You'll get my new backlinking software when YOU PRY IT of my dead cold hands

Clint Faber

12 years ago

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wegenbelasting 12 years ago

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- Mike Anthony 12 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by wegenbelasting
  
  Mike nice that you mention but what is this website about: Real Link Juice - Your Link Dreams Come True
  Isn't that your 1 click solution?
  
  No my non-sherlock holmes friend. Is BMR a 1 click solution? Man people get so defensive when you suggest they quit their drugzz errr I mean backlink push a button to rank software.
  
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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Clint Faber

Do I sense some hostility?.

nope but I generally find the people who say ouch the fastest are the people whose foot you just stepped on

Not to worry clint I have no doubt that software that Zoooms you to the front page of google in one hour is legit. How could it not work asdvertised?

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Clint Faber

12 years ago

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Clint Faber

Yes, Are Backlinktopia software speaks for itself with the testimonials of warriors here on the forum.

Testimonials? Well then there must be magic in it. I'm sold. Will buy it now then based on that and will report back in an hour with my brand new ranking.

6:00 PM eastern standard time. start the clock. reve the engines. Feeling social myself today. Fun stuff.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

aww shucks. Sorry Clint - can't buy it. I took a pledge never to buy a SEO tool that talks about Millions of competing pages. One of the greatest crocks we talk about in this forum all the time. Word count in the Google index is not competing pages anymore than the word Whale in the book Moby Dick is an indication that the author had a desire to compete to sell Fish.

Guess I will have to wait for the rank in two hours sequel

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Clint Faber

12 years ago

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Clint Faber

I'm sensing that you're not in a very friendly mood which is completely understandable I'm not always in the best of ones myself. But I try to stay away from social communications at that point.

I certainly will take that advice when I am not in a fine mood but I am now in a pretty good mood. I was actually enjoying this thread so you are wrong on the psychoanalysis thing.

Given the tone of this thread I must conclude my interaction with this discussion with the following statement.

There is no tone except what I hold to be true about SEo and the marketplace. You seem to be getting VERY defensive when not a single seller was mentioned in this thread. SO who was I having the tone with? No one. Simply pointing at the general trend in the marketplace. I think if we are being honest (we can be right?) its probably my viewpoint you have an objection to which is fine.

So to be direct (and boring) I have no reason to view any solution that indicates that they can rank within an hour as being realistic to those they are selling. I have no intention of opening my mind until my brains fall out. Its a sham that will not be created by most people.

Just bare in mind I never brought up any software. You brought up your own.

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down

12 years ago

Software is just a tool, the main thing is our strategy to become number one in all search engines. More new software is released for backlink in this day, because its market is very promising indeed.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by down

Software is just a tool, the main thing is our strategy to become number one in all search engines. More new software is released for backlink in this day, because its market is very promising indeed.

No doubt very promising market for the sellers but really if you could buy a tool that really does what several of them claim to do why are there so many people who can't rank and can;t get traffic in IM? Inquiring minds want to know.

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Clint Faber 12 years ago

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- Mike Anthony 12 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Clint Faber
  
  you can teach a man to fish but is up to the man to doing any thing beyond that point of what you have done for them.
  
  Too true my man but alas if only the analogy actually matched. It doesn't when we are talking about a contraption that catches fish - um - lets say
  
  "faster, easier and with almost no effort at all" and within an hour no less.
  
  What is there to teach? Heres the gas pedal. heres the brakes - Push the button and go baby!!
  
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Fraggler

12 years ago

Mike, you just have to have a look at some of the backlinking or 'seo' forums to see that many people forget the aim of the game and become obsessed with backlink counts and index rates rather than creating an online business utilising organic traffic.

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bitriot

12 years ago

There is some truth in what you are saying, but post Panda, I am still ranking up websites using a tried and true combination of blog comments, private blog network posts, article blasts and forum blasts - all indexed.

This is no guarantee these methods will work indefinitely, but for the time being they still work.

So, I guess, keep ranting and I will keep earning.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by bitriot

There is some truth in what you are saying, but post Panda, I am still ranking up websites using a tried and true combination of blog comments, private blog network posts, article blasts and forum blasts - all indexed. So, I guess, keep ranting and I will keep earning.

Try leaving off Blog comments . private blog networks, and articles and call me when you have read the OP. You just might have a legitimate point then. I mentioned all of those when I clearly indicated the blog comments, BMR and AMR still work. You just missed that in your anti rant rant. Your forum blasts don't matter squat no matter what you claim. leave the others off and you can prove otherwise.

Be happy man. Good thing you can still rank without great reading skills

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Marc_L 12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Your forum blasts don't matter squat no matter what you claim. leave the others off and you can prove otherwise.

I'd be willing to test this statement. I have a copy of xrumer collecting dust at the moment. I'll be willing to do some blasts to see if this is true. I don't think forum profiles are worth much of a "squat" but they do have some effect, even now.

Anybody here have a domain they are willing to test?
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- wegenbelasting 12 years ago
  
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  Marc_L 12 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by wegenbelasting
  
  nvm
  
  I see you own scrapebox (I glanced at your links). LOL Have you done any xrumer on this site?
  
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bitriot

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Try leaving off Blog comments . private blog networks, and articles and call me when you have read the OP. You just might have a legitimate point then. I mentioned all of those when I clearly indicated the blog comments, BMR and AMR still work. You just missed that in your anti rant rant. Your forum blasts don't matter squat no matter what you claim. leave the others off and you can prove otherwise.

Be happy man. Good thing you can still rank without great reading skills

Well first off, your rant reads like it is anti all forms of automated backlinks.

Second off, when you say directory links, I assume article directories.

Finally, after the links you specifically referenced, you added an "etc". WHAT PRAYTELL ARE THESE ETC LINKS?

Come off it guy.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by bitriot

Well first off, your rant reads like it is anti all forms of automated backlinks.

Lets see.

Yeah I know scrapebox still has it uses and so does AMR but seriously tell me - why do you go crazy for the newer tool that really offers nothing new?

Perhaps you should brush up on how you read cause that reads just fine to me. Last time I checked AMR is automated. In fact all your complaints can be put down to reading issues. I said AMR - what kind of directories do you think that refers to?

I really don't need to respond further

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bitriot

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Lets see.

Perhaps you should brush up on how you read cause that reads just fine to me. Last time I checked AMR is automated. In fact all your complaints can be put down to reading issues. I said AMR - what kind of directories do you think that refers to?

I really don't need to respond further

I'm not an idiot. If I have to parse your post word by word to understand your point it is not I who lacks in communication skills. And even if my post was slightly wrong about your intended point, you handle it with the acerbic grace of a total jerk.

Hope that attitude is working out for you!

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by bitriot

I'm not an idiot. If I have to parse your post word by word to understand your point it is not I who lacks in communication skills. And even if my post was slightly wrong about your intended point, you handle it with the acerbic grace of a total jerk.

Hope that attitude is working out for you!

Perfectly , I only use it when it is called for

and anyone who attacks the way that you do certainly calls for it.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Marc I am bored with you. Can't even bother reading through another response more than a quick glance through. You run into every thread I am in like a forum stalker hoping to win a point any point no matter how tangential. I need retract nothing - all my points all still stand and I don't care what you claim for yourself, your service (when don't you?)or your point of view.

What Panda has done to many sites that have utilized weak links is well known and documented and all over this forum. You want to advocate people continuing to use the same crappy services and methods? Fine do so. Its says more about you than it does me. Just don't think anyone has to bow to your malformed ideas or be labeled "absurd" or full of "crap logic" when its your arguments that have been shown to be deficient.

Me and many others? We'll continue to advocate in context links and getting links on pages with authority. You know - basic SEO 101 stuff post panda.

HAHA, yeah they are so dumb that they believe our sales copy over their own bottom line. People use services like ours and others because they WORK.

Well we had to have the obligatory ad now didn't we? I was talking about what you have been advocating in this thread. Anyway I'd say see you around but where would that be? Not at the top of any serp I have ever had to bother with. First page as ranking? LOL sell it to the newbs position ten aint ranking. No more than the Miami Dolphins are contending for a playoff spot

.

P.S. if you think buying aged domains is the only way to get High Pr links you are even sadder in the SEO department than I thought. Enough for now. toodles.

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

What Panda has done to many sites that have utilized weak links is well known and documented and all over this forum. You want to advocate people continuing to use the same crappy services and methods? Fine do so. Its says more about you than it does me.

That's exactly the point! I haven't seen the dropped rankings. We have no idea what other people are doing and why the got "slapped". What I do hasn't caused this issue, period.

Just don't think anyone has to bow to your malformed ideas or be labeled "absurd" or full of "crap logic" when its your arguments that have been shown to be deficient.

Not by you.

Well we had to have the obligatory ad now didn't we?

I was responding to your attack on us and other providers. Let me refresh your memory.

Originally Posted by you

What they are though sometimes is desperate and then people like you and others come along and tell them all is well just keep on buying our services.

I will respond when you attack our services, if you don't bring it up then I won't.

I was talking about what you have been advocating in this thread. Anyway I'd say see you around but where would that be? Not at the top of any serp I have ever had to bother with.

We'd have no idea, now would we. For all we know, you have zero customers.

First page as ranking? LOL sell it to the newbs position ten aint ranking. No more than the Miami Dolphins are contending for a playoff spot

.

Since you bring the service up AGAIN, top 10 is something that people like to get there sites to initially. It isn't the end of the game by any stretch of the imagination. And again you crap on all of our customers as being idiots who just don't know any better. All you have to do is notice that you have these back and forths with multiple warriors. I don't. It's Mike Anthony, who is constantly arguing with warriors, not me. I think this should tell every body what they need to know.

P.S. if you think buying aged domains is the only way to get High Pr links you are even sadder in the SEO department than I thought. Enough for now. toodles.

Yup, that's exactly what I wrote.:rolleyes:

I have nothing personally against you. I have a lot against your continued attack on warriors intelligence, other's integrity and yet more peoples honesty. I don't post against you because it's you but against your ideas and I will continue to do so. I've never searched your name for posts I find them by reading the forum. Where appropriate I will try and give an opposing viewpoint.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Marc_L

That's exactly the point! I haven't seen the dropped rankings. We have no idea what other people are doing and why the got "slapped". What I do hasn't caused this issue, period.

the thread is not about your services. this is your third different attempt to derail it. Nothing in that quoted passage even mentions your service. It mentions what people have expressed about their experience with panda. If you admit to not knowing what is going on with other people then you have nothing to offer this thread but we both know why you are here and it has nothing to do with the thread.

