; Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you,
          thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you. One of the most brilliant pieces of closing I've ever seen. And I know I'll use it.
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  • Profile picture of the author David Miller
    Now THAT is a post!
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  • Profile picture of the author Ashley Wright
    Two fantastic posts there Ken!

    May I ask how would the conversation with Bob start? Will defiantly help myself and am guessing others who are reading.

    Maybe this will help you. ( this is assuming that you have made appointments and actually made a sale after going to the appointment )


    Take a pen and paper, and right down everything that you said at the app.

    on another piece of paper right what they said.

    on a third. right out there questions and your responses
    Very good piece of advise going to structure that now and go with it see how I get on!
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    • Profile picture of the author ChristopherDittemore
      The most powerful question you asked IMO is: do you believe you'll make more than $200/mo with this system?

      As soon as he says yes he is sold.

      You've created a construct that he operates from.

      However, I'll add a couple things to this thread...

      1. Value Chain Building
      - Figuring out exactly what the prospect bases his buying decisions on and the questions/statements that will increase each part of the chain.

      Then you figure out where the prospect is in the chain, and know where to move from there...

      Obviously hard closing works if the value gap to price gap is small, but if it's large you can close till your blue in the face and even if you get the sale it's going to come back.

      2. Showing credibility as a form of results in advance.

      Now, I do a sort of consultant approach on the phone to show them that I know what I'm talking about and I'm the lucky lottery ticket that called him up...

      "Bob how much traffic is your website getting?" "You're not tracking that Bob? Wow, we'll fix that for you..." "Anyways, let's set that aside how much money are you making from it?" "You don't know, Bob?" "Wouldn't you agree that figuring out what's making and wasting your money is important?"

      That shows him your the guy.

      3. Figuring out what Bob believes is the biggest reason he hasn't achieved his goals...

      Once you know this, you position your product to solve that problem, easy.

      4. Figure out what Bob is looking for...

      Once you know this, you position your product to create that outcome...

      You do a phantom close... Bob if I can give you xxx, would you be willing to get started today? Even if you can't give them xxx, you only have to close on the short distance from what you CAN do vs what xxx was.

      5. I'd also like to 2nd "tonality" as being crucial. In everything I've ever sold, I write the script and say it about 100x before it flows like butter.

      My style is different, but I do one call closes. My approach has always significantly put me in the highest closing ratios for everything I've sold or trained others to sell. Build value, phantom close, tie down what they want (create construct), close after stacking benefits.

      Closing is important, but I am more interested in showing I have the goods, figuring out if they want them, then closing on what they want in exchange for testimonials.

      C.
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  • Profile picture of the author yanbotha
    Phone sales is mostly done today's market and also it is done fast and easily but also you have to take care that the sale is done to particular men. so you have to send the mail to the customer and star the transaction between you and the customer.
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    • Profile picture of the author mak25
      Hey guys this thread is exactly what I'm needing.

      Great, great stuff here. And please, no posts about how using the phone
      is so 'yesterday' and 'doesn't position yourself well'. They just sound so
      pompous and whiny. Especially when your posts become novelettes. B-O-R-I-N-G.

      @John, long time no talk. Haven't been on the TMF in a l-o-n-g while.
      How ya been my brotha from anotha motha?

      I wish I could add value to this thread, but I'm the student here, not the one with
      experience.

      I could give you my life story, but really, who cares, right? Everyone has a tale to tell,
      so let fast forward to now.

      I'm the typical person in a hole. Lost everything a few years back
      due to the banking/mortgage crash, then last year got a j-o-b.

      Well being 59, I was supplanted by a younger dude. Out on the street again.

      Oh well, whaddaya gonna do? Pick myself up and reinvent myself.

      So I got into doing Mobile sites for smartphones. OK. Learned what I needed to.
      Went pounding the pavement. I'm making a few bucks. Selling some.

      But it's like banging your head against the wall. People not in. Drive to the next prospect.
      Leave me your card. I'll think about it. Gotta talk to my partner. Yeah, love your product,
      but hit me up in a few months.

      Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr.

      In the back of my mind I keep thinking, I should be using the phone. I could cover more
      ground, not waste precious gas money. Not waste time with the decision maker not being around.

