>>>OFFLINER's - I Got FIRED by a Client

Irishman · 10-27-2009, 07:16 PM

Offline Marketers – Beware of the Lies!

I Got Humiliated & then FIRED by my 2nd Offline Client... All Because of the ‘Horse-Puckey’ Commonly Shoveled to Offliner’s Like You and I.

This Does NOT Have to Happen To You!

What You Absolutely MUST Know Before
Stepping in Front of Another Local Business Owner!

Warrior - if you have ANY hopes of building your successful Offline Consulting business, but you get this squishy little sensation in your gut that screams... “something’s gotta be missing here!” then you don’t want to miss this WSO report.

Written straight from the heart, you’ll find the report to be candid, confronting, and sterile from pitches.

Don’t believe me?

Hear this now, because it’s extremely rare... there’s not a single affiliate link, or product pitch inside my report.

How much?

Easy now, put your credit card back in your pocket. What kind of warrior would charge you money to expose lies in an industry? This is our call as warriors to help each other clear the haze, right? That’s exactly why it’s yours completely FREE! Well, you do have to opt-in (ooh, the dread).

Here’s Why –

I’m trying to build a private list of warriors & friends to network with in this Offline Marketing world so we can watch each other’s backs. Call it an “email-mastermind group” if you will. You’ll get the absolute best I have, and I’m hoping the same from you. And hey, the minute you think you’re getting otherwise, opt right out. No hard feelings. Sound fair to you?

So enjoy my gift to you. – there will be more where this came from!

Will Irish

“YEP, I WANT THE FREE REPORT NOW!!”

PS - I sincerely hope this report helps you avoid the humiliation I encountered when I started my business. Thank God it didn’t end there and I learn quickly! Those on my list will tell you straight up, I hold nothing back.

Irishman · 10-29-2009, 11:10 AM

Thanks for the heads up, just revalidated the link. All set!

Enjoy,

Will

Irishman · 10-29-2009, 11:27 AM

Joebaby - thanks for your kind words and review!

I'm grateful you mentioned the 2nd part about whether or not I think Offline Marketing is not a good business. I LOVE this business, it just took learning a few things the hard way before I made it not only extremely lucrative, but FUN!

Thanks - look forward to hearing more feedback.

Will

abundantliving · 10-29-2009, 12:31 PM

VERY good report. I recommend anyone interested in consulting with offline businesses read this report. Will is right... business owners don't care what action you take (i.e. backlinks, videos, #1 google placement)... what they are REALLY interested in is RESULTS.

Delivering results is simple as 1,2,3:

1. Gain visibility in the search engines.
2. Excite searchers into going to the website.
3. Convert website visitors into leads/customers.

Notice, I said "simple." It is simple... but that doesn't mean it's "EASY."

You really either (a) need to know how attain results yourself, or (b) you need really great people you can outsource the work to.

Again, the business owner doesn't care HOW you get the results... whether you do the work yourself or outsource it, whether you generate backlinks via directory submissions or video submissions, whether they are on page 1 or page 10 of the search engines... as long as they are SEEING RESULTS.

I'll say it again... GREAT report!

Irishman · 10-29-2009, 12:46 PM

Holly - spot on! Thanks for leaving your detailed thoughts... you had me at the word: "RESULTS"

Appreciate the kind words and review!

Best,

Will

thomasmps · 10-29-2009, 01:51 PM

That report was dam fantastic,it was like when Jerry Maquire decided that the industry needed a wake up call in the middle of the night and he wrote his report. I agree with every word you wrote,no one talks about how to quantify results for the client and they never talk about in their programs how to go about actually doing the work to get results.

Keep giving out good content and I will continue to read for sure and tell others.

Jason_V · 10-29-2009, 01:55 PM

Will,

You made some good points with your report. I'm sure a lot of people will benefit from this information that you're sharing in this report.

So long as you're being upfront and honest with your client about the cost and what exactly they are getting in return, there should be no problems.

For example, "Mr. Client, you don't have a web presence. It's important to leverage your other advertising mediums by having one. I will make you a (X) number of pages website for $(Y)."

Or:

"Mr Client, your site could use some improvements, I think I can help you get better results by tweaking it and giving your visitors a much better browsing experience. I can do this for $Y"

In fact, call up a local web design company and ask them about rates for a site. You will notice all they are "promising" is a website for (X) number of pages for $(Y). They don't guarantee results. They're paid to make a website, period.

