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Emotional Close: Pain first Then Pleasure or Visa Versa

by Mirnova
14 replies
Anyone tested this...

First painting all the pleasure the prospect will have after buying the product, followed the dire warnings of the pain and loss they'll feel if they pass it up.

Or.... starting with the pain they are feeling about the current problem the product solves, then ending with painting the picture of that problem solved and all the pleasure that comes with it.

What works best generally?
#close #emotional #pain #pleasure #versa #visa
  • Profile picture of the author Alex Cohen
    If you think about the purpose of stoking emotion and stating benefits, you'll realize that putting benefits first in the sales letter doesn't make sense.

    That said, in the close, a line or two contrasting life after the reader makes his decision is appropriate...
    "Will you do nothing and blah, blah blah...

    Or will you take action and blah, blah, blah."
    Alex
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    • Profile picture of the author DavidG
      Originally Posted by Alex Cohen View Post

      If you think about the purpose of stoking emotion and stating benefits, you'll realize that putting benefits first in the sales letter doesn't make sense.
      Hey Alex,

      Could you expand more on that?

      I understand shock value for headlines and maybe on some leads. But whats your perspective?
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      • Profile picture of the author Alex Cohen
        Originally Posted by DavidG View Post

        Hey Alex,

        Could you expand more on that?

        I understand shock value for headlines and maybe on some leads. But whats your perspective?
        I was thinking of a common sales letter technique where the writer agitates the reader's pain early in the body copy. By doing so, the prospect's emotions are stoked and he is more aware of his need for a solution.

        It doesn't make sense to talk about benefits before his awareness has been increased.

        Alex
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        • Profile picture of the author DavidG
          Originally Posted by Alex Cohen View Post

          I was thinking of a common sales letter technique where the writer agitates the reader's pain early in the body copy. By doing so, the prospect's emotions are stoked and he is more aware of his need for a solution.

          It doesn't make sense to talk about benefits before his awareness has been increased.

          Alex
          Oh okay.

          So the more aware of the pain (or problems), then agitate early on (including headline or lead)? Typically something emotional.

          The more aware of the solution, then simply present the benefit of the product early on?

          I could see how this is well connected to the stages of awareness. And of course, it all depends in the situation the prospect is in, and the idea, I just want to see how others approach things.
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  • Profile picture of the author ThomasOMalley
    One effective approach to your copy is the problem, agitate the problem, solution technique.

    Study some of the top sales letters and see how the copywriter is structuring his sales letter.

    Often, you should determine the stage of market awareness as you mentioned (see E. Schwartz's Breakthrough Advertising).

    Another excellent resource for developing the framework for your sales letter is Michael Masterson's book "Great Leads."
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  • Profile picture of the author sethczerepak
    Originally Posted by Mirnova View Post

    Anyone tested this...

    First painting all the pleasure the prospect will have after buying the product, followed the dire warnings of the pain and loss they'll feel if they pass it up.

    Or.... starting with the pain they are feeling about the current problem the product solves, then ending with painting the picture of that problem solved and all the pleasure that comes with it.

    What works best generally?
    It depends on who you're talking to. Are your reader's naturally optimistic or pessimistic? Optimists will be more interesting in seeking pleasure and opportunity, pessimists are more focused on solving problems.

    Generally speaking, 80% of people are pessimists. That's why "bad" news sells. But if you're talking to business leaders, entrepreneurs, those are your optimists. I'd suggest testing two approaches:

    For pessimists, headline and opening like this:

    "Is [PROBLEM] [EMOTIONAL IMPACT OF PROBLEM]?"

    Are you sick of [symptom of problem]?

    Tired of [another, bigger symptom of the problem]?

    Are you ready to stop [biggest symptom of the problem] for GOOD without [thing they don't want to have to do in order to solve the problem]?

    For OPTIMISTS, test a headline and opening like this:

    "How Would You Like to [BENEFIT] and NEVER [PROBLEM] Again?"

    Imagine [DESCRIPTION OF BENEFIT], WITHOUT [thing they don't want to have to do in order to experience the benefit].

    Imagine [DESCRIPTION OF ANOTHER BENEFIT] in [SHORT TIME PERIOD].

    ******************

    Test those two and see what pulls a better response. That will answer your question
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  • Profile picture of the author TimothyTorrents
    When I write copy I usually follow the second format. I can't say if it is better than the first format because I never did any testing with the two types of copy but it does work quite well.

    Why not do some split testing and let us know how it goes?
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  • Profile picture of the author max5ty
    Hmmm...

    Copywriting/advertising is a great business to get into.

    I can make you a millionaire.

    I've worked with some of the biggest companies in the world.

    Have an 8 car garage. A house most only dream about. Indoor pool, maids, 12 bedrooms, 9 bathrooms, limo...

    Have a fleet of cars most only see in a magazine. Actually own a part of 3 magazines and a major fashion line.

    Have a private jet that can whisk me away to anywhere in the world...whenever I want.

    Have a Prevost tour bus I can use to travel around on simply because I've created killer marketing for 2 of the greatest entertainers in the world.

    I've mentored 14 people...they've all became millionaires.

    Now Mr. Cohen...did I state the benefits before the pain? Or the Pain before the benefits...

    or did you put both together to relate to your situation?

    _______________

    Are you struggling to pay the bills?

    Think you have what it takes to be a copywriter, but can't make things click?

    Stay awake at night putting together ideas?

    I can make you a millionaire...

    I've worked with some of the biggest companies in the world.

    Have an 8 car garage. A house most only dream about. Indoor pool, maids, 12 bedrooms, 9 bathrooms, limo...

