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My pastor wants to pay me to build site for his business-what to charge?

by BeckyF3506
20 replies
  • WEB DESIGN
    • |
I created a small, simple WordPress website for our church, and maintain it on a volunteer basis.

Yesterday my pastor asked me if I'd build a website for the home inspection business he's starting, but he insists on paying me if I'll do it.

I make my own websites, but have never offered website building as a service. I've been reading around all morning, trying to figure out how much to charge, and all I've gotten is confused.

One woman in the business told me that she'd charge her clients around $2400. to build a site of this type, and $40. an hour for ongoing maintenance, but then somebody else told me that $1000. for the site and $25. an hour for ongoing maintenance would probably be more realistic. Since he's my pastor though, should I go down to $500. to do the site (or even less), and $25. an hour for maintenance? I have no idea.

He says he just wants a simple site, and I don't think it will have many pages, probably less than five. I'd have him sign up for his own hosting account, and purchase his own domain name so I wouldn't have to keep track of that every year.

I know he has a very tight budget too, which makes it harder to know what to charge. Maybe whatever we agree on for a price could be broken up into monthly payments to make it easier for him?

If you have any suggestions about how to figure out what to charge him, I'd appreciate them.

Thank you.
#build #businesswhat #charge #pastor #pay #site #website design pricing
  • Profile picture of the author bangtoob
    Great question!

    My rule of thumb whenever Im charging someone for a service is this math equation:

    Number of hours You think it will take X 3 X dollars/hour - Any discounts for being a friend or in this case a man of god :-)

    Generally though everything u think of in terms of hours of work will tAke 3 times as long due to under estimation and hours spent communicating with the client.

    And of course once you get the final number and it seems a bit high or low (usually depending on how much you like the project and person :-) drop the price or raise it accordingly.

    Unfortunately I cannot give you and exact number but this should get your estimation process close to accurate.

    If you need more details or help reply here and I'll so my best to help.
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    • Profile picture of the author BeckyF3506
      Thank you for the reply, Bangtoob, and I never thought about estimating a price using that formula, but it looks like it could come in handy.

      I'll see what I come up with this way.

      Thank you for your help.
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      • Profile picture of the author bangtoob
        Originally Posted by BeckyF3506 View Post

        Thank you for the reply, Bangtoob, and I never thought about estimating a price using that formula, but it looks like it could come in handy.

        I'll see what I come up with this way.

        Thank you for your help.
        Sure thing!
        I have been owner of my own recording studio for about 8 years and in charge of getting my own clients. This formula worked well for that. I have also done about 5 web designs as well.

        Generally the first few jobs you do will feel like you. Are charging too much. But soon enough you will understand why and raise your rates :-)

        This formula should get you in the ballpark and hopefully help you avoid some of the pain I had to go through lol

        Good luck! And have fun.
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        • Profile picture of the author BeckyF3506
          I just did a quick estimate using this formula.

          I *think* it would take me about 15 hours to do a site for him, times 3 equals 45 hours.

          I feel that $25. an hour would be a fair amount as a "friends and family" discount, so that would come to $1125.

          I could just round that down to $1000. for the site, and would feel like I wasn't gouging him, but yet it would be a decent hourly amount for me.

          You're right though--it DOES feel like an awful lot of money to charge, because I'm in the habit of doing this type of thing for free.

          Does $1000. for a simple WordPress website sound reasonable, or is that still way out of line?

          I'm just so afraid of charging too much, especially since he's my pastor.

          I guess it's a fine line between not wanting to charge too much, and charging so little that you don't really feel like working on the project.

          $500. is another possibility, but that feels like a bit too little for the work that would need to be done.
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          • Profile picture of the author kpmedia
            Originally Posted by BeckyF3506 View Post

            I'm just so afraid of charging too much, especially since he's my pastor. .
            Why does this matter? He'll be using whatever you make to make his money. I'm sure he's not thinking about you when he does that. He needs to make money, and a site is his expenses. He'd hire you to make a site, and you need to cover your time and expenses.

            I have custom "template" type sites that I'd do for $300 to $500. Swap out images, changes the colors, make few custom mods for the business, done. It still takes time, and these are themes I created, not some free crap or a $50 ThemeForest theme.

