Unconscious Persuasion Techniques

by Mark Andrews Banned
32 replies
As copywriters we may sometimes tap
in to the power of using unconscious
persuasion techniques to direct the
action.

To direct a prospect, to get them to
do what we want them to do.

What specific psychological tactics
or persuasion phrases do you use
and why?

And further, what do you think is the
effect this has on the persons mind
who is reading your sales copy?

Or indeed to bring a potential client
on side?

Please feel welcome to post your
thoughts or opinions or indeed any
links you wish to share below...


Mark Andrews
#nlp #persuasion #persuasion psychology #persuasion techniques #persuasive psychology #power of persuasion #techniques #unconscious
  • Profile picture of the author ThomasOMalley
    Curiosity is a powerful motivator.

    One good persuasion technique to use the power of curiosity is to ask relevant questions that require the reader to read more to get the answer.

    For example, Do You Make These Mistakes In English? The reader has to read more copy to find out what those mistakes are.

    Also, get prospects to see themselves doing what you want them to do with future pacing...use words like "imagine", "picture this", "think about this."
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  • Profile picture of the author Mark Pescetti
    Create a massive sense of immediate consequence for BOTH taking and NOT taking action.
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  • Profile picture of the author Rezbi
    Originally Posted by Mark Andrews View Post

    As copywriters we may sometimes tap
    in to the power of using unconscious persuasion techniques to direct the action.
    Unconscious persuasion techniques?

    Isn't that, like, black magic voodoo stuff?

    Is that legal?
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    • Profile picture of the author Mark Andrews
      Banned
      Originally Posted by Rezbi View Post

      Unconscious persuasion techniques?

      Isn't that, like, black magic voodoo stuff?

      Is that legal?
      Advertising Rezbi is full of hidden persuasion techniques.

      You see it all the time on the TV for example.


      I guess, you must think this should be outlawed yes / no, which?

      Cults use these unconscious persuasion techniques all the time as well, what would you do, ban all cults or anything which could be used as a psychological weapon to get people to do what you want them to do?

      Politics another example, spin doctors, what are you going to do Rezbi, ban this whilst you're at it? Call it illegal? Well? Where do you draw the line?

      What's morally corrupt and what's acceptable, where do you draw the line and how do you define the boundaries? By what kind of precise measurement? Further how does this work in practice?

      If you want to play Orwell's thought police, please be my guest.

      I'm just playing devil's advocate with you.

      Come back with a response worth reading - I'm more than interested in your answer.


      Mark Andrews
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      • Profile picture of the author Rezbi
        Originally Posted by Mark Andrews View Post

        Advertising Rezbi is full of hidden persuasion techniques.
        Advertising me?

        Who would want to advertise me?

        And how is advertising me full of hidden persuasion techniques?
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        • Profile picture of the author V12
          Originally Posted by Mark Andrews View Post

          Advertising Rezbi is full of hidden persuasion techniques.
          Originally Posted by Rezbi View Post

          Advertising me?

          Who would want to advertise me?

          And how is advertising me full of hidden persuasion techniques?
          Just couldn't resist bringing this up. Amazing what can be conveyed with a couple of commas.

          Advertising, Rezbi, is full of hidden persuasion techniques.
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  • Profile picture of the author RedShifted
    This stuff works better than conscious persuasion techniques imo. Eban Pagan used a TON of it in his dating salesletters.

    One technique is to interupt a pattern at the point you induce a specific emotion. The way I do this is simple. If I'm trying to induce fear, I will intentionally word my language in an unnatural way, right before I trigger the fear.

    Its like throwing up a "subliminal stop sign" in your sentence, then you induce the emotion. This does 2 things at once. It confuses the persons thought pattern, then spearheads a focused emotion straight into their brain. What it winds up really doing, is strengthening their memory. So they remember the emotion at the point they felt "weird" or "unnatural".

    All you're really doing is breaking a pattern, then dropping an emotional anchor. You can repeat this over and over as much as you want.

    Then there are very subtle ways to anchor social proof. Without a person even noticing it. One thing Eben always did, was start off his stories with "I was talking to a friend today". Most people don't even view something so subtle as social proof, but depending on how the story goes, you can use it to create massive social proof. The friend can wind up being Tony Robbins or some other well known figure. So many ways to take this.