      But then I talk myself out of it, thinking people need to SEE what it is I'm selling.
      The visual aspect of my product. How the hell could I do that over the phone and close them?

      So I plod on. Knowing full well in the back of my mind that this is NOT the way to
      better utilize my time, and make the most $$$ that I can.

      So I ask you tele-pro's: If you were in MY shoes, how would you go about selling and
      closing a product like this over the phone? Is it doable in your eyes?

      I'm so glad this thread was started, and am thankful for ALL of the great posts given here.

      I'm going to stay glued for more responses and hopefully I'll learn what I need to know
      to get me out of my car and on the phone so I can make some real money. Not pocket change.

      Thanks everyone. Sorry if I interrupted. Carry on.

      Mike
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      • Profile picture of the author kirbymarketingconcierge
        the nifty fifities! congrats

        yes. you can sell mobile using the phone.

        small business is getting the message.
        look up the articles and research on mobile.
        soon the smart phone and the ipad will be 1 device.
        people respond to their phones, more than sitting in front of their PC.


        Mr. biz. owner I'm not a acne laced kid, told to sell you something you don't need.
        I've been around like you and know you have to look at what is new and innovative, so Bottomline...you want to get more business.

        have you noticed some people are using their phones?

        Get their attention when they are close to your business: ready, willing, and able to buy what you have right now!!!

        just off the top of my head.

        objection : "Yeah, love your product,but hit me up in a few months."

        I could, but I will be engaging your competition! Can you give me a few more miuntes to back up what I'm saying because this is about now. it's about getting customers right now, not a few months from now. Isn't That What's Most Important ?

        best wishes and go for it.
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      • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
        Originally Posted by mak25 View Post


        Leave me your card. I'll think about it. Gotta talk to my partner. Yeah, love your product, but hit me up in a few months.

        Mike
        Mike you will get those same objections on the phone.

        Here is a way around it.

        ALWAYS, ask them if they can make the decision on there own.
        if they say no. call back when you can talk to both of them at the same time.

        Talking to two people at the same time sucks. the key is to find out who is
        really making the decisions, and you need to do it quick. Once you do
        talk directly to that person, do not forget about the other person, sprinkle him into the convo, but focus on the one.

        Or, just move on to the next prospect.

        If they say yes they can make the decision, and when you close them
        they say "Gotta talk to my partner."

        Bust their ass. literally remind them they said they can make the decision.

        Also, say some thing like this.

        (you) So bob, you and steve have been in business what , 10 yrs together?

        (bob) yes

        (you) so do you trust steve?

        (bob) of course, he would not be my partner if i didn't

        (you) exactly bob, you trust steve, and steve trusts you.
        So you know he trusts you to make good decisions

        When he gets back to tommorow, if you show him how you just set things up to help your company take a maor leap foward, do you think he is going to be upset ?

        (Bob) no

        (you) of course he isnt, as a matter of fact he is counting on you to help grow the business isn't he?

        (bob) yeah,


        BAMM you got him. so now close him

        fyi. that same technique applies to the husband / wife objection

        just change how long they have been in business to together to how long they have been married.

        edit---

        forgot to hit on this "but hit me up in a few months."

        on the phone or in person, that's just a blow off. end of story.
        if they say they love your product and then say that, you missed somethign and need to figure it out and repitch that area.

        if they just say it on the phone, before they know about your product.
        just move on, save your self some time.
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        • Profile picture of the author David Miller
          Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

          on the phone or in person, that's just a blow off. end of story.
          if they say they love your product and then say that, you missed somethign and need to figure it out and repitch that area.

          if they just say it on the phone, before they know about your product.
          just move on, save your self some time.
          Ken -

          In your opinion, or anyone else's actually, do you think there's any validity of talking about your refund policy (assuming there is one) instead of the push-pull of the "does your partner trust you" technique?

          Suppose your product either has a refund or it's a situation that your obligation is month to month. I believe in that case something such this could work:

          "Bob I understand that the way the economy is, a decision to spend even one dollar can seem like a gamble. Bob, there's no contract here, and after 30 days you can cancel. But I'm going to go one step further Bob, if you go ahead and sign up now....give us 30 days....if after that you don't think it was the right decision, I'll see to that you get a full refund.

