Bad Breath Niche - New Product - Would Welcome Feedback and Advice

10 replies
Hello there,

My name is Dolors and I have just registered. I would be really grateful if I could get some feedback and some advice.

Last month I finished a 152 page ebook on how to cure halitosis (bad breath). Having suffered from halitosis myself for 12 years, I know very well that most (if not all) ebooks currently on the market are not the real deal (in fact, I have bought them all...)

I wanted to create a product that gave real value to the customer so have I put 9 months of my time writting it (part time). Anyway, all this is to say that I trully believe I have a product that is genuinely good, and that is not just something put there to make money, but that will really help people out.

Of course, this is worth nothing unless I can sell it! I have also spent hours learning how to do basic stuff on Photoshop and so I have created all the graphics myself. I am happy with the results so far...

However, when it comes to copywritting my sales page, I am a bit lost. The problem is that I do not have enough traffic right now to that page yet (an average of 15-20 uniques a day right now) to properly know conversion rates and do split testing.

I have tested several layouts and copy but still unsure what works best. From the sales I have made so far, I am pretty sure that emotional headlines on top and personal story on top do not work well (contrary to what I thought initially... I think it may be because they just sound a bit too scammy and people are tired of them). I find that the current layout seems to produce more sales, not sure why, but I want to improve it, so would love to hear other people´s opinions :-)

Also, I need affiliates and would also be grateful for some advice on where is the best place to find them. I will work on traffic myself, but I am no expert so will do my best by adding articles to my site and Article sites.

Not sure how to put the link to my sales page, as I have not posted enough to be allowed a link here... (EDIT): I have just noticed that you can get to my sales page by clicking over my name on the left and choosing "Visit Dolors Jou´s Homepage" :-)

Thank you very much in advance,

#advice #affiliates advice #bad #bad breath #breath #copyrighting advice #feedback #halitosis #new product #niche #product
  • Profile picture of the author John_S
    I am pretty sure that emotional headlines on top and personal story on top do not work well
    My guess is this is your story. Everybody does this.

    You have to prove you are not a data point of one. It worked for you, but will it work for me is the question (usually) in the back of the reader's mind.

    The "my story" technique often falls flat for this reason. It is best used later, "I'm not just the owner ...I'm also a customer."

    Anyway, I shall reveal a little twist. This is what you should test.

    The way I'd market this is to go out of your way to explain 1) You can order this for someone else 2) Anonymously.

    Halitosis isn't just a problem for the person who has it, and many aren't aware they have the problem or won't admit it's that bad. The people affected by this problem are the people around them.

    Finally, there is the whole rest of the industry serving this market, and pitching it just about the same way. By the way ...if it is an industry in the tens of millions of dollars as this one - it ain't a niche.

    "The other victims of halitosis" is your underserved market niche. That is the angle you work into a unique selling proposition.
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  • Profile picture of the author Ansar Pasha
    Dolors, other copywriters may be more inclined to help if there was a direct link - I know your post count is low so I'll post it here for you:

    I can remove it if you want to.

    I read the story and it sounds very genuine. Your bullets aren't half bad either... however, they lack the emotional benefit. They're only factual (already a lot of posts on facts vs benefits so I'm not going into broken record mode).

    That said, I do think you could do a few basic things to improve conversions.

    - Try removing the banner since it's distracting from the headline

    - Use a darker, more noticeable front like red or dark blue

    - Create a better headline directly addressing the audience and how they can help you... this is just off the top of my head, but something like "How to cure halitosis, even if you've tried every "solution" in the book...".

    I don't know anything about halitosis or how bad it can be - but as you mentioned - the embarrassment of the situation is something I'd work into it more.

    - Once you're done with the headline, use the lead in copy (which is currently under the testimonials). Then after that, I'd introduce the bulletpoints.

    - Also, use a story of how you reached "enlightenment" from the burden of bad breath.

    - The copy also lacks structure... the testimonials and guarantee are out of place and it seems random. There are some good resources pinned to the top of this forum to check out if you're stuck.

    Of course, all this is speculation without some stats, but sticking to classic direct response techniques couldn't hurt.

    All the best,

    P.S. Does anyone recall this ad (I think it was GH)? It was about the story of a woman who used to get asked out on many dates.. but for some reason, never got called back or followed up... she then discovered it was because of her bad breath (without her knowing until long after) - it was used to sell a halitosis product. I heard it on an interview with someone but never saw the actual ad. Maybe it could help.
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    • Profile picture of the author aandersen
      P.S. Does anyone recall this ad (I think it was GH)? It was about the story of a woman who used to get asked out on many dates.. but for some reason, never got called back or followed up... she then discovered it was because of her bad breath (without her knowing until long after) - it was used to sell a halitosis product. I heard it on an interview with someone but never saw the actual ad. Maybe it could help.
      It's a 1925 Listerine ad titled "Often A Bridesmaid Never A Bride." I have no idea who wrote it, but I just did some googling and found a copy.


      and a later version (changed)

      signature goes here

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    • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
      Hi Dolors,

      At the the bottom where your name is,
      I noticed you used the letters MD in front of it...

      are you a practising doctor?

