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Old 08-27-2009, 11:12 AM   #51
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Default Re: ★★ HOT!! HOW I GENERATE $202.91 A DAY USING BLACK-HAT ADSENSE TECHNIQUE!..PROVEN SCREENSHOT! ★★

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Originally Posted by alloo View Post
It won't happen in a day. There is work involved in his method. I wish it was that easy and fast, but it isn't.

Hey I think this method is pretty fast if you have an established website with some decent paying keywords. The only thing that I'm thinking is that Google might get suspicious as to why we are "protecting" where our traffic source is coming from.



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Old 08-27-2009, 11:38 AM   #52
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Hey I think this method is pretty fast if you have an established website with some decent paying keywords. The only thing that I'm thinking is that Google might get suspicious as to why we are "protecting" where our traffic source is coming from.
Even if you have an established website I wouldn't go hardcore on this method unless you are already making nice profits from adsense then you can add some more to it. For a new site it would be stupid just to begin making 200 a day with adsense you need to build it gradually.


I agree on the fact that google might get suspicious on the traffic. Even though you need to get all kinds of traffic to hide your tarffic source and lower your CTR you gotta realise that most people clicking on the adds will come from nowhere and Google will probabaly notice this. I actually was thinking that you might even want to try this with not that high paying keywords. High paying keywords mean high competition and google won't like it if a site which doesn't even rank gets too much traffic and adsense clicks.
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Old 08-27-2009, 11:40 AM   #53
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You will more than likely have your Adsense account banned with this though. Going from pennies a day to $40 an hour is definitely going to raise flags. Once your adsense account is gone - IT'S GONE.

Well I don't really agree with this. You always can get other adsense accounts. I mean even if you don't want to use a different adress you can use your wife or you relatives, friends names and open a new adsense account.
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Old 08-27-2009, 11:48 AM   #54
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Default Re: ★★ HOT!! HOW I GENERATE $202.91 A DAY USING BLACK-HAT ADSENSE TECHNIQUE!..PROVEN SCREENSHOT! ★★

Hey folks

When you display your Adsense screens, be careful not to show the CTR numbers as I believe it's against Google TOS to show this information. Correct me if I'm wrong. I don't want the Warrior Forum to get into trouble.

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Old 08-27-2009, 12:07 PM   #55
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Well I don't really agree with this. You always can get other adsense accounts. I mean even if you don't want to use a different adress you can use your wife or you relatives, friends names and open a new adsense account.
Why would you want to go through the hassle of getting your wife or neighbor to sign up for a new account....when you just lost the money that was in your original account because it was banned? lol - I don't get it...

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Old 08-27-2009, 12:16 PM   #56
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Why would you want to go through the hassle of getting your wife or neighbor to sign up for a new account....when you just lost the money that was in your original account because it was banned? lol - I don't get it...

Well Who says you are going to get banned as soon as you make your first 100$??? As you can see OP has been doing this for 5 months. I'm not saying this can't happen but you might as well try this and have a chance at making some good money with this.
I can understand that you don't want to risk your adsense account. But if you don't make any money with adsense you can at least have a shot at it with this technique.
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Old 08-27-2009, 12:37 PM   #57
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Default Re: ★★ HOT!! HOW I GENERATE $202.91 A DAY USING BLACK-HAT ADSENSE TECHNIQUE!..PROVEN SCREENSHOT! ★★

Here's what I don't get: If it's that easy to get an adsense account banned, couldn't you just send a lot of click-happy traffic to your competitor's websites and sabotage their adsense?

:)
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Old 08-27-2009, 12:40 PM   #58
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Well Who says you are going to get banned as soon as you make your first 100$??? As you can see OP has been doing this for 5 months. I'm not saying this can't happen but you might as well try this and have a chance at making some good money with this.
I can understand that you don't want to risk your adsense account. But if you don't make any money with adsense you can at least have a shot at it with this technique.
thanks Ehsan for your explaination..

yes i'm doing this for 5 months already..this is black-hat.. and you should know what is the risk when using this method.. if you afraid to loose.. then, this is not for you.. one more thing, this method can be used with other ads network to..

either you make the money, or someone else will. That’s it. It’s business, people. Nothing more, nothing less. Either you eat, or be eaten.

