Just received the email and watching it now. Good video.

I'm gonna post something from an email I just received from my friend Ben Mack that was remarkably timely.

In this piece Ben mentions Blair Warren (who has seemingly dropped off the planet) and his One Sentence Persuasion Course...

...search the War Room for "Occult Book" and you might find a copy.

Anyway...

Did someone say something about the Zeigarnik Effect?

Maybe not, but it sure felt like it.

Maybe you'll enjoy reading this.

Brian

Great post, Bruce, but I personally I don't equate nested loops with cliffhangers.

New loops can and should be opened earlier than your link -- many novels have
a large number of subplots running concurrently, with the chapters switching back
and forth between them, until they converge at the climax.

I'm not an NLP expert, so I'm not clear on why nesting loops allegedly creates
"amnesia" and helps to sell products --maybe Rick can explain that.

I've heard that Richard Bandler creates a lot of confusion by opening many different
stories, but of course listening and reading are different.

Ah, just thought of the great granddaddy of nested loops -- 1001 Arabian Nights.

There's the overall framing story of the king and Queen Scherazade. And the stories
as translated by Sir Richard Burton contain many stories within stories. (Note to parents:
the full length, uncensored stories are NOT for children!).

Great post and info Ross, thanks for sharing.

Thanks to Brian too for posting that email -- definitely a "printer-upper".

Cheers,
Dave

Stories work because they're passive and not as "pushy" when it comes to selling. Good stories allows the listener/reader to engage fully with us because we're naturally curious.

We like being led. And we like being entertained. If you can do both (very well) then you're halfway there.

In fact, there is one technique in particular that I love so much when telling stories. It can be very powerful when used with purpose, and with deliberate application. In fact, it's responsible for most of my success as a magic performer.

It's completey turned my "parlor" show from fairly entertaining, to something that draws and holds the attention of my audience almost more than anything else I do.

Without this one tool, I was just a guy that did "tricks" and "puzzles", but with it, I (apparantly) can do miracles. It elevates any piece I use it on to a whole different level of entertainment by merely setting the stage right (metaphorically speaking) before the effect has truly begun - and the best and most succesful magicians do it almost without being aware of it.

People stop, give me their complete attention, and completely focus and hang on every word I'm saying - always making the finish of the effect something that commands immediate appreciative response (hehe...a standing 'o').

I learned it from an "old-school" Chicago magician (a true performance master) that isn't as well known these days amongst the Youtube crowd and "street"-magic sixteen-year-old's. Shame.

But the most amazing thing happened when I realized this technique could be used in almost any situation when communicating with others to compel instant attention and genuine interest. As you know, it truly makes it so much easier to persuade when you can command that kind of attention.

It's worked miracles for me, and it can for you too if you don't already use it. Especially when you give it the conscious practice it deserves. Without exaggeration this one technique alone can change your everyday conversations, relationships and more.

Know what it is?

(You already do of course...)

You guys have mentioned it above.

One of my favorite authors Steven K. Scott calls it "salting". It's not original with him obviously, but that's where I really learned to put it to use - like building intense curiosity in my audience.

It works like this. If I want to share something with you, something that I know is valuable, but you may not have the right appreciation for yet, it's much better to get you to want to hear it first.

You've talked about the same kind of things above, but I love the way he describes it. He says that while "you can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink", he can get a horse to drink the water every time.

You simply sprinkle salt to his oats, then bring him to the water.

It's the same with conversations, and the same with performing magic. For example, in one effect I'll tell the audience a story about how there has been one "holy grail" effect in card magic that has escaped most magicians over the years.

Magicians have sought after a good method to reproduce this legendary effect, but usually it suffers somewhere in the presentation and isn't worth performing until the perfect method is discovered (if there is any).

I tell them this one trick is said to be...and that only a few magicians that I've read about can... and so forth.

Finally, I tell them that while I can't do the trick for them, if I could do it, it might look something like this. And then I go on to perform it and so on.

Salting, in that case makes the audience "prepped" to see what I'm about to do, as opposed to just taking a deck of cards out and saying, "wanna see something cool?"

It may not read as well here, but story-telling (or as I like to call it "story-selling") using salting works great.

If I can get you to desperately need to know what I already want to tell you, you'll find the information far more intrinsically valuable and relevant.

I (somewhat?) tried to do so in this post before giving the answer. May not be the best example, but there ya go.

After I posted last night, I realized I'd blown it.

Not only is 1001 Arabian Nights full of stories within stories within stories -- it's a
premier example of the power of cliffhangers.

If Queen Scherazade had given in to the king's desire to know the end of a story
right away -- she'd have been beheaded in the morning.

[DELETED]

Storm in a "D" cup. Complete beat-up.