    Then obviously you can use consistency to have a person agree with things they normally wouldn't. We use to run these patterns verbally when seducing women.
    Those are the "yes" patterns you see people use in their copy. Again, you can get pretty fancy with this stuff to induce thoughts people normally may not agree too. This one I will rush, so it probably won't work as well as it should.

    "Do you agree that most pedophiles were sexually abused when they were younger?"

    Yes.

    "Do you see how most pedophiles suffered trauma at younger ages?"

    Yes.

    "Do you think most pedophiles had remodels who corrupted their thinking?"

    Yes.

    .........

    "So then you realize that most pedophiles really aren't bad people?"

    Ye..... WTF!!

    lol. Pedophiles was probaly a horrible example. And it takes time to execute this so it always works. But I definitely use it a lot in my copy.

    I honestly love subliminal persuasion more than conscious persuasion. I just believe it works a lot better and there are so many different techniques you can use.

    Another thing that works is using honesty to set reference points. Than using that reference point to make people believe things they normally wouldn't believe.

    What you do is overtly be VERY honest in your copy.
    You can say 3 things that make you look BOTH bad & honest.
    But its a balancing act. When you do this, you have to make yourself look more honest than bad. Like you can tell people you always make typos. Or that you suck at grammar. And that you're also afraid of heights (it could be anything like this).

    Directly afterwards, you can feed people hype, and have them believe it. Like "90% of people who took my coaching made over $1300 in the first week".

    Now this example doesn't flow right (I didn't connect the thoughts), but you can see what I mean. People FEEL honesty so much in your copy, that it gives you leverage to feed them extravagant claims. There are so many different ways this can be used. Some evil, some just to get a point across.

    Honestly, I'd love to see someone write a book about this stuff. I'm not good at explaining it, but I learned a lot of this stuff when I learned NLP. We use to run patterns on women and I was suprised by how effective they were. But there's lots of calibration involved. If you learn how to do this stuff verbally, using it in copy is that much easier imo.

    Great thread Mark!
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    • Profile picture of the author ewenmack
      This method I learnt from Clayton Makepeace.

      It's naming the reader's enemy.

      Do it and they become your buddy,
      and not an advertiser to be cautious of.

      Here's an Adwords ad I wrote for credit repair
      which demonstrates it.

      CREDIT SUCKS?
      Don't you hate it how those BIG companies
      make you feel like crap? I'll fix your bad credit.
      Call 1 877 305 5753
      ---------------------------------------------

      Best,
      Ewen

      P.S. I've seen split test results where just 2 words
      in the headline including "sucks" has been the winner.
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      • Profile picture of the author Alex Cohen
        If by "unconscious persuasion" you mean "bypass the critical mind", story works very well. It's a great technique to use to bypass buyer resistance.

        Alex
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  • Profile picture of the author zapseo
    I hate the term the word unconconsious. I think it's a mis-representation -- as though it's something asleep. And it's not.

    What we describe as conscious and unconscious would be better categorized as awareness and attention. (And, no, I'm not going to up-end the whole nomenclature here - too big of a task, especially for one small WF post.)

    I do think "subliminal" is reasonably descriptive -- as that is the creation of associations in the reader's mind without their direct conscious awareness that that association is being made.

    As for Rezbi -- I remember Rezbi from Fortin's board -- and having some of the same moral qualms then.

    ...and now has a link saying they are giving up the copywriting game. Funny. I thought that's what Rezbi was doing way back then.
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    • Profile picture of the author Mark Pescetti
      Originally Posted by zapseo View Post

      I hate the term the word unconconsious. I think it's a mis-representation -- as though it's something asleep. And it's not.

      What we describe as conscious and unconscious would be better categorized as awareness and attention.
      Awareness is part of one's attention.

      All the word "unconscious" means is: Underlying conditioning.

      People don't have a clue WHY they do what they do.

      ...WHY they think what they think.

      ...WHY they believe what they believe.

      ...WHY they have certain preferences.

      ...WHY they tell certain stories about their lives (but exclude others.)

      ...Etc.

      When a really emotionally targeted piece of advertising captures someone's attention (including their awareness,) it's triggering their unconscious (a.k.a. the stuff that makes them do what they, want what they want... and they don't know WHY exactly.)

      You know...

      Conditioning. (Or programming)

      Most prospects are weak-thinking.

      In other words...

      They're the product of their environment.