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Old 08-27-2009, 12:41 PM   #59
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Well, I'm in I set up a test and in one hour
Today's Earnings: $38.73

Page impressions Clicks Page CTR Page eCPM [?] Earnings
AdSense for Content 299 75 25.08% $129.55 $38.73
Total Earnings $38.73

So, I'm curious about how this works.
Thanks.

marketing online for offline businesses
http://www.GreensboroOnlineMarketing.com
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Old 08-27-2009, 12:49 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by PowerWealth247 View Post
Well, I'm in I set up a test and in one hour
Today's Earnings: $38.73

Page impressions Clicks Page CTR Page eCPM [?] Earnings
AdSense for Content 299 75 25.08% $129.55 $38.73
Total Earnings $38.73

So, I'm curious about how this works.
Thanks.
mind to share us your screenshot?

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Old 08-27-2009, 12:58 PM   #61
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Hi,
just made a payment,
waiting for your reply
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Old 08-27-2009, 02:07 PM   #62
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Default Re: ★★ HOT!! HOW I GENERATE $202.91 A DAY USING BLACK-HAT ADSENSE TECHNIQUE!..PROVEN SCREENSHOT! ★★

To me, the smart play here is using other networks. The payout wouldn't be as high but you aren't really chancing slitting your own throat with Google either.

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Old 08-27-2009, 02:08 PM   #63
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Yeh I agree with Garret, but which networks are worthwhile? And how do you find high paying keywords with them?



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Old 08-27-2009, 02:49 PM   #64
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Oh, I can think of several 'other' networks that could work with this, if utilizing this method is a matter of POINTING this 'mysterious' traffic to your preferred site or page. But not having purchased the guide yet, I may be just talking out my ear.

I just sent 'AdsensePayback' my adsense code, so let's see if the proof IS in the pudding.

Golf Brain Entrainment - Use NLP & Visualization to Boost Golf Performance.
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Last edited by webdiva; 08-27-2009 at 03:57 PM. Reason: wrong username for 'AdensePayback'
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Old 08-27-2009, 02:50 PM   #65
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MrEyeconic I think it will probably take a bit of leg work to figure it out.

This is my strategy: grab a domain name that that is generic enough to use but still targeted for high paying keywords, even in another network. Huh? :-) I mean something like legalbiz.com, or whatever.

Now do a bit of research on your ad networks, and pop up some sub-domains @legalbiz.com. So something like headinjury.legalbiz.com.

Get those up and running. I would (rather will) do a number of them, let them run for awhile and then start using this method.

I will spend about 1/2 hour setting all of these up because I'll be using wordpress and a subdomain plugin and I will set them all on auto status. Probably be making some pretty good $$ on affiliate sales also. :-)

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Old 08-27-2009, 02:52 PM   #66
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I REALLY like the fact that I seem to have the largest return so far. Must be destiny.

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Old 08-27-2009, 03:02 PM   #67
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Well I personally wouldnt touch this WSO... BlueFart = unethical... Why do that?

In fact this could border on the illegal side because it is against adsense TOS. Which you agreed to. Better hope there is no click fraud or anything along those lines.

I believe you put up this WSO because you know Google is going to be dropping the banhammer on this method and you just want the quick cash from a lot of money hungry IM'ers from the forum.

Lets face it... google can trace things... You login to the forum here... you post that you bought it and its working great etc... then you login to your website or your adsense account... google can follow that.

They have the top statistics software and near unlimited resources... do you really think you can beat them?

Yea i dont like those footprints.

But just my .02

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Old 08-27-2009, 03:21 PM   #68
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Well I personally wouldnt touch this WSO...
...But just my .02
Should you be posting your 2 cents if you haven't purchased and you're not interested in it?

:)
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Old 08-27-2009, 03:25 PM   #69
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couldn't you just send a lot of click-happy traffic to your competitor's websites and sabotage their adsense?
Indeed, this happens and has happened to me in the past. No appeal to Google would help you either. That's why people protect their sites and niches as best they can.

Jeff
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Old 08-27-2009, 03:37 PM   #70
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Should you be posting your 2 cents if you haven't purchased and you're not interested in it?
Also, like it or not BH is a fact of life. Some people are okay using it, others not so. As witnessed in this very thread, some have said it's hardly BH at all while others have said it is very BH. So what is BH to one very well might not be to another.

So at the end of the day I try not to make too many judgements myself, I'm in no position to judge anybody. I take in as much information as possible and make my own choices. I'll be responsible for my actions and imagine one way or another, others will be responsible for theirs.

