NLP Copywriting - Embedded Command Openings

Hopefully you're not under the impression that embedded commands in copy actually persuade readers to take action.

Alex

I presume you wrote that tongue in cheek, right? ... because that's not an embedded command.

If you can see it, it's not embedded.

I covered these in Super Power Copy. If you're lucky, you might find my WSO kicking around.

If you're lucky.

@ arsuarez, funny, i used to do private coaching with dr moine back in the day.

also harlan's regarded as the nlp copy ninja.... i know he's got an nlp copywriting course.

i'm sure someone will chime in with the url and/or feedback if they've got it.

When would right now be a good time to forget about Embedded Command Openings?

NLP was "created" by observing human behavior. Most of it doesn't translate to salesmanship in print. And what does, isn't new. Master copywriters have been using those same techniques for many years.

In the world of copywriters, NLP is simply a hook used by some copywriters to position themselves. Supposedly it gives them persuasion powers not known by other copywriters.

Alex

No fur. LOL

Yes, it's embedded. No, it doesn't compel people to read further.

People will read further because you challenged them. Or they want to see what you mean by an "open mind". But not because the phrase "read this reply" is in the sentence.

Alex

Paul and Harlan's programs are probably what you are looking for...

My guess though is the negative remarks to embedded commands are more geared to the idea that:

A. Embedded Commands don't work

B. They real don't make sales (and that's coming from people who have some success with successful copy; who can argue with Obi Wan's teacher?)

Harlan's correct though:

Hardly anyone knows how to pull off NLP in real life let alone sales copy because they don't understand how to apply them properly. That's why I believe most poeple don't believe or use them.

Basic rule: If it don't sound natural, it's a bunch of baloney. That's also why people tend to be negative about them because they hear them and go "yeah right -roll eyes"

B - I agree with this. NLP/ embedded commands are tools and they are barely take priority over such things as metaphors and stories or the many, many other tools successful copywriter's have used for decades.

The tried and true basics of copy are more powerful than any embedded command IMO.

Every tool added to one's arsenal effectively can add more power per punch...so it might be a good idea to learn them too.

Paul's Super Copy course is the real deal. It was seeing some of that material from that course that convinced me to take his mentorship program (so worth it by the way). I have not seen Harlan's material but from what I can see on his copy/posts and reading his book, he knows his stuff very well.

Here's just one of the NLP patterns I've learned that you can add to your collection...and it won't break the bank.

Ambiguities.

This little addition is great when you want to carry on the conversation even when you thought it ended...and you can start it all over again.

See? See how at first you thought the sentence ended and then it continued on?

I use spaces between my copy to emphasize my own natural style of speak but this technique I learned from a neat Apache type NLP fellow:

The Run on Sentence. Once someone thinks a thought is complete, you can really throw the mind for a loop by running the sentence on....and then getting them to buy.

Catch it? (questions hide embedded commands too). Now, if you are careful, you can add an embedded command into the run on part. Words such as "maybe" and "might" which many say are weak words can be used to soften the next idea.

For instance:

You are such a great copywriter...and in need of real help...train me.

What just happened to your brain? Fuzzy? Play with this fun jazz for a while...you just might love it.



Oh here's a 3rd technique:

The one word command:

Seems silly but I use it every day with my kids.

Instead of saying: "Billy, you left the lights on"

I say "Billy...Lights"

Think. Stop. Question. Answer. Pause for a moment.

OK so it's always one word. An incredibly short sentence works too.

Read this. And you can decide. Now....

Want it? Do you really...want it?

Now I'm just having some silly fun. Play is one of the only ways to really learn embedded commands. It again is not the end all be all. It's just a tool and for you to decide if it works for you and your copy.

Note on one word command: Notice what a command feels like - it sort of has the tonality of how firm parent would speak. That's the easiest way to spot them.

Just think for a moment....what are you doing? Opening your mind to thinking?

Anyways, as a disclamier, I'm no expert and I would respect the advice given by some of the experienced copy writers on these forums. They know their stuff for a reason. If you want info on that NLP guy, PM. Taught me more about how to really use NLP better than anyone I've ever met.

PS - The other day I was transcribing an older million dollar sales letter and saw embedded commands all over the place... and I knew the copywriter who wrote it didn't have a clue he was doing them. NLP is just an observation of what people just like copywriting is the observation and testing of what works in the real world of sales. In the end learning to write great copy will naturally produce persuasive communication better than a bunch of NLP techniques ever could.

Personally I would master copy first then add in the NLP in later.

As a psychotherapist, and one who
worked in major teaching hospitals as
well as teaching generations of medical
practitioners, psychologists, counsellors
and similar I attest that embedded
commands, paradox, metaphors and
many other 'tricks' taught in NLP do
work.

BTW as well as being a Family Therapist,
I also studied NLP at its birthplace with
some of the originators, so I'm declaring
an bias here.

There is a school of Family Therapy that
involves letter writing after each therapeutic
meeting. Embedded commands, paradox, and
metaphors may sometimes be used in these.

In effect the 'therapist' is 'selling' a patient
the ability to perceive an alternative possibility
to their pain, or problem.

