finding niches is SOOO difficult

44 replies
  • SEO
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I have been trying to find microniches based on following criteria:

- should have at least 2000 exact searches and 10,000 phrase searches
- any top level domain .com/net/org
- medium competition with less or no sites ranking on top.


I am not able to find any good niches uptill now. Almost all good niches have already been taken.

Any ideas what to do? I know about Market Samurai and softwares like those but... i dnt have $90+ to spend on them. I have already spent money on other products.

I have been trying to use Google keyword tool which is ofc next best alternative but looks like all good niches are gone.
#difficult #finding #niches
  • Profile picture of the author AusSi
    I can relate. Finding exact keyword match domain names now days can be very difficult. But after a couple years of online marketing, it will become apparent that having keyword in a domain name is just not that important in the long run. Yes it is a big ranking factor but it is not the be all and end all of online marketing.
    What you should be spending your time doing is finding niches that interest you and have good earning potential without ridiculous competition.

    Though you wont rank first spot for the main niche terms in the first month or so, with a bit of persistence you can build a content rich site of value that will bring in hundreds of long tail visitors (that are more likley to convert anyway), not having an exact match domain will force you to build a build a better quality site that in the long run would out perform any low quality exact match domain site.

    I find so many people getting way to caught up in finding the right domain that they never end up starting anything and when they do they slap on a few pages, get ranking for the domain keyword and move onto another site never having really made anything of value in the first one.

    This is the online marketing of the past, google and other search engines now place a lot more emphasis on the quality and value of a site (amount and quality of the content) than the keywords in the domain.
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    • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
      You may want to check this video out to see why you and others are having a hard time on niche selection.


      All the best,
      Ewen
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      • Profile picture of the author DavesKIEST
        Originally Posted by ewenmack View Post

        You may want to check this video out to see why you and others are having a hard time on niche selection.

        YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

        All the best,
        Ewen
        Great video, it sum the keyword research very

        :p
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        • Profile picture of the author bristol
          Originally Posted by DavesKIEST View Post

          Great video, it sum the keyword research very

          :p
          Agreed! It was very good and informative!
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  • Profile picture of the author priyankeshu
    thanks for replies..

    it is so difficult to get started damn!
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  • Profile picture of the author BobJutsu
    "where supply and demand meet is equilibriam...there is no way to make money there"
    Here is where I call a big fat stinky pile of BS. Go tell everyone killing it on dating offers, weight loss offers, etc that there is no way to make money in those markets...

    I would rather have a small piece of a big pie, than an entire tiny one, get what I'm saying? Besides, I don't understand why people run from competition, no matter how big the market is, someone has to be the leader and I see no reason for it not to be me/you.

    I like to look at markets based on profitability, not on competition. If the money is there, so am I. Besides, entering large markets means you have room to move laterally, instead of having to start from scratch in a new market all the damn time you can leverage the assets you already have.

    So, my advice summed up...when you are looking at your competition, look for a way to offer a unique selling proposition...the rest is just work.
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    • Profile picture of the author sparckyz
      Originally Posted by BobJutsu View Post

      Here is where I call a big fat stinky pile of BS. Go tell everyone killing it on dating offers, weight loss offers, etc that there is no way to make money in those markets...

      I would rather have a small piece of a big pie, than an entire tiny one, get what I'm saying? Besides, I don't understand why people run from competition, no matter how big the market is, someone has to be the leader and I see no reason for it not to be me/you.

      I like to look at markets based on profitability, not on competition. If the money is there, so am I. Besides, entering large markets means you have room to move laterally, instead of having to start from scratch in a new market all the damn time you can leverage the assets you already have.

