Experienced copywriters, your opinions requested please.

16 replies
Hello and thanks for checking this out. If I may, I'd like to receive your
opinions regarding several matters on my sales letter for Escape from Anger.

Quickly, I'm in the process of re-doing this letter. I haven't done much with it
in a long time for a variety of reasons. Its taken a back seat to other projects,
basically.

It has received little marketing and still makes sales each month. I'm kind of
surprised with that. So that's cool.

Ok...

1. Do you feel the lack of left/right margins makes this uncomfortable to read?

I read several times, somewhere and a long time ago, that readers' minds need
some kind of margin for the purpose of comfort. Or maybe it's a psychological need
to have some inherent order while reading.

2. How would you address the issue of lack of testimonials?

I have received only positive testimonials for this ebook. But no one wants to give
me permission to use them. Just has to do with privacy and avoiding the possible
embarrassment of anyone finding out about them and this issue.

I have not had any refund requests, either.

I was thinking of putting a small section and explaining the situation about this. I
can't think of much else to do.

Thanks very much for your time about this. If you care to comment on anything else,
that's fine and cool. And I do appreciate any time you take to do this.

Best regards...
#copywriters #experienced #opinions #requested
  • Profile picture of the author Collette
    Hey Ken - I'm not sure what you mean by "margins", but if you're referring to the justified layout, it shouldn't be a problem in online copy. No harm in running a test (same copy and design, just indents added) and see if you get any bump in response.

    Re: the lack of testimonials - beef up your proof elements. Dig up some research on anger and use the results to 'prove' that anger is a danger to health, wealth, and relationships. 'Borrow' quotes from nationally recognized figures relevant to your audience. You can use short quotes from published works, such as books, without violating copyright, as long as you do not change the quote in any way, and you give full attribution.

    Also, unrelated suggestion: I had to hunt for the price and guarantee. In fact, I missed it on the first skim past. I'd suggest making the price obvious, maybe give it a single line so it 'pops'. And use a Johnson Box for the Guarantee so it's waaaay more visible.

    A little more of your personal story would be relevant, too. Your life Before, During, and After. That sort of thing. Since you can't use buyer testimonials, demonstrate for the reader that your methods work by using yourself as an example.

    You can also use unattributed testimonials (certainly not as powerful as attributed testimonials), but keep them to the point:

    "I never realized how much I hated my job. Or how I was taking it out on my wife and kids, and making their lives hell, too. This book opened my eyes and gave me the tools to make the changes I needed to make."

    Add a couple of lines saying something like:

    "I'm sure you understand why these people didn't want me to use their names. Be assured, I'll never betray your confidence and trust in me. Because I know exactly how it feels to be misunderstood and stereotyped, too.

    And that's why it's so important that you take action right now to change your future..."

    Blah, blah, blah.

    You're selling a $14 e-book of information that people want, and that worked for you. You offer a solid guarantee. That puts you miles in front of many online marketers. Keep it simple, keep it real, and you're good to go.
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      • Profile picture of the author Darrel Hawes
        Originally Posted by WordPro View Post

        I'm scrolling down a little bit and I see that you are directly calling your visitors to leave your sales page and to go to a quiz, via another link.

        On this new page, I've not looked at it yet, you will be asking your anger sufferers to perform another action. This I don't think you need at all.

        There is no point to be gained in prematurely asking your visitors to leave from the page, upon which you are trying to make a sale. You will lose some of your potential conversions this way.

        Do whatever you can, to keep the visitor, your readers on this one page for as long as possible.
        Mark is right on target here.

        Could you use a modified form of your "anger quiz" as a squeeze page, such as the type popularized by Eben Pagan?

        I understand that due the the subject matter, this would have to be handled delicately...

        but bottom line...Mark is absolutely right: you do not want to invite the reader to leave the page.

        If using the quiz as a squeeze page doesn't work for some reason, could you put quizzes on "Web 2.0" sites, and link back to your sales page?
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  • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
    Originally Posted by KenThompson View Post

    2. How would you address the issue of lack of testimonials?

    I have received only positive testimonials for this ebook. But no one wants to give
    me permission to use them. Just has to do with privacy and avoiding the possible
    embarrassment of anyone finding out about them and this issue.

    I have not had any refund requests, either.

    I was thinking of putting a small section and explaining the situation about this. I
    can't think of much else to do.

