The Essence of a Sales Page?

34 replies
Hey everyone.

We always find threads about how to create more traffic and how to make more money but not near as many threads about what you really need for a sales page to be a high converter.

It's a strange thing that more webmasters take a natural interest in how to increase traffic to make more money instead of focusing on converting that traffic they already have until you have a high rate of conversion.

Therefore I would like to start a thread where people can learn what they need to know about sales pages from conversion rates to the essentials that are needed in sales pages.

So please add your own opinion and experience in creating sales pages, using sales pages, designing sales pages and the rest.

Very interested in hearing everyone's opinions.
#essence #page #sales
  • Profile picture of the author x3xsolxdierx3x
    Originally Posted by willyboy104 View Post

    Hey everyone.

    We always find threads about how to create more traffic and how to make more money but not near as many threads about what you really need for a sales page to be a high converter.

    It's a strange thing that more webmasters take a natural interest in how to increase traffic to make more money instead of focusing on converting that traffic they already have until you have a high rate of conversion.

    Therefore I would like to start a thread where people can learn what they need to know about sales pages from conversion rates to the essentials that are needed in sales pages.

    So please add your own opinion and experience in creating sales pages, using sales pages, designing sales pages and the rest.

    Very interested in hearing everyone's opinions.
    In my testing (everything should be tested, right?)....the Belcher button has worked really quite well....
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  • Profile picture of the author ChrisByrns
    Keeping everything (including the signup box) above the fold is a big plus, imho.
    Also, readability and good use of whitespace.

    My 2cents.
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  • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
    Originally Posted by willyboy104 View Post

    what you really need for a sales page to be a high converter
    That would be traffic.

    "High-converting" sales pages are still almost always converting in the single-digit percentages.

    If you're not bringing thousands of people to your page, you can't really see the difference from one version to the next.

    And if you are, then split-test. Should this headline be blue or red? Try both, gather statistics, and after a while keep the one that did better.

    But even split-testing doesn't work unless you can drive traffic.
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    "The Golden Town is the Golden Town no longer. They have sold their pillars for brass and their temples for money, they have made coins out of their golden doors. It is become a dark town full of trouble, there is no ease in its streets, beauty has left it and the old songs are gone." - Lord Dunsany, The Messengers
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    • Profile picture of the author willyboy104
      Originally Posted by CDarklock View Post

      That would be traffic.

      "High-converting" sales pages are still almost always converting in the single-digit percentages.

      If you're not bringing thousands of people to your page, you can't really see the difference from one version to the next.

      And if you are, then split-test. Should this headline be blue or red? Try both, gather statistics, and after a while keep the one that did better.

      But even split-testing doesn't work unless you can drive traffic.
      Yes, I actually don't know of one sales page which over a long period of time has had a higher than single digit conversion rate when tested with thousands of potential buyers.

      However there must be ways of increasing this so it is at least in the high single digit zone.

      Also you can cushion the overall low conversion rates with the use of free giveaways/squeeze pages as some others have mentioned. Although there is conflict with some affiliates who rightly argue that with these opt in sales funnels they may not get the sale and instead the vendor will profit as well as gaining an email address to sell to repeatedly.

      Traffic is obviously very important but what I want to talk about here is before traffic, and from people's experience with traffic through split-testing to see what sort of things/factors work and which don't.
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      • Profile picture of the author CDarklock
        Originally Posted by willyboy104 View Post

        people's experience with traffic through split-testing to see what sort of things/factors work and which don't.
        What works best on YOUR sales page and what works best on MY sales page may be completely different.

        That's why you do your own split-testing. You can't use the results of mine; they're not your traffic. You have to test what works best with the traffic you're getting.
        Signature
        "The Golden Town is the Golden Town no longer. They have sold their pillars for brass and their temples for money, they have made coins out of their golden doors. It is become a dark town full of trouble, there is no ease in its streets, beauty has left it and the old songs are gone." - Lord Dunsany, The Messengers
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  • Profile picture of the author Marc Eglon
    I think it's really difficult to pin it all down because it really depends more on the way the page is being used....

    If you're talking about the classic long-copy sales page that most people load up for their clickbank sites, a good place to start is with the stuff from the conversion doctor. Ryan Deiss, Perry Belcher and many others have done a ton of testing so give everybody a good place to start.

    The advantage these guys have is the massive volume of traffic so they get split testing results in real time. Most marketers (especially at the time that matters) don't have those numbers so testing is slower and less accurate.

