Is reading the best copywriting books like a college degree in copywriting?

12 replies
I was reading a thread here about the Top Copywriting books ever and wanted to ask this question. Hopefully this will help those of us that believe they are still a novice copywriter and have a lot left to learn.

OK, so let's say someone read all these books below and was a total newbie writer before reading. Wouldn't it be plausible (Thanks Mythbusters!) that that person would have to be at least a "good copywriter" by the time they finished all those books AND put some of that knowledge into action? So the question remains, if someone, a total newbie writer wanted to learn copywriting and all they did was read all of these books and put into use only 5% of the knowledge contained, how good of a copywriter do you think they would be? I think 5% would be very low, however that is very easily attainable so that is why I used that percentage.

Oh, and let's say they have a high school degree and are fluent in English. Didn't want the argument that it depends on level of education or vocabulary. Let's just say the "average Joe" for this hypothetical situation.


This list came from the thread: Top Copywriting books ever

"Scientific Advertising" Claude Hopkins

"Tested Advertising" Caples (4th edition or earlier only)

"How I Raised Myself from a Failure to Success in Selling" Betger

"How to Write a Good Advertisement" Schwab.

"How to Write Sales Letters That Sell" Drayton Bird

"The Robert Collier Letter Book" - by Robert Collier

"Tested Advertising Methods" -by John Caples

"How To Write A Good Advertisement" - by Vic Schwab

"The Lazy Man's Way to Riches" - by Joe Karbo

"Break-Through Advertising" - by Eugene M. Schwartz

"7-Steps To Freedom" - by Ben Suarez

On Writing - Stephen King

"Advertising Secrets of The Written Word" by Joe Sugarman

"Making Ads Pay" by John Caples

Web Copy That Sells by Maria Veloso

The Architecture of Persuasion by Michael Masterson

Influence The Psychology of Persuasion by Robert Cialdini

The Adweek Copywriting Handbook by Joe Sugarman

"The Elements of Copywriting" by Gary Blake and Robert Bly

"The Ultimate Sales Letter" by Dan Kennedy

Cashvertising by Drew Eric Whitman

"Write to sell " it is written by Andy Maslen

"Influencing Human Behaviour" by H.A.

"Tested Sentences That Sell" by Elmer Wheeler

"Unlimited Selling Power" by Moine and Lloyd.

Writing for Emotional Impact by Karl Iglesias

Bob Bly's "The Copywriter's Handbook"

How To Make Your Advertising Make Money - John Caples

Tested Advertising Methods - John Caples

The Copywriters Handbook - Bob Bly

The Adweek Copywriting Handbook - Joseph Sugarman

Sales Letters That Sizzle - Herschell Gordon Lewis

Cash Copy - Jeffrey Lant

Magic Words That Bring You Riches - Ted Nicholas

Ogilvy On Advertising

Method Marketing by Denny Hatch.

My First 50 Years in Advertising by Maxwell Sackheim.

The Greatest Direct Mail Sales Letters of all Time " by Richard Hodgson.

How To Write Advertising That Sells by Clyde Bedell

Ads That Sell by Bob Bly

How To Write A Good Avertisement-- Victor Schwab

Advertising Headlines That Make You Rich-- David Garfinkle

Magic Words-- Ted Nicholas

Robert Collier Letter Book-- Robert Collier

My Life In Advertising -- Claude Hopkins

Bird - Commonsense

The First Hundred Million by E. Haldeman-Julius

David Ogilvy's "Blood, Brains and Beer"

"Confessions of an advertising man"

"Million Dollar Mailings" by Denison Hatch

"The Wizard of Ads" trilogy by Roy H. Williams

Making Ads Pay by John Caples

Method Marketing - Denison Hatch

"How to Write Sales Letters that Sell" by Drayton Bird.

Hypnotic Writing -- Joe Vitale

"The Lazy Man's Way to Riches" - by Joe Karbo

Denny Hatch's Million Dollar Mailings
#books #college #copywriting #degree #reading
  • Profile picture of the author ProfitwithAdam
    I think it would have to be similar to a college degree in copywriting. I mean in college you learn all the fundamentals, techniques, strategies, etc. for a given career. Usually its not till the end when you do an internship when you actually put your knowledge to work. So reading these books (or textbooks for college) would be very much the same in my opinion. Especially if you have some projects that you would be working on as sample projects while reading these books.

    So, if someone read all these books and only got out of it and applied only 5%, then they would have to be pretty good at the craft. I mean those names are most of the best of the best out there. So using those methods would have to give you a great shot to be a very good copywriter.

    My personal experience was that I was a self proclaimed horrible writer, however after reading a few of these, I started writing a lot better. It sucked, but writing is the best way to get better. Reading and constantly learning is great and a must, but putting what you learned on paper helps a great deal. Looking back at my first few articles before reading a few of these classics versus now after reading a few, is a giant leap forward. My articles are getting picked up more and my sales and conversions have multiplied dramatically. After all, a sales letter could be written well, but if it doesn't convert, it still sucks!
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  • Profile picture of the author John_S
    Wouldn't it be plausible (Thanks Mythbusters!) that that person would have to be at least a "good copywriter" by the time they finished all those books?
    No. You become a good copywriter by doing, not reading. Even reading about others who do it.

    This is the fallacy (the myth) of college. That reading is doing. What you propose is akin to reading about writing, then considering yourself a good writer having read about THE ACT.

    I'll let you in on a little secret. Reading these books merely gives you how the author thinks they did it ...not how they actually did it. (Or it tells you how the author wants you to think they did it).

    You learn something by doing it a thousand books will not imbue. You have the information, not the knowledge. The real reason behind the crown jewel of college out in the world: The Unpaid Internship.

    To a copywriter, that is your final grade. You will have to admit, colleges have tests. And you've passed none by just reading. You must demonstrate your understanding of what you have read.

    And sorry, but most will do so by copying what Schwab or Nicholas wrote, then passing it off as though they've learned something. So the college thing is somewhat apt, but oh so wrong.

    Having read these books, a sub par copywriter will try to write like Sugarman, or Caples. And fail. As a good copywriter you learn to write like you.

    Having read the books, you are ready to start learning to be a good copywriter. You do so by writing ..and having that writing tested and produce results. Poor, fair, good, great ....this is your final exam grade give by customers who grade with their dollars. And they do not grade on a curve.

    Copywriting Sells Stuff. What's a plausible comparison? Salesmanship. Go sell something, face-to-face.

    Reading these books does not make one a good copywriter. Merely a good reader.
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  • Profile picture of the author Hans Klein
    Originally Posted by ProfitwithAdam View Post


    OK, so let's say someone read all these books below and was a total newbie writer before reading. Wouldn't it be plausible (Thanks Mythbusters!) that that person would have to be at least a "good copywriter" by the time they finished all those books? So the question remains, if someone, a total newbie writer wanted to learn copywriting and all they did was read all of these books and put into use only 5% of the knowledge contained, how good of a copywriter do you think they would be? I think 5% would be very low, however that is very easily attainable so that is why I used that percentage.
    I think your metaphor that it's like a college degree is somewhat accurate.

    You'll get a basic understanding of how it works.

    However... when you go out into the real world... you'll likely find that there's still a lot to learn. Your "Degree" didn't really prepare you all that well.

    In other words... reading these books may give you new "tools" in your copywriter's arsenal. But you've got to actually put fingers to keyboard to make them a part of you.

    So... I think you'll find your answer is that you need to do both...

    Learn the theory... practice the theory.

    That said... let's say you run a local restaurant where nobody else is doing direct-response marketing. A low-competition market. You could probably put together a pretty responsive ad from reading just a few books and putting what you learn into action.

    It's quite different than say writing an ad for financial investors... or even Internet marketing.
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  • Profile picture of the author John_S
    Doing is learning. The idea performing a skill has merit as a teaching tool is merely out of fashion.
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  • Profile picture of the author Jake Gray
    For the most part, reading is a major learning source for a lot of us. It'd be
    useless to read tons of books related to copywriting, psychology or persuasion
    and not take action. As John said, you learn from actually putting pen to paper,
    not just reading. That being said, If you are planning on reading a few books,
    then make sure you take notes, but nothing lengthy.
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  • Profile picture of the author ProfitwithAdam
    I think I wasn't clear enough in my original post. When I said put into use only 5%, that is doing.

    When I said "Wouldn't it be plausible (Thanks Mythbusters!) that that person would have to be at least a "good copywriter" by the time they finished all those books?" I thought that meant you had to put that into action, thus the 5% comment. I'm not that naive thinking one can read something and be amazing at it. I know that doesn't work, I've read several stock market / investing books and am still not rich as they claim I would be. I've probobly made some better decisions on investments knowing what to look for, because of reading and putting into good use what was read. But, without the knowledge you will lose your ass in the stock market.

    If I had a choice of writing and learning on my own that way versus reading the techniques from the experts AND writing, I gaurantee you that the guy who learns from the experts is going to have a better writing career than the self taught guy. At least his chances are greater. There are several who are self taught from the list above, but the odds are not in their favor.

    Why do so many of us buy WSO's? Because the OP has or supposedly has the skills and knowledge that will make you successful and if we buy their report or product they will teach it to us. Wait a minute, there was no action at this point. Just learning and then action, so it is a very good idea to learn and then put into action or both at the same time. Which is what I said above. If you have purchased an WSO before, then your point of reading and putting that into action is not as good as just doing is a moot point. Because if your theory is accurate there would be no WSO's purchased.

    The point i was making was that if you just write, but don't have the knowledge or the concepts to help figure out why your copy isn't working, then your just a writer. Period. But, if you learn from the best, learn from good copy that converts and put that new knowledge into use, it should help you make your copy better.

    I know it works for me. And no I don't copy and paste from the best copy and say its original. All my sales letters have been original and I fine tune them till they get the conversions the way I am happy with them. Constantly split-testing copy. That is what a good copywriter does, which I am not claiming to be, but always strive to be.
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    • Profile picture of the author arfasaira
      Sighs...

      Ok, you spend 5 years in medical school to learn AND apply.

      If I read all the best books on brain surgery, does this mean I'm qualified to perform brain surgery?

      Can you imagine a patient asking 'how many times have you done this surgery before?'

      and surgeon saying 'oh i've read about it hundreds of times...'

      I'm sure anyone with common sense would probably run as fast as they could out of there.

      If you really want to do copywriting, reading isn't enough - you need to apply, as John points out above.

      Ross Bowring does a really good dissection of some sales letters in his 'Stripped Naked Sales Letters' which is very useful for anyone wanting to learn the ropes and understand how to put a good sales letter together.

      Other than that, practice, practice and more practice until you get good.
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      • Profile picture of the author Ross Bowring
        Originally Posted by arfasaira View Post

        Ross Bowring does a really good dissection of some sales letters in his 'Stripped Naked Sales Letters' which is very useful for anyone wanting to learn the ropes and understand how to put a good sales letter together.

        Other than that, practice, practice and more practice until you get good.
        Thanks...

        Way to become my favorite camouflage wearing baby on this sub-forum!

        Getting good at copy is a dual path. On one side you are scratching and crawling to find finer distinctions about what makes better sales copy. On the other side you are working to apply that knowledge daily, or as close to daily as you can come.

        Reading the held-up canon of books is essential. But so is scouring forum posts for insights... blogs... articles... anything you can get your hands on.

        Then there's the great lightbulb moments you can gleam from studying letters in detail sentence by sentence. But all this is not for much unless you apply that knowledge with enthusiasm.

        Ultimately... you get good at writing sales letters by writing a lot of sales letters.

        --- Ross
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  • Profile picture of the author John_S
    All my sales letters have been original and I fine tune them till they get the conversions the way I am happy with them. Constantly split-testing copy. That is what a good copywriter does, which I am not claiming to be, but always strive to be.
    Okay, but I've encountered something you might not be aware of.

    And that is people who have not read the books, who manage to master something many copywriters strive for: Authenticity.

    They may be all "aw shucks" in print. But they do still get the sales job done.

    To really graduate, you have to study up on how people doing all the wrong things (well, truth be told, many things ... they get a few key things right) triumph over what the books keep telling you. As a quote/unquote good copywriter, look for those letters which buck the trends and accepted wisdom.

    You'll learn more.
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  • Profile picture of the author RefundHost
    A college degree in copywriting would cost about as much as all those books
    and whether you read them or not, you won't be an effective copywriter
    until you understand the true essence of what they are teaching
    and some of them may even be WRONG.

    The best way to be a good copywriter is to:

    Find similar product offers - examine how they are presented.
    Model yours after those offers.
    Then TEST different changes to see the effect on sales.
    THEN ( and only then ) will you be a competent copywriter.
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