We'd have no idea, now would we. For all we know, you have zero customers.

And for all we know the majority of your testimonials are bought by incentives, faked, begged for or Jved. Happens all the time. See? it goes both ways. We both can be dubious about each other

. The fact that you run a WSO here and I don't hardly makes you by default more reliable or what you claim more factual. In some circles perhaps less.

I have nothing personally against you. I have a lot against your continued attack on warriors intelligence, other's integrity and yet more peoples honesty.

I leave it to people who have seen our previous debates to figure out how honest you are being about not having personal issues with me. You have certainly made it very personal in the past. How you choose to dishonestly mischaracterize my dissent from your low quality link spam defence is your choice . Fact is I do get in to back and forths with people who defend certain things that are both spammy and don't work for most people. I have a great many friends here and have been a long time participant with a record of people who have appreciated my posts as is obvious by the stats. I can tell you that almost all of my tussles with people have been on this same link spam issue. There is a contingency that simply hate to hear a dissent from that practice and who do try in vain to squelch that dissent. You are not a likely candidate to succeed regardless of your distortions.

Fact is I don't think warriors lack intelligence at all. That i have no hesitance in stating is a bare faced lie on your part . Truth be told in the general board you will get blasted to kingdom come by warriors for espousing software that slams people sites to place a link. Seen it over and over. Think I think people are stupid for mostly agreeing with me? So believe it or not you are in the minority. Link spammers or those that defend it have always been in the minority except here in the SEO forum where they are more vocal and would like to people to believe everyone is for it.

Now is there a contingency that takes advantage of the fact that alot of warriors have real jobs and real lives and don't have the time to sort through all the variables of what work and doesn't in SEO? Why of course. That hardly makes them stupid. If I thought Warriors were stupid I would not even write here anymore. What would be the point? I'd think they were incapable of getting any point I made. Fact is I am the loudest dissent against your kind of SEO and darn proud of it and for that I have been thanked often in the forum and by PM countless times.

So your attempt to claim I think Warriors are stupid is an utter failure and transparently dishonest. Frankly I think a great many of the others that disagree with me don't do so because they are stupid either . A great deal of the time they have a vested interest like the other thread where you are running me down because I warn people not to drop $2,000 a year on weak link spam . Most of the dissenters there are senuke x providers or tied to it by their own admissions.So stupid or ignorant absolutely not. Their vested interest makes that logical

I think the sellers sometimes are though because they often think people will not eventually get around to learning their ways don't work. Some of them think if they can mischaracterize what a dissenter says then they can live to fight another day. Others descend on any post that says that a link spam tool failed and try and place all the blame on the poor guy stating it didn't work.

Like I said I think Warriors are smart. When they do have the time they catch on real quick. Many of them let me know all the time and even more since Panda opened their eyes

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

And for all we know the majority of your testimonials are bought by incentives, faked, begged for or Jved. Happens all the time. See? it goes both ways. We both can be dubious about each other

. The fact that you run a WSO here and I don't hardly makes you by default more reliable or what you claim more factual. In some circles perhaps less.

Yeah, all of them are bought and paid for. Here's the kicker, they keep coming back over and over again why? There are only two options.

They are getting results they like.
They are stupid.

You say they aren't getting results so that leaves us with one option.

Don't try to say that they are naive as that would account for the first sale only.

I leave it to people who have seen our previous debates to figure out how honest you are being about not having personal issues with me. You have certainly made it very personal in the past.

I've merely pointed out what the evidence seem to indicate directly from your posts.

Fact is I do get in to back and forths with people who defend certain things that are both spammy and don't work for most people.

How do you know what works for most people?

Fact is I don't think warriors lack intelligence at all.

Then you must explain the facts above. They are either getting results and they buy over and over again or they are stupid for buying over and over.

So your attempt to claim I think Warriors are stupid is an utter failure and transparently dishonest.

There are no other logical conclusions to the facts.

I think the sellers sometimes are though because they often think people will not eventually get around to learning their ways don't work.

Well again, this is pure BS. Again this insults a whole lot of warriors buying over and over again. Why would they be doing that? Why would they willingly invest their money over and over again on something that isn't working for them? Does that make any sense? Why on earth would they do that?

They are getting results they like.
They are stupid.

Obviously if you say they aren't getting results then that leaves option 2.

Some of them think if they can mischaracterize what a dissenter says then they can live to fight another day. Others descend on any post that says that a link spam tool failed and try and place all the blame on the poor guy stating it didn't work.

If it was the tool then 100% of the users would be having the same issue. If not then it has to be something else.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

I guess I should have added not to try anymore distortions :rolleyes:

Originally Posted by Marc_L

Yeah, all of them are bought and paid for. Here's the kicker, they keep coming back over and over again why? There are only two options.

They are getting results they like.
They are stupid.

You say they aren't getting results so that leaves us with one option.

Logical fail. Creating only two choices so that through sophistry you can make the bare faced lie stick. Doesn't work - still a bare faced lie because there ARE other logical choices (and this can apply to any service and therefore is not an implication to any service in particular so you can quit again trying to work references to your own service in to this thread)

3. its the best they know of which applies to us all at some time or the other which hardly makes them stupid.
4. they are satisfied because its all they think they can afford
5. They are misinformed about the value of the service and the results by the seller/someone else who is teaching them. Sorry Marc having a bad teacher never made a student stupid.
6. they never tried anything else before and have yet to try anything after---- Yet. Experience teaches all of us dumb or smart.

Your logic fails miserably to anyone who looks at the other options. it does not imply that I m calling them stupid and further you have now only compounded the lie with an intellectually dishonest argument to boot. I could hardly have come up with a better example of a purposely logically distorted argument. Touche!

How do you know what works for most people?

Because most people to this day still say they are not getting enough traffic Marc despite buying all the tools and services related to the tools. Its in almost every other thread.

If it was the tool then 100% of the users would be having the same issue. If not then it has to be something else.

Another demonstration of Specious logic. Lets not have recalls on products that affect a number of drivers because not everyone has the issue. After all it can't be the car design if 100% of drivers have not experienced the same issue. Its got to be the drivers. Leave the infected meat out there for sale because not everyone that eats a hamburger from it gets sick from ecoli therefore it can't be the meat. Its got to be the meat eater. Not all serps are the same and there are variables with competition but hey it s got to be the user if the tool doesn't work for him and well while we are at it - If google doesn't catch everyone (100%) with link spam it can't be links spam that got them. It must be something else the user did.

You will no doubt deny it but you are embarrassing yourself at this point.

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Marc_L 12 years ago

You are like Bill O'Reilly, when he says he will give you the last word, he almost never does. LOL

I'll leave it here and give you the last word.
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boxoun

12 years ago

Mike, why do you support bmr and amr? I'm starting to get confused. Doesn't bmr roll off to n/a? And I'm assuming you support amr for advanced uses and not posting to article directories.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by boxoun

Mike, why do you support bmr and amr? I'm starting to get confused. Doesn't bmr roll off to n/a? And I'm assuming you support amr for advanced uses and not posting to article directories.

Box contextual links still work to some degree. BMR I have no idea how fast they roll off but even when they do initially they will carry some link juice over . I agree they ultimately roll off into never never land but its conceivable to me that they work till they do AND Google recrawls the domain.

What is inconceivable, proven weak over and over especially post Pandais blasting a page with garbage forum links, social bookmarks and to some degree article directories but I still see some evidence that AMR can give you some popularity brownie points but frankly I think many of those especially when you are trying to get a thousand are weak as can be as well.

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yukon

Banned 12 years ago

The problem I've found with low quality links (profiles, etc...) is they bounce the page your trying to rank like a mofo, in the SERPs.

The only way I recovered was stop the junk links, build a few quality links, then lay off the the linking & on-page updates to let everything settle down in the SERPs. Next resume quality linking, after the SERPs settle down to recover.

Maybe others have different experiences, personally I don't like all that SERP bouncing back & forth like a ping pong ball, that's when I decided to skip the junk links.

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dukestravels1972

12 years ago

Originally Posted by yukon

The problem I've found with low quality links (profiles, etc...) is they bounce the page your trying to rank like a mofo, in the SERPs.

The only way I recovered was stop the junk links, build a few quality links, then lay off the the linking & on-page updates to let everything settle down in the SERPs. Next resume quality linking, after the SERPs settle down to recover.

Maybe others have different experiences, personally I don't like all that SERP bouncing back & forth like a ping pong ball, that's when I decided to skip the junk links.

Firstly. I haven't read everything, but a big thanks to the OP. I am a complete noob to this and have spent a fair bit on these one click programs and gotten absolutely nowhere, so I'm ready to believe he's correct.

yukon (and anyone else who is up on this stuff) when you say build a few quality links, can you explain how one would go about this. I'm assuming you mean blog posts on high PR edu and GOV sites? Here is a scenario. If I have a wordpress website with the following credentials.

Fully SEO optmized
two excellent articles
easy to rank keyword (0.2)

How many of these quality backlinks would one need to gain in order to see some good google rankings? Would 50 be enough? Should this be repeated weekly? monthly?

Cheers.

edit: just read part that that this is mostly pertaining to easy to beat serps and not tough competition. i dont go for tough stuff, so i think im still going to keep the questions up...

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by dukestravels1972

How many of these quality backlinks would one need to gain in order to see some good google rankings? Would 50 be enough? Should this be repeated weekly? monthly?

Depends entirely on the keywords and the competition on the front page. So do your competition analysis well

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BigNorm

12 years ago

Originally Posted by dukestravels1972

How many of these quality backlinks would one need to gain in order to see some good google rankings? Would 50 be enough? Should this be repeated weekly? monthly?

Cheers.

edit: just read part that that this is mostly pertaining to easy to beat serps and not tough competition. i dont go for tough stuff, so i think im still going to keep the questions up...