          Fair enough Bob?

          Rather than address the "need my partner" objection, I think it's wiser to ignore it. If the prospect says no to this, there aren't too many places to go if it's a relatively low ticked item. However, it's also an opportunity to fish out the real objection.
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          • Profile picture of the author David Miller
            I just want to add this post about selling mobile sites.

            I've done my share of pounding the pavement. I've sold Yellow Page ads in South Florida that way. It was the company sales method. Somehow the management felt that it was important that the prospect be "able to see" the book! Sorry, but even in person, the yellow pages is not that hot of a product. However, the most sucessful salespeople in our organization used the phone....they understood that people knew what the yellow pages look like.

            The same holds true for websites, any size web sites!

            Unless the mobile sites you build are so entirely different from any other mobile website, is there really any need to have to show them your website on your phone.

            In some ways, a mobile website may be easier to pitch on the phone. If you're a website salesperson trying to sell a web based product, there's a tendency to use the prospects pc as a sales tool. This is done by asking if they are near their pc and if they could go to a url. In previous posts we pretty much beat up this idea because it really allows a prospect to blow you off by simply saying they can't get to their pc now or something like that.

            In this case, there's either the possibility that you're talking to them on the very instrument that you need them to see (unless it's an iphone on verizon) or in reality, how far is anyone from their smart phone these days?
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          • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
            Originally Posted by David Miller View Post

            Ken -

            In your opinion, or anyone else's actually, do you think there's any validity of talking about your refund policy (assuming there is one) instead of the push-pull of the "does your partner trust you" technique?
            .
            Personally, since the majority of our ( new ) clients pay with a credit card.
            we know they have upto a yr to charge back. regardless of any refund policy.

            i was taught long long time ago, not to pitch a charge back by mentioning
            refunds and what not.

            So if they ask me i will tell them, but if they don't. i wont say anything.

            With that said, every wk, new clients get a call from us, where we hand hold them through a few things, answer questions, massage them, so that
            there isn't buyers remorse, and generally go out of our way to help them.
            Even if it is a bit outside of the scope of our agreement.

            This has really helped with refunds/charge backs

            as well as upsells

            not to mention referrals. we get a LOT of those. I would make a venture 80% of our referrals are because of the "personal" touch.
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            • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
              I bumped this thread, simply because a lot of the questions i'm seeing posted in the past 3 or 4 days are covered in detail here.
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              • Profile picture of the author HypeText
                10 things I have taken note of over the years regarding cold calling:

                1) East Coasters seem to be more aggressive about it, Why? We just don't take no for an answer and really, deep down, don't give a rats ass what anyone one else thinks.

                2) Naysayers are just SCARED!

                3) Listening is more important than talking.

                4) Cold Calling is one of the oldest forms of Marketing for a reason...it works

                5) Sometimes all it takes to close a sale is simply asking for it

                6) If they are still asking questions...they are a buyer

                7) Prospects are like Piranha...if they smell your blood (fear, discomfort, lack of confidence) in the water they will eat you alive. Confidence is key

                8) Keep it conversational....Scripts screw things up if your Prospect thinks you are working from one

                9) If they are in a Lead list...they are getting calls all the time no matter what people say

                10) It doesnt matter if #9 is true or not....they haven't heard from me yet!
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                • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
                  Originally Posted by HypeText View Post

                  10 things I have taken note of over the years regarding cold calling:

                  1) East Coasters seem to be more aggressive about it, Why? We just don't take no for an answer and really, deep down, don't give a rats ass what anyone one else thinks.

                  2) Naysayers are just SCARED!

                  3) Listening is more important than talking.

                  4) Cold Calling is one of the oldest forms of Marketing for a reason...it works

                  5) Sometimes all it takes to close a sale is simply asking for it

                  6) If they are still asking questions...they are a buyer

                  7) Prospects are like Piranha...if they smell your blood (fear, discomfort, lack of confidence) in the water they will eat you alive. Confidence is key

                  8) Keep it conversational....Scripts screw things up if your Prospect thinks you are working from one

                  9) If they are in a Lead list...they are getting calls all the time no matter what people say

                  10) It doesnt matter if #9 is true or not....they haven't heard from me yet!
                  ok here is my list.

