How Did You Get The Ball Rolling As A Copywriter?

One other side note...

What forms do you recommend I will need to do this right? Is there a good place to get sample forms I can modify to my own copywriting business?

Most copywriters go in the opposite direction. They start out as
copywriters and then move towards writing for their own products.
They see this as freedom.

Why would you want to do the opposite? Or you just want another
branch to your business?

-Ray Edwards

I created a product. And since I was too dumb to know that copywriting was an exalted specialty unto itself I wrote the copy for it. And it did pretty well. I actually came across my second sales letter as I was searching for something on my hard drive and I think it's pretty good. It sold better than the first.

I don't write copy for people anymore though I did for awhile. One of the most important things you're going to need starting out is a portfolio, stuff to show your prospects. By the time I decided to write for others I had three converting sales letters (my own products) and could prove I was making sales. Bang, zoom.... I was a copywriter.

I'd much rather be writing fiction though.

I started out like you.

I made money on my own, selling products I created, then thought, "If I can do this for myself, why not other people?"

I only took on a few small projects before figuring out exactly how I could most effectively help people sell their solutions (i.e. position my copywriting business.) For me, it's about being genuine and using every single piece of copy I write as an opportunity to build up my confidence and knowledge-base.

I also chose to march to the beat of my own drum. I don't quote the guru copywriters every chance I get on this forum or with clients just to make myself sound more astute. And once you realize this biz is almost entirely about emotion, you may very well end up studying self help books to help you write copy more than courses and bibles written by the greats.

Mark

Hey Dayne,

Good question.

For me, I hadn't originally planned to become a copywriter. I literally fell into the industry. The longer version of the story is on my copywriting site but for the sake of brevity, my first paid client was a friend who guilted me into helping him with his marketing. He had introduced me to my future wife years before so that was his ace in the hole for the guilt trip. What I wrote worked really well for him and he immediately referred four other small business owners to me without even asking me if I was looking for clients.

I treated it like a part-time hobby business for months... new clients were gotten strictly from word of mouth referrals that previous clients sent my way. When I decided to get more serious about it, I launched a copywriting WSO to build a broader portfolio and get testimonials. I also wanted more leverage to get the fees I wanted to charge so getting at least one more client hit was an easy way to accomplish that goal.

Unlike many WSO copywriters, my WSO was a short-time special offer. Every WSO I've ever run, both copywriting and info-product, has always had a firm expiration date or limited spots available and I stick to it.

A special offer is not a special offer if you don't have an expiration date or limited spots that you stick to -- it's become your standard price instead. My initial WSO also explained why I was running the WSO -- to add a wider range of portfolio samples and get client testimonials.

I'll tell you the same thing I've told a number of my copywriting students... a WSO is just another marketing weapon in your arsenal. If it makes sense from a strategic standpoint to run one -- be it for needed cashflow, building a portfolio, getting client testimonials -- then it's a good weapon to use. But like any other marketing weapon, you don't want to rely 100% on it to get clients.

To be honest, I think you may be better suited to look for other marketers to partner with. You bring the copywriting skills to the table... they bring something else like traffic generation or programming skills to the table. If you have any product launch experience or JV brokering experience, that's another way you can partner with similar level or higher level marketers.

That's the business model, many marketers like Ryan Deiss (partnering with copywriter Perry Belcher) and Jason Fladlien (partnering with programmer Wilson Mattos) have eventually transitioned into because IMHO, collaborating keeps them motivated and inspired.

When you get into the copywriting business and already have a good marketing background, then you may find it frustrating to work with clients who do not have the same level of marketing experience or better. You're looking to help them with their marketing -- not because their personal mentor. This last point will depend on you... I don't know how much you like to mentor or teach people... I don't know if you have the patience to do so... mentoring/teaching others is a separate skill set and not everyone has it or has the desire to develop it.

It's also a really good idea to not take on any projects that you aren't passionate about the product or the niche... the prospect might be excited about their new underwater basket-weaving course but if you don't feel the same then it's going to be much harder to get your creative juices flowing to write their copy.

Hope that helps,

Mike

Mike, absolutely excellent points...

I've actually never done any type of WSO and I'm still debating it as far as copywriting goes. Lately I've been brainstorming ideas on who I might be able to couple my services with or providers who already provide a service who might be able to promote my services for a commission per successful lead. All kinds of angles to look at really.

I really love the point you made Mike about only taking on projects that I feel some sort of passion towards. I couldn't agree with you more. Of course, I don't have to be highly passionate about it, but a little helps.