You need to change your thinking around. Alot of people have this misconception that once your site is on the first page of Google the battle is won, when in fact it's just the start. You should always be publishing content and building backlinks and it should become an automatic mindset, if you get one keyword to the first page of Google then slow down the linkbuilding to that keyword and concentrate it on others. For every piece of content you have published on your site, you should be looking at building consistent links to it, anywhere up to 100 links a day. If it's an easy to medium competition keyword, it should take you anywhere from a week to a month to rank on the first page of Google, if it's a harder keyword then it may take you a little longer.

I always like to target easy, medium and tough competition keywords. Not all tough competition keywords will be hard to rank for, especially if the sites are not well optimized.

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Marc_L

12 years ago

I'd like to make a proper test out of it so lets see what somebody else suggests.

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MaverickUK

12 years ago

Sorry but I disagree with the forum profiles crap Mike. No, they're not the most pwerful of links but I'm almost certain they're useful to a degree in SEO campaigns - if they were not, then the big dawgs like Matt Carter wouldn't still be Iain them - or me.

I've noticed they're valuable, but not anywhere near as valuable as contextual blog links.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by MaverickUK

Sorry but I disagree with the forum profiles crap Mike. No, they're not the most pwerful of links but I'm almost certain they're useful to a degree in SEO campaigns

Mav just about any link will have an effect in a weak broken down serp no one is going for. There are people who rank in weak serps with no BACKLINKS. When someone can show me a serp where forum profile link s is beating out a site with a solid portfolio of quality links with the same keywords and the same target then you will have a point. but every time this is asked for there is nothing but crickets.

I have even put up a $100 bounty for someone who can show a page in a competitive serp ranking on the power of those where they can show that it is not better links actually doing the heavy lifting. I'll gladly put it up again. So certain? Good go for it and show it in the serps.

What we have in this thread from some is to be expected I suppose - a whole lot of people angry at the messenger who are still hoping against hope for the good old days and cannot adapt so they are trying to hang on to what no longer works and in the process just leading people down the wrong path while making some bling selling the pieces to nowhere.

Theres just enough newbies in IM every year for enough of them to leave testimonials based on getting to the front page of Google on a low traffic term few care about and getting even less of that traffic because they don't get past position 5 getting less that 4% of that already weak traffic.

Truth hurts. I know it does but I used to use and sell profile links when they were good too. Adapt. don't hang on refusing to. Its part of growing up. If I could then you can too.

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

I have even put up a $100 bounty for someone who can show a page in a competitive serp ranking on the power of those where they can show that it is not better links actually doing the heavy lifting. I'll gladly put it up again. So certain? Good go for it and show it in the serps.

How the hell can one show that? This is a bogus challenge.

Plus, what is a competitive search phrase? If a site ranks highly using profile links then the term isn't competitive, by Mike's definition.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Marc_L

How the hell can one show that? This is a bogus challenge.

Being ignorant of how a challenge could potentially be met doesn't make it bogus. It just means you need to be educated more. Its actually pretty simple. My goodness I already laid it out. Give me a serp where a page with less high pr and contextual links and lots of forum profiles is beating out one with significantly more High Pr links and in content links with both of them targeting the same keywords. Freaking easy if it exists

Can't do it because those facts are not on your side? Fine but thats because the proof of it does not exist in the serps and your own arguments are bogus since last time i checked the lack of evidence defines something being bogus..

Plus, what is a competitive search phrase? If a site ranks highly using profile links then the term isn't competitive, by Mike's definition.

Already stated it right in front of you. Its a number of pages going after the same term with an assortment of link resources. Geez how do YOU determine competitiveness if not by the targeted terms and the backlinks pointing at the site on the first page. You always are looking for some classification separate from the first page competition and its totally BOGUS to do so.

Thats why alot sellers come up with this totally concocted competing pages foolishness when Google states pretty clearly that the results count is just that results of a data base lookup to see how many pages show. It makes their ranking for "barb wire tooth brush" look impressive with nearly 4 million competing pages.:rolleyes:

The fact that their customers go "wow' and never calls them out on that tells me theres a whole lot of newbies behind those testimonials. (and before you think thats at you you did not mention testimonials in this thread someone else did)

This very thread may show in the index for "competing pages" or "Mike anthony" or "determine competitiveness" and I am not trying or competing to get any of those terms ranked.

By the way hows the other test going for how 100 .info N/As will rank you for great terms. I trust this xrummer tests won't deprive us of those other results we are all waiting for from the other thread.

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Being ignorant of how a challenge could potentially be met doesn't make it bogus. It just means you need to be educated more. Its actually pretty simple. My goodness I already laid it out. Give me a serp where a page with less high pr and contextual links and lots of forum profiles is beating out one with significantly more High Pr links and in content links with both of them targeting the same keywords. Freaking easy if it exists

Number one, I don't think anybody is claiming that sites with xrumer profiles are going to out rank sites with in context links high PR (or in context no PR links for that matter). At least not in this thread. So the challenge is crap just on those terms.

Can't do it because those facts are not on your side?

What is my side? That I think profile links are the cat's meow and will help sites out rank anything else? Not my side.

Fine but thats because the proof of it does not exist in the serps and your own arguments are bogus since last time i checked the lack of evidence defines something being bogus..

But nobody is making this argument (not in this thread at least).

Thts why sellers come up with this totally concocted competing pages foolishness when Google states pretty clearly that the results count is just that results of a data base lookup to see how many pages show.

I agree that the "in quotes" search number is useless. Your definition is too ambiguous for anybody to take your challenge seriously. One could find a term then you would nit pick it saying that there isn't any PR links therefore the term isn't competitive.

This very thread may show in the index for "competing pages" or "Mike anthony" or "determine competitiveness" and I am not trying or competing to get any of those terms ranked.

I agree.

By the way hows the other test going for how 100 .info N/As will rank you for great terms. I trust this xrummer tests won't deprive us of those other results we are all waiting for from the other thread.

I made a proposal for what I think a keyword would be that would make sense for an "average IMer" who would be in the market to spend $200 to start a network. It was met with crickets. I haven't seen one single example from you for a keyword so I think I left the ball in your court on that one.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Marc_L

I made a proposal for what I think a keyword would be that would make sense for an "average IMer" who would be in the market to spend $200 to start a network. It was met with crickets. I haven't seen one single example from you for a keyword so I think I left the ball in your court on that one.

No you didn't. You are lying. your post is still there saying you would run the test.

Originally Posted by Marc_L

I'll set something up with 100 of my domains. I'm going to setup a new domain that will have zero keyword density in the domain name. Then I will rank that keyword in the top 3. I gave a keyword earlier in the thread. I won't submit any content relating to this site to any of my other blogs.

The question becomes how to verify. I use these sites and I really don't want to get them exposed. I'm sure you can understand this. I'm open to suggestions.

You had your keyword and said clearly you would proceed with it. You claiming you were waiting on me for a keyword is a clear and easy to see fabrication. As usual poor form.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by MaverickUK

if they were not, then the big dawgs like Matt Carter wouldn't still be Iain them - or me.

.

I don't give a rip who uses what. This is another problem with IM people and SEO. You take the whole IM guru hype marketing junk hero worship and carry it over into SEO and in the process fool yourselves and a whole ton of newbies. Don't give me evidence based on who uses it give me evidence in the serps. You won't find any real SEO expert AKa "big dawg" :rolleyes: that says that forum profiles are good but personalities in IM have different ideas. Who cares either way. Show your theories in the serps. I will

EXHIBIT A

Anyone that has been around a few years knows that the number one search term used to sell backlinks was well "backlinks".

Angela killed that term for quite awhile using profile links. From before the first Panda update however that technique got kicked to the curb. Now the only backlinker that breaks top three utilizes a healthy dose of High PR links not forum junk.

No one trying to get that term anymore? Guess again. From time to time the backlink xrummer guys try and get up there but can't crack into the money spots and get kicked down. You'll see the most recent kicked down one on the second page. Pretty obvious who it was when you see the domain name.

Now if in the the serp that was number one for selling these kinds of links you can't even crack top three what does that say about their effectiveness. I know.....

Go ahead and ignore the evidence and tell me how certain you are again.

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

EXHIBIT A

Anyone that has been around a few years knows that the number one search term used to sell backlinks was well "backlinks".

Angela killed that term for quite awhile using profile links. From before the first Panda update however that technique got kicked to the curb. Now the only backlinker that breaks top three utilizes a healthy dose of High PR links not forum junk.

No one trying to get that term anymore? Guess again. From time to time the backlink xrummer guys try and get up there but can't crack into the money spots and get kicked down. You'll see the most recent kicked down one on the second page. Pretty obvious who it was when you see the domain name.

Now if in the the serp that was number one for selling these kinds of links you can't even crack top three what does that say about their effectiveness. I know.....

Go ahead and ignore the evidence and tell me how certain you are again.

This is all true and it doesn't establish that forum profiles aren't worth "squat". What it shows is that they are not as powerful as they used to be, that's it.

So if you are trying to rank for "backlinks" using xrumer only isn't going to work. No S*** Sherlock

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Marc_L

This is all true and it doesn't establish that forum profiles aren't worth "squat".

So what you want to quibble over the definition of squat like a child? here

squat - definition of squat by the Free Online Dictionary, Thesaurus and Encyclopedia.

6. Slang A small or worthless amount; diddlysquat.

So I and the dictionary agree . Very small value and I consider Profiles of very very little value. Go argue with the dictionary.the term does not mean worthless.

So if you are trying to rank for "backlinks" using xrumer only isn't going to work. No S*** Sherlock

You are new and wet behind the ears Marc Or you would know that it did in fact rank two years back using profile forum links. that indicates a change in the algo against those links. No matter how you cry about it the implications are clear. Since those changes a number of software tools have come out claiming the same things for many of those links as they did before the algo change.

Marc just so others know. W e jsut finished having a long ole back and forth and I am totally unimpressed by your assertions or knowledge on SEO so I'll skip going back and forth in another thread because you feel a need to get into another one where perhaps you might vindicate yourself. Run your test , No need to hijack the thread.

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

So I and the dictionary agree . Very small value. Go argue with the dictionary.the term does not mean worthless it means of little value

HAHA, not that I like to quibble but you said that they aren't even worth squat, so less than squat.

You are new and wet behind the ears Marc Or you would know that it did in fact rank two years back using profile forum links. that indicates a change in the algo against those links. No matter how you cry about it the implications are clear. Since those changes a number of software tools have come out claiming the same things for many of those links as they did before the algo change.