Any copywriter seeking to understand how to
apply these techniques might do worse than
read the following works from the world of
therapy, rather than sales copy, and adapt
them:

The Answer Within: A Clinical Framework
of Ericksonian Hypnotherapy, by Stephen
and Carol Lankton.

Patterns Of The Hypnotic Techniques of Milton H.
Erickson M.D. Volume 1, Richard Bandler and John
Grinder.

Narrative Means to Therapeutic Ends,
Michael White and David Epston

These texts, however, will be of little use to
those who aren't devoted to the science of
copywriting.

They require some translation from the clinical
world of therapy into the that of sales. Also there is
some redundancy in the texts because perhaps
two thirds of the words are irrelevant to writing
sales copy.

The cardinal rule of good copywriting prevails
when using the techniques revealed in these books.

When you write with the interest of your
reader in mind you will make sales, but when
you write solely out of self interest even a child
will smoke you out and you'll end up falling on
your arse!

Stephen

I would just study Richard Bandlers work - He is the co-founder

So in response...since I saw this thread show up again:

They Laughed At When I Sat Down At The Piano (end of thought)...(or is it)

But Then I Started to Play...

This might be a weird this to call ambiguity but the ending of a thought that is over...and then continues to me is a use of ambiguity. You wait for the mind to go off track and then change their state or train of thought.

Sometimes people forget that changing someone's state (creating a chemical reaction in their mind and body) is part of the persuasion process.

The Lazy Way To Riches makes great use of another form of ambiguity.

There are no testimonials in that letter...but Joe Karbo knew a older lady, a younger lady, a full time mom, etc (and no I'm not looking directly at the letter as reference; I've just studied it and caught this) would lived the dream.

And there is no exact mention of their names or anything else for that matter. Complete ambiguity.

Ambiguity works and is seen in communication and sales letter everywhere. In fact successful bullets carry this very trait. And what's interesting is that hardly any successful copywriter would call it that but from a NLP standpoint that's what is being done.

NLP, once again, is the observation of what is and not the creation of something new.

What's even more effective is to study successful copy and why it works rather than studying NLP..although knowing some deeper NLP can help you catch more stuff (again study Kilstein or Hancox for some neat material these strategies)

So there you go (to the original poster of this thread). An NLP technique you can notice in copy.

My Brother, NLP Commands do and can be used in textual script. However the trick is more in the flow and the character of the writing, the pace of the literature. Creative writing is an art, it's paint strokes can be taught and mastered, but writing is much more a whole, complete task than it is focusing overly on bold fonts.

True Solution

Joe Vitale says,

“Anything you do which makes your readers react because of MENTAL IMAGES you plant in their minds is HYPNOTIC SELLING!”

Isn't all sales copy putting mental images or feelings in your customers mind?

The words you use are inputted into the copy. Could this be considered being embedded?

M E

Words are power. You all read books and scientific journals and study the best, just like me. Then you know that it's proven over and over and over again that we get different results depending on which words we choose, the way we use them and the way they are presented.

Now, what I want to know... do you suddenly feel the same urge for chocolate ice cream that I did a few minutes ago? I'm having it now.

Anyway, NLP is a way of understanding something that already exists. Master manipulators have used these "tricks" for milleniums.

It's like saying "Do you believe in reciprocity? I heard some guy Cialdini invented it." No, he didn't, he observed it and he tested it. But it was there all the time.

Now, more ice cream.

Sure, I get your point. I guess you embedded something right there in all those sweets. Funny you would make such a reference though.

What I meant was that it doesn't matter what label we put on it... be it NLP, embedded commands, conversational hypnosis or just good old persuasion. It's been there all the time, we just create theories and models to understand it and sometimes we can use those very same models to come up with techniques to reverse the process.

So yes, using the knowledge is better than just having it, however I was thinking about it in a broader sense. I should have embedded that in a more clever way. :p

If I embedded anything I didn't do it consciously. I was just adding to what you're saying, you aren't wrong.

Best,

Ross

Interesting Thread!

My opinion follows: (all of yours kicked butt)

NLP is best used when it's ON YOURSELF, to change something. I've been studying and applying NLP for about two years now, but only out of my own quest for excellence (installing successful thinking patterns, reconditioning my mind.. things of that type).

Lol.. guys like Derren Brown (people who use NLP as a vehicle for persuasion) remind me of charlatans!

Interesting thread!

So NLP doesn't work in print is the impression I'm getting.

Harlan can correct me if I'm wrong here, as I *think* I heard this in one of his talks ... mass control seminar?

ISTR a situation where someone needed some help but just would not accept it. The solution was to write up "a sales letter" that would get this guys attention in newspaper format. Because this person would not have read it or accepted it anywhere else, it was put in the john.

Apparently the result was successful, and a change in this persons behavior/actions was the result.

So I am having a bit of trouble thinking that NLP can't be effective when used in a sales letter.

Marvin

The most effective use of NLP is when you use it conversationally as in person or video. It can still be used in stories on sales letters but others suggest not in the form of embedding commands.

-Ross