Keyword Research Discussion

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Hey Warriors!

I just wanted to get some discussion going on what methods you're using to research keywords (competitor and niche specific).

I currently use a program called Market Samurai that seems to help with keyword generation and it also provides a clean format to view approx monthly searchs, CPC, etc.. My problem I seem to be having is determining what keywords to select, and what I should be looking for.

Right now, I'm currently working on a lead generation roofing niche for a specific county (and all cities in the county), so I assume I would have city specific keywords, for example: Eugene Roof Repair.

I'm really looking forward to some of the input you guys will have!

Best,
Will
#discussion #keyword #research
  • Profile picture of the author AndresNWD
    I've been reading a local search guide today Mastering Local SEO Part 1: The Basics where I think you will find a couple of good advices:
    1. Register in google business
    2. Make sure your brand is mentioned in local listings (yellow pages ,yelp, etc).

    On site-wise, just make sure you can find all the local phones and addresses of those services.
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  • Profile picture of the author xj975
    Originally Posted by Techalo View Post

    Hey Warriors!

    I just wanted to get some discussion going on what methods you're using to research keywords (competitor and niche specific).

    I currently use a program called Market Samurai that seems to help with keyword generation and it also provides a clean format to view approx monthly searchs, CPC, etc.. My problem I seem to be having is determining what keywords to select, and what I should be looking for.

    Right now, I'm currently working on a lead generation roofing niche for a specific county (and all cities in the county), so I assume I would have city specific keywords, for example: Eugene Roof Repair.

    I'm really looking forward to some of the input you guys will have!

    Best,
    Will

    Market Samurai is great, make sure you are leveraging the tool fully.

    When selecting a keyword some elements that are important are search volume, and competition.

    Basically you are looking for words that you can win easily that will have an impact. Getting a bunch of easy wins is often a better road than going for one major win (in SEO at least)

    In the roofing business you should be targeting long tail clouds that are related to your niche. If you are localizing for each area, then the same root keywords related to roofing could be used, and just prefixed/suffixed with geographic location.


    Root keywords: Roofing repair, emergency roofing, get roof fixed fast

    Localization modifies: Katy Texas, Chicago Illinois


    So the list of keywords you identify in one market will generally be good for all the areas you want to optimize for. (depending on the local competition)

    Feel free to message me if you have any questions.
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    • Profile picture of the author Techalo
      Originally Posted by xj975 View Post

      Market Samurai is great, make sure you are leveraging the tool fully.

      When selecting a keyword some elements that are important are search volume, and competition.

      Basically you are looking for words that you can win easily that will have an impact. Getting a bunch of easy wins is often a better road than going for one major win (in SEO at least)

      In the roofing business you should be targeting long tail clouds that are related to your niche. If you are localizing for each area, then the same root keywords related to roofing could be used, and just prefixed/suffixed with geographic location.


      Root keywords: Roofing repair, emergency roofing, get roof fixed fast

      Localization modifies: Katy Texas, Chicago Illinois


      So the list of keywords you identify in one market will generally be good for all the areas you want to optimize for. (depending on the local competition)

      Feel free to message me if you have any questions.
      Xj, this is really helpful, thanks so much for sharing! I feel I haven't been leveraging Market Samurai to the fullest either so I'll have to brush up on that. I'll send you a pm.

      Regards,
      Will
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      • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
        Market Samurai is a total waste of time. Get your money back.
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  • Profile picture of the author expmrb
    If you are using Market Samurai then its good. As your niche is 'roofing', its a very specific field so try to find out the keywords which have low competition and have high value. Target the long tail keywords along with alternate keywords of the original ones. As you are targeting a specific country so use country/cities names with them to get better results such ' best roofing in East Coast' or 'best roofing in New York' etc.
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  • Profile picture of the author KylieSweet
    Originally Posted by Techalo View Post

    I just wanted to get some discussion going on what methods you're using to research keywords (competitor and niche specific).
    I usually used Google keyword planner for the guidance in the selection of the keyword phrase but with using other platforms like Reddit you will have the best keyword phrase idea on this active community which will answer on how your targeted audience talks about the brand or services (preferences, ideas, needs, benefits and expectations).
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    • Profile picture of the author Techalo
      Originally Posted by KylieSweet View Post

      I usually used Google keyword planner for the guidance in the selection of the keyword phrase but with using other platforms like Reddit you will have the best keyword phrase idea on this active community which will answer on how your targeted audience talks about the brand or services (preferences, ideas, needs, benefits and expectations).
      Thanks Kylie,

      You got me to really look into the keyword planner further, and it has proven to be most helpful!

