PHP vs. HTML: Ranking & SEO - Which REALLY works better for a website?? | Warrior Forum - The #1 Digital Marketing Forum & Marketplace

Dayne Dylan

Banned 15 years ago

I believe they are just as equal (PHP vs. HTML).

Correct me if I am wrong Warriors.

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Jay Moreno

15 years ago

as dayne dylan says they are just as equal your php output code gets rendered as html anyway by your browser.

whre you find the improvement in using dynamic websites with php/mysql CMS scripts such as wordpress and joomla you can control your content much easier as well as automate a lot of the time consuming tasks that are incurred with generating regular HTML

personally i use Joomla and find it has very few limitations, for SEO/IM campaigns i get first page ranking with google and yahoo all the time for competitive terms. However this is probably more due to experience than the fact i use Joomla - Joomla just makes my life/job at lot easier!

It's just me favoured weapon of choice!

hth

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JustaWizard

15 years ago

Originally Posted by ukescuba

whre you find the improvement in using dynamic websites with php/mysql CMS scripts such as wordpress and joomla you can control your content much easier as well as automate a lot of the time consuming tasks that are incurred with generating regular HTML

It's just me favoured weapon of choice!

hth

I've not heard of Joomla, is that "like" wordpress? Better? Have you used both? Am I asking too many questions? ;-)

THANKS! David

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Jay Moreno

15 years ago

Originally Posted by JustaWizard

I've not heard of Joomla, is that "like" wordpress? Better? Have you used both? Am I asking too many questions? ;-)

THANKS! David

Hi david,

i havent used wordpress before, so would be unfair to pass comment - however i have researched it and from what i have read i dont feel that it is as flexible as Joomla from a developers point of few.

just like wordpress there are plenty of SEO plugins, but you can also optimize Joomla 1.5 with overrides

i think for quick sites and depending on what your goals are it comes down to personal preference - i dont think either wordpress or joomla would be a bad choice, however if your building a full out and out complex site my choice from what ive read/seen joomla would be a better option...

hope that helps

jay

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JustaWizard

15 years ago

Originally Posted by ukescuba

Hi david,

i havent used wordpress before, so would be unfair to pass comment - however i have researched it and from what i have read i dont feel that it is as flexible as Joomla from a developers point of few.

just like wordpress there are plenty of SEO plugins, but you can also optimize Joomla 1.5 with overrides

i think for quick sites and depending on what your goals are it comes down to personal preference - i dont think either wordpress or joomla would be a bad choice, however if your building a full out and out complex site my choice from what ive read/seen joomla would be a better option...

hope that helps

jay

That does help, Jay thanks - one more question if I may: I started with raw HTML then "graduated" to dreamweaver, but I'm far from a developer, I know just enough to get the job done (look at the code on my sig site, you'll see I'm a "B for basic" web guy) - so I guess my question is, how "technical" is using Joomla?--would I have to have software programmer level of ability to use it?

THANKS!
David

Thanks
1 reply

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Jay Moreno

15 years ago

Originally Posted by JustaWizard

That does help, Jay thanks - one more question if I may: I started with raw HTML then "graduated" to dreamweaver, but I'm far from a developer, I know just enough to get the job done (look at the code on my sig site, you'll see I'm a "B for basic" web guy) - so I guess my question is, how "technical" is using Joomla?--would I have to have software programmer level of ability to use it?

THANKS!
David

Hi david

unfortunately a lot of the documentation for joomla is very overwhelming and there appears to be no logical place to start... i am actually trying to single handedly fix this! LOL

however you can create your own templates and position your content and modules easily using CSS - this is an example of one of our biggest joomla projects to date: www.cowboysdancehall.com obviously a little more technical that your average 5 page website but it gives you a good example of what you can push its very few limitation too... correct me if im wrong guys but i dont think wordpress could do this...

basically just like someone mentioned earlier about placing the include files for the header/footer/etc in your html you would do EXACTLY the same thing with your joomla template albeit your placing modules instead of include files...

its not something i can explain really in a single post - but if you would like some more information, i can provide some good resources for you but i just dont have them to hand right now.

to summarize i feel a novice web designer could use and design some really good sites using joomla providing they get the right training resources....

hope that helps

jay aka ukescuba

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RedMatrix

15 years ago

PHP is server-side code, which when run, renders client-side HTML.
So, the search engines will never see any PHP code. However, I
find that PHP includes are a big time saver.

I guess the 3 most common includes are the header, footer, and sidebar.
For example, I use this for my DROM site:

index.php

PHP Code:

  <?php include("inc.header.php"); ?>

<div id="page">

    <div id="content">

        .......................main page stuff here

    </div>

<?php include("inc.sidebar.php"); ?>

<?php include("inc.footer.php"); ?>

You can name the include files anything you want!