            For custom work, I charge hourly. It can be anywhere from $1k to $10k, depending on several factors. And yes, one of those factors is how much a client wants to micro-manage and make changes. It's their dollar, and I expect weekly payments when doing custom projects. None of that "paid when finished" BS.
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            • Profile picture of the author BeckyF3506
              Originally Posted by kpmedia View Post

              Why does this matter? He'll be using whatever you make to make his money. I'm sure he's not thinking about you when he does that. He needs to make money, and a site is his expenses. He'd hire you to make a site, and you need to cover your time and expenses.

              I have custom "template" type sites that I'd do for $300 to $500. Swap out images, changes the colors, make few custom mods for the business, done. It still takes time, and these are themes I created, not some free crap or a $50 ThemeForest theme.

              For custom work, I charge hourly. It can be anywhere from $1k to $10k, depending on several factors. And yes, one of those factors is how much a client wants to micro-manage and make changes. It's there dollar, and I expect weekly payments when doing custom projects. None of that "paid when finished" BS.
              Boy, these are good points to consider as well.

              I'm not a real web designer by any stretch. (Writing/blogging and digital art are more my areas.) I know enough to make websites that work for my purposes, and I learn more as I go along, but when somebody says they want to pay you to do a site, it becomes a whole different ball game.
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              • Profile picture of the author bangtoob
                I think $1,000 is fair.

                What is most important is that you clearly tell him what he gets for that price.

                Letting him know of all the benefits will let him know how much work you will be doing and make him feel like you know what you are doing and that you care.

                1. Tell him you plan on spending X amount of hours sitting with him designing a layout and content flow of the site (this could be a wire-frame software or a sheet of paper and a pencil
                2. ask him to gather hi resolution images and written content that he will be using for the site
                3. get him to pick a few color choices and possible font choices ahead of time (this will all change I'm sure but its good to take him along for the journey)
                4. plan for initial design and let him know how long it will probably take to get initial design
                5. give him certain opportunities along the way (time line) of when you will be at a point for him to check it and offer changes. (i would not give him access to the site until you feel you are on your way to success)

                These should help you control your client and keep them in the loop. I have found the more the client understands about the process the more they see it isn't as easy as a quick fix.

                Even a background color change will take 10 minutes minimum.
                - turn on computer
                - navigate to filezilla and the website
                - Firebug the color change
                - find in CSS document and change the setting
                - save
                - clear cache
                - review
                -Then write an email to client letting him know you finished it (or phone call)
                - if phone call happy talk about his kids or the church or other events coming up

                after a few phone calls and him gaining trust in your work, he will start to feel like you guys are fiends. Which means... he will spend your valuable time talking about his life and the super awsome plans he has for the website and his future, as well as the cool events he is throwing and or attending in the near future. all of this is good and necesarry when working with a client =-) BUT remember you will be spending your precious time... hence the X3 padding.'


                A quick glimpse into the reality of a client/service based small business.

                To summarize: As long as you keep him informed with the work you are doing and the skills you are using to get it done (that he doesn't have or else he would be building it), you will prove to him you are worth it and he wont feel cheated at the end.

                The times I did intensive work and didn't update the client regularly, they thought it was easy and didn't get why i charged so much. They never called me for work again =-)
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                • Profile picture of the author BeckyF3506
                  This is getting more complicated by the minute--no wonder I stick to my art, ha ha.

                  I know he won't want to micromanage this project because he wants as little as possible to do with it. He really doesn't have a whole lot of opinions on colors, fonts, page design, etc. The less he has to pay attention to it (as long as it looks decent, and functions), the happier he is because he's extremely busy.

                  I think what will happen is that he'll leave pretty much everything up to me, and after it's done, he might want to change a couple of things. He's easy enough to work with.

                  I had been planning to write him a long e-mail, detailing all that actually goes into getting a site up and running, even if it is simple. It's not something you can just slap up there, if you want it to be halfway-decent, that is.

                  I'm starting to see why, if I'm guessing I could do it in two full days, it might actually take five or six, so, Bangtoob, your way of estimating prices is pretty handy.