      Cheers,
      Will
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  • Profile picture of the author seolinkcafe
    Google Keyword Planner for average monthly searches, LongTailPro/MarketSamurai for ranking competition research.
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  • Profile picture of the author Techalo
    Thank you everyone for all the helpful input and advice!

    I've been looking into how to use the Keyword Planner properly, and it's proven to be VERY helpful. To anybody that is new or just getting back into this like myself, you should check out how to leverage the Keyword Planner using the advanced features.

    Using the planner, I put in place the few root keywords that I had, and I was able to set all my locations that I'll be targeting (all the cities within the county and even the county itself) and have it suggest keywords. It then generated a list of keywords that were relevant to my localized targeted area (which I think is genius if that's really how it populated the keywords). Regardless of how it populated them, it gave me good suggestions and showed me what keywords had the most traffic, with the least amount of competition. I was then able to add them to a plan, and simply export them to a CSV to get a complete list of my root/long tail keywords.

    I also just want to give xj975 another thanks! When he provided his example, he gave me the best keyword with the best traffic, and also low competition (which the keyword planner showed)!

    Great discussion going! I'm interested in hearing more!

    Best,
    Will
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    • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
      Originally Posted by Techalo View Post

      he gave me the best keyword with the best traffic, and also low competition (which the keyword planner showed)!
      You do know that the competition shown in the Google Keyword Planner has nothing to do with SEO, right?
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      • Profile picture of the author Techalo
        Originally Posted by MikeFriedman View Post

        You do know that the competition shown in the Google Keyword Planner has nothing to do with SEO, right?
        Hi Mike,

        I ignored your first response, because I can appreciate your initial opinion. However, I don't understand why you're trolling the thread. Instead of being negative, try providing some positive input like others have so generously done.

        I'm sure you don't appreciate when people are condescending to you - I stated I was just getting back into this so no, I don't know how every metric is measured. However, I do know that Keyword Planner competition has to do with the keyword advertising(adsense), and not the SEO comp, but thanks for checking.

        I don't expect handouts from this community, I'm more than capable of reading and learning from trial and error. I'm just trying to get a healthy discussion going that may provoke better ideas.

        With that being said, I would like to encourage you to be positive on this thread, please.

        Best,
        Will
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        • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
          Originally Posted by Techalo View Post

          Hi Mike,

          I ignored your first response, because I can appreciate your initial opinion. However, I don't understand why you're trolling the thread. Instead of being negative, try providing some positive input like others have so generously done.

          I'm sure you don't appreciate when people are condescending to you - I stated I was just getting back into this so no, I don't know how every metric is measured. However, I do know that Keyword Planner competition has to do with the keyword advertising(adsense), and not the SEO comp, but thanks for checking.

          I don't expect handouts from this community, I'm more than capable of reading and learning from trial and error. I'm just trying to get a healthy discussion going that may provoke better ideas.

          With that being said, I would like to encourage you to be positive on this thread, please.

          Best,
          Will
          Wow, calling me a troll for trying to help you and keep you from going astray.

          I was being positive.

          I am positive that Market Samurai is a total POS and waste of money. It is worthless. It provides nothing of value.

          I am also positive that tons of marketers make the mistake of assuming that the competition level in Google Keyword Planner has to do with ranking competition. I was making sure you were not making the same mistake that countless others have because your comment sure made it sound like you were.

          There was nothing condescending in anything I said... yet.
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          • Profile picture of the author DABK
            Mike is right: Market Samurai is not a good tool to use, unless you're looking to sort keywords by number of words in it... Say, you want only 4 word or more, Market Samurai sorts out the 1, 2, and 3 keywords.

            The competition in Google keyword planner is for adwords. Just because people bid high on a keyword in adwords it doesn't mean it's high competition from an SEO point of view.