I think the key is simply providing absolutely killer copywriting to new clients. I think when the work is good, like many have said...the money will naturally come. Of course, a nice sprinkle of marketing here and there won't hurt either, especially at first to get things rolling.

I'm not going to lie, I've taken a look at a few WEBSITES of "copywriters" lately and I've literally been appalled at what I've seen. I think to myself, if they can't even put together a decent looking site, WHY would anyone in their right mind hire them?

One guys site I looked at yesterday was simply awful (and so was the formatting and text to be honest), and yet he says his monthly retainer was like $3-$4k minimum. Bzzzz! No way. At least not to a person like me. I'm sure his copywriting was just as bad.

When I see crap like that, I think to myself, I KNOW for a fact I can do better. I know people don't have to have the best looking website with all the bells and whistles, but c'mon...at LEAST put some personality into it, and some decent formatting. Look at what it says about yourself.

Anyway, ranting here...enough about that...

What do all of you think about taking on projects from places like Elance, ODesk, or Guru.com?

Dayne, I would figure out your price for copy that you like to write and specialize in that area. For me I write copy for service businesses and product copy for Christian ministries (think back of the book type copy).

For myself I love to write short affiliate reports that I give away and sell low cost (I write my own copy) and I write my ad copy and descriptions for products and services.

Whatever you do specialize in something anything, that way you will be known in other marketers minds (Copywriters too), that you specialize in such and such type of copy.

There is an old saying "If you don't stand for something, you don't stand for nothing"

By specializing in a certain kind of copywriting let's take sales letters, in a certain niche that you enjoy or a hot niche that is in demand all the time and you stand to make a lot of money in, by specializing in this you can position yourself and stand out in others minds so now you are more easily referable.

This shouldn't be limiting. By specializing you will actually be able to write your own ticket.

Or maybe I am not explaining it properly. Any way good luck.

PS. Once you figure out your price I would try the warrior for hire section and point your sig to your classified ad.

I will note MAJ, that I'm not moving 100% into copywriting for others. I am also busy doing my own product promotions, testing, etc. It's just another stream of income I would like to add.

Even if I can do an extra $2-$3k a month with it only, I'm fine with that.

I hear you. I didn't mean to sound depressing but that's just the reality of it. It's just like the desktop pc market. Are some people still making money selling them? Yes. But that market is shrinking quickly.

I wish I could agree on the talent part. But that's simply not the case. I've been doing this for over 10 years. Since the market is flooded with writers, in part due to AWAI and others, I have seen so many newbie copywriters claim they're achieving double-digit conversion rates and generating millions in new revenue for clients. And they're charging hundreds while you're trying to charge thousands. To the typical business, the writing looks the same. And many of these newbies are taught to take someone's control and rewrite it as one of their samples. Prior to '08 and before AWAI and similar companies went into overdrive trolling the aspiring writer boards, money was fast and easy and in large sums. Now its turned into a game of the business owner chosing from 7 different loafs of bread, each priced around $1 and you're the only one charging $4 a loaf claiming your usp justifies your price.

The positioning thing is over-rated, unless you have a patent on something.

Here's how it plays out in the real world.

Mr. Businessowner is looking at several proposals. Everyone's claiming they have sky-high conversion rates. And everyone has some sort of USP, and claims they take good care of their clients. Or that they specialize in that medium of copy or that niche, etc. Take a look at the USP's/positioning of most of the copywriters here, and out there, they're practically all saying the same thing. Really, how are you going to distinctly position yourself differently from other writers? What you're doing, most everyone else is doing too.

Join AWAI and spreading your social influence and wings from there?

I am also a copywriter and I have started my job on Fiverr! I`m looking for new collaborations on different projects!

Don't do what I did.

I read John Carlton's Kick Ass Copywriting manual, saw a chapter titled "Gun to the Head copywriting"... and well, that's how I got my first client.

I kid, I kid.

Seriously, though.... the single best way I've found to get clients... is to get results.

Like Gary Bencivenga has said many times, once you're consistently producing results, your phone will not stop ringing.

Those marketers "in the know" will find out who the top writers are, who has controls in their market, and will find them/seek them out/make them an offer.

There are so many ways to land the first client.

Elance, Warrior forum, adwords, seminars, email marketing, direct mail, etc....

Honestly, it doesn't matter where you get your first client. What matters is that you start getting letters circulating and getting results.

From there, you can branch out in many different ways.

Ray Edwards from Spokane just mentioned in his seminar the other day that he landed his first gig right here, on the warrior forum.

i know many six and seven figure writers who have written on elance. I know a few who landed clients from Craigslist.