    But the real point is that it depends on the way visitors arrive at your sales page. Have they been whipped into a frenzy after a week of receiving awesome money magnets? In which case the content of the page is less important - a paypal button would probably do.

    Or do the visitors even know you from Adam? in which case the sales page has a lot of work to do.

    Just for the record, I actually just launched a site 2 days ago so I'm really interested in this stuff and I'm testing everything I can.
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  • Profile picture of the author Allurre
    1. Evoke the right emotional responses that makes buyers take action.
    2. Fulfill their needs, or HELP THEM recognize their needs.
    3. Structure of presentation is important - you want to keep them hooked from the very first sentence.
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  • Profile picture of the author davidfstyles
    Copywriting is such a big topic but after all the tests I've done, I've found you can't beat creating a strong 'message to market match'... mixed with a strong call to action and proof of results.

    I also use multi-variate testing... which is essentially testing to see what the market wants.

    If you're looking for good sales letters... go to the ClickBank marketplace and search for 'high gravity'. IMO these are some of the best converting online sales letters on the planet. Then model them to suit your market.

    David.
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    • Profile picture of the author VegasVince
      THE OFFER. That's the foundation.

      Selling "stuff" people want....and preferably "stuff" they can't live without....often requires a hell of a lot less "copy" then some pig dressed in a blue dress...hidden behind a perfectly formatted sales page that does everything "right" except change the nature of the "beast."

      Great offers...have more to do with great "positioning" then great sales copy.

      Positioned in the middle of a desert...I suspect a card board sign with the words GOT WATER scribbled on it....would convert rather "well."

      And if I was thirsty enough....I doubt I'd much care about what type set or font was used.

      I'd be a buyin'!



      xxx Vegas Vince
      Legend.
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      • Profile picture of the author Daniel Scott
        Originally Posted by VegasVince View Post

        THE OFFER. That's the foundation.

        Selling "stuff" people want....and preferably "stuff" they can't live without....often requires a hell of a lot less "copy" then some pig dressed in a blue dress...hidden behind a perfectly formatted sales page that does everything "right" except change the nature of the "beast."

        Great offers...have more to do with great "positioning" then great sales copy.

        Positioned in the middle of a desert...I suspect a card board sign with the words GOT WATER scribbled on it....would convert rather "well."

        And if I was thirsty enough....I doubt I'd much care about what type set or font was used.

        I'd be a buyin'!



        xxx Vegas Vince
        Legend.
        You can't change the offer... but you CAN change the positioning.

        To run with Vince's example... selling drinking water would do great.

        Selling water for doing laundry not so much. After all, who cares about clothing when they're dying of thirst?

        Same product, different positioning.

        One of the things that separates the men from the boys in this endeavor is how they position a product.

        -Dan
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        Always looking for badass direct-response copywriters. PM me if we don't know each other and you're looking for work.

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  • Originally Posted by x3xsolxdierx3x View Post

    In my testing (everything should be tested, right?)....the Belcher button has worked really quite well....
    Do you actually believe that it's going to matter much whether your Add To Cart button has an orange or a green background color? I mean, really? do you actually believe that's what makes people swing their credit cards? Nah...

    Here's my tip:

    Do NOT waste valuable traffic split-testing stuff like your "Add to Cart" button, or the color of the background, and stupid stuff like that. That's the last thing you want to split-test. What you want to split test is: A) price, B) your autoresponder sequence and C) video sales page vs. standard text sales page.

    Once you've tweaked those three components to (almost) perfection, then you can move onto split testing the minor details such as your Add To Cart button...
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    • Profile picture of the author x3xsolxdierx3x
      Originally Posted by Anonymous Affiliate View Post

      Do you actually believe that it's going to matter much whether your Add To Cart button has an orange or a green background color? I mean, really? do you actually believe that's what makes people swing their credit cards? Nah...

      Here's my tip:

      Do NOT waste valuable traffic split-testing stuff like your "Add to Cart" button, or the color of the background, and stupid stuff like that. That's the last thing you want to split-test. What you want to split test is: A) price, B) your autoresponder sequence and C) video sales page vs. standard text sales page.

      Once you've tweaked those three components to (almost) perfection, then you can move onto split testing the minor details such as your Add To Cart button...
      There are very interesting, strategic ways, with the pricing, that we've used the Belcher button....what works for me may not work for others....

