FORGET BLOGGING/EBOOKS/PPC/SEO/ARTICLES ▄█▀ ▄█▄ ██ ▀█ █ THIS WILL EARN YOU $500+ DAILY ON AUTOPILOT!

[cherylwright]

Originally Posted by Matt Fulger

Actually, Dan has NOT scammed anyone and doesn't deserve to be banned from the WF over his actions at MM365. If you want a refund, request one and he'll probably give it to you.

I haven't seen him disrespecting this forum. He's asked for opinions and he's made some WSO offers. If you aren't happy with a purchase you made, request a refund and don't do business with him again. Simple as that.

You honestly think he's not scammed anyone?

People have paid him huge amounts of money and have received nothing in return. That sounds like a scam to me.

And just the fact of how he refuses to communicate with people is VERY disrespectful.

I'm sorry, but this guy does not give a damn about other people. He also doesn't issue refunds until you make the request on a public forum. That's how I ended up getting mine -- after more than six months of asking.



Cheryl

[Dave777]

Originally Posted by cherylwright

You honestly think he's not scammed anyone?

People have paid him huge amounts of money and have received nothing in return. That sounds like a scam to me.

And just the fact of how he refuses to communicate with people is VERY disrespectful.

I'm sorry, but this guy does not give a damn about other people. He also doesn't issue refunds until you make the request on a public forum. That's how I ended up getting mine -- after more than six months of asking.

Cheryl

What really surprises me is we have 13 pages with endless warriors who purchased this WSO, basic or the reseller package including some more well known warriors and few have much to say!
Maybe they're not subscribed to this WSO thread anymore...

You would think that Allen and other warriors in general would be a little more concerned on this matter of $1,000's of dollars down the drain, pretty much our own trusting loss so maybe few really care on the principal on the issue as a whole and just choose to move on and write the whole thing as a learning experience...

Buy WSO's from only warriors that first seriously prove themselves and don't be a follower unless you're 110% sure you can fully trust them!

Dave

[nazri97]

So this is scam? Should warriors buy it?

[cherylwright]

Originally Posted by nazri97

So this is scam? Should warriors buy it?

So you've read the thread and are considering buying it? You are joking, right?




Cheryl

[Matt Fulger]

Originally Posted by cherylwright

You honestly think he's not scammed anyone?

People have paid him huge amounts of money and have received nothing in return. That sounds like a scam to me.

And just the fact of how he refuses to communicate with people is VERY disrespectful.

I'm sorry, but this guy does not give a damn about other people. He also doesn't issue refunds until you make the request on a public forum. That's how I ended up getting mine -- after more than six months of asking.

Cheryl

Well Cheryl,

Paid HUGE amounts of money for NOTHING in return? Who? I know I didn't pay huge amounts of money for my membership and neither did anyone else buying in through his WSO.

Maybe you don't think hosting is worth anything? And maybe you don't think any of the many products he has available for download are worth anything?

Even at the $27/mo fee of normal members, it's NOT a SCAM. He does deliver products, including hosting of unlimited domains. The hosting alone is worth the monthly fee. It's not up to Dan to hold his members hand and make them use the hosting and other products.

Fact is, I've seen FAR worse offers than the MM365 membership and people are happy with those. When I first joined the MM365 site, Dan had tons of downloads that were 10 times better than other membership sites I've joined.

That said, I do admit that IF I were a monthly paying member, I wouldn't be happy and would cancel my membership and probably request a refund. But since he does give people a 14 day trial to decide, it's not his fault if they do NOT cancel. It's not like he's hiding the continuity of the site.

As per your refund request that took 6 months to get...

Be honest Cheryl!

Unless I missed something (emails, PMs, etc.), you threatened to request a refund for much of that time but didn't actually do it until right before you got it.

Now, I do know that Dan kept telling you to give it a chance, but he never REFUSED to refund you that I'm aware of. If he did, well that's just downright wrong.

I've already said time and time again his communications skills suck, but that doesn't make him a scammer. I've seen much worse on this forum and from some of the so-called gurus at that.