      If so, is there anything, both legally and personally
      stopping you from using your credentials to advertise
      a book?

      If not, then I would use a Doctor theme for your letter.

      A storyline where you as a doctor suffered the embarrassment
      of all of your years of medical training, yet you couldn't cure
      your own bad breath.

      Now you have set up your authority on the subject
      in saying what is on the market are inadequate for a sufferer.

      This removes other alternative options readers may be considering.

      I see this Doctor theme is the BIG IDEA for you.

      It gives you the right to call yourself the leading authority on the subject.

      It gives you leverage to have people believe whatever you say is true.

      It gives you the power to capture your readers minds and wallets.

      And it still gives you an outlet to tell your story.

      Very interested to hear your thoughts.

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  • Profile picture of the author travlinguy
    The most powerful appeals to people come from those who have legitimately overcome a problem. As a sufferer for 12 years I'd guess you'd have a heartfelt story to tell.

    Thousands of sales letters use a very simple outline to put this across. It's not always as obvious as what I'm going to illustrate but it's used a lot because it works.

    · Feel
    · Felt
    · Found
    Does your breath wilt flowers? Are you sick of the embarrassment that goes with halitosis? Man o man, do I ever know how you feel. I felt the same way when I had it. I actually searched for the remedy for 12 years. I tried everything with almost no improvement. I was pretty much resigned to just live with the problem. But then it happened. It was actually very simple. Let me show you what I found...

    That is a brief example, not one you would actually use. Come up with a headline that captures the reader's attention. Does Your Breath Wilt Flowers, is something along the lines of what I mean. As you go through your story work in smaller accounts of your experiences that people will relate to. Maybe a date left you to find your own way home because your breath was stronger than the air freshener in his car. Not being a wise guy, here, just trying to show you what works.

    Tell your story from the heart as I've done above. Many of the top copywriters use this model though they often don't use the words feel, felt and found in such an obvious fashion. Good luck.

    One more thing, create a signature file and put your link in it. Even the newest members are allow that much.
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  • Profile picture of the author Daniel Scott
    Subtle, that is the most awesome thing I've ever seen.

    I've been experimenting with using offline "magazine ad" looks for my sales pages - sort of combining the usual sales letter style with a more visual method.

    Too early to give results yet, but I'm pretty hopeful - and your design has given me some killer ideas.

    So... thanks.

    To the OP... You can't do everything.

    I get you don't have enough cash for a copywriter... but here's what I'd do if I were you.

    Get traffic happening. This is your #1 priority. Get it to 100 uniques a day at least - a few hundred would be better.

    Then you've got two things...

    1. A baseline to test whether the changes you make will improve conversions or not

    2. MONEY!

    Money you can use to get more traffic, make more money, and pay a professional to do this for you.

    I'd also suggest that coming up with a USP - a point of difference - is a high priority.

    Ewen mentioned the doctor thing. I like that, and think a really effective story could be how your patients couldn't stand your bad breath - lots of meat in there for various reasons, not the least of which is juxtaposition (a super-successful person was shunned like some kind of drug addict).

    Whatever you run with, once you get a USP down, that's going to help you get traffic easier, because you've got something to hang your hat on. Something that's gonna make people think you're not just the same old, same old.

    And FYI - "it really works" won't cut it. You need something meaty and interesting.

    On another note - I'm impressed at the work you've put in. Kudos.


    P.S. Two people who've actually put work into their pages before asking for a critique in one day? Must be some kind of galactic equinox...

    Always looking for badass direct-response copywriters. PM me if we don't know each other and you're looking for work.

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    • Profile picture of the author Ele-Jota
      Hello there!

      Wow, I am a bit overwhelmed by the amount of replies! Thank you so much guys!

      To John_S: this is something worth considering, definitely. To add a button so that an email can be send anonymously to somebody else, to notify them that their breath does not smell of roses... Something I will definitely consider. Thank you so much for your advice.

      To Ansar Pasha: Yes, I already tried removing the banner but this is something I will need to test when I have more traffic, as so far it is impossible to tell whether it makes a difference. But yes, I agree, it needs to be removed and tested.

      I have already tried using emotional headlines and emotional language but I am very conservative so far, because I am myself so fed up with the overuse of emotional language that I am afraid of using it. I have also been on the other side (a customer) and the competitor pages are just a bit over the top in my opinion... ethically I mean. I don´t want to take advantage of bad breath sufferers, although I want to capture their attention of course.