      So, my advice summed up...when you are looking at your competition, look for a way to offer a unique selling proposition...the rest is just work.
      I'm no expert, but i'm guessing the problem with high competition and authority sites in the lead is it could take you years, a decade (or even never) to beat them and get to page one of serps.
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      • Profile picture of the author BobJutsu
        Originally Posted by sparckyz View Post

        I'm no expert, but i'm guessing the problem with high competition and authority sites in the lead is it could take you years, a decade (or even never) to beat them and get to page one of serps.
        If it takes you years, you are doing it wrong.

        First, think in terms of findability, not SEO. Large markets mean lots of opportunity for media buys, partnerships, visibility, etc. Its about being able to offer a unique selling proposition that your competition doesn't offer and putting it in front of as many qualified eyeballs as possible. Your ranking isn't the goal, it is just another metric for measurement...profit is the goal.

        Second, think about profit. Not every large market is for me, I'm not saying that just because a market is large and has lots of competition that I'm in it...I'm saying that profitability is my primary concern on whether to enter a market or not...no whether or not I can bottom feed. Competition does not automatically = profitable, not by any means...but competition isn't going to deter me from entering a profitable market either, that's all I'm saying.

        And in terms of SEO, it boils down to a few simple things really...write more, and better content than your competition, get more and better links than your competition, and offer a better offer than your competition. Do that, and you will rank well and be profitable. I'm no fool, I understand that not everyone has the means to spend $10,000 on a high level link building campaign...but while your building everything on your own, I would still rather build in a market that allows me to grow as much as possible, so I can compete on that level later on.
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    • Profile picture of the author MichaelParsons
      Originally Posted by BobJutsu View Post

      I would rather have a small piece of a big pie, than an entire tiny one, get what I'm saying? Besides, I don't understand why people run from competition, no matter how big the market is, someone has to be the leader and I see no reason for it not to be me/you.
      Stole my thunder there a bit Bob, but I agree with your premise. Competition=money. I'm working on some training videos. You know how competitive that can be. I'll probably get my head handed to me, but I have to try. :rolleyes:

      In response to the main issue, URI/URL, I have a lot of stuff on my main site relating to SEO, Internet marketing tips, current events posts, I give away 10,000 PLR articles and eBooks to my free members, all kinds of stuff.

      My readership and member numbers have been growing more since I've been on the forum (thanks Warriors!) and I get about 8% of traffic from searches, according to Alexa.

      My URL is MY NAME, but I still show up very well on SERPS against companies which have exact matches to the search terms as their URL. No one wants to search for Michael Parsons, but if you did I'd still be on page 2 with an exact match in my URL. A lot of "competition" for my name :p

      Prime example, in a Google search for "Holistic SEO" (with or without quotes) my site is not only on the first page of the SERPS, but is 2 spots above the company that has this exact keyword DOT COM.

      The point I'm trying to make is, "Don't sweat too much about exact matches for URL." Better to have the info in your "title tag" as an exact match and get as close as you can in the URL.

      Maybe you should add or drop a word from your keyword search. If you're trying for "EasyThightFatExercises", and you can't get that, try a synonym for exercises, or drop easy, or add easy or a synonym for easy.

      I hope you get the gist of what I mean. Best of luck!
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      • Profile picture of the author Abruzzo Villas
        Originally Posted by MichaelParsons View Post


        The point I'm trying to make is, "Don't sweat too much about exact matches for URL." Better to have the info in your "title tag" as an exact match and get as close as you can in the URL.

        I hope you get the gist of what I mean. Best of luck!
        thanks for your input... For me i already rank high with my main key word (and the key word is also part of my title tag) but now i want to rank high with other keywords too - are you saying that in order for me to do this i need to change my original title tag now?

        My concern now is that if i do change my title tag it will then disrupt my ranking with my already high raking main key word...

        Is there a way where i can create a blog entry within my site but make the URL also contain the keywords and ALSO create title tag for this blog that sits on my website? hmmmm i hope you follow?
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        • Profile picture of the author MichaelParsons
          Originally Posted by Abruzzo Villas View Post

          thanks for your input...

