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How I know SEO is King!

by Li Weng
14 replies
  • SEO
    • |
SEO is what drives you long-term stable hands-free traffic down the track. Without proper SEO, you'd have to buy traffic and do a lot of work constantly like monitoring campaigns and things like that.

and Just by looking the number of SEO posts on this forum compared to PPC and Adsense, am I not correct in making that judgment?
#king #seo
  • Profile picture of the author Easy Cash
    For sure.

    SEO is a long term solution. You can hurry things up with it in a none saturated market - but it is the ideal way to make good money as it is totally free.

    Combine SEO with good site structure and relevant backlinks and it seems to work well.
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  • Profile picture of the author dburk
    Originally Posted by Li Weng View Post

    SEO is what drives you long-term stable hands-free traffic down the track. Without proper SEO, you'd have to buy traffic and do a lot of work constantly like monitoring campaigns and things like that.

    and Just by looking the number of SEO posts on this forum compared to PPC and Adsense, am I not correct in making that judgment?
    Hi Li Weng,

    Organic SE traffic is great because it's free. But only in niches that aren't too competitive.

    When you start getting into highly competitve niches you may need to spend a lot of time and money on this "free" organic traffic.

    Also, keep in mind that when a searcher is "just looking", they are more likely to click the organic links, but when they are in the mood to make a purchase, they are far more likely to click on the sponsored links.

    If you're in it for the money, the bulk of it will be found in the sponsored listings.

    If you want to make a little money, SEO is they way to go. If you want to make a lot of money, you use all the profitable channels.
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    • Profile picture of the author Li Weng
      Originally Posted by dburk View Post

      Hi Li Weng,

      Organic SE traffic is great because it's free. But only in niches that aren't too competitive.

      When you start getting into highly competitve niches you may need to spend a lot of time and money on this "free" organic traffic.

      Also, keep in mind that when a searcher is "just looking", they are more likely to click the organic links, but when they are in the mood to make a purchase, they are far more likely to click on the sponsored links.

      If you're in it for the money, the bulk of it will be found in the sponsored listings.

      If you want to make a little money, SEO is they way to go. If you want to make a lot of money, you use all the profitable channels.

      I have to disagree with you there. I know a couple of top-level marketers who make millions per year from free targeted traffic, and does not touch paid traffic at all. eg. Michael Cheney And what's good about it is that it's hands free. Free targeted traffic is traffic you get for long-term. Once you build it up to a certain level, if you decide to leave it completely, it will still make you money for years and years down the track.
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      • Profile picture of the author dburk
        Originally Posted by Li Weng View Post

        I have to disagree with you there. I know a couple of top-level marketers who make millions per year from free targeted traffic, and does not touch paid traffic at all. eg. Michael Cheney And what's good about it is that it's hands free. Free targeted traffic is traffic you get for long-term. Once you build it up to a certain level, if you decide to leave it completely, it will still make you money for years and years down the track.
        Hi Li Weng,

        Reasonable people can disagree, I believe I can find a 1000 companies making millions via paid ads for every one you find with organic only. And let's not forget there are companies making billions as well (that's a thousand million). :p
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        • Profile picture of the author Li Weng
          Originally Posted by dburk View Post

          Hi Li Weng,

          Reasonable people can disagree, I believe I can find a 1000 companies making millions via paid ads for every one you find with organic only. And let's not forget there are companies making billions as well (that's a thousand million). :p

          That's true. But I'm talking from an individual's point of view. It's quite a different story with companies. I guess it's really a lifestyle choice. When you talk about automating the income, it's really free targeted traffic at work.
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          • Profile picture of the author dburk
            Hi Li Weng,

            I'm also talking from an individual point of view. In America, up until a couple months ago, most companies were owned by individual shareholders.

            Now, if you are talking about a hobby site, which isn't necessarily out to make a profit, then organic only traffic is probably the better option. For profit websites, however, should not limit their profits to organic only traffic.

            The typical small private business owner can rarely afford to forfeit such a large swarth of profits for their business. Why would they want that? :confused:
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    • Profile picture of the author johnsamuels
      Originally Posted by dburk View Post

      Also, keep in mind that when a searcher is "just looking", they are more likely to click the organic links, but when they are in the mood to make a purchase, they are far more likely to click on the sponsored links.

      If you're in it for the money, the bulk of it will be found in the sponsored listings.

      If you want to make a little money, SEO is they way to go. If you want to make a lot of money, you use all the profitable channels.
      Research has shown more than once that organic traffic converts more than ppc traffic. 60% more in fact.

      The last sentence in your post is the only part that holds any water.
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      • Profile picture of the author dburk
        Originally Posted by johnsamuels View Post

        Research has shown more than once that organic traffic converts more than ppc traffic. 60% more in fact.

        The last sentence in your post is the only part that holds any water.
        Hi johnsamuels,

        What research? I have heard that myth repeated endlessly by folks selling SEO products or services, but I have never seen any credible data that supports that claim.

        If there really is some research that has data that support your assertion, please provide a source!

        I have plenty of hard data that shows PPC traffic converts 300%-400% more than organic traffic, on average. Some campaigns far exceed these numbers.

        While I believe that you could run a PPC campaign so poorly that your own results could be lower than organic traffic, this would be the result of a badly managed campaign and not representative of the industry as a whole.

        I have heard of credible studies that suggest your ROI could be as much 60% higher for money spent on SEO campaigns verses PPC. But these numbers vary wildly based on the industry niche, level of competition and quality of the respective campaigns.

        The true story that seem to get hidden in these studies is that you may be forfeiting 80-90% of the total profit available within your industry. And that's what really hurts you when you buy into this maximum ROI concept.

        Ask yourself, would you rather have the highest ROI or the highest profit? Would you rather have 99% profit on $1000 or 3% profit on $10,0000,000 each month?