If you take this approach, you will have no problems.

Now, if you want to offer SEO services and auto-responder services, your report is pretty much dead on.

However, even with that being said, if you treat the SEO package as a service without promising the moon you'll be okay.

You just have to look at how people right here in the WSO section do it as an example. People here who have a bookmarking, article writing, or blog commenting service don't guarantee you results. They tell you "I will provide my service of X, you will pay me $Y"

Again, if you take this approach, the business owner has no reason to be mad. You delivered on exactly what you promised you would do.

Obviously, you want to do your best to make the owner money. You want them to have results. So, as your guide says, think about how you can set them up a profitable funnel. If your offering more than just a website design deal.

So it does go back to your guide, that people should be careful about what they promise. Just stick to exactly what you'll do for them and how much it will cost.

You also need to educate the the business owner on how they need to promote their site as well. Make sure receipts print the website address at the bottom of them.

If you install a auto-responder make sure their sales staff are telling every customer at the end of a transaction pointing to the receipt saying "We have online only discounts and specials if you sign up at our website."

Make sure the owner puts signage up in the store somewhere about their website, obviously the more prominent the location the better.

I'll even throw in one of the tips from my prospecting guide right here:

One final thought on this topic, the biggest mistake I see people who do integrate their website into other forms of advertising make is:

They don't make the website address large enough or place it in a prominent enough place. Most companies make the mistake of treating their website like an afterthought and put it at the bottom with small letters.

Don't let your business owner make this mistake. Make sure that if the website address is written in the advertisement that it is placed in a prominent place with adequate sized letters.

Irishman · 10-29-2009, 02:39 PM

Jason,

Thanks for your detailed response and specifically for the tip you shared in the last paragraph.

I absolutely agree... it comes down to setting proper expectations.

I was just having a dialogue with another warrior and after giving it some thought it seems that where the rubber really meets the road, is here:

What are you billing yourself as... a technical service provider, or an offline/online marketing consultant?

Because you correctly state, if the offer is to install an autoresponder, or design a website, you've really delivered the tangible result upon completion, and to your point, the business owner has what he/she paid for.

The flip side is if you're presenting yourself as an expert online marketing consultant, (which I think you'll agree many offline marketing products are geared towards) then I would believe we're stopping short if we don't consult a customized online marketing strategy to improve their sales/profits.

It seems that the USP of many products is around showing a business owner how our IM knowledge can help their business grow. IMHO, a marketing consultant would really be remiss if they didn't "consult" with the business owner and strategically pull together all the IM tools to build a marketing system to improve that business.

All that said, if an offline marketer was new to this business, and went looking for help on how to start this offline niche, it is VERY easy to get distracted by "how to get your client's page 1 rankings" or "longtail keyword search" etc. Those are great, but if we're selling page 1 rankings to someone as the USP, well... what does the business owner want that for?

Again - as you mentioned above, "expectations" are vital. What are we offering, and... does the client know that?

I couldn't think of anything worse than someone being put in my shoes as I was when I got started. The day came and though I collected the money (thousands), I did a really poor job of focusing on the business owner's needs, and more on what I knew how to do.

My hope is that this report will help others keep a fresh perspective and clear initiatives when engaging business owners.

Thanks again for your thoughts and tips!

Will

CherylJohnson · 10-30-2009, 03:17 PM

Thanks for this WSO...

I've considered offline marketing for sometime but haven't pursued it because of what you write about in your report.

I live in Reno, NV and it is pretty easy to get someone to the top page of google with the right keywords, linking strategies, and geo targeting.

The only problem is how many searches are done per month on these long tail key words?

I used the google keyword tool to check out the number of monthly searches for pizza parlors, automobile shops, carpet cleaners, beauty salons, and many other yellow page advertisers and the results were shocking to say the least.

So many of the searches resulted in 300 or less searches a month...what a surprise

But others had 500 to 5000 searches but not many above the 5000 mark. With the average being about 1000 searches. ("Reno Pizza" had almost 10K but that was very rare)

If I ever decide to give this a go it will only be with business that the keyword gets at least 500 hits a month. With no competition, I figure I can show some bottom line CASH results to my clients.

Again, thanks for the WSO...it definitely gave me something to think about.