                  Another thing is, he doesn't know the difference between a free WordPress theme, or a paid one, and I'm sure he doesn't care, so if I use a free theme, would this make the price come down much further, as Nettiapina was mentioning?

                  It wouldn't really be a "template site", but wouldn't be fancy. Would that put it more in the $500. range, or does the theme not really have much bearing on prices, especially when the client has no preference anyway?

                  Would I be better off to ask him what he has in mind to spend on a website, instead of me worrying about what might be "too much"? Then if he says $200., I make a decision as to whether or not I want to spend the time and do the work for that little?
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  • Profile picture of the author nettiapina
    $500 for a simple template-based small business site might not be a bad deal, and you might actually get compensated for your work. I've actually promised to do a site for a local event for euro equivalent of that price, BUT they've got a graphic designer on top of that and their volunteers are completely building the contents by themselves. Also I knew how simple the system would be, and the technical heavy lifting was done the year before.

    You really need to interview the client and make sure you've got all the requirements down. Non-technical people often have no idea that "oh and I also need a shopping cart" can easily double the price. Unfortunately this evaluation is not the easiest thing to get right.
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    • Profile picture of the author kpmedia
      Originally Posted by nettiapina View Post

      $500 for a simple template-based small business site might not be a bad deal, and you might actually get compensated for your work. I've actually promised to do a site for a local event for euro equivalent of that price, BUT they've got a graphic designer on top of that and their volunteers are completely building the contents by themselves. Also I knew how simple the system would be, and the technical heavy lifting was done the year before.

      You really need to interview the client and make sure you've got all the requirements down. Non-technical people often have no idea that "oh and I also need a shopping cart" can easily double the price. Unfortunately this evaluation is not the easiest thing to get right.
      Yes, yes!

      The design of images (logos, etc) and content is the client's responsibility, beyond the site coding work.

      Depending on the topic, I may help (free or fee), but it's entirely my choice here. I do turn down a lot of work these days, from the "make me a site, k thankx" crowd. That's not my job to make a "site".

      Originally Posted by heckyes View Post

      . If he moans about 500, then come down to 400.
      Nope. If he wants to spend less, he has to pay for it in some way. One way I do this is to tell clients that *I* get to make some of the decisions on how it looks. If they want more say, then I get more pay.

      None of this discount = more work BS that happens far too often.

      The cheapest clients = the biggest PITA.
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      • Profile picture of the author BeckyF3506
        Originally Posted by kpmedia View Post

        Yes, yes!

        The design of images (logos, etc) and content is the client's responsibility, beyond the site coding work.

        Depending on the topic, I may help (free or fee), but it's entirely my choice here. I do turn down a lot of work these days, from the "make me a site, k thankx" crowd. That's not my job to make a "site".


        Nope. If he wants to spend less, he has to pay for it in some way. One way I do this is to tell clients that *I* get to make some of the decisions on how it looks. If they want more say, then I get more pay.

        None of this discount = more work BS that happens far too often.

        The cheapest clients = the biggest PITA.
        More food for thought!

        So that's a myth, that giving a large discount might end up bringing in more work?

        And that thing about the cheapest clients being the biggest PITA makes me think twice...
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  • Profile picture of the author Entrecon
    Do it for free.

    Set-up a contact/lead capture page and get a commission for every contract gained from the website.


    (I just figured I would throw that in to make your decision even more complicated)
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    • Profile picture of the author Kay King
      This is getting more complicated by the minute--
      Back to earth! He wants a simple site - I doubt it will take 15 hrs to build a simple site. He's not being picky about design or theme or colors so that makes it easier. What happens on the forum when you ask about pricing is that estimates on what you can charge go into the stratosphere.

      You are talking about using a free WP theme and he's paying for domain and hosting...so it's costing you only a day or two of time.

      He's your minister - he's starting a small business probably on a shoestring budget. If it were me I'd donate building a site for him or point him to Wix or similar place where he could build his own easily.
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      • Profile picture of the author nettiapina
        Originally Posted by Kay King View Post

        Back to earth! He wants a simple site - I doubt it will take 15 hrs to build a simple site.

        ...

