Can I send emails to businesses in the USA legally?

9 years ago

Originally Posted by abozeb

I'm not sure about the laws in the US, but I have a list of companies which i want to sell my services to. So basically I want to request a meeting. Is it ok to send one email asking for a meeting?

Thanks!

Sending individual queries is completely legal, as long as you observe a few rules.

Most of them are common sense or just good manners.

> No deceptive headlines.
> No adding people to automated lists or bulk lists without permission.
> Provide a means to let them stop hearing from you.
> Provide contact information.

Here are the rules, straight from the horse's mouth:

CAN-SPAM Act: A Compliance Guide for Business | BCP Business Center

PDF version:

http://www.business.ftc.gov/sites/de...e-business.pdf

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michaelmark

9 years ago

As far as scraping email addresses, the legality depends entirely on how and where you are doing it. For example, using Google to find sites that have email addresses and then grabbing them from a ton of different sites, is most likely not illegal since they could not have been scraped by Google if they were not posted publicly. If you are grabbing them from a password-protected database that you don't own, it probably is illegal. .
So, yes, as long as you follow the CAN SPAM rules, you can legally scrape and send to random emails as long as you don't sent to emails after they unsubscribe..

Thanks
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Alexa Smith

Banned 9 years ago

Originally Posted by michaelmark

As far as scraping email addresses, the legality depends entirely on how and where you are doing it. For example, using Google to find sites that have email addresses and then grabbing them from a ton of different sites, is most likely not illegal since they could not have been scraped by Google if they were not posted publicly.

Incorrect. It's set out in black and white in the Can-Spam act.

Originally Posted by michaelmark

So, yes, as long as you follow the CAN SPAM rules, you can legally scrape and send to random emails

Also incorrect: the Can-Spam Act expressly prohibits that.

And stop sending me private messages telling me that you're "a lawyer in the state of California". I don't believe you and neither will anyone else here. If you think you can intimidate me just because I'm young and female, you have another think coming. I've been making my living through email marketing for 6 years and you have no idea what you're talking about.

A lawyer would know better than the nonsense you're posting.

.

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Kingshouse

9 years ago

I think anyone considering 'scrapping' email addresses legally is really looking for a very short term business online.

Certainly not the sort of list I would want to be on.

I won't even wish you all the best!

Thanks
1 reply

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JohnMcCabe

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Kingshouse

I think anyone considering 'scrapping' email addresses legally is really looking for a very short term business online.

Certainly not the sort of list I would want to be on.

I won't even wish you all the best!

There's a big difference between scraping emails to add to a list for the purpose of spamming them, and using publicly available information to ask for permission for continued contact using individual emails.

Go back and read what the OP asked - whether it was legal to contact companies whose information he found online to request a meeting to explore interest in hiring him.

Not quite the same as scraping a list and spamming them, eh?

All the best...

Thanks

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OTrap 9 years ago

Originally Posted by Alexa Smith

Incorrect. It's set out in black and white in the Can-Spam act.

Also incorrect: the Can-Spam Act expressly prohibits that.

Same with the CASL and the EC Directive.

Essentially, sending to scraped email addresses is illegal in the US, Canada, and the UK (as well as several other countries).

What's even more interesting is that it's technically illegal to send to addresses of users IN those countries, even if you don't actually live in them yourself. Now, granted, if you were to break that law, it would require more effort for those countries to prosecute, but it's illegal nonetheless.

But on top of that, it's just not good business practice anyway.
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fulfilledlife

9 years ago

For a business, sending one email should be ok, given that it is an email you took from their contact page and basically it is an email they give for public to contact them.

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maxqsoft

9 years ago

Here are links to the regulations and guides that govern email compliance in Canada and the USA.
Canada: Canada's Law on Spam and Other Electronic Threats - Home - Canada's Anti-Spam Legislation
USA:CAN-SPAM Act: A Compliance Guide for Business | BCP Business Center

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jamesfreddyc

9 years ago

I'm curious to know how the OP's intent is transactional? From what I can tell, asking for an appointment to meet doesn't quite fit that definition.

Yes? No?

Originally Posted by abozeb

I'm not sure about the laws in the US, but I have a list of companies which i want to sell my services to. So basically I want to request a meeting. Is it ok to send one email asking for a meeting?

Thanks!

Thanks
1 reply

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Alexa Smith

Banned 9 years ago

Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc

I'm curious to know how the OP's intent is transactional?