    Have a fleet of cars most only see in a magazine. Actually own a part of 3 magazines and a major fashion line.

    Have a private jet that can whisk me away to anywhere in the world...whenever I want.

    Have a Prevost tour bus I can use to travel around on simply because I've created killer marketing for 2 of the greatest entertainers in the world.

    I've mentored 14 people...they've all became millionaires.

    ___________________

    Two different openings.

    There is no right or wrong answer.

    You need to test your approach.

    Test, test, test...ad Mr. Miz says.
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    • Profile picture of the author Alex Cohen
      Now Mr. Cohen...did I state the benefits before the pain? Or the Pain before the benefits...
      You didn't state any pain at all in the first example.

      And BTW, you mixed apples with oranges.

      Your first example is more appropriate when trying to move someone towards pleasure. Your second example is more appropriate when trying to move someone away from pain.

      Alex
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      • Profile picture of the author max5ty
        Originally Posted by Alex Cohen View Post

        You didn't state any pain at all in the first example.

        And BTW, you mixed apples with oranges.

        Your first example is more appropriate when trying to move someone towards pleasure. Your second example is more appropriate when trying to move someone away from pain.

        Alex
        I disagree.

        The point I was trying to make is that when people have pain...in this case a lack of money...

        you don't have to come right out and confirm that, or build a whole scenario letting them know you know how they feel.

        Most will read the first example and subconsciously be processing the info as it relates to their situation.

        As people read things, there's a million different ideas running through their mind. Most of the thoughts they have always place themselves into situations.

        So...

        there is no right or wrong answer to the question.

        It all depends on the approach you use.

        As you get more experience, you'll understand what I'm saying.
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      • Profile picture of the author sethczerepak
        Originally Posted by Alex Cohen View Post

        You didn't state any pain at all in the first example.
        Alex
        Jealousy is pain. Any time you vividly describe someone else succeeding at something the reader wants to succeed at, but isn't, you create pain through jealousy.
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    • Profile picture of the author DavidG
      Originally Posted by max5ty View Post

      Hmmm...

      Copywriting/advertising is a great business to get into.

      I can make you a millionaire.

      I've worked with some of the biggest companies in the world.

      Have an 8 car garage. A house most only dream about. Indoor pool, maids, 12 bedrooms, 9 bathrooms, limo...

      Have a fleet of cars most only see in a magazine. Actually own a part of 3 magazines and a major fashion line.

      Have a private jet that can whisk me away to anywhere in the world...whenever I want.

      Have a Prevost tour bus I can use to travel around on simply because I've created killer marketing for 2 of the greatest entertainers in the world.

      I've mentored 14 people...they've all became millionaires.

      Now Mr. Cohen...did I state the benefits before the pain? Or the Pain before the benefits...

      or did you put both together to relate to your situation?

      _______________

      Are you struggling to pay the bills?

      Think you have what it takes to be a copywriter, but can't make things click?

      Stay awake at night putting together ideas?

      I can make you a millionaire...

      I've worked with some of the biggest companies in the world.

      Have an 8 car garage. A house most only dream about. Indoor pool, maids, 12 bedrooms, 9 bathrooms, limo...

      Have a fleet of cars most only see in a magazine. Actually own a part of 3 magazines and a major fashion line.

      Have a private jet that can whisk me away to anywhere in the world...whenever I want.

      Have a Prevost tour bus I can use to travel around on simply because I've created killer marketing for 2 of the greatest entertainers in the world.

      I've mentored 14 people...they've all became millionaires.

      __________________
      Interesting.

      Okay so for the first example, you sell why copywriting is a great business to get into.

      The prospect would likely be someone who needs to make money. He or She doesn't know where to go, but they are aware they need to make money.

      So saying what they want to hear, almost word for word, is similar to an emotional appeal, right?

      The way I approach things is, yeah, benefits or emotion can be tested. But benefits (like the first example) NEED to be, almost word for word, spot on.

      If not, then it could be ignored easily. Like I did.

      As for emotion, I'd think that since everyone has the same struggle, you basically speak out to a larger percentage of people...

      Like your second example.

      And then slowly narrow them down with the lead. But still, would have a chance of a bigger winner than straight benefits.

      Let me know what you think.

      On the side, here's a question...

      What if its a prospect who has trouble trying to get a job.

      A prospect who was part of the whole 2008 fiasco. Someone a bit more specific.

      The logical thing would be to talk about why copywriting is a secured job, or relating with a story and how you made it out unscratched because of copywriting.

      Right? Or would you keep things as is? Which is, that you keep the same benefits because "it's what they want and they'll apply it to their situation."

      I understand that this is just an example, but whats your take? And why?

      As for your second example, the first sentence straight out goes for emotional value. Same with the second and third...

      Very good copy by the way...

      But you question them in this example. A different style, nevertheless, more emotional. And therefore could grab newbies and seniors (even me) who still feel this way.

      If you tried to sell me with your first example, it wouldn't work, because I kind of know that already. I'm aware its a great opportunity, but I am still in a rut.

      It feels like everyone is climbing the ladder except me. It stings because I don't know what to do...etc.

      By the way, you don't have to recognize stages of awareness, I understand many in this forum fall asleep to the book. But it helps me see how emotion vs benefits work.


      David
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  • Profile picture of the author Mark Pescetti
    Starting out with benefits can paint a picture so appealing, it causes pain.

    I think Max achieved that in his example.

    Mark
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  • Profile picture of the author Quality Copywriter
    You want to paint appealing pcitures of what life will be like with your widget/course etc.

    do not labour too much on the negative.
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