      Again, until I have more traffic, it is only a guess knowing what works best. But so far, sales have only occurred when I have not used the emotional headlines on top. Could of course be a coincidence or that my headlines were rubbish :-) I used "Chronic Halitosis Sufferer Finally Finds a Way to Permanently Cure Bad Breath After 12 Year Battle"... Not sure if it is any good but no sales occurred.

      Thank you very much for your advice, I really appreciate it!

      To Travlinguy: as I was saying above, I am a bit fed up myself (when I am in the customer role) of ending up in (competitor) pages where I can clearly see they are overdoing it on the "emotional" front.

      I think the market I am trying to appeal to is those who have already tried many bad breath products and nothing has worked. So they will be wary and SUSPICIOUS, and so I want a page that looks more professional than emotional, if that makes any sense. Although I agree I need to use more benefits than facts, and more emotional headlines. I just don´t know how to do it in a subtle way without looking like I am just marketing the product. I will definitely remember the "feel, felt and found" rule. Thank you so much for the advice.

      To Ewenmack: This has made me smile! MD stands for Maria Dolors, my name. I never thought this could be confused with Medical Doctor, and who knows, maybe it plays in my advantage. But no, I am no doctor I am afraid! I am a single mum of a two year old studying for a Physics & Maths degree; not sure mentioning that would help me make me any more sales! LOL

      In fact, one of the main competitors (livingbadbreathfree(*)com) is using that already. He is a doctor and is using this fact and a pic of him (or a model) with a coat in his sales page. I am sure it is good for credibility. However, in my case, I have to use the fact that I overcame the problem after 12 years, as my credibility tool. Thank you for your idea, though, I really appreciate it.

      To Mr Subtle: You definitely know how to make yourself noticed! That is brilliant! I must confess, I have a mixture of feelings: I feel rubbish for having spent nearly 2 weeks to end up with the sales page I have now, and then in a matter of hours, voila, you come up with this LOL

      I honestly cannot afford paying for something like that now (I would obviously if I was a doctor LOL) but also, I first need traffic so I can test what works best, before investing (when I have the money) in better design and copy. For now, I will definitely contact you soon for affiliate banners and ads if you do those at a reasonable price, as I like the idea of using something similar to this to advertise the book. Thank you so much for your idea, I am sure it has inspired others too :-)

      To Daniel Scott: I totally agree with the idea of combining a visual method with the conventional sales style. As I mentioned, I think people are getting used to the same layouts and structure so, in order to stand out, the magazine ad look seems like a very good option to stand out from the crowd.

      And yes, I need traffic and I will start working on it right now! I look back at the last two weeks, constantly tweaking, changing this and that, just GUESSING what might work. As much as I enjoy it, the fact is I have no real clue what works. So it is a waste of time, I suppose. Statistics, including conversion rates, are useless unless large numbers are involved. I should know that... So I will leave the page as it is now until I get 100 uniques, this is my goal for the next weeks.

      Absolutely, when I get the money, I can use it to pay the proffessionals rather than do it all myself and spend centuries learning how to do it!

      Regarding my USP. I am a bit worried about one thing. ALL other competitors are using the the fact that their product can "eliminate bad breath in X seconds" " X hours" "... in X days" This is what people want to hear. A QUICK way to get cured.

      However!! The problem is, I KNOW THIS IS NOT TRUE. You cannot eliminate chronic bad breath in hours, not even days. If you are lucky a few weeks. And this is precisely WHY I have written this book: to give people the REAL way to go about curing bad breath: learning to identify the real underlying causes and treating them individually. Mouthwashes or home-made potions ARE NOT the solution, contrary to what the competitors say.

      So how on earth do I capture customers the same way competitors do, when I cannot say "fix your bad breath in 90 seconds flat" like livingbadbreathfree(*)com does for instance....?? I need to be smart I guess and test what works best, and make the page look professional as well...
      Thank you so much for your advice!

      Anyway, again, I really appreciate everybody´s feedback and advice. I did not expect this response and you have all been really helpful :-)

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      • Profile picture of the author Lene
        Your product sounds interesting.

        If you are going to attract affiliates, I think you need to add your product to Clickbank or get some different affiliate program that offers your affiliates 50-75% of the sale.
        NoobListBuilding - List building for newbies
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        • Profile picture of the author Ele-Jota
          Hi Lene,

          Yes, I had it on Clickbank for a long time but was not successful in gathering affiliates that really drove traffic to my site. In January I removed my book from Clickbank and signed for KDP in Amazon, which does not allow the book to be made available elsewhere.

          It is going well so far, so I am happy :-)

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