          Is there a way where i can create a blog entry within my site but make the URL also contain the keywords and ALSO create title tag for this blog that sits on my website? hmmmm i hope you follow?
          Absolutely, you can make a blog post title another keyword!!!

          I have done so quite successfully! You might search for "PLR MRR" and find a post on that subject by me on a blog that has no other SEO component for those search terms.

          The "PLR" and "MRR" are in not only the Title, but also the long-tail of the URI/URL.

          Example: a Post on "Uses for FOO" would have that in the title, but also have MYSITE[dotcom]/#or category/UsesForFOO. You'll attract searches for "FOO" and "Uses of/for/the/ FOO" even if your URL has no mention of FOO.

          At least this is what WP does, and you can make the HTML say anything you want if you hand-code.
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          • Profile picture of the author Abruzzo Villas
            Originally Posted by MichaelParsons View Post

            Absolutely, you can make a blog post title another keyword!!!

            Example: a Post on "Uses for FOO" would have that in the title, but also have MYSITE[dotcom]/#or category/UsesForFOO. You'll attract searches for "FOO" and "Uses of/for/the/ FOO" even if your URL has no mention of FOO.

            At least this is what WP does, and you can make the HTML say anything you want if you hand-code.
            Thanks! But is better to have the site with dashes in between the URL keywords ie MYSITE[dotcom]/#or category/Uses-For-FOO
            or does it make no difference?
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    • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
      Originally Posted by BobJutsu View Post

      Here is where I call a big fat stinky pile of BS.
      It's interesting you should think this.

      Big players put down $15,000 to get inside knowledge from that source.

      They do it to get an edge over the masses and hold their position as underground Big players.

      Ewen
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      • Profile picture of the author BobJutsu
        Originally Posted by ewenmack View Post

        It's interesting you should think this.

        Big players put down $15,000 to get inside knowledge from that source.

        They do it to get an edge over the masses and hold their position as underground Big players.

        Ewen
        Don't confuse authority with knowledge. I was, and am still, referring to the specific line that I quoted earlier "there is no more money to be made"... and that is, and always has been BS. Even if everything else they have to say is spot on gold, that part is BS.

        And I don't give a damn who pays for anything, anybody who pays 15 grand to be told that a) markets follow that stupid graph, which they don't, and b) you can't make money if other people are already making money, obviously aren't very innovative or observant.

        But I don't want to get too far offtrack, I also don't want anybody to think that you shouldn't exploit a smaller niche for some easy cash if that is your thing, just that it is wrong to think that large markets and competition are something to be feared...they are not and there is plenty of money to be made.
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        • Profile picture of the author priyankeshu
          Originally Posted by BobJutsu View Post

          Don't confuse authority with knowledge. I was, and am still, referring to the specific line that I quoted earlier "there is no more money to be made"... and that is, and always has been BS. Even if everything else they have to say is spot on gold, that part is BS.

          And I don't give a damn who pays for anything, anybody who pays 15 grand to be told that a) markets follow that stupid graph, which they don't, and b) you can't make money if other people are already making money, obviously aren't very innovative or observant.

          But I don't want to get too far offtrack, I also don't want anybody to think that you shouldn't exploit a smaller niche for some easy cash if that is your thing, just that it is wrong to think that large markets and competition are something to be feared...they are not and there is plenty of money to be made.
          I agree with you. There are many cellphone companies that exist in the market. They are the market leaders but still new companies come in and take some market share.

          It would be wrong to say that there are no opportunities left.

          PS: I started this thread to discuss availability of EMD domain names and not talking about niches or markets.

          According to me there is enough space left everywhere to make money. Just think about this people want new products.

          But EMD would have made my task easier. NO! NO NO! im not running away from hard work but then again i am a human ...
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          • Profile picture of the author seonow123
            Its very difficult to find out niche website but if we try to found niche website for SEO purpose. Then it helps in site ranking in search engines. I always try to find niche website for making website links.
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    • Profile picture of the author watsonovedades
      Originally Posted by BobJutsu View Post

      Here is where I call a big fat stinky pile of BS. Go tell everyone killing it on dating offers, weight loss offers, etc that there is no way to make money in those markets...

