Newbie that could use some help :).

13 replies
Hello Everyone,

I'm new to the copywriting thing but I have made my first attempt. I thought about using a simple attractive design, stating the facts, and pitching the product towards the end.

I have used real examples, testimonials, and facts through out. So none of it is made up. I was hoping the truth value could help me out?

I have attached a screenshot and I appreciate all and any feedback.

Thank you very much for any help you can provide.
#copywriting #newbie
  • Profile picture of the author Mr.Sinister
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    • Profile picture of the author Crazydictator

      Target market is US/Canada/UK/Australia. Any developed English speaking country.

      The benefit is methods, letters, and guides to making companies do things your way. For example: getting a replacement laptop even after the warranty ran out. This is actually one of the examples and it's a true story, there's many more.

      No plans as of now, still working on finishing the book itself. I have written it, had it professionally edited, and now going through it one final time. Whenever I'm ready.

      They'll be looking whenever they feel like they get no where being all nice .
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  • Profile picture of the author Mr.Sinister
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    • Profile picture of the author Crazydictator
      Not manipulation, just taking a stand and winning.

      I intend on marketing online and offline. But I have already done the keyword research and designed adsense campaigns to run with it, as well as 29 affiliates so far- hoping this will increase once the product is live.

      I'm thinking of hiring a copywriter but I don't really want to pay a lot. Unless I pay out of the profit.

      Thanks for your advice.
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  • Profile picture of the author Consultant
    While I agree somewhat with Mr. Sinister re: manipulation. There are some good points. Frankly, I don't find the current copy that compelling.

    Just curious:
    The overall tone sound somewhat negative. Is there a way to make this ore positive?

    This might be your target market. But I'm thinking something along the lines of:
    "Turn your legitimate complaints into real results..."

    What is the guarantee?

    You might improve the value proposition by expanding on this point.

    To build credibility you should consider a couple of case studies describing situations and the results.
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    • Profile picture of the author Oxbloom
      You've got a product that solves a problem. This is good! My thinking on how to market it goes like this...

      When you've got a product that solves a problem, you've got four levels of thinking you need to address:

      1) The symptom
      2) The disease
      3) The cure
      4) Life after the cure (aka...drumroll...The benefits)

      You've found a symptom: people don't stand up for themselves. It's a very real symptom, and a very real problem, but you're not going to drive the crowd into a buying frenzy by pointing out their symptoms. They already know those, or they wouldn't bother searching.

      The disease in this case is: "You have no spine!" Inability to get what you want from people is a symptom of an inability or unwillingness to stand up for oneself. It's a self-esteem issue, or something similar. So how do you cure it?

      The cure is: "I can teach you how to develop a spine!" You are uniquely qualified to do this because of your long and successful history as blah blah blah. But nobody wants to have their spinelessness pointed out. And nobody wants to be told you can cure a problem they will go out of their way to deny they have in the first place. So you need to sell them the benefits...

      The benefit is: "When I teach you how to be an ALPHA-BITCH (I love this concept, BTW), you'll get the service you deserve, the money you have coming to you, the sex life you desire, and hordes of subservients groveling at your feet!"

      Obviously, these terms aren't the ones you need to hammer on, but the ideas ARE. You're looking at this inside-out, from a marketing perspective. Yes, people are searching for, "How to complain." But what they're hoping to find...what they're going to be willing to a solution that promises them that when they know how to complain YOUR way, they're going to get that raft of benefits...that life they never knew they were missing out on, but always kind of dreamed they could live.

      Tear them out of their sexless, milquetoast everyday, and drag them bodily into your world.

      When a woman (and let's be frank...your target audience is 99% women if you're using "bitch" as a sales focus) finds your site, she's pissed about the fact that she can't get her refund on a defective box of oatmeal cream pies.

      But when she FINDS you, she sees your headline and suddenly realizes that her inability to complain is costing her a lot more than the cost of a box of Little's costing her power, pride, sexual gratification, money, and all the other things REAL alpha-bitches have.

      And you, dear marketer, ARE one. You aren't AN alpha bitch. You are THE alpha bitch. When the student is ready, the teacher appears! YOU, and ONLY YOU can teach her to howl properly. Here's your's why you're's what she, the humble milquetoast can expect from her new life...and here's the almost unbelievably good deal you're willing to offer her...all this? The life of my dreams? A whole new, empowered me with fangs and a killer instinct that no Bangalore call lackey would ever dare stand up to again? All for only $49?!!!! Sign me up NOW! Where's the singles club?! Where's my domineering husband?! Where's the snotty salesman?! Where's my boss?! RRRRROOOOAAAARRRRR!

