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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 12:11 PM   #1201
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Sorry to be soooo simple...Where is the report?
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 01:04 PM   #1202
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Originally Posted by beksworld View Post

I stumbled across this after searching CPA PPC for NEWBIES.....Please comment...
CASHTACTICS (dot) NET
The stuff at CashTactics is good (especially the case study, even though it's ****). Like most of the free stuff, it's very broad but can help you get things going.

That's Ralph Ruckman's (Ruck) old blog (runs Convert2Media - which, if you haven't visited their blog, contains tons of info on how to promote CPA with some really killer stuff in the Training Forum - all free).

Check out www.cdfnetworks.com and www.clickconsultants.com as well

The latest AC stuff (week 2), while thin on content in some areas, is starting to go in the right direction.

Just have to bide my time until they get to the scaling and business structure material - that is where I'm hoping to find the gold in this course.
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 01:17 PM   #1203
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Originally Posted by nobodyspecial View Post

Sure Toddie, some real numbers for you. Since signing up for AC I've ...

1) Launched a campaign with $30 payout on Dec. 14th. Tweaked on Dec 29th then scaled up last week after a valid sample of data for performance came in.

Here are the numbers from last week:



With a $30 payout, about $1250 profit plus 2% cash back on the adspend (which is about $15k/month).

2) Attended the Traffic University seminar

3) Requested and received two samples for new products I am launching next month

4) Requested a refund from AC

So I've done a little more than "complain" ....

Is that OK or should I continue?
It's always uplifting to read of people's successes.
Certainly works for me more than people's frustrations. I can just read my own head for that.
Obviously, those with a lot more experience in IM would definitely be disappointed in AC so far. Whether there are any true pearls at the end of this rainbow remains to be seen. I will say that for beginners, this has been very helpful for me.

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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 01:32 PM   #1204
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GREAT TIPS on ADCOPY today in week 2 for Arbitrage. They are showing some unique tips and tricks specifically regarding wording. I am feeling much better about this.
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 01:52 PM   #1205
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Originally Posted by beksworld View Post

GREAT TIPS on ADCOPY today in week 2 for Arbitrage. They are showing some unique tips and tricks specifically regarding wording. I am feeling much better about this.
Good to hear...I've only been through video 1 so far.

Thanks!
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 01:58 PM   #1206
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Thanks man! I appreciate all the help!! I was kind of wondering if reading the thread through would be educational or not for me



Originally Posted by tradermike2008 View Post

This thread is mainly consists of a few people bashing the arbitrage conspiracy launch and pointing out inconsistencies and sleaze in their sales process, unhappy customers, and a few affiliates who were saying anything to get people to sign up to so they would earn an affiliate commission. Not sure how much you would actually learn by going through this whole thread. The few bits of educational material have just started in the past few days so if you are looking for that I'd just look back the past few days to find it and not start from the beginning and go forward.
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 02:07 PM   #1207
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You have to ask yourself why every product promoted in these courses and examples (and I say that loosely) is for things like weight loss, zit cream, penis growth, bigger breasts, fewer wrinkles, the fountain of youth or a plethora of these type of products where results are thin and hopes high.

Stop looking for the Easy Button and create some value. You know why Google treats everyone like they're innocent until proven guilty? Because they have to spend a great deal of their resources policing people who can't control their greed impulses or have no interest in providing value of any kind.

I'm just giving them what they wannnnnnnnannt....blah, blah, blah. BS, you are most likely the same people who are now trying to convince the world you didn't know what you were signing when you bought the house you couldn't afford then and certainly cant afford now. - Boo hoo, that's what lawyers are for. You won't get a water molecule of sympathy from my eye especially now that I again have to pick up the pieces in your victim clamoring, irresponsible wake.

I find it humorous that so many people who know nothing about business are willing to waste time fighting the current and learning to game the system before they learn some principles they can actually build on - absolutely moronic.

My advice, stop dragging the rest of us down with this crapola. It's all the same. It has at its root the desire to make money at ANY cost. Create some value or get back to your Dilbert cube. I'm getting tired of the mistrust created by your layer of miscreant.
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 04:45 PM   #1208
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Originally Posted by jimrpips View Post


If you don't want to talk about AC, plenty of other threads. If you got ripped off buying herbal pecker-upper online, take it up with your doctor.
LLLLLLLLOOOOOOOOOOLLLLLLLL.......HAW, HAW, HAW....:-D

Or how about Herbal Ready-Freddy?

Now there's a AC Cpa campaign waiting to happen. :-D

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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 04:48 PM   #1209
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Originally Posted by simebern View Post

Adwords seems to be getting a much harder game to play these days..

[snip]

I think if too many people use the same displat URL your ad will not appear, but also what the hell do you put in place of it that reflects the landing page if you cant use the actual landing page!!!!????

HELP
From what I know (definitely not claiming to be an expert, just based on reading and my own experiences), I think you are right. I know the AC Boys are talking about "iframing" as a solution to this and they indicate instruction coming down the road.

I don't know if that counts as "help," but keep up the hard work and keep posting! Thanks for the data points.
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 04:58 PM   #1210
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I know it's early, and people are learning and getting their feet wet, but should'nt there be a decent amount of successes?

Even minimal profit, but something in the positive side of profit equation to see there is hope and validity to the information?

Even possibly MORE breakeven than losses, at worst?

Can't the most CRAPPIEST, SLIMEYEST course in history still have SOMEONE(s) make it a success?

Does THAT legitimize it as a decent and/or fair course and all others who failed simply are slackers?

Should'nt we see a fair test after maybe 2 or 3 months, after growing and learning pains are past?

And exactly what is the average standard of time for ppc and cpa learner/doer to know if its for you are not, wrong information or not?