I agree with all this, profile links got nerfed earlier this year.

Marc just so others know. W e jsut finished having a long ole back and forth and I am totally unimpressed by your assertions or knowledge on SEO so I'll skip going back and forth in another thread because you feel a need to get into another one where perhaps you might vindicate yourself. Run your test , No need to hijack the thread.

Here's the issue between us Mike. Actually I'll comment there because it relates to the network conversation.

For profile links...
Even today, profile links have value. They do move rank but not for anything real competitive, agreed. They aren't better than in context links by no stretch of the imagination.

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wegenbelasting

12 years ago

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12 years ago

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12 years ago

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Originally Posted by wegenbelasting

For a test it doesnt matter, i think there are enough noobs who type in service group, assuming google knows exactly what they want

old people perhaps.

I dont care about that site, I just want to see some results with xrumer profiles, or make use of the opportunity to sell it, who bids more then $100? I need monies.

Dude, I'm not trying to put money in your pocket.

I don't think either of those keywords would be a good test. One is so obscure that it wouldn't take much to rank for and the other one is so competitive that profile links wouldn't even make it move one spot.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by wegenbelasting

For a test it doesnt matter, i think there are enough noobs who type in service group, assuming google knows exactly what they want

old people perhaps.

OF course it matters. Why not just go for "elephants that need SEO"

Old people. and newbs type in service group.LOL

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wegenbelasting

12 years ago

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MaverickUK

12 years ago

Originally Posted by wegenbelasting

LOL, you guys have no clue, but that doesnt matter, everyone has his/her flaws. I just checked "service group" and it's a medium competitive phrase to rank. So it would match perfect for this challenge.

1.400.000.000 competing pages
1.760.000 inurl
848.000 intitle

Top 3 positions in google have PR3+ and have it in url and in title and in description.

A bit different then "pink elephants looking for seo nubnuts"

0 exact searches according to GKWT lol, but that doesnt mean its easy to rank for when looking at the above information.

Oh dear. You didn't just write that, surely... -__-

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Marc_L

HAHA, not that I like to quibble but you said that they aren't even worth squat, so less than squat.

Yes so as I said I consider forum profile links as very very low value :rolleyes:. If you are not in this thread to quibble then why do so? I've said multiple times in this thread that they have some value. Not zero as you insist I meant. However they are so low in value they have little utility in creating anything meaningful toward ranking in any serp with competition.

Mav just about any link will have an effect in a weak broken down serp no one is going for.

never said they had no effect but Like a child you continue run down your definition for less than squat equating to no value despite the evidence.

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Yes so as I said I consider forum profile links as very very low value :rolleyes:. If you are not in this thread to quibble then why do so? I've said multiple times in this thread that they have some value. Not zero as you insist I meant. However they are so low in value they have little utility in creating anything meaningful toward ranking in any serp with competition.

never said they had no effect but Like a child you continue run down your definition for less than squat equating to no value despite the evidence.

It's just the way your mind works, all or nothing. Profile links have to be the best in the world or worth zero. Anybody who mentions profile links has to be "corrected" when, perhaps they are using profile links for keywords that they work on.

Some keywords that are still worthwhile will be moved by adding xrumer links to your link profile.

Hell, Mike Grant used them on that site we were discussing on the other thread. Just as an aside.

In any case I am happy to accept your retraction

when you mistyped that profile links aren't even worth squat.:p

So, affiliate marketers, profile links will move your ranks for a lot of the keywords you are targeting. Mike wasn't referring to your situation, carry on.

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yukon

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by Marc_L

So, affiliate marketers, profile links will move your ranks for a lot of the keywords you are targeting. Mike wasn't referring to your situation, carry on.

It's not the moving part that's the problem, it's stopping the SERP bounce that sucks.

At some point you have to say enough is enough, stop bouncing... I'm not waiting a month for junk links to settle down in the SERPs.

Low quality links are an unnecessary headache IMO.

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Originally Posted by yukon

It's not the moving part that's the problem, it's stopping the SERP bounce that sucks.

At some point you have to say enough is enough, stop bouncing... I'm not waiting a month for junk links to settle down in the SERPs.

Low quality links are an unnecessary headache IMO.

Yeah, you can't do big blasts, that's for sure. I don't use them much anymore at all.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Marc_L

It's just the way your mind works, all or nothing. Profile links have to be the best in the world or worth zero.

Marc stop the lying man. I just finished saying it is not nothing and there you are back to it again. Sheesh. Honesty matter so little to you?

In any case I am happy to accept your retraction

when you mistyped that profile links aren't even worth squat.:p

LOL. there is no retraction. You merely think that very little value rather than low value equates to no value. Your math logic like your SEO needs some work. Thats your world and you live in it man -not me. I must have really got under your skin (to close to home I guess)for you to follow me thread to thread to quibble and argue for your meaning for a word like a guy desperate to win a point.

So, affiliate marketers, profile links will move your ranks for a lot of the keywords you are targeting. Mike wasn't referring to your situation, carry on.

Oh so affiliate marketers never have competition right?:rolleyes: You are a funny man

. I got to tell you though I am so glad in 2011 the problem for average Imers getting the traffic they needed has been completely solved and the majority are ranking number one for their terms. Must be with so many backlinking tools on the market

Oh wait........ROFL.

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Marc stop the lying man. I just finished saying it is not nothing and there you are back to it again. Sheesh. Honesty matter so little to you?

Oh come now. You said they weren't worth squat, that was an overstatement at the least. I do now accept that you didn't mean what you wrote at first. OK?

LOL. there is no retraction. You merely think that very little value rather than low value equates to no value. Your math logic like your SEO needs some work. Thats your world and you live in it man -not me. I must have really got under your skin (to close to home I guess)for you to follow me thread to thread to quibble and argue for your meaning for a word like a guy desperate to win a point.

Well you are abrasive, this is indisputable. I'm glad we could come to some agreement in this thread.

Oh so affiliate marketers never have competition right?:rolleyes: You are a funny man

.

I didn't say this. Here it is again, all or nothing. I said "a lot of" not all.

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Mike Anthony 12 years ago

Originally Posted by Marc_L

Oh come now. You said they weren't worth squat, that was an overstatement at the least. I do now accept that you didn't mean what you wrote at first. OK?

I accept totally that you didn't understand what I wrote yes but how is that anything new?

Originally Posted by Marc_L

I didn't say this. Here it is again, all or nothing. I said "a lot of" not all.

You implied I wasn't talking to affiliate marketers at all in "their situation". Keywords some yes but that I wasn't talking to them as a group when I spoke/wrote. Your points are just crap Marc. Nothing new.
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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by dagaul101

I agree that the game has changed, and blasting links these days will more than likely get your site penalised

yeah we haven't even talked about those nasty messages with penalties google has been sending out to webmasters who utilize those blasts. Unfortunately there are still a lot of people who don't know about them because they don't have the time keep up with SEO news.

Originally Posted by Marc_L

Well you are abrasive, this is indisputable. I'm glad we could come to some agreement in this thread.

ROFL. Thanks for the literal Black Friday laugh (I am still chuckling to myself) The most notoriously known as being indisputably abrasive and rude even to their own customers part owner calling ME abrasive? leave that to someone else.

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

ROFL. Thanks for the literal Black Friday laugh (I am still chuckling to myself) The most notoriously known as being indisputably abrasive and rude even to their own customers part owner calling ME abrasive? leave that to someone else.

Yes you are abrasive, may I remind you that you are talking with me now. If there is another person you might be referring to I'd leave them out of it.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Marc_L

Yes you are abrasive, may I remind you that you are talking with me now. If there is another person you might be referring to I'd leave them out of it.

Actually you have been instructed before to leave the personal comments out entirely. They were not on point. If you must know and should be obvious the rebuttal very much had you in mind. So we have found each other to be abrasive when we disagree? Notice anything about that in the OP?

Get back on thread topic. You've been trying to derail it for awhile now based on previous disagreements in another thread. We can both be more mature than that.

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Actually you have been instructed before to leave the personal comments out entirely. They were not on point. If you must know and should be obvious the rebuttal very much had you in mind. So we have found each other to be abrasive? Notice anything about that in the OP?

Get back on thread topic. You've been trying to derail it for awhile now based on previous disagreements in another thread.

HAHA, you say leave the personal comments out of it then make one in the same post.

I'll give you the last word on this so you won't be tempted.

Carry on.

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IM Ash

12 years ago

Human nature always seeks the path of least resistance. It's all about instant gratification: instant food, instant messaging, instant weight-loss, instant credit, instant loans, and of course..... instant SEO!

Marketing is a psychological science and junklink sellers just have to appeal to our human nature to make bank.

The true SEOers are continuosly testing and adapting to the changes and the rest are just looking for the instant solution.

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Mike, I don't think anybody is saying profile links are more powerful than any other kind of link. Not sure why you are asking for proof of something like that.

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DPM70

12 years ago

Mike, you infuriate me and educate me in equal measure - good job!

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Also I have xrumer waiting if we can all agree on a test.

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MaverickUK

12 years ago

Mike nobody is saying forum profile links or signature links are anywhere near as powerful as high quality, contextual blog links. You said they're worthless, which they are not - and no, nobody will ever rank for a competitive term solely with these links, I don't think anyone in this thread suggested that either.

I'm just challenging your statement of them being worthless, which they are not. I'm happy to use them here and there on my affiliate sites, however I'd never dream of using just them alone to rank a site - you'd have to be an idiot to even try or do it for that matter.

Yep, they're generally lower quality than other links but they still have a place in modern day SEO, unless you're gunning after the big dogs then in which case you may want to overlook them.

Anyway, morale of the story; they have value

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MaverickUK

12 years ago

Guess it depends how much you rely on the junk links Yukon. I've found that sites with enough 'high quality' backlinks can tolerate a fair few profile/signature links. Besides I've had sites ping around the SERPs for over a month (i.e. not in top 300) with just high quality links.

