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Cutting the AdGroup fat

by taguinod
8 replies
  • PPC/SEM
    • |
Hi all,

So I've been recently turned on to applying the 80/20 rule to my campaigns. Essentially 20% of my campaigns produce 80% of my conversions (more or less). The problem with this is that I believe that some of my adgroups/keywords are attributing to conversions, but aren't necessarily last click conversions. However, I do believe in oversaturation of keywords.

For anyone who has trimmed down their wasteful keywords and allocated more budget to productive keywords, how do you draw the line with what is useful and what is not?

Just for clarification, I am running about 20 campaigns totaling close to $1 mil. Any insight would be appreciated thanks!
#adgroup #cutting #fat
  • Profile picture of the author fasteasysuccess
    If understand your question...

    Not sure how large your keyword group is, but may want to cut back and break into smaller groups so can see true conversions of sets of words. The clickthrough rate can help you with paying less on the click, however if those keywords are getting clicks but not converting, then wasting money anyways. Want to tighten up groups and then expland to other groups so can have a true accurate test of conversions verus clicks.
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    • Profile picture of the author taguinod
      Fasteasysuccess,

      Thanks for the response. I've already broken down my keyword groups into focused adgroups. My problem is I that I have a bunch of ad groups that aren't contributing to conversions and sucking up a bunch of my budget.

      I want to trim all the adgroups that are under-performing, but I want to avoid removing any adgroups that are contributing to conversions (first-click, etc). How do you determine which adgroups to pause and which ones to keep running? I don't think conversions are the only KPI to consider when 'trimming down' my adgroups.

      Thanks!
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  • Profile picture of the author fasteasysuccess
    I'm not sure how small broke your ad groups into, but was referring to conversions since you said spent million so far. That would of gave you tons of stats and data on what was performing by now and what wasn't. I'm not sure why you feel conversions wouldn't be a factor? If not bringing you return, why keep running.

    It really all comes down to traffic and conversions, if certain keywords are bringing in traffic but not converting yet other keywords are bringing in traffic and converting to same website or landing page, then does come down to eliminating those keywords not helping with conversions.

    Then from there the "converting keyword" groups will come down to testing ads because you already know converting, so goal is to improve ctr and conversions.

    Obviously, would want to test other keyword groups as you go, but definitely separate from groups already successful.

    Now here's the exception...if not doing a one time close or basically bringing to a sales page and lets say an optin or free offer where they sign up and they receive offers throughout a certain period of time, now there can be money coming in down the road where initial tests wouldn't compare correctly because lifetime customer value is higher.
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    • Profile picture of the author taguinod
      Fasteasysuccess,

      It's not that I dont think conversions are an important KPI, its that I dont think its the only KPI to consider when eliminating wasteful keywords.

      My question is how do you determine what is wasteful and what is not?

      Would you guys use click assisted conversions? What KPIs would you look at to determine what to pause? Thanks!
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      • Profile picture of the author dburk
        Hi taguinod,

        I believe you have the right idea.

        What we do is define business objectives, set goals, select a strategy, and define the KPIs that will tell us how our tactics are performing against those specific goals.

        Some people make the mistake of setting a goal based a on a metric you would use for optimization. Your goals should be measurable, but also meaningful to your primary business objective. For example, if your goal is to grow your market share in fast growing industry while remaining profitable you would probably use a different set of metrics than someone that has a goal of increasing gross margins while maintaining market share within a mature market. So the first step in your process should be to clearly define your marketing goals.

        Once your primary marketing objective is clearly defined, and you have specific goals set, you can devise a strategy and select the primary KPI that accurately measures the progress you are making toward your goal.

        If one of your marketing goals include market share growth then conversion assists will likely be an important factor to consider when evaluating your ad group performance. Once you have your direct response campaigns built out and optimized, the upper portion of your marketing funnel will become critical to driving a larger audience into your funnel, as well as maximizing conversion rates for your direct response campaigns targeting the bottom of your funnel.

        I have found having mixed goals in the same campaign more difficult to manage. Ideally, you should create separate campaigns, each focused on the primary marketing objective of that campaign. Move keywords that are primarily targeting the early phase of the buying cycle into a campaign that is specifically designed to contribute to impression assist and click assist conversions. Then optimize those ad groups based on how well they assist conversions.

        You will find click assist and impressions assist conversions are easier and more reliable measured if you link Google Analytics to your AdWords account, and also to your Search Console account.

        HTH,
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        * Get Results - Outsource Your PPC Management |
        *         Don Burk Advertising & Marketing - www.donburk.com

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  • Profile picture of the author taguinod
    Dburk,

    I appreciate the response, it was very insightful. You're spot on with our goal being to increase our market share while maintaining the same budget. I'm going to give your idea of restructuring campaigns, keeping assist conversions in mind, some thought.

    My only concern is making large campaign changes when every hour of every day is crucial to conversions. I'm considering running an experiment with restructured campaigns to only a few campaigns to test how they perform.
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  • Profile picture of the author Marty Foley
    Originally Posted by taguinod View Post

    The problem with this is that I believe that some of my adgroups/keywords are attributing to conversions, but aren't necessarily last click conversions....

    Any insight would be appreciated thanks!
    Hi Taguinod,

    Keyword attribution is important. If you ignore it when removing seemingly non-performing keywords from a PPC account to "cut out the fat", you can hurt performance.

    Advice on this:

    1. In your Adwords account, under: Tools > Attribution, you can get insight into which keywords attribute to conversions (along with campaigns and ad groups), but that may not show any direct conversions.

    2. Obviously a direct conversion is worth more than an impression- or click-assisted one. There are different formulas for compensating for the difference, with a click-assisted conversion considered more valuable than an impression-assisted one.

    3. You can more easily monitor attribution in your Adwords account, by modifying the columns under the appropriate tab (such as Keywords) to show "Click assisted conv." and "Impr. assisted conv." columns.

    Marty Foley ~ PPC Traffic & Conversion Mad Scientist
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    • Profile picture of the author taguinod
      Originally Posted by Marty Foley View Post

      Hi Taguinod,

      Keyword attribution is an important issue. If it isn't taken into consideration when removing seemingly non-performing keywords from a PPC account, in an effort to "cut out the fat", performance can be inadvertently harmed.

      Advice on this:

      1. You can get more insight into which keywords (as well as campaigns and ad groups) attribute to conversions, but may not be shown as directly converting, in your Adwords account, under: Tools > Attribution.

      2. Obviously a conversion is worth more than an impression- or click-assisted conversion. There are various formulas for compensating for the difference, with a click-assisted conversion considered more valuable than an impression-assisted one.

      3. You can more easily monitor attribution in your Adwords account, by modifying the columns under the appropriate tab (such as Keywords) to show "Click assisted conv." and "Impr. assisted conv." columns.

      Marty Foley ~ PPC Traffic & Conversion Mad Scientist
      Thanks for your response Marty.

      I incorporated click assisted conversions into my KPIs like you recommended and am using them as a ranking factor for eliminating wasteful keywords. Right now my strategy is to look at everything 3 conversions and lower for the past 4 months, and then looking at the conversions, cost/conv., and click assisted conversions.

      I was surprised to find the amount of keywords with CPA $500+ even reaching $2000+. This has been a good start so far, but if you guys have any other suggestions moving forward I would really appreciate it!!
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