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Remember - Its not ALL about Copywriting

by CityTiger
17 replies
Just browsing through this part of the forum for the first time and although its an awesome section full of really good tips and advice - I think its important to remember that copywriting is only part of the conversion funnel.

Its a VERY important part granted, but unless you get everything else right from the site design, stucture and layout right through to the pricing, product offering and order process, even the best copywriting in the world will not get good conversions.

Just a thought to keep in mind
#copywriting #remember
  • Profile picture of the author Ashley Gable
    Well to me, the site design, structure, layout, pricing, offer and order process are all part of copywriting.

    Copywriting isnt just about the headlines, subheadlines and font size. Its selling through writing.

    The stuff that people most attribute to copywriting , like big bold headlines and highlighted words are just part of the equation, but it is the message the copywriter is conveying within the letter, that makes him a copywriter.

    And you can't craft a letter that sells unless you take into consideration the offer, the product, order process, where the traffic is coming from and pretty much everything else.

    Its a bit like telling a face-to-face salesman that talking isnt everything. He knows that, but its what he is saying that makes him what he is, and the same goes for copywriters.

    Ashley
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    • Profile picture of the author Stephen Dean
      Originally Posted by AshleyAA View Post

      Well to me, the site design, structure, layout, pricing, offer and order process are all part of copywriting.
      Cheers. Most copywriters who test copy also test site design, structure, layout, pricing, offer and even payment methods.

      It's a bundle.

      Stephen Dean
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    • Profile picture of the author kalens99
      Originally Posted by AshleyAA View Post

      Well to me, the site design, structure, layout, pricing, offer and order process are all part of copywriting.

      Copywriting isnt just about the headlines, subheadlines and font size. Its selling through writing.

      The stuff that people most attribute to copywriting , like big bold headlines and highlighted words are just part of the equation, but it is the message the copywriter is conveying within the letter, that makes him a copywriter.

      And you can't craft a letter that sells unless you take into consideration the offer, the product, order process, where the traffic is coming from and pretty much everything else.

      Its a bit like telling a face-to-face salesman that talking isnt everything. He knows that, but its what he is saying that makes him what he is, and the same goes for copywriters.

      Ashley
      I agree but like CityTiger mentioned there is more to think about than even the layout of the site or even its functionality. Your attitude and professionalism in how you conduct yourself across the web means everything and that includes how you deal with customers and how you promote yourself offsite. Your brand and reputation are what drive people to your site and let them know whether or not they can trust you. Get that wrong and it doesn't matter how beautiful your layout is or how you worded your written content.
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  • Profile picture of the author brainerd
    It is an art, science, and a bit of luck. One thing I learned very early on was to to not try and do everything myself so I started trading services with a local copywriter and now we both are more successful because of it.
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  • Profile picture of the author Raydal
    Originally Posted by CityTiger View Post

    Just browsing through this part of the forum for the first time and although its an awesome section full of really good tips and advice - I think its important to remember that copywriting is only part of the conversion funnel.

    Its a VERY important part granted, but unless you get everything else right from the site design, stucture and layout right through to the pricing, product offering and order process, even the best copywriting in the world will not get good conversions.

    Just a thought to keep in mind
    Maybe that's why it's only part of the forum.

    -Ray Edwards
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    • Profile picture of the author CityTiger
      Originally Posted by Raydal View Post

      Maybe that's why it's only part of the forum.

      -Ray Edwards
      Haha yeah fair point but I dont see any of the other parts of the forum being about designing for conversions, or any other parts of the conversion mix.

      I know the majority of people on here know that words are only part of getting a good conversion rate, still I figured it was worth a little reminder - especially for guys who may be a lot newer to all of this.

      Personally my split testing often shows that graphical layout changes have more of a positive impact than simple changing of the words. Now that could be because my copy was already fairly solid or it could be that design and layout is more important than the actual words.

      Afterall, the majority of people will scan over a page before going back to the sections that stood out and appealled to them. Depends on the product, site, niches, etc but I have found very few people read all your copy, in fact not athat many read more than maybe 50% of it, particularly on more impulse purchases.
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      • Profile picture of the author SEOArbiter
        True, copywriting is just one aspect, but I'd have to say a VERY important aspect. Not only for SEO purposes, but just as a neon open sign of your business to the world. You simply cannot have a site that is poorly written or that has grammatical and spelling errors. This will present your biz as unprofessional. Keep your copy polished and up-to-par.
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        • Profile picture of the author ARSuarez
          I think a lot of folks need to remember this. Some guys get so hung up on copywriting, they forget the only thing that makes copywriting work - the MARKETING.