It doesn't happen as often, granted, but it does :p

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

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dagaul101

12 years ago

I agree that the game has changed, and blasting links these days will more than likely get your site penalised

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by wegenbelasting

I'm going to contact offline businesses with an offer they can't refuse, no need for cheapass warriors, we want real money"

and that my man is the "secret" of running a SEO Business. There are a few thousand warriors who will buy your service for under $97 and millions online that run real businesses and are accustomed to spending thousands of dollars on advertising.

ten WF customers will make you a thousand a month and ten small business customers will make you $10,000-$20,000 or much more per month.

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

and that my man is the "secret" of running a SEO Business. There are a few thousand warriors who will buy your service for under $97 and millions online that run real businesses and are accustomed to spending thousands of dollars on advertising.

ten WF customers will make you a thousand a month and ten small business customers will make you $10,000-$20,000 or much more per month.

Well, except those small business owners are much harder to get than the warriors are. If you put together something the warriors like and can do so at a price that is profitable yet cheap enough then you are golden plus you can get a whole lot more warrior customers than 10.

I wouldn't say one is better than the other it just comes down to your preferences and who you think you can sell to more effectively. If you can do so to both then, why not?

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Marc_L

Well, except those small business owners are much harder to get than the warriors are.

Nope. If you know what you are doing the leads fall right in your lap almost daily and I think any rational person can see the clear advantage of having customers that pay several times more for a service with a better business approach. More money less stress but that too as an ongoing discussion is best for some other thread.

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Nope. If you know what you are doing the leads fall right in your lap almost daily and I think any rational person can see the clear advantage of having customers that pay several times more for a service with a better business approach. More money less stress but that too as an ongoing discussion is best for some other thread.

Well I'm sure you can get referrals and leads on a daily basis but if you market to warriors in most cases you don't have to do anything at all to make the sale. But it comes down to servicing those clients and you'd be 100% correct if it requires the same level of work for each set of clients, but it doesn't need to.

Before you misconstrue my post, there is nothing whatsoever wrong with marketing to small business owners, none. It makes a lot of sense. It also makes a lot of sense to possibly serve more customers for for less money (per customer) as no one or two or 10 clients can sink your bottom line and the customers are much easier to come by.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Marc_L

Well I'm sure you can get referrals and leads on a daily basis but if you market to warriors in most cases you don't have to do anything at all to make the sale..... It also makes a lot of sense to possibly serve more customers for for less money (per customer) as no one or two or 10 clients can sink your bottom line and the customers are much easier to come by.

Disagree with both your points. I've done both and there is no additional work to get high paying clients if you set things up right and you have to set things up right for WF clients as well. You get a lot more hobbyists at WF than you ever will real businesses so the cancellations are much fewer and theres absolutely no reason you have to cut off getting customers so that cancellations "sink your bottom line". However Like I said this thread has absolutely nothing to do with getting SEO clients So a debate on this ongoing would just be a continuing derailment of the thread. nuff said

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Disagree with both your points. I've done both and there is no additional work to get high paying clients if you set things up right and you have to set things up right for WF clients as well. You get a lot more hobbyists at WF than you ever will real businesses so the cancellations are much fewer and theres absolutely no reason you have to cut off getting customers so that cancellations "sink your bottom line". However Like I said this thread has absolutely nothing to do with getting SEO clients So a debate on this ongoing would just be a continuing derailment of the thread. nuff said

You just had to get the last word in, didn't you? I don't care if you disagree with me, in fact I find it comforting that you do.

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BigNorm

12 years ago

I enjoyed reading this thread, well actually the debate between yourself and Marc. As for automated software, I have them but stopped using them a long time ago and now use 2 Warriors back-linking service and 2 drip feed services which I've found on here and all 4 have had excellent results on my sites. Different strokes for different folks I guess.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by BigNorm

I enjoyed reading this thread, well actually the debate between yourself and Marc. As for automated software, I have them but stopped using them a long time ago and now use 2 Warriors back-linking service and 2 drip feed services which I've found on here and all 4 have had excellent results on my sites. Different strokes for different folks I guess.

Nope. Google's algo doesn't change depending on the different folks. This is WF. There will always be some people claiming this or that works for them. Just saw a thread yesterday where someone is claiming they can rank in a competitive serp with no backlinks

. The reason for this is multiple.

A) People define great result based on their level of experience. There are some people that get all excited because they got their first 2nd page result. They swear thats excellent. Others get to the first page and actually believe - mission accomplished without even cracking top three.

B) People rank in very weak serps that get very low levels of traffic capable of monetizing and swear they have gotten somewhere. Plus Most software backlinkers have nothing to compare it to. They don't know and probably will never know how to get high quality links so they have to swear by the spammy stuff and yeah since you can rank in a very weak serp with no backlinks it stands to reason you will be able to pull out some serps with some poor quality links - sure.

C) People remember the results of things selectively and remember only when the page moved up not when it tanked or failed to

D) Unfortunately some people in Warriors just weigh in with claims cause they don't like the conclusions others are drawing. They don;t have to show any proof so they fire away.

However at the end of the day the google serps don't lie and with a backlink checker its pretty obvious to any objective person that the top of Google results have very few competitive pages ranking on the strength of good links not automated spammy ones. You can see that over and over and over and over and over again in serp after serp.

Theres a simple question though that reveals the answer. Since these tools have been around for years, sell like hot cakes and services around them are so popular - why are people still having problems with traffic In IM?

Pretty obvious they don't in fact work.

But will there always be people who play the ostrich and bury their head in the sand and say it tastes good? Sure. Some people even learn to really love the crunchiness of the grains between their teeth too.

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Nope. Google's algo doesn't change depending on the different folks. This is WF. There will always be some people claiming this or that works for them. Just saw a thread yesterday where someone is claiming they can rank in a competitive serp with no backlinks

. The reason for this is multiple.

I have to point out that people have different levels of competitiveness for their keywords. These automated tools can and do bring traffic if you select the right keywords. If you want to go for more competitive keywords then, yes, you need more firepower. However, if you go for the lower competition keywords then these tools will work to bring money making traffic to your websites.

A) People define great result based on their level of experience. There are some people that get all excited because they got their first 2nd page result. They swear thats excellent. Others get to the first page and actually believe - mission accomplished without even cracking top three.

Right, people can't decide if they are getting any return on their investment. C'mon Mike, people using warrior services are not morons.

B) People rank in very weak serps that get very low levels of traffic capable of monetizing and swear they have gotten somewhere. Plus Most software backlinkers have nothing to compare it to. They don't know and probably will never know how to get high quality links so they have to swear by the spammy stuff and yeah since you can rank in a very weak serp with no backlinks it stands to reason you will be able to pull out some serps with some poor quality links - sure.

How about the bottom line? Does that matter? Are only "high PR only" zealots like yourself making money with their websites? Horse crap!

D) Unfortunately some people in Warriors just weigh in with claims cause they don't like the conclusions others are drawing. They don;t have to show any proof so they fire away.

Some weigh in because what is being stated is obvious BS. Your posts in particular.

However at the end of the day the google serps don't lie and with a backlink checker its pretty obvious to any objective person that the top of Google results have very few competitive pages ranking on the strength of good links not automated spammy ones. You can see that over and over and over and over and over again in serp after serp.

Right, only highly competitive keywords make money. Sure, Mike.

Theres a simple question though that reveals the answer. Since these tools have been around for years, sell like hot cakes and services around them are so popular - why are people still having problems with traffic In IM?
Pretty obvious they don't in fact work.

Maybe because they go after the wrong keywords? But the bottom line is that not everybody who uses tools have problems with traffic. Not everybody who uses tools isn't making money with their websites. Your points are absurd and, as usual, use crap logic.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Marc_L

I have to point out that people have different levels of competitiveness for their keywords. These automated tools can and do bring traffic if you select the right keywords. If you want to go for more competitive keywords then, yes, you need more firepower.

They bring nothing special to the table over authority links. You get a few of those you get the same result EVEN IN A WEAK SERP. My goodness I mentioned blog commenting and the lowly article directories ALA AMR as doing better. Given the algo changes that shows Google is working against those spam links it is therefore in the best interest of everyone to change their game. What you and a bunch of other sellers are advocating by that argument is a business as usual approach even after the game has changed.

However, if you go for the lower competition keywords then these tools will work to bring money making traffic to your websites.
Right, people can't decide if they are getting any return on their investment.

Marc you and some others are off in your own world here. I am writing SPECIFICALLY because people have been slapped recently by those techniques. look around at the amount of panda thread we have had and stoop being obtuse. Plenty of peoples bottom line has been hurt by these links. Many many people in this thread and others have not weighed in and they don't respond to you either because they know what you are talking about is crap and the game has changed.

I don't think they are morons at all - you do by telling them its fine to continue to do the same despite panda changes . What they are though sometimes is desperate and then people like you and others come along and tell them all is well just keep on buying our services. Yeah thousands of people got slapped in every Panda update but heres this shiny new tool/service and it will do you great offering the same ole same ole that Google is on a war path against.

Right, only highly competitive keywords make money. Sure, Mike.
Maybe because they go after the wrong keywords? But the bottom line is that not everybody who uses tools have problems with traffic. Not everybody who uses tools isn't making money with their websites. Your points are absurd and, as usual, use crap logic.

You always resort to strawman logic Marc. Its actually sad that you can't do better (and equally tiring). If someone who cannot process basic points thinks that your logic is crap and absurd its actually a good thing so I am encouraged. The point is not that only highly competitive terms make money its that you don't REALLY know when a link is valuable when it is up against no or little competition. A child could understand this. If you go into a serp where there is little competition it is a poor determiner of the power of the links being used. So given that, more and more people are going with links that can do a better job and yes provide a better insulation against Panda. They are doing so even in weaker serps because the inability of the spammy links to rank for anything competitive exposes the links as weak and susceptible to floundering under algo updates.

Why wouldn't they change their approach with the changes to the algo? :rolleyes:. So that they can satisfy you and the spam link sellers and get hit again by the next Panda update? Why would they be looking for more new tools to create more spammy links that google is on the war path against? Look up the word absurd. I don't know that I can make it any clearer to you.

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Marc_L

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

They bring nothing special to the table over authority links. You get a few of those you get the same result EVEN IN A WEAK SERP. My goodness I mentioned blog commenting and the lowly article directories ALA AMR as doing better. Given the algo changes that shows Google is working against those spam links it is therefore in the best interest of everyone to change their game. What you and a bunch of other sellers are advocating by that argument is a business as usual approach even after the game has changed.