      For example, we have a product that we sell at $97.....it is a packaged course, however, each part of the course stands-alone as a separate valuable product....

      We assigned each product a value and offered them for individual purchase....however, we used the "Add to Cart" Belcher button for purchase of the entire course, and a completely opposite deep red and black "Buy NOW" button for purchase of individual products....

      Of course, the point is to draw people to the belcher button, complete $97 sale....

      I do recognize that there are other variables at play....but, for us, the Belcher button has had a valuable well thought out strategic purchase....
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      • Originally Posted by x3xsolxdierx3x View Post

        For example, we have a product that we sell at $97.....it is a packaged course, however, each part of the course stands-alone as a separate valuable product....

        We assigned each product a value and offered them for individual purchase....however, we used the "Add to Cart" Belcher button for purchase of the entire course, and a completely opposite deep red and black "Buy NOW" button for purchase of individual products....

        Of course, the point is to draw people to the belcher button, complete $97 sale....

        I do recognize that there are other variables at play....but, for us, the Belcher button has had a valuable well thought out strategic purchase....
        And I can assure you that your business bottom line would have benefited if instead of wasting traffic split-testing on the color of your $97 belcher button, you would have split tested $97 vs. $147 vs. $197 regardless of the color of the damn button.

        The VERY first and utter most thing a sales letter needs to split test is, always, the price tag itself.
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  • Profile picture of the author Loren Woirhaye
    Sales copy formula. I made this up and it works for my methods
    of writing copy. I adapt it as needed.

    First, get attention - some sort of headline usually

    body copy:
    1. premise
    2. promise
    3. problem
    4. solution
    5. examples
    6. order form
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    • Profile picture of the author willyboy104
      Originally Posted by Marc Eglon View Post

      I think it's really difficult to pin it all down because it really depends more on the way the page is being used....

      If you're talking about the classic long-copy sales page that most people load up for their clickbank sites, a good place to start is with the stuff from the conversion doctor. Ryan Deiss, Perry Belcher and many others have done a ton of testing so give everybody a good place to start.

      The advantage these guys have is the massive volume of traffic so they get split testing results in real time. Most marketers (especially at the time that matters) don't have those numbers so testing is slower and less accurate.

      But the real point is that it depends on the way visitors arrive at your sales page. Have they been whipped into a frenzy after a week of receiving awesome money magnets? In which case the content of the page is less important - a paypal button would probably do.

      Or do the visitors even know you from Adam? in which case the sales page has a lot of work to do.

      Just for the record, I actually just launched a site 2 days ago so I'm really interested in this stuff and I'm testing everything I can.
      That's a good point to make about how the visitor has been directed to your website especially since many digital products are promoted by affiliates who use a variety of techniques to push traffic to the sales page.

      I suppose it also depends what sort of reputation your product name/your name or website name has.

      Thanks for your input.

      Originally Posted by VegasVince View Post

      THE OFFER. That's the foundation.

      Selling "stuff" people want....and preferably "stuff" they can't live without....often requires a hell of a lot less "copy" then some pig dressed in a blue dress...hidden behind a perfectly formatted sales page that does everything "right" except change the nature of the "beast."

      Great offers...have more to do with great "positioning" then great sales copy.

      Positioned in the middle of a desert...I suspect a card board sign with the words GOT WATER scribbled on it....would convert rather "well."

      And if I was thirsty enough....I doubt I'd much care about what type set or font was used.

      I'd be a buyin'!



      xxx Vegas Vince
      Legend.
      Hey dude, excellent example a little farfetched ;P but I totally get what you mean. I suppose at the end of the day if it's something someone really wants then by just making it obvious that you're giving them what they need/want then your sales copy isn't as important as the offer like you mentioned.

      However if you have competition in the market, which 99% of people do then surely ensuring your sales page is top notch would be effort put to good use.

      For example say you was in the desert and their were two signs saying "Got water" but one said you got a BOG OF deal ;P

      Which would you be more likely to go with?

      Good input dude.

      Originally Posted by CDarklock View Post

      What works best on YOUR sales page and what works best on MY sales page may be completely different.

      That's why you do your own split-testing. You can't use the results of mine; they're not your traffic. You have to test what works best with the traffic you're getting.
      Very good point. I hope you don't think I am trying to use the results of other people to create my own sales page. Obviously getting ideas is good but as you mentioned we may be testing products in totally different areas. But for a basic insight to what should be included in sales pages I think this would be a good break point for new players to IM and Product creation.