How many FAIR successes should there be per customer purchase to say a course is decent, I wonder?

Going to be interesting for AC purchasers.

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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 05:02 PM   #1211
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From the results, so far, looks like a looooooooonnnnnnnnnggg way to $50,000- $100,000
days.....or even 1/50th of that.

We'll have to wait and see, I guess.

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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 05:11 PM   #1212
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Originally Posted by dkblair View Post


[snip]

I hope this is off some encouragement to others on this forum.

The main thing that it has proven too me is that internet marketing really works and you really make some serious money in this business, provided you think positive.

Sure the guys don't present well and have had poor customer service. But if I can't recoup the cost 10-20 times over, then there is something seriously wrong as its dead simple.

That's fantastic info, dkblair! Thanks for sharing that with us and congrats on your success. This is helpful and inspirational to all of us (well, me, anyway). :rolleyes:

My main gripe regarding AC goes to what you have done. It's clear you can making money in arbitrage. Cool. But what's also clear is that the people making money on it (like you) aren't doing it the AC way! So, as a wet-behind-the-ears noob who is trying to follow the course materials to the letter... well, you can understand why so many of us are dissatisfied, perplexed and downright sore?

Can I ask you... if you're not using Google, are you using Yahoo or MSN or...? I honestly don't know how you can get $.06-.12 clicks. Is that an exchange rate thing? Are you doing just Aussie offers?

It would be extremely helpful to me to know this on a number of fronts.

I've shied away from Yahoo based on the fact they don't allow direct linking (at least as I understand it), which is the whole point of what AC is teaching right now. Ironically, Ayman has also said that Yahoo accounts for "60 to 70%" of the business they do. But this was said in passing and he did not elaborate on how they do it since the course is currently focused on Adwords. Sigh.

Anyway, please keep posting and best of luck!
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 05:37 PM   #1213
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Originally Posted by The 13 th Warrior View Post

From the results, so far, looks like a looooooooonnnnnnnnnggg way to $50,000- $100,000
days.....or even 1/50th of that.
All simply a matter of scale.

200 Offers doing $500 a day. Or some other combination (some doing $500, some doing $50, Some doing $5000).

That's what these guys are doing. They have hundreds of campaigns going.

That's why the REAL value in this course is in their business structure and how they are managing all those campaigns. What are the jobs that they outsource, what those people do and how they fit in with the rest of the team.

Remains to be seen how detailed that particular information is but if they deliver big there, you can learn the rest of the material from any number of free or low cost sources.

Once you know the structure, how to scale and manage that scale, you have the keys to the kingdom. Not just in CPA but Affiliate Marketing as a whole.
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 05:41 PM   #1214
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Originally Posted by Mann View Post

I've shied away from Yahoo based on the fact they don't allow direct linking (at least as I understand it)
one word: iframe
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 06:23 PM   #1215
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Originally Posted by Mann View Post

Can I ask you... if you're not using Google, are you using Yahoo or MSN or...? I honestly don't know how you can get $.06-.12 clicks. Is that an exchange rate thing? Are you doing just Aussie offers?
Google, Yahoo, and MSN are NOT the only game in town. Granted the most popular/most used, but not the only source of PPC online. Do some searching, and you'll find a lot more, where clicks can be had for a fraction of the cost of the Big 3. Improves your margin.

You can focus your campaigns to specific regions; you're not limited to promoting only USA/Canada offers. Find at least one campaign for say... Australia ONLY, and try it.

The AC guys are right about one thing, cranking is the way. If you do 2 campaigns a day (like they REQUIRE), you'll take a long time to find your profitable campaign. If you do 5-10 DIFFERENT campaigns a day, you will find profit faster than you think. Ayman mentions in week 2 that it took him months (350) to find a nugget. Maybe your luck is that you are on that same path? I hope you aren't, but if you are, all I can say is this: GET TO 350 AS FAST AS YOU CAN! When you find that profitable campaign, your whole attitude/outlook will change. Promise.

For anyone without a domain trying to circumnavigate the direct linking, have you tried this: http://www.warriorforum.com/blogs/mi...your-blog.html

One word of caution:
Befriend your AMs, but DO NOT share your profitable campaign info with them. If you can, DO NOT send keywords using SubIDs. They are in this business to make money and will steal your profitable setups faster than you can blink. Ever think why all these CPA networks let you sign up for free? You are providing them with a valuable service: you're performing the (tedious and expensive) footwork of finding what works to make a profit. Once you find the keyword/AdCopy/PPC Network that makes a profit (resulting in a noticeable commission to you) they will use their established tracking systems to steal that info and make their own profit.
See... if they're giving you a $2.00 commission, the CPA network is probably getting a $2.50-$3.00 commission directly from the merchant. So, why give you 75%+ of their profit, when they can get 100% by simply using your hard work?
Please keep this in mind!!

STILL buzzin' [8D]
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 06:31 PM   #1216
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RE The $2k tuition: Forget the dollar amount. It could be $5000 or $499 what matters is that it made me (and others) take action... I am now extremely invested and I'll be damned if I waste $2,000... I will make this shit work if it kills me trying.

For those who aren't seeing any success: I again revert to the gym analogy... If you are fat and you go to the gym a couple of times, you will not be skinny! You might even go for a month but if you are not eating right, and exercising right you will still be fat! It's a formula...

I agree with a previous post that the real meat of this program will come when these guys reveal how they exploded their business. I was in the mortgage business for 11 years and the difference between the guys making $80k a year and $1.5M a year was not so much in their closing techniques or their sales pitch or even their connections it was all in their system... The AC guys obviously have a system that I want to emulate.