      ...

      So let's say you're selling a financial opportunity.

      And you're targeting people who are struggling to make ends meet.

      On the surface...

      All of your claims for financial freedom will challenge their limiting beliefs.

      Their conditioning (and environment) says, "You can only make so much money."

      Yet....

      If you can get underneath their hair-trigger impulse to just say "bullsh!t" - by successfully articulating what they REALLY want...

      ...you'll be talking with their "unconscious," so to speak, and overriding their conditioning just enough to make the sale.

      I've said this before...

      Sometimes you need to challenge people's beliefs to make the sale.

      But challenging their beliefs doesn't mean saying, "You're wrong!"

      It just means appealing to the wants and desire they don't let themselves accept as being possible or realistic - long enough to whip out their credit cards.

      Anyways...

      mark

      P.S. Harnessing this information is only immoral is you're selling crap. If you are, go shoot yourself in the face with a double barrel shotgun. Otherwise, like I said above: Create consequence! People eat that sh!t up.
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  • Profile picture of the author zapseo
    Most prospects are weak-thinking.

    In other words...

    They're the product of their environment.
    And if people aren't a product of their environment, Mark ... what are they a product of?

    Don't give me this crap about "deep thinking" ... isn't their ability to think deeply still a "product of their environment"?

    This is part of the paradox of free will: Whether you choose nature vs nurture -- neither answer leaves much room for free will.

    I'm more than willing to consider the sheep-like way in which groups of people move -- but I think it's a GRAVE error to think you (or anyone) is free from that. Social acceptance is a strong motivator and has considerable "survival" value -- in MANY MANY ways. It plays an important part in handling stress and consequently plays a strong role in health.

    I also choose not to dis other people by using a perjorative term such as "weak thinking."

    Live JoyFully!

    Judy
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    • Profile picture of the author Mark Pescetti
      Originally Posted by zapseo View Post

      And if people aren't a product of their environment, Mark ... what are they a product of?

      Don't give me this crap about "deep thinking" ... isn't their ability to think deeply still a "product of their environment"?

      This is part of the paradox of free will: Whether you choose nature vs nurture -- neither answer leaves much room for free will.

      I'm more than willing to consider the sheep-like way in which groups of people move -- but I think it's a GRAVE error to think you (or anyone) is free from that. Social acceptance is a strong motivator and has considerable "survival" value -- in MANY MANY ways. It plays an important part in handling stress and consequently plays a strong role in health.

      I also choose not to dis other people by using a perjorative term such as "weak thinking."

      Live JoyFully!

      Judy
      I'll rephrase,

      Weak thinking = Does not believe in creating their own reality = in reaction to their circumstances.

      Someone who is a product of their environment looks outward for their next step.

      The beauty of acknowledging that is...

      You have the opportunity to empower your prospects and help them exercise free will that goes far beyond their current sense of boundaries.

      Mark
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  • Profile picture of the author copyassassin
    I'm currently testing PPC ads with small little tweaks that believe it or not, make a huge difference.

    For example, commas, upper vs lower case, adding in numbers, make a HUGE difference. Even word order makes a difference.

    On landing pages, rounded edges vs 90% edges make a difference.

    Also, if using a graphic of a woman, try different shades of hair and eye color. Also, try different hues of red lip stick on the woman. This is a job for a photoshop nerd, but you an outsource this on fiverr.

    Also, and this will immediately increase your opt-ins, make the "submit" button right aligned.

    please send commision check to 255 E. Santa Clara St, Suite 210, Arcadia CA 91006
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  • Profile picture of the author zapseo
    Whatever peeps beliefs are -- still a product of their environment, no ?

    If I persuade someone that they can create their own reality, or leap over their limiting beliefs, or whatever ... it's still part of their environment ...

    Someone who is a product of their environment looks outward for their next step.
    Sorry, my Pescetti parsing engine isn't functioning today ... not quite sure what you are saying there. (It actually sounds a bit contradictory to your previous post.)
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    • Profile picture of the author Mark Pescetti
      Originally Posted by zapseo View Post

      Whatever peeps beliefs are -- still a product of their environment, no ?

      If I persuade someone that they can create their own reality, or leap over their limiting beliefs, or whatever ... it's still part of their environment ...