Hobo82 · 10-30-2009, 03:29 PM

Thanks for the download Will, its nice to think about making money outside the IM world. Never have all your eggs in one basket

Nice to see people willing to help others in this forum.

Hobo82

Izesta · 10-30-2009, 05:51 PM

Will, yes, I absolutely, positively agree. Earlier this year, I spent a few months investigating doing business with brick and mortar. Spent a bit of money and time. For a moment, I thought I was strickened with catatonic analysis paralysis because I had not yet made contact with one business owner after having tons of info everywhere. My hard drive was full of stuff and I had printed and consumed a mountain of info.

Then one day, as you said, I realized why I was hesitant. I was very skeptical about my ability to deliver results, sales, customers, etc. I had all the tools and details of "what" neat little Internet services I could offer, but in my mind, I could not translate the services into tangible results for the client. "Tangible" is the key word. And of all the stuff I purchased and read, it was rare to read about "tangible" results. It was mostly about what services and how much "I" could make. Sometimes I would read the prices that consultants were charging biz owners and I sat in shock. I know all about predicting response and calculating cost versus increased sales. But the calculation of increased sales/traffic was too iffy for me. Key words - "for me."

I realize a lot of marketing offers no guarantee. Like the Yellow Pages. Biz owners advertise there every day with no guarantee of anything but a listing or a spread, and then they hope for the best. And that's fine. But it's not the kind of marketing I wanted to do.

I wanted to do something where results were more quantifiable and where the biz owner could see something happening - not in 6 months maybe, but in a few weeks. Using something they could see, touch and feel.

Given all that, I decided to start out with showing them how to increase business using email marketing to drive previous and current customers back to their door. With this, results are more measureable. I offer no guarantee of "sales." My promise (in a nutshell) is to (1) get verified readership of their mail and (2) increase foot traffic to their store. Sealing the deal with a sale is in their hands. But they know that. Most business owners feel confident enough that if the people come, they can sell them.

I actually get most of my clients using my own email (autoresponder) marketing, so they can see it in action before I start their campaign.

I also offer Local Listing assistance. I sometimes throw it in as a freebie to clients doing email marketing with me. It helps to get in the door. And I will create a simple Blog. Other than support services (and charges) for what I do, my core offering is limited to Email marketing, Local Listings and Blogs.

For now, while I get my feet wetter, I refer SEO and website business to another local source. I freely admit I know very little about outsourcing to far off places and probably wouldn't trust it. In the end, I am responsible to my client. Me and my assistant (neighbor) get it all done.

Am I leaving dollars on the table? Sure, but it's not all about me. I will venture into more as I grow.

The clients I have are truly Local. I solicit and do business in my area. It is critical that I show "tangible" results so I can count on referrals from those clients.

The drawback to email marketing is that I must first show them how to get email addresses from their customers. Most have zilch for contact info. But it's at this point they realize how foolish that is in 2009. When I say, "What format is your list in now?" they of course say, "I don't have a list." Deal sold. It takes a few weeks to get the list rolling using a variety of methods, but it's only up from there.

When I read your report, it was right on point with me. I experienced it all. I am thankful I did not just go out and try to "do it" or I would have made a fool of myself. And it would have shown a disrespect for the business owner and his/her time. Mine too.

The plan I chose is "solid" for me and "solid" for the business. And I can spell it out with confidence to the biz owner with no uhs, huhs, .....

Offline marketing is not something to just go out and try to do on a whim.

Next step in my plan - Webinars. Tease them with bits and pieces using free webinars.

Thanks for the report Will. Glad to see someone else was thinking like me. Anyone working with brick and mortar should read it.

Success to all.

Zesta

JohnMcCabe · 10-31-2009, 03:39 PM

Haven't finished the dance yet, so I can't say anything about the report. But I do want to compliment you on putting forth a clear, concise offer with your cards face up on the table.

Thanks...

Edit:

Will, I just finished reading your report. Our thinking is so similar on these things that it's scary.

Even if y'all get that elusive #1 ranking for a decent keyword, the job is just begun. Assuming the searcher is going to click on something on that page - and that's not a forgone conclusion - you still have to beat out the competition.

There are nine or so other listings on the page, plus the local results in many instances. There are also up to ten paid ads (Adwords). So, even if you do get #1, you have to compete with up to nineteen other listings for every click. The reality is, you ain't gonna win every time, no matter how good you are.