Never Ever Doubt the Power of a Positive Attitude and an Extreme Will to Succeed!
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 06:32 PM   #1217
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Originally Posted by buzzword View Post

Google, Yahoo, and MSN are NOT the only game in town. Granted the most popular/most used, but not the only source of PPC online. Do some searching, and you'll find a lot more, where clicks can be had for a fraction of the cost of the Big 3. Improves your margin.

You can focus your campaigns to specific regions; you're not limited to promoting only USA/Canada offers. Find at least one campaign for say... Australia ONLY, and try it.

The AC guys are right about one thing, cranking is the way. If you do 2 campaigns a day (like they REQUIRE), you'll take a long time to find your profitable campaign. If you do 5-10 DIFFERENT campaigns a day, you will find profit faster than you think. Ayman mentions in week 2 that it took him months (350) to find a nugget. Maybe your luck is that you are on that same path? I hope you aren't, but if you are, all I can say is this: GET TO 350 AS FAST AS YOU CAN! When you find that profitable campaign, your whole attitude/outlook will change. Promise.
Excellent post so far, anyone doing 350 campaigns is going to succeed no matter if they bought the course or not.

Originally Posted by buzzword View Post

One word of caution:
Befriend your AMs, but DO NOT share your profitable campaign info with them. If you can, DO NOT send keywords using SubIDs. They are in this business to make money and will steal your profitable setups faster than you can blink. Ever think why all these CPA networks let you sign up for free? You are providing them with a valuable service: you're performing the (tedious and expensive) footwork of finding what works to make a profit. Once you find the keyword/AdCopy/PPC Network that makes a profit (resulting in a noticeable commission to you) they will use their established tracking systems to steal that info and make their own profit.
See... if they're giving you a $2.00 commission, the CPA network is probably getting a $2.50-$3.00 commission directly from the merchant. So, why give you 75%+ of their profit, when they can get 100% by simply using your hard work?
Please keep this in mind!!
Then your post fell apart. LEGIT CPA networks are NOT out to steal your campaigns. This tinfoil hat b.s. is ridiculous. If a network is stealing campaigns, they won't be a network for long because the affiliate will squeal like a pig, (and rightly so). They're not interested in taking over your profitable campaign because they have 1,000's of other affiliates doing profitable campaigns with them and some are doing MASSIVE numbers. They get a piece of every affiliate so why would they ever risk that just to steal a profitable campaign? Any network with a fraction of a brain wouldn't do this. There is way too much at risk to take your profitable campaign, way too much. I do agree that there might be the odd unscrupulous affiliate manager that comes along once in a while, but they would be fired immediately if they did this, (with a legit network anyway.)

Sorry, but I've seen that line of thinking show up too often and it's just not true for 99% of the networks out there.

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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 06:44 PM   #1218
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From Success to Sucksass!

I am running a zip submit that was doing about $30 per day at a $.54 eCPC then all of sudden it started to drop and today it is down to $.04 and I haven’t made any adjustments... what gives?
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 07:29 PM   #1219
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Originally Posted by PPC-Coach View Post

Then your post fell apart. LEGIT CPA networks are NOT out to steal your campaigns. This tinfoil hat b.s. is ridiculous. If a network is stealing campaigns, they won't be a network for long because the affiliate will squeal like a pig, (and rightly so). They're not interested in taking over your profitable campaign because they have 1,000's of other affiliates doing profitable campaigns with them and some are doing MASSIVE numbers. They get a piece of every affiliate so why would they ever risk that just to steal a profitable campaign? Any network with a fraction of a brain wouldn't do this. There is way too much at risk to take your profitable campaign, way too much. I do agree that there might be the odd unscrupulous affiliate manager that comes along once in a while, but they would be fired immediately if they did this, (with a legit network anyway.)

Sorry, but I've seen that line of thinking show up too often and it's just not true for 99% of the networks out there.
Say what you will, but IT HAPPENS! Yes, stupid to outright take your winning combination and play it themselves. But, piggyback off of your find? Gonna do it! Sorry. You can deny it all you want. Still gonna happen.

I wouldn't want anyone to get stung by being oblivious to this. My suggestion: Find a winning offer. Instead of ramping it up with the same CPA network, find the same offer on a separate network or two and spread the success around so you stay below the radar.

Just like the previous post... what you think happened there? Just out of the blue? Sure!

STILL buzzin' [8D]
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 08:24 PM   #1220
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Originally Posted by digabot View Post

All simply a matter of scale.

That's why the REAL value in this course is in their business structure and how they are managing all those campaigns. What are the jobs that they outsource, what those people do and how they fit in with the rest of the team.
Yeah, I agree. I think their heart is in it but just handling 2500 new and cranky customers may be a bit much for them? They seem really genuine, but just incompetent at putting on the show. It's probably their first run at it, and maybe they bit more than they can chew. Dunno. My (revised) impression is not to lynch them quite yet but to give them slack and wait and learn the 13 weeks. Going after your favorite Greed******* Guru may not do anything, they have much thicker skins and a lot of KARMA coming to them. IMHO.

Now to FYI ...

1. Do Google image search for "Aymen+affspy" to see pix of the Aymen and Affspy boys

2. Jerry West (from Stompernet gang...yes, from Brad Fallon's posse) is taking the contrarian view to AC ("don't buy it!!!" Too late Jerry.) and you might want to sign up to his free CPA course that seems to interject very sober experience into the business of CPA networks. Here are some samplings: 35% of leads never get paid. You will lose $5,000 initially. Then there's Amit's advice to go broad BEFORE you go deep. Guaher Chandhry, who got "pissed" because Aymen reveals the "Alexa strategy" in AC, says that doing $75K a month is doable (once you learn the system). Good enough for me.

3. Very positively impressed by the CPA networks themselves. Not bad. They seem helpful (vested interest, for sure, but still), one of them even has a (near) real-time offer Twitter feed, that's really cool: twitter.com/maxbounty. Wish they all would do it. Another advised now that all the lemmings have moved to "****", they've left a gaping hole elsewhere. Machiavellian manipulation of newbies or genuine advice. Dunno.