Ironic thing about the whole sub-plot about David's emails is I didn't get an email. I did a YouTube search for his name to see if he had anything new out and came upon it that way. Had no idea it was going out in emails the same day.

Funny how these things turn out.

--- Ross

Back on the story tip, the book Made to Stick has a pretty interesting chapter on stories rife with theory and examples. (While you're at it, you might as well read the whole book. There are great nuggets throughout for both copywriting and marketing in general.)

The subtle power of stories is, once the reader finishes, she feels as if she's reaching the conclusion herself. So, you could tell me not to accept a beer from strangers because it's dangerous... or you could tell a story about someone who took a beer, got ruffied, and then had his liver harvested. Without explicitly saying it, I'll deduce myself that drinks from strangers are bad. You just guided me to the conclusion (nice!).

This is also an excellent way to connect with the reader of your copy. Telling stories about yourself allows her to deduce that you're trustworthy, just like her, etc. Way more effective than screaming "TRUST ME BECAUSE I SAY SO."

There are a ton of other subtle psychological benefits to storytelling, but I suggest you just go get the book.

This thread looks like it is drooping. Perhaps there are no more gems to be uncovered. However, it has glistered - even though all that glisters has not been gold - reflected and transmuted ... me ... along with it.
I came to this thread to discover something about nlp copywriting. From that perspective, I was left with only shards. Instead, what I did receive, far exceeded my expectations. I feel as if I have been showered with pearls of wisdom from a copywriting masterclass.

Thank you all for contributing.

Awesome video.

I didn't know stories could be used in those 2 ways.

Now I'm on a quest to find out every way a story can be used in sales...

I have Unlimited Selling Power. I've always thought that was one of the best sales books I've ever read.

As for the Marcia thing... David Garfinkel doesn't need to explain himself. There's always going to be someone angry about something you do no matter WHAT you do.

Comes with the territory of having a list I guess.

I had someone email me and say he was mad about the music playing on a sales page I sent him to. It was just regular old music.

Just today alone I got at least 7 replies with people angry about me saying "Dude" in an email.

The funniest thing ever is that I get the most complaints when I send people to free webinars and telecalls with experts sharing free info.

So hey... It's ridiculous and I feel your pain. And I don't think angry whiners are buyers anyway. No sweat.

When I started this thread I had a full head of hair.

Good one to ressurect though. Rick, especially, goes off on some good riffs.

--- Ross

Hey Ross,

Though I've been a member here for a while now, I've never really "hung out" much, and this is actually my very first time in the copy writing forum. It was David's name that caught my attention though, because my very first exposure to the topic, or should I say the world of copy writing, was a course David put together for / with Mike Dillard called "The Copywriter’s Guild". I guess you could say I got off on the right foot! I've been pretty fascinated with "the topic" and the immense value of developing strong skills in this area ever since.

Anyway, I've really enjoyed the thread a lot and just wanted to thank for starting it off!
I don't know much about any "lame emails", but I would have to agree that Mr. Garfinkel is truly one of the very best out there. His course, which I was lucky enough to start off with, is still to this day, one of the most valued and most appreciated products I've ever purchased since I even learned how to spell "Internet Marketing", or started to get a clue what the term even meant.

Thanks Ross!! (and everyone else) ...This was truly enjoyable.

~ Jeff

Hey Ross,

So I know you posted this back in April of last year...but I am just coming across this today!

Copywriting is always something I am working on and really is the lifeblood of any product or site....it doesn't matter what you're selling!

This will help me create short stories that illustrate a point quickly and won't lose the readers attention, thanks again Ross!

I think I'll check out and subscribe to David's blog right now....

Cheers!

hey

thanks for posting that

i love that guy

Hi All,

Interesting thread. I thank you all for taking the time to respond.

If you want to know more about David Garfinkel's and Harlan Kilstein's stuff then please read on...

FYI: Just Google "Fast Effective Copy" for David Garkinkel's latest products. I have the hard copy binders and I am a member of his Fast Effective Copy Group. (And NO I am not an affiliate so you know, just giving a little info for those that want to check it out.)

Recently I purchased David's newest package "Effortless Influence".

This is pricy, but it is a super buy IF you use what you learn in it.

I love it! It is chock full of value, and is ALL about using stories to sell. David outlines and reveals many of his private copywriting methods about how to tell/sell with stories. He gives excellent examples of the different kinds of stories and which ones to use, when to use them and how. He does a great job of showing you exactly what he does to use stories to go behind a readers radar and uncover and create a critical link to their subconscious and sell them. It is awesome stuff!

On the NLP thread:

For the last couple years I have been working on learning Harlan's NLP methods. If you are wondering if adding NLP to your copy is worth the expense (READ: blood, sweat and tears) and CONSIDERABLE TIME INVESTMENT to learn it -- IT IS. But..