    Thanks very much for your time about this. If you care to comment on anything else,
    that's fine and cool. And I do appreciate any time you take to do this.

    Best regards...
    Ken,

    Here's how to get around the privacy issue...

    Use their testimonials ANYWAY.

    Just dont use their last name. Do first name and last initial.

    For example: Jason D, Long Island

    Something like that.

    You don't need pictures although having them helps, but you can live without them.

    Or if you're feeling ambitious, you can offer your current customers a bonus for
    a testimonial.

    Have them answer questions you make up so you can dictate the format of your testimonials.

    I heard John Reese say something to that effect on one of the Product Launch Formula 1.0 CDs when he gave a case study for his original Traffic Secrets launch.

    But like i said, you can and should take what you ALREADY have from people that
    were leaving you brutally honest feedback.

    Hope this helps
    Jason
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  • Profile picture of the author KenThompson
    Hello everyone. I wrote this early this afternoon and left. I just got home. It's about 2
    AM, now.

    I do appreciate everyone's feedback and suggestions. This is very cool. I was hesitant
    for some time to do something like this but I'm glad I did.

    It's funny, Collette, because I was driving into PA this afternoon, and for some unknown
    reason it occurred to me that I was completely off the mark in my discussion about
    the margins. Ain't the brain funny?

    What I was really talking about was this...

    Having a visible vertical line on the right and left that just serves as a border. Yes, there
    are right/left margin spaces, but that's really not what I meant to draw attention to.

    So, sorry about that confusion, and thank you for your time and help.

    Mr. Andrews... thanks very much for your observations and very good suggestions.

    In fact, I'll say it again. I really do appreciate everyone's time and input.

    Paul. lol. Interesting comments, there. It's quite ok if you don't believe I had this problem. But I think I understand that you may also be speaking to me as a reader may
    think as he/she reads this letter.

    You said...

    "If you were the angry person, you are not letting enough of that
    emotion out. I imagine people with this problem have very deep
    emotional scars from past acts."

    The operative word is "were." And I'm happy that it is past tense. No, Paul, I don't agree
    with you about this one. And that's fine. Right? I don't think it's necessary to write a
    pissed off sales letter to people who live with anger every day.

    However, I must confess that my basic aversion to hype does affect my writing. That
    has been a recurring issue for me in my copywriting. I've had more than one client ask
    me to inject more emotion and pizzazz (sp?) in my copy.

    And I do realize that emotional expression does not necessarily equate to hype. So it is
    a real issue for me, I have to admit that.


    "I think Paul, he might be writing this from an NLP or counselling background perspective, hence he is well aware that the copy itself doesn't need to be written in such a way, that it inadvertently creates more anger. Rather it is conveyed in such a manner that it creates a resonance within the readers mind. he is doing this as far as possible from a very respectful stance."

    Yes. Very good, sir. My background is highly varied and includes many areas of study
    and influence. But I found the most useful things to come from the most unusual
    and surprising sources.

    I tried to address my own anger for many years. And before that, deep down I knew I
    had a serious anger problem. But it's a lot like some kind of addiction problem because
    there's a tremendous amount of denial about it.

    "It was pretty obvious to me, that he is dealing predominantly with men's anger problems, not general anger for example, from right across the spectrum of human society.

    That is his target audience, unless I'm very much mistaken."

    You're not mistaken, Mark. The 'anger management' market is a tough one to deal with
    because there are a number of different kinds of anger and for lots of different reasons.
    And a lot of people search for legal reasons. Perhaps they received a court order to take
    AM classes, etc.

    I gave this a lot of thought, in the past, and the best way to describe the anger I had
    is to call it chronic anger. It's every day anger for no 'apparent' reason. The reasons
    originated from past events and are deeply rooted.

    But there aren't many people searching for chronic anger ebooks. lol. Kinda sucks but
    that's the deal. It's really tough because the main thing people think of is 'anger
    management.'

    It's like everyone searches to buy whatever kind of car they want. But the only thing
    they search for is, car. lol It's a ppc advertising nightmare. When I was doing ppc last
    summer I had almost 300 negative keywords. It helped, but it was pain in the ass.

    I've also discovered that just as many women buy this as men. And I even had a 16 yr
    old girl from another country buy it. It was so sweet because she had trouble with the
    download and sent me an email. She explained that her 'mum' bought it for her. When
    she told me her age I thought... what? This isn't for kids! lol. So there you go.

