Can you guys help me make a life decision?

Well, I'll be first to chime in before someone tries to sell you b.s. -- you have a good income in insurance, you're apparently pretty good at it... Stick with it.

You can put together your own product (or find a product) and do copywriting in your spare time... for yourself... answering to no one ... with no deadlines except your own. If you love copywriting, that's the best way to do it... No easier way to lose that love than making it your grind and having to answer to clients...

Not only that, but selling your own stuff is probably the best way to go from zero to 85k, if you're good at copywriting (and marketing in general)... You might be able to do it in far less than 5 years, if you're good... whereas working with clients invites all sorts of variables that you can't control ... the kind of variables that can in fact put a real damper on your outlook...

...And I'll close on this note: even the "Titans of Direct Response" (the guys who wrote those books you've read) are starting to say things like "Titans Takeaway #10: Copywriting and direct marketing are becoming commodities..."

You wanna give up a near 6-figure income to compete with all the people entering copywriting now that's it's being sold as a "biz opp"? Stay with insurance, write on the side...

Nate,

Why not create a marketing system you could sell or license to other insurance agents?

I know a lot of insurance agents are more like independent contractors/self-employed... so it's up to them to get clients.

If you know the insurance game... and you've studied copywriting... you could probably create some kind of an "all in one" marketing system that insurance agents could use to attract more leads and clients.

You could target insurance agents in either trade publications or do some ads in newspapers.

The reason I say this is... I did it successfully with 2 "offline businesses" I was in for a while. Real estate and personal training.

Once I got good at copywriting, I took what Gary Bencivenga advised doing, and that's creating a marketing system that offline businesses could use to attract clients. Gary suggested licensing it out annually, and updating it.

So, I did this locally for personal trainers and real estate agents and it worked well, so I rolled it out to larger cities.

Both produced incomes significantly higher than six figures each... so this may be a way to combine both insurance and copywriting... so you become known as the insurance copy/marketing go-to guy.

Just a thought... but heck, it shouldn't take you any longer to get past the $85,000 mark if you know what you're doing. These days, it takes a completely different approach.. since so many aspiring copywriters come into the biz each year. But the good news is, once you get good and start producing results... you won't have to work as hard to find clients and your income should shoot up past $85k pretty easily.

There's not a "realistic answer" when it comes to copywriting - like many things, it's about how much you leverage yourself (that is, network, practice, and most importantly, write!).

You can't expect yourself to be the insurance agent you are now if you don't go out to meet new people/clients, practice your sales pitch, and put yourself out there. The same with copywriting...

You already know the basics and the foundation - you've read the classics, you understand the formula, and you had a coach. Just from being able to do all of that, we can see you have the determination and will power to do this.

But you will never know if you can't meet deadlines or not if you don't practice and make mistakes. You can always try getting practice with Fiverr, or looking at WSO offers and seeing how you could offer to improve their pitches.

Since you're an insurance agent, you can always find insurance companies out there with some form of advertising, and ask if there is a way for you to improve their copy.

You don't have to take a giant leap of faith, you could take it step by step until you feel comfortable.

I would say that if you are already making money stick with it.

Getting copywriting clients is A LOT HARDER than many would have you believe. Over the last year, I've used a wide range of techniques and copy to draw people into my net.

Most of the time, I've gotten low-end, nut cases that want you to work for nothing. The last person wanted to pay me decently, but I had to let her go because she kept telling me exactly what to write. I finally told her to write her own junk since she was the only person on the planet that knew what she wanted written.

Responding to emails from Internet HR firms, craigslist or approaching with email, is a bad idea. To date I've sent out thousands and gotten a very low response. I tried a direct mail campaign but it turned up pretty fruitless and if you aren't experienced with a campaign like that, you can blow through a bunch of money and not know where you went wrong.

So, stick with what you have, my friend. It sounds like you're doing pretty good. Put in a couple hours a day or at least an hour into your writing, and eventually you'll probably start getting clients.

God Bless!

Elmo

When I was just starting out as a freelance copywriter, one of the first fellow copywriters I met was a guy who was a full-time computer programmer and part-time copywriter. The programming job provided benefits for his family and paid him six-figures each year. The part-time copywriting business paid for his expensive hobbies, family vacations, and anything he wanted to buy.

Sorry I disagree. You set project deadlines when you agree to take on a project. If you know you can't meet a deadline, then you either turn down the project or you budget more time than you think you need when you quote for it. If everything goes right, then you deliver the project a bit early.

When I started my copywriting business, I did so part-time while I was still running my own massage therapy business full-time. I made the transition to copywriting full-time in 2 months BUT most people can't ramp up that quickly. I already had 12+ years of direct response marketing experience so I wasn't your typical new freelance copywriter.