Change is good, I have no problem with change but the bottom line is that these "spam links" still move rank in serps that make money, period.

Marc you and some others are off in your own world here. I am writing SPECIFICALLY because people have been slapped recently by those techniques.

Yeah, in a world where we are producing results with the techniques I advocate. Where people are making MONEY off of my techniques. I'm not just talking here. I have no idea who is getting "slapped" but I am not getting slapped.

look around at the amount of panda thread we have had and stoop being obtuse. Plenty of peoples bottom line has been hurt by these links. Many many people in this thread and others have not weighed in and they don't respond to you either because they know what you are talking about is crap and the game has changed.

Right.

I don't think they are morons at all - you do by telling them its fine to continue to do the same despite panda changes .

What am I telling them to do specifically? Bottom line is that people who use my techniques are seeing positive ROI on their projects. I am seeing good results as well.

What they are though sometimes is desperate and then people like you and others come along and tell them all is well just keep on buying our services.

HAHA, yeah they are so dumb that they believe our sales copy over their own bottom line. People use services like ours and others because they WORK. Your suggestion that people pay over and over and over and OVER again because they are desperate and gullible is insulting.

You always resort to strawman logic Marc.

So you are saying that "spam" links are making people money?

Its actually sad that you can't do better (and equally tiring).

Tell me, specifically, how I am wrong.

If someone who cannot process basic points thinks that your logic is crap and absurd its actually a good thing so I am encouraged.

Hey, you stole that idea from me.

The point is not that only highly competitive terms make money its that you don't REALLY know when a link is valuable when it is up against no or little competition. A child could understand this.

But, what if one is making money with these "weak links"?

Why wouldn't they change their approach with the changes to the algo? :rolleyes:. So that they can satisfy you and the spam link sellers and get hit again by the next Panda update?

I haven't seen many changes in the SERPS, Mike. No matter what you are saying, how many times you say it or how you say it. Money making keywords or "average IMer" keywords can be ranked using tools, money can be made with these keywords, money IS being made ranking for these keywords. There is nothing whatsoever that you can say to change this.

Now, tools are just that, tools. You can't just blindly blast, you have to make plans with them. A tool is a tool and it takes a mind that understands how to leverage the links that the tool can make. There are no magic tools.

Why would they be looking for more new tools to create more spammy links that google is on the war path against? Look up the word absurd. I don't know that I can make it any clearer to you.

The problem with your argument is that even today forum profiles (one of the spammiest links you can get) carry some weight. Before you go off on this, profile links ARE weak but that isn't the point. The point is that they still, after billions of billions of xrumer blasts, carry some weight albeit not much.

Google's own philosophy of link popularity and editorial vouching from one site to another pretty much guarantees that "spam links" will always work to some extent. Google would have to fundamentally change their whole approach, and I don't see them doing so. Tweaks? Sure.

Also, don't act like the high PR approach you advocate can't be over done and slapped as well. Google doesn't like their serps manipulated whether it is by "spam links" or through "quality links". So imagine everybody goes your way, you don't think Google is going to come down on your precious networks? I can see them dropping all PR on expired domains that change owners and go private immediately. What's to stop them? If your approach becomes the norm then it will get abused and it will get exposed and it could get "slapped" just like anything else.

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HKSEO Rotzee

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

You always resort to strawman logic Marc. Its actually sad that you can't do better (and equally tiring). If someone who cannot process basic points thinks that your logic is crap and absurd its actually a good thing so I am encouraged. The point is not that only highly competitive terms make money its that you don't REALLY know when a link is valuable when it is up against no or little competition. A child could understand this. If you go into a serp where there is little competition it is a poor determiner of the power of the links being used. So given that, more and more people are going with links that can do a better job and yes provide a better insulation against Panda. They are doing so even in weaker serps because the inability of the spammy links to rank for anything competitive exposes the links as weak and susceptible to floundering under algo updates.

LMAO! You don't nuke rabbits. Will it kill them, yes..but so will a .22 Appropriate tools for appropriate things. You won't know the power of a tool unless you start small and test it.

- Shoot a spit wad at a rabbit, it doesn't work.

- Move to a sling shot, some time it works sometimes it doesn't...not reliable.

- Try a .22 caliber with long rifle with hollow points...lookie there it worked! And I didn't need to spend a million dollars on a large nuclear device.

Does that mean a .22 caliber is going to work on a Bear? No, you'd probably want to go with something like a .338 win mag, and if you shot a .22 caliber long rifle at a bear...you'd quickly realize that it doesn't work and reasonably see how powerful it is (Or isn't) and where its use lies; but that still doesn't mean you need to nuke them just because it CAN kill them....a .338 will work just fine and again, cost less money.

You can't use the opposite strategy to figure out the power of a tool, "which is what you seem to be asserting," to figure it out. A nuke will work on everything, so how do you gauge it?

BOOM! killed the city!

BOOM! Killed the guy!

BOOM! Killed the rabbit!

BOOM! Killed the fly!

^ What the hell does that tell you that you don't already know? Yes nukes are awesome, but they aren't always needed...its better to diversify and use the appropriate tools for the appropriate jobs.

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BigNorm

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Nope. Google's algo doesn't change depending on the different folks. This is WF. There will always be some people claiming this or that works for them. Just saw a thread yesterday where someone is claiming they can rank in a competitive serp with no backlinks

. The reason for this is multiple.

A) People define great result based on their level of experience. There are some people that get all excited because they got their first 2nd page result. They swear thats excellent. Others get to the first page and actually believe - mission accomplished without even cracking top three.

B) People rank in very weak serps that get very low levels of traffic capable of monetizing and swear they have gotten somewhere. Plus Most software backlinkers have nothing to compare it to. They don't know and probably will never know how to get high quality links so they have to swear by the spammy stuff and yeah since you can rank in a very weak serp with no backlinks it stands to reason you will be able to pull out some serps with some poor quality links - sure.

C) People remember the results of things selectively and remember only when the page moved up not when it tanked or failed to

D) Unfortunately some people in Warriors just weigh in with claims cause they don't like the conclusions others are drawing. They don;t have to show any proof so they fire away.

However at the end of the day the google serps don't lie and with a backlink checker its pretty obvious to any objective person that the top of Google results have very few competitive pages ranking on the strength of good links not automated spammy ones. You can see that over and over and over and over and over again in serp after serp.

Theres a simple question though that reveals the answer. Since these tools have been around for years, sell like hot cakes and services around them are so popular - why are people still having problems with traffic In IM?

Pretty obvious they don't in fact work.

But will there always be people who play the ostrich and bury their head in the sand and say it tastes good? Sure. Some people even learn to really love the crunchiness of the grains between their teeth too.

I do agree with some of this, especially along the lines of gaining top page rankings for obscure keywords which have very little traffic and monetary value whats so ever. IF your going to compete with-in a market, ensure it has the potential to yield profit or your pissing into the wind.

I'll be honest, automated software for me has it's value, especially Bookmark posters where links are still active today. By in large I don't use them anymore because I am now at a stage where I can pay someone else to do it for me.

I would be safe to say the main problem people have with traffic is the work behind it. Lets be honest, one of the main things that attracts people to IM is the idea of working less and making more which is what people promise, but when you start you find it's the opposite, work more earn less till you get round that learning curve.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by BigNorm

I'll be honest, automated software for me has it's value, especially Bookmark posters where links are still active today. By in large I don't use them anymore because I am now at a stage where I can pay someone else to do it for me.

Actually I think Bookmarking is the one thing that hasn't changed much. Its never been a great ranker - maybe indexing yes. The right ones. But don't believe the distortion of a few over what the OP clearly states. AMR is automated and I mentioned it as having functionality. Someone even took objection on that point. Scrapebox is automation and although I don't care for spamming I can't deny that it provides a level of automation even with manual commenting (doesn't always have to be full automation) thats effective. but only IF its not a spammed to death page.

I like tons of automation. I subscribe to Magic submitter (only because of its ability to add your own link sites which can include any site.) own a copy of Zennoposter for the same reason . I even use automation rigs I set up myself.

its not the automation thats the problem its the programs popping up claiming they are make money machines which really only offer poor links regardless of whether they are automated or not. One particular person in this thread has been running me down for not liking SenukeX and the $149 a month it drains from newbs pockets even though he knows over a year that takes nearly $2,000 from people while giving them only N/A and zero links.

$2,000 if you used it right would give you all kinds of high authority links and resources that you can leverage to get more and more assets to rank multiple sites. Intuititively even people new to SEO know thats a lot of money to spend on low quality links but the purveyors of low quality links get offended when you dare to suggest better allocations of funds primarily because its not what they offer. How dare you tell newbs to skip spending $2,000 a year on PR N/A and Zero links! Why Why those PR n/a and zero links are what I use. Mind you they don't even have to offer the same kind of links they just object to you talking quality because they know they don't really offer it.

I would be safe to say the main problem people have with traffic is the work behind it.

But thats my point Norm. People HAVE BEEN buying these packages and the software in droves and they STILL can't get traffic. The whole point of the software and then even the services that run the software for you is to get the traffic and yet even with the work getting done by the service provider traffic is still a problem in IM. Proof is in the pudding

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BigNorm

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Actually I think Bookmarking is the one thing that hasn't changed much. Its never been a great ranker - maybe indexing yes. The right ones. But don't believe the distortion of a few over what the OP clearly states. AMR is automated and I mentioned it as having functionality. Someone even took objection on that point. Scrapebox is automation and although I don't care for spamming I can't deny that it provides a level of automation even with manual commenting (doesn't always have to be full automation) thats effective. but only IF its not a spammed to death page.

I like tons of automation. I subscribe to Magic submitter (only because of its ability to add your own link sites which can include any site.) own a copy of Zennoposter for the same reason . I even use automation rigs I set up myself.

its not the automation thats the problem its the programs popping up claiming they are make money machines which really only offer poor links regardless of whether they are automated or not. One particular person in this thread has been running me down for not liking SenukeX and the $149 a month it drains from newbs pockets even though he knows over a year that takes nearly $2,000 from people while giving them only N/A and zero links.