    When I put this together, I guess I kind of assumed that mainly men had these kinds of
    problems with anger. I'm not trying to offend in any way. It was just an assumption that
    I did not think about too much, if at all.

    So that's why it probably reads the way it does, giving the impression that it's targeted
    to men.

    "The image is about the restoration of family unity and the enjoyment a family can have when a problem such as this is dealt with, by the man of the house, who bears responsibility for his actions."

    Pretty much nail on the head.


    "I hope mentioning the word anger 9 times before I scroll doesn't piss
    anyone off. "

    Me too!

    "To be honest the use of the word 'anger' is used way too much. "

    Nothing intentional there. I was just talking.

    "I don't really see a lot of NLP in this copy. I also don't have that trained eye yet"

    Then you wouldn't be expected to see it if you don't have a trained eye. Not a lot in
    there. I actually had plans to include some NLP. But as I previously mentioned, got busy
    with other things.

    Jason... thanks for stopping by. Me thinks I'll not do that with the names and stuff. A
    few of my customers were highly adamant about not having anything they said to be on
    the letter.

    Oh... the thing about the tabs and other stuff.

    I did a lot of experimenting with this site, and it really was a lot of fun. The tabs, the
    quiz included, the scrolling text of my background. Other things, too. I did them for very
    particular reasons, and actually the whole thing just kind of got left where it was.

    So. Excellent and outstanding feedback. I'd take you all out for dinner and a drink if I
    could as a thanks to you. So maybe consider it as done in spirit.

    I've been thinking about transforming this site into an authority site. It has been in my
    mind for many months. I have a lot of good ideas for it. So we'll see.

    Take care, everyone.
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    • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
      Originally Posted by KenThompson View Post

      Jason... thanks for stopping by. Me thinks I'll not do that with the names and stuff. A
      few of my customers were highly adamant about not having anything they said to be on
      the letter.
      Ok, don't use testimonials on your salesletter bc you're scared of your customers. lol

      If anything, use the testimonials, just change the name.

      Think outside of the box a little Ken!!
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      • Profile picture of the author KenThompson
        Originally Posted by jasondinner View Post

        Ok, don't use testimonials on your salesletter bc you're scared of your customers. lol

        If anything, use the testimonials, just change the name.

        Think outside of the box a little Ken!!
        Thanks babe.
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        • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
          Originally Posted by KenThompson View Post

          Thanks babe.
          ha!!! lol
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      • Profile picture of the author Collette
        Originally Posted by jasondinner View Post

        Ok, don't use testimonials on your salesletter bc you're scared of your customers. lol

        If anything, use the testimonials, just change the name.

        Think outside of the box a little Ken!!
        If Ken's customers "were highly adamant about not having anything they said to be on the letter.", then using their information in any way - without their permission - will open him up to a lawsuit.

        It really doesn't matter if he changes the names. If he uses a recognizable quote, then he's crossing the line. And if he changes the quote without saying in the letter that he has done so, he could be violating "truth in advertising" laws.

        It is NEVER a good idea to use a customer testimonial without first getting permission to use it. Permission doesn't have to be elaborate. It can be as simple as contacting the customer by email, explaining what you want to do, and how you intend to do it, and having them email you back with, "Yes, you can use my testimonial so long as (CONDITIONS)."

        Even better, is to have a simple release form that you can send to them.

        Either way would give you some protection.

        The fact that a customer sends you a testimonial does NOT automatically give you permission to use the information. If you solicit the testimonial, and explain its intended use in your request, you would be OK. If not, you should go back to your customer and get their (preferably written) permission.

        Selling on the Internet does not excuse you from the usual rules. And just a few simple steps can save you from an expensive "violation of privacy" lawsuit.
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        • Profile picture of the author Collette
          Originally Posted by KenThompson View Post

          ...I tried to address my own anger for many years. And before that, deep down I knew I
          had a serious anger problem. But it's a lot like some kind of addiction problem because
          there's a tremendous amount of denial about it.

          ...The 'anger management' market is a tough one to deal with
          because there are a number of different kinds of anger and for lots of different reasons.
          And a lot of people search for legal reasons. Perhaps they received a court order to take
          AM classes, etc.

          I gave this a lot of thought, in the past, and the best way to describe the anger I had
          is to call it chronic anger. It's every day anger for no 'apparent' reason. The reasons
          originated from past events and are deeply rooted.