A lot of people start a new business part-time, build it up gradually, and then transition. I have two friends doing it now (one in the Kindle marketing arena and the other in day trading/swing trading). They're both married with young kids so they have less than optimal energy most days and time is always in short supply.

Instead of saying you can't do insurance work full-time and copywriting part-time, ask yourself a better question: How can I set-up my copywriting business and build it while I'm still doing insurance full-time?

Food for thought,

Mike

Everything Mike said.

Plus some obvious things that need to be said.

Writers write. Period. You want to be a copywriter someday? Start writing now.

"I won't have the energy". BS. You don't know anything about the future. And if you have a dream you want to make happen, you'll make it happen on nights, weekends, whatever it takes. Some days I burn the candle at both ends with an eye on the middle, all because I want to go into biz full time eventually. To me, your thread is oozing fear/nerves.

I get it. You gotta do what you gotta do to survive. I lived in a car and worked out of Starbucks once upon a time.

So step 1: make the decision - you staying in insurance and playing it safe, or are you eventually transitioning into copywriting and taking more of a risk? Sounds like you lean toward the risk but are afraid to make the leap. Happens to a lot of copywriters, my friend. You're not alone.

Step 2: if you decide to transition, make a plan for how to do so. Create a program in your spare time. Prospect for X many clients. Whatever you need to do. Work backwards from your income goals step by step to figure out what actions you need to take, and take it one day at a time.

There's no way around the learning curve. There's only how quickly you adjust. And you'll find that out by doing rather than studying and wondering.

Two cents and then some from everyone's favorite mouthy broad.

Paraphrasing Tim Ferriss...

The things that worry you the most in life rarely - if ever - happen.

If copywriting is truly a passion then make it happen. Damn the torpedos.

Not everyone's circumstances mirror your own Angie. Am I to move my wife and child into my car? No person has the power to change all of their life's circumstances immediately. It would take a god to do that. Different circumstances take different amounts of time to change. One needs to understand the timescale for each of their present circumstances and work within that. Trying to work beyond them can only lead to failure.

I appreciate your post. I can't have perfect knowledge of the timescale for each circumstance I have in the short-run. I am motivated by your post to try to push beyond what I believe I'm capable of. However everyone has limits. I think splitTest's idea is more prudent than jumping into the freelance world at the moment because of a few particular circumstances..

No matter what others say here... it only matters when you've made your mind up to move forward.

Because that's the only time true change can take place... when you've made your mind up.

At first, I'd probably be VERY hesitant to come on a copywriting forum to ask for LIFE advice and what's best for me and my family.

The only place I'd need to look is inside me and my heart... and what's best for me and my family.

BUT.... it certainly doesn't hurt when you read about Angie, what she went through, and the kind of ass she's kicking now.

THAT is certainly inspiring enough to show that no matter what has happened up until now, you can literally change your entire life from this moment forward.

ONE simple choice can literally change the entire trajectory of your life.

Just ask someone who decides to get behind the wheel of a car intoxicated. So many lives can change in the blink of a moment.

That may be a sh*tty analogy to use here... but it's just to show that you can literally change a lot about your life in a moment. The drunk who decides to make a foolish decision can cause so much hurt and pain in an instant.

But, I've seen so many cases in my own life... where a decision to change something I wasn't happy about... it led to a lot of happiness and joy because of that.

So yeah, Nate, just that mere fact that you're THINKING about making certain changes in your life... it all starts there my friend. From those thoughts... you can start actually taking physical steps to start rearranging the building blocks to MAKE it happen.

It may not happen right away, but you can put it into motion... and then keep working to make it actually happen.

I guess my blabbing could have been summed up in a few words...

Whether you think you can do this or you think you can't... you're right either way.

For every Angie out there... someone who decided that they deserved and could do SO MUCH MORE... there are thousands of others who may THINK they want something different... but decide that it's just easier to keep doing what they're doing.

Nate, something that helped me about 15 years ago when I first started online. I was in a position where the gym I was working at closed down... so I was without a job.

At this crossroads in my life... I decided I was done working for others.

So, instead of debating for a long time about what I should do, I just carved out one hour each evening, and did ONE thing that moved me closer to having an internet fitness biz.

Whether it was writing my ebook, learning copy, or whatever... I just broke it down into chunks because one hour seemed doable to me.

I didn't look at the LONG term... I just told myself... "Okay, one hour a day... you can do this"

So I learned all I could.

Well, after about a month... I had the makings of my first online business... all built from one-hour blocks.

I could have spent that entire month on the fence, wondering what I should do next.