      Look at the problem from the top down, instead of the bottom up, and your marketing develops teeth.

      Good luck with it!

      (P.S. - In your photo, you look like you have a little bit of a punk thing going for you. Work that into your style, and it'll carry you along powerfully.)
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      • Profile picture of the author Jazzy Nan
        You need to be WAY more specific about your target market. Your description is much too general -- it's like when you ask those dear little Mary Kay ladies who sell their cosmetics who their target market is, and they say, "Oh, anyone with skin."

        The more clear and focused you are about your target audience, the more you are able to write in THEIR language using terminology and examples that resonate strongly with THEIR lives, dreams, frustrations, hopes, challenges, etc.

        If your market is business oriented, the "bitch" terminology will probably NOT resonate -- especailly with women in business who are exceedingly fed up with being characterized as bitches. Actually, for me personally, as a woman, I would be disinclined to buy something that identified me as a bitch -- that's why I've never bought any of the "for dummies" books.

        There's a quote from Barbra Streisand that goes something like, "When a man has strong opinions, knows what he wants and asks for it, and doesn't settle for less, he's called a decisive leader. When a woman behaves that way, she's called a bitch."

        I think that word has too much of an emotional and cultural charge, and ultimately will hurt more than help your sales. Perhaps there's a more positive way to characterize the results that you're promising and the way in which you're showing people to approach situations -- maybe Wonder Woman? Xena Warrior Princess??

        I totally agree with what Oxbloom posted that you are THE alpha-bitch (or whatever) -- Yes, you need to OWN that and BE that expert... but again, if you can come up with anther word....

        If your target market IS specifically those wimpy, passive, fearful folks who make themselves doormats, they behave that way often because they are deathly afraid of others characterizing them as "bitches" -- they want to be liked at all costs and truly wonder why we can't all just get along. They would probably not buy something that promises to turn them into what they are afraid of being seen as.

        To put my "professional coach" hat on for just a moment, there is a distinction between being assertive and aggressive. People who are wimpy and somewhat passive about these things have a default setting that sees being assertive as OVERLY agressive, and that's extremely uncomfortable for them. I think the key for you is to find another term or phrase that gives them a vision of how they could behave in a way that gets results and stretches their comfort zone without completely demolishing it.

        Also, it will be very helpful to have, again here's that word, very SPECIFIC testimonials, for example: "I used to let people cut in line (talk me into buying stuff I didn't want; eat cold restaurant food). Then I got a copy of this e-book. It showed me step by step exactly what to say in that situation and how to behave. I tried it last week when the waitress messed up my lunch order, and not only did I get my food exactly the way I wanted it, they gave it to me for free!"

        MarketingMambo --"Marketing 101" resources
        ProductDevelopmentCoach -- Turn YOUR brilliant ideas into profitable tools
        TheMagicOfMastermind -- where Multiple Minds = Exponential Results
        Best Business Minds -- Become THE recognized expert in your field
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        • Profile picture of the author Leto
          Originally Posted by Jazzy Nan View Post

          Also, it will be very helpful to have, again here's that word, very SPECIFIC testimonials ...
          Agreed, but be aware of the new FDC rulings regarding testimonials.

          You can find them here
          “A person needs new experiences … Without change something sleeps inside us and seldom awakens. The sleeper must awaken.” (Duke Leto Atreides, Dune)
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  • Profile picture of the author Mr. Enthusiastic
    It looks like the purpose of the book is to train consumers is how to effectively demand that support problems get solved, no matter what the industry, product or service that was screwed up.

    So the starting point of the sales letter should be to get the attention of consumers who are fed up with lousy service, with the run-around, with paying their hard-earned money for junk that doesn't work, won't get fixed and they can't get their money back. The top of the letter should let people who are frazzled and frustrated see that this is a web site about their exact issue. Hey, this looks like my life! Check it out, there's a web site talking to me right where I am, on hold, in line, needs unmet and unheard!

    Hint: "Dr. Bitch," "an e-book" and "Ph.D." don't meet the frustrated consumer where their hearts and minds are currently stuck in No-Support Purgatory.