Here is what my inc.header.php looks like:

HTML Code:

<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Strict//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-strict.dtd">
<html xmlns="http://www.w3.org/1999/xhtml">
<head>
<meta http-equiv="content-type" content="text/html; charset=utf-8" />
<title>Direct Response Online Marketing</title>
<meta name="keywords" content="" />
<meta name="description" content="" />
<link href="default.css" rel="stylesheet" type="text/css" />
</head>


<body>
<div id="header">
	<div id="logo">
		<h1><a href="./">Direct Response</h1>
		<h2>Online Marketing</h2>
		<h3>for your</h3>
		<h2>Offline Business</a></h2>
	</div>
	<div id="menu">
		<ul>
			<li class="first"><a href="./" title="">Home</a></li>
			<li><a href="lightbox.php" title="">Lightbox</a></li>
			<li><a href="services.php" title="">Services</a></li>
			<li><a href="contact.php" title="">Contact</a></li>
		</ul>
	</div>
	
</div>

So, if I need to change the title or the copyright...etc, I only change one file.

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JustaWizard

15 years ago

Originally Posted by RedMatrix

So, if I need to change the title or the copyright...etc, I only change one file.

So, if I understand correctly, you're saying that's similar to my HTML Dreamweaver template where if I change the copyright info, I make that change on the template and all the pages update, without having to manually open each page - so that advantage in PHP/Wordpress PLUS the ability to do that with the header/sidebars (ets) is what you're saying is the main advantages, plus the various includes/widgets?

Am I getting close? :-)

THANKS!
David

Thanks
2 replies

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Lanadili

15 years ago

Originally Posted by JustaWizard

So, if I understand correctly, you're saying that's similar to my HTML Dreamweaver template where if I change the copyright info, I make that change on the template and all the pages update, without having to manually open each page

I use to use a template in Dreamweaver as well, that way when I updated the template, it would update each page. Unfortunately, I would then have to re-upload each page (which was getting over 100) so it was a major pain. I started using php includes and now I only have to update and upload that one include file, and all the changes are automatically changed on every page that I have the include command on. It saves me soo much time now it's not even funny.

Thanks
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JustaWizard

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Lanadili

I use to use a template in Dreamweaver as well, that way when I updated the template, it would update each page. Unfortunately, I would then have to re-upload each page (which was getting over 100) so it was a major pain. I started using php includes and now I only have to update and upload that one include file, and all the changes are automatically changed on every page that I have the include command on. It saves me soo much time now it's not even funny.

Thanks again - sooo.... hmmm... using includes: is that something I will set up when creating my site initially, similar to a Dreamweaver template, or will my Wordpress theme set that up automatically?

THANKS!
David

Thanks
1 reply

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Lanadili

15 years ago

Originally Posted by JustaWizard

Thanks again - sooo.... hmmm... using includes: is that something I will set up when creating my site initially, similar to a Dreamweaver template, or will my Wordpress theme set that up automatically?

Honestly I don't use Wordpress, I'm still a fan of Dreamweaver and I just use php includes instead of templates now. So I'm not even sure if you could use that with Wordpress or not.

But if you still want to use Dreamweaver, I'd definitely switch to using php includes to cut down on time.

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Jay Moreno

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Lanadili

Honestly I don't use Wordpress, I'm still a fan of Dreamweaver and I just use php includes instead of templates now. So I'm not even sure if you could use that with Wordpress or not.

But if you still want to use Dreamweaver, I'd definitely switch to using php includes to cut down on time.

this is how i advanced from doing HTML to using PHP...

for me joomla's use of positional modules is basically a similar priciple to using include files, however you have much much more logic and control over how, when and where they are displayed - once i realized that there was no stopping me!

Thanks

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JustaWizard

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Lanadili

Honestly I don't use Wordpress, I'm still a fan of Dreamweaver and I just use php includes instead of templates now. So I'm not even sure if you could use that with Wordpress or not.

But if you still want to use Dreamweaver, I'd definitely switch to using php includes to cut down on time.

Aha! (light bulb coming on slowly...) and here comes another embarrassing admission from me: I still use Dreamweaver 3! I've got 4 books on it, Dreamweaver Bible, Dreamweaver for Dummies and 2 others and I can't recall PHP includes in any of them, I'll go back and look... do you happen to know offhand if that's a feature perhaps introduced in later versions? Which version are you using?