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Old 08-27-2009, 03:46 PM   #71
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Well Who says you are going to get banned as soon as you make your first 100$??? As you can see OP has been doing this for 5 months.
How do you know he's been doing it for 5 months? Because he says so???

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I'm not saying this can't happen but you might as well try this and have a chance at making some good money with this.
For me personally, my Adsense account is too valuable.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ehsan_am View Post
I can understand that you don't want to risk your adsense account. But if you don't make any money with adsense you can at least have a shot at it with this technique.
Do you realize that this method pretty much defrauds advertisers on the adwords and other ad networks? I'm all for making a couple bucks - the more the better But just realize that chances are good you are ripping people off on this very forum more than likely by using this method.

What the hell though - It's a couple of bucks, right?

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Old 08-27-2009, 04:02 PM   #72
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What the hell though - It's a couple of bucks, right?
People are mature enough to to expand their IM education in any way they see fit. What they choose to do with the info is for them to decide.

I'm not endorsing the product, and though my curiosity compelled me to buy it, I have no plans to use it. But I don't like to see a WSO getting shot down by people who don't have any experience with the product, and have no interest in purchasing it. The author of the WSO is very upfront about the nature of the material he is offering.

I believe it's the policy of this section that you shouldn't be commenting if you're not a buyer or potential customer with a question.

And afterall Jeremy, you have a WSO that includes in the title "...Piss People off on the Warrior Forum..." (which I bought and thought was great). You admit in your WSO that Black-Hat techniques are discussed, and TOS are violated. It wouldn't be hard to turn your words around on yourself.

:)
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Old 08-27-2009, 04:09 PM   #73
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I'm not endorsing the product, and though my curiosity compelled me to buy it, I have no plans to use it. But I don't like to see a WSO getting shot down by people who don't have any experience with the product, and have no interest in purchasing it.
You see, that is where you are mis-informed. I HAVE purchased this product...I DO know exactly what it says...and IT IS DEFRAUDING legitimate advertisers on not only the adwords networks but any other network you use it on.

I'm not going to get into a pissing match about this because frankly, I don't really care one way or the other. The adwords racket is tough enough without a bunch of people running around getting people charged for illegitimate clicks.

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Old 08-27-2009, 04:19 PM   #74
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And afterall Jeremy, you have a WSO that includes in the title "...Piss People off on the Warrior Forum..." (which I bought and thought was great). You admit in your WSO that Black-Hat techniques are discussed, and TOS are violated. It wouldn't be hard to turn your words around on yourself.

If you can really compare the two methods - 1 which rips off advertisers and one which manipulates numbers to your benefit then you need to have a serious session of reflecting dude...

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Old 08-27-2009, 04:22 PM   #75
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Ethics in IM sound like a joke to me. This is business and money. No one cares about ethics. You can realise that by looking at all the review pages people put up on their sites to promote a product, when they actually have no clue what the product is about and they never plan on purchasing it themselves.
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Old 08-27-2009, 04:28 PM   #76
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You see, that is where you are mis-informed. I HAVE purchased this product...I
Well if you have purchased it then you can speak your mind. I think that you can frame this as fraud, just as easily as you can frame a ton of traffic-generating techniques as fraudulant (including ways that the majority of forum members engage in).

It's easier to go on a self-righteous rant about this because it's more direct in terms of generating money. Do the internet gods really frown more harshly on this as opposed to someone who puts a bogus profile on a forum for backlinking purposes?

:)
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Old 08-27-2009, 04:33 PM   #77
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Freeman, putting a profile on a forum for backlinks doesn't take money out of anyones pocket

You certainly have the right to your opinion, but what I think a lot of people don't get is that your not just taking cash from Google...You are taking money from the people that advertise on Google which could be ANYONE in this forum. Any person that pays to have their ads shows could be affected by this and I personally think that is ****ty.

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Old 08-27-2009, 04:34 PM   #78
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If you can really compare the two methods - 1 which rips off advertisers and one which manipulates numbers to your benefit then you need to have a serious session of reflecting dude...
I disagree. Both exploit the system, sometimes at the expense of advertisers, competitors, or the TOS of a resource.

