Why are people so caught up on likes?

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I am really curious about why people are so hung up on trying to drive likes to their pages when they should be finding ways to increase sales!

Likes do not equal sales people! The value of a list is in the quality of the list, not the quantity of it.

If you want to do something different with your pages, spend more time trying to convert your current fan base than you would trying to grow a bigger fan base.

I swear you will get more sales doing this.

Discuss.........
#caught #likes #myth #people
  • Profile picture of the author PPC-Coach
    Likes matter because you get exposure.

    Online marketers always want instant and measurable results. They don't understand that sometimes having your ad seen by 1,000's or millions of people time and time again builds brand awareness and eventually sales. BUT that can't be measured directly so we as direct online marketers discount its value.

    I fell into this trap for years. But now I understand the value of brand awareness too. Facebook is just another medium. You cannot measure results directly from TV, newspaper or any other offline ad medium, yet they work and have been around for a long long time.

    Businesses utilize them because they work. You can't measure results instantly, but you can measure them long term. Nobody online likes to think past the next 30 seconds. If they don't get a conversion right away, it didn't work in their mind.

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  • Profile picture of the author ronrule
    Originally Posted by webpeon View Post

    I am really curious about why people are so hung up on trying to drive likes to their pages when they should be finding ways to increase sales!

    Likes do not equal sales people! The value of a list is in the quality of the list, not the quantity of it.

    If you want to do something different with your pages, spend more time trying to convert your current fan base than you would trying to grow a bigger fan base.

    I swear you will get more sales doing this.

    Discuss.........
    Not everyone uses social sites for generating sales... more often than not, social media pages are more of a consumer engagement strategy than a marketing one, in which case quantity is important. The more people who follow you, the more eyes you have on your messaging. The top brands in the world aren't using Facebook to promote their products - they're using them to reach their customers where they already work and play.
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    • Profile picture of the author webpeon
      Originally Posted by ronrule View Post

      Not everyone uses social sites for generating sales... more often than not, social media pages are more of a consumer engagement strategy than a marketing one, in which case quantity is important. The more people who follow you, the more eyes you have on your messaging. The top brands in the world aren't using Facebook to promote their products - they're using them to reach their customers where they already work and play.
      No business in their right mind, would spend time, money and resources on something that would not generate more sales. Especially the top brands in the world.

      It may seem like on the outset, they are just there to reach customers where they work and play but I can assure you that if that effort doesn't result in sales at some point in time, the manager of those profiles will find themselves jobless real quick.
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      • Profile picture of the author ronrule
        Originally Posted by webpeon View Post

        No business in their right mind, would spend time, money and resources on something that would not generate more sales. Especially the top brands in the world.
        Right, because Pepsi only has a Facebook page and makes funny posts so people will say "What's pepsi? Never heard of that, I think I'll buy it..."

        Come on dude, be serious. Why do all of the big consumer products companies have Facebook pages with millions of followers, but never post links to buy products?

        Because they're smart enough to realize that social media isn't a marketing platform - it's a consumer engagement platform that can be used for marketing. People don't visit social media sites to shop, they visit them to socialize. The best brand development strategies are the ones that understand this and take it into account.

        Pepsi isn't reaching new clients or getting sales from Facebook, and nobody who sees their posts is going to say "wow, I should go buy a Pepsi". That's not the point of brand engagement. Brand engagement isn't measured by direct response from advertisements - it's measured by memorability. No one is going to buy a Pepsi from a Facebook post, but they will remember it. And having people remember YOUR product when they're ready to buy a product that does what your product does is valuable beyond measure.

        It's the same reason etrade and other big companies run Superbowl ads... they don't convert into sales, and every study that's ever been done in the last ten years will attest to that. Nobody is going to say "Man that talking baby is hilarious, I should start investing!" But when someone reaches the point where they need to pick an online broker, guess which one they're going to remember?
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        • Profile picture of the author webpeon
          Originally Posted by ronrule View Post

          Right, because Pepsi only has a Facebook page and makes funny posts so people will say "What's pepsi? Never heard of that, I think I'll buy it..."