      I would rather have a small piece of a big pie, than an entire tiny one, get what I'm saying? Besides, I don't understand why people run from competition, no matter how big the market is, someone has to be the leader and I see no reason for it not to be me/you.

      I like to look at markets based on profitability, not on competition. If the money is there, so am I. Besides, entering large markets means you have room to move laterally, instead of having to start from scratch in a new market all the damn time you can leverage the assets you already have.

      So, my advice summed up...when you are looking at your competition, look for a way to offer a unique selling proposition...the rest is just work.
      same here, i completly agree
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  • Profile picture of the author terryd
    There are still a lot of them out there but it's hard to find them or very time consuming for your method. You really need to get Market Samurai as it makes finding the niches so much easier and faster, then if you combine it with Micro Niche Finder it's even better.
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  • Profile picture of the author priyankeshu
    is Microniche finder different from market samurai?
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    • Profile picture of the author Highdefinition
      Originally Posted by priyankeshu View Post

      is Microniche finder different from market samurai?
      Yes it is. But they're both helpful on finding your niche to market. It's just how you use them that makes the difference.
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  • Profile picture of the author james911
    yes i have the same question
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  • Profile picture of the author Fernando Veloso
    Millions of NEW searches are made every year in Google.

    Difficult to find niches (or should we say "keywords") to dive in?

    Give me a break.

    The world is evolving every day. New stuff happening. New searches typed every day. People struggling to find a niche are just doing it the hard way.

    Here's one example:

    Why should people try to get onto Weight loss battle when they can have a (small BUT ongoing) blast in a small niche, let's say, your hometown? Or your holiday destination?

    IM can be (and it IS) far more then all the niches you see splattered all over the place.

    P.S.: Just a reminder:

    Millions of NEW searches are made every year in Google.
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    People make good money selling to the rich. But the rich got rich selling to the masses.
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  • Profile picture of the author peekay
    It is a process which in the main part has nothing to do with paid tools.
    Those tools are just there to help you automate the process. Niche research is a skill which you can learn. Once you master it, you will be spoiled for choice, believe me.
    Look at: lulu.com/content/5970832
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  • Profile picture of the author paulgl
    When people talk difficulty, they are really referring to the myth of an easy way to riches with some easy domain, niche, etc.

    Never understood this. Either go big or go home.

    Looks can be deceiving. Small does not mean easy. Large does not mean hard.

    Don't be afraid of hard work. You'll need it either way.

    Paul
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    If you were disappointed in your results today, lower your standards tomorrow.

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    • Profile picture of the author priyankeshu
      No i am not looking for an easy way but i have very limited money to invest so i want best ROI

      I know that sites without keywords domains can rank and get traffic but that would require a lot more time and effort.

      It is not just about effort but time as well.. with all due respect please understand that if people who are finding it difficult did nt wanted to work hard would never got into Internet marketing or even entreprenuership..

      I have seen guys having a simple EMD and making all the money they want.

      Am i looking for easy money? Probably.. but im also ready to work hard at the same time.. and i am working hard.. after investing my time and money in couple of sites that are not EMD i am now trying to find sites/niches open and posted my thoughts here just to get some ideas...

      anyways i think the best thing to do in such a situation is what Michael Parsons mentioned here..

      go for additional alternatives adding or dropping a word here n there and then build upon the content...
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      • Profile picture of the author Mike Anthony
        Originally Posted by priyankeshu View Post


        I know that sites without keywords domains can rank and get traffic but that would require a lot more time and effort.