:)
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Old 08-27-2009, 04:36 PM   #79
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Originally Posted by Jeremy Kelsall View Post
Freeman, putting a profile on a forum for backlinks doesn't take money out of anyones pocket
I advertise on Adwords, so I can relate to your feelings on this. But if I had a forum and people were exploiting it for backlinks, I'd probably feel just as violated as an Adwords customer who is the victim of clickfraud. Anyway, I'll let you have the last word if oyu want it, and then we can give this thread back to the peeps wanting to discuss the specifics of the WSO.

:)
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Old 08-27-2009, 04:36 PM   #80
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Default Re: ★★ HOT!! HOW I GENERATE $202.91 A DAY USING BLACK-HAT ADSENSE TECHNIQUE!..PROVEN SCREENSHOT! ★★

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I disagree. Both exploit the system, sometimes at the expense of advertisers, competitors, or the TOS of a resource.
You think manipulating numbers and position is the same thing as THEFT? LOL

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Old 08-27-2009, 04:38 PM   #81
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I advertise on Adwords, so I can relate to your feelings on this. But if I had a forum and people were exploiting it for backlinks, I'd probably feel just as violated as an Adwords customer who is the victim of clickfraud. Anyway, I'll let you have the last word if oyu want it, and then we can give this thread back to the peeps wanting to discuss the specifics of the WSO.
The last thing I'll say on this because it's obvious that we won't agree is, if YOU use this method it will be poetic justice for you to wake up one morning and see your adwords budget maxed out from a bunch of these types of clicks.

I can be swayed pretty far to the "dark side" but I draw the line at stealing.

On a positive note for the seller - by bringing these things up there is a good chance that he will probably sell 50 more copies than he originally would have...Controversy sells, right?

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Old 08-27-2009, 04:40 PM   #82
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Default Re: █░█..(¯`*..HOW I GENERATE $202.91 A DAY USING THIS BLACK-HAT ADSENSE TECHNIQUE!..*´¯)..█░█

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Originally Posted by deltamatrix View Post
What's the easiest way of taking a snapshot of your account like that?
The easiest way is to:

(1). Hit your, "Print Scrn/ Sys Rq" key - this will take a picture of whatever is on your monitor at the time.

(2). Pull up Microsoft "Paint" usually found by going to START - PROGRAMS - ACCESSORIES - PAINT

(3). Go to "Edit" and then select "Paste" voila!

(4). After that you can save the file and then post it as you please

Another option that willl give you more functionality is buying one of the screen capture programs.
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Old 08-27-2009, 04:48 PM   #83
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Default Re: ★★ HOT!! HOW I GENERATE $202.91 A DAY USING BLACK-HAT ADSENSE TECHNIQUE!..PROVEN SCREENSHOT! ★★

Well personally I dont think much of the guy selling this WSO as I am an avid Adwords user and have always been. It aggravates me to know that I may be paying so much per click because you help people to successfully engange in click fraud. Which is theft. From Google and from many warriors who also use adwords.

if he generates $200 a day for 1 month thats about $6,000 in ONE month.

Okay hes selling this $37.. something seems wrong here...

By selling this he is giving away his "Secret" and sooner or later he is going to ruin it for himself. IF he has even gotten this to work consistently OR if he even has an adsense account anymore. If I had that kind of secret I wouldnt tell a soul.

Screenshots are easy to fake.

I can come up with a BlueFart method that is almost fool proof. Make it sound really impressive, Photoshop a screenshot and then boom. Sell it as a WSO. Hmm maybe I should get his Ip Address and report this WSO to google?

I bet thatd give them a nice heads up.

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Old 08-27-2009, 05:04 PM   #84
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Default Re: ★★ HOT!! HOW I GENERATE $202.91 A DAY USING BLACK-HAT ADSENSE TECHNIQUE!..PROVEN SCREENSHOT! ★★

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Originally Posted by Jeremy Kelsall View Post
You think manipulating numbers and position is the same thing as THEFT? LOL
Don't be daft -- comparing things isn't the same as equating them.

You're saying: "Money comes out of someone's pocket for bogus click, so that equals bad." Which is a fine stance. But I'm trying to illustrate how the ethics of internet marketing are a little more nuanced than that.

As I said, I'm not endorsing this, and I don't have plans to use it. I'm happy to learn about it though, because it helps inform me. OK, that's really my last word.