          ....
          A few thoughts I had on this point:

          Any chronic, self-defeating behavior is the result of pent up frustration seeking an outlet. The behavior - in this case, an outburst of anger - provides release from the stress of 'holding in' sublimated feelings.

          This is why 'addictive' behavior is so addictive. It gives the sufferer a release from anxiety and/or pain that he/she can't get anywhere else.

          Chronic anger "for no apparent reason" falls into the "addictive behavior". There is a release, no matter how minor or temporary, that allows the person to briefly feel better. Of course, as you already know, unless the deep-rooted issues are recognized and addressed, the behavior will continue to explode.

          A lot of people with chronic anger problems feel bad after they cool off a bit. And they usually are puzzled as to how "something so small" could have set them off.

          And, just like a drug addict, they get to feeling bad about their 'bad' behavior... which makes them feel 'bad'... which stresses them out... and as the stress builds they need a release... so they 'choose' the only release they 'know' works - they blow up.

          And the cycle begins again. With all the angst, destruction, and crippling consequences from the old cycle driving the new cycle.

          It's like a hurricane feeding upon itself. The more it spins, the more powerful - and destructive - it gets. And the more devastation it leaves in its wake.

          If you can incorporate the idea of providing your customers with another way to live (that they're already consciously seeking, or they wouldn't be at your site), you may be tapping into something very powerful.

          Also, I would absolutely take your story out of the scrolling box. You really should have it seen and read, because it's a powerful "I was just like you. I know exactly what you're going through" credibility builder.

          And, P.S. I think your first subhead is more powerful than your actual headline.
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        • Profile picture of the author jasondinner
          Originally Posted by Collette View Post

          If Ken's customers "were highly adamant about not having anything they said to be on the letter.", then using their information in any way - without their permission - will open him up to a lawsuit.

          It really doesn't matter if he changes the names. If he uses a recognizable quote, then he's crossing the line. And if he changes the quote without saying in the letter that he has done so, he could be violating "truth in advertising" laws.

          It is NEVER a good idea to use a customer testimonial without first getting permission to use it. Permission doesn't have to be elaborate. It can be as simple as contacting the customer by email, explaining what you want to do, and how you intend to do it, and having them email you back with, "Yes, you can use my testimonial so long as (CONDITIONS)."

          Even better, is to have a simple release form that you can send to them.

          Either way would give you some protection.

          The fact that a customer sends you a testimonial does NOT automatically give you permission to use the information. If you solicit the testimonial, and explain its intended use in your request, you would be OK. If not, you should go back to your customer and get their (preferably written) permission.

          Selling on the Internet does not excuse you from the usual rules. And just a few simple steps can save you from an expensive "violation of privacy" lawsuit.
          ok, so only use the testimonials where they weren't "adamant" about you not using them.

          We don't want anyone getting Angry (get it? ha)
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          • Profile picture of the author Intrepreneur
            With experienced copywriters testomonials aren't only about the fact that someone is there to testify the qulaity of the product but about creating white space for a friendlier more readbale page.

            I've decided that even if I don't have testomonials (which I'm finding difficult to get as my customers don't know what Im is) I'm going to press forward and get on with it, and then ask customers to submit their feedback based on questions I ask and then ask them are they happy for it to be published as a testomonial.

            I wish you success and luck with your project.

            Best Wishes
            Intrepreneur.
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  • Profile picture of the author quiescen
    Ken,

    Just a thought, but this product might sell better if it were turned into an audio Mp3. Or, you could include a short hypnosis script in Mp3 format along with the book.

    The other thing I see is long copy with no compelling offer or reason to buy now.
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  • Profile picture of the author KenThompson
    Interesting Quiescen because I thought about doing that, or rather offering an audio
    mp3 to accompany the pdf. Basically there were technical issues with doing it. I'd
    either need to hire someone to do it manually, or use text to audio s/w which I have
    found is not good. At least I haven't found any that sounds acceptable to me.

    I've received some very good suggestions in this thread, and I will begin re-writing this
    weekend.

    I appreciate your time and comments.

    Best regards.
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  • Profile picture of the author KenThompson
    Thanks Intrepreneur, and I wish you much success as well. And yes, why not... press on
    and get something going. The testimonials will come and it'll work out on its own.

    Take care.
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