THANKS!
David

Thanks
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Lanadili

15 years ago

Originally Posted by JustaWizard

Aha! (light bulb coming on slowly...) and here comes another embarrassing admission from me: I still use Dreamweaver 3! I've got 4 books on it, Dreamweaver Bible, Dreamweaver for Dummies and 2 others and I can't recall PHP includes in any of them, I'll go back and look... do you happen to know offhand if that's a feature perhaps introduced in later versions? Which version are you using?

A friend I know who is really into PHP introduced me to php includes awhile back, so I'm not sure if you can even find them in those books. The example that RedMatrix has above is exactly how you would use a php include though. It might take awhile to change your pages (depending on how many you have) to list the php include files, but it's well worth the time that you'll save in the long run.

As far as what version of Dreamweaver I'm using, I'm still using version 8 (before CSV 3 and 4). I keep telling myself I'm going to upgrade one day, but then I somehow get sidetracked and forget, heh.

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RedMatrix

15 years ago

Originally Posted by JustaWizard

... you're saying that's similar to my HTML Dreamweaver template where if I change the copyright info, I make that change on the template and all the pages update, without having to manually open each page ...

Am I getting close? :-)

THANKS!
David

Well, maybe. But then you'd have to upload every single .html page to your server, where as just one included file with php.

PS: Shouldn't' this thread be in the programming section, lol.

Thanks

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~Dave

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GeorgeO7

15 years ago

Justa,

I once managed a 4500 page static html beast of a site... or should I say... it managed me.

I now do all my sites in Wordpress, get great results with SEO and would NEVER go back to the old school.

Good luck with your transition and be sure to 301 redirect your old pages to the equivalent new WP pages.

George

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JustaWizard

15 years ago

Originally Posted by GeorgeO7

Justa,

I once managed a 4500 page static html beast of a site... or should I say... it managed me.

I now do all my sites in Wordpress, get great results with SEO and would NEVER go back to the old school.

Good luck with your transition and be sure to 301 redirect your old pages to the equivalent new WP pages.

George

YIKES!! - 4500 PAGES... I shudder to think what the navigation nightmares must have been... thanks for the input, I do appreciate it! If you have any other suggestions or tips you think I should know, please so share!

THANKS!
David

Thanks

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Jared Alberghini

15 years ago

David,

There IS a difference in SEO with certain php applications compared to static html pages.

For instance, by default, the wordpress app gives you pages like this: index.php?id=36 which is NOT good in SEO terms.

Think of it like this, the search engines also look at the filename & folder name as well as the page contents, so if there is a match, it ranks higher in relevancy. yoursite.com/your-category-keywords-here/article-name-here/... looks much better and ranks higher than yoursite.com/index.php?id=36

When you install WordPress, you need to go to the Settings area, and setup Permalinks. This is a must for any new WP installation. Doing this makes your site SEO'd and just as good, if not better than a static html site with keywords in the filenames.

The search engines LOVE a SEO'd WP site, with frequently updated relevant content, which is so easier to produce through the WP admin login, quickly through your browser, at any computer, compared to creating a new HTML file, logging into your FTP account, uploading a new file, trying to organize the categories/filenames manually...

These CMS/Blog apps just save so much time to publish new content, with relevant keywords, in relevant categories.

Jared

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JustaWizard

15 years ago

Originally Posted by Jared Alberghini

David,

There IS a difference in SEO with certain php applications compared to static html pages.

For instance, by default, the wordpress app gives you pages like this: index.php?id=36 which is NOT good in SEO terms.

Think of it like this, the search engines also look at the filename & folder name as well as the page contents, so if there is a match, it ranks higher in relevancy. yoursite.com/your-category-keywords-here/article-name-here/... looks much better and ranks higher than yoursite.com/index.php?id=36

When you install WordPress, you need to go to the Settings area, and setup Permalinks. This is a must for any new WP installation. Doing this makes your site SEO'd and just as good, if not better than a static html site with keywords in the filenames.

The search engines LOVE a SEO'd WP site, with frequently updated relevant content, which is so easier to produce through the WP admin login, quickly through your browser, at any computer, compared to creating a new HTML file, logging into your FTP account, uploading a new file, trying to organize the categories/filenames manually...

These CMS/Blog apps just save so much time to publish new content, with relevant keywords, in relevant categories.

Jared

Hey Jared, I'm definitely aware of the SEO point you made about keywords in the URL after the first forward slash, that is, in terms of naming pages at that pages named php?id=36, as you used in your example, don't help with SEO - so to be clear, are you saying that all I need to do to solve that problem in Wordpress is to set up Permalinks? - does that mean setting that up will allow me to name pages for SEO purposes instead of winding up with pages named, for example, "php?id=36"?