        Oh my. Now I understand your problem. You are completely sold on ONE way of doing SEO - exact domain name match. Keyword research is not about finding searches that have no one else with domain name matches its finding keyword phrases with less competition regardless of domain name match.
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    • Profile picture of the author Natlex
      Originally Posted by paulgl View Post

      When people talk difficulty, they are really referring to the myth of an easy way to riches with some easy domain, niche, etc.

      Never understood this. Either go big or go home.

      Looks can be deceiving. Small does not mean easy. Large does not mean hard.

      Don't be afraid of hard work. You'll need it either way.

      Paul
      Exactly. You do realize that the time your putting to find a very good keyword that fits all your criteria is also meant to be time intensive/hard? Either you put a lot of time finding the perfect KW or you work on KW's that aren't all perfect.

      With IM you trade having very low revenu for a few weeks/months for the option of working from home in the future.. Either way you'll be working hard.
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      • Profile picture of the author paulgl
        Originally Posted by Natlex View Post

        Exactly. You do realize that the time your putting to find a very good keyword that fits all your criteria is also meant to be time intensive/hard? Either you put a lot of time finding the perfect KW or you work on KW's that aren't all perfect.

        With IM you trade having very low revenue for a few weeks/months for the option of working from home in the future.. Either way you'll be working hard.
        Exactly! If it's all about monetization, money can be made in a short/decent time. Isn't
        that what's it all about? Hard work is needed, no matter if you are looking
        for "easy." Whatever that means. What I call easy would make some squirm.
        What some of you call easy would make me squirm.

        Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

        Oh my. Now I understand your problem. You are completely sold on ONE way of doing SEO - exact domain name match. Keyword research is not about finding searches that have no one else with domain name matches its finding keyword phrases with less competition regardless of domain name match.
        I'll second the Oh My!

        Paul
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        If you were disappointed in your results today, lower your standards tomorrow.

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  • Profile picture of the author Clyde
    I really have no clue why people still choose to do things manually..

    I can find 100's of exact match domains everyday without blinking an eye.
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  • Profile picture of the author Abruzzo Villas
    have you tried hittail .com?
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  • Profile picture of the author cooler1
    I thought you could add another word onto a domain but it still get ranked for keywords i.e. instead of www.kitchenappliances.com this instead> www.kitchenappliciances-online.com
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  • Profile picture of the author unlimitedwealth
    Find good niches within that parameters is actually very easy and very fast if you are equipped with the right tool.

    Look around, there are many good keyword tools around which save you time and money by automating these manual task effectively.

    Your time should be spent on digesting information rather than actually mining it.
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  • Profile picture of the author RyanEagle
    It's really not that difficult... just make a bunch of sites in different niches and see which one takes off, then build out from there.
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  • Profile picture of the author seoindiaforu
    It's not that difficult...you need to think .....brainwash would help!!
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  • Profile picture of the author Tom L
    There is definitely a fast way to find exact match domains... I just have not found it yet.
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  • Profile picture of the author brettb
    There are loads of niches that the SEO crowd haven't done much with, you just need better tools for finding them. Try The Keyword Academy or something - the Niche Refinery is brilliant.

    Most of my best niches have been things I've already known about, but a quick go of the Niche Refinery allows me to confirm whether the niche is worth writing about.
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  • Profile picture of the author dagaul101
    Don't give up hope just yet, there are still niches popping up all the time, jus wait a while and something will popup, who knows if the next Twitter or Facebook site will produce a ton of niches to play with
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  • Profile picture of the author Dan Weaver
    Have you thought about finding a niche based on an up and coming trend??

    For instance, I regularly check gaming sites, film sites, tech sites etc to see what the next big thing is going to be... and then produce a blog or forum based on the exciting subjects I find... and if you act fast enough you can often get some great keyword based domains... Like CallofDutyTips.com or IpadHelp.com ... then add Adsence to your blog or forum and spend some time finding related affiliate programs and CPA offers. Works like a treat!
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  • Profile picture of the author Naveen Kapur
    Hi
    I was reading this entire post for last 20 mins. Offcourse I was looking for something else but after having landed on this post, I could not reist putting in my comments too.

