Does MaxBounty have alot of shaving?

23 replies
Hi!

Just applied for MaxBounty not that long ago. I was working with another network but my conversion rate would go from 20% to 2% overnight with no change in traffic source/traffic location/offer. Because of this I was losing at least $50 a day for 2 days (Facebook PayPerClick). There hasnt been any direct answers to my questions over what was happening so I decided I should probably switch networks.

My question is, those of you who work with MaxBounty, do you have rapid conversion rate drops for no reason/alot of shaving?

Thanks, hope I made my question understandable.
#alot #maxbounty #shaving
  • Profile picture of the author CPAveteran
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  • Profile picture of the author ChocolateRain
    I usually do email/zip submits. Thanks for the replys....

    Not trying to get of topic, but any particular zip/email submit offers you've had luck with with them? Any you would recommend staying away from?
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  • Profile picture of the author Matt Red
    I really comes down to your traffic source... There not shaving if you have quality traffic....
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    • Profile picture of the author ChocolateRain
      Originally Posted by Matt Red View Post

      I really comes down to your traffic source... There not shaving if you have quality traffic....
      Ok.. Would all US traffic with a 17-20% conversion rate be considered "quality traffic"?
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  • Profile picture of the author MaxBounty
    I can confirm that MaxBounty does not shave.

    If you are having concerns about a particular campaign, please speak with your AM. I'm also happy to take a look at your account and the offers you are running. Feel free to speak with me over AIM or Skype.
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    • Profile picture of the author Fernando Veloso
      Originally Posted by MaxBounty View Post

      I can confirm that MaxBounty does not shave.
      You can't confirm anything unless you work there or have access to all data.

      Have you got any of those?
      Or you just posting for the sake of it?
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      People make good money selling to the rich. But the rich got rich selling to the masses.
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      • Profile picture of the author MaxBounty
        Originally Posted by Fernando Veloso View Post

        You can't confirm anything unless you work there or have access to all data.

        Have you got any of those?
        Or you just posting for the sake of it?
        I have worked at MaxBounty since 2005.
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        Learn more about our $1000 bonus for new affiliates! www.MaxBounty.com
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        • Profile picture of the author Trevor
          I don't see any decrease in conversion rates with Maxbounty...
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  • Profile picture of the author jphilips
    Any advice on the best way(s) to avoid shaving? If the advertiser is the one making this determination then I would guess that the best thing to do is to provide quality leads. How does one try to estimate the quality of the leads your method might produce before all of the work goes into setting up a funnel?
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  • Profile picture of the author PPC-Coach
    I used to say that networks don't shave, merchants do. However after going through a demo of a very popular cpa network backend, I can confirm that networks now shave at their level. If they see numbers that are outside their normal parameters, they're going to shave you. If they just want to get rid of you but not tell you to f-off, they'll shave you till you leave.

    When I owned my network there was no "shaving" button. Now there is and it's sad.

    The only way to deal with it is use multiple networks and compare them on the same offer. If you see a big difference call them on it. Odds are they're shaving you.
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    • Profile picture of the author CreativesLinda
      Originally Posted by PPC-Coach View Post

      I used to say that networks don't shave, merchants do. However after going through a demo of a very popular cpa network backend, I can confirm that networks now shave at their level. If they see numbers that are outside their normal parameters, they're going to shave you. If they just want to get rid of you but not tell you to f-off, they'll shave you till you leave.

      When I owned my network there was no "shaving" button. Now there is and it's sad.

      The only way to deal with it is use multiple networks and compare them on the same offer. If you see a big difference call them on it. Odds are they're shaving you.
      I don't know about other networks, but I can guarantee that Campaign Creatives does NOT have a shaving button. I don't know what platform has that but ours doesn't. The leads we get paid for are, in turn, paid to our affiliates, always, no ifs, ands, or buts.
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  • Profile picture of the author Patrick Kelly
    Hi,

    I can't say for specific that MaxBounty doesn't shave, but what I can say is that this is a network that has treated me very well. The AM that works with me is very fast in getting back to me with answers to my questions. I can't say that about some other networks!

    cheers, Patrick
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  • Profile picture of the author ChrisBa
    Originally Posted by ChocolateRain View Post

    Hi!

    Just applied for MaxBounty not that long ago. I was working with another network but my conversion rate would go from 20% to 2% overnight with no change in traffic source/traffic location/offer. Because of this I was losing at least $50 a day for 2 days (Facebook PayPerClick). There hasnt been any direct answers to my questions over what was happening so I decided I should probably switch networks.

    My question is, those of you who work with MaxBounty, do you have rapid conversion rate drops for no reason/alot of shaving?

    Thanks, hope I made my question understandable.
    How long have you been running the campaign, have you mapped out the day of week and time of day which are both profitable and unprofitable? You may need to make changes to optimize the campaign. Also what you should do is see if you can find the same offer on another network and split your traffic between the two, and see if it's happening to both or just one
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  • Profile picture of the author JP Sauve
    This is an old thread but I thought I'd add a quick comment.