                  As a sales person you only need to know 3 things about anybody your going to sell to.

                  A) What their fears are
                  B) What is their greed factor
                  C) Can they pay you.


                  If anyone is wondering why i did A,B,C instead of 1,2,3
                  its because i'm a firm believer in Always, Be, Closing
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                  • Profile picture of the author HypeText
                    Originally Posted by kenmichaels View Post

                    ok here is my list.

                    As a sales person you only need to know 3 things about anybody your going to sell to.

                    A) What their fears are
                    B) What is their greed factor
                    C) Can they pay you.
                    Very True! Ohhh....Wait!

                    You mean they are supposed to pay me? I thought I was supposed to give it all away for FREE!

                    (Ok, so some not so suave words poking fun at the Freebie People)
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      • Profile picture of the author Ashleydupray
        Mike mac25 pm me your contact info I can help you out.
        Ashley
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      • Profile picture of the author Claude Whitacre
        Originally Posted by mak25 View Post

        Well being 59, I was supplanted by a younger dude. Out on the street again.

        Oh well, whaddaya gonna do? Pick myself up and reinvent myself.

        So I got into doing Mobile sites for smartphones.
        Mike; I know two things;
        Being your 50's gives you a huge advantage. Now you can offer advice instead of just pitch (I mean it sounds like advice, you are still pitching)
        You are at the perfect age. Old enough to be wise, but young enough to still be mentally agile.

        And you sell the perfect product for phone sales. Go get em.
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    • Profile picture of the author David Miller
      Originally Posted by yanbotha View Post

      Phone sales is mostly done today's market and also it is done fast and easily but also you have to take care that the sale is done to particular men. so you have to send the mail to the customer and star the transaction between you and the customer.
      Nonsense! Please don't use this thread to increase your post count.

      Just to restate, this thread is NOT about questioning the validity of phone sales. Phone sales as a method of closing the deal is not at issue.

      Please feel free to post your thoughts and techniques about how you use the phone to close the deal. It's fine to view the phone as a tool. In this thread it's a tool also.....a hammer!
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  • Profile picture of the author itzpaul
    Amazing posts. Keep up the good work. Thanks guys. I'm getting started in my process soon.
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    • Profile picture of the author David Miller
      It's great to see this thread back again! Hopefully it stays focused this time on the "HOWS" of using the phone and not the pontificators of negativity!
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      • Profile picture of the author HypeText
        Originally Posted by David Miller View Post

        It's great to see this thread back again! Hopefully it stays focused this time on the "HOWS" of using the phone and not the pontificators of negativity!
        I remember when my son was like 5 or 6 and really, really, really wanted to do something or wanted a new toy he saw on TV.

        He would ask, I would say "No"

        He would stand there and say "Please" over and over every time I said "No"

        Too bad child Labor is illegal...

        I could get rich with an Army of 5 yr olds!

        We seem to lose that tenacity as we get older...
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  • Profile picture of the author vndnbrgj
    I just had to bump this, due to the fact that it is some good reading and wouldn't mind some more advice.
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    • Profile picture of the author IMguy123
      I can't offer advice in the way of closing over the phone but I will say a big THANK YOU to those that have contributed so much to this thread. This is a fantastic thread.

      For me I am specifically thankful to Ken Michaels, David Miller, Deidra, and John Durham.

      I aspire to master closing over the phone and this thread helps alot.
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  • Profile picture of the author ridebuyer
    I have to agree. I make over 90% of my money from cold calling. Anyone who avoids it is losing out. If I didn't cold call I would have to get a normal JOB.
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    • Profile picture of the author David Miller
      I'm halfway through a book that I would recommend to anyone that wants to hone their cold calling skills or get the courage to start dialing.

      Smart Calling by Art Sobczak...if you buy the book on amazon and go to his website, enter your order number and there's a bunch of bonus reports you can pick up. Can't attest to the value of the bonus because I haven't really explored any of them. However, you will get put on his mailing list and I can say that there's some value to many of the emails you'll get.
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      • Profile picture of the author Ashleydupray
        Ok My 2 cents on closing a mobile website.

        Ask the question "why do you have a website?
        Hopefully they will give the correct answer but they may not...