      Sorry, my Pescetti parsing engine isn't functioning today ... not quite sure what you are saying there. (It actually sounds a bit contradictory to your previous post.)
      Everyone on planet can only perceive what their beliefs and judgments allow (usually B.S. that's been instilled within them at a young age.)

      React if you must to that last statement.

      Now...

      If you capture someone where they are (e.g. aggitate,) you'll get them reading.

      Or watching/listening (if you're using video.)

      You're appealing to their present beliefs (and potentially triggering either their hope or fear, depending upon your aggitation approach.)

      This is the "product of your environment" part of the copy.

      Now...

      Let's say you're selling something to audience that desperately wants the results you claim your product or service provides.

      Will they believe you straight away?

      Nope.

      Duh, right?

      Now...

      If you've got a clear insight into WHY your avator finds themselves in the position they're in...

      ...you can speak to those emotions/circumstances and get them to shut off the naysaying noise/voices in their heads.

      Once you achieved this sometimes lofty goal...

      You can challenge their conditioning (i.e. unconscious influences, including limiting beliefs) by articulating what they REALLY want and WHY it's NOT pie-in-the-sky.

      If you're persuasive enough...

      You'll reach their raw desire...

      ...and overcome their cerebral (unconscious) need to over-analyze everything to the point that they reach an emotional stalemate (thus walking away.)

      In words words...

      Yes...

      Everything people see... or witness... or include in their experience is the result of conditioning (from being the product of their environment...)

      But when you know that; when you meet prospects WHERE they are, you can HELP them overcome the conditioning keeping them stuck in limitation and open them up to embracing what they really want...

      ...rather than settling for what they have (and resent.)

      Cliff notes:

      ...Uncover why your prospects settle for less (i.e. their limiting-belief-inducing objections.)

      ...Help them make sense of their current circumstances.

      ...Appeal to their raw desires and create a sense of consequence for remaining complacent or fearful to move forward.

      ...Really go in-depth about what can become available to prospects - WHEN they take action.

      ...Repeat consequence (i.e. what they'd be leaving on the table should they walk away. Let them know, on some level, that just because they haven't necessarily achieved what you're promising, it doesn't mean it's not within their immediate grasp.)

      ...If you have social proof, use it here. The age old concept of, "What one man can do, another man can do" is a powerful way of challenging one's conditioning (i.e. unconscious.)

      ...If you're really brave, acknowledge their mindset and bring forth the limiting beliefs (conditioning) that is keeping them stuck at square one.

      Anyway...

      No people aren't stupid.

      But you have to acknowledge that most prospects are searching for solutions because they need help.

      If you can help them...

      ...you need to understand the conditioning that got them stuck in the first place - so you can address it and put prospects at ease.

      Anyways...

      Mark
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  • I think "aware" and "unaware" - are much better than "conscious" and "unconscious".

    Saves a lot of confusion.


    Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author copyassassin
      Originally Posted by Steve The Copywriter View Post

      I think "aware" and "unaware" - are much better than "conscious" and "unconscious".

      Saves a lot of confusion.


      Steve
      Steve, I really like your choice of words. I think you nailed it. Just to add onto your foundation, like say "unconscious" or "subconscious" is really "mental processing that requires no active thinking". Or, "auto-processing".

      Things like blood pressure, sugar levels, hormone levels are all done with "auto-processing", which as you have brillantly said, we are "unaware" of.

      In fact, most of our lives are built on "auto-processing" because "thinking" requires too much time, effort, and resources.

      To add to this conversation, questions to ask a group of people that mirror your target population:
      • Political Heroes?
      • Hated Villains?
      • Inspiring Books
      • Most hated teacher?
      • Favorite Teacher?
      • Favorite Book?
      • Childhood traumas (if willing to share)?
      • Political affiliation of parents?
      • Favorite Cartoons growing up?
      • Imagery of Safety?
      • Imagery of doom?


      Use this information in your copy to tell a powerful story.

      I come from this belief: it's easier (and more profitable) to reinforce existing beliefs, prejudices, & ideas than implant new ones.

      Figure out the "train tracks" of your customers "auto-processing" brain, and you'll be a wealthy dude (or babe).
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      • Profile picture of the author Mark Andrews
        Banned
        Originally Posted by Rezbi View Post

        Advertising me?

        Who would want to advertise me?

        And how is advertising me full of hidden persuasion techniques?
        Sorry Rezbi, you've lost me.