:)
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Old 08-27-2009, 05:10 PM   #85
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Default Re: ★★ HOT!! HOW I GENERATE $202.91 A DAY USING BLACK-HAT ADSENSE TECHNIQUE!..PROVEN SCREENSHOT! ★★

Freeman, I see where you are coming from

I just wanted to comment here so that the guy that just bought his first WSO or maybe hasn't been doing it that long understood what it was and what the repercussions might be.

Jeremy

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Old 08-27-2009, 05:46 PM   #86
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Default Re: ★★ HOT!! HOW I GENERATE $202.91 A DAY USING BLACK-HAT ADSENSE TECHNIQUE!..PROVEN SCREENSHOT! ★★

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Hello, I wanted to shaRe my thoughts on this product...

THIS IS BLACK-HAT Which I know a lot of people won't care about - as long as it puts money in the account, right?

You will more than likely have your Adsense account banned with this though. Going from pennies a day to $40 an hour is definitely going to raise flags. Once your adsense account is gone - IT'S GONE.

With that being said, If I were going to put this method into action, I would definitely use a different Ad network that I didn't care whether it banned my account or not - I WOULD NOT USE IT ON MY ADSENSE ACCOUNT.
The most important thing is this question, "If you have an Adwords Account, how would YOU feel knowing you were paying for fraudulent clicks?"

I have a Adsense Acct and a Adwords Acct and I watch them like a HAWK! If I tracked such suspicious activity you can best believe I'm going to address it with a Ninja 360 degrees over the top drop kick! I've probably read about a couple dozen BlueFart ebooks and am a member of a number of BlueFart forums. I do this so I can track what these guys are doing to make sure they don't stick it to me!

IMO - No such activity is worth getting BANNED! In addition, you just may be BlueFartting income from one of your fellow warriors members???

Not trying to rain on your parade, just stating the facts!
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Old 08-27-2009, 07:42 PM   #87
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Default Re: ★★ HOT!! HOW I GENERATE $202.91 A DAY USING BLACK-HAT ADSENSE TECHNIQUE!..PROVEN SCREENSHOT! ★★

Well, here's my screenshot showing $66.98 in Adsense earnings with AdsensePayBack using my Adsense ad unit and his technique for just ONE (1) hour.



I used my least active Adsense account for this test (I have two accounts).

NOW I'm a believer that this works. So I'm going to buy this Warrior's report and find out exactly HOW his technique actually works.

I like to think outside the box. Thinking outside of the box has been very Very good to me. There could be additional ways to utilize this technique, and I'm going to find out.

Thanks AdsensePayback!

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Old 08-27-2009, 07:55 PM   #88
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Default Re: ★★ HOT!! HOW I GENERATE $202.91 A DAY USING BLACK-HAT ADSENSE TECHNIQUE!..PROVEN SCREENSHOT! ★★

I think there is definately another way in monetizing this traffic. Time to get my thinking cap on. I'll report back IF i think of something

Gurpreet



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Old 08-27-2009, 09:22 PM   #89
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Default Re: ★★ HOT!! HOW I GENERATE $202.91 A DAY USING BLACK-HAT ADSENSE TECHNIQUE!..PROVEN SCREENSHOT! ★★

This is a very basic technique... many people have lost their accounts doing this... Google WILL get suspicious when doing a double metal refresh.

Just my opinion though...

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Old 08-28-2009, 02:08 AM   #90
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Be VERY wary of this, this is past BlueFart, this is outright fraud and clear theft. Infact you could easily be stealing directly from the pockets of warriors and people who can ill afford to be stolen from.

Anybody who advertisers with Google for their business/product is the target of this theft.

In addition Google will shut your account down in a heartbeat with this and may well take it further to make an example of some people.

Also note this guy refuses to refund, so I seriously suggest you consider this very carefully. I am about to open a paypal dispute now.

In addition, ask yourself , if this technique has any long term value, why he's so desperate for funds he can't refund a $37 purchase.

Out of dozens of WSO's, this will be my first ever refund.

Sig Smig - I'm selling nowt.
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Old 08-28-2009, 02:12 AM   #91
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Default Re: ★★ HOT!! HOW I GENERATE $202.91 A DAY USING BLACK-HAT ADSENSE TECHNIQUE!..PROVEN SCREENSHOT! ★★

I clearly mention in my sales letter this is a black-hat technique.. and if you’re faint-hearted, this is not for you.. if you are white-hat guy, this is also not for you.. so, please back off from this thread.

when we talk about black-hat, you should understand this technique comes with the risk.. either you make money, or someone else will.. if you too much worry about your account, this game is not for you man! you can continue with your daily bored activity and forget about this WSO and do not come back here.

i already show you that this technique works...you can find a lot of screenshot from the warriors who take the "test drive" session.. either you want to belive it of not it is up to you. use your judgement. i'm here to help others to make money online.

i belive some of my buyers already have an idea on how to manipulate this technique with other ads network or other programs. i know, there's a lot of potential here.. it is time for you to act!