$2,000 if you used it right would give you all kinds of high authority links and resources that you can leverage to get more and more assets to rank multiple sites. Intuititively even people new to SEO know thats a lot of money to spend on low quality links but the purveyors of low quality links get offended when you dare to suggest better allocations of funds primarily because its not what they offer. How dare you tell newbs to skip spending $2,000 a year on PR N/A and Zero links! Why Why those PR n/a and zero links are what I use. Mind you they don't even have to offer the same kind of links they just object to you talking quality because they know they don't really offer it.

I think automation is great and the services I subscribe to do use it to great effect. Both auto and manual. But it comes at a responsibility, spamming is a big no no and should be frowned upon and with so many niche markets still waiting to be picked clean, it's not needed and people forget that. People see the these claims of thousands of backlinks sent to one site and get all excited and think they will dominate any market just with thousands of backlinks. They forget IM is about quality over quantity. In fact it would be fair to say, the Panada update by Google is in response to those very people, spamming the **** out of low quality backlinks to move low quality sites through the serps, even though I know it hit established authority sites as well.

My next project once I can get a decent cash flow is to start building my own private network of sites to garnish backlinks from. It's the age old saying, "if you want something done right, do it yourself" and getting high quality backlinks from a personal network is the best way to go about it.

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mosthost

12 years ago

It stands to reason that auto-generated links lose value. After all, many of the same pages are being spammed repeatedly. That means thousands of crappy links going to probably very poor websites. Plus, the next wave of 'tool users' comes along a few seconds after you post, etc.

There aren't that many 'auto approve high PR blogs' on earth to withstand this after-market of link sellers.

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boxoun

12 years ago

Was it me that was running you down about senukex? That software allowed me to earn my first couple thousand so of course I had to defend it.

Being a rational human being, I'm allowed to change my mind based on recent results and say senukex is too expensive for what it offers.

Also, please keep in mind I always promoted senukex if you can find it cheaper than 147/month.

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Mike Anthony 12 years ago

Originally Posted by boxoun

Was it me that was running you down about senukex? That software allowed me to earn my first couple thousand so of course I had to defend it.

Lol . No Box. not you . I have only one person running from thread to thread trying to win a point and thats not you.
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Fraggler

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

You know it aint going to happen right? A tool that even shows you ranking will only do so because YOUR keyword research found a low competition term. Just send the dollars to a local charity would be better.

I'll have a go at putting this back on track...

There are a wide range of people trying to get a start making money online (using organic traffic). While some are looking to create a long lasting business that can be built up and stand the test of time, there are still many who just are after some extra cash to help make things a bit easier.

Not everyone can afford to start out building their own network of sites or rent links off other networks. They have to work with what they've got and many can afford the $20 to buy one of these automated tools that claim to make things easier - and scalable - just to get the ball rolling. They go for the software because they think it's needed to get results. Quantity over quality is a well worn track in this forum but many of that crowd jumped ship with the crackdown on selling spammy backlink sources and methods.

It's not needed if you work within your means - your SEO skillset and experience.

Where these guys can get started without having to rely on spamming links is by looking for the low competition terms and working their way back up the chain of difficulty. I've covered the numbers in the past but a keyword with even less than 1000 searches per month can get you more traffic than more highly searched terms with tough competition. The reason is that most of the traffic goes to the #1 spot. The traffic drops off fast as you move down the top 10. Anything past 5 is almost insignificant.

There are low competition buying keywords where a few well placed links will let you dominate. They don't have to be wastes of time. Brainstorm by thinking outside the box and the options are limitless.

Create content that you are proud of. This will make it easier to approach other sites for links. It will allow you to comment with a link attached without worry of it being written off as spam. You will also have a page that converts once the traffic gets there.

Once you have those first few pages making a regular income you can start looking at tougher versions (shorter keywords) for the same pages and use that regular money to either start buying links or building your asset base :: your very own private network. (Paying for video creation, guest post writers, info graphics are some other ways to invest your earnings for more links). Always pay attention to your return on investment and potential for growth. This will allow you to invest in quality links with confidence they will pay off.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Fraggler

I'll have a go at putting this back on track...

thanks troy. I 'll concentrate more on your posts and ignore the rabble form the bleachers from here on in.

Not everyone can afford to start out building their own network of sites or rent links off other networks. They have to work with what they've got and many can afford the $20 to buy one of these automated tools that claim to make things easier - and scalable - just to get the ball rolling.

Agreed. Valid point. thats why I talked about blog commenting with scrapebox and mentioned AMR. I use Magic submitter where you can also do press releases and add your own sites instead of hitting the same sites over and over again by all the users. As I mention in the OP what I am talking about is this desire to run out and buy the new tools that frankly add nothing new but concentrate on weak links and in particular blasts of great numbers from truly crappy link resources. People ARE getting tanked by this approach.

I have seen sites built up with Blog comments and it can be done in a non spam way. No building networks. AMR can be setup to publish to blogs as well (Although for that feature I much prefer the ease of use in something like Spinchimp)

They go for the software because they think it's needed to get results. Quantity over quality is a well worn track in this forum but many of that crowd jumped ship with the crackdown on selling spammy backlink sources and methods.

I know. A very prominent seller of a backlink product that used to go at me a year and a half ago came in on a thread and stated something that made my mouth drop. He has done a 180. He came out straight and said that he can confirm that you can tank a site with a good xrummer run and that those days are done. Panda had changed the game.

IF I mentioned the name and the product he sells you would know it but I am not going to do that to him. I think it took major props for him to come in and change direction but like you said to most SEOs Panda is a wake up call.

The problem is that the general public that does not eat drink and know SEO (and should not be expected to because they have their own careers and life) usually lags behind in knowledge in great part because sellers who can't let go of the past and adapt keep pushing the same things that no longer work in order to keep the dollars coming in.

Anyway thanks Troy. Your post came in at the perfect point to snap me out of get embroiled further in a pointless conversation. Good stuff as usual.

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Fraggler

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

The problem is that the general public that does not eat drink and know SEO (and should not be expected to because they have their own careers and life) usually lags behind in knowledge in great part because sellers who can't let go of the past and adapt keep pushing the same things that no longer work in order to keep the dollars coming in.

If the general public focused more on marketing their business rather than having a single goal of getting to #1 then they might be pleasantly suprised at what will actually happen to their rankings. It is one area I'm working hard at - creating a website that is worth talking about on its own right. If I can make a great product (website) then I can start making use of the tactics the bigger brands can use online.

I still rely heavily on paid links but it would be nice to get other people to talk about my site building the links for me at a rate I couldn't afford.

Obviously viral/social campaigns aren't suitable for all niches but there are many opportunities if you are willing to try something new. (If anyone wants to see some good examples) I enjoy reading the marketing/link building campaigns covered on The Famous Link Building Blog

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Fraggler

creating a website that is worth talking about on its own right. If I can make a great product (website) then I can start making use of the tactics the bigger brands can use online.

I hear you. I have been brushing off what little programming skills I have and diving in to Drupal and ASP.net. They are both amazing technologies in their own way and both allow you to create the kind of websites and put the kind of feature into them that allow you to get quite a buzz once you have a fairly unique Idea.

For those that don't want to touch programming Drupal can allow webmasters with no programming knowledge to build some pretty sweet and often unique things. The architecture and community has kind of built basic building blocks like Lego into the CMS that allow you to tweak it to do things that haven't been done before. It does have a learning curve though with that power but its steady and scalable - some of the biggest sites are built on it

Being picked up by a bevy of High authority tech blogs is GOLDEN and if you notice some of the sites they pick up never catch on and alot of the times are not even great ideas - those links though I would pay for - serious juice. Sometimes people get it wrong. I build sites that people link to not just link straight to my money sites. Put those sites into your network and then you can use those sites to do alot of other good things for your money sites on top of what they generate themselves.

The number one thing I see people doing wrong in link building is that they over concentrate on building anchor text links straight to their money site. The world really opens up when you take off those blinders.

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paulgl

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Fraggler

If the general public focused more on marketing their business rather than having a single goal of getting to #1 then they might be pleasantly suprised at what will actually happen to their rankings. It is one area I'm working hard at - creating a website that is worth talking about on its own right. If I can make a great product (website) then I can start making use of the tactics the bigger brands can use online.

I still rely heavily on paid links but it would be nice to get other people to talk about my site building the links for me at a rate I couldn't afford.

Linkbait and viral is the two most overlooked perks of generating your own
visitors that are truly interested in the useful stuff on your site. Which
leads to google love as well.

Paid links are terrific. Not only can you get some PR, relevancy, it
can also generate a little targeted traffic. And most paid links, one
at a time, are affordable for most anybody.

But people hear paid links and think google hates them. Which is
just not true. Google hates some links, paid or not. I would go
for one great paid link before I blasted a million profile links
or auto-spammed some blogs.

Paul

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Legit SEO

12 years ago

wtf are you babbling about?

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Daedalus

12 years ago

Mike, if I ever become filthy rich I'll build a statue in your image. I am amazed how both you and yukon have the patience to tell people the same things over and over. Unfortunately, they refuse to accept them. The main problem is that 80% of people who call themselves internet marketeers are the victims of the same market they are trying to dominate. People refuse to consider the fact that internet income requires work before, if ever, it becomes autopilot.
The constant quest for the next best thing is quite similar to gambling. I say similar due to the fact that it gives you even worse odds of profiting. Most of the things that are launched are worthless, but people always get hooked due to low price of the product and the fake feeling of being a VIP who will gain the edge that nobody else has.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Domsa

Mike, if I ever become filthy rich I'll build a statue in your image. I am amazed how both you and yukon have the patience to tell people the same things over and over. Unfortunately, they refuse to accept them.

Where will that statue be located ?

but no they do worse than refuse to accept them they actually attack you pretty hard for pointing people away from things that don't work.

HO Hum... comes with the territory

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yukon

Banned 12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

Where will that statue be located ?

but no they do worse than refuse to accept them they actually attack you pretty hard for pointing people away from things that don't work.

HO Hum... comes with the territory

You need more testimonials to make them believers, lol!

[just playing]

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HKSEO Rotzee

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

:rolleyes: Look I could hit the report button but I am going to try and explain this one last time because I sense you are gtting the ENTIRELY wrong idea

HK I am not a mod and have no inside connections. Your posts were deleted I believe because you insist on directly advertising and linking to your business inside posts rather than in sigs where they are allowed.