        The answers just in case should be
        To get more customers or so people can read
        about my products, services, menu etc...

        To get found by people looking for my type of business.

        OK great if they answered in any of those ways or if you had to remind them.

        Now tell them to close their eyes and picture people walking around with
        their gigantic PC's or laptops coming into their place of business.

        They may laugh or snicker. : )

        Say it's hard to imagine right?
        Well now guess what 35-50% of your visitors coming to your website are trying to access you on that 3 x 5 inch comp they have in their pocket its called a cell phone. And when they went to your website to find the very info you said you wanted people to find they couldn't see it!!!

        So most likely they clicked off immediately and you just lost them as a possible customer that does have a mobile site.

        So are you now ready to make your website available to those 35-50 percent or do you want to continue to dismiss them?

        My fee to do this for you today is xxx.

        Oh you want to think it over or talk to so and so that's ok.

        I 'll tell you what it seems like you see the value in this.
        You see that you will not lose any more prospects to your website how about if you do this today I can know $100 off. I will not be able to offer that tomorrow. So does that sound like an offer you can't refuse?


        As I said just my 2 cents.
        Ashley
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  • Profile picture of the author debml
    This thread contains some great information, and is definitely worthy of getting back on track.

    My question is to those who have transitioned from face to face selling to selling more on the phone - I'm wondering if you scripted your calls prior to transitioning, or if trial by fire is equally as effective.
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    • Profile picture of the author David Miller
      Originally Posted by debml View Post

      This thread contains some great information, and is definitely worthy of getting back on track.

      My question is to those who have transitioned from face to face selling to selling more on the phone - I'm wondering if you scripted your calls prior to transitioning, or if trial by fire is equally as effective.
      Back on track would be great....read the first post in this thread...talks about getting hijacked just like it is now....so if you don't like SALES, get lost!

      @Rockrz - Occupy Wall Street called....you're late for the meeting son!

      I strongly suggest that any further posts from Rockrz are just ignored....it's just going to get silly and stupid....let's try and continue on and discuss CLOSING on the phone.
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    • Profile picture of the author David Miller
      Originally Posted by debml View Post

      This thread contains some great information, and is definitely worthy of getting back on track.

      My question is to those who have transitioned from face to face selling to selling more on the phone - I'm wondering if you scripted your calls prior to transitioning, or if trial by fire is equally as effective.
      Sorry that your question went unanswered because of all the pointless turmoil.....trial by fire is never the way to go...but I've always found that having some scripting was key to getting to where you need to go in the most logical way possible. The fact is that it's going to take some time until you find the script that works the way want. In that sense, there's always a bit of trial by fire.

      There's been a lot of back and forth about using a script and it doesn't sound natural, that's not at all true. Naturally it's going to take a little practice and time to sound natural but before you know it, you're the only one on the phone that knows you're using a script. The equally important value of using a script is that you always know where your are in the process, and it makes it a lot easier to make course corrections when it's needed.

      These are my opinions based on my experience and everyone has their own methods.....a lot of people who claim they don't use a script are actually saying the same thing call after call and guess what....that's a script!
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  • Profile picture of the author thehazard
    Perhaps i missed this part but since i am starting from the ground up, with no supplies save my mac and iPhone, what is the best way to A: generate leads, and B: make the necessary amount of calls to start making money? if this was answered previously can you point me to it?
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    • Profile picture of the author kenmichaels
      Originally Posted by thehazard View Post

      Perhaps i missed this part but since i am starting from the ground up, with no supplies save my mac and iPhone, what is the best way to A: generate leads, and B: make the necessary amount of calls to start making money? if this was answered previously can you point me to it?
      What are you selling? websites , .mobi, seo ?

      if its anything like that, and easy cheap source, is the phone book.

      There are plenty of business directories online, you also have the better bizz
      site.

      any of them will provide free easy leads.

      Or you can goto google, or the wso section and type scraper...
      not free, but a serious time saver if you find one you like
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  • Profile picture of the author M Mark
    Thanks for all the scripting - just found this and it's something timely
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  • Profile picture of the author Rearden
    I would LOVE to close life insurance business over the phone but here's my mental roadblock:

    1) This is B2C sales to mainly 60-80 year olds -- and to qualify for life insurance one needs not only banking information for recurring drafts, but also a Social Security number. In a world where seniors perceive scammers phishing for their cash, I would HATE to lose a sale to that, when I know for a fact I could get it face to face.