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Old 08-28-2009, 02:14 AM   #92
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Originally Posted by SimonHarrison View Post
Be VERY wary of this, this is past BlueFart, this is outright fraud and clear theft. Infact you could easily be stealing directly from the pockets of warriors and people who can ill afford to be stolen from.

Anybody who advertisers with Google for their business/product is the target of this theft.

In addition Google will shut your account down in a heartbeat with this and may well take it further to make an example of some people.

Also note this guy refuses to refund, so I seriously suggest you consider this very carefully. I am about to open a paypal dispute now.

In addition, ask yourself , if this technique has any long term value, why he's so desperate for funds he can't refund a $37 purchase.

Out of dozens of WSO's, this will be my first ever refund.
please read my "buy back guarantee" . you should read the sales letter before you ask for a refund.

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Old 08-28-2009, 02:17 AM   #93
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Default Re: ★★ HOT!! HOW I GENERATE $202.91 A DAY USING BLACK-HAT ADSENSE TECHNIQUE!..PROVEN SCREENSHOT! ★★

I don't think clicks that come from people who seek information are "fraud clicks".

(And of course, if they found what they're really looking for, it's most likely they'd buy it wouldn't they ? So, it's worth your AdWords cost)

At least that's what I understand from the traffic source's readme page.
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Old 08-28-2009, 02:17 AM   #94
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Default Re: ★★ HOT!! HOW I GENERATE $202.91 A DAY USING BLACK-HAT ADSENSE TECHNIQUE!..PROVEN SCREENSHOT! ★★

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please read my "buy back guarantee" . you should read the sales letter before you ask for a refund.
You're book is a guide on how to steal from quite possibly Warriors and others. It's that simple and as such I had no intention of using it . I don't care about your flimsy worthless guarantees.

There is no doubt "it works" so does credit card fraud.

Just be very wary of these earnings screen shots, this is NOT warriors testing it for themselves, this is him taking their adsense code and adding to his sites, or even him just spamming clicks to it, he could well end up destroying your accounts.

I've had two PM's in 5 minutes from Warriors who were in that test, and one of them saying he didn't even understand what happened with the test but was asked to post the image here.

That this guy won't honour refunds on a WSO on the Warrior forum should ring alarm bells.

Sig Smig - I'm selling nowt.
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Old 08-28-2009, 02:48 AM   #95
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You're book is a guide on how to steal from quite possibly Warriors and others. It's that simple and as such I had no intention of using it . I don't care about your flimsy worthless guarantees.

There is no doubt "it works" so does credit card fraud.
if you dont want to use it, thats is your problem, not mine.

if giving people a refund just because he had no intention to use the information that he get from the ebook, then no one will selling ebook.. anyone can get a free copy from ebook seller... after buy just will ask for a refund with the reason "I had no intention of using it"..

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Old 08-28-2009, 02:57 AM   #96
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if you dont want to use it, thats is your problem, not mine.

if giving people a refund just because he had no intention to use the information that he get from the ebook, then no one will selling ebook.. anyone can get a free copy from ebook seller... after buy just will ask for a refund with the reason "I had no intention of using it"..
Twaddle.

Warriors buy thousands of WSO's a day, we don't refund them, even if we don't end up using them, but they don't promote out and out theft. Your book will get people's accounts banned and probably worse.

Your "testimonials" are simply you spam frauding clicks to other people's accounts. People scanning this might be misled into thinking it was Warriors actually testing this themselves on their own websites etc.

Had your WSO stated this was stealing from advertisers , I would never have purchased it.

Warriors honour other warriors on this forum, this is a DP type product at best and has no place here on WF.

I don't care about $39, I do care however about the principle, that a Warrior refuses to refund a fellow Warrior on a WSO unless they commit fraud.

Like Jeremey, I'll be bowing out now and leaving this thread, I've made my feelings clear on this product and your own ethics when it comes to dealing with fellow warriors. I'll see let Paypal deal with it from here.

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