Dave777,

I think the reason you don't find too many complaints here is because the vast majority of his members don't feel like they were scammed.

I know I don't.

When I see a scam I'm not afraid to call it a scam. But in its most basic terms, I see a scam as when someone lies to you to get your money and then never bothers to deliver the product(s).

Dan has been delivering products through his membership site. Content has been added even if it's not always added by Dan himself. However, Dan has added a ton of videos, articles, etc. and has given members the opportunity to communicate with each other, promote their own offers through his site, run their own blogs, upload their own products, etc.

His spaces platform does outperform the vast majority of membership sites I've personally been a member of. People can do Joint Ventures, launch products, promote offers, etc. right inside the spaces platform.

How Cheryl sees that as a SCAM is beyond me.

I've seen some sites who charge a monthly fee just to be able to communicate with other members inside their member areas. This is on top of any fees they have already paid to become a member in the first place.

So I'm sticking to my guns. MM365 is not a scam in my eyes.

Again, I don't like the fact that Dan has a serious problem with communicating to his members, but that doesn't make him a scammer.

These are simply my opinions, you don't have to agree with them. But I'm not changing my mind just cuz one person feels like they were scammed.

Peace & Prosperity,
Matt Fulger

[cherylwright]

Matt, I asked Dan repeatedly for a refund (privately), and didn't get it until I posted the request to this forum.

And no, he hasn't delivered what he promised. He told resellers they would have a top-notch membership site to promote and sell. The site is a joke. People can't sign up most of the time, let alone the fact he wasn't adding products regularly. He also said it was a step-by-step blueprint to making money online.

We both know that never happened, and in fact, it was you and I who told him he needed to remove that misleading information from the sales page.

When people are not getting what they're promised, they're being scammed. I just hope everyone who has paid him for reseller rights and have had no returns in the way of membership sales asks for their money back.

Sure, you get hosting, but that's not what he was selling, and we both know it.

And while I was a reseller, the members were adding more products than Dan was. I'm sure that's why he added that feature - it took the pressure off him to keep up the site.

I'm not sure why you keep defending him, because you've openly said you refuse to promote the site because it's not up to standard.




Cheryl

[Dave777]

Originally Posted by Matt Fulger

Well Cheryl,

Paid HUGE amounts of money for NOTHING in return? Who? I know I didn't pay huge amounts of money for my membership and neither did anyone else buying in through his WSO.

Maybe you don't think hosting is worth anything? And maybe you don't think any of the many products he has available for download are worth anything?

Even at the $27/mo fee of normal members, it's NOT a SCAM. He does deliver products, including hosting of unlimited domains. The hosting alone is worth the monthly fee. It's not up to Dan to hold his members hand and make them use the hosting and other products.

Fact is, I've seen FAR worse offers than the MM365 membership and people are happy with those. When I first joined the MM365 site, Dan had tons of downloads that were 10 times better than other membership sites I've joined.

That said, I do admit that IF I were a monthly paying member, I wouldn't be happy and would cancel my membership and probably request a refund. But since he does give people a 14 day trial to decide, it's not his fault if they do NOT cancel. It's not like he's hiding the continuity of the site.

As per your refund request that took 6 months to get...

Be honest Cheryl!

Unless I missed something (emails, PMs, etc.), you threatened to request a refund for much of that time but didn't actually do it until right before you got it.

Now, I do know that Dan kept telling you to give it a chance, but he never REFUSED to refund you that I'm aware of. If he did, well that's just downright wrong.

I've already said time and time again his communications skills suck, but that doesn't make him a scammer. I've seen much worse on this forum and from some of the so-called gurus at that.

Dave777,

I think the reason you don't find too many complaints here is because the vast majority of his members don't feel like they were scammed.

I know I don't.

When I see a scam I'm not afraid to call it a scam. But in its most basic terms, I see a scam as when someone lies to you to get your money and then never bothers to deliver the product(s).