First of all, I didn't say you were a mod, or had a mod deleted them. YOu caused unnecessary negative attention to an honest thread and turned it into something it wasn't. Or you flagged it, who knows. And no, I didn't start off saying "WE USED THESE TOOLS TO RANK IN THESE CASE STUDIES, LOOK HOW GOOD THEY WORK!!" I said we are the creators of....

Start any thread you want and post where you want but it cannot have ads for your business within the post and the threads can not all be about your services or a case study based on your tools or services (you can do studies on basic SEO principles). I've tried to explain this to you but you do not get it.

No, you tried to tell me my thread was something it wasn't and then tell me the thing that it wasn't, was wrong. Just as easy as I can say THIS is a sales thread because your bashing High PR Networks the same time you have a link that says your about to launch a High PR Service. :rolleyes:

I would love to do a case study on what my services can do myself but again its not allowed. Thats why you have had threads and posts deleted. i Know I saw them and they start out with links to your own site right in the OP.

Like I said, it only said we are the creators of...to establish authority and that this wasn't some case study done by Joe Blow. If that was the problem, a mod could of easily said to delete that part.

Sigs are allowed, starting SEO related threads are allowed but advertising directly within your posts is not.

I looked on the forum rules (in the only place I could see anything that mentioned forum rules) and couldn't find anything that said that. That is the only reason it was made that way. (I'm not calling you incorrect, but saying thats what happened..in fact..a link to the rules that say that would be great)

The only place that mentioned forum rules was..

What are the Forum Rules?

Out of that, the closet thing I see as a rule is...

1. Please don't make it one big advertisement.
and
2.All blogs that are nothing but a 'test' or an 'ad' will be deleted. We will be pruning them on a regular basis.

^ My thread was not an "ad" or a test post. So why would I think that it was "breaking a rule". How can anyone here that owns tools, do a case study then? Everyone that owns a tool will use it. I didnt sell it, or over mention it, PEOPLE asked what tools..I said PM me. How that not handling it appropriately??

Further more my sig has nothing to do with me getting ready to sell a network.

lol...riiiiiight :rolleyes:

P.S. I have had threads deleted in the past. The idea that I can get a mod to remove a legitimate thread in order to help me sell something is way off. You don't know the mods if you think that.

You keep saying that, not me.

I simply stated this was a case study created by the makers of.... not these are the tools that made such glorious results. Not only that, but anytime some one even ASKED us about the tools used, I asked them to PM me because I didn't want to discuss it in the thread, that the point of the thread was the case study.

It wasn't till you came in there trying to turn it into a sales thread by talking about our tools over and over that it became one and then got deleted. The same exact thread, on forums with the same exact rules...are thriving.

On one it has 3,684 views with 111 replies and no one came in like an a-hole trying to make it seem like it was some infomercial, or that it was anything other than what it was...a case study.

You tell me how I can do a honest case study, if I don't tell what I did honestly? Of course I used SOME of our tools, we own them..I'm not going to pay for something I can do for free. The best I can do is not mention it was MY tool, and thats what I did...when someone asked..I just said to PM me.

The only time I mentioned any links was originally as I introduced who I was.

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by HKSEO Rotzee

The only place that mentioned forum rules was..

What are the Forum Rules?

Out of that, the closet thing I see as a rule is...

^ My thread was not an "ad" or a test post. So why would I think that it was "breaking a rule".

HK I give up. I tried to explain but its went on deaf ears. IF your threads were deleted by a mod then you broke a rule. Complaining about mod action isn't something to do in this thread (this thread is about the use of tools for SEO not bashing networks) or for that matter in any open thread. Take it up with a mod but pointing out where else you broke them isn't a smart move either especially after admitting you link to your sales pages to "introduce who I was" :rolleyes: in regard to case studies that are entirely about your own services.

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HKSEO Rotzee

12 years ago

Originally Posted by Mike Anthony

HK I give up. I tried to explain but its went on deaf ears. IF your threads were deleted by a mod then you broke a rule. Complaining about mod action isn't something to do in this thread (this thread is about the use of tools for SEO not bashing networks) or for that matter in any open thread. Take it up with a mod but pointing out where else you broke them isn't a smart move either especially after admitting you link to your sales pages to "introduce who I was" :rolleyes: in regard to case studies that are entirely about your own services.

I've said maybe 5 times, they weren't about our own services....we used ONE tool of ours that is sell-able out of all the things done, and thats because it was the truth.

We are currently Ranked #54
Today we built.....
• 50 bookmarks
• 50 profiles
• 18 link linkwheel

Rank: 181

• 1,500 profile links, drip rate 250/day (Note: This isn't recommended for new sites, this site is very old so it can handle more a day.)

Rank: 2

• 1,000 article links drip rate 40/day
• 100 comments

^ Exact Text Copied from what I posted that included any tool use (and is located on other forums where the case study was posted and followed live)....WHEW!! LOOK AT ALL THAT ADVERTISING!!
We don't have tools we sell that make "Bookmarks, Link wheels, or articles" Which is 80% of what was done in this case studies...and the other 20% didn't even mention the tool of ours we used...just what we did with it. So how in the world would you call that "a case study that only show cases our tools??"

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Mike Anthony

12 years ago

Originally Posted by HKSEO Rotzee

^ Exact Text Copied from what I posted that included any tool use (and is located on other forums where the case study was posted and followed live)....WHEW!! LOOK AT ALL THAT ADVERTISING!!

Your lying but yeah lets look at some advertising - I took out the link but here you are just two days ago in yet another thread were no one was asking for your service.

Originally Posted by HKSEO Rotzee

If you really want to see some SERP movement try out High PR Society | High Page Rank Backlinks For Link Building - ( It lets you put links on ACTUAL homepages with ACTUAL High PR, and there is a limit to the amount of links per home page so that it doesn't get spammy)

Google doesn't like new links that nobody knows....so when your link comes knocking on Google’s door by itself, he’s not going to let some stranger into his SERPS. BUT, if your links show up with 5 or 10 of Google’s High PR friends.....he'll not only let you come in, he'll let you come in and kick your feet up on the coffee table!

Well that is what High PR Society is all about. It allows you to post your links on Google trusted, High PR HOMEPAGES! (Are these links posted ON the actual home page with high PR? YES!)

Your link will be permanently on the homepage for as long as you choose. In addition to being able to post on the actual homepages of High PR websites, you can also create articles or comments that will randomly land and cycle through home page of High Pr websites (PR1-PR6) within the network!

NO advertising right

. The only thing missing from that TV spot was the 800 number

Seriously all you are doing is telling people your services are so weak you have to come on a forum and spam it to death to get your word out instead of ranking for a term that would bring you business. You are telling a whole lot of people to stay clear of your services and wasting the time of mods that have better things to do.

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Fraggler

12 years ago

Originally Posted by HKSEO Rotzee

^ My thread was not an "ad" or a test post. So why would I think that it was "breaking a rule". How can anyone here that owns tools, do a case study then? Everyone that owns a tool will use it. I didnt sell it, or over mention it, PEOPLE asked what tools..I said PM me. How that not handling it appropriately??

You created a thread to spruik your own service. You launched the service that same morning as I just received the launch email from your company. Next thing I logged onto the WF and you had a thread created for a 'case study', and apparently not the first (you said the others were deleted).

I believe the mods have made it clear in the past that you can't create or make posts promoting your own service unless it is an answer to a direct question such as: where do I find the HKSEO service? They have also said you can't create case studies where you end up selling a product or service directly related to that case study. People have been trying that one for a long time.

I reported your advertising posts and I will keep reporting them. I report every time someone tries and slips one in. I am sure other people are reporting them too. No one wants this place to become nothing but a series of cases studies of people 'proving' how good their service is when it would be financial suicide to even hint that it might fail. That's what the classifieds and WSO section is for.

For a case study to be of any use it would have to be completely transparent and run by someone with no ties to the service its proving right or wrong.

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HKSEO Rotzee

12 years ago

^ That was HERE in this thread, not on the case study. Don't mix and match what we are talking about. Not only do I not need to lie, the same case study was posted on multiple forums...I couldn't post different information in different places that people frequently cross visit.

Yeah, our services are "weak" who's ever heard of us lol. I'm on here because checking the forums is part of my job (And because your so much fun

). This isn't a one man company, and is successful enough to support a team of people who comfortably do this for a living as their only means of income.

^ Not that, THAT has anything to do with anything...I'm not sure why you randomly bring up weird psuedo-facts like that lol

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Mike Anthony 12 years ago

Originally Posted by HKSEO Rotzee

^ That was HERE in this thread

Nope that was in another thread but looks like that was deleted too. It tells anyone who to believe when you say you were not advertising. I'm not asking . I saw that thread and so did Troy who just stated so. You were advertising in the case study that was deleted or it wouldn't be deleted . end of story.

I'm on here because checking the forums is part of my job (And because your so much fun ). This isn't a one man company

Even worse - a company that pays someone to troll and spam forums and if thats not what they pay you to do the way you are representing them here I would look for a new job - Stat.

Thanks for all the bumps of the thread though - preciate it Have a great night.
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Prog3nie

12 years ago

bump - need to come back and add some insight to this thread.

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Hossain 12 years ago

I have a fiverr gig where I said I will create 3 blog posts using blogspot, wordpress and tumblr. Then I will blast 10000 forum profile backlinks to these 3 tier1 blogs. I made only 44 sales during last 3 months.

I had a fiverr gig where I was offering 10000 forum profiles and I made over 300 sales within 1 month!

@- Folks dont have enough knowledge on SEO
@- Descriptions are very attractive to hypnotize folks.
@- They are very optimistic
@- Everybody wants to make money within few minutes!
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boxoun

12 years ago

I wondet why a bunch of folks are reporting successful ranks using automation and or services who blast garbage plr spun content. I ask them for reports on how long they keep ranks but reports keep telling me these "garbage" tools or services are working.

Hard to know what's right.

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Mike Anthony 12 years ago

Hi boxoun,

Unless you know the keywords and URLs people are using its hard to say the links - any links - are working really. Sure if you have some term no one is going after you can rank a site with any kind of links - sometimes even no links. So every link will work for something but to get an increase to the point of getting real good traffic requires at least being able to beat decent competition.
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You'll get my new backlinking software when YOU PRY IT of my dead cold hands

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