      Thanks.

      Originally Posted by Anonymous Affiliate View Post

      Do you actually believe that it's going to matter much whether your Add To Cart button has an orange or a green background color? I mean, really? do you actually believe that's what makes people swing their credit cards? Nah...

      Here's my tip:

      Do NOT waste valuable traffic split-testing stuff like your "Add to Cart" button, or the color of the background, and stupid stuff like that. That's the last thing you want to split-test. What you want to split test is: A) price, B) your autoresponder sequence and C) video sales page vs. standard text sales page.

      Once you've tweaked those three components to (almost) perfection, then you can move onto split testing the minor details such as your Add To Cart button...
      Another excellent point. I think testing colours, buttons, images e.t.c is low down on the priority list, probably worth doing but not until you are satisfied with everything else first.

      Those points you made are really important since price is a big factor when selling a product however if you combine this with a great offer many people will pay within a very big variable for your product.

      Thanks everyone
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    • Profile picture of the author samoyin
      This is really helpful cheers! A Sales page would usually determine the success of a product or service on the net.
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      • Profile picture of the author Alex Cohen
        I call these "The 5 Unbreakable Rules of a Sales Letter" ...

        1. Interesting (eyeball grabbing headline and "greased slide")
        2. Believable
        3. Benefits touch prospect's driving emotions
        4. Urgency
        5. Irresistible offer

        Alex
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  • Profile picture of the author badboy_Nick
    A sales page only has 1 goal: To get that person to take out his credit card and BUY what you have for sale.

    Forget traffic, if the site cant sell then its a dud no matter how many targeted people see it. Copywriting skills are key here!

    Any questions just let me know

    Nick
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    Read my incredible story: www.affiliatechamp.co.uk
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  • Profile picture of the author Raydal
    You need to visit the copywriting sub-forum for these kinds of
    discussions. Anyway there a a ton of different factors that
    go into a well oiled website. Format, graphics, headlines,
    offers, bullet points, guarantee, price presentation, social proof,
    readability, emotional appeal, ... and the list goes on. This would
    be one massive thread hence why the moderators gave this
    discussion it's own forum.

    -Ray Edwards
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    The most powerful and concentrated copywriting training online today bar none! Autoresponder Writing Email SECRETS
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  • Profile picture of the author gubwell12
    [DELETED]
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    • Profile picture of the author willyboy104
      Originally Posted by Paul McQuillan View Post

      Thanks for sharing that...

      I get 1 in 3 but I signed a blood pact swearing to never
      reveal how.

      The only way to get my super secret method of the 1 in 3
      will be my 24 hour WSO launching tomorrow (it's only $7!)






      by the way.. I'm full of shi.....
      Jokes - ;P

      I don't understand why people even bother commenting with that.

      Thanks everyone up to now for your great input.

      What are peoples views on multiple page sales pages in comparison to single/long sales pages?
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      If you want to learn how to make money online, no bullshit click here.
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    • Profile picture of the author x3xsolxdierx3x
      Originally Posted by Paul McQuillan View Post

      Thanks for sharing that...

      I get 1 in 3 but I signed a blood pact swearing to never
      reveal how.

      The only way to get my super secret method of the 1 in 3
      will be my 24 hour WSO launching tomorrow (it's only $7!)






      by the way.. I'm full of shi.....
      $7 sounds like a STEAL for that kind of info! Can't wait! lol...
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  • Profile picture of the author Adam Goldman
    Split testing the headline, bullet points, the length, and the place where the price tag is showed in the first place.
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  • Profile picture of the author Loren Woirhaye
    It's commonly found in direct mail that a "warm" colored order
    form using reds, golds, and oranges, outsells a "cool" one with
    blues on it. It doesn't surprise me that the Belcher Button is
    orange and yellow.

    Price, offer, order form copy and headline and deck copy are
    the main things that interest me from a testing and optimization
    point of view. Of course if your middle copy is real bad it can
    hurt you, but many buyers will forgive bad body copy and
    just scroll down to check out the price and offer, think, "hmm.
    price is okay. offer looks good," then scroll back through the
    letter to resolve their general concerns.

    So if your price is fair, your traffic is targeted and your offer is
    nice and people are actually scrolling down to look at it, the
    thing to look at next is whether your body copy is answering
    their questions in a clear manner.

