The Google Penguin Rumour!

11 replies
  • SEO
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Hi Fellow Warriors,
I went to a charity event this weekend and was on the same table as another full time SEO expert, at least this is what he claimed! He was very quiet so chatting with him was a bit of a struggle, but after a few beers we had a very interesting conversation.

He previously worked for microsoft and this initially helped him with his conversion to full time seo, but I was more interested in the Penguin update from google, as the majority of my sites got hit and hit hard!

I said to him that I had approx 20 sites, with about half in one particular niche, I had used the same backlinking method on all sites but some had been hit hard by the latest update and I couldn't make any sense of it, trying to backward engineer the new algo was causing me real problems, this is when he told me a bit of golden information, but wanted to run it past you folks to see if its right, or if he has also been led up the garden path!

He said that he has an inner circle of friends that included a contact who didn't exactly work for google, but was some kind of freelancer, or contractor, who had access to some engineers within the search engine team. He went on to say that the google search algo is evolving from old techniques, and that pushing a new update is not an exact science, its kind of like building an extension of your house without adding anymore foundations, and as such their is no exact formula or at least it is very complex! But what he did tell me is that the new penguin update isn't as smart as most people think, or should I say as clever, it is smart - very smart. What I was told is that the new algo first uses the old methods to find your links, then it looks at the links and see if any come from forums, article sites, web2.0 sites etc. If any of your backlinks come from cancelled accounts, i.e have 404 pages it tells google that you have been banned, or your article has been banned from these sites for illegal reasons like scamming.

We continued this conversation and I started to think about it - the sites that got hit hardest for me were the sites that I had done a lot of work on (backlinking) and thus would have more 404 sites that use to backlink to my sites, and thus made sense.

The penguin update therefore is an additional crawl of your backlinks to find the percentage of 404 that use to link to your site - if the percentage is greater than x, then you get penalized.

I then went on to mention about the theory that many people believe that the google analytics account has an impact on your sites, i.e. google has further information on bounce rates etc. He said that he had heard of this but was not convinced, and said that he wouldn't worry too much about this.

I'd love to hear your thoughts on this.
#google #penguin #rumour
  • Profile picture of the author ketset
    Is this true? It kind of makes sense though, Links to your site are the most crucial part of SEO and it stands to reason that the Google code would search those links more carefully..ummm
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    • Profile picture of the author modernians
      Originally Posted by ketset View Post

      Is this true? It kind of makes sense though, Links to your site are the most crucial part of SEO and it stands to reason that the Google code would search those links more carefully..ummm
      I'm not sure if its true, thats why I'm asking here! I think a portion of the new algo could incorporate this and many other techniques - interesting though!
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  • Profile picture of the author ok180
    Banned
    [DELETED]
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    • Profile picture of the author modernians
      Originally Posted by ok180 View Post

      Its possible, my site got hit and i have had a lot of backlinks deleted that i have built over the last 12 months. Probably 50%.

      The this is i have studied other sites in othe niches that have done the same kind of thing and theyre still there. I think it is something they could be looking at though.
      Yea, I think it may be a small proportion of the update.
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  • Profile picture of the author soboer
    The penguin update therefore is an additional crawl of your backlinks to find the percentage of 404 that use to link to your site - if the percentage is greater than x, then you get penalized.

    If this is true, negative seo will be much easier than white hat seo.
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  • Profile picture of the author GeorgR.
    Guys, there are 100s of factors and don't think that one or two are deciding here.
    That blog networks, but also web2.0 and low quality article sites have been slapped is nothing new, and of course, a 404 meaning your link disappeared will NATURALLY have a negative effect on your SERPs.

    If you, eg, used one of the networks like ALN/BMR etc. where now the majority is de-indexed..the logical consequence is you lose all those rankings.

    As for bounce rate, i vaguely remember that bounce rate (time spent on a site) has an effect, and IMHO it makes sense if google would assess bounce rate as ONE way to evaluate site quality.
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    • Profile picture of the author modernians
      Originally Posted by GeorgR. View Post

      Guys, there are 100s of factors and don't think that one or two are deciding here.
      That blog networks, but also web2.0 and low quality article sites have been slapped is nothing new, and of course, a 404 meaning your link disappeared will NATURALLY have a negative effect on your SERPs.

      If you, eg, used one of the networks like ALN/BMR etc. where now the majority is de-indexed..the logical consequence is you lose all those rankings.

      As for bounce rate, i vaguely remember that bounce rate (time spent on a site) has an effect, and IMHO it makes sense if google would assess bounce rate as ONE way to evaluate site quality.
      True - but what my new friend was saying is that it is not that technical, its easier for google to warn the owners of sites and get them to police their sites with the risk of being deindexed in google, then all google have to do is look at the 404 links! Simpals!! Its only hearsay but makes a bit of sense! This is a big difference, its saying that the authority sites are having an effect on your rankings by deindexing your articles, all google is doing is adding the 404 sites to the equation!
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  • Profile picture of the author Janet Walker
    I can almost prove this and will shorlty. Where as the original Panda update back in may did devalue certain link profiles - Penguin has carried this further plus attached an algo penalty to it in addition to devalued links. So if infact what I am saying is true then the affected sites will bounce back to a certain degree in which ever time period is allocated to. The 404 errors the op is talking about makes perfect sense albeit that is just one prong of the multi pronged algo.
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  • Profile picture of the author Mister Rex
    I dont think he is completely correct in his assumptions, but I am SO GLAD he said he was not convinced analytics hurts people's sites. That is actually a voice of reason.

    I had never even heard that ignorant theory before coming to this board. Its like some one with a lot of posts comes up with an idea, then everyone else follows blindly with NO proof the person is correct.

    I have analytics and WMT on all my sites. None of my sites were affected by this or any other update. Why did Google not punish me? My bounce rates are not all that good.

    The truth is, different sites in different niches have different bounce rates. Marketers know this and Google knows this. Google knows that a forum id going to have a lower bounce rate than an ecommerce site. They also know that the bounce rate is dependent on which page a person lands on.

    The truth is there is NO validity to the claim that analytics hurts your site. Those of you running off to statcounter, are doing yourselves a disservice. There is so much data analytics gives you to make your site better.

    Maybe that is why I havent been "punished." I use the bounce rates and exit rates to split test pages to improve my metrics.

    Whoever tells you analytics is hurting you is a liar and a fraud, and some one you should never take advice from again.
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  • Profile picture of the author Fraggler
    Over all these years it's amazing how many people meet Microsoft and Google connections at the pub.
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  • Profile picture of the author discuss4u
    If it is all about 404 percentage of the backlinks, then building new links may help to make the sites recover....
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