Dan has been delivering products through his membership site. Content has been added even if it's not always added by Dan himself. However, Dan has added a ton of videos, articles, etc. and has given members the opportunity to communicate with each other, promote their own offers through his site, run their own blogs, upload their own products, etc.

His spaces platform does outperform the vast majority of membership sites I've personally been a member of. People can do Joint Ventures, launch products, promote offers, etc. right inside the spaces platform.

How Cheryl sees that as a SCAM is beyond me.

I've seen some sites who charge a monthly fee just to be able to communicate with other members inside their member areas. This is on top of any fees they have already paid to become a member in the first place.

So I'm sticking to my guns. MM365 is not a scam in my eyes.

Again, I don't like the fact that Dan has a serious problem with communicating to his members, but that doesn't make him a scammer.

These are simply my opinions, you don't have to agree with them. But I'm not changing my mind just cuz one person feels like they were scammed.

Peace & Prosperity,
Matt Fulger

Matt,

Keep in mind, when Dan was questioned a few times by warriors regarding the lifetime of his membership concept he assured them with comments like...

"You simply pay a one time fee of $17 and then you earn for many, many years to come on complete autopilot!"

But to be fair to Dan... Other WSO concepts at times have broken similar promises so I guess it's always buyer beware on these type of related issues...

Dave

[Matt Fulger]

Originally Posted by cherylwright

Matt, I asked Dan repeatedly for a refund (privately), and didn't get it until I posted the request to this forum.

And no, he hasn't delivered what he promised. He told resellers they would have a top-notch membership site to promote and sell. The site is a joke. People can't sign up most of the time, let alone the fact he wasn't adding products regularly. He also said it was a step-by-step blueprint to making money online.

We both know that never happened, and in fact, it was you and I who told him he needed to remove that misleading information from the sales page.

When people are not getting what they're promised, they're being scammed. I just hope everyone who has paid him for reseller rights and have had no returns in the way of membership sales asks for their money back.

Sure, you get hosting, but that's not what he was selling, and we both know it.

And while I was a reseller, the members were adding more products than Dan was. I'm sure that's why he added that feature - it took the pressure off him to keep up the site.

I'm not sure why you keep defending him, because you've openly said you refuse to promote the site because it's not up to standard.

Cheryl

Hey Cheryl,

Okay. Now I can see where you are coming from as a reseller.

Personally, I didn't buy into ANY of his OTOs or ANY other offer he's made for that matter. All I paid was my initial $17 investment of which I'm happy with.

I guess I should look at the opportunity from all the various viewpoints and I must admit that I've failed to do so. I'm on the inside and rarely look at the outside anymore. I decided long ago NOT to promote MM365 and so quit really paying attention to anything not inside the members area.

Mainly, since I figure it is from the members area that I will know if it's worth promoting, that is what I've paid attention to. I still hadn't seen enough improvement to want to promote it because of Dan's own claims of what the site will be. However, I have seen Dan making improvements to the site by adding features within the "Spaces" platform. So I do see Value in the site itself. But not in the way it is promoted.

You are absolutely correct about the step-by-step blueprint which still has never appeared. I have openly complained about his marketing methods and did in fact, tell him he needed to reword his entire sales page.

He has changed the sales page up a bit over time, but checking back today I do see he's still promoting step-by-step instruction and that's simply NOT available anywhere in his members area in the context he makes it seem. If it is, it's not out in the open and not easily found.

Taken from the MM365 sales page:

You'll learn EXACTLY how to earn a steady income online, and we'll show you (step-by-step) how this is done

Um....hmmm. Where is this EXACTLY?

When people are not getting what they're promised, they're being scammed. I just hope everyone who has paid him for reseller rights and have had no returns in the way of membership sales asks for their money back.

The problem with this is that I'd be willing to bet that there ARE some resellers (mainly WARRIORS) making money off of his site right now.

Now, I will agree that what is promised on the sales page is not exactly what is inside the members area. But a lot of what is promoted is true. And there actually IS a hell of a lot of value within the members "Spaces" area.

If the site was promoted differently on the main page, I would have no problems promoting the site based on "Value" alone.