    I have been in the SEO business for years. There is no keyword that I think that I can't attain. Just to add to it, there is not less of hard work either.

    What I am trying to say is, what ever neiche you get into, there is bound to be hard work.

    And if you run away from it, I am sorry you are just in the wrong business.
    Forget what marketers tell you on "how to make money online in 24 hrs" and blah blah. Let me brain wash you to the fact that there is no easy way doing it.

    Many would say list building is the fastest way to make money. Well
    Yes and No.

    If you build a list, what would you offer to them - just some affiliate program or some good free stuff. If your motto is not to keep them active and keep them live, I am sorry you will fail again. And to keep them active and live there is more of a hard work finding valuable stuff for your subscribers/readers.

    As far as SEO is concerned, it would be nice to just do a simple search for traffic and analysis in google adwords keyword tool suggestion;

    https://adwords.google.com/o/Targeti...AS#search.none

    Step 1 Target your keywords and country - i.e which country do you want to focus (you will be surprised to know that there are some countries that have good traffic and payouts in adsense and cpa than US alone.) Search for your niche, I would recommend something of your domain knowledge or interest and I am sure it won't be just 1

    Step 2: When you do a basic research of keywords look for 2 good things -
    a) Traffic
    b) Trends.
    Look for trends that are rising. Maybe some spikes too.
    Looking at these keywords and studying them carefully will give you a rough analysis, not exact. Don't waste your time looking for EXACT keywords. There is no such thing as EXACT PROFITABLE, ADSESNED, MONEY keywords. It is just an estimate.

    Don't worry about traffic or competition they are always achievable. There is too much of traffic on the www. As they say "plenty of fish".

    Even if you spent 2 hrs everyday in your online and offline optimization, I promise you good amount of traffic and SERP's in a matter of 3 months on the maximum side.

    Step 3: Focus on Content and giveaways (autoblog, auto content alone won't help) You need something of value to be added. Unless you learn to give something of value to your visitors you won't get anything back. (act like a visitor/customer to your own website and see what's missing)

    Step4:
    Don't loose hope and keep at it. It does not make much difference with dashed domains. Every minute you loose not doing it is the money lost. Research before hand is a good idea, but over research will only divert your focus.

    Every tool almost derives its value / numbers from Search Engines. Why not try understanding how search engines do the math.
    Don't over depend on tools.
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  • Profile picture of the author calfred
    I have found that using my brains first (by surveying the market: dissecting authority sites) and then searching for EMDs using keyword tools is a far better approach.

    The problem is, if you find something (new keywords) that you don't know about, it is hard. This is even harder when the keyword tool throws a bunch of synonyms, tier 1, tier 2 , tier 3 related keywords at you.

    Matt Cutts indeed gave a good advice here: design your site based on serving people, not the search engines.

    This is also why having passion for a niche is important. When you have passion for something, you already have the expertise in a niche. You (will) know all about (and thus all the possible keywords) your niche.

    It also helps a LOT to think in terms of niche instead of keywords (based on stats alone).

    EMDs are still out there.
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  • Profile picture of the author Fahmod
    Originally Posted by priyankeshu View Post

    I have been trying to find microniches based on following criteria:

    - should have at least 2000 exact searches and 10,000 phrase searches
    - any top level domain .com/net/org
    - medium competition with less or no sites ranking on top.


    I am not able to find any good niches uptill now. Almost all good niches have already been taken.
    I think you are trying to hard and too technical ...

    Many times a niche is exactly in front of your nose, something you are doing daily, have a passion for and/or are good at.

    Agreed, identifying it, package it together to share and ADD VALUE to others, it's the difficult part.

    Maybe the other way around would be better? Get the idea first and then look into technicalities, SEO etc.

    Just some thoughts ...
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