    Currently, what I do is a 2 step process -- qualify hard over the phone, then set an appointment only after I know and they know I'm coming to collect a check, an app, and to approve them for coverage. If I could do that all over the phone... that would be most incredible!

    Any thoughts or experience on how to remedy this?
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    • Profile picture of the author sandalwood
      Originally Posted by Rearden View Post

      I would LOVE to close life insurance business over the phone but here's my mental roadblock:

      1) This is B2C sales to mainly 60-80 year olds -- and to qualify for life insurance one needs not only banking information for recurring drafts, but also a Social Security number. In a world where seniors perceive scammers phishing for their cash, I would HATE to lose a sale to that, when I know for a fact I could get it face to face.

      Currently, what I do is a 2 step process -- qualify hard over the phone, then set an appointment only after I know and they know I'm coming to collect a check, an app, and to approve them for coverage. If I could do that all over the phone... that would be most incredible!

      Any thoughts or experience on how to remedy this?
      I don't know what state you are in or who you work for but selling life insurance (I do) for most companies carries this requirement:

      You must have seen the applicant face to face when you took the application.

      The application even requires it in your agent's report section. Since you are selling in the senior market, you have to call an 800# while you are at the person's home so the "voice" can ask them the same questions you just asked them. Then the voice gives you a number you have to write on the application. No # no approval.

      Seniors have been the victims of so many scams, the Ins Commissioners made the "final expense" jockeys tow the line. Look at your state's laws and see what they say.

      Yes you can buy life insurance over the Internet. But pay close attention how they verify you. So don't use that as a rebuttal.

      Your question is answered thusly: make the appointment, fill out the app, call the voice, pick up the check and leave. Bingo, you are an insurance sales superstar.

      Of course you could be selling for a company in the final expense market that allows you take apps over the phone but makes you record everythig and submit the recording. You can fill out the app, have them sign it over the phone, get their credit card number and send the app and the recording to your team leader or gen agent. This does suffice as a face to face contact but if you forget to record every word, oops, no sale.

      The problem with this method is a higher turn down ratio. Buyer's remorse or a relative scolding them for buying something over the phone instead of from a person they saw is a big deal killer with seniors.

      Regardless of all that, call, visit and leave. Your magic formula.

      Just my 2¢...
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      • Profile picture of the author Rearden
        I agree.

        There's a big player in the final expense biz that does a lot of phone prospecting. I've heard first-year lapse ratio is something like 40%... (industry average for final expense is somewhere around 25%).

        However, a lot of final expense companies are paving the way for more phone apps -- I think 10 years from now, you'll see phone sales for final expense be more prevalent.

        Thanks Mr. Sandal,
        Dave

        Originally Posted by sandalwood View Post

        I don't know what state you are in or who you work for but selling life insurance (I do) for most companies carries this requirement:

        You must have seen the applicant face to face when you took the application.

        The application even requires it in your agent's report section. Since you are selling in the senior market, you have to call an 800# while you are at the person's home so the "voice" can ask them the same questions you just asked them. Then the voice gives you a number you have to write on the application. No # no approval.

        Seniors have been the victims of so many scams, the Ins Commissioners made the "final expense" jockeys tow the line. Look at your state's laws and see what they say.

        Yes you can buy life insurance over the Internet. But pay close attention how they verify you. So don't use that as a rebuttal.

        Your question is answered thusly: make the appointment, fill out the app, call the voice, pick up the check and leave. Bingo, you are an insurance sales superstar.

        Of course you could be selling for a company in the final expense market that allows you take apps over the phone but makes you record everythig and submit the recording. You can fill out the app, have them sign it over the phone, get their credit card number and send the app and the recording to your team leader or gen agent. This does suffice as a face to face contact but if you forget to record every word, oops, no sale.

        The problem with this method is a higher turn down ratio. Buyer's remorse or a relative scolding them for buying something over the phone instead of from a person they saw is a big deal killer with seniors.