    MaxBounty doesn't shave. Some advertisers conditionally change the % of leads they accept based on the quality of the leads over a test period. It's not something we like, but is becoming the norm in this industry, expecially in email-submit campaigns. This is a problem that all networks unfortunately have to deal with.

    So don't rush to judge the network.
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    • Profile picture of the author david15923
      Originally Posted by JP Sauve View Post

      This is an old thread but I thought I'd add a quick comment.

      MaxBounty doesn't shave. Some advertisers conditionally change the % of leads they accept based on the quality of the leads over a test period. It's not something we like, but is becoming the norm in this industry, expecially in email-submit campaigns. This is a problem that all networks unfortunately have to deal with.

      So don't rush to judge the network.
      Can't you, the networks, do something about it?? Like, contact the advertiser and give us a warning or something? I've seen case studies of other affiliates who get shaved when promoting offers with adwords or facebook ads. I mean, how much better quality can it get?? Isn't it (in a way) the advertiser's fault for the leads not converting like they'd like to? :rolleyes:
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      • Profile picture of the author JP Sauve
        Originally Posted by david15923 View Post

        Isn't it (in a way) the advertiser's fault for the leads not converting like they'd like to?
        Not necessarily. Leads that come from email traffic using an approved creative generally convert the best for the end advertiser. By that I mean it earns them the most revenue per lead they pay for. Leads that come from banner traffic, less so. Leads that come from home-made creatives, even less again. Affiliates breaking the rules with iframes, deceptive advertising, "guaranteed leads", and whatnot earn the sponsor the least... often nothing at all. The end advertiser doesn't know what source of traffic you're using, they just know how much revenue they earn off your individual traffic. If there's reason, as in the revenue per lead you generate is low, they scale conversion down so they can make some profit as opposed to pulling you completely from their offers.

        I don't think it's necessarily right for them to do so, but I accept that it's the nature of the email-submit game. To a certain extent, the affiliate marketplace brought this on. It's the only defence an advertiser has against pulling an affiliate with low quality traffic from one network just to see him to jump to another network with the same traffic they don't want. This is something most affiliates do when pulled from a campaign, even when they know it's wrong. (Email submit campaigns see some of the most aggressive and high volume fraud by rogue affiliates.) Also, email-submits used to pay like $0.50 per lead. But then one sponsor came in paying $0.75 with a minor scrub and all affiliates jumped on board, blinded by the new higher rate. Then in response, the first advertiser came back at $1 CPA with stricter guidelines, and affiliates again came flocking. Then a third at $1.25. Then $1.50. Etc. Until we are where we are today. Affiliates chasing the highest CPA regardless of the details is part of what caused email-submits to go down this path. Not right, just telling how it is.

        The advertiser is in control of how they define a valid lead and when a lead is declared, not the network. Affiliates should know that advertisers don't exactly declare their intention to scrub to any CPA network since we only earn when you earn. So if you're getting scrubbed, so are we. Do some research and you'll see some other posts with more info on how email-submits work. There still a ton of revenue to be made with them, but you have to have the right kind of traffic.
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  • Profile picture of the author ResultsDriven
    I'm afraid too many affiliates make accusations based on how things FEEL or LOOK compared to how things may be statistically.

    1. You're living under the law of small numbers and mistaking it for the law of large numbers. ($100 sample size? Really???)

    2. It can be 100% random as in day parting, hour parting, yada yada... Or It can be as simple as "ad blindness" because your demographics are just starting to ignore your ads.

    Regressions toward the mean comes to mind.

    I don't know... I tend to approach all of my campaigns like I'm managing a black box at Goldman.

    Quantify, quantify, quantify!

    Ah... And Maxbounty has been good to me in the past, I'd trust them over a few other networks... I'd also be hesitant to accuse someone of shaving unless I have a large data-set to support my claims (less I come out looking like a "noob").
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  • Profile picture of the author JP Sauve
    As an aside to all this, smart affiliates will recognize this is also starting to happen with second and third tier networks on ALL campaigns, offering to pay crazy high CPA rates on campaigns that we know (as a CPA network that doesn’t shave) are impossible. If for example CPAoutHouse.com is paying more on a credit report campaign than everyone else and/or they have 10 different versions of the exact same campaign, no doubt they’re getting those versions re-brokered from multiple networks. These networks need to shave to pad a margin that is unattainable without working direct with the end advertiser.

    Chasing the highest CPA rate isn’t always the right thing for an affiliate to do. Know your network.
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    MaxBounty.com is a CPA network that pays weekly.
    The largest rewards program in CPA – solely for MaxBounty affiliates!
    > > > > > http://www.AffiliateRewards.com < < < < <
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  • Profile picture of the author crazyaff
    Yes They do shave
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