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Which is the best framework?

by Magnatolia
7 replies
  • WEB DESIGN
    • |
Hi guys,

I'm interested in buying a Wordpress framework that allows me to create the template easily. I understand that Genesis doesn't do this. So I've seen two choices - Catalyst and Thesis 2.0.

I've heard Thesis is uber hard, however the only reason I'm undecided is that Thesis 'hypes' their features a lot more than Catalyst which makes me wonder if Catalyst does as much as Thesis.

Thesis claims that you don't need to touch any code, and you can drag and drop to create a beautiful website. And they mention the visual design template editor which sounds great. And the thesis boxes and packages (my understanding is these can negate the need for certain plugins). Plus you can verify your site directly. Add Google Rel authorship. Uses Markup Schema? (apparently something that search engines love). Unrivalled seo options? But the big thing for me is that Matt Cutts aka Google's SEO guy is apparently using it for his blog.

Catalyst on the other hand has hardly any information about what they actually offer features-wise. Admittedly they have more tutorials apparently which is great but I'm sure there will be tutorials already created in the community for Thesis 2.0 - plus I'm a bit suss about the fact that Catalyst doesn't allow you to go to the website of any showcase sites - each one is a picture, a snapshot in time that may have changed. Plus they don't tell you who owns the site.

I have heard that Thesis 2.0 is harder to use in the beginning but has more features than Catalsyt. Is this right? Should I go with Thesis 2.0? What are your thoughts?

Thanks!
#framework
  • Profile picture of the author David V
    Originally Posted by Magnatolia View Post

    .....allows me to create the template easily......
    It's only going to be as easy as your knowledge.

    If your looking for something fairly turn-key, where you can just click, click, click and have a cool style, that's not going to happen.

    There's a trade-off.

    If you buy something that's has a zillion options, you'll have a template full of bloat.
    If you buy barebones, you'll need knowledge to design it.

    There are many turn-key templates for Genesis, Catalyst, and Thesis out there.

    The frameworks you mentioned are all good, but styling is styling regardless of the framework.

    Without html/css knowledge, you should find a template that's "close" to your idea, or hire someone to do it.
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    • Profile picture of the author Magnatolia
      I assume by bloat you mean too many choices, not a bloated front-end as each option will adjust the coding of the template.

      I'm happy to learn some basic html and CSS although my understanding is that the frameworks are designed so this is minimal if any.

      And there are plenty of free skins, at least for Thesis, that I can utilise and then adjust to suit my needs. I like the fact that Thesis has the ability to save the end result as a template. And the idea behind the boxes, my understanding anyway, is that they would reduce both the number of plugins and subsequently the load time for the site.

      I don't really see why it wouldn't/couldn't be click, click, click. Sure you need to change settings to make the end result look like what you want. And it will probably take time to actually get the end result looking like what you want. I assume you mean a user can't just install the framework, click a button and presto they have an amazing site...

      I've read some reviews and Thesis seems to be the best one, what they lack in information and tutorials, will be available through other sites now. That seemed to be their biggest sticking point. But I've also been checking out Headway which seems quite intuitive...although with what appears to be less third party creations.
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      • Profile picture of the author David V
        Originally Posted by Magnatolia View Post

        I assume by bloat you mean too many choices, not a bloated front-end as each option will adjust the coding of the template.....
        By bloat I mean just WAY too many choices, selections, and assets.
        Some themes just go over the top to the point of overwhelming the user and loading way too many assets.
        You can't go wrong with Thesis, definitely no bloat there, and a good theme.

        When I say click, click, click and have the site look the way you want, what I mean is many people think they can click a button to change a part of the site that really needs to be customized via design/css.

        Again, the more options there are to change a "part" of the design, the more bloated the theme becomes.
        Themes are not universal for the most part.
        The authors come out with a design "style" and too often people (newbies) try to change it 360 degrees when they should just find something closer to what they want.

        If you start out with something like Thesis as you said, it's fairly minimal with design, so you can tweak and customize to your liking, but again, it's not by clicking option buttons, but by using css so a little knowledge is required.
        Headway is totally different then Thesis, some find it harder, some find it easier.
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        • Profile picture of the author Magnatolia
          Thanks David, after some investigation I'm steering clear of Thesis. And going to Headway as I used the demo for Headway and found the drag and drop to be quite decent for getting a good layout.

          The big reason for moving away from Thesis is one of the big reasons for eyeing off Thesis was that they listed Matt Cutts from Google in their showcase. Gotta give them credit for getting the SEO person from Google to use their theme. However, I just discovered that he actually ditched them yet they still show him in their showcase. At least say when it was used and that it may be different now.

          The one disappointment is it feels like Thesis has a bigger community offering than Headway. Seems to be a lot more blocks and packages than Headway. But maybe the Headway ones are a bit harder to find. It's only a nice-to-have as the functions can be used with a plugin.

          Any coding I need to learn will be available easy enough on the internet, tutorials and such.

          Thanks for the advice!
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  • Profile picture of the author Stevewoody82
    I agree with David, I build lots of Wordpress websites and my preference has always been the warp framework from yootheme, I've used thesis, genesis, page lines etc

    My new friend is twitter bootstrap and I've just created a YouTube series that explains how to use it with Wordpress.

    Hope it helps

    Learn how to create a Wordpress Theme with Twitter Bootstrap 1 of 6 - YouTube

    I do this because I like control of my site, my advise is learn the tools of your trade. Get stuck into HTML and create your own site. Frameworks are good but these days functionality is more important. The only way you can learn that is to get stuck in, then after that get thesis and you will have. Better idea of how it all works
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    Your website is the window to your business . Don't fill it with cheap crap !

    What I don't know about Wordpress either isn't worth knowing or hasn't been invented ;)

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  • Profile picture of the author appliedvisual
    I'm assuming you don't already know html and css, in which case David V said it best, "Without html/css knowledge, you should find a template that's "close" to your idea, or hire someone to do it." The framework really doesn't matter. I've used the free wordpress themes twenty ten and twenty twelve and created amazing results, but you have to have knowledge of html/css.

    Here's a free resource to help you out if you're bent on doing it yourself. W3Schools Online Web Tutorials

    Aloha
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  • Profile picture of the author FostinWD
    In my opinion, you should learn to code if you aim to build really good quality staff.

    I would say try bootstrap and foundation, they are both responsive frameworks...
    Signature

    If you're going to tell members to check your signature, this is what they'll see.

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