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Something I've noticed since Panda

by hicksdelight
20 replies
  • SEO
    • |
Not stating this as a fact, just my opinion on observations.

I have noticed a lot of sites move down rankings to be taken over by sites with no backlinks to a page and not really optimized for the term they are ranking for, but the root domain in question is a trusted one.

It looks to me like newer sites, even with emd's, that are optimized right and with more backlinks are falling down some spots to be taken over by more trusted sites that just happen to have a page on a keyword that they havent even tried to optimize for.

Maybe the days of getting a domain and ranking with an emd are over, Google in my observations are ranking pages more based on trust of the domain as a whole then ever before, even when they arent optimized for it.

Sort of like google is saying 'we will rank you higher then newer sites that are fully optimized for it because your domain has been around ages and is trusted by us, so even though you havent optimized for this word or have any backlinks to said page, we trust the fact your page is probably not just a spammy money making effort'

Anyone noticed this or am I going crazy?
#noticed #panda
  • Profile picture of the author Fernando Veloso
    You're definitely not crazy. Noticed a bunch of new traffic (and income) from my oldest sites. They rank for stuff I didn't even knew it was there
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    • Profile picture of the author hicksdelight
      Originally Posted by Fernando Veloso View Post

      You're definitely not crazy. Noticed a bunch of new traffic (and income) from my oldest sites. They rank for stuff I didn't even knew it was there
      It will f>ck over a lot of people if they are doing that, but I can see why they would go that route, if it is the case I think it's a very smart move.

      But as I say, it will mess things up a bit for IM'rs into niche building (myself included), take a lot longer to make decent money as well, smart move though and one I would of done in their position (again, IF true).

      Its just something I have noticed happening on quite a few keywords I monitor.
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  • Profile picture of the author Fernando Veloso
    Keep one thing in mind tho: this is just another cycle. And by that I mean: Google will soon re-do some maths and EMD's will be back on top... and so on... and so on.
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    • Profile picture of the author hicksdelight
      Originally Posted by Fernando Veloso View Post

      Keep one thing in mind tho: this is just another cycle. And by that I mean: Google will soon re-do some maths and EMD's will be back on top... and so on... and so on.
      I'm certainly going to monitor it with some interest.

      But I dunno, I think it might be here to stay, its easy to see why they would do it this way if they have and I think its a smart move, and not one to change.

      Google Panda is essentially a website quality update. It is the first step towards search engines returning quality sites that are not based on webmaster votes (i.e. links).”
      That quote would back up my observations that trust in the root domain now plays a MAJOR part.

      But we will see.
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      • Profile picture of the author Fernando Veloso
        Originally Posted by hicksdelight View Post

        I'm certainly going to monitor it with some interest.

        But I dunno, I think it might be here to stay, its easy to see why they would do it this way if they have and I think its a smart move, and not one to change.



        That quote would back up my observations that trust in the root domain now plays a MAJOR part.

        But we will see.
        Google ALWAYS runs in cycles. Why? Cause their ability to add/remove items (or % of items) into their algos is limited. They need to get something back in future updates.

        In a new mix? Definitely. But nothing is DEAD with them. Nothing.
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  • Profile picture of the author TheFBGuy
    Originally Posted by hicksdelight View Post

    Not stating this as a fact, just my opinion on observations.

    I have noticed a lot of sites move down rankings to be taken over by sites with no backlinks to a page and not really optimized for the term they are ranking for, but the root domain in question is a trusted one.

    It looks to me like newer sites, even with emd's, that are optimized right and with more backlinks are falling down some spots to be taken over by more trusted sites that just happen to have a page on a keyword that they havent even tried to optimize for.

    Maybe the days of getting a domain and ranking with an emd are over, Google in my observations are ranking pages more based on trust of the domain as a whole then ever before, even when they arent optimized for it.