4. I got a notice of week 2 posted stuff, let's do it.

karmapoolcleaner We're all flying through space in Orion Spur, a minor spiral arm of the Milky Way galaxy, at combined orbital speeds of probably around 600 kilometers a second. Let's make it fun ride. No victory is worth celebrating if it is at the expense of your fellow man. There's no glory in taking advantage of people's ignorance, stupidity or even their greed to make a buck.
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 08:58 PM   #1221
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PPC is a tough road. It seems like one of those things that you either have a knack for or don't. PPC kicks my a$$ every time. The only success I have with Adsense is promoting my own website for an offline business I have. That works great. But affiliate programs with adsense. It's a losing game for me.

Jonathan

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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 09:29 PM   #1222
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It just makes zero business sense to steal campaigns from affiliates and to suggest that networks do that is painting everyone with a pretty broad stroke.
Originally Posted by buzzword View Post

Just like the previous post... what you think happened there? Just out of the blue? Sure!
He got scrubbed. It wasn't the network stealing his campaign, it wasn't the network screwing him over, the merchant turned up the scrubber on the email addresses being submitted. They can set the dial to go a day back up to a year back searching for duplicates. Typically merchants will accept a lot of emails in the beginning, see how the traffic converts, then decide whether they want more from that affiliate or not based on conversions. I really hope the course is going to cover scrubbing in detail, because zip and email submits get hit HARD by this daily.

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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 10:20 PM   #1223
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RE The $2k tuition: Forget the dollar amount. It could be $5000 or $499 what matters is that it made me (and others) take action... I am now extremely invested and I'll be damned if I waste $2,000... I will make this shit work if it kills me trying.

BY GOLLY, I THINK YOU'VE JUST MADE A PRETTY DAMN GOOD POINT!

No, Seriously....I am the type that goes from one frolicking $97 report to another. Ever since Arbitrage, I have not even flinched before deleting the spam emails I get regarding the next big gig.

Thanks for the insight!...

ALSO: PPC-COACH is in the house!

I even signed up with PPC-COACH today. I am GLAD I did that, I have a feeling I wont be hanging around here as often.

Aww shucks, who am I foolin'? Im as hooked to this thread as you are, maybe moreso!
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 10:31 PM   #1224
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Originally Posted by PPC-Coach View Post

LEGIT CPA networks are NOT out to steal your campaigns..
So you're saying that the in house PPC teams at some networks don't benefit from the info you send via your campaigns? I don't know about that. Maybe not stealing but they sure as hell get ideas if you send your sources/keywords.

It's really no different than the d-bag spy platforms where tons of other affiliates WILL outright steal your campaigns. I'd be more worried about that.

What they will do however is give your winning campaigns to their "super affiliates" (if they aren't running it already) to get more volume (especially if you've found a winner that no one else is promoting but you don't have the $$$ to move big volume).

You must hide your traffic. There is no reason for a network to see your traffic sources. The traffic you send either converts or it doesn't and the merchant either wants it or they don't. They should deal with you based on that.

I really hope they cover scrubbing too because having the old "scrub dial" is a scary thing for affiliates.

Just like when one network promises you higher payouts to come to run offers for them but then they just scrub you enough so they maintain their margins and you don't make any more money - but they get your business.

That's why a lot of big time players in CPA who've been affiliates are setting up their own networks.
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 10:39 PM   #1225
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Originally Posted by PPC-Coach View Post

It just makes zero business sense to steal campaigns from affiliates and to suggest that networks do that is painting everyone with a pretty broad stroke.

He got scrubbed...
Never said EVERYONE does it. Never said YOUR site does.

I simply said "Say what you will, but IT HAPPENS!". Would you not agree your CPA affiliates should use some method to include anonymity in their keywords?

By the way, PPC-Coach, did you know that clicking the link in your signature produces this:

"Reported Attack Site!

This web site at 220.196.59.23 has been reported as an attack site and has been blocked based on your security preferences.

Attack sites try to install programs that steal private information, use your computer to attack others, or damage your system.

Some attack sites intentionally distribute harmful software, but many are compromised without the knowledge or permission of their owners."


Thought you might want to know. I was actually gonna check out your sites.

STILL buzzin' [8D]
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 10:46 PM   #1226
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Becksworld: You sound like me. I'm just like you! I leap from offer to offer, and salivate over the endless promises of the rosetta stone of affiliate marketing. Yet, The "AC", too, has truly inspired me, galore. I've taken action for the first time - in a long time.
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 10:49 PM   #1227
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Originally Posted by buzzword View Post

Never said EVERYONE does it. Never said YOUR site does.

I simply said "Say what you will, but IT HAPPENS!". Would you not agree your CPA affiliates should use some method to include anonymity in their keywords?

By the way, PPC-Coach, did you know that clicking the link in your signature produces this:

"Reported Attack Site!

This web site at 220.196.59.23 has been reported as an attack site and has been blocked based on your security preferences.

Attack sites try to install programs that steal private information, use your computer to attack others, or damage your system.

Some attack sites intentionally distribute harmful software, but many are compromised without the knowledge or permission of their owners."


Thought you might want to know. I was actually gonna check out your sites.
His site is not at that IP. That IP is for a site in *China*. You've got a trojan/virus on your pc hijacking some of your links. You need to run a good spyware remover right away.
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 10:54 PM   #1228
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Originally Posted by karmapoolcleaner View Post

Now to FYI ...

1. Do Google image search for "Aymen+affspy" to see pix of the Aymen and Affspy boys
Aymen is very handsome in a "geeky" sorta, kinda way. His smile is infectious, and you can sense his enthusiasm over the video. Nice find.