        To everyone else...

        Thanks for taking the time to go back and forth on this conversation. Some interesting thoughts are coming out here.

        Splitting hairs aside, whatever we decide to label the process, I do believe in any one moment we can change our own perception of reality.

        True enough, thoughts, suggestions, on the other extreme, mind control can be implanted into individuals minds fairly easily.

        And some people they are admittedly much more prone than others to accept such signals or frequencies directly into their own brain chemistry.

        Naturally, we all are attuned to accept some programming whether or not we realize what is going on. And some of this programming embedded into the mind can affect some people adversely a lot more than others.

        Environmental conditioning too of course plays it's part. Local customs, history, culture, perception, can vary massively even across relatively short geographical boundaries.

        But understand this, in any one moment if you're switched on and completely aware of yourself, tuned into a higher frequency if you will, you can at any one moment choose to switch off certain signals, block others or only allow limited amounts of information through which you believe in the long run will benefit your survival instinct.

        As a few of you know, I was born 3rd generation into an American mind control cult operating here in the UK.

        Until the point when I was 28 years old, I actually had no choice whatsoever to pick and choose what I perceived to be my own understanding of life. All thinking was done for me by what we 'apostates' call the Borg (the organization which you're not allowed to question upon pain of death - you can only begin to imagine how this went down with me).

        The first 28 years of my life were extremely confusing. In the end driving me very close to the point of suicide. I left the organization because quite frankly I thought their teachings sucked - to put it just a tad very mildly.

        In leaving, I lost everything familiar to me, my home, wife, son, business, mother, father, sister, extended family and about 600 'friends' I'd know since birth. Totally excommunicated they're now forbidden even from saying a greeting to me should they meet me in the street.

        What I find amazing is people's susceptibility to accept such teachings and to act these out in life even though this goes against their total natural instinct.

        People will often go to extraordinary lengths to protect themselves from 'perceived' harm. No matter how daft the implanted thought pattern or behavior model is to the rest of us.

        Now 45, pushing 46, us cult mind deprogrammers, an activity I still partake in part time voluntarily (I'm on call 24 hours a day 365 days a year for the worst affected victims who may be very close to suicide throughout the UK) this past time will often push my mind to it's limits. It can be incredibly difficult at times to help an individual whose thinking flies completely in the face of conventional wisdom. Someone whose thinking model is based upon such powerfully embedded commands, received often since the day they were born.

        Mind control is a subject which fascinates me (obviously). I've studied it in depth for years. Finding, identifying and undoing the negative effects of mind control so a person can experience total and complete freedom. Releasing the inner child who for so long has been virtually snuffed out of existence. It's a source of great joy to me and gives me a huge amount of satisfaction when a person finally starts seeing the light and is prepared to get out there and start living their life on their own terms.

        Unconscious persuasion techniques are all around us constantly. Some of these can influence the mind in very negative ways. Not all though. Some silently embedded psychological commands can help release a person from the chain of bondage to which they've held on to for so long.

        In copywriting, salesmanship-in-print we also can use these triggers for good or bad purposes. Which one we choose is up to us. Me? I prefer the former.

        My ultimate goal in copywriting is to help other people. Help them to find working solutions to problems which they might be experiencing in life. Helping them to release themselves from a pattern of behavior which to date has been perhaps unknowingly biting them in the ass. Holding them back.

        A clever use of words, a language twist, a riddle, or simply a straight out command to action can have remarkable effects on the person reading your sales copy.

        In the self development niche, which niche from a copywriting perspective I'm most interested in pursuing, if used responsibly can be used to great effect to nudge an individual in a direction which ultimately will help transport them up to the next level of consciousness.

        Conscious thought patterns are those ones we're aware of. We may 'see' words floating past our conscious mind in the the form of a thought pattern, which through choice, we can choose to either latch on to or ignore altogether knowing in advance based on environmental conditioning what the resultant effect will be.

        Unconscious thought patterns though often try to play with our mind and we can be completely unaware of their existence. They can be used as a force for good or a force for evil purposes and much in between too. Sometimes almost impossible to label and define even under close examination.

        Unconscious programming comes in all shapes and sizes not just written language. Music, symbols, color, mood programming and much more can be classed as unconscious programming. Most are completely unaware of it's existence which is why it can used as such a powerful weapon of communication.