Irishman · 10-31-2009, 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CherylJohnson

Thanks for this WSO...

I've considered offline marketing for sometime but haven't pursued it because of what you write about in your report.

I live in Reno, NV and it is pretty easy to get someone to the top page of google with the right keywords, linking strategies, and geo targeting.

The only problem is how many searches are done per month on these long tail key words?

I used the google keyword tool to check out the number of monthly searches for pizza parlors, automobile shops, carpet cleaners, beauty salons, and many other yellow page advertisers and the results were shocking to say the least.

So many of the searches resulted in 300 or less searches a month...what a surprise

But others had 500 to 5000 searches but not many above the 5000 mark. With the average being about 1000 searches. ("Reno Pizza" had almost 10K but that was very rare)

If I ever decide to give this a go it will only be with business that the keyword gets at least 500 hits a month. With no competition, I figure I can show some bottom line CASH results to my clients.

Again, thanks for the WSO...it definitely gave me something to think about.

Cheryl, you're welcome and thanks for sharing your thoughts. I did want to make sure I was clear in the report on something though.

If you have a good rounded online marketing background, don't be afraid to get started with the business model, but just be sure set proper expectations with the business owner.

If you're selling the benefits of page 1 google rankings and letting the owner translate the keyword searches into guaranteed customers, we are asking for trouble.

Rather as a "Marketing Consultant" if that's what we desire to be, we should look to pull together all the IM tools we have at our disposal to sincerely help the owners succeed. Google page 1 is great, and longtail searches, even though lower, are known to convert much better. They're more qualified. It's just important to think laterally and present the many ways you intend to "rampage" the market for their business.

Do some testing and see. That's the first thing I did when I was "enlightened" (read: fired) haha. I tested with a business for free with one page that took me an hour to create. Tested until I knew what to expect, and tweaked until optimal. Then moved to my next online technique and so forth... finally, you have a viable - practiced business model.

Hope that helps at least in encouraging you!

PM me if you I can help you in any way.

Will

Irishman · 10-31-2009, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Izesta

Will, yes, I absolutely, positively agree. Earlier this year, I spent a few months investigating doing business with brick and mortar. Spent a bit of money and time. For a moment, I thought I was strickened with catatonic analysis paralysis because I had not yet made contact with one business owner after having tons of info everywhere. My hard drive was full of stuff and I had printed and consumed a mountain of info.

Then one day, as you said, I realized why I was hesitant. I was very skeptical about my ability to deliver results, sales, customers, etc. I had all the tools and details of "what" neat little Internet services I could offer, but in my mind, I could not translate the services into tangible results for the client. "Tangible" is the key word. And of all the stuff I purchased and read, it was rare to read about "tangible" results. It was mostly about what services and how much "I" could make. Sometimes I would read the prices that consultants were charging biz owners and I sat in shock. I know all about predicting response and calculating cost versus increased sales. But the calculation of increased sales/traffic was too iffy for me. Key words - "for me."

I realize a lot of marketing offers no guarantee. Like the Yellow Pages. Biz owners advertise there every day with no guarantee of anything but a listing or a spread, and then they hope for the best. And that's fine. But it's not the kind of marketing I wanted to do.

I wanted to do something where results were more quantifiable and where the biz owner could see something happening - not in 6 months maybe, but in a few weeks. Using something they could see, touch and feel.

Given all that, I decided to start out with showing them how to increase business using email marketing to drive previous and current customers back to their door. With this, results are more measureable. I offer no guarantee of "sales." My promise (in a nutshell) is to (1) get verified readership of their mail and (2) increase foot traffic to their store. Sealing the deal with a sale is in their hands. But they know that. Most business owners feel confident enough that if the people come, they can sell them.

I actually get most of my clients using my own email (autoresponder) marketing, so they can see it in action before I start their campaign.

I also offer Local Listing assistance. I sometimes throw it in as a freebie to clients doing email marketing with me. It helps to get in the door. And I will create a simple Blog. Other than support services (and charges) for what I do, my core offering is limited to Email marketing, Local Listings and Blogs.

For now, while I get my feet wetter, I refer SEO and website business to another local source. I freely admit I know very little about outsourcing to far off places and probably wouldn't trust it. In the end, I am responsible to my client. Me and my assistant (neighbor) get it all done.