        Regardless of all that, call, visit and leave. Your magic formula.

        Just my 2¢...
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  • Profile picture of the author nyk24
    Am still a noob when it comes to telesales but I have tried to soak in as many threads in the offline section and came across somewhere there I think it was the "no is good method".

    I use this tactic in my cold calls (only made 50 calls so early days). I would say, "you don't need life insurance do you?"

    This puts the person on the spot. Usually you will get a no but that's great cos you haven't wasted time like many salespeople do on your long opening sales speel for someone who probably wasn't ever going to buy plus you get through your calling list quicker to those who are looking to buy or want to buy but just never gotten round to it.

    This example was used for door to doors sales just to get an appointment for life insurance and it got sales...downside is you will lose sales by not closing there and then.

    Therefore my question to the wiser forum members here is: if you are selling say local seo, video seo and mobile sites. Isn't it going to be hard to close on the phone all those options or at least one or two of them in that one phone call, bearing in mind your prospect is a clueless one who would find it easier to digest things if you emailed him the details?

    If it's easier to set the appointment up and then upsell and sidesell on a prospect who looks like they are going to buy your main service? I realise this has pitfalls too as you are giving the prospect time to change his mind.

    Any examples on how to explain those sort of services in a minute or 2 and then close on them?

    Thanks guys for a great thread you could be charging for this....a certain chap from nabo does this (the company is uk business coaching firm) for a living. I am not endorsing him or his service but for fellow noobs theres a lesson to be learned here. If someone is doing well in your industry copy them and and improve on their winning formula...its not rocket science when you think of it that way so thanks for all the telesales advice to all those wise posters and sorry if I have strayed a bit

    anyway that's my 2 cents (or 1.33p in uk money)
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  • Profile picture of the author jherewini
    This is a fairly long thread but since were talking closing heres three techniques I use to close notice I said close

    The optional close is a guarantee - so would you like me to send 2 or would you prefer 1?
    would you prefer to pay by credit card or paypal?

    The assumptive close is where I assume they have said yes to the offer and I take control by asking questions like the following, how do I spell your first name and surname? when were you born? etc you get the idea by now they're happy to give you other bits of information including social security numbers and I always ask for the credit card like I do above.

    If at any stage I am asked why do you need this information, I respond honestly by saying I want to make sure I have your personal information loaded and spelt correctly for our system is that ok? notice the question is a confirmation set up for a yes answer.

    Then i would ask another trial close question, something along the lines of and always starting with a would you agree lead in....for example I don't know about you but would you agree its insensative when people spell your name wrong? exactly and thats how I feel as well, which is why I asked, with your permission would you like me to get this going for you? excellent where would you like this delivered?


    these work a treat for me when closing the sale remember I have all ready gone through trial closing, adding value, asking open questions this is my punch close and stay close techniques I have shared with you.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mav91890
    Why do I always picture "Bob" as Bob from That 70's Show? lol
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  • Profile picture of the author sj9287
    In my opinion the telephone is a great prospecting method for ANY type of sales. Mostly because of its efficiency. But as far as effectiveness I think that varies depending on what your selling. When it comes to more or less standardized products, closing over the phone can be a great way to rack up sales. But when your selling personalized services, appointment setting is the way to go. If you strictly concentrate on closing you overlook the aspect of qualifying or consulting per say.
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  • Profile picture of the author Tracy411
    This thread is gold! Thanks so much to all the experienced cold-callers and also to those who asked great questions that these guys could answer. I am going to cold-call and these tips and this feedback will help me in crafting my script.

    Thanks again I reserve the right to return with questions

    Tracy
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  • Profile picture of the author PanteraIM
    I don't know if this piece of advice strictly fits here or not, but on every cold call campaign I've run from home I've always incorporated a technique called the Ascending Close.

    I always make sure to get them to say 'Yes', at least 6 times in the presentation to push them into an agreeable state of mind before the close. It's kind of like a gear in their mind which gets stuck into place when you do this over and over and it makes it very hard for them to say NO.

    It was created by encyclopaedia salesmen in the 70s when we still sold encyclopaedias door to door.. cost around a million dollars for them to develop it and it's a good tool to use today.
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    you cant hold no groove if you ain't got no pocket.

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