Either way, where and how you get your first clients, to me, doesn't matter. It's what you do with it that DOES. Again, you want results you can use in future prospecting.

so, in my experience... getting results and using those results in future marketing helps to get clients.

If you can sell you will get work, period.

I tend to not make my deadlines and have an assortment of other non desirable traits. I'm not always very easy to work with. I can sell your stuff though, and so people hire me.

If your a copywriter and you can't convince a business owner who is knows he needs a copywriter (if he didn't know he needed one, why would he be talking to you?) to pay your fee, maybe you don't deserve the fee.

One other point. Network.

The advice to network with business owners is often given and valuable. But you should also network with the best copywriters and marketers you can get with. You will learn and grow, but also I tend to find that most people who are really top quality have more work than they can do and they tend to pass it around amongst themselves.

I wrote an entire guide on this subject, but the short version is this:

1. Make sure you can dedicate time to marketing yourself AND writing copy.
2. Establish a marketing plan.
2a. Active plan: contacting companies you want to work with
2b. Passive plan: allowing "random" companies to contact you with work
3. Niche yourself
4. Develop a USP
5. Begin marketing

Within a couple months (one month if you work fast) you should have your first client.

This article is old, but still valid, maybe even more so now.

If Clayton still has copies of MBS he goes into his business model in detail, and it would be very profitable for most good copywriters.

Six Figures is Chump Change | MakepeaceTotalPackage.com

Just landed my first official copywriting job today for around $500. It's not a huge project by any means, but it's a start. They initially only wanted to pay around $200 for it, and I said that I don't write cheap, low-quality copy...so I don't charge cheap rates. They accepted my quote at $500, which I think is good considering the amount of writing (short form sales material) required. I wouldn't have taken any less for the job.

Quick questions...

- How many revisions do you usually offer on your copywriting jobs?

- What are your typical payment terms? Do you do a 50%/50% split or all up front?

For this job, I'm requiring 100% payment up front. I was just curious how many of you go about this. I was thinking that maybe on jobs that are under $1500 or so, 100% payment up front would be required. Anything above that would be at least a 50/50 split.

Do any of you even bother with copywriting gigs on places like Elance or ODesk?

Or do you seek out businesses and/or websites that you could improve instead?

Dayne,

From reading your initial post, my advice is to heavily leverage the fact that you've already sold $1 million worth of product.

Very few copywriters start out with such results already in their back pocket. Use it. Make a big deal about it.

You don't need to do a WSO but it can be a start. I did. A little pokey one that's still netting me serious and appreciative clients and coaching students even today because the copy gets re-posted from time to time.

It all depends on how you do it. How you position yourself. The quality of your writing, etc.

Or you could forgo the WSO route to create your own stand-alone sales page, then use this forum to give good value and lead people to your link.

Or you could create a free report that breaks down some of your successful sales letters. It will establish your competence and authority. It will give prospective clients CONFIDENCE when you send it to them as a gift after they reach out to size you up for their project. I did this. It's still getting me gigs and securing very profitable partnerships many years later.

Just some thoughts. Either way, just do something and do it well.

Hope it helps.

--- Ross

I wish I had your courage from the start. I unfortunately started down this route and after 3 years under my belt, I cringe at the memory of some of the jobs I took on.

That being said, I still have contacts today that I met through lower paid jobs who now value work at what it is really worth. It's not ideal but if you don't have any contacts then taking slightly lower (emphasis on the slightly) paid work to make contacts can be a starting point of introduction

It is really encouraging to find that clients who have seen your work, and reaped the benefits, will accept significant increases to keep your services.

It sounds like you will probably have a fair few contacts already whom you can tap into to get the ball rolling, in which case, ignore all of the above, we need more people in our game to stick firmly to rates to gradually weed out the cheap as chips guys and make quality of work the key factor every time!

I'm not a copywriter but my bread and butter is freelancing and I've found the best clients come from referrals and networking preferrably face to face networking. Thats the fastest way to build a great relationship in my opinion.

Shake their hand look them in the eye and just have a chat usually all sorts of opportunities pop up when you get them talking about their business.

I would start by reaching to your immediate network. See if there's anyone you know who is selling to business's already and then sit down have a chat and see you can work you service into their offering.

Maybe you know a web designer, graphic designer, digital strategist etc All these types of people are usually a hub for clients who need a variety of services.

One last thing before you approach anyone get a good looking site happening with plenty of that personality injected. Be real. Be yourself and stay away from being too hypey.

Heck why not write a report on how long form sales letters can inject new life into businesses. Then give that bad boy away to as many people as you can get in front of.

Hope that helps man.
TC