        Communication isn't always about building bridges. Sometimes, depending on the person discharging the unconscious programming they can wield their power to influence a susceptible person whether they like it or not.

        Anyway, I better stop there because at this rate, I'll be sat here all night writing at top speed upon the subject.

        I just hope one or two of you enjoyed these few extra words - it's a subject I'm certainly highly passionate about.

        Please do feel welcome to continue with the discussion. I'm really enjoying reading and taking in some of the responses so far.

        Warmest regards,


        Mark Andrews
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        • Profile picture of the author RedShifted
          Originally Posted by Mark Andrews View Post

          Sorry Rezbi, you've lost me.

          To everyone else...

          Thanks for taking the time to go back and forth on this conversation. Some interesting thoughts are coming out here.

          Splitting hairs aside, whatever we decide to label the process, I do believe in any one moment we can change our own perception of reality.

          True enough, thoughts, suggestions, on the other extreme, mind control can be implanted into individuals minds fairly easily.

          And some people they are admittedly much more prone than others to accept such signals or frequencies directly into their own brain chemistry.

          Naturally, we all are attuned to accept some programming whether or not we realize what is going on. And some of this programming embedded into the mind can affect some people adversely a lot more than others.

          Environmental conditioning too of course plays it's part. Local customs, history, culture, perception, can vary massively even across relatively short geographical boundaries.

          But understand this, in any one moment if you're switched on and completely aware of yourself, tuned into a higher frequency if you will, you can at any one moment choose to switch off certain signals, block others or only allow limited amounts of information through which you believe in the long run will benefit your survival instinct.

          As a few of you know, I was born 3rd generation into an American mind control cult operating here in the UK.

          Until the point when I was 28 years old, I actually had no choice whatsoever to pick and choose what I perceived to be my own understanding of life. All thinking was done for me by what we 'apostates' call the Borg (the organization which you're not allowed to question upon pain of death - you can only begin to imagine how this went down with me).

          The first 28 years of my life were extremely confusing. In the end driving me very close to the point of suicide. I left the organization because quite frankly I thought their teachings sucked - to put it just a tad very mildly.

          In leaving, I lost everything familiar to me, my home, wife, son, business, mother, father, sister, extended family and about 600 'friends' I'd know since birth. Totally excommunicated they're now forbidden even from saying a greeting to me should they meet me in the street.

          What I find amazing is people's susceptibility to accept such teachings and to act these out in life even though this goes against their total natural instinct.

          People will often go to extraordinary lengths to protect themselves from 'perceived' harm. No matter how daft the implanted thought pattern or behavior model is to the rest of us.

          Now 45, pushing 46, us cult mind deprogrammers, an activity I still partake in part time voluntarily (I'm on call 24 hours a day 365 days a year for the worst affected victims who may be very close to suicide throughout the UK) this past time will often push my mind to it's limits. It can be incredibly difficult at times to help an individual whose thinking flies completely in the face of conventional wisdom. Someone whose thinking model is based upon such powerfully embedded commands, received often since the day they were born.

          Mind control is a subject which fascinates me (obviously). I've studied it in depth for years. Finding, identifying and undoing the negative effects of mind control so a person can experience total and complete freedom. Releasing the inner child who for so long has been virtually snuffed out of existence. It's a source of great joy to me and gives me a huge amount of satisfaction when a person finally starts seeing the light and is prepared to get out there and start living their life on their own terms.

          Unconscious persuasion techniques are all around us constantly. Some of these can influence the mind in very negative ways. Not all though. Some silently embedded psychological commands can help release a person from the chain of bondage to which they've held on to for so long.

          In copywriting, salesmanship-in-print we also can use these triggers for good or bad purposes. Which one we choose is up to us. Me? I prefer the former.

          My ultimate goal in copywriting is to help other people. Help them to find working solutions to problems which they might be experiencing in life. Helping them to release themselves from a pattern of behavior which to date has been perhaps unknowingly biting them in the ass. Holding them back.

          A clever use of words, a language twist, a riddle, or simply a straight out command to action can have remarkable effects on the person reading your sales copy.

          In the self development niche, which niche from a copywriting perspective I'm most interested in pursuing, if used responsibly can be used to great effect to nudge an individual in a direction which ultimately will help transport them up to the next level of consciousness.