Does anyone know what's the scoop on his marital status? I go to Beauty School in the US, and I'll lather him up, real nicely.

*wink*
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 11:03 PM   #1229
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Originally Posted by jhiggins View Post

PPC is a tough road. It seems like one of those things that you either have a knack for or don't. PPC kicks my a$$ every time. The only success I have with Adsense is promoting my own website for an offline business I have. That works great. But affiliate programs with adsense. It's a losing game for me.

Jonathan
I think you meant Adwords? I assume so.

I've been in sales since 10, and I can't think of a stupider, more hostile selling environment than PPC. It's a party where the only girl in town invites every horny bloke in town into the same room, all wanting to get lucky. With PPC, you spend probably 70-90% of your effort and money to COMBAT the other guys rather than courting the girl. You ain't selling when you're fighting with the other boys. It's hostile selling.

You gotta control your own selling environment. Make apples-to-apples comparison impossible. Up your offer so that you appear the only boy in town. Read Elmer Wheeler's Sentences That Sell. Learn about (cognitive/emotional) buying triggers. Try to squeeze emotion into it. People buy on emotion and justify with logic. The words (and their semantic cloud) you use are critical, here's why ..

Your brain has a pre-attentive visual selector mechanism that "looks" at the page about 500 msec before you become conscious what you are looking at. Your brain sees the page half-a-second before you do. It then sends your eyeballs to look at some part of the page. Say his search is for "****" (that's what's now in loaded into his semantic / cognitive search mechanism). Google "****", and you'll see that the word **** appears some 60+ times on page one above fold. How is his pre-attentive system going to respond? It gets screwed. Which link do I click so I don't waste my time? Bad, bad scene for selling. No wonder click-thrus are 2-3%. Too many choices for the visitor.

Step back from the Wonderful World of Goigle: There are about 9,500,000 millionaires in the world. Of those, how many do you think made their millions mastering PPC? Yeah, Sergey and Larry. The rest of them used traditional marketing methods. I showed one tactic to Aymen, and he told me to test it. Since then, a far better system has come to light. PM and I'll explain how to reach 500,000-1.5 million with CPM around ¢6-¢58. Good for CJ, CB products with CPA offers sprinkled throughout.

karmapoolcleaner We're all flying through space in Orion Spur, a minor spiral arm of the Milky Way galaxy, at combined orbital speeds of probably around 600 kilometers a second. Let's make it fun ride. No victory is worth celebrating if it is at the expense of your fellow man. There's no glory in taking advantage of people's ignorance, stupidity or even their greed to make a buck.
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 11:22 PM   #1230
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Originally Posted by dkblair View Post

Ok First post here. I've seen alot of negativity about this course, but I was given a very strong referral from someone who knows these guys. And I trust his judgement.

A couple of test campaigns that are doing well for me in the last 7 days, which will be ramped up

1) Spent $12.00, sales $92.00
2) Spent $2.47 sales $21.00
3) Spent $300, sales $400
4) Spent $10.00, sales $33.00
5) Spent $10.11, sales $18.00
6) Spent 0.60, sales $10.00

A few more have broken even, (about 10-15 campaigns) the ones that don't work are dumped.

And I'm a dumb aussie who has only been doing internet marketing since September 08.

I am promoting offers from 9 different CPA companies and none rejected me.

I dont use Google. I wouldn't even consider it for a test campaign. Even I was suprised they had this on the video.

As far as I'm concerned it works, and I will be pushing hard to adding a few zero's on the numbers above.

Most of my conversions come from $0.06 - $0.12 cents a click.

I hope this is off some encouragement to others on this forum.

The main thing that it has proven too me is that internet marketing really works and you really make some serious money in this business, provided you think positive.

Sure the guys don't present well and have had poor customer service. But if I can't recoup the cost 10-20 times over, then there is something seriously wrong as its dead simple.
You must be in a different course from the one I'm taking!

So, you're saying we shoudn't be so negative toward the course because if we sign up for the course and don't do anything they say and instead use some unnamed ad center besides google and select offers that are nothing like the ones they told us to select, then we will be sucessful.

Somehow I can't seem to replicate those results.
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Unread 13th Jan 2009, 11:51 PM   #1231
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Originally Posted by digabot View Post



That's what these guys are doing. They have hundreds of campaigns going.

That's why the REAL value in this course is in their business structure and how they are managing all those campaigns. What are the jobs that they outsource, what those people do and how they fit in with the rest of the team.

Remains to be seen how detailed that particular information is but if they deliver big there, you can learn the rest of the material from any number of free or low cost sources.

Once you know the structure, how to scale and manage that scale, you have the keys to the kingdom. Not just in CPA but Affiliate Marketing as a whole.
Now thats a very interesting perspective. Business Structure, taking what works to the next level, professional level. Courses that have outsourcing methods or scale up methods once something is proven to work is where the course pays for itself multiple times( if course works).


Originally Posted by buzzword View Post


One word of caution:
Befriend your AMs, but DO NOT share your profitable campaign info with them. If you can, DO NOT send keywords using SubIDs. They are in this business to make money and will steal your profitable setups faster than you can blink. Ever think why all these CPA networks let you sign up for free? You are providing them with a valuable service: you're performing the (tedious and expensive) footwork of finding what works to make a profit. Once you find the keyword/AdCopy/PPC Network that makes a profit (resulting in a noticeable commission to you) they will use their established tracking systems to steal that info and make their own profit.
See... if they're giving you a $2.00 commission, the CPA network is probably getting a $2.50-$3.00 commission directly from the merchant. So, why give you 75%+ of their profit, when they can get 100% by simply using your hard work?
Please keep this in mind!!
Would like more PPC/CPA people to chime in on this one. PPC Coach had some valid points against this arguement....but, I wonder, even if they continued to pay you as agreed and promised, whats to stop them from DUPLICATING the thousands of campaign information they are sent? They can still pay you as promised AND earn some extra from your hard earned information. They continue to pay you, so where is it unethical or damage to take and use the campaign information you send them? CAN they diminish or damage your profitable campaign by duplicating it??....and if not duplicating it, use the information to come up with a proven keywords and such for their personal campaign? They still pay you PLUS make extra on the side, thanks to your researched information.