Am I leaving dollars on the table? Sure, but it's not all about me. I will venture into more as I grow.

The clients I have are truly Local. I solicit and do business in my area. It is critical that I show "tangible" results so I can count on referrals from those clients.

The drawback to email marketing is that I must first show them how to get email addresses from their customers. Most have zilch for contact info. But it's at this point they realize how foolish that is in 2009. When I say, "What format is your list in now?" they of course say, "I don't have a list." Deal sold. It takes a few weeks to get the list rolling using a variety of methods, but it's only up from there.

When I read your report, it was right on point with me. I experienced it all. I am thankful I did not just go out and try to "do it" or I would have made a fool of myself. And it would have shown a disrespect for the business owner and his/her time. Mine too.

The plan I chose is "solid" for me and "solid" for the business. And I can spell it out with confidence to the biz owner with no uhs, huhs, .....

Offline marketing is not something to just go out and try to do on a whim.

Next step in my plan - Webinars. Tease them with bits and pieces using free webinars.

Thanks for the report Will. Glad to see someone else was thinking like me. Anyone working with brick and mortar should read it.

Success to all.

Zesta

Wow Zesta - awesome post here. What you shared should be such an encouragement to people looking to start off in this business. Excellent!!

Truly grateful for your transparency and helpful reply!!

Will

Irishman · 10-31-2009, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe

Haven't finished the dance yet, so I can't say anything about the report. But I do want to compliment you on putting forth a clear, concise offer with your cards face up on the table.

Thanks...

Edit:

Will, I just finished reading your report. Our thinking is so similar on these things that it's scary.

Even if y'all get that elusive #1 ranking for a decent keyword, the job is just begun. Assuming the searcher is going to click on something on that page - and that's not a forgone conclusion - you still have to beat out the competition.

There are nine or so other listings on the page, plus the local results in many instances. There are also up to ten paid ads (Adwords). So, even if you do get #1, you have to compete with up to nineteen other listings for every click. The reality is, you ain't gonna win every time, no matter how good you are.

John - thanks for the review. Glad to know I'm in the same company as you... I've benefited greatly from some of your posts while in lurker mode.

Best!

Will

sanjid112 · 11-04-2009, 07:39 AM

Download it already and read it right away.

I found new word (not too new either

). It is INTEGRITY. Integrity for me means "watch out your tongue and take full responsibility of your own action." Integrity means to serve not just to be good, but more of that, to be best. It means give the best for your clients, and not just a crap.

Bring them not just more costumers but also potential and valuable costumers.

Thanks Irish for sharing it with us. It is really good WSO.

-Malik

Terry Loving · 11-07-2009, 12:50 PM

Thanks for writing this up so completely. I have been working with "off line" clients for some time now and appreciate the grounded information. Many do not understand the hype around Google, they do know they want to get ranked high but for me it was my reputation at stake - bringing them customers. I always take the discussion further explaining the next layers of marketing - and dispelling the "magic" of major financial success from walk in customers from a page one ranking of google. Thanks again.
Terry

MrYossu · 11-11-2009, 08:44 AM

OK, I don't want to be a damp squib here, but I wasn't as impressed with the report as others seem to be. Before I go any further though, I want to say that I appreciate what you have done, and am NOT trying to criticise. I'm trying to be constructive. It could be that the report wasn't aimed at me.

Anyway, as I read it, the report basically has two main points to make. First that most IM products geared towards the offline market are more interested in showing you how to get a cheque and less in how to build long-term profits for the business. Well, as I don't buy IM products, I guess I may be less exposed to the lie than others.

Why don't I buy IM products? Simple, I don't need to. If you read the offline threads in this forum (and one or two other places), you'll get all the info you need. In particular, anything written by Andrew Cavanagh is worth reading. One of the main points he stresses over and over again is that you need to listen to the SBO and find out what he wants to build his business. Then offer him that. If you do that, then your emphasis isn't merely on getting the customer, it's giving him what he actually wants. That is laying the foundation for long-term profits for you, as the SBO will keep coming back to you for more.

Given that I am an avid reader of Andrew's posts, I wasn't really in a mindset of just getting customers. I'm actually quite surprised that anyone interested in offline marketing would think like that actually, as even a modest amount of reading up on the subject will expose the truth.