          Conscious thought patterns are those ones we're aware of. We may 'see' words floating past our conscious mind in the the form of a thought pattern, which through choice, we can choose to either latch on to or ignore altogether knowing in advance based on environmental conditioning what the resultant effect will be.

          Unconscious thought patterns though often try to play with our mind and we can be completely unaware of their existence. They can be used as a force for good or a force for evil purposes and much in between too. Sometimes almost impossible to label and define even under close examination.

          Unconscious programming comes in all shapes and sizes not just written language. Music, symbols, color, mood programming and much more can be classed as unconscious programming. Most are completely unaware of it's existence which is why it can used as such a powerful weapon of communication.

          Communication isn't always about building bridges. Sometimes, depending on the person discharging the unconscious programming they can wield their power to influence a susceptible person whether they like it or not.

          Anyway, I better stop there because at this rate, I'll be sat here all night writing at top speed upon the subject.

          I just hope one or two of you enjoyed these few extra words - it's a subject I'm certainly highly passionate about.

          Please do feel welcome to continue with the discussion. I'm really enjoying reading and taking in some of the responses so far.

          Warmest regards,


          Mark Andrews
          This post blew my mind, and I thank you for sharing that.
          I had a "similar" yet different scenario earlier in my life. That I never talk about here.

          But I was also subjected to a form of "mind control". Nowhere near as severe as yours, but severe enough to shatter my identity. Rather than pick up the pieces, I had to find a completely new way to think and live.

          Essentially, my youth was plagued in drugs. But that wasn't the "mind control". Just normal peer pressure. I got so wrapped up in the culture, that I wanted to lead it. So I started manufacturing MDMA and various other designer drugs (before I even got into drugs I was reading chemistry books, I always had a passion for chemistry long before psychology). And it earned me a lot of "respect" from my peers. That was the culture I was a part of. It was all I really knew back then.

          Then 2 months after I entered college, my home was raided by the DEA, and I was thrown in prison. All my money was gone, my life, my family, my friends, my girlfriend, my dog.. everything I cared about was gone. Well except my honor because I never had any. This is something I never talk about on here, but since you shared your story, I decided to share mine.

          At 19 years old, when all my friends were starting college, I was serving a 7 year sentence. I was never a bad kid, I was obsessed with money and "respect". The drugs kept me blind. In prison, the "mind control" was delivered by the CO's and other prisoners. In the form of "institutionilization" (sp). It wasn't enough for my life to be torn to pieces at a young age, but I was demeaned and beat to shit in prison. Long story short, I somehow survived 3 years and got my first parole date.

          But it is the sole reason I have such a passion for psychology. Without psychology, without learning how people tick, my tiny little ass would have not survived that situation. I went in knowing really nothing about people, and the trauma of life forced me to learn psychology quick.

          I can't even explain how good some criminals are at manipulating people. At intimidating people. At scaring people. So one thing I became really good at, or I think I did, was controlling my own mind. When I got out I immediately put myself through college, and got my degree in psychology. I also got into seduction, and women became my new "addiction". And no I was never good with women. I only thank psychology for that. I also thank Eben Pagan as thats when I first discovered him. Graduating was one of the best days of my life. Probably the first time I was really proud about something. And from then on my life has been nothing like it use to.

          I won't go into depth, as there is so much to say about this experience. All I can say is I'm glad you shared that. There is A LOT that can be learned through extreme adversity in life. And I wouldn't trade that experience for anything in the world... even money. What I gained from it is truely invaluable.

          I'd imagine your situation would be exactly the same.

          Take care man.
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          • Profile picture of the author Mark Andrews
            Banned
            I'd change a few things for sure but the lessons learned like you were invaluable nonetheless. And like you, in the past, I've done my fair share of mdma. And lots of other illegal drugs too back in my very wild rave days.

            Our history is what makes us not breaks us. It's in the past where it belongs now.

            What is important is the here and now not the past.

            It's what our plans are for the future, how we intend to live our lives in the moment which counts now.

            Personally, I don't care about anyone's history. I don't judge or at least I try not to. I try to treat everyone the same. Everyone on this planet deserves dignity and respect.

            There's already too much division going on - we don't need more.

            Division just causes ill feeling and at worst war. And what purpose does this serve except to line the pockets of the puppet masters with the money and control they crave by setting individuals and countries one up against the other.

            I'm not going to serve their megalomaniac interests. I refuse to bow down when they say jump.