My guess is "not" ... but he's not here to opine one way or the other, himself: November 2nd, when he asked his question, was also the last time he was logged in here.

The thread still has some amusement value over the brief appearance in it of a guy who was here to try to promote (in various ways, deleted now) an "email address scraper" - until he learned that that wasn't going to go down too well, here.

.

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jamesfreddyc

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Alexa Smith

My guess is "not" ... but he's not here to opine one way or the other, himself: November 2nd, when he asked his question, was also the last time he was logged in here.

The thread still has some amusement value over the brief appearance in it of a guy who was here to try to promote (in various ways, deleted now) an "email address scraper" - until he learned that that wasn't going to go down too well, here.

.

Why guess?

Just comment on the relevant topic. No need to opine on intent of the op. I am curious to know how sending a public business an email to request an appointment, a referral to the appropriate person to speak with, or any other non transactional content is violating CAN SPAM ACT.

Thanks
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Alexa Smith

Banned 9 years ago

Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc

Why guess?

Because I wasn't certain, I'm not a lawyer, and the answer to the question you asked apparently depends on the correct interpretation of the word "transactional".

Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc

I am curious to know how sending a public business an email to request an appointment, a referral to the appropriate person to speak with, or any other non transactional content is violating CAN SPAM ACT.

So you said.

And as I said, my guess is that it isn't.

Sending email to email addresses scraped from the web, for any purpose whatsoever, however, is contrary to the Act (in the US, and contrary to CASL in Canada, and contrary to the EC Directive in Europe). And (perhaps unlike the exact legal definition of "transactional"), I don't need to be a lawyer, to know that.

.

Thanks
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jamesfreddyc

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Alexa Smith

Because I wasn't certain, I'm not a lawyer, and the answer to the question you asked apparently depends on the correct interpretation of the word "transactional".

So you said.

And as I said, my guess is that it isn't.

Sending email to email addresses scraped from the web, for any purpose whatsoever, however, is contrary to the Act (in the US, and contrary to CASL in Canada, and contrary to the EC Directive in Europe). And (perhaps unlike the exact legal definition of "transactional"), I don't need to be a lawyer, to know that.

.

It's pretty clear that transactional is in regards to the content being related or containing a solicitation of products or services.

Thanks
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Alexa Smith

Banned 9 years ago

Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc

It's pretty clear that transactional is in regards to the content being related or containing a solicitation of products or services.

Well, I'm no lawyer but my guess is that you're probably right about that.

My point, however, is that even if you are, it doesn't change the fact that sending email to addresses scraped from the web, for any purpose whatsoever, is illegal.

.

Thanks
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jamesfreddyc

9 years ago

Originally Posted by Alexa Smith

Well, I'm no lawyer but my guess is that you're probably right about that.

My point, however, is that even if you are, it doesn't change the fact that sending email to addresses scraped from the web, for any purpose whatsoever, is illegal.

.

That's not anywhere in the OP, which is what I have commented on from the start.

I did a quick search on the CAN-SPAM Act: A Compliance Guide for Business | BCP Business Center but didn't find any reference to the word "scrape", "scrapped", "scrap", etc...

Where are you reading that CAN-SPAM act has provisions related to what you say regarding scrapped emails?

Thanks
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Alexa Smith

Banned 9 years ago

Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc

Where are you reading that CAN-SPAM act has provisions related to what you say regarding scrapped emails?

"the law is very clear that you're also not allowed to "scrape" email addresses off of websites and email to them." Source: CAN-SPAM Act

.

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jamesfreddyc 9 years ago

Originally Posted by Alexa Smith

"the law is very clear that you’re also not allowed to “scrape” email addresses off of websites and email to them." Source: CAN-SPAM Act

.

That's not was the provision states. What you are referencing is a summary page and not the actual statute.

The term "address harvesting" under section 5 is specifically related to "commercial" content of the email. It doesn't have a blanket statement as related to your comment that all "scraped" email addresses are not allowed.

Edit: this was cut out from this post for some reason so I am adding it here:

you’re also not allowed to “scrape” email addresses off of websites and email to them.

The legislation is intended to DISCOURAGE scrapping of email addresses but it does not appear to prohibit it. However, when done in conjunction with another violation(s) of CAN-SPAM then it will likely contribute to the penalties should something be enforced. But you are incorrect in saying, "you’re also not allowed to “scrape” email addresses off of websites and email to them".
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JohnMcCabe

9 years ago

Originally Posted by jamesfreddyc

That's not anywhere in the OP, which is what I have commented on from the start.