    A lot of folks get their heads full of hype about magic methods
    of writing "Cash sucking headlines" and "persuasion secrets",
    but success at this often just comes down to serving the
    market with an appropriate product at a price that doesn't
    put the brakes on the sale and clear communication of what
    they get for their money.
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  • Profile picture of the author samoyin
    All I think is, its all about 'Finding A Need' get the best solution to this 'NEED'
    then 'FILL IT'.

    You should be able to show that you really have the solution. Then comes the Sales.
    From you solution oriented Sales Page.
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    • Profile picture of the author Bill Farnham
      Originally Posted by samoyin View Post

      All I think is, its all about 'Finding A Need' get the best solution to this 'NEED' then 'FILL IT'.
      That would work great if it weren't for the fact that people buy on "wants" and not "needs".

      Failure to understand this difference can be fatal.

      ~Bill
      Signature
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      • Profile picture of the author x3xsolxdierx3x
        Originally Posted by Bill Farnham View Post

        That would work great if it weren't for the fact that people buy on "wants" and not "needs".

        Failure to understand this difference can be fatal.

        ~Bill
        I've been sitting here pondering this post for a minute or 2.... (I'm a deep thinker...at least I try to be....)

        Say you had the only water bottle in a desert, or had the key to the only bathroom at a rock concert....

        Couldn't you charge a premium for the one thing that will allow a person to satisfy their "need"? .....when you have the only bottle of water in a vast desert, suddenly your product becomes that much more valuable, right?

        just thinking here....
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        • Profile picture of the author willyboy104
          Originally Posted by Bill Farnham View Post

          That would work great if it weren't for the fact that people buy on "wants" and not "needs".

          Failure to understand this difference can be fatal.

          ~Bill
          Although I agree with this comment I also think that businesses also realise that sometimes it's not enough to need something, they have to want something too.

          Take a house for example, this is one of the basic needs in life. But that doesn't mean to say you NEED 3 bathrooms, a luxurious swimming pool, three living rooms, smoking room and a humongous kitchen.

          These are extras, beyond the basic needs. However by combining both wants and needs you open up space for a massive market.

          All you need is some bricks or corrugated metal and hey presto! you have a house, capable of keeping you relatively dry. Take a look at the shanty towns, they are create their own homes from whatever material they can find.

          I think overall by combining these needs and wants you are able to create great products.
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        • Profile picture of the author Bill Farnham
          Originally Posted by x3xsolxdierx3x View Post

          I've been sitting here pondering this post for a minute or 2.... (I'm a deep thinker...at least I try to be....)

          Say you had the only water bottle in a desert, or had the key to the only bathroom at a rock concert....

          Couldn't you charge a premium for the one thing that will allow a person to satisfy their "need"? .....when you have the only bottle of water in a vast desert, suddenly your product becomes that much more valuable, right?

          just thinking here....
          Well, nothing happens until someone want's something in regards to what we're talking about. As an example, you may have the only bottle of water, and I may want to kill you for it instead of satisfying the requirement (need) that I pay you for it.

          One restroom, no trees?

          The point is this...if you added up all the money spent on ebooks, courses, software, et al, that are sitting on peoples' hard drives collecting dust you would see that it was only a 'want' that caused them to buy the item, and not a need.

          It's fun to believe that 'needs' drive the equation here, but the facts don't prove that out.

          Ask the next overweight smoker you see why they don't lose weight and quit smoking. You know they need to do both, they know they need to do both, yet they don't 'want' to do either.

          It's human nature you're up against in the needs vs wants area.

          ~Bill
          Signature
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          • Profile picture of the author x3xsolxdierx3x
            Originally Posted by Bill Farnham View Post

            Well, nothing happens until someone want's something in regards to what we're talking about. As an example, you may have the only bottle of water, and I may want to kill you for it instead of satisfying the requirement (need) that I pay you for it.

            One restroom, no trees?

            The point is this...if you added up all the money spent on ebooks, courses, software, et al, that are sitting on peoples' hard drives collecting dust you would see that it was only a 'want' that cuased them to buy the item, and not a need.

            It's fun to believe that 'needs' drive the equation here, but the facts don't prove that out.

            Ask the next overweight smoker you see why they don't lose weight and quit smoking. You know they need to do both, they know they need to do both, yet they don't 'want' to do either.

            It's human nature you're up against in the needs vs wants area.

            ~Bill
            geeze, Bill....your posts make me think to much (I guess that's a good thing....lol)....

            ...response forthcoming in a few hours...lol
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