Originally Posted by karmapoolcleaner View Post


2. Jerry West (from Stompernet gang...yes, from Brad Fallon's posse) is taking the contrarian view to AC ("don't buy it!!!" Too late Jerry.) and you might want to sign up to his free CPA course that seems to interject very sober experience into the business of CPA networks.
As I said on another thread, this dude bat a thousand right out the box with his first letter of the course. This guy presents VERY sobering, realistic information, practical and , so far, totally free of hype and hyperbole. Very few present information in the fashion he presents, very, very few.


Originally Posted by digabot View Post


I really hope they cover scrubbing too because having the old "scrub dial" is a scary thing for affiliates.

Just like when one network promises you higher payouts to come to run offers for them but then they just scrub you enough so they maintain their margins and you don't make any more money - but they get your business.

That's why a lot of big time players in CPA who've been affiliates are setting up their own networks.
Yeah, thats a good question, how many big time players out of how many start to set up their own networks and why? Should'nt they be happy with the money they making and if not, why not? Why set up a new network?



Originally Posted by karmapoolcleaner View Post


I've been in sales since 10, and I can't think of a stupider, more hostile selling environment than PPC. It's a party where the only girl in town invites every horny bloke in town into the same room, all wanting to get lucky. With PPC, you spend probably 70-90% of your effort and money to COMBAT the other guys rather than courting the girl. You ain't selling when you're fighting with the other boys. It's hostile selling.

You gotta control your own selling environment. Make apples-to-apples comparison impossible. Up your offer so that you appear the only boy in town. Read Elmer Wheeler's Sentences That Sell. Learn about (cognitive/emotional) buying triggers. Try to squeeze emotion into it. People buy on emotion and justify with logic. The words (and their semantic cloud) you use are critical, here's why ..

Your brain has a pre-attentive visual selector mechanism that "looks" at the page about 500 msec before you become conscious what you are looking at. Your brain sees the page half-a-second before you do. It then sends your eyeballs to look at some part of the page. Say his search is for "****" (that's what's now in loaded into his semantic / cognitive search mechanism). Google "****", and you'll see that the word **** appears some 60+ times on page one above fold. How is his pre-attentive system going to respond? It gets screwed. Which link do I click so I don't waste my time? Bad, bad scene for selling. No wonder click-thrus are 2-3%. Too many choices for the visitor.

Step back from the Wonderful World of Goigle: There are about 9,500,000 millionaires in the world. Of those, how many do you think made their millions mastering PPC? Yeah, Sergey and Larry. The rest of them used traditional marketing methods. I showed one tactic to Aymen, and he told me to test it. Since then, a far better system has come to light. PM and I'll explain how to reach 500,000-1.5 million with CPM around ¢6-¢58. Good for CJ, CB products with CPA offers sprinkled throughout.
Now here is very interesting perspective of PPC. Money spent combating other PPC'ers vs courting the girl(customer).

You sound like a very experienced marketer. You do what successful marketers do AND at the same time do what very few marketer do or key in on. A very fresh perspective.

Very top marketers and some legends, the hype free, sober ones, have this view and perspective of real world marketing. One dude even avoids a lot of stuff added on his page, even if its the newest craze, bells ,whistles, graphics,etc.,because anything that slows down the loading of the page and detracts from what the customer wants is considered bad for conversion. One of his main philosophies of marketing is NEVER confuse the customer, don't give him a reason to click "off" the page, get the customer what he wants as fast as possible.

Good contribution.


Scrubbing and Business Structure have been brought up and seem to be very high bullet points and key elements to take a foward motion in this business and move to the next level.

The 13 th Warrior
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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 12:03 AM   #1232
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Originally Posted by Lance K View Post

Well, if you would take all the facts into account it wouldn't sound so ridiculous.

30 day guarantee

Course starts 26 days after launch

If you bought launch day...you have a 4 day guarantee. Even though you bought during the launch and helped carry momentum. But the people who joined the day before the course will get to evaluate the first 4 weeks. The people who helped AC the most by joining during the launch are essentially BEING PUNISHED! These folks are completely clueless on a number of things when it comes to business sense. Regardless of their CPA knowledge.
If they don't give you a refund, why not call your credit card company to get your money back via chargeback?

Your Business Success (YBS) Formula | FREE 55-page eBook.
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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 12:16 AM   #1233
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not bad in my opinion.
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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 01:26 AM   #1234
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A lot of crap so far, you can get 99% the info presented in week 1-2 for FREE on the internet from a thousand websites of hundreds of free ebooks!, don't expect to see any secrets revealled until 30 days after the doors closed!
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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 03:58 AM   #1235
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Originally Posted by RichS View Post

Somehow I can't seem to replicate those results.
ROTFLMAO!

Right on brother!
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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 06:06 AM   #1236
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Originally Posted by RichS View Post

You must be in a different course from the one I'm taking!

So, you're saying we shoudn't be so negative toward the course because if we sign up for the course and don't do anything they say and instead use some unnamed ad center besides google and select offers that are nothing like the ones they told us to select, then we will be sucessful.