    Sort of like google is saying 'we will rank you higher then newer sites that are fully optimized for it because your domain has been around ages and is trusted by us, so even though you havent optimized for this word or have any backlinks to said page, we trust the fact your page is probably not just a spammy money making effort'

    Anyone noticed this or am I going crazy?
    Yes, your observations are 100% correct, and has been the case since late last year. But it's really easy to develop this trust, of course this means more time has to be spent on our sites, but its not hard to gain Google's trust.
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  • Profile picture of the author Legit SEO
    I've noticed a bunch of crappy 2.0 posts landing on the first page for competitive terms. SERP's are just all messed up right now.
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    • Profile picture of the author DeskCoder
      Originally Posted by talkmeow View Post

      I've noticed a bunch of crappy 2.0 posts landing on the first page for competitive terms. SERP's are just all messed up right now.
      I've seen this too. Time to create a bunch of 2.0 sites.
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  • Profile picture of the author boxoun
    Authority doesn't equal relevant so i don't think this is happening to all cases based on my results
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    • Profile picture of the author hicksdelight
      Originally Posted by boxoun View Post

      Authority doesn't equal relevant so i don't think this is happening to all cases based on my results
      No, but authority = trust

      Way I see Google is doing it is this

      a - new site with emd and optimized for keyword

      b - authority root domain with no optimization that just happens to have a sub page up mentioning the keyword few times

      Google seems to be ranking site B higher as even though it doesnt have any optmization, Google is saying 'well, we trust your site, we trust that the page you have put up is a non spammy page and not just trying to make money'.
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  • Profile picture of the author gtk29
    I think it is a good thing for 2-3 year old domains. But would make things difficult for newcomers.
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    • Profile picture of the author hicksdelight
      Originally Posted by gtk29 View Post

      I think it is a good thing for 2-3 year old domains. But would make things difficult for newcomers.
      Yes, as I said I think its a smart move, they dont want sites that are just there to make money straight off the bat, they want people to build sites for their visitors, concentrate on subjects they know about and do it for the long term and aim to make the site a respected and trusted site, which is why I believe the trust of a site has come into play in a big way. (and trust of a site vs a domain that is just old and never been used are 2 different things if people think they can just go and buy an old domain).

      So it could be bye bye to building micro niche sites for quick and easy money and hello got to think long term now to make money from them, or not, I dunno.

      But if it is the case its a good move even though I will be affected.
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  • Profile picture of the author mramp
    I've totally noticed it. Although I was correlating it with the age of the root domain, which generally reflects the trust+PR of the site.

    I'm also seeing exact match subdomains doing well, which I am sure they will change once everyone starts gaming that.

    You gotta wonder if the algorithm changes at this point really improve the SERP quality or not. At a certain point you go 50,000,000 SEOed pages going for top 3 spots, google moves them around like musical chairs and hopes their clients get good information.

    More and more, I am seeing seo as just gambling.
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  • Profile picture of the author hicksdelight
    Going to be interesting to see whether stay as they are with regards to this and few other tings.
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  • Profile picture of the author chenkev
    Google has stated that Panda 3.4 and forward will be targeting low quality over-optimized sites.
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  • Profile picture of the author hicksdelight
    Which is basically code for micro niche sites out to make quick buck
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  • Profile picture of the author hicksdelight
    Today I have noticed the same things happening on a few more keywords, slowly does it!

    Is this the end for micro niche sites out to make quick buck?

    IF Google are placing a lot in the trust of the domain, then surely it has to be? With the only option to go towards a long term authority site money making opportunities are gonna be few and far between before you get trusted for a yr or 2.

    I know what some of you are saying don't put all your eggs in one basket, VERY true, but to make money you need visitors, and while you can get some visitors from communities and social networks, it isn't a continous stream like Google can provide on different keywords.

    Also, I have always thought people who bookmark and come back to your site come back because they like it, not because they want to buy something, organic search traffic is the best for a buyers market, least for the type of sites I like to do/will do.

    So it makes things quite difficult.

    Thanks for the replies so far, I find it all quite interesting, if a little bit worrying
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    • Profile picture of the author virtueinfo11
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      • Profile picture of the author Bofu2U
        Originally Posted by virtueinfo11 View Post

        how old domain play importance in search engine ranking?
        It's important if you don't want to wait for the whole "Google should trust me" part to kick in, heh.

        But if you're willing to put your time in on a site and continue to give it attention, age isn't really too much of a factor until you get into competing with extremely old/authority/both sites like webmd, etc.
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  • Profile picture of the author hicksdelight
    I don't know, I am only speculating from my observations, and others seem to be seeing the same thing.
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  • Profile picture of the author Steadyon
    Not sure if it directly related to age or authority as such.

    A colleague of mine just lost 50% of his traffic overnight on a 300+ page site that is over 10 years old.

    There has been zero black hat stuff or linking on that site. Zero!

    Income and traffic down by 50% since 23rd March 2012.

    What google says they want, in many cases, isn't reflected in the current search results they provide!
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