        You are talking about using a free WP theme and he's paying for domain and hosting...so it's costing you only a day or two of time.
        "Simple site" is one of the most misleading phrases you hear in this business. Never assume that unless you've got the project sufficiently well explained in your offer and client has accepted the offer and the scope.

        I guess the pastor is a reasonable guy, and OP would work for free, so this isn't an issue, but... Small business owners are potentially problematic clients. They've got high expectations but no experience, and often not budget to cover what they want. That's lethal combination especially if you don't define the project scope.

        Also, two days of my time happens to be very close to 15h.

        point him to Wix or similar place
        That's actually good suggestion in my opinnion. And I build sites as my main job.
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        • Profile picture of the author BeckyF3506
          I think I just got my answer on whether or not to do this project for my pastor. When trying to change themes on our church website a few minutes ago, it messed up a bunch of stuff, and now I have a whole lot of work to do over. Hopefully I didn't wreck the whole site.

          This isn't my area of expertise. I do the best I can with the skills I have that have been sufficient for my own websites. I just don't want to be responsible for someone else's site.

          So I guess it will be thank you for thinking of me, but I'm going to pass...

          Thanks for all the replies on my thread.
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    • Profile picture of the author heckyes
      Hi - New here to Warrior Forum -

      I do freelancing all the time, usually for smaller businesses that just need something or a total update - I start with a minimum of $500 for a site and go from there. Get an idea of what their budget is and then factor that in with everything they want on the site. Price in design revisions if you're going to be doing anything really custom.

      Be sure to get some payment terms - half at the start, half at the completion. Work in how much support you'll offer when everything is finished before you kick in an hourly rate for changes.

      This is your pastor, he knows you and knows your work - if you treat him right then he'll likely give you a bunch of referrals and you'll be on your way.

      Another note on the pricing - factor in how much this cuts into your free time - are you married with a family, full-time job, long commute... if so then the pricing might go up because your spare time is more valuable. If you're growing your freelance work or doing this while having a part-time job - then that would also matter.
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      • Profile picture of the author BeckyF3506
        Wow, lots more stuff to think about--thanks for all the suggestions!

        Let's see, yes, I would do it for free for him, but he absolutely won't allow it.

        I'm an empty-nester who works from home selling printable wall art and collage sheets on Etsy, and designs on print on demand sites such as Cafe Press and Zazzle, so I could concentrate on his project and get it done probably within a couple of days, as a wild guess.

        After I do this site for him, I don't know if I'd want to try to make it into a business because I feel that there's still too much I don't know, but at the same time, if anybody else wanted me to make them a simple site, I probably wouldn't turn down the work.

        I wouldn't try to earn commissions from his leads, and wouldn't even use my affiliate links to send him for his web hosting or domain name purchases, even though somebody told me I should do that.

        I'm more of a creative person than a business person; that's why I always have a struggle when it comes to giving somebody prices. I'd rather do the work for free, but then others around me admonish me, and tell me that I "could have made some money" from whatever project is being discussed.

        Maybe I should just do it for $200 or $250, and maybe he'll like it enough to keep me in mind if he hears of somebody else who needs a simple site put up.

        So today I've gone all the way from $2400., which was the first price somebody suggested that I charge, all the way down to maybe a couple hundred dollars or so. I know that's getting into "my high school nephew could toss up a site for you" territory, but he is my pastor, and also friend.
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        • Profile picture of the author heckyes
          That's a good way to look at it and the point I was trying to make with your current situation. You want a few extra bucks? then keep it cheap.. is it a business you're trying to launch, then charge biz prices.. still, I'd call it $500 - that buffers in the updates you might make down the road and the "oh could you add one more thing?" before you launch. If he moans about 500, then come down to 400.
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          • Profile picture of the author BeckyF3506
            Originally Posted by heckyes View Post

            That's a good way to look at it and the point I was trying to make with your current situation. You want a few extra bucks? then keep it cheap.. is it a business you're trying to launch, then charge biz prices.. still, I'd call it $500 - that buffers in the updates you might make down the road and the "oh could you add one more thing?" before you launch. If he moans about 500, then come down to 400.
            This sounds like a very reasonable price. Thank you.
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