            If you're looking for local keywords, pick the best keywords in Google keyword planner

            in insurance, it will give you
            auto insurance
            car insurance
            as the top keywords by volume

            You'd take these keywords and stick them in http://www.5minutesite.com/local_keywords.php. (It's an easy way to add city names in front and after keywords based on a location and radius).

            Then you'd run the list you get in keyword planner, to get volume.

            Google will bring no volume for a lot of them. Usually it means that Google's not bothering with the location not that there is no traffic.

            I get lots of local keywords where Google says no traffic where, in Google webmaster tools, Google tells me a page of mine was shown 70 or 110 times for that very keyword.

            Back to Market Samurai and keyword competition. You're better off finding out which 3 pages show up at the top for a keyword (you can use Market Samurai for that) and opening each one in Google and taking a look at the url, page title, h1.

            If they have all the right places properly done, they're going after the keyword.

            You can then look them up in something like majesticseo.com to see if they've done a great job with the backlinks.

            You're looking for sites that don't have the keyword in all the right places and have few if any backlinks, or from good sites and with good keywords as anchor text.

            Back to Mike

            Though he often comments in negative format, he doth know SEO far beyond most of the other commenters on this forum. Far, far beyond.

            Generally speaking, go for substance not form.
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            • Profile picture of the author Techalo
              Originally Posted by DABK View Post

              Mike is right: Market Samurai is not a good tool to use, unless you're looking to sort keywords by number of words in it... Say, you want only 4 word or more, Market Samurai sorts out the 1, 2, and 3 keywords.

              The competition in Google keyword planner is for adwords. Just because people bid high on a keyword in adwords it doesn't mean it's high competition from an SEO point of view.


              If you're looking for local keywords, pick the best keywords in Google keyword planner

              in insurance, it will give you
              auto insurance
              car insurance
              as the top keywords by volume

              You'd take these keywords and stick them in http://www.5minutesite.com/local_keywords.php. (It's an easy way to add city names in front and after keywords based on a location and radius).

              Then you'd run the list you get in keyword planner, to get volume.

              Google will bring no volume for a lot of them. Usually it means that Google's not bothering with the location not that there is no traffic.

              I get lots of local keywords where Google says no traffic where, in Google webmaster tools, Google tells me a page of mine was shown 70 or 110 times for that very keyword.

              Back to Market Samurai and keyword competition. You're better off finding out which 3 pages show up at the top for a keyword (you can use Market Samurai for that) and opening each one in Google and taking a look at the url, page title, h1.

              If they have all the right places properly done, they're going after the keyword.

              You can then look them up in something like majesticseo.com to see if they've done a great job with the backlinks.

              You're looking for sites that don't have the keyword in all the right places and have few if any backlinks, or from good sites and with good keywords as anchor text.

              Back to Mike

              Though he often comments in negative format, he doth know SEO far beyond most of the other commenters on this forum. Far, far beyond.

              Generally speaking, go for substance not form.
              Thank you for sharing this!

              I purchased market samurai about 5 years ago when my dad tried to get me into Affiliate Marketing as that's how he made his living(unfortunately I was too young to see the value in this at the time). Since then, he has had medical problems, and his vision has gone and he can no longer look at a computer. The information he gave me then doesn't seem to be relevant now, as a lot has changed.

              Market Samurai is not something I lean on heavily, rather something I have readily available. So if it's useful and I can take advantage of it, I would like to try and do so.

              I really appreciate your input, and the website you provided (I would normally just look it up manually and create an excel formula to do this - this is much easier, thanks!).

              Thank you for the input on Mike - It's not my intention to be rude or argue with anyone, especially with someone that has been active in the community for so long.

              Again, thank you for this nugget, and I will go for substance, not form!