THANKS!
David

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vlabroo

15 years ago

Great thread. Such insight from all the experienced warriors, makes it so valuable for Newbies.

Thank you

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GeorgR.

15 years ago

this is WAAYYY to generalized asking, the question "is HTML better than PHP in terms of SEO" doesnt make sense, really.

No matter WHAT language a site is in, it will ALWAYS translate into HTML as displayed in your browser. HTML/PHP are NOT mutually exclusive, its basically the same thing with PHP the underlying (VERY powerful language) to have more control over the HTML which is displayed as result.

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GeorgR.

15 years ago

the pinging and other web2.0 features as we have in WP are not really primarily related to PHP. PHP is the underlying language, yes, but PHP is not the factor which makes a blog. So..your question is a bit "misleading" since its not really about the language but rather the concept (eg. blogs).

And, yes, in terms of SEO eg. wordpress does WAY better than some cheap XSite Pro site or static HTML site without blogging/pinging and things like that.

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GeorgR.

15 years ago

>>
So I'm considering making my new websites using Wordpress themes just for sake of the ease of using categories, etc. I
>>

and yes, you will never go back

believe me...

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JustaWizard

15 years ago

Originally Posted by GeorgR.

>>
So I'm considering making my new websites using Wordpress themes just for sake of the ease of using categories, etc. I
>>

and yes, you will never go back

believe me...

I DO believe you! :-) Are there any downsides you can think of? Any at all on any level?

David
PS: sorry for not asking my original question more clearly, but thanks for being able to see what it was I'm trying to find out and clarifying the difference between PHP as coding language, and the pinging aspect of Wordpress themes/blogs, I appreciate it!

PPS: Ping, I'm somewhat embarrassed to admit, is one area of SEO I really just don't "get" - if you don't mind giving me the bird's eye explanation, I'd sure appreciate it!

Thanks

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zeurois

15 years ago

A while ago, HTML was seen better than the PHP because of the dynamic features of PHP (eg show special content if it's a bot, etc).

Right now it's obvious there's no difference between them especially because of the server configurations (you may hit .html and actually be .php)

Cheers

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WareTime

15 years ago

David, I think if I can give a basic overview of the php include that will bring it home for you. php is a scripting language, so you'll need your pages on a server that has it installed (99% chance this is the case if you are at any of the major isp's)

A php include can go in plain old html pages so you can stick with what you know, Dreamweaver. The include basically says when you render this page web server, grab the content in the include file and insert it into the page.

The include file is just a plain html file with a php extension on the name rather than html. In the include file you put anything from basic html to advanced php. The include file is on your web host, just like your pages are.

Even at the most basic level where you are really only using html in the include files you can cut your maintenance time down hugely. What are common areas to all of your web pages? Nav bar? Header? Footer? Sidebar? The code for these areas of the page can all be included via php includes. You would need to tweak each page once to drop in the includes, but after that your work is decreased.

Imagine you want to add a link in the nav to all your pages. The current way you are doing it, you would need to touch each page. With php includes, you edit only the included file. The next time someone loads the page, what you updated in the include file is rendered in your web page.

php includes are similar to a css stylesheet that is external to your pages. Each page points to the css file, but if you want to change a font or color, you don't go into each page, you edit the css file itself and all the pages get the change automatically as they are served to the end user. I hope those analogies and examples help you out.

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MikeWords

15 years ago

PHP is a programming language and it's output is HTML, so there is no difference to Google. When you use a PHP run CMS you can activate plugins that will make onsite SEO more automated, but no real advantage as far as what the google spider reads.

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JustaWizard 15 years ago

Here at the likely end of this thread - thanks to all, much appreciation fellow Warriors!

Also, I realize that my question was asked "in the dark" and in ignorance so thanks for your patience with me.

Finally - I need to pay closer attention - this thread SHOULD have been in a different category as noted by another warrior!

Best to all,
David Portney
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rudyespinosa

13 years ago

I want to mention some related tips. I use Joomla for most of my sites. Joomla does not produce SEF URLs out of the box. There are many components and built-in SEO switches that will produce search engine friendly URLs. My favorite component also allows you to specify the extension, such as .php, .html, .htm, or no extension if you prefer it. It also allows you to create aliases by just entering the alternate page names. The component automatically creates 301 redirects for the aliases. A CMS such as Joomla is extremely powerful.

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essentialoilindia

8 years ago

Acturally my Site is www.aosproduct.com has made in PHP and this due to speed is very slow almost less than 60%, when i ask from a webmaster specialist then he said that use for better speed html and responsive tools. So its my big confusion that whats are the best technology for making better rank of Technology.

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PHP vs. HTML: Ranking & SEO - Which REALLY works better for a website??

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