    So you identify with the problem. Now agitate it a bit. What will happen if this gets worst? More money lost, more opportunities lost, more frustration. Maybe the loss of personal information on the broken computer. Can't have time with family or friends because stuck on hold with the incompetent time-wasting phone line. Etc.

    Well, that's where the buyer lives and they hate it. They want a way out. You wouldn't happen to have a source of hope, would you?

    Let's look at some examples of people who got the satisfaction and justice they deserved. Fixed flight plans, refunded prices, working laptops. Why, here are some smiling relieved faces with some things to say about how Ms. Bitch helped them get all they needed but couldn't get on their own.

    Well that's interesting. Who's Ms. Bitch?

    I bet I have to go to London and pay a hell of a lot of money to meet her. What's that, she's got a workbook with all the letters and phone scripts I need to get my way? And it's guaranteed to work for me?

    Hmm, that might work if it doesn't cost too much.
    But I don't have to drive to a bookstore or wait for Amazon to ship it to me.

    Oh, a download? I just put my credit card number in here and my problems are solved?

    There's a sales letter outline for you that will probably work better than your current one.

    Next I'd see if you can get interviewed by Clark Howard and other well-known consumer advocates. For each interview, make three points and give three tips, no matter what questions they ask. Honestly help any callers as best as you can, then pitch the book.

    This thing should be easy to make a hit.

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  • Profile picture of the author Loren Woirhaye
    Your price is too high, in my opinion, for a short sales letter
    like this one. There are print books on the art of complaining
    available for half the price or less.

    That doesn't mean you cannot price your ebook at $50 - just
    that there is a corresponding resistance that rises with price
    in many cases. When the resistance level exceeds the
    persuasiveness of your sales pitch, you don't get the sale.

    If you want to charge $50 you need a longer, more developed

    The tone of the letter also doesn't match the "bitch" mental
    movie. If you've read "Skinny Bitch" you know how powerful
    the writing style is. Even if your writing style in the ebook
    is wicked-funny, the letter doesn't communicate this.

    People not only buy stuff to solve problems. They buy to
    be entertained as well. If you're going to position it your
    product this way I would expect entertainment value.
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    • Profile picture of the author Consultant
      Lots of great tips here to developing solid copy. Love that analogy Oxboom.

      JN makes a great point. Focus in to your target market. Heck you could write 20 different sales letters each targeting a specific niche but you need to have the core value proposition nailed first.

      Heck you could even take the lessons taught within and turn it around into a new product aimed at call center agents on how to deal with your most diffiicult customers.

      I would not worry about the price point too much. Bottom line is once you find a formula that works for you, the copy will begin pulling sales. When it comes to pricing strategies its always good to remember two things:

      1) You can always come down in price but rarely if ever up.


      2) Price is the easiest thing to replicate.
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      • Profile picture of the author Loren Woirhaye
        Originally Posted by Consultant View Post

        to pricing strategies its always good to remember two things:

        1) You can always come down in price but rarely if ever up.
        I respect where you're coming from but this is a simplification
        that is false. Raising your price is easy - and in fact "the
        price is going up Monday" close works deleriously well in
        IM salesletters, especially with a house list with prospects
        on the fence. Nothing gets people to whip out their
        wallets like a take-away, and raising the price takes away
        the old, "bargain" price. It's the easiest selling method of all.

        Of course desire must be present in the prospect.

        Starting a new product off at a too-high price quashes
        early sales. When your product isn't selling, you don't get
        feedback. I'd recommend launching at a modest price,
        getting some raving feedback, then increasing price
        until profits fall off. The problem with cutting price after
        your launch is it makes you look like a heal to people
        who bought at the higher price, especially your house list.
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  • Profile picture of the author rtcj
    Great! I wish you luck and hope everything works out. Best of luck
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  • Profile picture of the author Affiliateprocom
    Where do I sign up?
    The Warrior Forum Rocks...
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    • Profile picture of the author Crazydictator
      Thank you guys for all the advice, I read every word and some of them more than once . Sadly, I'm not much of a marketer or copywriter for that matter. I'm not sure if I should take the time to learn it, or hire someone to write the sales copy. I have 3 other books in the series which I am working on.

      If any of you highly intelligent marketers would like to help out for a percentage of sales please let me know. I can't send PMs apparently, so just let me know your email/msn and I'll contact you.

      Thank you very much for the tips and I'll keep them in my head while I form the site. I'm sure other newbies will find the thread helpful too.
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