Somehow I can't seem to replicate those results.
Sorry Rich that you misunderstood me. The answer too your question has been answered here several time. Someone said Google is not the be all and end all and they are right. Have you tried Yahoo and MSN? Ask Jeeves?
As I said, I was suprised that they said to do trial offers on Google as I tried that a month ago and it was encouraging, but I don't like to lose money!!!
Aymen said the same thing in the first teleseminar, there is another world besides google.

Someone asked how I get 6-10 cents per click - long tail.

And whilst I live in Australia, I don't bother with local offers to test as traffic is too small.

How do you reply to a private message on this damn forum!

Wouldnt let me do it because I've made 15 posts or less, so I apologize to Steve!!
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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 06:49 AM   #1237
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When you get the basics honed you can get into popunders, CPV, seo and a myriad of other traffic methods including Video to CPA etc.....

The first few weeks are about the mechanics and understanding the background to this.

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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 07:08 AM   #1238
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Add me to the list of requested refunds. I had two support tickets unanswered for nearly one week, they speak really fast which is ok but if you are offering a step-by-step program you need to slow down and really walk a newbie through it. (ie) Michael Cheney's Golden Thread Program was really well done and these guys would have done well to get some advice from Michael. The failed webinar shouldn't have happened, then it took 2 days to get it into the members area. Then on Monday when week 2 was meant to start at 4pm EST it still wasn't available. What gives? I want to believe they are not scam artists and that they just weren't ready but it seems like a real botch up to me all the way around. Requested a refund on the 12th - still haven't seen it......
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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 09:45 AM   #1239
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Here is a list of what I don't like about the course so far:

1. They are asking us to do things that they have clearly said they don't do any more, like direct linking, how ridiculous is that!
2. They said in the sales pictch that this absolutley not an advanced training PPC course, but clearly that is what you need to make this work
3. They keep refering back to what they did when they got started 3 years ago, well things are different now, what worked then no longer works
4. They have not anwered 2 support tickets in over 2 weeks, one asking for some carification about the #2 guarantee
5. They keep using google as the example even though it's the hardest SE to run ads
6. The pdf files they post for the lessions are 1-2 pages and contain almost no info
7. Only two of the super bonuses have been given out and after a little research it seems like you can get most of these for free anyway from other sources
8. Most of the content to date is public info, even the google help tells you how to set up your ad campaign very clearly
9. Reading between the line it sounds like they have millions of keywords, use a lot of fancy tools to build custom landing pages for each word etc, yet in the sales pitch it sounded all so simple, I think the writing is on the wall, simple no longer works in PPC

I simply don't trust these guys anymore to honor the #2 guarantee, and don't intend to have to face the prospect of meeting their very lose and poorley defined gurantee requirements

In a nut shell I gave it a shot but have been VERY disapointed with the content, I just think what other high quality couses I could buy with the $2K when I get the refund, I'll hang in until my day 28
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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 10:28 AM   #1240
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Originally Posted by kenwarrior View Post

Here is a list of what I don't like about the course so far:

1. They are asking us to do things that they have clearly said they don't do any more, like direct linking, how ridiculous is that!
2. They said in the sales pictch that this absolutley not an advanced training PPC course, but clearly that is what you need to make this work
3. They keep refering back to what they did when they got started 3 years ago, well things are different now, what worked then no longer works
4. They have not anwered 2 support tickets in over 2 weeks, one asking for some carification about the #2 guarantee
5. They keep using google as the example even though it's the hardest SE to run ads
6. The pdf files they post for the lessions are 1-2 pages and contain almost no info
7. Only two of the super bonuses have been given out and after a little research it seems like you can get most of these for free anyway from other sources
8. Most of the content to date is public info, even the google help tells you how to set up your ad campaign very clearly
9. Reading between the line it sounds like they have millions of keywords, use a lot of fancy tools to build custom landing pages for each word etc, yet in the sales pitch it sounded all so simple, I think the writing is on the wall, simple no longer works in PPC

I simply don't trust these guys anymore to honor the #2 guarantee, and don't intend to have to face the prospect of meeting their very lose and poorley defined gurantee requirements

In a nut shell I gave it a shot but have been VERY disapointed with the content, I just think what other high quality couses I could buy with the $2K when I get the refund, I'll hang in until my day 28
I agree 100%, Kenwarrior.

I take some comfort from their "Money Back + $500" if you haven't at least made enough profit to cover the cost of the course, provided you've created an average of 2 new campaigns per day.

But, having said that, at the moment, there seems little point banging my head against a brick wall every day trying to implement the strategies they have taught us so far, when they clearly DO NOT WORK anymore. It's quite simply throwing good money away.

*IF* I decide to see the course thru (decision within next 7 days), I will play "catch-up" with the campaign setups once we've got something that might yield some results.

Btw, I have support tickets outstanding from before Xmas - so I wouldn't hold your breath. I have got to such a point of frustration with the lack of any kind of response, that I'm sending copies directly to Aymen's email - not that it's made any difference.

Right. Enough negativity. I'm off to do something constructive...
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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 10:29 AM   #1241
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Originally Posted by Spamalot View Post

Aymen is very handsome in a "geeky" sorta, kinda way. His smile is infectious, and you can sense his enthusiasm over the video. Nice find.

Does anyone know what's the scoop on his marital status? I go to Beauty School in the US, and I'll lather him up, real nicely.