The site has changed considerably on the inside since you were a member, Cheryl. The fact that it is back up now, shows that Dan didn't just give up on the site because he doesn't care about his members.

He has a message saying:

MoreMoney365 Admin apologies for the downtime... too many people watching videos at the same time!

That's a very plausible response. It is very possible and even probable that his server simply couldn't deal with all the bandwidth. Like I said, it has been much more active recently.

I simply can't sit here and say the site is a SCAM, when I see more value inside his site than many others out there. If Dan were to approach the marketing differently, he could still easily justify the monthly membership fee of $27 bucks a month.

Members can have their own store right inside the members area if they take the time to set it up. They can start their own blogs, upload videos, ebooks, software, etc. It isn't just an empty site with a pretty cover and it's not full of nothing but junk downloads either.

My biggest complaint with the site is the lack of Dan's communication skills & the disappearance of the original downloads and descriptions, etc., along with the lack of step-by-step instructions that are promoted on the sales pages. I'm also not happy with the fact that Dan claimed there would be new products "drip fed" into the members area every couple of days which I've never really seen happen.

I wasn't too pleased with the forum being shut down either, but I do understand why he did it. He wanted people to participate inside the members' "Spaces" area rather than in the forum itself. It does seem to have helped too. There does seem to be more active members in spaces now than there ever was on the forum and in spaces combined while you were a member.

While I can empathize with you and can understand why you feel like you were scammed, I didn't buy into any extra offers he pushed to us and don't feel like I was scammed in any way.

I don't go around begging others to join and I don't push his offer on anyone specifically because I do not agree with the front end marketing, but I do see real Value inside the members area and if the site were promoted differently on the sales page I probably would promote it.

Now, if people were unable to cancel their subscription either before the trial or even after the trial, then I would say the site is a scam. But that's not the case here. The way you and I purchased isn't the same as what monthly members are subscribing so there is a difference on cancellations, refunds, etc.

I'm personally not sure if he ever worked out the kinks in the member signup process, but a bug in the script doesn't equal a scammer. He's using the Rapid Action Profits script from a fellow Warrior to handle the payment processing and affiliate program and I'm sure MM365 isn't the only site to ever have problems with the script. That is the nature of these things. You cannot predict all server settings, browser types and user settings so it's impossible to make scripts work for everyone.

The sad part about MM365 is that the last I knew the support script wasn't working for all users and Dan wasn't responsive through email either. I can't verify that myself though as I don't have problems accessing support and when I needed it, Dan did answer my questions. I will say that I did have a hard time contacting him through email in the past, but now I simply use the "Spaces" messaging and that seems to be working pretty well.

I still think Dan could use to improve his communication skills and let people know what's going on with spaces, etc. ahead of time. For example, the only reason I even know about the store fronts we can put up is from messing around inside spaces itself. I never heard a word from Dan about this. If he communicated it somewhere, I missed it.

The site was down for a little while and when it was back up there were some new features and some missing links. I asked Dan about the missing links and he responded quite quickly, apologizing for the inconvenience and said they would be back soon, etc. I checked back for a couple of days and didn't see the links appear, but they are back now.

The menus do keep changing, which makes navigation exceedingly confusing. But in the end it looks like he's just trying to make improvements to the site and has almost no communication skills to tell anyone what the hell is going on.

So as I said before, I don't see him as a SCAMMER. A NON-Communicator, Yes. But not really a SCAMMER. Maybe I'm being too soft on Dan, but considering his site is MUCH better than many other membership sites out there, I can't condemn him for his efforts.

Peace & Prosperity,
Matt Fulger

[Matt Fulger]

Originally Posted by Dave777

Matt,

Keep in mind, when Dan was questioned a few times by warriors regarding the lifetime of his membership concept he assured them with comments like...

"You simply pay a one time fee of $17 and then you earn for many, many years to come on complete autopilot!"

But to be fair to Dan... Other WSO concepts at times have broken similar promises so I guess it's always buyer beware on these type of related issues...