          I think it was Ben Settle who said he wished he had mastered the marketing before the copy.

          It's often forgotten copy multiplies the power of the marketing, but good copy alone will not a successful business make.

          Best,

          Angel
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  • Profile picture of the author topsytoppy
    Well i guess we should all be reminding ourselves that copywriting goes beyond just writing. The purpose of a copy is fulfilled when it makes the sales or else it is just another waste of time. Like brainerd said, copywriting is an art and science of writing to make sales.
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  • Profile picture of the author Stephen Dean
    I remember arguing with someone on the forum over whether or not to include a link next to the order button saying, "Only Click Here If You Decide NOT To Buy."

    I assumed it wouldn't work. (Although I admit assuming is dangerous.)

    He told me that if a tiny link loses you the sale then you obviously didn't write good enough copy...

    ... I responded...

    ...having wider margins in your mini-letter template has increased sales on every test I've run!

    Small things do make a difference, it is definitely more than just words.

    Cheers,
    Stephen Dean
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    • Profile picture of the author Aj Wilson
      Originally Posted by Stephen Dean View Post

      I remember arguing with someone on the forum over whether or not to include a link next to the order button saying, "Only Click Here If You Decide NOT To Buy."

      Cheers,
      Stephen Dean
      Hehee... that's what "Exit Pops" are for!?

      I just cant stand the abuse of exit pops, that's all ... but anyways ...

      that's another story
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      • Profile picture of the author RickDuris
        I know a lot of folks get all excited over copywriting formulas, and checklists and "stuff" that is supposed to be in a piece. Candidly, I do too.

        However, allow me share with you a different perspective.

        One of my mentors (and I have been mentored by literally the best) told me you can have all that and end up with mediocre results.

        He would say "Ricky, your stuff is great, but it could be outstanding. Here's what your copy needs: You need to learn to go 'the last mile'."

        At the time, I had no idea WTF he was talking about. He would never say. It used to piss me off big time.

        Today I understand.

        It's a difficult concept to convey. It took me a year, maybe two to figure it out.

        But I can tell you it was worth the effort and the wait.

        Once you get done reading all the books, going to all the seminars, writing out longhand all the classics, there's a place where you come into your own.

        It's "the last mile." It's what makes the piece "sing."

        - Rick Duris

        PS: I just got off the phone with a Client. He's ecstatic. I developed a pre-recorded telephone presentation script for him. It's only been a few hours, but he's experiencing 40 to 50% conversions. Compared to 10 to 15% conversions before. I owe it all to focusing on the last mile.

        I'm not bragging here at all, I'm trying demonstrate there's a place beyond the checkboxes of what makes a great piece. It's that "somethun somethun."
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  • Profile picture of the author DanielleLynnCopy
    I agree completely - whenever I do my website copy reviews, I also go into detail about graphics placement, formatting, heck, even colors. An expert copywriter can envision conversions through more than just words.
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  • Profile picture of the author burnbebe
    I agree with all of you. Copywriting indeed encompasses a whole lot more than just writing stuff!
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  • Profile picture of the author CityTiger
    By the way I have posted in the main forum about a conversion rate survey I am running. Ill be happy to share the results on here but I could do with a few more responses so if you havent already done so please fill it in here:

    Conversion Rate Optimisation

    Should only take about 5 or 10 minutes to complete and I am giving $50 cash away in a draw from all the completed ones. Also it doesnt matter if you know everything about conversions or absolutely nothing, thats part of the point - to find out how much people feel they know and how important they optimisation is.

    Should also add that you only need to provide an email address if you want to enter the prize draw, otherwise you can complete it anonymously if you wish.
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  • Profile picture of the author Eduardo2
    Hey I got a thought...copywriting, design, whatever...as long as its converting then it's doing something good
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  • Profile picture of the author vanmed
    In the end, the ultimate result, the sale, is dependant upon the effective execution of each step of the process. Having worked for ad agencies, marketing firms, in business development and as an independant consultant, I have met few who consider the copywriter the end all be all of a project, and I know few copywrighters who consider themselves designers, project manager and ultimate messiah. It is awesome to have a diverse skill set and professional accumen in multiple disciplines, but for most it is quite enough to be a competent writer without trying to carry the weight of the world as well.
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