              Best,
              Will
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  • Profile picture of the author mdarifsadik
    I think google adwords tools is the best keyword research tools
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  • Profile picture of the author cookiesfromhome
    Banned
    Market samurai and Google adword keywords planner are some best keywords research tools.
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  • Profile picture of the author Slade556
    Originally Posted by Techalo View Post


    I currently use a program called Market Samurai that seems to help with keyword generation and it also provides a clean format to view approx monthly searchs, CPC, etc.. My problem I seem to be having is determining what keywords to select, and what I should be looking for.
    No! Bad market samurai!
    You're better off using Google's planner, it's free and it's way better!
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  • Profile picture of the author addbizglobal
    I don't use any tool for keywords research. I just simply type my product or service in Google and it gives some suggestion. It is called Google Instance. So i select exact and searchable keywords without any tool.
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  • Profile picture of the author Techalo
    Hi Mike,

    When you said it has nothing to do with SEO, you didn't offer any sustenance, but rather an inexpressive reply that I perceived as negative. If you would have positioned it in a way where I was able to take something away from it, my interpretation would have been completely different. It's like having cereal without milk, yeah you can still eat it, but it's not as good without milk... right? Negative without the positive...

    My apologies for misinterpreting your tone. I'm not hear to argue with you or anyone else, and if I offended you by thinking you were trolling, then I apologize.

    I welcome all constructive criticism, and I know there is much to learn in this ever evolving business, and I'm already behind. I've been a web developer for just under 10 years, so I know a little about a lot, and this is a great community to spark innovation!

    With that being said, do you care to share any pointers on SEO?

    Best,
    Will
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    • Profile picture of the author MikeFriedman
      Originally Posted by Techalo View Post

      When you said it has nothing to do with SEO, you didn't offer any sustenance, but rather an inexpressive reply that I perceived as negative. If you would have positioned it in a way where I was able to take something away from it, my interpretation would have been completely different. It's like having cereal without milk, yeah you can still eat it, but it's not as good without milk... right? Negative without the positive...
      I phrased it that way on purpose. Too many people want every little thing spoon fed to them without doing any work or research on their own. Just one of the many reasons most of them fail. I asked the question rather than giving you the answer so that if you did not know that, you would look up what the competition in Google's Keyword Planner really means yourself.

      So in other words... Get your own damn milk.

      As for Market Samurai, here is some of why it is a total useless POS. First of all, the training the developers provide with it is total crap, and mostly outright lies. They tell you when analyzing competition to look at things like EDU/GOV links, the number or results in Google's index (I think they call it SEOC if I remember correctly), how many backlinks a page has, and a host of other useless data. None of that has to do with competition.

      Second, the product itself is slow as hell, and it is just grabbing keyword data from Google. You can go to Google yourself and get the data in a fraction of the time.

      Nothing has changed. It was always an over-hyped garbage can.
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      • Profile picture of the author Techalo
        Haha, I'll get my milk as soon as I find the cow!

        I appreciate you taking the time to outline the reasons why market samurai is ineffective. As I was telling DABK, I purchased Market Samurai around 5 years ago, and it's not something I lean on heavily, rather something I have readily available. So if it's useful and I can take advantage of it, I would like to try and do so.

        I would like to ask you, Mike, do you have any recommendations on good ebooks/literature? I'm not looking to be spoon fed, or get something I didn't work for. However, as someone that knows little about the SEO world, asking someone that knows a lot, I would really appreciate your recommendation.

        Best,
        Will
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  • Profile picture of the author kirakenny
    Well sorry, mind i ask something?

    The question is, what you mean by competition? I am still new to this. I am seeking for what you are seeking too. But I am always getting things like what Mike is giving. And I just don't get it. And I understand it is frustrating.

    "SPOON FEED ME PLEASE IF YOU HAVE TO TROLL"

    BTW, do you mean the keywords is strongly targeted by others? If so, I think I read somewhere before in this forum, they call it manual research or something like that. Just "type in your keywords" into Google. And look at the results. If it is highly targeted you can see

    1. a lot bolding (meaning directly your keyword) in tittle, description
    2. a lot advertisement
    3. and many more other elements which i can't remember xD

    Personally I will click all the links on 1st page of result and go through all their sites and check their description, title, and keywords. But I heard that "the keyword" meta thing isn't useful anymore. (those you put in header)


    P.S. well i am in Singapore so from my result I felt it is. Any chance somebody teach me to look at result from other country?
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  • Profile picture of the author Nahin0001
    I think google adwords tools is the best keyword research tools.You should try it.
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