Dave

Well, in theory one could make money through his site even with the one time fee of $17 IF they promoted the site. After you have paying members under you, then you could get money on "complete autopilot". There was never a requirement to buy into his other offers to make even more money through the OTOs, that was an option.

Now the "complete autopilot" statement is way overused by tons of marketers and it's never "completely" true. You simply cannot join any site and expect automatic money to flow into your paypal account. It simply does NOT work that way and never will.

As I keep saying, I really do NOT agree with his marketing and is WHY I refuse to promote his site.

If he were to change the way he markets the site by telling people exactly what they are really getting on the inside, he could still sell plenty of memberships. Unfortunately, he seems focused on newbies that are going to be expecting this step-by-step guide that they aren't going to be able to find.
Hell, if he simply wrote (or paid someone to write) a real step-by-step guide that is claimed to be inside the members area, he'd have one hell of a winner with MM365.

As is, there's really no direction whatsoever inside the spaces platform. You are left to figure it out for yourself through clicking the links and playing around with all the features, etc.

I'm fairly certain that most members have no idea what most of the links even lead to. I thought about making a tutorial, but haven't bothered yet.

Anyway, I still don't feel scammed.

[cherylwright]

Matt, I'm not talking about this from a member's viewpoint, rather a reseller's viewpoint.

When Dan makes claims to RESELLERS that simply aren't true, then people are being scammed. That's my opinion, and I'm sticking to it.




Cheryl

[Matt Fulger]

Originally Posted by cherylwright

Matt, I'm not talking about this from a member's viewpoint, rather a reseller's viewpoint.

When Dan makes claims to RESELLERS that simply aren't true, then people are being scammed. That's my opinion, and I'm sticking to it.

Cheryl

You have every right to your opinion. Technically, I am a reseller too but didn't buy into any of the "extras" he offered (there were several of which I never did completely understand). Maybe I should feel scammed too as I don't feel like I can promote the site and still feel good about myself.

But I do like it as a "Member".

[williamtan]

I'm one of the early member, or rather, reseller that bought into this program and WOW, the debate is still hot.

Anyway, all early resellers are promised lifetime member access - I've gone to the main site but login is changed to email instead of username previously. So is the promise still valid?

[RobinInTexas]

Originally Posted by williamtan

I'm one of the early member, or rather, reseller that bought into this program and WOW, the debate is still hot.

Anyway, all early resellers are promised lifetime member access - I've gone to the main site but login is changed to email instead of username previously. So is the promise still valid?

I was able to login a few days ago, I think I had to fiddle with the lost password routine to get on.

[Matt Fulger]

Originally Posted by williamtan

I'm one of the early member, or rather, reseller that bought into this program and WOW, the debate is still hot.

Anyway, all early resellers are promised lifetime member access - I've gone to the main site but login is changed to email instead of username previously. So is the promise still valid?

Your membership is still valid but the logins did change. You may need to request a lost password. Or you may be able to login using your email address instead of your username. However, if you never registered for the "Spaces" platform, then you may need to contact Dan directly to get your signup code in the first place.

You can contact Dan through the WF by clicking his username and sending him a PM from the first page of this thread.

Let me know if you have problems or need help getting the proper login info. If needed, I'll try to contact Dan for you & help you get your username and password squared away.

Good Luck!

Peace & Prosperity,
Matt Fulger

[williamtan]

Thanks Matt. Indeed, the "Spaces" thingy is new. I'll PM Dan first.

It has changed a lot since Day 1. Need to relook at what it has now.

Originally Posted by Matt Fulger

Your membership is still valid but the logins did change. You may need to request a lost password. Or you may be able to login using your email address instead of your username. However, if you never registered for the "Spaces" platform, then you may need to contact Dan directly to get your signup code in the first place.

You can contact Dan through the WF by clicking his username and sending him a PM from the first page of this thread.

Let me know if you have problems or need help getting the proper login info. If needed, I'll try to contact Dan for you & help you get your username and password squared away.

Good Luck!

Peace & Prosperity,
Matt Fulger