The other point the report made was about getting #1 in Google. This is really another angle to the previous issue, and that is that our job here is to increase sales for the SBO. Again, anyone who's read the discussions on offline marketing here will have heard this over and over again. I'm not sure who believes this lie. On the contrary, I find it's more likely the SBO who believes he needs to be at #1. I have often had to convince people that this isn't necessarily what they want, and may be distracting them from what will actually make them more money.

As I said, I'm not trying to criticise, but I was quite surprised at the content of this report. Anyone who is serious about offline marketing should have read enough to know that the lies you debunk are lies. Anyone who isn't serious and is just out to extract money from the SBO isn't going to read or take note of your report anyway.

Please take this post in the constructive sense it was intended.

Irishman · 11-11-2009, 05:06 PM

MrYossu,

Thanks for taking the time to post your thoughts, and no worries mate, I can appreciate a different perspective than my own.

I would however like to clarify a bit more based on your post as it seems you're replying from a rather peculiar position. I'll explain...

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrYossu

Well, as I don't buy IM products, I guess I may be less exposed to the lie than others.

In my opinion, that's where your post should have ended. No offense intended.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrYossu

I'm actually quite surprised that anyone interested in offline marketing would think like that actually, as even a modest amount of reading up on the subject will expose the truth.

Respectfully, I'd ask you to consider this...

Your comments can sound really condescending to those that do buy the products, and follow the advice often given about page 1 google, and get customers... without a solid plan of how to fulfill and manage the client expectations.

I'm a perfect example. I never had any malicious intent when I started out. But I had purchased a boat load of products to make sure I was well informed. One product in particular gave me so much juice that I couldn't take my eyes off of how easy this was going to be. Page 1 rankings, promise of my IM expertise and boom, I'm going to strike it rich.

But... what some of the products had left out was the grounding I needed. Teach me how to consult with owners, and not go into the promises of my seo prowess. How many offliners that are starting out even have an idea of how much business would be generated from a google page 1? I'm sorry, but if you read many of the offline products, it's not hard to get caught up in focusing on the wrong things.

Your inability to believe that anyone could be caught up in that hype, while not even buying those products is a bit naive I must say. Good people, with good intent, trying to learn the business can get distracted.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrYossu

Again, anyone who's read the discussions on offline marketing here will have heard this over and over again. I'm not sure who believes this lie. On the contrary, I find it's more likely the SBO who believes he needs to be at #1.

Reading discussions on forum boards can be helpful, but when you see a product that is written by an owner claiming to have made thousands of dollars in easy cash, people want to follow THAT advice.

For the record, my report wasn't about bashing offline products and their owners, it was about making sure there was a balanced story going into the business model. I was fired by a client, so regardless of what forum discussions take place, I followed the advice of a guide and didn't have a complete picture of what it meant to be a consultant. My bad, nobody's fault but mine. But, I'm not going to sit back and just hope that I was the only person who wasn't seeing things clearly... my report was to help those that do buy those products to know how to be most well rounded in their model.

Also - the reason I posted it here in the WSO section is because most, if not all offline products I refer to are sold via WSO. I posted this in the WSO forum because those folks who DO buy offline products would be able to read this report. In other words, this is where you reach the target market I intended to share this with.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MrYossu

As I said, I'm not trying to criticise, but I was quite surprised at the content of this report. Anyone who is serious about offline marketing should have read enough to know that the lies you debunk are lies. Anyone who isn't serious and is just out to extract money from the SBO isn't going to read or take note of your report anyway.

Again - I'll repeat you're very wrong in your conclusion on this matter and I have over 100 emails from readers who would beg to differ. They are serious about offline marketing, and they are not out just to extract money from the SBO... but there absolutely is a need for grounding.

Maybe not you. It sounds like you have a rather solid grasp of the offline consulting model, but it doesn't mean others are less than ethical for not being able to see through the fog caused by hyped up guides.

And btw, regarding Andrew's report. I personally learned a lot from his guide. I read his posts with a lot of respect as well, and grateful for it. I don't see a hyped up focus on google page 1 or even all the money to be made. So to be clear, I wasn't even thinking Andrew Cavanaugh when I wrote this report... I was simply trying to help others from making the same mistakes I did.

I hope you know in the same fashion as yours that my thoughts were meant to be constructive in nature. I wish you the best my friend in your ventures.

Will

MrYossu · 11-12-2009, 10:32 AM

Quote: