NO, You Really Do Suck!

Ashley Gable

14 years ago

hmmm.....

Would the person you be so graciously guiding them to be yourself?

Thanks
2 replies

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max5ty 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Ashley Gable

hmmm.....

Would the person you be so graciously guiding them to be yourself?

No sir, I haven't taken a new client in over 3 years.
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Mark Andrews

Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Ashley Gable

hmmm.....

Would the person you be so graciously guiding them to be yourself?

If you read this gentleman's posts you would obviously and very clearly see this is not the case.

He's merely making a point. A point which it has to be said...

...you might learn something from, rather than instantly jumping to a false conclusion insinuating his thread is advertising spam. Blatantly it's not. But then, I would have thought that much was obvious.

Obviously not. Which is why he's such a good copywriter.

Riddle that one through your syntax membrane.

Thanks
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Ashley Gable

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Pete Walker

If you read this gentleman's posts you would obviously and very clearly see this is not the case.

He's merely making a point. A point which it has to be said...

...you might learn something from, rather than instantly jumping to a false conclusion insinuating his thread is advertising spam. Blatantly it's not. But then, I would have thought that much was obvious.

Obviously not. Which is why he's such a good copywriter.

Riddle that one through your syntax membrane.

Pete, talking to me like I am some sort of bull****ting child just trying to rile up an argument doesnt sit well with me.

I read his post.

A couple times.

I know he is a good copywriter. I know he is a helpful copywriter on here. I know you are a good copywriter, and I know you are helpful on here.

But that doesnt change the fact that he puts up a post (that has been said over and over mind you) that presents a problem and then he offers to "guide them".

Hey I can be wrong, I cant read minds thats for sure. I can only go by what was written. He replied to my post very nicely. I got it.

Doesnt change my impression of the post.

Ashley

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max5ty

14 years ago

You know Pete, that's one reason why I like you...

You're a straight forward..no holds barred type copywriter...

You're on your way to be one of the best there ever was.

You're not there yet, lol, only because we're not always reading about you...

You're good enough to get there though -- let's give it some time.

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petevamp

14 years ago

Now if you are pertaining to the message I placed here. If you read the entire message. I said I am no copywriter nor would I ever claim to be. However I am not going to spend anywhere from 60-300 for a single solo message with out knowing if it is going to convert. When I can write it my self. I hate to write and 3/4 of the time I outsource this aspect. But I will not pay a copywriter to right a solo message for me when its not being sent to my list at all. I only asked for thoughts on my message and what changes any one here things I should make. Nothing more. I just want an oppinion on my message to see what you actual copywriters thoughts would be as to changes I can make to it to make it better.

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max5ty

14 years ago

Ashley...I'm wishing you all the best.

Been doin' this for over 25 years...it's a good business to be in.

The reason I mentioned a Maserati in my last post is because my 25 year old son just bought one last week.

It's a great life being a copywriter.

Hoping you get the best from what you're doing...

Thanks
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Alex Cohen

14 years ago

Originally Posted by max5ty

Ashley...I'm wishing you all the best.

Been doin' this for over 25 years...it's a good business to be in.

The reason I mentioned a Maserati in my last post is because my 25 year old son just bought one last week.

It's a great life being a copywriter.

Hoping you get the best from what you're doing...

Since all you've made regarding yourself are unproven claims, and since you haven't identified who you are...

Well, enough said. Nothing personal.

Alex

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max5ty 14 years ago

Originally Posted by Alex Cohen

Since all you've made regarding yourself are unproven claims, and since you haven't identified who you are...

Well, enough said. Nothing personal.

Alex

Alex, I don't have anything to hide.

Here's my cell phone number

419-296-2354

Call me if you want to talk.
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- Daniel Scott 14 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by max5ty
  
  Alex, I don't have anything to hide.
  
  Here's my cell phone number
  
  419-296-2354
  
  Call me if you want to talk.
  
  A cell # doesn't really prove anything.
  
  Why not tell us your name... maybe a little bit about your history in the world of business and copywriting.
  
  Where have you worked (and worked on)... what have you done... and where are you in life now-a-days?
  
  Obviously you don't have to answer any of this if you'd rather not. But I - and presumably others - are certainly interested.
  
  -Daniel
  
  Thanks
  
  1 reply
  
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  Always looking for badass direct-response copywriters. PM me if we don't know each other and you're looking for work.
  
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  Mark Andrews Banned 14 years ago
  
  So ring him up then and have a conversation with the fellow Dan.
  
  He kindly made the offer. It's available there for you to take advantage of the offer.
  
  Nitpicking on him demanding he reveal his identity etc is uncalled for. He doesn't have to prove himself to you or anybody.
  
  He's taken time out to offer good advice on the forum, others have benefited from it, he asks for nothing in return, not even a signature link, but one or two of you still want to piss in his pond.
  
  Is there some jealousy going on around here when someone obviously successful posts here?
  
  He's been upfront with you. Provided his number.
  
  Call it.
  
  Thanks
  
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Ashley Gable

14 years ago

Originally Posted by max5ty

Ashley...I'm wishing you all the best.

Been doin' this for over 25 years...it's a good business to be in.

The reason I mentioned a Maserati in my last post is because my 25 year old son just bought one last week.

It's a great life being a copywriter.

Hoping you get the best from what you're doing...

I guess that puts me in my place, I mean I am 24 and I only have a Volkswagen, shucks :rolleyes:

Thanks

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HeySal

14 years ago

Interesting that guys always measure success in terms of sports car ownership.

I have a jeep patriot. 1/5 or less the price of a maseradi -- And I am not stuck playing on the sidewalk. (Although I will admit to having to jack and push after getting high ended on outcrops in creek beds every now and again.)

Copy writing takes talent - but it also takes an understanding of status-quo. I have always assumed that once someone understands the true nature of the status-quo, it would leave them impetus to break away from it - untie from the restrictions of the socially imprinted lifestyle. But still the sports car comes into the conversation.

Sport cars, hair club for men, freak if you get mud on the Italian loafers, and never trust a woman who doesn't own a pravda handbag. All so damned sad to see that a lucrative creative profession doesn't loosen the tethers tad.

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Sal
When the Roads and Paths end, learn to guide yourself through the wilderness
Beyond the Path

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Mark Andrews

Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by max5ty

You know Pete, that's one reason why I like you...

You're a straight forward..no holds barred type copywriter...

You're on your way to be one of the best there ever was.

You're not there yet, lol, only because we're not always reading about you...

You're good enough to get there though -- let's give it some time.

Thanks Max. Sincerely.

It will take time yes. Many years. That's cool. And even then, I might not get there. Truth is, copywriting is something which I enjoy but it's not my true vocation. If I become known for anything, I would hope it would be that instead.

In the meantime if I can earn my clients a tidy little sum doing something I very much enjoy, I'm happy.

Kindest regards,

Pete

Originally Posted by Ashley Gable

Pete, talking to me like I am some sort of bull****ting child just trying to rile up an argument doesnt sit well with me.

I read his post.

A couple times.

I know he is a good copywriter. I know he is a helpful copywriter on here. I know you are a good copywriter, and I know you are helpful on here.

But that doesnt change the fact that he puts up a post (that has been said over and over mind you) that presents a problem and then he offers to "guide them".

Hey I can be wrong, I cant read minds thats for sure. I can only go by what was written. He replied to my post very nicely. I got it.

Doesnt change my impression of the post.

Ashley

Ashley. I never called you 'a bullsh*ting child'. Those are your words not mine.

Wherever you picked up this insinuation, I have no idea.

Your interpretation is skewed. Of your own making. A false premise projected towards others who are simply trying to help you to see the light.

Personally I don't know what you're on and to be honest with you, I don't really care either.

Originally Posted by HeySal

Copy writing takes talent - but it also takes an understanding of status-quo.

Heysal, what's with the self positioning of yourself as being in a qualified position to tell other professional copywriters where they're going wrong, or telling them what you think they don't already understand?

Only coming from somebody who hates marketing (your words not mine) and isn't a professional copywriter, one has to take everything you say on this forum with a pinch of salt.

*****

General comment:

What beats me is that Max was just trying to be helpful. Freely giving of his time. His professionalism. And his expertise.

When other Warriors simply leap down that persons throat who otherwise had good intention, is it little wonder why a lot of the other top copywriters only visit the Copywriting Forum these days so infrequently?

Ahhhhh, soon will come the day when the newbies will all be telling everyone else how to do their jobs.

Great! :rolleyes:

Pete Walker

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Ashley Gable

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Pete Walker

Ashley. I never called you 'a bullsh*ting child'. Those are your words not mine.

Wherever you picked up this insinuation, I have no idea.

Your interpretation is skewed. Of your own making. A false premise projected towards others who are simply trying to help you to see the light.

Personally I don't know what you're on and to be honest with you, I don't really care either.

I picked up the insinuation the same way you picked up my "leaping down his throat". Those are your words not mine. And the same way I picked up on his original post.

Its called interpretation.

I dont need help "seeing the light". I am quite capable.

I dont need to be enlightened.

You are acting like you a gift from God here in the forum.

You are no doubt a hell of a copywriter, I have seen the posts Rick Duris and others put up praising you.

But your not my cup of tea I have to say.

Ashley

Thanks

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Ashley Gable

14 years ago

Originally Posted by Pete Walker

When other Warriors simply leap down that persons throat who otherwise had good intention, is it little wonder why a lot of the other top copywriters only visit the Copywriting Forum these days so infrequently?

Well you have been here only a couple of months and you almost have as many posts as me.

So it cant be that bad, now can it :rolleyes:

Originally Posted by Pete Walker

Ahhhhh, soon will come the day when the newbies will all be telling everyone else how to do their jobs.

Great! :rolleyes:

Oh pete dont you know, we have been doing that for a looong time.

Its just that those who actually listen to us arent really going anywhere to begin with.

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Daniel Scott

14 years ago

First thing's first...

Don't put words in my mouth.

I never "demanded" he do anything... nor did I "nitpick".

Hell, I straight-out said he didn't have to answer unless he felt like it.

But you tell me what's better...

A hundred people calling your cell... so you can talk to them all?

Or posting info that can be verified on a forum once?

(Yeah, I get some people don't want to post about themselves on a forum for various reasons. Nothing wrong with that.)

The second part of your post I take issue with is... obviously successful?

Why? Because he said so?

I'm not having a dig at the guy... for all I know he could be the real deal.

From the posts of his I've read, I totally agree with some of it, and think some has been pulled from his nether regions (like the video thread).

Now, you're absolutely right... he doesn't have to prove himself to me. And I never said he did.

But when people disagree on things that I've found via actual split-testing (both mine and others')... I want to know when, where, why, and how.

And frankly, if someone's going to post about their success, questions will be asked. Why you've got a problem with people doing their due diligence instead of blindly drinking the kool-aid is beyond me...

Especially when there are so many wannabes and pretenders on here saying they're super-successful when they're writing copy for peanuts.

I mean c'mon... the guy's even said "PM me and I'll tell them about a copywriter I know" after he's been leaving a rash of posts on the forum (most of which don't, to me, provide any really tasty content).

Look Pete... I've been here a while. I've seen a lot of people come and go.

I also know there are people on here who are praised as great copywriters with impeccable, big-name pedigrees who will turn around and write WSO letters for $300... and lie, cheat and steal while they're doing it.

I know this because I talk to the guys who hire them.

Now... to clarify, because you seem to delight in taking things out of context... I'm not putting max5ty in this boat.

I'm simply saying I don't know jack about him. And since I take my business very seriously, I like to qualify people who drop blanket statements... because they could be very well be right.

It's a public forum, Pete. I'm within my rights to ask a question. And I'm pretty sure max5ty is a big boy and doesn't need you jumping to his defense for every perceived slight.

-Daniel

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Always looking for badass direct-response copywriters. PM me if we don't know each other and you're looking for work.

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JakeDaly 14 years ago

There are a lot of sayings from old Greek, Roman & Chinese philosophers that all basically say the same thing: Those that are truly successful and secure in their ways will very rarely mention those successes.

You may attempt to argue the OP wasn't trying to "brag" and was rather "trying to make a point." Let's just say a good lesson very rarely includes a side comment about recently buying a Maserati. Shame on both of you, max and Mr. Walker. Two members of this copywriting forum who, until today, have always come across as wonderful contributors to this forum.

I suppose it is just a lone hiccup, but still..
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- Mark Andrews Banned 14 years ago
  
  Mountains out of molehills?
  
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  gjabiz 14 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Pete Walker
  
  Mountains out of molehills?
  
  you are carrying the biggest shovel.
  
  If there is a mountain being built...why do you keep throwing on more dirt than anyone else?
  
  Or, maybe, it's just me and the way I things going around here.
  
  gjabiz
  
  Thanks
  
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  gjabiz 14 years ago
  
  Originally Posted by Pete Walker
  
  Mountains out of molehills?
  
  you are carrying the biggest shovel.
  
  If there is a mountain being built...why do you keep throwing on more dirt than anyone else?
  
  Or, maybe, it's just me and the way I see things going around here.
  
  gjabiz
  
  Thanks
  
  1 reply
  
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  Mark Andrews Banned 14 years ago
  
  What I'm seeing is a few of you having a right go at him (Max.)
  
  Why? I have no idea. No idea at all. Overall he's proven to be very helpful on this forum and has posted up some excellent advice. Advice which Gordon, you yourself have thanked him for on more than one occasion.
  
  I don't like to see posters ganging up on anyone for no reason and I don't usually care too much how many other people are involved. If I see someone being picked on unnecessarily, both offline and online, I'll usually rally to that persons defense if I feel a need to.
  
  It wasn't so long ago, if you recall, that somebody else was calling a few of the other copywriters out and there too, I jumped to their defense.
  
  Everyone is in business for themselves here. We're all in this together. There's plenty enough work to go around. So why jump on other guys just because one disagrees with a couple of points made? Making the other party look bad? What's the point of that? What good does that accomplish?
  
  You call that throwing dirt? Well, that's up to you Gordon. Whatever.
  
  Max is a good contributor on this forum as is pretty much everyone else most of the time. Rather than seeking to cause division, why not do more to bring us together to support one another with a bit more encouragement rather than all of this negative BS, mud slinging etc?
  
  Wouldn't that create a better outcome?
  
  Thanks
  
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Pusateri

14 years ago

Pravda handbag? Is it free with a subscription?

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HeySal

14 years ago

Heysal, what's with the self positioning of yourself as being in a qualified position to tell other professional copywriters where they're going wrong, or telling them what you think they don't already understand?

Only coming from somebody who hates marketing (your words not mine) and isn't a professional copywriter, one has to take everything you say on this forum with a pinch of salt.

Pete - where did I say they were going wrong? I made an observation. It is an observation that has me doing an RCA dog head tilt. You keep raging about "marketing and copywriting". I have a pretty hefty background in cognitive sciences. Okay? I see a juxtaposition that surprises me. So I said so. That makes me pompous? What a lark.

So if I'm pompous what are you when you keep insisting because I don't LIKE marketing and copywriting that I have no understanding of it? God I swear if I had too much testosterone in my system I'd run out and grab several copywriting jobs just to prove something.

My view that you like to twist? If someone is writing something that is truthful and it sells a crap load of products - it's pretty obvious that they aren't doing anything wrong, whether it appears they are or not. Make sense to you? I don't care if what they write violates every known "should work this way" in the book - if it works it works. Human response isn't the black and white science some people want to believe it is. If it were, everyone who wrote copy would know how to achieve 100% results from a target group.

But I can still be amazed at some of the mindsets that are in the game without being deserving of flaming and I do not understand how people who spend their lives cracking through to obscure status quos still have regard for them. Maybe from your self elevated view of copywriters that is blasphemy - but from a cognitive science orientation, it's a freaking valid question -- so unknot your panties before you give yourself a hemorage.

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Sal
When the Roads and Paths end, learn to guide yourself through the wilderness
Beyond the Path

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Mark Andrews Banned 14 years ago

Originally Posted by HeySal

God I swear if I had too much testosterone in my system I'd run out and grab several copywriting jobs just to prove something.

So why don't you then?

Thank me for the encouragement later. I think you'd do quite well to be honest. You've got the sheer bloodymindedness for it, you're intelligent and you can write very well indeed.

I'm happy to have been of some assistance to you today.

Kindest regards,

Pete Walker
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Doceye

14 years ago

And my dad can lick your dad any day of the week ... and twice on Sunday.

(wielding conducting baton)

Tap, tap, tap. Attention members: tempo, please ... tempo. We're all playing in the same orchestra.

Doc

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NO, You Really Do Suck!

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