*wink*
What are you 13? How about a little control over your hormones.
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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 10:31 AM   #1242
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Originally Posted by kenwarrior View Post

Here is a list of what I don't like about the course so far:

1. They are asking us to do things that they have clearly said they don't do any more, like direct linking, how ridiculous is that!
2. They said in the sales pictch that this absolutley not an advanced training PPC course, but clearly that is what you need to make this work
3. They keep refering back to what they did when they got started 3 years ago, well things are different now, what worked then no longer works
4. They have not anwered 2 support tickets in over 2 weeks, one asking for some carification about the #2 guarantee
5. They keep using google as the example even though it's the hardest SE to run ads
6. The pdf files they post for the lessions are 1-2 pages and contain almost no info
7. Only two of the super bonuses have been given out and after a little research it seems like you can get most of these for free anyway from other sources
8. Most of the content to date is public info, even the google help tells you how to set up your ad campaign very clearly
9. Reading between the line it sounds like they have millions of keywords, use a lot of fancy tools to build custom landing pages for each word etc, yet in the sales pitch it sounded all so simple, I think the writing is on the wall, simple no longer works in PPC

I simply don't trust these guys anymore to honor the #2 guarantee, and don't intend to have to face the prospect of meeting their very lose and poorley defined gurantee requirements

In a nut shell I gave it a shot but have been VERY disapointed with the content, I just think what other high quality couses I could buy with the $2K when I get the refund, I'll hang in until my day 28
The biggest aspect of what I can have empathy for you, Ken, is the inability to get support on your questions for the course.
Getting answers to your questions is CRITICAL in an arena as complicated as CPA.
One of the smartest things I did was to use James Schramko's affiliate link to get into this course. He is not paying me to say this; I only do so because I want to validate what he's doing in the forum I'm now a member of. I want him to continue with the high level of support that he and Andy have given us as members of the forum. One of the reasons James is now largely absent from this discussion is that he is devoting all of his energies to those who had faith in him, and ordered the course through him
I would MUCH rather have my forum membership than some of the kickback refunds and other silly "bonuses" from other gurus that other affiliates were offering. Because what I also agree with, Ken, is that most of these "bonuses" can be found in other areas of the Internet b/c what they are is basically opt-in pieces of cheese.

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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 10:55 AM   #1243
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Originally Posted by jjjt View Post

I take some comfort from their "Money Back + $500" if you haven't at least made enough profit to cover the cost of the course, provided you've created an average of 2 new campaigns per day.
Think about what you're saying.

If you were to do an average of 2 campaigns per day for 12 weeks that's 168 campaigns. If you used only $30 to test each offer (which is WAY too low to get any meaningful data in most cases) and didn't make any money, you would be down $5040 - not to mention a huge chunk of your time.

So even with their guarantee, you'll be out a couple of grand MINIMUM.

They know that 90% of the people in the course won't do the work anyway so it's a low risk guarantee for them.
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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 11:08 AM   #1244
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You got to laught, in one of the week 2 videos the guy actually said...

"...in this video I'm going to answer most of your questions err hum and if your question is not answered err hum try and work it out yourself err hum and send in your question again err hum... "
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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 11:53 AM   #1245
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Originally Posted by kenwarrior View Post

"...in this video I'm going to answer most of your questions ...
Yeah, and "We get 500 Questions each week"...

AND ANSWER 5!


Does anyone else think that Week 2 is basically 90% of the same information as Week 1 but just worded differently?

And...

WTF is up with their support? Worse than I've seen for a $97 product let alone $2000
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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 11:54 AM   #1246
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Sybiz ; Mann ; beksworld ; jimrpips ; Spamalot ;

AMAZING FORUM RESTRICTION:
Dang, apparently I can't reply to your PMs until I have 15 posts. LOL. Send your email link to kumpunen at Gee Mail, you know the one that Sergey and Larry put up and I'll get back to you (apparently not allowed links either until your 15 posts).

karmapoolcleaner We're all flying through space in Orion Spur, a minor spiral arm of the Milky Way galaxy, at combined orbital speeds of probably around 600 kilometers a second. Let's make it fun ride. No victory is worth celebrating if it is at the expense of your fellow man. There's no glory in taking advantage of people's ignorance, stupidity or even their greed to make a buck.
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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 12:57 PM   #1247
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TOddieM
Is there is cance to join James Schramko's forum?

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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 01:00 PM   #1248
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Originally Posted by James Schramko View Post

When you get the basics honed you can get into popunders, CPV, seo and a myriad of other traffic methods including Video to CPA etc.....

The first few weeks are about the mechanics and understanding the background to this.
Good day James! Is there still chance to join your forum?
I am such a rookie I did not even know at the incentives some of you pros were giving out..
cheers!

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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 01:14 PM   #1249
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Originally Posted by beksworld View Post

RE The $2k tuition: Forget the dollar amount. It could be $5000 or $499 what matters is that it made me (and others) take action... I am now extremely invested and I'll be damned if I waste $2,000... I will make this shit work if it kills me trying.

BY GOLLY, I THINK YOU'VE JUST MADE A PRETTY DAMN GOOD POINT!

No, Seriously....I am the type that goes from one frolicking $97 report to another. Ever since Arbitrage, I have not even flinched before deleting the spam emails I get regarding the next big gig.

Thanks for the insight!...

DITTO!!! lol...
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Unread 14th Jan 2009, 01:37 PM   #1250
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Originally Posted by The 13 th Warrior View Post

...how many big time players out of how many start to set up their own networks and why? Should'nt they be happy with the money they making and if not, why not? Why set up a new network?
No Middle Man = Full Payout when you run your offers. You aren't going to get that unless you're a badass and the network agrees ro "run flat" on a particular offer.

You Make a Percentage of All Commissions Generated by Affiliates

You can Easily Run Your Own Offers - This is a HUGE money maker and allows them to seriously leverage you.

Take for instance this *Exclusive* offer: www.naughtyornice.com

This offer pays out $2.65 a lead to affiliates for Dating leads (2 to 3 pages).

What is not so obvious is that this offer is actually being run by the Network. They pay you $2.65 to generate a lead for them and then they take that lead and sell it to the actual Dating Sites (Eharmony, True, Match, etc) for $30-80. You take all the risk, they take all the money.

Cha-ching
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