          Come on dude, be serious. Why do all of the big consumer products companies have Facebook pages with millions of followers, but never post links to buy products?
          You should check out pepsi's page some time because this looks like a sales pitch to me...

          Timeline Photos | Facebook

          Oh and look, if they really weren't trying to sell anything then why not just remove the pepsi branding and just have photos of the lovely beyonce instead? because theyre trying to sell you on pepsi!

          Timeline Photos | Facebook

          People see ads like that and think, oh I could do with a pepsi, and then what happens? they go buy one!

          Just because the post doesn't have the words "buy now" plastered all over it, their goal is to get people to buy their product. There is no other reason they're there!
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          • Profile picture of the author ronrule
            Originally Posted by webpeon View Post

            You should check out pepsi's page some time because this looks like a sales pitch to me...

            Timeline Photos | Facebook

            Oh and look, if they really weren't trying to sell anything then why not just remove the pepsi branding and just have photos of the lovely beyonce instead? because theyre trying to sell you on pepsi!

            Timeline Photos | Facebook

            People see ads like that and think, oh I could do with a pepsi, and then what happens? they go buy one!

            Just because the post doesn't have the words "buy now" plastered all over it, their goal is to get people to buy their product. There is no other reason they're there!
            They're a business - they exist for the sole purpose of selling you something. But that doesn't mean they're using Facebook to try to get you to buy Pepsi... they are using Facebook to make you THINK about Pepsi.

            That's why Likes matter.
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            • Profile picture of the author webpeon
              Originally Posted by ronrule View Post

              They're a business - they exist for the sole purpose of selling you something. But that doesn't mean they're using Facebook to try to get you to buy Pepsi... they are using Facebook to make you THINK about Pepsi.

              That's why Likes matter.
              Exactly! They want you to THINK about pepsi to get you to BUY pepsi. Marketing 101: Paint a picture and the customer will buy.

              I could almost guarantee you that their marketing team doesn't get together and ask, right how do we get more likes on their page, they will spend their time asking how do we get more sales.

              Sure likes play a role, but if half the people here worried more about how do I get more sales and not how do I get more likes, they're business would be better off.
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              • Profile picture of the author ronrule
                Originally Posted by webpeon View Post

                Exactly! They want you to THINK about pepsi to get you to BUY pepsi. Marketing 101: Paint a picture and the customer will buy.

                I could almost guarantee you that their marketing team doesn't get together and ask, right how do we get more likes on their page, they will spend their time asking how do we get more sales.

                Sure likes play a role, but if half the people here worried more about how do I get more sales and not how do I get more likes, they're business would be better off.
                It's like you get it, but don't get it at the same time...

                I can tell you exactly what they are thinking with their Facebook page. Their goal is to promote brand engagement. Not sales. They want people to see their brand - and being in their face every day entertaining them is a great way to do it. That's why they spend money on Facebook, and don't care that there is no measurable impact in direct sales.

                "OMG, Beyonce drinks Pepsi, I am totally buying one!"
                - Said nobody, ever.

                You're so focused on direct sales that you're forgetting the bigger picture. I think if more people were focused on getting Likes (real people, not fake Likes or purchased followers... just to be clear on the difference) instead of trying to "make money" on Facebook, they would be more successful on Facebook.

                One of my clients uses Facebook ONE DAY per year to promote a product, and the rest of the year is all about attracting followers and entertaining them. That one day - the only time you will ever see a promotion to buy the product - is CyberMonday. Last year they made more as a direct result of simply posting their CyberMonday deal on their Facebook page than they made in normal online sales in an entire month. Their average monthly volume is about $70k.

                Likes matter, man.

                ALL of the focus is on getting Likes and promoting brand engagement, and SPECIFICALLY EXCLUDES driving sales. Because smart companies know that the more eyes are on your brand, the more you'll sell in other channels - you don't have to promote your product on Facebook for it to be worth it.

                Your original question was why do people spend so much time getting likes instead of sales... that's why. Good brand strategies aren't measured using direct response metrics.
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                • Profile picture of the author webpeon
                  Originally Posted by ronrule View Post

                  It's like you get it, but don't get it at the same time...
                  and in your case you just dont get it. But that's fine, not everyone does.

                  The underlying message here, regardless of how they are doing it is...

                  They are on Facebook to acquire sales, through whatever means possible. None of what they are doing is aimed at getting likes.
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                  • Profile picture of the author ronrule
                    Originally Posted by webpeon View Post

                    and in your case you just dont get it. But that's fine, not everyone does.

                    The underlying message here, regardless of how they are doing it is...

                    They are on Facebook to acquire sales, through whatever means possible. None of what they are doing is aimed at getting likes.
                    lol, what are you talking about? :rolleyes: This is your quote here...

                    If you want to do something different with your pages, spend more time trying to convert your current fan base than you would trying to grow a bigger fan base.

                    I swear you will get more sales doing this.
                    And this is 100% wrong. If you spend more time trying to convert a small fan base than you spend trying to grow it, you're only pitching to a small number of people - who will quickly get annoyed with constant attempts at selling to them, and eventually stop listening. But, as I've demonstrated, if you spend MORE time growing and LESS time pitching, when you DO eventually pitch - subtly and infrequently - it will be far more effective.

                    I guarantee you if the strategy I told you about in the last post was done your way, they wouldn't have made anywhere NEAR what they made from that one day sale over the course of the entire year. There wouldn't have been enough people there to see the posts, and would have long since tuned out the brand's messaging by then. But if you keep them engaged throughout the year, you have their attention on the rare occasion you make a pitch.
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  • Profile picture of the author webpeon
    That sure is my quote, but once again you missed the point.

    I did not say, like's aren't important or to stop expanding your fan base.

    Actually the title says, why are people so caught up on likes, not, don't you dare go get anymore likes.

    I think i've said this in every post. Likes have their role, but what's more important than likes is marketing, why because likes do not equal sales. you forgot to quote that part. So with that said, spend more time converting you base than you do trying to build a base and your sales will increase.

    What has me laughing about what you have to say more than anything is that you have this idea in your head that when I say converting your customer base you automatically assume that I mean convert them using direct sales techniques. Not once did I mention how to convert those likes into sales, which you have based most of your argument on.

    So when you're ready, lets get back on topic aye?
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  • Profile picture of the author ronrule
    And like I said before, there are reasons other than sales to promote a Facebook page and to spend money doing so. The fact that you're asking the question only indicates the concept of consumer engagement is over your head. :rolleyes:
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    • Profile picture of the author webpeon
      Originally Posted by ronrule View Post

      And like I said before, there are reasons other than sales to promote a Facebook page and to spend money doing so. The fact that you're asking the question only indicates the concept of consumer engagement is over your head. :rolleyes:
      Says the guy that thinks Pepsi isn't on Facebook to make more sales lol. You may want to check their page and then post, you missed that point too.

      The journey may be different, the destination is the same. They are there to get more sales period!
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  • Profile picture of the author ronrule
    Wrong again...

    We can do this all day. There are many reasons to have, and spend money promoting, a Facebook page and never having the intention of getting sales through it. Fact. Sorry the concept of consumer engagement escapes you, I don't know how else to dumb it down.
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  • Profile picture of the author webpeon
    Why are they promoting consumer engagement? To get more sales!

    The journey may be different, the destination is the same.
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    • Profile picture of the author ronrule
      Originally Posted by webpeon View Post

      Why are they promoting consumer engagement? To get more sales!

      The journey may be different, the destination is the same.
      No, not usually. That's the part you keep missing.
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  • Profile picture of the author webpeon
    So what is it, no or not usually. Are you even sure yourself, or are you finally realizing you took a wrong turn somewhere?
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    • Profile picture of the author ronrule
      Originally Posted by webpeon View Post

      So what is it, no or not usually. Are you even sure yourself, or are you finally realizing you took a wrong turn somewhere?
      That would depend on the purpose of the page now, wouldn't it.

      Some people create Facebook pages to sell a product. Others create them for entirely different purposes that have nothing to do with marketing products to people. The flaw in your argument is that you've approached this topic under the assumption that all Facebook pages exist to sell a product, while completely ignoring the fact that many pages exist only to engage consumers or drive traffic. I'll try this one more time before I give up on you...

      Here's a short counter point I didn't mention earlier: If your business model is traffic driven (say, a newspaper that makes its money on ad clicks) then Likes are the ONLY thing that matters because you have no product to sell. You want them to see your content and click on it and nothing else. So that alone negates your entire argument that the only reason someone would want Likes is to "get sales".

      But back to brands... the majority of consumers active on social networks, who have already made a purchase decision believe a brand's Facebook page is more important than a brand's website. I bolded that part because it's important: it means they already knew about you and wanted to buy what you had, now they're doing their due diligence and seeing how you interact with the customers you already have.

      Now, as a business, knowing that consumers place so much value on the content of your Facebook page, if all they ever see when they get there are low follower counts and a bunch of marketing junk, what perception do they walk away with of your business? Now compare that to the perception they would get if they saw thousands, or even millions, of happy followers liking and sharing all of the cool stuff you post? It reinforces their decision to purchase.

      It's called "social proof". There are people looking at your page that will never hit the Like button. If you honestly still think a business should only have an engaging Facebook presence to market things to people, and that there is no value in attracting followers that you have no intention of selling to, then what can I say, the concept of consumer engagement and "brand essence" is over your head. At this point I'm kind of curious why you even started this thread since, in your head at least, you seem to have all the answers.
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      • Profile picture of the author webpeon
        You really need to make up your mind, one minute you are ready to give up, next minute you are back posting again. Walk your talk man... and then keep on walking.

        Originally Posted by ronrule View Post


        I'll try this one more time before I give up on you...
        I came here already knowing the answer, probing to see who I could network with that knew their stuff as well. Obviously you don't. Lesson learnt!
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        • Profile picture of the author ddyson
          Ronrule is saying that when the focus is purely on sales in a compulsive way then the marketing endeavor loses the opportunity to explore what can become the passive undertone of the entire business; the impression of the brand in the consumers mind.

          It's absolutely useless to demand that someone admit that all operations of a business are about making sales/money. There isn't one person on this forum that doesn't know the importance of sales. But stressed focus on a single point eliminates the chance to use peripheral vision. Both have their applications, but you do not have the full experience of successful sight without both.
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  • Profile picture of the author webpeon
    You'll telling the story brother. One minute you're telling me Pepsi's Facebook presence has nothing to do with sales and now you're trying to tell me 'not usually'. So what is it? no or not usually. simple question really, only 2 answers. no or not usually? No marketing degree needed to answer that one. LOL okay you don't need to answer that.

    Besides you are still missing the point, I didn't come here to argue about marketing techniques, we really could be here all year. It's irrelevant how they get there but the purpose of every business Facebook page is to generate more sales, or it should be if you intend to get results. It doesn't matter where about's your Facebook profile fits into your sales funnel, or what methods you use to market once they are there, that's irrelevant, but stop messing around already if that Facebook profile doesn't fit into your sales funnel already, get it in there now. Front end, back end, side offer, trip to the dairy. Just get it in there!

    I came here to tell everyone to spend more time marketing to their like list than they do building it. If you spend 3 hours getting likes, spend 4 hours marketing to that fresh list. If you spend $300 on ads to generate likes, spend $400 on marketing to that fresh set of leads.

    Are you following now?
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  • Profile picture of the author ronrule
    According to your thread topic, you came here dazed and confused as to why anyone would market a Facebook page that didn't sell product. Now you know why. Class dismissed.
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