But instead, I just put my head down and completed one hour blocks of something that would move me closer to my goals.

THAT one choice changed my entire life's trajectory... because here I am, 15 years later, and I have more now than I ever could have imagined.

And it all started with that thought... "Whether I think I can, or I think I can't... I'm right either way"

I know this is a copywriting board... but honestly, this video of a commencement speech given by Jim Carrey has SO many life and BUSINESS lessons... I just thought this was a good place to share it...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V80-gPkpH6M#t=618

LOL interestingly enough, this guy here ^, Shawn, ran a sales letter contest shortly after I lost my place. This was a couple years ago now.

If memory serves me correctly, out of the hundreds of applicants, I managed to make it to the top 8. Unfortunately, my entry crapped out at that point. I actually found that old letter the other day and saw all the holes in it.

But not bad for something done entirely in the library and at Starbucks.

I tell this story to say thanks to Shawn. You're one of the ones that motivated me to keep going. I (and my career) really appreciate your help.

You just made me have a girly wave-my-hands-in-front-of-my-face-because-it-suddenly-got-VERY-VERY-DUSTY-in-here moment. Thank you, Shawn

There's a fast answer to this problem.

If you have to be utterly "convinced" to do something.

Don't do it.


Steve


P.S. Without writing acres of psychology to explain. It always boils down to this.

If you really, really want something. You'll find a way to do it.

No what ifs, buts or doubts.

Your heart, gut and mind is decided and whoosh for better or for worse you go for it.

When I read the title I was really hoping this wasn't one of those "HA! Made you click on it, see how much of a good Copywriter I am?" type of threads. Good to see it wasn't.

Anyways, this doesn't have to be that difficult. Just do Copywriting on the side... get through the honeymoon phase, and if you want to keep going, then keep going. lol

Sometimes you just have to take a leap of faith to see whats on the other side. Either way you need to make the decision what is best for you? I wish you the best in whatever you do.

Interesting. The positive feedback was met with a contemptuous reply.

You say you were coached by Scott Haines. I'm sure he could tell you a couple stories about making sacrifices.

You work long hours so you don't have time for copywriting? Boo hoo. Been there done it. Angie gives you some positive feedback. So you throw something back at her that she's suggesting you move your family into your car. Please.

Okay already. You persuaded everyone. You can't do it.

Stick with the insurance.


Bill


.

Just to throw something else out there... and I don't remember where I read this.

If you consciously try to remove the word "but" from your vocabulary when thinking of goals, or life changes, or trying to achieve something you want... you're much more likely to attain it.

I wish I could find where I read this, but the percentages of reaching your goals were so much higher when you consciously got rid of the word "but" from your communications... whether to yourself, to others, written, or verbal.

I guess when saying or using the word "but" when combined with thinking about goals or wants... it works against your internal dialogue... and it's almost like using that word programs your mind to NOT work on finding the solution... because you've already made up your mind that it can't be done.

So, instead of thinking of all your goals... and then thinking "but" and then all of the reasons why it won't work... just get rid of that word.

It helps with your internal dialogue and programming... because using the word "but" causes your mind to start thinking of reasons why something "CAN'T be done".

Not trying to get too "woo woo" and far out on people here... just wanted to relay something that helped me out a lot over the years, when making decisions.

Getting rid of the word "but" helped me keep focusing on the stuff I wanted and not focus on the stuff that would hold me back.

Jack Canfield (co-author of the Chicken Soup for the Soul series, plus a ton of other stuff) says something similar, Shawn.

He talks about the importance of stating goals in the present, of not using negatives.

He says when you say, "I'm enjoying not smoking", your brain conveniently ignores the "not" and focuses on "smoking", which makes you more likely to fall back into the habit. A better choice would be something along the lines of "I am enjoying being smoke-free".

I don't believe in "woo woo" type stuff either. But mindset is some pretty powerful shit, man.

To achieve it, you first gotta believe it. If you don't believe you'll ever do it, then you're never really going to be motivated to try.

There's no magic behind that at all. If you don't believe you can be an Oscar-winning actor, you're not going to train like one. If you don't believe you can be a successful copywriter, you'll never make the leap.

No one's going to give you permission or validate you. That has to come from you.

*steps off soapbox*

Based on your vocabulary and tone - you are doing well at 85k. I'd stick with that. It's very unrealistic for someone like you, with your attitude, to make 200k.

The fact that you would even ask this in a public forum is the problem. This is not a "how realistic is it?" question. It's a self-esteem problem.

It's a amazing the lack of respect and appreciation I see here constantly lol But it always serves as a valuable lesson and reminder of common behavior. That's why whenever I give anyone any advice I assume I'm just brainstorming out loud and they probably won't use it