        Pursuing maximum ROI almost never gives you maximum profit. While pursuing maximum profit almost never gives you maximum ROI, it is maximum profit, right?
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        • Profile picture of the author johnsamuels
          Originally Posted by dburk View Post

          What research? I have heard that myth repeated endlessly by folks selling SEO products or services, but I have never seen any credible data that supports that claim.

          If there really is some research that has data that support your assertion, please provide a source!

          I have plenty of hard data that shows PPC traffic converts 300%-400% more than organic traffic, on average. Some campaigns far exceed these numbers.

          While I believe that you could run a PPC campaign so poorly that your own results could be lower than organic traffic, this would be the result of a badly managed campaign and not representative of the industry as a whole.

          I have heard of credible studies that suggest your ROI could be as much 60% higher for money spent on SEO campaigns verses PPC. But these numbers vary wildly based on the industry niche, level of competition and quality of the respective campaigns.
          Actually I think it was first put forward in an old marketing sherpa issue, I'd have to dig deep to find it. At a keyword level though not a straight campaign comparison.

          I must admit I've used it in the past to sell SEO services, without a huge amount of checking on my part. But I should qualify that I mean at a keyword level, not a PPCcampaign vs an SEO campaign. At a campaign level the PPC would almost certainly convert better as you can dump poorly performing keywords, obviously impossible for SEO.

          In my research when I check down to a keyword level, ie 'blue widgets' I have always found (no exceptions up till now) that the SEO traffic for the keyword 'blue widgets' will convert more than the ppc traffic for the same term. Additionally there is a lot more traffic. And these are BIG campaigns over a variety of niches ( I work as an inhouse consultant for quite a few major Aus companies).

          You are absolutely right though that you are leaving money on the table if you don't use PPC, and not just from a ppc sales persective. The best SEO campaign is one that uses the keyword conversion data from their ppc campaign to define their target keywords for the SEO side of things.
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  • Profile picture of the author Topgunb
    Search engines which you target with the correct long text key terms are worth their weight in gold.

    keywords are just to vague .... which explains a lot

    ppc if done correctly ... long tailed keyterms are great

    but

    why pay for it when you can get it free?


    Brian
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    • Profile picture of the author dburk
      Originally Posted by Topgunb View Post

      Search engines which you target with the correct long text key terms are worth their weight in gold.

      keywords are just to vague .... which explains a lot

      ppc if done correctly ... long tailed keyterms are great

      but

      why pay for it when you can get it free?


      Brian
      Why not pay for it when it's even more profitable? :confused:
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  • Profile picture of the author Black Hat Cat
    Banned
    Originally Posted by Li Weng View Post

    SEO is what drives you long-term stable hands-free traffic down the track. Without proper SEO, you'd have to buy traffic and do a lot of work constantly like monitoring campaigns and things like that.
    Where do you people come up with this nonsense? I have ppc campaigns that have been running for close to a year now that I look in on maybe once a week. I do not do a lot of work constantly monitoring campaigns.

    As for seo, "free" search engine traffic is great, but who gave you the idea that it is hands-free, or long-term or, lol, "stable"(that's a good one) for that matter? Do a search for "google florida update", or "I lost my website rankings" to see how stable free seo traffic is.

    The reality is, if you are in a relatively competitive niche, your fate is sealed the moment you stop working on your rankings, because, guess what? You're competitors haven't stopped working on their's. You may not lose your rankings overnight, but it will happen....that's if you ever had them to begin with.

    and Just by looking the number of SEO posts on this forum compared to PPC and Adsense, am I not correct in making that judgment?
    No, that doesn't make you correct. The reason for this is basic economics: people prefer what they can get for free over what they have to pay for. That's why people are more interested in learning how to get traffic for free vs having to pay for it, not because one is better than the other.

    I know a couple of top-level marketers who make millions per year from free targeted traffic, and does not touch paid traffic at all. eg. Michael Cheney
    No, you know a couple of marketers who SAY they do this. I bet they have a course showing you how to do it too, don't they, lol? That's also probably where you learned that ppc requires constant monitoring.

    Let's keep things in perspective. Again, free seo traffic is great. I'm not going to lie...I LOVE IT! But, if your business relies solely on the whims of the search engines, your business is built on sand. Just because you make it to number 1 doesn't mean you are destined to stay there. I hope you're saving a lot of money to carry you through the inevitable crash that is to come. And I'd be afraid if I were you. It is December, after all.
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    • Profile picture of the author Laughingbird-Software
      I agree with BlackHat...
      relying solely on organic searches is a bit scary.

      80% of my traffic comes from organic searches. Mainly Google.
      My keywords; Logo Design and Logo Design Software are in the top 10 - but when I drop to 20 or below the first page, my sales tank big time.

      You've got to keep up with other methods of obtaining traffic. Press Releases, talking in forums and Social Networks, and keeping on top of your own mailing list make it easier to maintain traffic.

      Just my two cents
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    • Profile picture of the author Li Weng
      Originally Posted by blackhatcat View Post

      Where do you people come up with this nonsense? I have ppc campaigns that have been running for close to a year now that I look in on maybe once a week. I do not do a lot of work constantly monitoring campaigns.

      No, you know a couple of marketers who SAY they do this. I bet they have a course showing you how to do it too, don't they, lol? That's also probably where you learned that ppc requires constant monitoring.
      Nope, now you're making random assumptions out of nowhere. I wasn't TOLD about this. I learned from my own experience of PPC, it does require a lot of testing and tweaking to get results, especially for the unexperienced.

      Don't get be wrong here, I'm not discounting PPC. I don't cut it completely out of the equation. It's a good way to get traffic if you're advanced at it. But SEO should be the focus, and PPC something on the side.
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