Be forwarned -- NLP suggestions and subliminal methods...they go really deep.

I find my copy is much more engaging because the stories are more believable and resonate more deeply with the visitor's inner fears, deepest desires and personal/private dreams. I not only get inside their heads, but also unearth hidden wants, needs and desires -- and with having their subliminal needs uncovered and hopefully fullfulled (by the product) -- I can connect to the emotions inside their hearts... (and they buy from an emotional state not a logical one.)

And with that private connection made... What that means is they are more likely to believe in me (and what I write) and buy. This is NOT hard sell. This is selling to their innermost wants, needs, and desires... sometimes it brings to the fore -- emotions that even THEY are not aware of...

Conversions go up significantly using NLP suggestions -- using them very elegantly that is...

NOT blantantly, which has given NLP (from people that don't know better about the use of NLP) a bad rap... And if buying (investing) in your product really is for their own GOOD, then what is the harm in it?

But be aware... It is much tougher to weave NLP methods into your copy than at first glance.

You can go really DEEP, like...

i.e. nested loops, hypnotic induction with pacing and leading, causal modeling patterns, mind reading suggestions, nominalizations, embedded commands, relative clauses, repetive cue words, change of state verbs, negative questions, metaphors, and about 20 other NLP style suggestions (Harlan Kilstein is an expert on) in your copy!

But... it IS worth the hard sweat to learn it, because it boosts sales tremendously. I find it doubles and even in some cases triples conversions when I split test it on launches.

Just check out Harlan Kilstein's site and Google NLP Copywriting + Harlan Kilstein to find Harlan's stuff. (And NO, again, I am not an affiliate for him either... so rest easy on that.)

But I do own his "NLP Copywriting Course", his "Value Based Copywriting DVDs", the "Art of the Swipe DVDs" and his "Real Estate Copywriting Course". They are all rock solid courses and when I used what I learned from them... It boosted my earnings in the last 2 years to almost DOUBLE my previous years! So was buying these courses worth the cost. YOU BET!

I love Harlan's stuff. I love his sense of humor and how he tells it like it is!

So dive into some NLP. It is worth the effort even if all you do is add engaging stories like Rick Duris says. Your conversions will rise higher than you ever dreamed -- but be sure and follow Harlan's methods so you do it with style!

So Harlan if you come out with anymore goodies, let me know, OK?

Good luck to all in your copywriting!

Hey Mal,

Yeah, you are right to call me out on that...

But I have to tell it like it is...

I DO LOVE Harlan Kilstein and David Garfinkel AND Clayton Makepeace....

The fact is, with these copywriting experts help I write copy that SELLS and FINALLY CONVERTS!

With what I learned from them in the last couple of years... helped me break $100,000 NET last year with my copywriting business. (**MY POINT HERE, IS IT DOESN'T MATTER WHERE YOU START OUT YOU CAN SUCCEED IN THIS BUSINESS --- IF YOU INVEST IN YOURSELF AND IF YOU WORK REALLY HARD, AND GIVE IT YOUR ALL -- YOU CAN BUILD A SUCCESSFUL COPYWRITING BUSINESS.)

And... I have written copy (that they ran and made money on) for Ken McCarthy, Brad Callen, and Andy Jenkins -- maybe you have heard of them?

Oh yeah, I forgot to mention...I did 3 launches last year with Chris McNeeney (Chris X) , and Mo Latif (the top 2 Clickbank affililiates. They made over $500,000 NET (not gross sales) off just 1 launch I did in the first 30 days....and I am booked for more launches for this year...)

*** POINT 2, YOU CAN RUN WITH THE "BIG DOGS" EVEN IF YOU ARE A FEMALE.)

I would be ungrateful if I did not mention the incredible expertise of the people that have helped me to be successful. And that includes this forum and the awesome people I meet here...

Just sayin'

Jennie

I'm learning the art of copywriting myself. This is defintley bookmark worthy material

I'm happy for you, Jennie, keep it up!

----

When it comes to stories, here's a little nugget to check out:

The Editing Room, home of the original Abridged Script.

What's an Abridged Script?

Think of them as Cliff's Notes for popular movies. 'Cept Cliff's an assh*le and he doesn't like your movie.

On deck: The Hunger Games.

The Editing Room: Abridged Scripts for Movies

It's great for giggles, story ideas and ways of framing conversations. Or random diversion.

- Rick Duris

This video was really inspiring.

Storytelling is actually a passion of mine in both my song writing and personal life. My dad was a great storyteller. We didn't have television, only a few DVDs and my dads imagination. and I am very grateful for that now.

I can't wait to apply storytelling more to my copywriting after seeing this video! Thanks so much for posting, will definitely check out the books...

Anyone else have a storyteller instead of TV at home growing up?