I did a quick search on the CAN-SPAM Act: A Compliance Guide for Business | BCP Business Center but didn't find any reference to the word "scrape", "scrapped", "scrap", etc...

Where are you reading that CAN-SPAM act has provisions related to what you say regarding scrapped emails?

I believe the proper term is "scraped". Otherwise, see below...

Originally Posted by Alexa Smith

"the law is very clear that you're also not allowed to "scrape" email addresses off of websites and email to them." Source: CAN-SPAM Act

.

I'm not a lawyer, either, but many of the folks at anti-spam Project Honeypot are, and they quote a specific section of the Act itself, rather than a simplified version menat for the general public.

As I read it, the key is in defining the word "scraped" (also referred to as "harvested") email addresses. You can read the section here.

The key distinction, as I read it, is the reason the email is publicly displayed. Scarping and harvesting seem to be defined as gathering emails from public websites (like discussion forums or social media sites or bulletin boards). Gathering email addresses intended for use in contacting a company are a different animal.

Again, as I read it, if someone scrapes addresses from a job board (for example) and uses that list to promote a business opportunity, that activity would be illegal and even aggravated for purposes of determining punishment. Harvesting the contact address of the site owner or admin for purposes of determining whether there is interest in, say, SEO services or PPC management, is different. In the latter example, you would be contacting the owner of the site, rather than a third party (people offering jobs or posting resumes, in this case).

Here's the subsection, actually found under "Sentencing":

(2) REQUIREMENTS -- In carrying out this subsection, the Sentencing Commission shall consider providing sentencing enhancements for --
(A) those convicted under section 1037 of title 18, United States Code, who --
(i) obtained electronic mail addresses through improper means, including --
(I) harvesting electronic mail addresses of the users of a website, proprietary service, or other online public forum operated by another person, without the authorization of such person; and
(II) randomly generating electronic mail addresses by computer; or
[...]

Emphasis is mine.

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jamesfreddyc

9 years ago

Originally Posted by JohnMcCabe

The key distinction, as I read it, is the reason the email is publicly displayed. Scarping and harvesting seem to be defined as gathering emails from public websites (like discussion forums or social media sites or bulletin boards). Gathering email addresses intended for use in contacting a company are a different animal.

Again, as I read it, if someone scrapes addresses from a job board (for example) and uses that list to promote a business opportunity, that activity would be illegal and even aggravated for purposes of determining punishment. Harvesting the contact address of the site owner or admin for purposes of determining whether there is interest in, say, SEO services or PPC management, is different. In the latter example, you would be contacting the owner of the site, rather than a third party (people offering jobs or posting resumes, in this case).

John -- we are talking about the OP and the activity of sending unsolicited email (not a solicitation for purchasing product/services) merely inquiring about something particular about the business. Not personal email addresses, not job seekers, but publicly advertised business email addresses. In all cases you state above it pertains to actually sending solicitations of a product or service, again that is not what the OP was about.

Here's the subsection, actually found under "Sentencing":

Emphasis is mine.

"Sentencing" is exactly what I mentioned: it doesn't prohibit the activity nor use of sending email to scrapped addresses. It's regarding enforcement of penalties to existing violations of CAN-SPAM. It is not specifically addressing the prohibition of sending email to scrapped addresses.

Edit: I just noticed your location in your profile. I spent a lot of time on the Peace river myself when I lived in Pt. Charlotte.

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JohnMcCabe 9 years ago

Guess I was so busy making my point about the difference between the kind of scraping described in the quote I posted and what the OP described I missed the post just above mine.

My original position was, and still is, that using publicly available email addresses of company officials gathered from the company's website to discuss the potential for business is legal. Regardless of whether those addresses were gathered manually, electronically or through hiring a third party.

Since the OP never specified where he got his list of companies he wanted to contact, nor where he got the email addresses he intended to use, this might be an exercise in tail-chasing. (Quick check - the OP hasn't been back to WF since making his post.)

I think we may have been trolled...
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Javisito

9 years ago

If I'm not wrong it's okay to send a personal e-mail but not to collect a lot of emails and add them to a list without permission.

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Can I send emails to businesses in the USA legally?

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