            Life is about building bridges of understanding between people not fueling further causes for war or lack of respect for others. If we all pulled together more in mutual trust and understanding, each holding out a hand of friendship rather than division the world would be a better place for it.

            Pointless arguments, attacking others just for the sake of it, well, to be honest with you, it gets most awfully boring after a while. Same old. Same old. Heard it all before. Seen it more times than I care to recall.

            These people who try and tell you they're better than you, that they have the truth and you don't is all about setting up an us against them mentality. This kind of group control can work very powerfully for some but at the end of the day to quote one great prophet, he said, "If they're not against us they must be for us."

            We all have common traits in common. Whether we choose to believe it or not we're all actually quite similar in many regards. We all need to eat, sleep, have sex, need company, and want to feel loved or to be admired and respected for who we are.

            So I say to you, embrace who you are, don't be afraid to poke your head above the parapet, be justifiably proud of who you are and never be afraid to live your life to the full.

            That's my advice to you for what it's worth.

            Enjoy life! You only live once as far as we know. Take advantage of life. Love it. Love yourself and love other people and commit random acts of kindness.

            Now go kick some ass!

            Kindest regards,


            Mark Andrews
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  • Be brill to keep this thread going with more examples.

    It's destined to become an advanced copywriters crib sheet.


    Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author Sean Ryan
    Mark Andrews - Interesting thread! Thanks!

    Where would be the best place to learn this kind of thing? Any top book recommendations? or even training courses to help teach persuasion in this manner?

    I am still quite new to copywriting but having seen this work first hand I am interested in learning as much as I can on the subject.

    Thanks,

    S
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  • Sean,

    Mr Andrews is taking extended leave from this esteemed forum - the colloquial word is "banned"

    Not because of this thread. Although I think he managed to persuade himself or persuaded others to make him leg it.

    As far as "persuasion books" go - most are extremely convoluted.

    Often they end up negating what they set out to achieve. Or are so complex you need a degree in astro physics to make any sense of them.

    Top notch books on the noble art of selling can be the most helpful.

    Type in "selling" on amazon and look at the reviews.

    Choose the ones that fit your style.

    Hopefully others will give a few more suggestions.


    Steve
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    • Profile picture of the author Sean Ryan
      Originally Posted by Steve The Copywriter View Post

      Sean,

      Mr Andrews is taking extended leave from this esteemed forum - the colloquial word is "banned"

      Not because of this thread. Although I think he managed to persuade himself or persuaded others to make him leg it.

      As far as "persuasion books" go - most are extremely convoluted.

      Often they end up negating what they set out to achieve. Or are so complex you need a degree in astro physics to make any sense of them.

      Top notch books on the noble art of selling can be the most helpful.

      Type in "selling" on amazon and look at the reviews.

      Choose the ones that fit your style.

      Hopefully others will give a few more suggestions.


      Steve
      Doh! Looks like I will have to check the dates on the threads I post in from now on as well! Thanks for letting me know Steve, appreciated!

      I will take a look at amazon and see what I can dig up - I do find it fascinating, I just don't know where to start!
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  • Sean,

    This is one of the best known and most respected books on persuasion.


    Influence: The Psychology of Persuasion:...Influence: The Psychology of Persuasion:...


    Steve
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  • Profile picture of the author contentedmal
    I like a little reverse psychology. So, I don't try to sell my services directly; I merely strike up a conversation and let things develop naturally. I hate being sold to, so I never 'sell' to others.

    To be honest, I have mixed results!
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  • Profile picture of the author The Copy Warriors
    I don't use NLP or anything like that. In my opinion, all that stuff is mega-overrated and 80% of it doesn't work.

    There are certain NLP tactics that are effective--such as embedding suggestions inside of hypothetical statements--but these are the exception rather than the rule.

    Honestly I think the best way to 'subconsciously' influence a reader/prospect is to just have the sales letter be as entertaining as possible, using devices like:

    - Story telling.
    - Jokes.
    - Personality and personable "one on one" communication.

    People have an inherent tendency to be more compliant toward people they like, and these kinds of techniques instantly make you more likable.

    Of course, there are exceptions to the rule. It can pay at times to use fear or even slight condescension in a sales letter (I'm thinking the Rich Jerk sales letter here), but again, exceptions, not rules, etc.
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